Why did only 6 Celtic words end up in English?

[Wulfhere]

If, as geneticists tell us, the English are a hybridisation between Anglo-Saxons and Britons, why did only six Welsh words end up in Old English? And even they related to geographical features (excluding place-names).

Old English is also more or less completely devoid of Roman words, disproving the idea that their ancestors lived here in Roman times.

[Electronic God-Man]

What are the six words?

[johngaunt]

If, as geneticists tell us, the English are a hybridisation between Anglo-Saxons and Britons, why did only six Welsh words end up in Old English? And even they related to geographical features (excluding place-names).

Old English is also more or less completely devoid of Roman words, disproving the idea that their ancestors lived here in Roman times.

Its funny that Avon survived (Afon mean river in Welsh) So river avon literally means 'river river'. I can imagine invaders being asked what that was (pointing to river) being told literally it was a River 'Avon' - then calling it river river ! LOLS.

There were many more than 6 words in use in northern and western areas of England. The farmer counting system Yan tan thretha is still in use ... thats at least about 20 words there .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yan_Tan_Tethera

I find it amazing that even that vestige of language survived in England. I think alot of the farming stock must have been purely briton, surviving on marginal land in England, maintain this counting system, 1000 years after the saxons took their lands :P .

[_______]

If, as geneticists tell us, the English are a hybridisation between Anglo-Saxons and Britons, why did only six Welsh words end up in Old English? And even they related to geographical features (excluding place-names).

Old English is also more or less completely devoid of Roman words, disproving the idea that their ancestors lived here in Roman times.

germanic supremacy :p

[Ouistreham]

Its funny that Avon survived (Afon mean river in Welsh) So river avon literally means 'river river'.

Most redundantly pleonastic placename is certainly Glendale Valley.

[Black Turlogh]

You'd have done well to have more. Tolkien was right in saying Welsh has no shortage of cellar doors. ;)

[Wulfhere]

Port (Latin portus)
Munt (Latin mons)
Torr (Latin turris)
Wic (Latin vicus)

I could only find four. Quite a few more Welsh words have entered English since the Old English period - a few dozen perhaps - of which the most common is probably penguin ("white head").

[Troll's Puzzle]

Old English is also more or less completely devoid of Roman words, disproving the idea that their ancestors lived here in Roman times.

as far as I know only the amateur population-geneticist Oppenheimer claimed that, unfortunately he put his dilettante linguistic idea into a best-selling book so some people read about these things for the first time ever and believed it :rolleyes2:

[Wulfhere]

as far as I know only the amateur population-geneticist Oppenheimer claimed that, unfortunately he put his dilettante linguistic idea into a best-selling book so some people read about these things for the first time ever and believed it :rolleyes2:

It has been repeated quite a few times in the media in recent years, so I thought I'd dispatch it.

[Peyrol]

Port (Latin portus)
Munt (Latin mons)
Torr (Latin turris)
Wic (Latin vicus)

I could only find four. Quite a few more Welsh words have entered English since the Old English period - a few dozen perhaps - of which the most common is probably penguin ("white head").

Inys (latin "Insula")

[Wulfhere]

Inys (latin "Insula")

That's not a word that existed in Old English. Or indeed modern English.

[Peyrol]

That's not a word that existed in Old English. Or indeed modern English.

Isn't celtic name of Anglesey Ynys Môn?

[Osweo]

Most redundantly pleonastic placename is certainly Glendale Valley.
I am from near the Longdendale Valley, which is also a triple one. :p

'river river'.
Pendlebury Hill is 'Hill Hill Hill Hill'! Beat THAT! :D



There were many more than 6 words in use in northern and western areas of England. The farmer counting system Yan tan thretha is still in use ... thats at least about 20 words there .

There is the letter (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20222)of Gospatric, from the late Anglo-Saxon period, which shows how much Welsh was present in the North, even in the mouths of the elite.

as far as I know only the amateur population-geneticist Oppenheimer claimed that, unfortunately he put his dilettante linguistic idea into a best-selling book so some people read about these things for the first time ever and believed it :rolleyes2:
That bastard wants sending to some South Sandwich Isles asbestos processing camp. :rage

[Wulfhere]

Isn't celtic name of Anglesey Ynys Môn?

It is indeed. But that's not English.

[Osweo]

It is indeed. But that's not English.

How can Welsh ynys be from Latin, if the IRISH also have a similar word inis? :confused:

[Wulfhere]

How can Welsh ynys be from Latin, if the IRISH also have a similar word inis? :confused:

Celtic and Italic diverged relatively recently, so we are told, compared to Italo-Celtic and Germanic. But having said that, different theories propose different classifications.

[Curtis24]

Its a matter of great controversy. As others have said, Oppenheimer screwed up the media perception by glibly claiming that the Anglo-Saxons were only a small portion of England's genetic ancestry.

[Alex Delarge]

Port is a celtic word? I was pretty sure it was latin.

[Odoacer]

Port is a celtic word? I was pretty sure it was latin.

Yes, a Latin word that entered Old English. I don't think anyone claimed it was Celtic. ;)

[Wulfhere]

Port is a celtic word? I was pretty sure it was latin.

There are a lot of words in Celtic that are similar to Latin. Rig ("king") for example. In fact, I don't think it's an accident that the Romans were able to take over most of Celtic Europe. They were closely related.

[Alex Delarge]

Yes, a Latin word that entered Old English. I don't think anyone claimed it was Celtic. ;)

Right, i think i misunderstood and didn't see which direction the thread went. Lack of quotes didn't help either!

[Alex Delarge]

There are a lot of words in Celtic that are similar to Latin. Rig ("king") for example. In fact, I don't think it's an accident that the Romans were able to take over most of Celtic Europe. They were closely related.

Hum... take over in what way? Make them speak a romance language? That was a very effective process indeed. But i would think brute force was involved there.

[Logan]

Hum... take over in what way? Make them speak a romance language? That was a very effective process indeed. But i would think brute force was involved there.

Perhaps somewhat. Not to those Picts and Irish left unsubdued. The Greeks took to the column without an Egyptian conquest. There are quite a few Latin based words in Gaelic.

[Wulfhere]

Hum... take over in what way? Make them speak a romance language? That was a very effective process indeed. But i would think brute force was involved there.

Yes, I'm sure it was. They just seemed to have more success in Celtic lands than elsewhere.

[Logan]

I doubt that any people could have resisted the Roman Legions. They were limited, but by a combination of other factors, much as are the North Americans of today.

[Wulfhere]

I doubt that any people could have resisted the Roman Legions. They were limited, but by a combination of other factors, much as are the North Americans of today.

The Germanic tribes resisted them. In fact, they slaughtered them and threw them out, in AD 9.

[Loki]

As others have said, Oppenheimer screwed up the media perception by glibly claiming that the Anglo-Saxons were only a small portion of England's genetic ancestry.

He destroyed his own credibility. I only read his book that far then put it down.

[Logan]

The Germanic tribes resisted them. In fact, they slaughtered them and threw them out, in AD 9.

One ambush, one battle. They Romans were at their limit geographically.

[Logan]

He destroyed his own credibility. I only read his book that far then put it down.

Strange position from someone of the surname Oppenheimer.

[Logan]

The Germanic tribes resisted them. In fact, they slaughtered them and threw them out, in AD 9.

It was to be centuries before the Germanic Tribes would be able to move into any lands that the Romans had held. Gibbon is an eloquent source. Another:


'By the fifth century Germany had turned into utter chaos. The Romans had lost most of their control over the territory that they once controlled. In AD 455 the Romans still controlled Germany, but later that year the Franks attacked and a conflict arose. By AD 457 Germany was occupied by a number of groups with both Roman and Frankish authority trying to prevail amongst all the strife. The last Roman soldiers entered into the Frankish army but still managed to keep their Roman identity. During this strife the Romans and the Franks seemed to coexist with each other. The Franks went so far as to elect Romans to serve as their kings. Sources have also shown that the Romans and the Germans allied together to fight the Goths and the Saxons. There are no specific incidents that suggest how Germany passed out of Roman hands, but the evidence seems to suggest that the Romans eventually merged with the many other groups that were occupying Germany at that time. This eventually led to the loss of identity by the Romans and this led to Germany being free of the Empire.'

Last bit in an interesting essay.

http://people.usd.edu/~clehmann/pir/germany.htm

[Alex Delarge]

Romans were formidable and Germanic tribes only managed to conquer a decadent empire centuries later. In any case Romans weren't just good at war but also at treachery and decieving. Like in Viriathus' case, leader of the Lusitanians who was killed in his sleep by bribed lusitanian men. The romans had signed a treaty of peace with them and they only conquered Lusitanian lands after his death.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viriathus

In any case, one has to admit how great Rome was:

http://www.armenian-history.com/Nyuter/HISTORY/ArmeniaBC/Roman_Empire_map.png

[Libertas]

One ambush, one battle. They Romans were at their limit geographically.

Arminius (Hermann), the great German hero, was a traitor to both sides because he had been made a Roman citizen for his services as an auxiliary soldier for the Romans.
Varus, the Roman commander, was an idiot who led a Roman army hampered by non-combatant women and children on a rambling march into German forests.

[gandalf]

There are probably more than six words of celtic origin ,
but celtic languages are not well known .

For example the word "car" come from the celtic "char" witch means charriot in french .

[Odoacer]

They are probably more than six words of celtic origin ,
but celtic languages are not well known .

For example the word "car" come from the celtic "char" witch means charriot in french .

Keep in mind, we're talking about Celtic words in Old English. "Car" is not one:


car (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=car&allowed_in_frame=0)
c.1300, "wheeled vehicle," from O.N.Fr. carre, from L. carrum, carrus (pl. carra), originally "two-wheeled Celtic war chariot," from Gaulish karros (cf. Welsh carr "cart, wagon," Breton karr "chariot"), from PIE *krsos, from base *kers- "to run." Extension to "automobile" is 1896. Car bomb first 1972, in reference to Northern Ireland.

While "car" is ultimately of Gaulish origin, it came into English by way of French, after the Norman conquest. In other words, the Celts of Britain did not introduce the word into English. :)

[gandalf]

The Germanic tribes resisted them. In fact, they slaughtered them and threw them out, in AD 9.

Battle of Teutoburug Wald , one roman defeat ,
for how many roman victories and slaughtering of germans ?

Same for celts , few victories , final disaster in Gaul .

There is no shame to reconise that courage and strenght
are not enough to win a war .

[antonio]

Its funny that Avon survived (Afon mean river in Welsh) So river avon literally means 'river river'.

Same case at Aragon(Spain) where is "río Flumen", being "flumen" Latin word for "río"/"river"...and that's a strange word, maybe sharing root with English verb "to flow" or Spanish one "fluir".

On the Gaulish (thru Normad) origin of most of Celtic words on English that should be debatable: we cannot know if some of them had correlated ones on old Britonic language.

[Wulfhere]

They are probably more than six words of celtic origin ,
but celtic languages are not well known .

For example the word "car" come from the celtic "char" witch means charriot in french .

Many of those have come in since the Old English period though, via French. However, there are some very common words in Old (and Modern) English, such as "pig" and "bird", that have no known cognates in any other Germanic language. Nor, indeed, do they have any known cognates in a Celtic language, so we simply can't say where they came from.

[johngaunt]

Many of those have come in since the Old English period though, via French. However, there are some very common words in Old (and Modern) English, such as "pig" and "bird", that have no known cognates in any other Germanic language. Nor, indeed, do they have any known cognates in a Celtic language, so we simply can't say where they came from.

Then again I think Swine is the germanic word used in English, pig comes form old English also and you are right, there is no similar word in other germanic tongues.

[Wulfhere]

Then again I think Swine is the germanic word used in English, pig comes form old English also and you are right, there is no similar word in other germanic tongues.

"Swine" is indeed cognate with words in other Germanic languages. "Pig" is a mystery though. The Welsh word for that particular animal, by the way, is mochyn, which is nothing like either. Latin porcus at least has similar consonants to "pig", but any connection must be quite distant, deep in the Indo-European past.

Like "dog" and "frog" (both Germanic), "pig" is derived from an Old English pet-form, or diminutive. There's apparently a word attested in Low German, Pugge, meaning "pet pig". So it probably is, indeed, Germanic.

[Wulfhere]

There are also a great many theories about Celtic influences on English grammar, though none of them proven.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brittonicisms_in_English#Various_Possible_Brittoni cisms

Loss of wurth

In Old English, constructions using "wurth" were used where today motion verbs like go and become are used instead e.g."What shall worthe of us twoo!" This use of motion verbs occurs in Celtic texts with relative frequency e.g. "ac am hynny yd aeth Kyledyr yg gwyllt" = "and because of this Kyledyr went mad" (Middle Welsh)

Rise in use of some complex syntactic structures

English construction of complex sentences uses some forms which in popularity may suggest a Celtic influence. Clefting in Old Welsh literature predates its common use in English by perhaps 400 years - depending on the dating of Welsh texts. Cleft constructions are more common in Breton French than Standard French and more common and versatile in Celtic English than Standard English. Clefting may be linked to the rise of a fixed word order after the loss of inflections.

Uses of himself, herself etc.

Celtic and English have formal identity between intensifier and reflexive pronoun. They share this feature only with Dutch, Maltese, Finnish, Estonian and Hungarian in Europe. In Middle English, the old intensifier "self" was replaced by a fusion of pronoun + "self" which is now used in a communication to emphasise the object in question e.g."A woman who is conspicuously generous to others less fortunate than herself."

Northern subject rule

The Northern subject rule was the general pattern of syntax used for the present-tense in northern Middle English. It occurs in some present-day dialects. The 3rd person singular verb is used for 3rd person plural subjects unless the pronoun, "they", is used and it is directly adjacent to the verb.e.g. "they sing", "they only sings", "birds sings". This anti-agreement is standard in Modern Welsh - excepting the adjacency condition. It had general usage in Old Welsh and therefore, presumably, in Cumbric.

Lack of external possessor

English does not make use of a construction called an external possessor. The only other "European" languages without the external possessor are Lezgian, Turkish, Welsh and Breton. Old English used the external possessor e.g. Seo cwen het þa þæm cyninge þæt heafod of aceorfan. "The Queen then ordered the King the head to be cut off" but Modern English must use the internal possessor "The Queen then ordered the King's head to be cut off".

Tag questions and answers

The statistical bias towards use of tag questions and answers in English, historically, instead of simply yes or no has been attributed to Celtic influence. Celtic languages do not use yes and no. Answers are made by using the appropriate verb. It has been suggested that yes is a fossilised tag answer (a combination of gea(=yes) and si(=it may be) making the 's' in yes seemingly redundant). Theo Vennemann has had a central role in the modern examination of this issue. He is also known for his work on the Vasconic substratum theory and suggests some syntactic structures can be used to diagnose a pre-Celtic substratum language - that is Semitic/Afro-Asiatic.

[Scrapple]

Well what we know of Old English is due to the written records left by those who were taught to read and write. I can't see the commoners (who we can't be certain of their exact ethnicity) of that time being taught to read and write just the elite families who were Anglo-Saxon.

So why did only 6 Celtic words end up in Old English? Because only the Anglo-Saxons elites could leave written records.

We really don't know what day to day speech was like during that time.

[Osweo]

Well what we know of Old English is due to the written records left by those who were taught to read and write. I can't see the commoners (who we can't be certain of their exact ethnicity) of that time being taught to read and write just the elite families who were Anglo-Saxon.

So why did only 6 Celtic words end up in Old English? Because only the Anglo-Saxons elites could leave written records.

We really don't know what day to day speech was like during that time.

That's not entirely watertight, but there IS something to it.

I'd add also that the churchmen had a bit of a grudge against the Welsh 'heretics' after the Synod of Whitby, and will have been less well disposed to any Brythonicisms in speech for which there were Germanic alternatives.

Anyway, once the social and ecclesiastical elites were removed in 1066, all of a sudden Middle English pops onto the scene. The differences with Old English might well have a lot of substrate reasons.

[gandalf]

There is a theory of continuity that can explain the apparent disparition
of celtic languages in both England and France .

In a few words : people of those countries didn't speak a language
close to what we usually call celtic , but were speaking a language
close to the actual language .

Quite interesting , even if it shake the mainstream theory .

http://www.proto-english.org/index.html

[Wulfhere]

There is a theory of continuity that can explain the apparent disparition
of celtic languages in both England and France .

In a few words : people of those countries didn't speak a language
close to what we usually call celtic , but were speaking a language
close to the actual language .

Quite interesting , even if it shake the mainstream theory .

http://www.proto-english.org/index.html

If Old English had been spoken in Britain during the Roman period, it would be full of Latin words, as Welsh is. In fact, more so, since south-east Britain was far more heavily Romanised than the mountainous west.

[gandalf]

I think it worth reading carefully this theory ,
it has a lot of advantages over the mainstream one ,
the more obvious is that it can answer the question of this thread :

because celtic languages aren't what we usually think they are ...

I won't say this is demonstrated but it is interesting , and
denegations of this shouldn't be as simple has Wulhere's .

For example the Latin language wasn't spoke anywhere in fact in the Roman empire ,
the proof is that Italian and romance languages are totally different from latin ,
only some vocabulary of latin survived , but not the latin's structure .

[Wulfhere]

I think it worth reading carefully this theory ,
it has a lot of advantages over the mainstream one ,
the more obvious is that it can answer the question of this thread :

because celtic languages aren't what we usually think they are ...

I won't say this is demonstrated but it is interesting , and
denegations of this shouldn't be as simple has Wulhere's .

For example the Latin language wasn't spoke anywhere in fact in the Roman empire ,
the proof is that Italian and romance languages are totally different from latin ,
only some vocabulary of latin survived , but not the latin's structure .

Nevertheless, a lot of Roman words ended up in Welsh, but virtually none in Old English. Any proponent of the theory that English was spoken in Roman Britain has to somehow explain this away.

[Treffie]

If Old English had been spoken in Britain during the Roman period, it would be full of Latin words, as Welsh is. In fact, more so, since south-east Britain was far more heavily Romanised than the mountainous west.

New evidence shows that Caerleon (http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/need-to-read/2011/08/24/romans-who-conquered-wales-may-have-landed-at-caerleon-91466-29291545/) in Wales was a Roman port (only 2 in Britain), suggesting the area was a very important place indeed.

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/icwales2/aug2011/9/3/an-artist-s-impression-of-the-newly-discovered-roman-port-at-caerleon-349623876.jpg

[gandalf]

Wulfhere read this :

http://www.proto-english.org/o3.html

The hypothesis is that east of england was already speaking a germanic language .

[Osweo]

Gandalf. That 'theory' is not 'interesting', 'curious' or 'groundbreaking'. It has no 'advantages'. It is


quite simply


absolutely fucking

STUPID .

[antonio]

the proof is that Italian and romance languages are totally different from latin ,
only some vocabulary of latin survived , but not the latin's structure .

That's not totally exact. Classical Latin and popular one (named Vulgar) could almost be considered two languages apart. And last one (a kind of simplified one spoken by the less instructed majorities) structure is basically the same than Romances to whose it finally evolved in the different areas.

Classical Latin, the one learned at least one year till recent times by all Spanish students, is a difficult matter. Vulgar one would be as easy as useless and unelegant.

So you should better talk about Classical Latin, probably at archaic variant preserving many of Indoeuropeans structures (like massive use of declinations) , from before 200 or 300 AC (an estimation from not an expert) confined progressively to official religious ceremonies, high politics and formal writings.

Ps. BTW if mochyn is Welsh for Spanish puerco, then it's probably related with many continental forms like:
French cochon
Spanish cochino
Galician cocho
and finaly, Asturian: gochu or gochín.

[Osweo]

That's not totally exact. Classical Latin and popular one (named Vulgar) could almost be considered two languages apart. And last one (a kind of simplified one spoken by the less instructed majorities) structure is basically the same than Romances to whose it finally evolved in the different areas.

Classical Latin, the one learned at least one year till recent times by all Spanish students, is a difficult matter. Vulgar one would be as easy as useless and unelegant.

So you should better talk about Classical Latin, probably at archaic variant preserving many of Indoeuropeans structures (like massive use of declinations) , from before 200 or 300 AC (an estimation from not an expert) confined progressively to official religious ceremonies, high politics and formal writings.:thumb001:


Ps. BTW if mochyn is Welsh for Spanish puerco, then it's probably related with many continental forms like:
French cochon
Spanish cochino
Galician cocho
and finaly, Asturian: gochu or gochín.
Hmm, I doubt it.

The Irish is muc. The ending -yn is probably just a diminutive in Welsh. I think the Celtic original will have been something like 'mocco'. The 'ch' in modern Welsh is pronounced like your 'j', but wasn't present in the time of the Imperium.

[Graham]

More than six...Gob, slogan, cairn, glen, loch, bog, crag, ben, banshee, Ghillie, bard

[Wulfhere]

More than six...Gob, slogan, cairn, glen, loch, bog, crag, ben, banshee, Ghillie, bard

You forgot penguin. None of those, of course, were in Old English (though a couple of them, conceivably, may have occurred as elements in place names).

[gandalf]

Gandalf. That 'theory' is not 'interesting', 'curious' or 'groundbreaking'. It has no 'advantages'. It is


quite simply


absolutely fucking

STUPID .

If you say so ... some people aren't curious but more like sheeps . :D

[Albion]

There is many theories that English may to put it simply be a Germanic language rendered in a Celtic style with Germanic and Romance vocabulary.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brittonicisms_in_English

It is very interesting to note that many proponents of this theory tend to be foreign linguists in Germany and Finland.

Some say that Mercian OE had a Celtic structure too. I personally believe that standard English is really representative of the situation across much of the country, the dialects around England probably have a great deal of Celtic influence.

I have a few PDFs and sites I'll dig out and post latter.

Also an interesting theory mentioned is that OE was the elite language and that it was written in it's purer form and that the population could have actually been speaking a highly Celtic-influenced language which evolved into Middle English.

[Riki]

Words in Portuguese and Galician Language of Celtic origin

abanqueiro[2][3] [m] 'waterfall < *(? beaver) dam', formally a derivative in -arium of *abanco, from Proto-Celtic *abankos 'beaver, water demon'[4][5] cognate of Irish abacc 'dwarf', Welsh afanc 'beaver, dwarf', Breton avank 'dwarf, sea monster'.
agruño / abruño [m] 'sloe', from proto-Celtic *agr-in-yo-,[6][7][8], influenced by Latin PRUNUM 'plum', akin to Irish áirne, Welsh eirin 'plum', Occitan agranhon, Catalan aranyó.
albó, alboio [m] 'shed, barn, enclosure', from proto-Celtic *(p)are-bow-yo-[9], cognate of Old Irish airbe 'hedge, fence, pen'.
Old Galician ambas mestas [f] 'confluence (of rivers)',[10] to Celtic *amb-[11] 'water, river' (cognate of Gaulish ambe' 'river') and Latin mixtas 'mixed'.
banzo[2] [m] (alternative spelling banço) 'crossbar, beam', from proto-Celtic *wank-yo-[12], cognate of Spanish banzo, Irish féige 'ridgepole'.
Derivatives: banza 'backrest', banzado, banzao 'palisade, dam'.
barra [f] 'garret, loft, upper platform', from proto-Celtic *barro-,[13][14] cognate of Irish, Welsh, Breton barr 'summit, top, spike'.
Derivatives: combarro, combarrizo 'shed, shelter'.


Berros.
berro [m] 'watercress', from proto-Celtic *beru-ro-,[15][16][17][18] cognate of Spanish berro, Old Irish biror, Old Breton beror, akin to French berle which derives from Gallo-Latin berula .
bico [m] 'beak, kiss', from proto-Celtic *bekko-,[19][20][21] cognate of Breton bec, Italian becco, French bec.
Derivatives: bicar 'to kiss', bicaño 'hill', bicallo (a fish, Gadus luscus).
bidueiro[2] [m] < *betūlariu, biduo [m] < *betūlu, bidulo [m] < *betūllu 'birch',[22] from Celtic *betu- or *betū-[23][24], akin to Spanish biezo, abedul, Old Irish beithe, Middle Breton bezu.
Derivatives: Bidueiral, Bidual 'place with birch-trees'.
billa,[2] alternative spelling bilha, [f] 'spigot; stick' to Proto-Celtic *belyo- 'tree, trunk'[25], akin to Irish bile 'large tree, tree trunk', French bille 'log, chunch of wood'.
borba[2] [f] 'mud, slime, mucus', from proto-Celtic *borwâ-,[26] cognate of French bourbe 'mud'.
Derivatives: borbento 'mucilaginous'.
borne [m] 'edge', from French borne, from proto-Celtic *botina.[27]
braga[2] [f] 'trousers', from proto-Celtic *braco-,[28] cognate of Spanish braga, French braie, Italian brache.
Derivatives: bragal, bragada 'spawn', bragueiro 'trus'.
braña [f] (alternative spelling branha) 'meadow, bog, quagmire', from proto-Celtic *bragno-,[29][30] cognate of Asturian braña, Catalan braina, akin to Irish brén Welsh braen Breton brein 'putrid', I bréanar W braenar B breinar 'fallow field'.
Derivatives: brañal, brañeira, brañento 'idem'.
breixo[31] [m] 'heather', from the Hispano-Celtic form *broiccios,[32] derivative of Proto-Celtic *wroyko-,[33] cognate of Old Irish froich, Welsh gwrug, French bruyere, Spanish brezo.
Old Galician bren [m] 'bran', maybe from Provençal brem, from proto-Celtic *brenno-,[34] cognate of French bran, Lombard bren.
bringa[35] [f]'stalk, rod', from *brīnikā, to Celtic *brīnos 'rod', akin to French brin 'stalk'.
brío[2] [m] 'might, power', from proto-Celtic *brigo-,[36] cognate of Spanish brío, Italian brio, Occitan briu, Welsh bri 'prestige, authority', Breton bry 'respect'.
Old Galician busto [m] 'cattle farm, dairy', from a Celtic composite *bow-sto-[37] meaning 'cow-place', cognate of Celtiberian boustom, similar to Breton boutig 'stable'.
Derivatives: bustar 'pastures'.
cai [m] 'quay, jetty', maybe from French (Normand) quai, from proto-Celtic *kag-yo-,[38][39][40] cognate of Welsh cae Breton kae 'hedge'.
cambiar 'to change', from Vulgar Latin cambiare, from proto-Celtic *kambo-,[41][42][43] cognate of Italian cambiare French changer Provençal, Catalan, Spanish cambiar.
Derivatives: cambio 'exchange', cambiador 'exchanger'.
camba[2] [f] 'wheel rim' from proto-Celtic *kambo-,[44][45][46] cognate of Old Irish camm 'crooked'.
Derivatives: cambito, cambada, camballa, cambeira 'coil; crooked log for hanging fish', cambela 'type of plough', cambota 'beam'.
camiño[2] [m] 'pathway', alternative spelling caminho, from Vulgar Latin *cammīnus, from proto-Celtic *kanxsman-,[47][48] cognate of Italian cammino, French chemin, Spanish camino, Catalan, Provençal camí; akin to Old Irish céimm, Breton cam 'step'.
Derivatives: camiñar 'to walk'.
camisa[2] [f] 'shirt' from proto-Celtic camisia.[49]
canga[2] [f] 'collar, yoke', from proto-Celtic *kambika.[50]
canto [m] 'rim, corner', from proto-Celtic *kanto-,[51] cognate of Old Irish cét 'round stone pillar, Welsh cant 'rim, tyre, dome', Breton kant 'disk', Old French chant Occitan cant, Spanish canto.
Derivatives: recanto 'corner', cantón 'extreme of a field', acantoar 'to hide, to isolate', cantil 'cliff'


A Galician traditional carro. The wheels are built with cambas or curved pieces; the laterals of the cart are called chedas.
carro [m] 'cart, wagon', from Vulgar Latin carrum, from proto-Celtic *karro-,[52][53][54] cognate of Rumanian car, Italian carro, French char, Provençal car, Spanish carro, Irish carr, Welsh car, Breton karr.
Derivatives: carreira 'road', carregar 'to load'.
cervexa[2] [f] 'beer', alternative spelling cerveja, from Vulgar Latin *cerevisiam, of Celtic origin.[55] Cognates: French cervoise, Provençal, Spanish cerveza, Welsh cwrw.
cheda[2] [f] 'lateral external board of a cart, where the crossbars are affixed', from proto-Celtic *klētā, [56][57][58] cognate of Irish clíath 'palisade, hurdle', Welsh clwyd 'barrier, wattle, scaffolding, gate', French claie, Provençal, Catalan cleda 'blinds'. Or either from proto-Celtic *klit-[59] 'pilar, post'.
choco [m] 'cowbell; squid', from proto-Celtic *klokko-,[60][61][62] cognate of Old Irish cloc, akin to French cloche 'bell', English clok.
Derivatives: chocar 'to bang, to shock', chocallo 'cowbell'.
colmea[2] [m] 'beehive', from a Celtic form *kolm-ēnā 'made of straw'.[63]
cómaro, comareiro [m] 'limits of a patch or field, usually left intentionally unploughed', from proto-Celtic *kom-(p)are-(yo)-,[64] cognate of Old Irish comair 'in front of', Welsh cyfair 'direction, place, spot, acre'. Or either to *kom-boros 'brought together'.[65]
Derivatives: acomarar 'to mark out a field (literally to dote with cómaros)'.
comba [f] 'valley, inflexion', from proto-Celtic *kumbā,[66][67][68] cognate of North Italian komba, French combe, Provençal comba, Irish com, Welsh cwm, Breton komm.
combo [m] (adj.) 'curved, bended', from proto-Celtic *kumbo-,[69][70][71] cognate of Provençal comb, Spanish combo.
Derivatives: combar 'to bend'.
comboa [f] 'corral used for capturing fish trapped in low tide', from medieval combona, from proto-Celtic *combā 'valley' or *combos 'bended'.[72]
crica [f] 'vulva; nose; ribbon', from proto-Celtic *krīkʷā,[73] cognate of Old Irish crich 'furrow, trench, boundary', Welsh crib 'comb, crest'.
croio[2] [m] 'rolling stone', croia [f] 'pip', from proto-Celtic *krowdi-,[74][75][76] cognate of Irish cruaidh 'hard, harsh' Occitan croi North Italian crojo.
Derivatives: croio (adj.) 'ugly, rude'; croído, croieira 'stony place/beach'.
crouca [f] 'head; protuberance in the back of cows and ox', from proto-Celtic *krowkā-,[77][78][79] cognate of French cruque 'mould', Irish croach 'heap', Welsh crug 'cairn, hillock', Old Breton krug 'protuberance'.
Derivatives: crocar 'swell, bulge, bruise', croque 'bump'.
curro [m] 'corral, pen; corner', from proto-Celtic *kurro-,[80] cognate of Irish carr 'protruding', Welsh cwrr 'corner, edge, brim, end', French cor 'edge, corner', Spanish corro, corral.
Derivatives: curruncho, currucho, currullo 'corner, end', currusco 'protruding part (in bread)', curral 'corral, pen'.
[edit]D - Z
embaixada [f] 'embassy', from Provençal ambaissada, from proto-Celtic *ambactus 'servant'.[81]
gabela [f] 'handful, faggot', alternative spelling gavela, from proto-Celtic *gabaglā-,[82][83][84] cognate of French javelle, Provençal gavela, Spanish gavilla; akin to Old Cornish gavael 'catch, capture'.
galga [f] 'plain stone', from *gallikā, to Proto-Celtic *gallos 'stone',[85] akin to Irish gall, French galet 'gravel' gallete 'plain cake', Spanish galga.
Derivatives: galgar 'carving a stone to make it plain and regular'.
gorar[2] 'to hatch, to brood (an egg, or a sickness)', from proto-Celtic *gʷor-,[86][87] akin to Old Irish guirid 'to warm' Welsh gori 'brood, sit (of hen)'.
Derivatives: goro 'warmed infertile egg'.
gubia [f] 'gouge', from proto-Celtic *gulb- 'beak',[88][89] cognate of Italian sgorvia, Welsh gylf.
lándoa [f] 'uncultivated plot', from *landula, Romance derivative of proto-Celtic *landā,[90][91][92] cognate of Old Irish lann 'land, plot; church', Welsh lann 'church-yard', French lande 'sandy moor, heath', Provençal, Catalan landa.
laxe[2] [f] 'stone slab', alternative spelling lage, from medieval lagena, from proto-Celtic *(p)lāgenā,[93] cognate of Old Irish lágan, láigean, Welsh llain 'broad spearhead, blade'; akin to Irish láighe 'mattock, spade'.
legua or légua[94] [f] 'league', to Proto-Celtic *leukā, cognate of French lieue, Spanish legua.
leira [f] 'plot, delimited and levelled field', from proto-Celtic *(p)lār-yo-,[95][96] akin to Old Irish làr 'ground', Old Breton lor 'floor', English floor.
Derivatives: leiro 'small, ou unleveled, plot', leirar 'land working', leiroto, leiruca 'small plot'.
Old Galician ler [m] 'sea, seashore', from proto-Celtic *liro-,[97][98] cognate of Old Irish ler, Breton llyr 'sea'.
lousa[2] [f] 'flagstone', from Proto-Celtic *laws-,[99] cognate of Provençal lausa, Spanish losa.
Derivatives: enlousar 'to cover with flagstones', lousado 'roof'.
meniño [m] 'kid, child, baby', alternative spelling meninho, from medieval mennino, from proto-Celtic *menno-,[100] akin to Irish menn 'kid, young of an animal', Welsh myn 'young goat, kid', Breton menn 'young goat'.
Derivatives: meniñez 'childhood'.


A miñoca.
miñoca [f] 'earthworm', alternative spelling minhoca, dialectal mioca, miroca, from medieval *milocca, from proto-Celtic *mîlo-,[101][102] akin to Asturian milo, meruca 'earthworm', Old Irish, Welsh, Breton mil 'animal'.
olga [f] 'patch, plot', from proto-Celtic *(p)olkā,[103][104][105] cognate of French ouche, Provençal olca.
peza [f] 'piece', alternative spelling peça, from Vulgar Latin *pettia, of Gaulish origin, from proto-Celtic *kʷezdi-,[106][107][108] cognate of Old Irish cuit 'piece', Welsh peth 'thing', Italian pezza, French pièce, Spanish pieza.
Derivatives: empezar 'to begin'.
rego [m], rega [f] 'furrow, ditch', from proto-Celtic *(p)rica,[109][110][111] cognate of Welsh rhych, French raie, Occitan, Catalan rega, Basque erreka.
Derivatives: derregar 'to mark out a field', regato 'stream, gully, glen'.
rodaballo[2] [m] 'turbot', alternative spelling rodavalho, from a Celtic composite form *roto-ball-y-o-,[112] meaning 'round-extremity'.


Galician traditional trobos or colmeas (beehives). The closer one is similar to reconstructed Iron Age huts.
tol and tola[113] [m / f] 'irrigation channel', to Proto-Celtic *tullo- 'pierced, perforated', [114] cognate of Irish toll 'hollow, cave, hole', Welsh twll 'pierced', Breton toull 'hole', Spanish tollo 'hole', Catalan toll 'pool in a river'.
tona [f] 'skin, bark, scum of milk', from proto-Celtic *tondā,[115][116][117] cognate of Old Irish tonn, Welsh tonn.
Derivatives: toneira 'pot for obtaining butter from the milk'.
toxo [m], alternative spelling tojo, 'spiny rush (ulex europaeus)', from proto-Celtic *togi-,[118] akin to French tuie Gascon toja.
Derivatives: fura-toxos 'marten'; toxa 'ulex gallii'; toxedo, toxa, toxeira 'place with toxos'.
trosma[119] [m] 'slow, heavy, awkward, fool', from proto-Celtic *trudsmo- or *truksmo- 'heavy'.[120]
trado, trade [m] 'auger', from proto-Celtic *taratro-,[121][122][123] cognate of Irish tarathar, Welsh taradr, Breton tarar, Occitan taraire, Catalan taradre, Spanish taladro.
Derivatives: tradar 'to drill'.
tranca [f], tranco [m] 'beam, pole', from proto-Celtic *taranka-,[124][125] cognate of Spanish tranca, akin to French taranche 'Iron nail', Provençal tarenco, Irish tarrag 'pin'.
Derivatives: taranzón 'pillar inside the potter's oven' < *tarankyon-, tarangallo 'Wood nail, pin', trancar 'to bar a door'.
trebo, trobo [m] 'beehive', from medieval trebano, proto-Celtic *trebno-,[126] cognate of Welsh trefn 'house'.
trogo [m] 'sadness, anxiety, pity', from proto-Celtic *trowgo-,[127][128] akin to Old Irish trog, Welsh tru 'sad, wretched', Breton truez 'pity', tru 'miserable'.
vasalo [m] 'vassal', alternative spelling vassalo, from Vulgar Latin vassalus, from proto-Celtic *wasto-,[129][130] cognate of French vassal, Spanish vasallo, Irish foss 'servant', Breton gwoz 'man, husband'.
verea [f] 'main road', from proto-Celtic *u(p)o-rēdo-,[131][132], cognate of Spanish vereda 'pathway', akin to Welsh gorwydd 'steed', Vulgar Latin veredus 'horse'.

[Riki]

Ooops

[Albion]

Why don't the English speak Welsh? (PDF) (http://www.hildegard.tristram.de/media/tristram_manchester_30-07-07.pdf)

[Albion]

That's not entirely watertight, but there IS something to it.

I'd add also that the churchmen had a bit of a grudge against the Welsh 'heretics' after the Synod of Whitby, and will have been less well disposed to any Brythonicisms in speech for which there were Germanic alternatives.

Anyway, once the social and ecclesiastical elites were removed in 1066, all of a sudden Middle English pops onto the scene. The differences with Old English might well have a lot of substrate reasons.

Yes, this is rather interesting. Middle English may have been the language of most people, comparable to Vulgar Latin in the Roman Empire.
Old English could have been older forms of the language brought with the Anglo-Saxons and written and spoken in elite circles alongside Latin.

Obviously most of the French additions came latter, but there's a very old version of Middle English that can be seen in Ormulum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ormulum) that dates back to the 12th Century. That's a pretty fast transition from Old to Middle English for a country with such divided social classes!

I can't read Old English (spot the odd word and that's it) but I can read Middle English and most of Ormulum without much difficulty.


Icc was þær þær i crisstnedd was
Orrmin bi name nemmnedd

I was there, there I christened was Orrmin by name named.

- grammar came later ;)

'Icc' was retained well into Middle English and is 'Ik' and 'Ich' in Dutch and German. The various dialects of Middle English are fascinating because they appear more like other modern Germanic languages than Modern English does. There are a lot of things that were lost in modern English which should have survived IMO.

[Albion]

I find it amazing that even that vestige of language survived in England. I think alot of the farming stock must have been purely briton, surviving on marginal land in England, maintain this counting system, 1000 years after the saxons took their lands :P .

This is likely since Anglo-Saxons came from low-lying areas of Northern Europe. In places such as Cumbria and the Yorkshire Dales it was only when Norwegians settled there that those areas lost Celtic speech. Anglo-Saxons had settled but didn't farm the hills very much, sticking to the valleys. The Norwegian Vikings on the other hand came from a mountainous landscape.
In Cumbria you can still see the patterns of Old English place names around the valleys and coast with Norse and Cumbric in the more hilly areas with the odd Old English one. Norse is also found around the coast though.

[Albion]

bump

[rashka]

There are probably more than six words of celtic origin ,
but celtic languages are not well known .
For example the word "car" come from the celtic "char" witch means charriot in french .

Keep in mind, we're talking about Celtic words in Old English. "Car" is not one:
While "car" is ultimately of Gaulish origin, it came into English by way of French, after the Norman conquest. In other words, the Celts of Britain did not introduce the word into English. :)

Proto Indo-European words
To turn: (s)kerb(h)- 'to curve, turn'
Wheel: kuel- 'to turn; wheel; neck?'

[Libertas]

Hildegard Tristram's "Why don't the English speak Welsh" quoted above is excellent and covers many points.

[Brat Ian]

Preach - Croatian pričati (prichati) talk

[Brat Ian]

*battle-leader |*ioudo-walo- | ioudo -> ljudi = people, thus leader of people not of battle
(hind)quarter (?) | *kʷetr-anī(-) (?) | obviously derived from number 4 - četiri, četvrt (quarter)


english | proto-Celtic | croatian
a third | *trijano- (?) | trećina


accuse | *kom-soud-e/o- (?) | sud = court, judgement "kome sude" = the one who is accused

eng proto-celt. croatian
air | *weto | vjetar (wind)
although | *kei, *ki (?) | iako