Xhaka and Shaqiri face 2 match bans over 'eagle gesture'

[IncelSlayer]

What are you on about? The J2b2-L283 sample comes from a time period linked to the Illyrians so it is most certainly Illyrian or proto-Illyrian. Illyrians weren't a single entity but they were a collection of tribes that shared similar things like language and culture so they aren't really this umbrella term as you make it seem. R1b-Z2103 was found in Vucedol and so it is more probable that it is linked to them in the Balkans and later the Illyrians and other Balkanite peoples. The Iron age Montenegrin sample hardly had enough SNPs to even predict it's eye colour but yet you are acting as if it is concrete autosomal evidence, actual samples with a good amount of SNPs cluster with the Balkans. Albanian clades of hapogroups like J2b2-L283 clearly post date Illyrians and are obviously from them, PH2967 is clearly Illyrian based on TMRCA.

Proto-illyrians lived in the steppe, the j2b2-l283 sample was from 1500 BC , illyrians were group of indo-europeans groups of late Halstatt culture(first period of Iron age).

[Kelmendasi]

Proto-illyrians lived in the steppe, the j2b2-l283 sample was from 1500 BC , illyrians were group of indo-europeans groups of late Halstatt culture(first period of Iron age).

Nope, at around 1600-1100 BC the Illyrians were already in the Dinaric alps region as well as the fact that the items found in the cave where the sample was found share resemblance to Illyrian items. Proto-Illyrians themselves were part of cultures like Cetina, Vucedol etc and not the Steppe as IE peoples had moved out ages ago.

[Lek]

Lol, I wonder why Albanians were shown as being the most homogenous European ethnicity in terms of IBD sharings then. http://journals.plos.org/plosbiology...l.pbio.1001555

Because that's autosomal DNA and not phenotype. If a modern population is a mixture of different ancient populations, which is exactly what Ilyrians were, and since then not much else has been added then they will appear genetically homogenous but can still be phenotypically diverse.

Here is on Ghegs/Ilyrians

Racially they were probably a mixture of
Nordics, Mediterraneans from the Adriatic
littoral, brachycephals from the same region,
and Pontic Mediterraneans from the Euxine
borderlands. They were able to stew in their
own genetic juice and produce their own
variety of human beings.

You cannot possible believe that such a mixture will produce a homogenous population? Explains why I see swarthy albos, light albos and other physical diversities. Really homogenous...

In other parts he concludes Malsors are diverse and have phenotypical or regional differences etc, for such a small area differences are large almost like 10 different populations.

Albanians have been isolated and also we have been arranged marriages at the same time meaning people exchanged brides with a certain area probably more than others etc hence genetic diversity there which explains differences we get on pca maps and gedmatch calcs etc.

[IncelSlayer]

Nope, at around 1600-1100 BC the Illyrians were already in the Dinaric alps region as well as the fact that the items found in the cave where the sample was found share resemblance to Illyrian items. Proto-Illyrians themselves were part of cultures like Cetina, Vucedol etc and not the Steppe as IE peoples had moved out ages ago.

They were not steppebut steppe was their ancestors because they were a subcategory of Corded culture named Halstatt from central europe who spread in the balkans and eventually even in Albania(were they found the native flat headed bell beaker from bronze age) and given the fact that the skulls found were almost entirely long headed cordeds like the much older steppe ones with exception in Albania were they were a mix we pretty much have a guarantee of what illyrians were.
Also, the illyrians culture rose during Halstatt culture, glasinac was about 300 BC, nothing in common with the J2B2 sample found more than a milenium ago, let alone other 2 samples.

[Kelmendasi]

They were not steppebut steppe was their ancestors because they were a subcategory of Corded culture named Halstatt from central europe who spread in the balkans and eventually even in Albania(were they found the native flat headed bell beaker from bronze age) and given the fact that the skulls found were almost entirely long headed cordeds like the much older steppe ones with exception in Albania were they were a mix we pretty much have a guarantee of what illyrians were.
Also, the illyrians culture rose during Halstatt culture, glasinac was about 300 BC, nothing in common with the J2B2 sample found more than a milenium ago, let alone other 2 samples.

The Illyrians themselves were greatly EEF admixed as shown by the fact that Steppe peoples in the Balkans assimilated peoples rather than thoroughly intermix with them. Illyrians arose from a mixture of cultures at the time like Vucedol, Cetina etc Hallstatt probably just gave in some material culture because of flow between the areas, Hallstatt is more linked to Celts and so haplogroups like R1b-U152, L21 etc rather than R1b-Z2103 which is responsible for the spread of Paleo-Balkanic languages

[Dibran]

What are you on about? The J2b2-L283 sample comes from a time period linked to the Illyrians so it is most certainly Illyrian or proto-Illyrian. Illyrians weren't a single entity but they were a collection of tribes that shared similar things like language and culture so they aren't really this umbrella term as you make it seem. R1b-Z2103 was found in Vucedol and so it is more probable that it is linked to them in the Balkans and later the Illyrians and other Balkanite peoples. The Iron age Montenegrin sample hardly had enough SNPs to even predict it's eye colour but yet you are acting as if it is concrete autosomal evidence, actual samples with a good amount of SNPs cluster with the Balkans. Albanian clades of hapogroups like J2b2-L283 clearly post date Illyrians and are obviously from them, PH2967 is clearly Illyrian based on TMRCA.

Hesss back. Mir se u ktheva

[Dibran]

Flat headedness/dinarid was brought by bell beakers in Europe during Bronze age they were not illyrian but illyrians mixed with them in Albania , r1b-l23 dominated them according to 2018 study.
Illyrians were groups not a single group of invaders during the Iron age corelated with the halstatt culture with the skulls found being by far dominated by long headed cordeds as expected, except in Albania were they were mixed with flat headed bell beakers that had nothing illyrian.

Skull shape is irrelevant you turd. There are numerous Albanians with the same haplogroup and different taxonomy/phenotype. Skull shape does not equate to haplogroup but to autosomal genetics over time. Haplogroups only represent a percent of the entire genome. It’s irrelevant whether or not the phenotypes have changed. Albanians still largely descend from Illyrians patrilineally. Get over it. Even genetics is proving this and you’re still coping.

[Kelmendasi]

Hesss back. Mir se u ktheva

Lol thanks, not for long though. Im gonna go to Albania in a few days so i'll be off for a while I guess

[Dibran]

Lol thanks, not for long though. Im gonna go to Albania in a few days so i'll be off for a while I guess

Enjoy. Hopefully I can go one day. My whole immediate family pretty much went to Sweden and here in the US.

[IncelSlayer]

Bell Beakers in fact didn't belong to R1b-L23/Z2103 as shown by samples so idk what you are on about with this sample from 2018, perhaps you are mixing it up with haplogroups like R1b-L2, L21 which seems to be linked with them. Linguistically Albanian does have connections with Illyrians which is why the Illyrian linguistic theory is still around and considered as the most likely theory by historians

r1b-l23 with different subclades dominated among Bell Beakers,they came from Armenia Shulaveri-Shomu culture and were the first ones to introduce flat occiput(brachy skulls) in Europe, r1b-l23/z2103 was western yamnayan who was absorbed into eastern bell beaker group and through a founder effect spread into the balkans were it also gave rise to bracycephaly through bronze age cultures like Vucedol/Shomo/Soimus..

Illyrians were part of the Halstatt cultures during Iron Age who came from the Corded Ware culture.
Again this is all supported by the skulls found, illyrians were long headed corded nordids unlike the bronze age native bracycephalic bell beakers they found in Albania.

in Mathieson et al. (2018), a sample classified as of Ukraine_Eneolithic from Dereivka ca. 2890-2696 BC is of R1b1a1a2a2-Z2103 subclade, so Western Yamna during the migrations also of R1b-L23 subclades, in contrast with the previous R1a lineages in Ukraine. In Olalde et al. (2018).
This is compatible with the expansion of Indo-European-speaking Yamna migrants (also mainly of R1b-L23 subclades) into the East Bell Beaker group, as described with detail in Archaeology (and with the population movement we are seeing having been predicted) first by Volker Heyd in 2007.

This is why where R1b-l23 dominated(Albanians,greece(arvanites), West Romania and Armenia only!),Coon himself said, before any genetic tests, that romanians from west transylvania are indistinguishable from albanians and albanians are almost identical to armenians.https://blogs.sapo.pt/cloud/file/eb6...l%20beaker.pdf
http://bellbeakerblogger.blogspot.co...oblematic.html

FROM SHULAVERISHOMU
TO BELL
BEAKER “SHULAVERI-SHOMU IS THE BIRTH OF THE R1B EXPANSION!
https://blogs.sapo.pt/cloud/file/eb6...l%20beaker.pdf