Who left more genetic impact: The Normans in Sicily or the Venetians in Crete?

[brennus dux gallorum]

I think that Venetians left more admixture in pelloponese, a few parts of central Greece and cyclades than Crete, even though the vast majority of the people have no venetian ancestry

I will vote for Sicily, but in every case the admixture was insignificant

[catgeorge]

The impact is so small it is rather irrelevant. We are perhaps talking about 2-5% overall impact that is uncesarily magnified due to the fact there has been no significant settlement.

Even the Bavarian settlers in Athens in Paleo Iraklio bought to Greece in early 17th century would have little impact you can hardly tell they are Bavarian

[Sikeliot]

I am not seeing how overall, either island has much of either influence.

[Sikeliot]

The other major influx was as we all know in Byzantine times - where again the West coast of the Peloponnese was flooded with Greek speaking Sicilians and Greek speaking Southern Italians in order to repopulate the hole left by the mass removal of the slavs. We must remember Calabrians for example only stopped speaking Greek as a native language around the 1600s.

Greek was spoken in Sicily until the 1600s also, but mostly around Enna, Syracuse, and Ragusa. If you listen to the accents and phonology of the Sicilian language you can hear how it is similar to Greek.

[brennus dux gallorum]

The Venetians only controlled the Peloponnese for the best part of two decades and couldn't really alter the demographics too much at that time. The real Italian admixture in the area or as I would say Italo/Greco admixture came after the fall of Sparta (370s BC) when 10,000s of Messenians (thanks to Epaminondas) repopulated the Southern Peloponnese - Messenians who had returned to their homeland primarily from Sicily and North Africa after leaving 300 years before because of the Spartans and their policies. Apparently the Messenians had maintained a transitory community in exile, or diaspora, for some 300 years - even keeping their unique Greek dialect intact.

The other major influx was as we all know in Byzantine times - where again the West coast of the Peloponnese was flooded with Greek speaking Sicilians and Greek speaking Southern Italians in order to repopulate the hole left by the mass removal of the slavs. We must remember Calabrians for example only stopped speaking Greek as a native language around the 1600s.

Before that they ruled some big towns, like methoni, monemvasia etc for a bigger period, however, yes most of pelloponese was frankish, not venetian

[Sikeliot]

Do you have any youtube examples?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMyZtuAXBtU&t=323s

[brennus dux gallorum]

Greek was spoken in Sicily until the 1600s also, but mostly around Enna, Syracuse, and Ragusa. If you listen to the accents and phonology of the Sicilian language you can hear how it is similar to Greek.

The accent of Greek is mostly associated with iberian accents

[Sikeliot]

The accent of Greek is mostly associated with iberian accents

Sicilian language might have Iberian influence too.

[Lavrentis]

Everything I have explained is from history books and actually living in the Cyclades. I recommend a book for you to read that will help you understand these islands far better.

Published in 1885 by a man who lived and travelled among these islands:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Cyclades-Li.../dp/0953992314

This book even documents funeral rituals the various Greek islands were conducting that were the last surviving vestiges of ancient Greece. Many would actually be celebrations - just as in ancient times.

The resentment against the Venetians however is massive and always has been. In the Cyclades it is common knowledge most preferred the Turks than the Venetians. The Turks had a hands off approach to the Cyclades (they would not even enter the islands but just send Jewish tax collectors to collect the tax) - the Venetians disinherited 100,000s of Greeks of their land in the Cyclades - turned the Greek population into serfs and classed Greeks below Turks and Jews in terms of cultural hierarchy. Again I can't speak for Crete because my years of studies have only been about the Cyclades of which I have personally visited about 20 islands and my family still have property there. I have also researched and written papers on the Peloponnese - where my grandfather originated from.

if you want to know Italians who the Greeks were very fond of - you need to look to historical heavyweights like Marc Anthony, Nero and Hadrian. The venetians were despised in the Cyclades and much of their legacy has been removed by Greeks as a result including 100s of churches they built being demolished.

Please read: Ιστορια του Ελληνικου Εθνους: Ο Ελληνισμος υπο ξενη κυριαρχια: (περιοδος 1669-1821)- Τουρκοκρατια-Λατινοκρατια. (History of the Greek nation: Hellenism under foreign occupation: 1669-1821, Turkish Occupation, Latin Occupation.)

You must read this very good book before saying that the Venetians were despised and that Turks were preffered than Venetians, when we have proof that the Greeks saw Venice as their last hope of not falling under the Ottomans. The Greeks always sided with the Venetians in the Venetian-Ottoman Wars.

What do the written paperers on the Peloponnese say?

Also, you say that Greeks demolished 100s of Venetian churches. Do you have a source on that? Because there are tons of Catholic churches on the Cyclades and tons of Catholics as well. Matter of fact, the number of Catholic and Orthodox churches in Tinos is equal.

[Tauromachos]

I think Crete would have more Slavic input (either from direct migration or mainland influence) than Sicily has Norman, which is evident by haplogroups. Venetian is probably less than Slavic in Crete.

I think there is not more Slavic input in Crete than Norman in Sicily.

There was never any historical mentioned presence of Slavs in the Island,whereas Norman in Sicily there was even though it can be true what you say that
Normans didn't left much genetic traces there.