Are some Americans more American than others?

[Sasuke]

That was the plan, actually. Didnt work out and they resisted assimilation.

The invaders should be the ones assimilating the local culture, not the other way around. It's basically the same as Muslims going to America nowadays: do you want the American people to assimilate to their culture or them to assimilate to American culture? Obviously the latter, obviously...

[LightHouse89]

The rightest thing for the British settlers to do would be give them citizenship instead of mass-murdering them.

The aboriginals were murdering the colonials. The viciousness went both ways. Aboriginals did not want to be citizens as they wanted their own tribal/nation sovereignty.

[Sasuke]

The people in the photograph were not American until 1924 when law enacted made them so.

Which was wrong. They should've been given citizenship at the same time when Whites received it. Giving the natives citizenship AFTER giving it to the invaders was very unjust, illogical and irrational. It was a mistake. When my own people commit mistakes I realize it, so why can't you realize that your people also committed mistakes?

[LightHouse89]

The invaders should be the ones assimilating the local culture, not the other way around. It's basically the same as Muslims going to America nowadays: do you want the American people to assimilate to their culture or them to assimilate to American culture? Obviously the latter, obviously...

Would you go from living in a more civilized society to living in a more primitive one? LOL I would prefer no immigrants at all from any part of the world. We don't live in an age where we need immigrants anyway. The west is no longer a place of producers and having an industrial infrastructure which requires millions of immigrants.

[Sasuke]

The aboriginals were murdering the colonials. The viciousness went both ways. Aboriginals did not want to be citizens as they wanted their own tribal/nation sovereignty.

That's the natural human instinct that every single human group on Earth has. Your ancestors should follow morals and ethics by giving up and being happy with only Europe, but no, you weren't happy enough in your own homeland and wanted to steal another folk's homeland. That's just immoral and antiethic.

[Sasuke]

Do you think that all the tribes were all hanging out together peacefully? Get real.

I never said or wrote such ridiculous statement. All I said is that they were the original inhabitants. Period.

[Sasuke]

Would you go from living in a more civilized society to living in a more primitive one?

I agree that Islamic societies are more primitive than Western ones, but calling the Native Americans "primitive" is an act of historical ignorance of the historical facts (no offense btw). Although they were in constant war against each others' tribes, they still lived in more balance with nature than the Europeans did at that same period in history. Perhaps our views on civilization are different... you may think it's more civilized to destroy nature, but in my honest opinion, a more civilized people is a people that lives (or lived) in a better balance with Gaia, a.k.a Mother Nature.

[LightHouse89]

Which was wrong. They should've been given citizenship at the same time when Whites received it. Giving the natives citizenship AFTER giving it to the invaders was very unjust, illogical and irrational. It was a mistake. When my own people commit mistakes I realize it, so why can't you realize that your people also committed mistakes?

1] Aboriginals did not want citizenship
2] Some tribes were considered enemies as they openly declared war on the state
3] they were not north western European

Mistakes? We have no control over what happened in history. I don't look at history as having mistakes or that people collectively make mistakes at different points in time to fit some modern narrative of social justice... that's insane Hegelianism at work right there. Its like a warped ideology of puritan original sin and how it passes on generation after generation ...ad nauseum. That's not taking history in an objective way but looking at it in a misinformed manner.

How a modern way of looking at history...

1] colonialism bad
2]white people were the bad racist
3] people of color lived in harmony with nature and themselves until racist civilization showed up
4] civilization was a bad thing
5] western culture is irredeemable and sinful

I have heard it countless times and have read from the same sources who have the same narrative... modern people are like mass produced ''informed'' masses who seem incapable of breaking out of this thinking.

Mind you the idea of civilization being progressive is equally as insane but that's a different topic.

The idea that aboriginals were more American than the settlers is insane and not even grounded in reality. A population that is conquered and pushed aside looses its territory to another population which in turn can create a state of its choosing and new identity... that has happened throughout history. It will continue to happen through out mankind's life span as a species. The aboriginals did the same things the European colonists did.

[dperucca]

I never said or wrote such ridiculous statement. All I said is that they were the original inhabitants. Period.

You posted pics of Pueblo ruins alongside a pic of people who look like Plains Indians. Different people. You are making gross generalizations about Native Americans and Americans in general.

[LightHouse89]

I agree that Islamic societies are more primitive than Western ones, but calling the Native Americans "primitive" is an act of historical ignorance of the historical facts (no offense btw). Although they were in constant war against each others' tribes, they still lived in more balance with nature than the Europeans did at that same period in history. Perhaps our views on civilization are different... you may think it's more civilized to destroy nature, but in my honest opinion, a more civilized people is a people that lives (or lived) in a better balance with Gaia, a.k.a Mother Nature.

''I agree that Islamic societies are more primitive than Western ones, but calling the Native Americans "primitive" is an act of historical ignorance of the historical facts (no offense btw).''

Its a fact. I wouldn't say muslims are uncivilized... but instead from a different type of civilized society. They may appear to a westerner to be barbaric which is fine but you cant really call them uncivilized. Their behavior and social norms are entirely alien to anything western and vice versa.

Most aboriginal nations in north America were uncivilized. They did not even have written languages. I look at civilized as being an advanced society... you can say that the Aztecs were protocivilized which is accurate as they were more advanced than their north American counter parts.

''Although they were in constant war against each others' tribes, they still lived in more balance with nature than the Europeans did at that same period in history. ''

The idea that aboriginals were living in harmony with nature stems from European accounts and records which are inaccurate and misunderstood. Archaeology has made different discoveries... natives/aboriginals were infact the opposite of living in harmony with the environment. They over hunted much of their game and lived at the tipping point of their natural capacity in terms of their usage of their local ecology. The tribes were in constant warfare with their neighbors.

Europeans had more efficient means to hunt and grow food and a better knowledge of growing/rotating crops. Europeans introduced to the natives, horses, steel tipped arrows, fire arms, durable pottery etc... natives took a lot more from the Europeans than vice versa in terms of knowledge or tools.

''Perhaps our views on civilization are different... you may think it's more civilized to destroy nature, but in my honest opinion, a more civilized people is a people that lives (or lived) in a better balance with Gaia, a.k.a Mother Nature. ''

The idea of living in harmony with nature sprang from western culture. The science of ecology was founded by a German nationalist whose opinions would influence the Nazi Party and its state policy later on. Ecology and environmentalism did not become politically important or noticeable until the late 1800s [1890]. People who live in hunter gatherer societies have historically been more warlike and far less ecological... they generally over hunt their hunting areas to the point they drive out wild life and have in the past hunted various species to the point of extinction. Hunter gatherer societies wee more fragile than more advanced societies and also much politically weaker... hunter gatherers have been on the decline since 10,000 years ago. How many hunter gatherer societies exist today? Not many.

Its impossible either way to live in harmony with nature though... mankind always exceeds his carrying capacity.