Black Pete Racist? 'Zwarte Piet' Controversy Leads To 90 Arrests In Netherlands

[Oneeye]

Most inhabitants of the Netherlands had not seen any black people until the 1970s, when Suriname became independent. The Netherlands, though big in the slave trade and transport (the Dutch were the largest European slave traders in the 17th century, shipping over half a million slaves to Dutch colonies in the Western Hemisphere and were the last to abolish slavery, at least on paper) never allowed slavery within its own borders.

The Netherlands is actually a quite racist and xenophobic society. Just look at their recent politics and laws. If you're Dutch and marry a foreign spouse, your government's policy is to make you leave the country. Yet, other Europeans and their spouses can move to the Netherlands with no barriers at all. Dutch people whine and complain how no one speaks their language, but when foreigners do, they're derided and insulted that they don't speak perfectly and have blonde hair and blue eyes. Even then, the government wants you to pay $15,000 for a useless course on how to visit the doctor, ask for govt assistance and find a job. Should you already have a job and not need any assistance, then they will threaten to fine you and take away your residency permit (forget getting the passport - not possible) if you don't quit your job and go take a freaking course.

Also, you know it was the Dutch who invented apartheid. right?

If I dressed up as Zwarte Piet, would you like to blanda upp?

[Dandelion]

If I dressed up as Zwarte Piet, would you like to blanda upp?

That story about that mandatory course could be true though. The Netherlands are very organised. Result is better integrated society than in most European countries (though layered with overlap) and less chaos. Downside is that people who don't need it are setback. Hypercorrect rules.

However, I wouldn't trust the word of a snobby expat. I like foreigners, but I know for one that expats are often a bunch of wine-guzzling snobs who pretend to know the country they reside in inside out and judge it by some international bias (usually Anglo-Saxon with their history in mind, as most culture the world enjoys comes from there). What expats write on their forums about Belgium is very offensive about Flemish and Walloon while they live in East Brussels (the only rich part of the city).

[Leto]

unlike most Flemings who butcher their native language, Azalea here knows Dutch grammar better than 90% of the Flemish for instance and I'm not exaggerating; I have talked to her in Dutch before joining any anthroboard).

Why is that? It's your native language.

[Dandelion]

Why is that? It's your native language.

Easy to explain. Flemish speak their native language sloppily. For instance a Fleming would often say 'noemen' instead of 'heten' as an intransitive verb. That is incorrect. Yet even professors do this here. Why? Not because they're dumb. They just don't care. Other example: 'zo'n dingen' instead of 'zulke dingen'. This while 'zo'n' is a combination of the words 'zo' and 'een'. How on earth could it be followed by a plural? That's incorrect. Yet the Taalunie counts it as correct just because Flemings seem incapable of learning it correctly.

For instance, Azalea being educated in the Netherlands has a thorough feeling for the Dutch language. I saw her once even correctly writing 'op de Balkan' because the Balkans are a peninsula. I can tell you that 95% of Flemish would say incorrectly 'in de Balkan'.

Flemish are lazy Catholics. Dutch are strict Protestants. Still true to this day. Doesn't explain everything though. Russians are also very correct in their use of language and they aren't Protestants and your society is pretty chaotic if I dare say so.

[Leto]

Easy to explain. Flemish speak their native language sloppily. For instance a Fleming would often say 'noemen' instead of 'heten' as an intransitive verb. That is incorrect. Yet even professors do this here. Why? Not because they're dumb. They just don't care. Other example: 'zo'n dingen' instead of 'zulke dingen'. This while 'zo'n' is a combination of the words 'zo' and 'een'. How on earth could it be followed by a plural? That's incorrect. Yet the Taalunie counts it as correct just because Flemings seem incapable of learning it correctly.

For instance, Azalea being educated in the Netherlands has a thorough feeling for the Dutch language. I saw her once even correctly writing 'op de Balkan' because the Balkans are a peninsula. I can tell you that 95% of Flemish would say incorrectly 'in de Balkan'.

I see. It's just colloquialisms, nothing special. It's like saying "them boys" instead of "those boys". You guys speak local dialects in everyday life, don't you? Some people think Flemish is a language of its own, not just a Belgian version of Dutch.

[Dandelion]

I see. It's just colloquialisms, nothing special. It's like saying "them boys" instead of "those boys". You guys speak local dialects in everyday life, don't you? Some people think Flemish is a language of its own, not just a Belgian version of Dutch.

My language is also very Southern Dutch or 'Flemish'. I have no problems with colloquialisms and I am also tolerant toward informal language. I even prefer some elements of our variant of Dutch.
However, over here a professor (!) would even write mistakes like 'zo'n dingen' or 'in de Balkan' on papers. WTF? 'Noemen' instead of 'heten' is still reserved to spoken language, luckily.

[Leto]

My language is also very Southern of Flemish. I have no problems with colloquialism and I am also tolerant toward informal language. I even prefer some elements of our variant of Dutch.
However, over here a professor (!) would even write mistakes like 'zo'n dingen' or 'in de Balkan' on papers. WTF? Noemen instead of heten is still reserved to spoken language, luckily.

I agree.

[King Claus]

Most inhabitants of the Netherlands had not seen any black people until the 1970s, when Suriname became independent. The Netherlands, though big in the slave trade and transport (the Dutch were the largest European slave traders in the 17th century, shipping over half a million slaves to Dutch colonies in the Western Hemisphere and were the last to abolish slavery, at least on paper) never allowed slavery within its own borders.

The Netherlands is actually a quite racist and xenophobic society. Just look at their recent politics and laws. If you're Dutch and marry a foreign spouse, your government's policy is to make you leave the country. Yet, other Europeans and their spouses can move to the Netherlands with no barriers at all. Dutch people whine and complain how no one speaks their language, but when foreigners do, they're derided and insulted that they don't speak perfectly and have blonde hair and blue eyes. Even then, the government wants you to pay $15,000 for a useless course on how to visit the doctor, ask for govt assistance and find a job. Should you already have a job and not need any assistance, then they will threaten to fine you and take away your residency permit (forget getting the passport - not possible) if you don't quit your job and go take a freaking course.

Also, you know it was the Dutch who invented apartheid. right?

Go troll somewhere else.

[Sikeliot]

The immigrants might live there, but they chose to move to the Netherlands.. the Dutch should not have to change their culture to appease people who moved there on their own free will. Even if it is racist.

[King Claus]

The immigrants might live there, but they chose to move to the Netherlands.. the Dutch should not have to change their culture to appease people who moved there on their own free will. Even if it is racist.

It's not racist at all. It might appear racist to trolls like benedicta, or benefit leeches.