Serbs Will Die Out in 500 Years

[Radojica]

One married couple in Serbia has 0.81 children on average, and to renew the population, at least four children per family is recommended.

Low Birth Rate: Serbs Will Die Out in 500 Years

http://www.javno.com/slike/slike_3/r1/g2009/m07/y208894403458268.jpg

http://www.index.hr/images2/starac_i_beba_bijelakuga_v.jpg

One married couple in Serbia has 0.81 children on average, and to renew the population, at least four children per family is recommended.



In Serbia during 2008, 30 thousand less children were born that is needed to maintain the natural reproduction exchange of the population. Serbia currently has the lowest birth rate in Europe, reports the Monday issue of Belgrade’s daily “Vecernje Novosti”, stating data from the Ministry of Social Politics.

In the year 2100, central Serbia will have only 2.1 million citizens, and Vojvodina will have 800 thousand citizens, and in Kosovo the number, according to current trends, should be 4.4 million. So we will be a national minority in our own country.
They stress that the number of children per couple has fallen from 4.1 to 0.81 and that the darkest predictions by experts show that, if this continues, Serbs will biologically die out in 500 years time.

The Belgrade paper states the evaluation by the birth rate expert professor Biljana Spasic, according to which the number of marriages during the last two decades has fallen by one quarter, and that one third of marriages do not have descendants. Currently around 800 thousand citizens are seeking medical assistance in order to become parents. At the same time, data shows that around 200 thousand abortions occur per year in Serbia.

Kosovo is catching up to Serbia in population

“In the year 2100, central Serbia will have only 2.1 million citizens, and Vojvodina will have 800 thousand citizens, and in Kosovo the number, according to current trends, should be 4.4 million. So we will be a national minority in our own country” says Spasic.

During the last 17 years, Serbia has lost half a million citizens without Kosovo, according to ‘Vecernje Novosti’ who report data from the experts from the state statistics institute. The statistics say that in 1991 there were slightly more than 7.8 million citizens in the country, And today there are slightly more than 7.3 million.

They added that it is concerning that the number of Serbian citizens is falling so fast, and that in order to have a positive birth rate, every family should have at least four children.

http://www.javno.com/en-world/low-birth-rate--serbs-will-die-out-in-500-years_271376

[Radojica]

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[Karl]

In the year 2100, central Serbia will have only 2.1 million citizens, and Vojvodina will have 800 thousand citizens

I'm jealous. Year 2100 and so many Serbs? There are currently around 930 000 Estonians and it's year 2009.

Luckily, Serbia doesn't have the worst situation in Europe.

[Radojica]

I'm jealous. Year 2100 and so many Serbs? There are currently around 930 000 Estonians and it's year 2009.

Luckily, Serbia doesn't have the worst situation in Europe.

And what is the birthrate in Estonia? Bear in mind that during 20th century more than 1/3 of Serbs (all population) has been killed (during 1st Balkan, 2nd Balkan war, WWI, WWII, and recent wars at the end of 20th century)... If that was not the case, there would be now more than 40.000.000 of Serbs all over the world, instead of 15.000.000 :|...

Don't be jealous....

[Jarl]

Seems correct. Apart from Germany, the Balkans have the lowest birth rate in Europe. However, stories about extinction are way too far-fatched.

[Loki]

My ethnic group could possibly die out in coherent form within a few generations, through assimilation and dispersion -- and the lack of a place we can call a fatherland.

[Tabiti]

Seems correct. Apart from Germany, the Balkans have the lowest birth rate in Europe. However, stories about extinction are way too far-fatched.
I'm sure some people are happy about that.
However, this is statistics for Bulgarian population for the last thousand years:


1887 3 154 375
1900 3 744 283
1910 4 337 513
1926 5 478 741
1934 6 077 939
1946 7 029 349
1965 8 227 866
1985 8 948 649
1990 8 669 269
1995 8 384 715
2000 8 149 468
2001 7 891 095
2002 7 845 841
2003 7 801 273
2004 7 761 049
2005 7 720 000[1]
2006 7,679,290+

Seems we were 2 times less in 19th century, like the whole world population itself.
http://blog.lib.umn.edu/eling002/architecture/world-population.jpg
The problem is not in our number, but the constantly increasing one of the Third World countries, due to better life conditions, maybe?

[Karl]

And what is the birthrate in Estonia? Bear in mind that during 20th century more than 1/3 of Serbs (all population) has been killed (during 1st Balkan, 2nd Balkan war, WWI, WWII, and recent wars at the end of 20th century)... If that was not the case, there would be now more than 40.000.000 of Serbs all over the world, instead of 15.000.000 :|...

Don't be jealous....

The birthrate is slightly higher and Estonians have also suffered in the 20th century. World War 1, Estonian Freedom War, World War 2 and then USSR.

About 1/3 of Estonians during the entire 20th century, have been killed. Or more.

[Jarl]

My ethnic group could possibly die out in coherent form within a few generations, through assimilation and dispersion -- and the lack of a place we can call a fatherland.

Yeah! That's the problem. The Netherlands is not a massive country, yet its very urbanised and the immigration levels are of the highest in Europe. There is not too much backcountry to fall back on. And I too noticed the Dutch love to emmigrate. Most Dutch I met were not very tied to their country. That is worrying indeed.

[Laudanum]

Yeah! That's the problem. The Netherlands is not a massive country, yet its very urbanised and the immigration levels are of the highest in Europe. There is not too much backcountry to fall back on. And I too noticed the Dutch love to emmigrate. Most Dutch I met were not very tied to their country. That is worrying indeed.

Yeah. I don't really like the Netherlands too. But that's because of the nature, because I love mountains, and feel strongly connected to Norway (don't know why). But i'm still proud of my herritage! And if i'd leave my country, I would always support it, and maybe visit it sometimes.

But I think most people don't really like the Netherlands because of the immigrants and because there's not much space left. I guess most people would like freedom instead living with a lot of black people in a big city, so I do understand most of them. However, that would never be a reason for me to leave my land. If you want to leave because of that, than you will meet the same kind of problems in the future, because immigrants are spreading damn fast.

[Tabiti]

What is so bad about sights like those?:
http://www.izzicarhire.com/slike/c/netherlands.jpg
http://www.internationalsos.com/en/imagesisos/The-Netherlands(1).jpg
http://www.openkerken.be/uploads/europe/netherlands.jpg
http://www.world-hotel-reservations.com/photos/normal/europehotels_en/NetherlandsHotels_en/hotels_in_netherlands_5.jpg
Or it is just the eternal human thought "the somebody else's ... is better than my own".

[Jarl]

Speaking of the devil...


Yeah. I don't really like the Netherlands too. But that's because of the nature, because I love mountains, and feel strongly connected to Norway (don't know why). But i'm still proud of my herritage! And if i'd leave my country, I would always support it, and maybe visit it sometimes.

;) Don't worry. I did not mean you Folkstorm, but rather full-blooded Dutch I met personally in England and in the Netherlands. Anyway, you are half-Scandinavian so its understandable that you can feel more affiliated with that part of your heritage. Thats the split-or-conversion issue which affects all mixed-heritage families...


But I think most people don't really like the Netherlands because of the immigrants and because there's not much space left. I guess most people would like freedom instead living with a lot of black people in a big city, so I do understand most of them. However, that would never be a reason for me to leave my land. If you want to leave because of that, than you will meet the same kind of problems in the future, because immigrants are spreading damn fast.

I definitely think you have a point. Urbanisation, globalisaton and immigration are eroding the Dutch culture and heritage. That might contribute to the final effect. If you want to have a peaceful life in some laid-back countryside, the Netherlands are possibly not the best choice. However, the Dutch have always been a very mobile nation anyway. I find many Dutch deeply fascinated by America and Anglo-Saxon culture. And indeed, they can assimiliate very easily into the Anglo-Saxon communities.

[Laudanum]

Or it is just the eternal human thought "the somebody else's ... is better than my own".

Of course not! I'm just a big fan of mountains, (and Norwegian/Germanic culture) and there are none in the Netherlands. I walk a lot in the forests here, but I would just love to live between the mountains in a cold, snowy land.;)

There really are some nice places in the Netherlands, but it's not really my taste though. I know many people would disagree with me, but again, this is only my opinion.:)

[The Lawspeaker]

Yeah. I don't really like the Netherlands too. But that's because of the nature, because I love mountains, and feel strongly connected to Norway (don't know why). But i'm still proud of my herritage! And if i'd leave my country, I would always support it, and maybe visit it sometimes.

But I think most people don't really like the Netherlands because of the immigrants and because there's not much space left. I guess most people would like freedom instead living with a lot of black people in a big city, so I do understand most of them. However, that would never be a reason for me to leave my land. If you want to leave because of that, than you will meet the same kind of problems in the future, because immigrants are spreading damn fast.
That sums up, in a nutshell, why I myself would prefer to leave for Norway if all hell would really break loose. I have met a couple of Dutchman that left the country for Norway. One of them was a highly skilled, Surinamese colonial who remarked that "if you want to do something you don't have much of a choice but to leave".

Saddening that even a colonial notices that. He is now living in a village near Bergen and working for IKEA and feels pretty much at home. And that was a chap that thought of himself as Dutch first, Surinamese second.. if at all.
Someone else left for Bergen as she had lived in Norway off and on and decided that it would be better still to leave. She is Dutch/Norwegian and works as a waitress and served us (in Dutch).
But right now I am still staying although I kind of feel tempted.

[Tabiti]

Nothing personal, but thread is about Serbs, not Dutch;)

[The Lawspeaker]

Nothing personal, but thread is about Serbs, not Dutch;)
I know. But it is an illustration of a problem that is not just our fellow Europeans in Serbia.

[Jarl]

That sums up, in a nutshell, why I myself would prefer to leave for Norway if all hell would really break loose.

Do you actually think some Dutch emmigrate because of the volume of immigration in the Netherlands?

[Laudanum]

Do you actually think some Dutch emmigrate because of the volume of immigration in the Netherlands?

I think they do! They don't like all the non-whites here. For me, that wouldn't be a good reason to leave, but that's just for them to decide. ;)

[The Lawspeaker]

Do you actually think some Dutch emmigrate because of the volume of immigration in the Netherlands?
I think that there are several reasons: security (too much crime going on nowadays), overpopulation, the multicultural society (you see how all those are linked) and a government that is too much on our tail while Dutch are a freedom-loving people. They want a safe society, perhaps a bit homogenous or at least secure, lots of space and a possibility to work for themselves.

[Jarl]

As the result of immigration, the Netherlands has a sizeable minority of non indigenous peoples. There is also considerable emigration. In 2005 some 121,000 people left the country, while 94,000 entered it. Out of a total of 101,150 people immigrating to Netherlands in 2006, 66,658 were from Europe, Oceania, Americas or Japan, and 34,492 were from other (mostly developing) countries. Out of a total of 132,470 emigrants, 94,834 were going to Europe, Oceania, Americas or Japan and 37,636 to other countries. [9]

It seems you've got more people leaving the country than migrating into it... That was the case with 2003-2007, however in 2008:

http://statline.cbs.nl/StatWeb/publication/?VW=T&DM=SLEN&PA=03742eng&D1=0-4&D2=0-7&D6=a,!0-7&HD=090722-1915&LA=EN&HDR=T&STB=G5,G1

You got 142 000 people in, and only 116 000 out. I wonder how often those who emmigrate are ethnic Dutch...



However here lies a certain paradox. The emmigration level has been steady in 2008, just like in the previous years. The ratio changed only beacuse you received hell more (30,000) immigrants in 2008 than in the years before.

[Laudanum]

It seems you've got more people leaving the country than migrating into it... That was the case with 2003-2007, however in 2008:

http://statline.cbs.nl/StatWeb/publication/?VW=T&DM=SLEN&PA=03742eng&D1=0-4&D2=0-7&D6=a,!0-7&HD=090722-1915&LA=EN&HDR=T&STB=G5,G1

You got 142 000 people in, and only 116 000 out. I wonder how often those who emmigrate are ethnic Dutch...


Wow, I didn't know that yet. But like I said, for me it wouldn't be a reason to leave.

[The Lawspeaker]

Wow, I didn't know that yet. But like I said, for me it wouldn't be a reason to leave.
Well I knew this but it hasn't really changed the existing situation much.. or at all.

[Crvena zvezda]

I did a qucik search of this claim. Some other forum came up with the following response someone made to this article:

This topic has come up more then enoguh times already. The reponses given before will easily refute the claims made by alarmist [ often intentionally lying ].

The onyl thing good about this article is that it isn't a repeat of the bulls**t claims the trolls Tito has posted.


Quote:In Serbia during 2008, 30 thousand less children were born that is needed to maintain the natural reproduction exchange of the population. Serbia currently has the lowest birth rate in Europe, reports the Monday issue of Belgrade’s daily “Vecernje Novosti”, stating data from the Ministry of Social Politics.



Our death rate is 11.6 according to the UN [According to the CIA world factbook it is 13.86]. The UN lists our population as 7.5 million, the CIA as 7.35 million [ both are incorrect, I'll mention it later why].

The discrepancy is because the UN only counts citizens, while the CIA also counts popul;ation groups not counted by the UN stats <-- foreign citizens permanently in Serbia, refugees and repatriations.

Now using the UN figures over total number of deaths would come to around 84,000. Using the CIA figures it comes to around 102,000.

The number of births, for citizens ( posted by me around new years, link: http://www.pressonline.rs/page/stories/sr.html?view=story&id=54806§ionId=33 ) in Serbia in 2008 was 75,000 and an increase of close to 10% on the previous years.

It's a question how they get this 30,000 lack of births figures, since according to UN figures this means there are 9,000 deficit, but 27,000 using CIA figures [ remember these births ignore children born to Montenegrin citizens permanently in Serbia, refugees and repatriations ].

The birth rate argument is also absurd. Our fertility rate is 1.79 according to the UN. The following European states have fertility rates below ours. Netherlands at 1.72, Luxembourg at 1.66, Belium at 1.65, Cyprus at 1.61, Estonia at 1.49, Portugal at 1.46, FYROM at 1.43, Switzerland at 1.42, Spain at 1.41, Georgia at 1.41, Molodva at 1.4, Armenia at 1.39, Italy at 1.38, Malata at 1.37, Germany at 1.36, Croatia at 1.34, Greece at 1.33, Bulgaria at 1.31, Romania at 1.3, Latvia at 1.29, Hungary at 1.28, Lithuania at 1.26, Slovakia at 1.25, Czech Republic at 1.24, Bosnia at 1.23, Poland at 1.23, Ukraine at 1.22, Belarus at 1.2.

Amazingly it seems the vast majority of European states has a birth rate below ours.


Quote:They stress that the number of children per couple has fallen from 4.1 to 0.81 and that the darkest predictions by experts show that, if this continues, Serbs will biologically die out in 500 years time.



4.1, the last time Serbia had a birthrate like that was post-WWII. I think the people giving these results should mention what years their talking about.

For the .81 figure to be true our birth rate would have to be about 20% below that of spain. Spain has 0.95 rate but a birth rate of 1.41 ( compared to Serbia's 1.79 ).


Quote:The Belgrade paper states the evaluation by the birth rate expert professor Biljana Spasic, according to which the number of marriages during the last two decades has fallen by one quarter, and that one third of marriages do not have descendants. Currently around 800 thousand citizens are seeking medical assistance in order to become parents. At the same time, data shows that around 200 thousand abortions occur per year in Serbia.



These claims here seems to be the only ones in the article based on facts.


Quote:“In the year 2100, central Serbia will have only 2.1 million citizens, and Vojvodina will have 800 thousand citizens, and in Kosovo the number, according to current trends, should be 4.4 million. So we will be a national minority in our own country” says Spasic.



Emigration to Vojvodina is low. They can't explain how Vojvodina's population drops by only 60%, but the rest of Serbia by 72%.

What even more goes against this vision is the fact that the rest of Serbia has a larger birth rate then Vojvodina. Has had one since WWII, and while the rest of Serbia [ignoring Kosovo] went to a sub-2.1 birth rate around the late 80s / early 90s, it happenned in Vojvodina in the 70s.

Also. Comparing Central Serbia ( ignoring Kosovo ), and Vojvodina the abortion rate in Vojvodina is twice as high.

Furthermore. your talking about something in a hundred years ago. In that time population dynamuics can change.

If I'm not mistaken pro-natalists just three years ago were claiming that by 2050 Kosovo would have 6.5 million people <-- an argument the Soros funded Forum for Ethnic Relations used as propaganda to get people to support Kosovo seperation.


Quote:During the last 17 years, Serbia has lost half a million citizens without Kosovo, according to ‘Vecernje Novosti’ who report data from the experts from the state statistics institute. The statistics say that in 1991 there were slightly more than 7.8 million citizens in the country, And today there are slightly more than 7.3 million.



This argument is absurd. I wonder if this person is aware that the methodology used in the census has changed since 1991.

In 1991 citizens who were sojourners [ spent a significant time aborad each year ] were counted as being permanently risdent in Serbia. In 2002 this was changed. By not countign these our population fell from 7.8 million to 7.5 million <-- it's more accurate level.

Here is the specific information regarding sojourners.
http://sr.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9F%D0%B....%A4%D0%A0%D0%88

http://sr.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9F%D0%B....%B8%D1%98%D0%B8

In 1991, counting sojourners we had 7,822,795 citizens counted in the census. Without sojourners this number is 7,576,837.

In 2002, coutning sojourners we had 7,893,125 citizens counted in the cnesus. Without sojoruners this nubmer is the 7,498,001 often cited.

Now the fall to 7.3 million, in actuallity to 7.35 million, can likely also be linked to sojoruners and immigration.

Again I must add that all these claims amde in this article ignore four important groups not counted:
* Montenegrin citizens in Serbia. Number some 300,000. They have a birth rate slightly above the 2.1 rate.
* Refugees from Bosnia and Hercegovina. Number over 500,000+. From my experience they seem to have a birthrate 50% higher then that of citizens.
* Internally displaced people from Kosovo. Number some 200,000+. Like rfugees tend to have a birthrate 50% higher then that of citizens.
* Repatriations. They number some 50,000. From 2007 - 2011 <-- the next census, their will be 150,000. [ There return was a requirement ot get visa free status.]

^^^ The discrepancy of UN figures and CIA figures seem to involve these groups. CIA counts all deaths, UN only counts those of people with definitive status.


Quote:They added that it is concerning that the number of Serbian citizens is falling so fast, and that in order to have a positive birth rate, every family should have at least four children.



Also. Emigration is never dealth by natalists The drop in piopulation can easily be attributed to immigration. I haven't heard definitive figures on this. And will not post about them.

The positive birth rate argument is crap hear. A positive birthrate is 2.1. Pro-natalists claim their should be 3 children born per women, I guess this year they diecided to up the figure to claim that the situation is more dire when it isn't. [Ironcially made the year after a 10% jumps in births was recorded].

[Crvena zvezda]

And what is the birthrate in Estonia? Bear in mind that during 20th century more than 1/3 of Serbs (all population) has been killed (during 1st Balkan, 2nd Balkan war, WWI, WWII, and recent wars at the end of 20th century)... If that was not the case, there would be now more than 40.000.000 of Serbs all over the world, instead of 15.000.000 :|...

Don't be jealous....

Add communism.

The communists promoted 2 children as a sign of progress after 1953 and discouraged the republics from pursuing pro-natalist policies [Serbia, Croatia, Bosnia had the most liberal abortion policies in Europe (Serbia still doe, the other two I'm not sure)].

Slovenia's gave money for mothers with more births but it wasn't successful [their poopulation wanted up only some 20% in the 20th century]. In Kosovo they allowed the Albanians to give 4 times the amount in grants then Slovenia did <-- encouraging the Albanians to waste funds from other republics and have more births, under the gorunds that it would cuase problems if these funds were not allowed like in the other rpeublic.

FYROM never ahd any natalist policies.

[Amarantine]

uh I'm avoiding even to think about that...what to say about Montenegrins? I don't want to know! But there is a hope of course since Belgrade is the major Montenegrin city:P

[Brynhild]

Perhaps a breeding program by some of you nice young people? How hard can it be? :D

[Guapo]

uh I'm avoiding even to think about that...what to say about Montenegrins? I don't want to know! But there is a hope of course since Belgrade is the major Montenegrin city:P


Yipee...We are saved :love: :p

[Guapo]

Perhaps a breeding program by some of you nice young people? How hard can it be? :D


I don't know about the others but I already have a program going :D

[Amarantine]

I don't know about the others but I already have a program going :D

I fulfilled it, but there is always a chance to added one more "project" ;)

[Jarl]

Perhaps a breeding program by some of you nice young people? How hard can it be? :D

:P Yeah! Im in!

[Radojica]

I don't know about the others but I already have a program going :D


I fulfilled it, but there is always a chance to added one more "project" ;)

It's my turn then :coffee:?!

[Svarog]

I don't want to know! But there is a hope of course since Belgrade is the major Montenegrin city:P

I'd say that Novi Sad is the major Montenegrin city, looks like every second person I run across is a Montenegrin these days, not that I mind or anything.

[Osweo]

I'd say that Novi Sad is the major Montenegrin city, looks like every second person I run across is a Montenegrin these days, not that I mind or anything.

Hehe, maybe they heard your comments on the gender ratios for that town? I certainly haven't forgotten! :naughty: It's my provisional Plan B...

Or are these Crnogortsy also mostly girls, and thus part of the 'problem'? :eek:;)

[Amarantine]

I'd say that Novi Sad is the major Montenegrin city, looks like every second person I run across is a Montenegrin these days, not that I mind or anything.

Novi Sad-Podgorichani, Niksicani, Pljevljaci, itd
Vrbas-exclusively Niksicani
Beograde, Beograde-svi mi...hehehe
Uzice i Sumadija-srednja CG-Kolasinci mostly, Moracani, Vasojevici

[Macedonia]

http://jeffmcintirestrasburg.greenoptions.com/files/images/laughing%20baby%20(cropped).jpg

[Atlas]

Dobardan. The Serbs are not in the worst situation ! No non-white in Serbia beside some gypsies (ever seen a black man in Beograd, me never). The worrying news is the low birthrate and the one of their ennemy of the south and east.

[Poltergeist]

Novi Sad-Podgorichani, Niksicani, Pljevljaci, itd
Vrbas-exclusively Niksicani
Beograde, Beograde-svi mi...hehehe
Uzice i Sumadija-srednja CG-Kolasinci mostly, Moracani, Vasojevici

So then, in 2006, it wasn't Montenegro that split from Serbia. but Montenegro split from another Montenegro?:D

[Guapo]

Montenegro's organized cigarette smugglers split from Serbia.

[Crvena zvezda]

So then, in 2006, it wasn't Montenegro that split from Serbia. but Montenegro split from another Montenegro?:D

Given that the voting procedures were corrupt it was the Muslims who enabled the seperation.

The number of citizens living abroad allowed tended to favour Bosniaks and Muslims.

Western media like the New York times even acknowledged this. Before you start claiming that as a lie.

[Svarog]

If only Montenegrin people voted they would never separate, Albanians and corrupted votes won on that day, Albanians from Albania even crossed borders and voted with ids of Montenegrin people who died 20 years ago, there are literal cases where brothers from the same mother and a father, one consider himself a Serb, the other one a Montenegrin lol

[Radojica]

there are literal cases where brothers from the same mother and a father, one consider himself a Serb, the other one a Montenegrin lol

haha, i witnessed the case when the wife of my uncle, who is declaring as Serbian although she is born there, threw out from the flat the brother of his husband (my 2nd uncle) because he entered their flat with the flag of Montengro :eek:!She is my favorite aunt :cool:

[Crvena zvezda]

If only Montenegrin people voted they would never separate, Albanians and corrupted votes won on that day, Albanians from Albania even crossed borders and voted with ids of Montenegrin people who died 20 years ago, there are literal cases where brothers from the same mother and a father, one consider himself a Serb, the other one a Montenegrin lol

I haven't heard of those. I've heard of ID cars being the sole requirement to vote and that the cards were given to Albanians from Kosovo, in most cases the ID cards were less then 6 months old <-- the requirement was 6 month residency in Montenegro to vote.

Then there were several bribery cases. Including several offering prisoners early parole to vote against the union.

Then there were threats to fire public employees if they didn't vote for independence. Casdting doubt on whether their was a secret ballot.

The fact that many students from Belgrade couldn't vote, who technically met the residency requirement, were blocked but up to some 15,000 Bosniaks [ incluging a Bosnian minister who boasted of revenge against the Serbs in Sarajevo media] and Albanians from abroad could vote.

Of course the fact that refugees, over 10,000 votes, mostly can't vote in montenegro.

[Марко Краљевић]

Serbia is following West in bad examples only, whilst not in good ones. We have first world birth rate whilst having third world economy (importing everything, exporting food only). Currently I am at Dubna in Russia, and here it looks like that a lot of young couples are having children, it is pleasant to see playing grounds filled with children, and with an indigenous one too. This is not the case in Serbia though. Look like that Putin's policies are giving some modest results.

[Thraex]

1887 3 154 375
1900 3 744 283 (Rapid growth post-Ottoman occupation: Bulgaria grows by 589,908 in a period of 13 years)
1910 4 337 513 (Even more rapid growth: Bulgaria grows by 593,230 in just 10 years)
1926 5 478 741 (Population boom: Bulgaria grows by 1,141,228 in just 16 years)
1934 6 077 939 (Growth post-Ottoman occupation: the population grows by 2 million and half in 47 years
1946 7 029 349 (Post-war Bulgaria, Communism takes over)
1965 8 227 866 (Bulgaria's population increases by a million and 200,000 after 19 years)
1985 8 948 649 (Stagnancy, the population increases by only 700,000 in the last 20 years)
1990 8 669 269 (Decline, the population drops by 300,000 in just 5 years)
1995 8 384 715
2000 8 149 468
2001 7 891 095
2002 7 845 841
2003 7 801 273
2004 7 761 049
2005 7 720 000
2006 7,679,290
2009 7,204,687
2050 EST. 4,500,000Looks like the growth of our population plateaued during Communism and has been in decline for the last 20 years.

[Jarl]

Looks like the growth of our population plateaued during Communism and has been in decline for the last 20 years.

Wait until Bulgaria joins ze Euro-zone.


Btw. Are there any limits set on Bulgarian emmigration to EU?

[Arne]

Btw. Are there any limits set on Bulgarian emmigration to EU?
I hope so.. because the Germans are against Turkics inside of the EU.
Sounds Reasonable for me.

[The Lawspeaker]

I hope so.. because the Germans are against Turkics inside of the EU.
Sounds Reasonable for me.
Bulgarians are no Turks. But yes.. I hope that they will set a limit as gypo's can use Bulgarian passports to travel here and as a matter of fact they already do.

[Thraex]

Bulgarians are no Turks. But yes.. I hope that they will set a limit as gypo's can use Bulgarian passports to travel here and as a matter of fact they already do.

Yeah, that they do but that number isn't too high since it's not often that a gypsy has a passport nor do a gypsy travel that far. Mostly it's the young uns who travel to Western countries (and bring their pickpocketing ways with them).


Wait until Bulgaria joins ze Euro-zone.

Poland is already poised to reduce from 38 million to 33 million by 2050 (and maybe even 25 million by 2100) so we're not going to be the only ones who are going to drop numbers pretty fast.



Btw. Are there any limits set on Bulgarian emmigration to EU?I dunno, I don't think Bulgarians have been migrating to a specific European country in large numbers. I think it's mostly because Bulgarians still have to apply for a work permit whereas Poles don't have to.

[hajduk]

The passport of everybody in Bulgaria has a paragraph "Nationality: Bulgarian".

EAD, not every person holding a Bulgarian passport is an ethnic Bulgarian, many "Bulgarians" that moved to Western Europe (which is good for Bulgaria from a racial point of view) in fact are gypsies, turks, or even arabs and blacks - Yes they use Bulgaria as a trampoline for Western Europe.