Alsace-Lorraine, French or German?

[Melki]

German. even their votes different than people like Melki Another point which make it more Germany like this is Turkish expats in France are concentrated there

Stop talking out of your ass about me or about a country you've never been to. Your hydrocephalic head full of ayran should better focus on Central Asia.

Alsatians and Lorrainians (at least those living in the northern part, since most of Lorraine is francophone) are in their majority ethnic Germans who share a deep FRENCH identity.

Germans annexed by force Alsace and the German speaking part of Lorraine, in 1870 and 1940, on pretext that the local populations, who were not solicited, were ethnic Germans. Exactly what Russians recently did in Ukraine.
But in France, cultural bonds matter more than ethnicities.

French historian Ernest Renan, in his most famous lecture ("What is a Nation?", 1882) explained the French conception of nationhood.

"[...] Yet the essence of a nation is that all individuals have many things in common, and also that they have forgotten many things. No French citizen knows whether he is a Burgundian, an Alan, a Taifale, or a Visigoth, yet every French citizen has to have forgotten the massacre of Saint Bartholomew, or the massacre that took place in the South in the thirteenth century. [...]
A nation is a soul, a spiritual principle. Two things, which are really one, constitute this soul and spiritual principle. One is in the past, the other, the present. One is the possession in common of a rich trove of memories; the other is actual consent, the desire to live together, the will to continue to value the undivided, shared heritage....To have had glorious moments in common in the past, a common will in the present, to have done great things together and to wish to do more, those are the essential conditions for a people. We love the nation in proportion to the sacrifices to which we consented, the harms that we suffered.
The existence of a nation (you will pardon me this metaphor) is a daily referendum, just as the continuing existence of an individual is a perpetual affirmation of life.
A nation never has a veritable interest in annexing or keeping another region against the wishes of its people"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/What_is_a_Nation%3F

And for your sake, be aware that Turkish immigrants in France (not all of them are Kurdish, contrary to what you think) are spread accross the whole French territory.

[Böri]

Stop talking out of your ass about me or about a country you've never been to. Your hydrocephalic head full of ayran should better focus on Central Asia.

Alsatians and Lorrainians (at least those living in the northern part, since most of Lorraine is francophone) are in their majority ethnic Germans who share a deep FRENCH identity.

Germans annexed by force Alsace and the German speaking part of Lorraine, in 1870 and 1940, on pretext that the local populations, who were not solicited, were ethnic Germans. Exactly what Russians recently did in Ukraine.
But in France, cultural bonds matter more than ethnicities.

French historian Ernest Renan, in his most famous lecture ("What is a Nation?", 1882) explained the French conception of nationhood.

"[...] Yet the essence of a nation is that all individuals have many things in common, and also that they have forgotten many things. No French citizen knows whether he is a Burgundian, an Alan, a Taifale, or a Visigoth, yet every French citizen has to have forgotten the massacre of Saint Bartholomew, or the massacre that took place in the South in the thirteenth century. [...]
A nation is a soul, a spiritual principle. Two things, which are really one, constitute this soul and spiritual principle. One is in the past, the other, the present. One is the possession in common of a rich trove of memories; the other is actual consent, the desire to live together, the will to continue to value the undivided, shared heritage....To have had glorious moments in common in the past, a common will in the present, to have done great things together and to wish to do more, those are the essential conditions for a people. We love the nation in proportion to the sacrifices to which we consented, the harms that we suffered.
The existence of a nation (you will pardon me this metaphor) is a daily referendum, just as the continuing existence of an individual is a perpetual affirmation of life.
A nation never has a veritable interest in annexing or keeping another region against the wishes of its people"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/What_is_a_Nation%3F

And for your sake, be aware that Turkish immigrants in France (not all of them are Kurdish, contrary to what you think) are spread accross the whole French territory.

Cool man, I was just teasing you

[Óttar]

Both. In the 19th century many of them spoke both French and German. Many even preferred the French because the Germans were always trying to conscript them into the army while the French generally left them alone. Unfortunately, the Elsaessich German language is dying out.

[Melki]

Both. In the 19th century many of them spoke both French and German. Many even preferred the French because the Germans were always trying to conscript them into the army while the French generally left them alone. Unfortunately, the Elsaessich German language is dying out.

Not totally, not yet at least, I lived one and a half year in Alsace, and the Alsatian dialects are still commonly spoken in every village, especially by older people. But it's also true that less and less young Alsatians, who hate everything which is related to Germany and who are influenced by French pop culture, are willing to speak it.

It's strange. In all other regions (Brittany, Occitania, Corsica, Basque Country, Catalonia, Gascony, Picardy, Normandy...), the local languages and dialects were sometimes on the brink of extinction and are now thriving in school, the youth is aware and proud of its regional identity. in Alsace, it's the opposite, young people are ashamed of their Germanic roots. Speaking Alsatian or Platt-Lorrainian is perceived as unsophisticated.

[Smeagol]

German.

[Melki]

Both. In the 19th century many of them spoke both French and German. Many even preferred the French because the Germans were always trying to conscript them into the army while the French generally left them alone. Unfortunately, the Elsaessich German language is dying out.

Alsatian soldiers who were forced to serve in the Wehrmacht or the Waffen-SS during WW2 were called the "Malgré-nous" (“against our will”)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malgr%C3%A9-nous

The population of Alsace has been very resentful towards the Germans because of that. Ironically, they've often been mistaken for Germans because of their thick accent by the other French and insulted.

My grandfather on my mother's side belonged to an accultured Alsatian family of local noble lineage. Although the surname was Germanic, nobody spoke Alsatian. Everybody felt deeply French.

[Óttar]

It's strange. In all other regions (Brittany, Occitania, Corsica, Basque Country, Catalonia, Gascony, Picardy, Normandy...), the local languages and dialects were sometimes on the brink of extinction and are now thriving in school, the youth is aware and proud of its regional identity. in Alsace, it's the opposite, young people are ashamed of their Germanic roots. Speaking Alsatian or Platt-Lorrainian is perceived as unsophisticated.

It reminds me of the situation of many European Americans in the U.S. I have contempt for Euro-Americans who have no knowledge of their heritage. German Americans constitute the single largest ethnic group in the U.S., yet most German Americans don't speak German. There are small minorities who speak German in the Midwest and a small contingent in Texas, but it is small. Imagine how widely represented German would be if the people maintained their language. I started teaching myself German at 13, and am certified C1 by the Goethe Institute. I just barely missed out on Irish citizenship; if I had been born three months earlier, I would have been eligible. My grandparents were eligible for Irish citizenship, but they both died without utilizing it. My father knows nothing of his Alsatian-German grandparents. I have met Americans who are eligible for EU citizenship, particularly Irish and Italian-Americans who have no intention of making use of such an amazing opportunity. They should relinquish it to me, who would appreciate it.

[Ouistreham]

German Americans constitute the single largest ethnic group in the U.S., yet most German Americans don't speak German. There are small minorities who speak German in the Midwest and a small contingent in Texas, but it is small.

It's all different. The linguistic unification of the USA wasn't a peacefull process. In 1917 it became forbidden by law to teach German to children (there were previously many privately organized parish schools, Catholic or Lutheran, serving German communities in the MidWest).

But we can admit that the U.S. had a nation to build, furthermore given the declaration of war to Germany.
BTW French schools were also outlawed in Louisiana at the same time.

Alsatians and Lorrainians (at least those living in the northern part, since most of Lorraine is francophone) are in their majority ethnic Germans who share a deep FRENCH identity.

Quite true.
Alsatians are ethnically Germanic, but psychologically very French. They even tend to consider themselves as the best real French, and sometimes they say that France would become really OK is all of the nation was made of Alsatians (which is a sort of "Besserwisser-Mentalität" that sounds somewhat German...).

Why did they choose to endorse a French identity is a long long story that goes back to the Thirty Years War.

[Ouistreham]

Another point which make it more Germany like this is Turkish expats in France are concentrated there

Ludicrous.
Indeed, many filthy Muslim migrant families from Turkey that happen to be in Germany cross the Rhine when the female is pregnant and settle in Alsace. The reason why is quite sad: because the French State grants much more Kindergeld (Children Benefits).

[Böri]

Ludicrous.
Indeed, many filthy Muslim migrant families from Turkey that happen to be in Germany cross the Rhine when the female is pregnant and settle in Alsace. The reason why is quite sad: because the French State grants much more Kindergeld (Children Benefits).

Nah there is nothing attractive about your country for Turks. Your culture more adapted for Moors, Arabs, Africans and Iberians. Also not all immigrants from Turkey are Muslim. Paris full with Christian Assyrians from south east Turkey. If you are offended because I said German, look I am not only in the thread