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Thread: Who were the proto semites?

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    Default Who were the proto semites?

    My fathers haplogroup J1-P58 is associated with proto semitic people.
    Who were they?
    What language did they speak?
    Where did they originate from?
    What people descended from them?
    When did it mutate into J1c3d?

    Any help would be appreciated!

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    Well, the proto-semitic speakers originated in the southern levant, and they are characterized by the haplogroup J1c3 or J1e. Arabians are overwhelmingly descended from such peoples(esp yemenis), but also in other places in the levant(palestinians 55 percent, syrians 54 percent and etc).
    https://www.ceremade.dauphine.fr/~ry...erIWSM2011.pdf

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilgamesh900 View Post
    Well, the proto-semitic speakers originated in the southern levant, and they are characterized by the haplogroup J1c3 or J1e. Arabians are overwhelmingly descended from such peoples(esp yemenis), but also in other places in the levant(palestinians 55 percent, syrians 54 percent and etc).
    https://www.ceremade.dauphine.fr/~ry...erIWSM2011.pdf
    So what is the timeline here? I know J1-P58 is approx. 8k years old and semitic languages are about 5k years old so when did proto semites migrate south to populate yemen?

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    The Proto-Semitic people originated in the Fertile Crescent region (not Arabia):



    They spoke "proto-Semitic" e.g. a Semitic urheimat, the earliest historical example of being Akkadian



    The Fertile Crescent region was one of the main centres of early human civilisation (along with the Indus Valley, Egypt, China and the Americas) and was a temperate zone both during and after the Ice Age(es):



    Most Near Eastern populations are in part descended from Proto-Semitic peoples:



    For instance:

    The results of these scientific studies lead to the startling realization that Turks, Iranians, Kurds, Iraqis, Jordanians, Lebanese are more closely related genetically to Assyrians than they are to other members of their own respective language families in Asia. These seven groups (and Jews) are genetically close.
    http://www.atour.com/health/docs/20000720a.html
    Spoiler!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anglojew View Post
    The Proto-Semitic people originated in the Fertile Crescent region (not Arabia):



    That spoke "proto-Semitic" e.g. a Semitic urheimat the earliest historical example of being Akkadian



    The Fertile Crescent region was one of the main centres of early human civilisation (along with the Indus Valley, Egypt, China and the Americas) and was a temperate zone both during and after the Ice Age(es):



    Most Near Eastern populations are in part descended from Proto-Semitic peoples:



    For instance:



    http://www.atour.com/health/docs/20000720a.html
    Werent the akkadians a semitic people though?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anglojew View Post
    The Proto-Semitic people originated in the Fertile Crescent region (not Arabia):



    That spoke "proto-Semitic" e.g. a Semitic urheimat the earliest historical example of being Akkadian



    The Fertile Crescent region was one of the main centres of early human civilisation (along with the Indus Valley, Egypt, China and the Americas) and was a temperate zone both during and after the Ice Age(es):



    Most Near Eastern populations are in part descended from Proto-Semitic peoples:



    For instance:



    http://www.atour.com/health/docs/20000720a.html
    Werent the akkadians a semitic people though?

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    Quote Originally Posted by oblivion View Post
    Werent the akkadians a semitic people though?
    Yes. Proto means "first" or "before" in Greek. It's just a reference to pre-history or before we have evidence. Therefore anything before the Akkadians are considered "proto" but there may be no actual difference in language or ethnicity. Basically we could see groups such as the Assyrians being the best modern representatives of Proto-Semites as well as some Jews, Palestinians, Iraqis, Syrians etc. Even linguistically unrelated peoples, because of assimilation and conquest, such as some Kurds and Turks are direct descendants too.
    Spoiler!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anglojew View Post
    Yes. Proto means "first" or "before" in Greek. It's just a reference to pre-history or before we have evidence. Therefore anything before the Akkadians are considered "proto" but there may be no actual difference in language or ethnicity. Basically we could see groups such as the Assyrians being the best modern representatives of Proto-Semites as well as some Jews, Palestinians, Iraqis, Syrians etc. Even linguistically unrelated peoples, because of assimilation and conquest, such as some Kurds and Turks are direct descendants too.
    So my paternal lines family broke off about 8k ears ago making me a descendant of proto semites... Correct?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anglojew View Post
    Yes. Proto means "first" or "before" in Greek. It's just a reference to pre-history or before we have evidence. Therefore anything before the Akkadians are considered "proto" but there may be no actual difference in language or ethnicity. Basically we could see groups such as the Assyrians being the best modern representatives of Proto-Semites as well as some Jews, Palestinians, Iraqis, Syrians etc. Even linguistically unrelated peoples, because of assimilation and conquest, such as some Kurds and Turks are direct descendants too.
    Assyrians are not the best represntation of proto-semites, mainly because they cluster very closely to armenians and etc who arent genetically semitic. The proto-semitic languages originated in the southern levant, and they are characterized by the haplogroup, J1c3 or J1e, which most arabians are descended from.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oblivion View Post
    So my paternal lines family broke off about 8k ears ago making me a descendant of proto semites... Correct?
    I'd just say that you're a direct descendant paternally of the earliest Semitic peoples. You're therefore very Near Eastern; Your ancestors were responsible for some of the earliest and most influential civilisations in human history without which there could be no Europe (named after a Semitic Goddess) or modernity as we know them today.
    Last edited by Anglojew; 10-15-2014 at 01:30 PM.
    Spoiler!

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