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Thread: Ottoman Empire: a Balkan Empire

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    Default Ottoman Empire: a Balkan Empire

    This map showing the telegraph lines within the Ottoman Empire demonstrate which regions they put more emphasis on.



    Especially Ottoman Erdogan fans from inner Anatolia should reflect on it. Ottoman sultans did not care much about Anatolia. Almost all historical buildings there are from the pre-Ottoman period. Ottomans left more trace on Balkan territories, most of whom have unfortunately been removed following wars. There were no schools, hospitals or any kind of important centers in Anatolia while all of these were concentrated on Balkan cities and what made Ottoman what it was was its Balkan territory. The loss of these lands was the biggest factor that led to its collapse because they were the heart and major center of the Empire.

    Kemalists gave more importance to Anatolia and tried to elevate its status after years of neglect. Ankara was nothing but a vast empty area and Kemalists chose an Anatolian city to replace Istanbul as the capital.

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    The Ottoman and Seljuk empires were more Islamic Turko-Persianaite Middle Eastern empires with heavy emphasis on Iranian and Balkan cultures than anything. In other words, Ataturk himself discard them as anything to do with Turkey and basically had put these empires under the rug of history.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilgamesh900 View Post
    The Ottoman and Seljuk empires were more Islamic Turko-Persianaite Middle Eastern empires with heavy emphasis on Iranian and Balkan cultures than anything. In other words, Ataturk himself discard them as anything to do with Turkey and basically had put these empires under the rug of history.
    hehehe that because is almost half of the current iran is Turkish speaker
    is a fact that Turks owned and belorded iran for 1 millenium

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    Balkan is a Turkish word and a Turkoman region. Today still officially used in Turkomania. This is Balkan region:



    So when some Turkomans left Middle Asia for Minor Asia (Anatoly) they always called their westernmost land always Balkan. So, in the new Turkey created by Seljuks and Ottomans, westernmost lands were again labeled as Balkan. And when Ottomans jumped to Europa anything there became Balkan

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    Quote Originally Posted by gültekin View Post
    hehehe that because is almost half of the current iran is Turkish speaker
    is a fact that Turks owned and belorded iran for 1 millenium
    Actually, the Safavid dynasty originated in the Iranian Kurdistan, and moved to today's Azerbaijan. The Azeris back in the day spoke an Iranian language called Azari, and the Turkification of today's Azeris was a gradual process that took many centuries to complete:
    The Safavid Kings themselves claimed to be Seyyeds,[40] family descendants of the Islamic prophet Muhammad, although many scholars have cast doubt on this claim.[41] There seems now to be a consensus among scholars that the Safavid family hailed from Persian Kurdistan,[31] and later moved to Azerbaijan, finally settling in the 11th century CE at Ardabil. Traditional pre-1501 Safavid manuscripts trace the lineage of the Safavids to the Kurdish dignitary, Firuz Shah Zarin-Kulah.[32][42]

    According to some historians,[43][44] including Richard Frye, the Safavids were of Turkicized Iranian origin:[33]

    The Turkish speakers of Azerbaijan are mainly descended from the earlier Iranian speakers, several pockets of whom still exist in the region. A massive migration of Oghuz Turks in the 11th and 12th centuries not only Turkified Azerbaijan but also Anatolia. The Azeri Turks are Shiʿites and were founders of the Safavid dynasty.

    Other historians, such as Vladimir Minorsky[45] and Roger Savory, support this idea:[46]

    From the evidence available at the present time, it is certain that the Safavid family was of indigenous Iranian stock, and not of Turkish ancestry as it is sometimes claimed. It is probable that the family originated in Persian Kurdistan, and later moved to Azerbaijan, where they adopted the Azari form of Turkish spoken there, and eventually settled in the small town of Ardabil sometimes during the eleventh century.

    By the time of the establishment of the Safavid empire, the members of the family were native Turkish-speaking and Turkicized,[18][47] and some of the Shahs composed poems in their native Turkish language. Concurrently, the Shahs themselves also supported Persian literature, poetry and art projects including the grand Shahnameh of Shah Tahmasp,[48][49] while members of the family and some Shahs composed Persian poetry as well.[50][51] The authority of the Safavids was religiously based, and their claim to legitimacy was founded on being direct male descendants of the Ali,[52] the cousin and son-in-law of Muhammad, and regarded by Shi'ites as the first Imam.

    Furthermore, the dynasty was from the very start thoroughly intermarried with both Pontic Greek as well as Georgian lines.[53] In addition, from the official establishment of the dynasty in 1501, the dynasty would continue to have many intermarriages with both Circassian as well as again Georgian dignitaries, especially with the advent of king Tahmasp I.[35][36]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safavi...tural_identity
    The Iranian Azeris are indeed the largest minority group in Iran in contrast to the Kurds of Turkey who are the 2nd largest group in Turkey after Turks.

    The Azari language:
    Old Azeri, also known as Azeri or Azari (Persian: آذری‎‎ Āḏarī [ɑːzæri]), is the extinct Iranian language that was once spoken in Iranian Azerbaijan and Azerbaijan. Some linguists believe the southern Tati varieties of Iranian Azerbaijan such as those around Takestan such as the Harzandi and Karingani dialects to be remnants of Azeri.[3][4][5] In addition, Old Azeri is known to have strong affinities with Talysh.[6]

    Azeri was the dominant language in Azerbaijan before it was replaced by Azerbaijani, which is a Turkic language.[5]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Azeri_language

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    Quote Originally Posted by gültekin View Post
    hehehe that because is almost half of the current iran is Turkish speaker
    is a fact that Turks owned and belorded iran for 1 millenium
    Belorded them so much that you adopted everything from them, including your genetics.

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    I like Balkans :

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    We didnt get anything from Persians. For Turkomans, traditionally even sleeping with Persian woman or captive is abomination and kids born from such relations not considered same as normal people
    English traveller confirms.

    The Turkomans observe a difference between their children from Turkoman mothers, and those from the Persian female captives whom they take as wives, and the Kazakh women whom they purchase from the Uzbeks of Khiva. The Turkomans of pure race enjoy full privileges, while the others are not allowed to contract marriages with Turkoman women of pure blood, but must choose themselves wives among the half-castes and Kazakh captives.

    As there exists a great animosity between the Yamuds and Goklans they do not intermarry, although they reckon themselves of equally noble lineage. The same hatred is extended to the Tekke Turkomans, whom the Goklans and Yamuds, moreover, look upon as their inferiors, being, according to their genealogies, the descendants of a slave-woman, whilst they are the posterity of a free-woman. (p. 71)

    The Turkoman women are, like the men, tall, and when young, well-shaped; their faces are rounder than those of the men; the cheek-bones less prominent; the eyes black, with fine eye-brows, and many with fair complexion; the nose is rather flat; the mouth small, with a row of regular white teeth. In a word, a great number of the younger part of the community might be reckoned as fair specimens of pretty women. (p. 73)

    Bode, C.A. "The Yamud and Goklan tribes of Turkomania". Journal of the London Ethnological Society, vol. 1, 1848, pp. 60–78.
    If you have Persian mother you are half caste

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    Quote Originally Posted by Siyendi View Post
    We didnt get anything from Persians. For Turkomans, traditionally even sleeping with Persian woman or captive is abomination and kids born from such relations not considered same as normal people
    English traveller confirms.


    If you have Persian mother you are half caste
    He talked about the later periods of Turkmenistan, not during the time that they arrived there in the early middle ages, and we can see that in their genes that they are a mix between Iranian and Turkic peoples which they were already mixed and assimilated many different Caucasoid tribes of Northern and Central Asia.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilgamesh900 View Post
    Actually, the Safavid dynasty originated in the Iranian Kurdistan, and moved to today's Azerbaijan. The Azeris back in the day spoke an Iranian language called Azari, and the Turkification of today's Azeris was a gradual process that took many centuries to complete:


    The Iranian Azeris are indeed the largest minority group in Iran in contrast to the Kurds of Turkey who are the 2nd largest group in Turkey after Turks.

    The Azari language:
    hehe idiot, everone knows that the official language of Safavids was Turkish, even Ismail has wrote his poets with pure Turkish. and also wery good documented which Turkmen tribes were included to Safawids. They called even persians tajik as etnic slure, they didn't allowed them to Army.
    Azari is another etnikk group. We talking here about Turks in Iran ,Turks living in south Azerbaijan Gulistan and Kashkaj, they reach to 35 million in current iran population

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