Apollonaris

My Response to Norse Sword on Gay Marriage, Part I

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Quote Originally Posted by Norse Sword View Post
In fact, you could spend all day citing that fact,
Ok, you originally asserted that

Quote Originally Posted by Norse Sword View Post
... actual data of studies done in Denver Colorado ... clearly indicates Homosexuals are 78% more likely to contract a STD, compared to Heterosexuals, {the control group}.
Let's take a look at the evidence you've provided to prove your claims.

The abstract of the Oxford Journal study you linked to says that homosexual men are "significantly more likely" than heterosexual men to have gonorrhea, early syphilis, and anal warts.

"Overall, homosexual men were significantly (p < 0.001) more likely than heterosexual men to have gonorrhea (30.31% vs. 19.83 %), early syphilis (1.08% vs. 0.34%) and anal warts (2.90% vs. 0.26%) ..."

However, it then goes on to say that homosexual men are "less likely" than heterosexual men to have nongonococcal urethritis, herpes genitalis, pediculosis pubis, scabies, and genital warts.

"... but less likely to have nongonococcal urethritis (NGU) (14.63% vs. 36.40%, p < 0.001), herpes genitalis (0.93% vs. 3.65%, p < 0.001), pediculosis pubis (4.30% vs. 5.35%, p < 0.005), scabies (0.42% vs. 0.76%, p < 0.02), and genital warts (1.68% vs. 6.69%, p < 0.001)."

This study does not prove that homosexuals are more likely than heterosexuals to contract an STD. The study only says that homosexual males are "significantly more likely" to have certain types of STDs, while heterosexual males are more likely to have other types of STDs.

Quote Originally Posted by Norse Sword View Post
And of course, the AIDS infection rate is really telling.....
The avert.org report you linked to shows that 73% of persons diagnosed with HIV in 2008 were male adult or adolescents. Of these, 63% (24,132) were infected through male-to-male contact.

"CDC statistics show that in 2008, 73% of persons living with a diagnosis of HIV infection were male adults or adolescents.

Over half (63%) of adult and adolescent males living with an HIV diagnosis in 2008 became infected through male-to-male sexual contact, around 17% of those diagnosed were infected through injecting drug use and 12% through heterosexual contact."


However, the report also shows that 73% of adult and adolescent females (8,706) diagnosed with HIV in 2008 were infected through heterosexual contact.

"The majority of female adult and adolescents living with an HIV diagnosis in 2008 were infected with the virus through heterosexual contact (73%). Most of the remaining females were infected through injecting drug use."


Thus, while the report does say that males are more likely to contract HIV through homosexual contact, it also says that the percentage of homosexual males with HIV who are infected through homosexual contact is actually lower than the percentage of female heterosexuals with HIV who are infected through heterosexual contact.

Most importantly, the report does not tell us what percentage of male homosexuals in the homosexual population as a whole are infected with HIV; it only tells us what percentage of males with HIV were infected through homosexual contact. This is an important distinction.

In fact, on the very same website you linked to above, it says that it is Blacks, more than any other group, who are the most likely to become infected with HIV, and that Blacks account for half of all people infected with HIV in the United States (here).

"To date, over 230,000 African Americans have died of AIDS - nearly 40 percent of total deaths - and of the more than 1 million people living with HIV in the United States of America today, almost half are black. And yet, as a racial group, African Americans represent just 13 percent of the US population. The estimated lifetime risk of becoming infected with HIV is 1 in 16 for black males, and 1 in 30 for black females, a far higher risk than for white males (1 in 104) and white females (1 in 588). In Washington D.C, which has the nation’s highest district HIV prevalence (3 percent), three-quarters of those infected with HIV are African American. According to the National HIV/AIDS Strategy, African Americans 'comprise the greatest proportion of HIV/AIDS cases across many transmission categories, including among women, heterosexual men, injection drug users, and infants.' "

The avert.org website states that Blacks made up an estimated 50% of new HIV diagnoses in 2009, Whites 27%, and Latinos/Hispanics 19%. The following chart from the same website shows that Blacks are the largest group diagnosed with HIV infection.



As an aside, a recent study by Hugo Mialon and Andrew Francis (In Sickness and in Health: Same-Sex Marriage Laws and Sexually Transmitted Infections) has found evidence that "societal tolerance toward gays is inversely associated with the HIV rate." One of the authors of the study, Hugo Mialon, an associate professor of economics at Emory University, outlined the results of his study in the following article ("An Attitude Adjustment" August 10, 2011):

"In work with my Emory University colleague, Andrew Francis, we have found evidence that societal tolerance toward gays is inversely associated with the H.I.V. rate. To measure tolerance, we used the General Social Survey, which has tracked the attitudes of Americans for the past four decades. Our estimates suggest that a 20 percentage point rise in tolerance toward gays — which corresponds approximately to the extent to which tolerance rose in America from the early 1990s to today — is associated with one fewer case of H.I.V. per 100,000 people per year.

"Societal intolerance toward gays tends to drive homosexual behavior underground. This type of risky behavior is characterized by anonymous encounters with high-risk individuals in secret, socially disconnected venues like parks, beaches and bathhouses, known as “cruisy” areas. Conversely, social acceptance of gays induces gay men to interact in open and socially mediated venues associated with less risky sexual behaviors, which decreases the rate of H.I.V. transmission among homosexuals. It also reduces the H.I.V. rate among heterosexuals, by altering the behavior of bisexuals and other men who have sex with men.

"How might this relate to the racial gap in H.I.V.? Tolerance toward gays among whites has risen considerably over the past two decades, with the percentage of white Americans expressing tolerance more than doubling to 42 percent in 2006 from 20 percent in 1990. In contrast, tolerance toward gays among blacks has risen much less, with the percentage of blacks expressing tolerance rising to 21 percent in 2006 from 16 percent in 1990. These are significant cultural changes, but there is a lot of room for increased tolerance, especially among blacks. Promoting tolerance toward gays among blacks may be a way to reduce the racial gap in H.I.V. infection rates. Perhaps the simplest policy would involve a public information campaign to show how much black gay people have in common with black straight people."

SOURCE: The New York Times
Quote Originally Posted by Norse Sword View Post
There are even statistics for African American Women who contract AIDS from Black Men who are Bisexual, Called on the down low.

Ironically, these are indivduals who can turn their 'Gayness" on or off.

African-American men "on the down low" may also be a factor in the burden of HIV on African-American women. This describes men who have sex with men and women, but who do not identify themselves as gay or bisexual. African-American women may not be aware of their partners' HIV risk factors.
The third link that you provided, the one to the Dakota Voice article, provided no statistics to prove your assertion that Black men "on the down low" are infecting Black women with HIV. (None of the other links you gave provided any evidence of this either.)

Quote Originally Posted by Norse Sword View Post
Reuters is reporting on the latest release from the Centers for Disease Control on Sexually Transmitted Diseases.
...

With gonorrhea, homosexual men were four times more likely to have the disease than heterosexual men (36% versus 9%).
This assertion is from the same Dakota Voice article already cited above. Following the link to the actual Reuters article (referenced in the Dakota Voice article) reveals that

"In addition, more than 350,000 cases of gonorrhea were reported in 2007, essentially unchanged from 2006, the CDC said. Gonorrhea rates fell dramatically from the mid-1970s through the mid-1990s, with little progress since.

Chlamydia and gonorrhea are easily diagnosed and treated, but frequently have no symptoms and remain undetected."




The above graphic from the CDC website shows the increase in gonorrhea rates since 2001 (notice that the article said that "gonorrhea rates fell dramatically from the mid-1970s through the mid-1990s"). The Reuters article than goes on to explain why there has been this increase in STDs, especially among HIV positive gay men:

"Douglas said many cases are occurring in HIV-positive men who are choosing other HIV-positive men as sexual partners.

" "Within that relationship, they are less concerned about the transmission of other conditions. They're not using condoms. They believe that their partner already has got the worst they can get -- they've got an HIV infection," he said."


This has less to do with homosexual sex acts and more to do with not practicing safe sex. In any case, I'll give you a pass on this one, if only because you directly quoted an actual source. However, this isn't going to help your case at all, since it doesn't even come close to proving your original assertion.

So, in conclusion: You originally asserted that

Quote Originally Posted by Norse Sword View Post
... actual data of studies done in Denver Colorado ... clearly indicates Homosexuals are 78% more likely to contract a STD, compared to Heterosexuals, {the control group}.
None of the links you provided were to the Denver Colorado study or even referenced the Denver Colorado study. None of the links you gave provided any evidence that can prove your original claim that "homosexuals are 78% more likely to contract an STD" than heterosexuals. None of the articles, studies or reports you linked to provided any evidence whatsoever that backed up any of the claims you made.

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Updated 09-15-2011 at 12:44 AM by Apollonaris

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