Map of the results of PISA (Programme for International Student Assessment) in science, reading, and

**Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas** · 12-19-2016, 07:54 PM

Originally Posted by Cristiano viejo

Yourself is answering the question: Immigrants who have the citizenship are not taken into the statistics obviously.
INNACURATE AS FUCK.

It is only inaccurate to someone like you who can't read or draw rational conclusions. Statistics are just mere data collection gotten by surveys and experiments. An immigrant is a non-native or someone who doesn't possess citizenship and that's all that matters for the statistics, unless it was specified that included as well second\third generation non-natives that have gotten meanwhile the citizenship (which was not). For statistical purposes that map is accurate, if non-natives who have now the citizenship are French or not is another debate.

**XenophobicPrussian** · 12-20-2016, 08:55 PM

Originally Posted by Viriato

Immigrants is a poor excuse in this case, since there are countries that have way more or similar amounts with far better results.

It isn't a poor excuse, the data for non-1st/2nd generation immigrants(a lot of 3rd generation immigrants will also bring down the "native" score) shows it. Breaking it down by race would make it even more clearer because they don't count 3rd generation immigrants(as native scores in 2003 were even higher than native 2009 scores, as more immigrant children reach age 15, and fyi the young non-white population is much higher as a proportion to young whites than overall non-white to white or native to immigrant). It isn't the only reason but it is the main one, there's no other conclusion you can come to.

If immigration wasn't the main factor, shitty East Germany wouldn't outperform the rest of Germany.

Only the US breaks it down by race, and white Americans do better than all Europeans save for Finns.

Estonia and fucking Slovenia are now the smartest countries in Europe because of immigration.

**Myanthropologies** · 12-20-2016, 08:58 PM

Is PISA basically the European equivalent of American high school standardized tests in Algebra, Biology, 10th grade English, etc?

**Myanthropologies** · 12-20-2016, 08:59 PM

Originally Posted by XenophobicPrussian

It isn't a poor excuse, the data for non-1st/2nd generation immigrants(a lot of 3rd generation immigrants will also bring down the "native" score) shows it. Breaking it down by race would make it even more clearer because they don't count 3rd generation immigrants(as native scores in 2003 were even higher than native 2009 scores, as more immigrant children reach age 15, and fyi the young non-white population is much higher as a proportion to young whites than overall non-white to white or native to immigrant). It isn't the only reason but it is the main one, there's no other conclusion you can come to.

Only the US breaks it down by race, and white Americans do better than all Europeans save for Finns.

Estonia and fucking Slovenia are now the smartest countries in Europe because of immigration.

Those eastern European countries that score really low have little to no immigrants though.

**XenophobicPrussian** · 12-20-2016, 09:05 PM

Originally Posted by Antimage

The hungarian pisa test results have been getting worse in the past decade (While relative to the country's gdp, hungarian gov't spends more to education than eu avarage)
As long as the % of roma population keep increasing i expect the results to get worse each year

It's more likely the amount of children/schools being tested is rising(poorer countries tend to have less people take the test, for example, sometimes on purpose, leaving out rural schools), so the score goes lower as more poor/less urban kids take it. Poorer countries tend to have less people take the test, while Western European countries tend to have more. You can see participation rate here:

The countries with less participation are likely to have inflated scores.

Also, the only reason Argentina rose 30 points from 2012-2015 was because these results were only from the capital Buenos Aires(you can look it up yourself), as there was fraud/inconsistancies found in all other regions and they were disqualified.