Marriage between different Europids?

[Nixon]

I don't think any Ulster Scot or mainland Scots should ever merry an Irish Catholic.

[Belenus]

I don't think any Ulster Scot or mainland Scots should ever merry an Irish Catholic.

More a question of Christian politics than race.

[Lumi]

As long as you breed blonde blue eyed children, I find no problem


If you had the faintest clue about how genetics work, you'd realise that nothing is a given.
Say a father has two recessive genes. Blonde hair and blue eyes, and the mother has dominant genes, like brown hair and brown eyes. Both are european through and through. The likelihood is, the kid will take after it's Mother and not the Father, because it's the Mother who has the dominant gene.
Of course, genetics can and do change. The "milkman gene" as it's commonly called. When the kid turns out to not look like the Father in the slightest.
And, the more kids you have, the more recessive the genes are.

So, saying that it's alright as long as the kids are blonde haired and blue eyed is a ridiculous statement. Genetics aren't ever set in stone. :coffee:

[2Cool]

If you had the faintest clue about how genetics work, you'd realise that nothing is a given.
Say a father has two recessive genes. Blonde hair and blue eyes, and the mother has dominant genes, like brown hair and brown eyes. Both are european through and through. The likelihood is, the kid will take after it's Mother and not the Father, because it's the Mother who has the dominant gene.
Of course, genetics can and do change. The "milkman gene" as it's commonly called. When the kid turns out to not look like the Father in the slightest.
And, the more kids you have, the more recessive the genes are.

So, saying that it's alright as long as the kids are blonde haired and blue eyed is a ridiculous statement. Genetics aren't ever set in stone. :coffee:

That's not true.

Also if both parents have blue eyes than their children will have blue eyes - all of them. If not then on the kids is not the biological child of one of the parents.

edit: Actually, it might be possible but it's extremely rare. But following Mendel's law it's impossible.

[Vixen]

Marriage among different Europeans nationalities has always been common, and even encouraged among the nobility and royal families in order to strengthen diplomatic ties. It has a very long tradition and I see nothing wrong with it.

[Rødskjegg]

That's not true.

Also if both parents have blue eyes than their children will have blue eyes - all of them. If not then on the kids is not the biological child of one of the parents.

Hah, you claim Lumi of writing something untrue, yet you do it yourself.

Two blondes can have a child with brown hair etc. Same goes with eye colour. Two blue eyed parents can have a child with brown eyes.

A friend of mine who is blonde, has got a father with almost black hair, and a brunette mother. Different eye colour as well,

[2Cool]

Hah, you claim Lumi of writing something untrue, yet you do it yourself.

Two blondes can have a child with brown hair etc.

A friend of mine who is blonde, has got a father with almost black hair, and a brunette mother. Different eyecolour as well,

Following what Mendel said no you can't. Eye colour is not the same as hair colour btw.

To have blue eyes you need to have inherited the recessive blue eye gene from both your parents. Let's say "b" corresponds to that gene. If both your parents have bb as their genes then all of their kids will them as well since all of the possible combinations are bb. So they'll have blue eyes. But if both of your parents have dominant Brown eye gene, denoted as "B" and a blue eye gene then there are four possible combinations: BB, Bb, bB, bb. Each kid they have has a 25% chance of having blue eyes.

This is an oversimplification but that's generally how it works.

[dandelion]

My one parent has blue eyes, the other brown, and I have green with brown. :lol:

[Lumi]

Following what Mendel said no you can't. Eye colour is not the same as hair colour btw.

To have blue eyes you need to have inherited the recessive blue eye gene from both your parents. Let's say "b" corresponds to that gene. If both your parents have bb as their genes then all of their kids will them as well since all of the possible combinations are bb. So they'll have blue eyes. But if both of your parents have dominant Brown eye gene, denoted as "B" and a blue eye gene then there are four possible combinations: BB, Bb, bB, bb. Each kid they have has a 25% chance of having blue eyes.

This is an oversimplification but that's generally how it works.

Mate. I aced genetic science in Biology.
I know that there is an exception to every Law of Nature. Genetics are NOT set in stone.
I know a girl. Her Mum has blue eyes, her Dad has brown. Guess what colour of eyes she has? Violet. She has violet eyes. Her Mum has black hair, her Dad has red (red, not ginger). She's got blonde hair. Aside from that, she looks totally like her parents.
My point? Kids don't always inherit the same genetics from their parents. Flukes do happen. And they aren't that uncommon. Given, I only know two people with violet eyes.
Also, how do you explain albinos? No pigmentation whatsoever in their bodies. Yet, their parents do. Another fluke.
That's like a kid who has green eyes, when both their parents have brown eyes, or a kid getting brown eyes when both their parents have blue. When two dominant genes or two recessive genes come together, they make another gene, or a fluke occurs. That's what's known as the milkman gene. When the kid doesn't resemble the parents in terms of hair or eye colour.

[Belenus]

In my extended family (from me and my parents out to grandparents, aunts, uncles, and cousins), there's black hair, dark brown hair, light brown hair, dark blonde hair, medium blonde hair, light blonde hair, auburn hair, dark red hair, crimson red hair, and ginger hair. There's brown eyes, hazel eyes, emerald green eyes, green-brown eyes, blue eyes, light blue eyes, and grey eyes. We've got skin that tans and skin that can only redden/burn. Pale and olive, clear and freckled (both red and brown variants). It's all mixed up, and light hair and light eyes seem to be increasing in number, not decreasing.

As far as my experiences have shown me, genetics can vary quickly and easily.

In case anyone is wondering, my grandparents had 11 children, and some of them had between 5-8 children, which is why there's a massive amount of variety in my family/clan.

[Graham]

I don't think any Ulster Scot or mainland Scots should ever merry an Irish Catholic.

Happens all the time with Catholics marrying Proddys. My auntie on the Episcopalian(Finlay) side married a catholic. Episcopalian side won. So both sides of family were at my four cousins baptism. :)

[2Cool]

Mate. I aced genetic science in Biology.
I know that there is an exception to every Law of Nature. Genetics are NOT set in stone.
I know a girl. Her Mum has blue eyes, her Dad has brown. Guess what colour of eyes she has? Violet. She has violet eyes. Her Mum has black hair, her Dad has red (red, not ginger). She's got blonde hair. Aside from that, she looks totally like her parents.
My point? Kids don't always inherit the same genetics from their parents. Flukes do happen. And they aren't that uncommon. Given, I only know two people with violet eyes.
Also, how do you explain albinos? No pigmentation whatsoever in their bodies. Yet, their parents do. Another fluke.
That's like a kid who has green eyes, when both their parents have brown eyes, or a kid getting brown eyes when both their parents have blue. When two dominant genes or two recessive genes come together, they make another gene, or a fluke occurs. That's what's known as the milkman gene. When the kid doesn't resemble the parents in terms of hair or eye colour.

Green eyes are more complex since it's a combo of colours, but blue eyes vs brown eyes is pretty straightforward. Albinism is something different and has to do with recessive traits too. If you have two albino parents you better believe it that most of their kids will be albinos as well. I remember reading of a family in India, both the parents are albinos and so are all of their kids (they had at least 6+ kids). It's the largest albino family in the world.

I've never seen someone with violet eyes, pics?

What I am saying is if you have a trait that depends on recessive genes, such as blue eyes, and both of your parents have those recessive genes, then the odds of you inheriting that recessive trait is pretty huge and in some cases 100%.

Sure some genes jump generations etc. but that's not what I'm talking about complex genes like that, or genes that combine with each other etc.

[Pallantides]

I don't think people from Hallingdal and Valdres should mix, but my maternal grandparents did.


Luck it was my granfather who was a Hallingdøl, if it had been the other way around there would have been a funeral and not a weeding. :coffee:

[2Cool]

In my extended family (from me and my parents out to grandparents, aunts, uncles, and cousins), there's black hair, dark brown hair, light brown hair, dark blonde hair, medium blonde hair, light blonde hair, auburn hair, dark red hair, crimson red hair, and ginger hair. There's brown eyes, hazel eyes, emerald green eyes, green-brown eyes, blue eyes, light blue eyes, and grey eyes. We've got skin that tans and skin that can only redden/burn. Pale and olive, clear and freckled (both red and brown variants). It's all mixed up, and light hair and light eyes seem to be increasing in number, not decreasing.

As far as my experiences have shown me, genetics can vary quickly and easily.

In case anyone is wondering, my grandparents had 11 children, and some of them had between 5-8 children, which is why there's a massive amount of variety in my family/clan.

Funny in my family and extended family (I'm included up to 1st gen uncles here and first gen cousins (numbering in the 20+ range)) and we all have dark brown to almost black hair, all of us can tan and we all have either brown or hazel eyes , except for me, I have green eyes :)

Funny how that works.

[Lumi]

Green eyes are more complex since it's a combo of colours, but blue eyes vs brown eyes is pretty straightforward. Albinism is something different and has to do with recessive traits too. If you have two albino parents you better believe it that most of their kids will be albinos as well. I remember reading of a family in India, both the parents are albinos and so are all of their kids (they had at least 6+ kids). It's the largest albino family in the world.

You didn't answer my question.
I've seen albino kids, whose parents aren't albino. How do you explain that if you're so all-knowing about genetics as you claim you are?


I've never seen someone with violet eyes, pics?

Elizabeth Taylor is said to have had violet eyes.

http://www.slate.com/content/slate/blogs/browbeat/2011/03/25/elizabeth_taylor_beautiful_mutant.html

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v664/Littleone1016/Scoliosis%20Stuff/elizabeth-taylor-007.jpg

Give me a break. Violet eyes are that rare, it's difficult to find a non-anime picture or even a picture that hasn't been edited.

http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac140/GaiaCircleLens/Violet%20Lenses/Wonder%20Eyes/WonderEyesVioletvsBesvueHyperEclips.jpg
Though the above appears to be real.


What I am saying is if you have a trait that depends on recessive genes, such as blue eyes, and both of your parents have those recessive genes, then the odds of you inheriting that recessive trait is pretty huge and in some cases 100%.

And what I am saying, and you continue to shoot down, is that NO GENETICS ARE SET IN STONE. I give you example after example of cases where genetics are shown to differ from parents in huge ways. Yes, nine times out of ten, genetics will be the same. But what you're saying is that it happens all the time, which is untrue. And I have seen real life cases of times when the genetics of a child differ from that of their parents.

[Arsen_]

Actually the blue eye gene is not recessive and that once-held view that blue eye color is a simple recessive trait has been shown to be incorrect.

[Belenus]

Actually the blue eye gene is not recessive and that once-held view that blue eye color is a simple recessive trait has been shown to be incorrect.

Source?

[2Cool]

You didn't answer my question.
I've seen albino kids, whose parents aren't albino. How do you explain that if you're so all-knowing about genetics as you claim you are?



Elizabeth Taylor is said to have had violet eyes.

http://www.slate.com/content/slate/blogs/browbeat/2011/03/25/elizabeth_taylor_beautiful_mutant.html

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v664/Littleone1016/Scoliosis%20Stuff/elizabeth-taylor-007.jpg

Give me a break. Violet eyes are that rare, it's difficult to find a non-anime picture or even a picture that hasn't been edited.

http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac140/GaiaCircleLens/Violet%20Lenses/Wonder%20Eyes/WonderEyesVioletvsBesvueHyperEclips.jpg
Though the above appears to be real.



And what I am saying, and you continue to shoot down, is that NO GENETICS ARE SET IN STONE. I give you example after example of cases where genetics are shown to differ from parents in huge ways. Yes, nine times out of ten, genetics will be the same. But what you're saying is that it happens all the time, which is untrue. And I have seen real life cases of times when the genetics of a child differ from that of their parents.

I don't get what you are saying. If you have two non-albino parents and they have an albino child, then the reason is pretty straightforward. Both carry the recessive trait for albinism. Their child simply had the misfortune of inheriting the recessive gene from both parents. That's the case for most albinos but like all things there are exceptions.

I also never said that genetics are set in stone but that a lot of traits are passed on from parents - > child in a pretty straight forward manner.

edit: My blue eyes example happens virtually every time.

[Arsen_]

Source?

I guess there are a lot of sources proving that in modern genetics, for example here (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/02/070222180729.htm) and here (http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=25003).

And by the way that theory about recessive blue eye gene doesn't work in real life. For example my maternal grandmother was blue-eyed and grandfather was brown-eyed. They gave birth to ten children and nine of them were blue-eyed.

[2Cool]

I guess there are a lot of sources proving that in modern genetics, for example here (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/02/070222180729.htm) and here (http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=25003).

And by the way that theory about recessive blue eye gene doesn't work in real life. For example my maternal grandmother was blue-eyed and grandfather was brown-eyed. They gave birth to ten children and nine of them were blue-eyed.

Your example works. All it means is that your grandfather was "Bb" - he carried the genes for brown and blue eyes. Possible combos are: Bb, and bb. So 50/50 chance for brown and blue eyes. It also means that are of your uncles from that side of the family carry the recessive gene for blue eyes.

[Arsen_]

Your example works. All it means is that your grandfather was "Bb" - he carried the genes for brown and blue eyes. Possible combos are: Bb, and bb. So 50/50 chance for brown and blue eyes. It also means that are of your uncles from that side of the family carry the recessive gene for blue eyes.

Well I am not that much into genetics and I cannot state anything for sure but it is a question of simple logic. How come that there are more people on Earth with "recessive" blue eyes than people with green eyes?

[2Cool]

Well I am not that much into genetics and I cannot state anything for sure but it is a question of simple logic. How come that there are more people on Earth with "recessive" blue eyes than people with green eyes?

I don't know. I'd assume that the process to have green eyes is more complex and that's why it's more rare (but how much rarer is it?). Blue eyes are simply the result of low melanin in the iris and it's source has been tracked to a single mutation that happened to a person living in the coast of the Black Sea. The gene (or combo of genes) that cause blue eyes are similar to the ones that cause albinism.

From wiki
"The genetic switch is located in the gene adjacent to OCA2 and rather than completely turning off the gene, the switch limits its action, which reduces the production of melanin in the iris. In effect, the turned-down switch diluted brown eyes to blue. If the OCA2 gene had been completely shut down, our hair, eyes and skin would be melanin-less, a condition known as albinism "