Nordish Riffian?

[Longbowman]

Sorry, but Nordoid influences are a minor element in the Berber populations.

No more than you'd expect from a population that used to be ruled by Vandals, once had a thriving European Slave Market, and benefited from Roman trade and Phonoecian colonies throughout its history.

This conversation is Danishberber's wet dream though ^^

[Übermensch]

exotic nordid.

[Furnace]

She would look pretty much like your average med without that dyed hair.

[Sidi Atlas]

No more than you'd expect from a population that used to be ruled by Vandals, once had a thriving European Slave Market, and benefited from Roman trade and Phonoecian colonies throughout its history.

The central base of the Vandals was Carthage, present day Tunisia. Tunisians seem to be much swarthier than Kabyles, so I don't see the correlation of fairer features with Vandal presence. I read as well that Vandals, where utterly destroyed by the Byzantines, the ones that weren't killed were sold as slaves through their empire.

[Longbowman]

The central base of the Vandals was Carthage, present day Tunisia. Tunisians seem to be much swarthier than Kabyles, so I don't see the correlation of fairer features with Vandal presence. I read as well that Vandals, where utterly destroyed by the Byzantines, the ones that weren't killed were sold as slaves through their empire.

A) it is doubtful they left no lasting presence. B) Carthage is no more, so as you say, the ones that set up camp there would have suffered far greater, thus leaving the Kabyles' area with more Visigoth presence. C) there's still the matter of the slave trade, regular trade, and colonies.

[Damião de Góis]

She would look pretty much like your average med without that dyed hair.

Not from here, i can't think of anyone similar.

[Furnace]

Not from here, i can't think of anyone similar.

Yes, she is more east med than med.

[Sidi Atlas]

A) it is doubtful they left no lasting presence. B) Carthage is no more, so as you say, the ones that set up camp there would have suffered far greater, thus leaving the Kabyles' area with more Visigoth presence. C) there's still the matter of the slave trade, regular trade, and colonies.

A) what kind of lasting presence if we're talking about negligible proportions in the total population?
B) I think you mean Vandal presence? I haven't read anything about Vandals setting up camps in Kabylie ... maybe you have more info.
C) peasants in a poor mountain region don't implicate in slave trade and colonies. It's towns and cities that are most affected, ironically people tend to be darker there.

There is nothing that proves that lighter hair and eyes are foreign (or a result of recent admixture) in North Africa. Even Ancient Egyptians noted the fairer features among certain Berbers (Meshwesh).

Not from here, i can't think of anyone similar.

Indeed she looks average coastal Maghrebi with dyed hair.

[Longbowman]

A) what kind of lasting presence if we're talking about negligible proportions in the total population?
B) I think you mean Vandal presence? I haven't read anything about Vandals setting up camps in Kabylie ... maybe you have more info.
C) peasant in a poor mountain region don't implicate in slave trade and colonies. It's in towns and cities that are most affected, ironically people tend to be darker there.

There is nothing that proves that lighter hair and eyes are foreign (or a result of recent admixture) in North Africa. Even Egyptians noted the fairer features among certain ancient Berbers (Meshwesh).

Considering millions of European slaves were sold in Morocco, and considering the Vandal input, I'm going to assume the rare instances of individuals with light complexions are of distant foreign origin.

What kind of lasting presence? Any. Even if a few hundred survived to propagate their genes, their genes would survive. The Vandals travelled through all North Africa, and had an impact on all populations west of Libya. But my main issue is with the more recent Spanish colonisation and slave trade. The fact that coastal denizens are darker is a coincidence. They're not native traits. The Egyptians only commented on lighter skin colour as compared to the Egyptians of the time.

[Sidi Atlas]

Considering millions of European slaves were sold in Morocco, and considering the Vandal input, I'm going to assume the rare instances of individuals with light complexions are of distant foreign origin.

What kind of lasting presence? Any. Even if a few hundred survived to propagate their genes, their genes would survive. The Vandals travelled through all North Africa, and had an impact on all populations west of Libya. But my main issue is with the more recent Spanish colonisation and slave trade. The fact that coastal denizens are darker is a coincidence. They're not native traits. The Egyptians only commented on lighter skin colour as compared to the Egyptians of the time.

I think you're mixing up a lot of things up. The slave trade is another subject (numbers which you claim always lead back to one controversial and doubtful source, "Christian Slaves, Muslim Masters: White Slavery in the Mediterranean, the Barbary Coast, and Italy, 1500-1800", Robert Davis, but even here it doesn't speak about millions).

The girl I posted is Kabyle. So let us remain in the Kabyle region, which history is quite different than that of Morocco.