Divisions strain NATO push for Libyan airstrikes

[Joe McCarthy]

And who says that we want an United Europe like the EU is going to pursue? I don't like the idea of a centralistic Europe and the worst what could happen is a United States of Europe form of rubbish. But we all know that US governments are a leading power in calling for an United Europe.
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I prefer some chaos with nation states over a Union without identity and common ground. Hence go speak for yourself.

This isn't really the case, but it's an interesting claim given that so many here are preoccupied with conspiracy theories involving the US 'dividing Europe'.

[Joe McCarthy]

[FONT="Georgia"]Not me, sorry. When we remain divided and don't find at least some common ground the Americans, Jews, Muslims and Chinese will divide us against each other and pick us off one by one. Not having a United Europe is exactly what the Americans AND Israeli's want (who do you think funds parties like the PVV and UKIP ?). For now- with our huge differences in terrain, economy, societies.. we are a lame duck.

This stuff seriously comes off like old style, rank anti-Semitism. The Jews are capitalists and communists, but mainly they suck because they're Jews. The Americans want to divide Europe and unite it, but mainly they're just Americans that suck.

I hate to get bottlenecked with kikes, but that's what is essentially being done here. We've replaced Jews among the more 'respectable' European far right types.

[The Lawspeaker]

I think that America (who funds the PVV and UKIP) has no interest in a United Europe: it would only become a competitor.

[The Lawspeaker]

This stuff seriously comes off like old style, rank anti-Semitism. The Jews are capitalists and communists, but mainly they suck because they'rew Jews. The Americans want to divide Europe and unite it, but mainly they're just Americans that suck.

I hate to get bottlenecked with kikes, but that's what is essentially being done here. We've replaced Jews among the more 'respectable' European far right types.

Rather that then blind, Joe.

[The Lawspeaker]

For now.. a kind of EFTA between the original members of the E.E.C (minus Greece) but with Sweden, Austria, Finland and Estonia (and maybe Norway, Switzerland, Liechtenstein and Iceland) could be the core to a new attempt to bring Europe closer together. But we should keep the Euro though but simply kick out the rest of all the Eurozone-members (as they have only costed us all a shitload of money) and get rid of Schengen for a while and start reforming the entire institution. At all costs: keep the Common Market.

[Groenewolf]

I think that America (who funds the PVV and UKIP) has no interest in a United Europe: it would only become a competitor.

Actually since the end of WOII America played a role in uniting Europe. Starting from the Marshall Plan, where America practically demanded that European nations must form some kind of economic cooperation before they received money from the USA. The reason why they had an interest in an united Europe is simple, it is more easily to deal with one minister of foreign affairs then with a few dozen.

And the PVV, as you know, has been branded as an anti-American party in diplomatic cables. Because Wilders does not supports Americas military operations. in the Middle East and calls for a pull back of Dutch forces.

[The Lawspeaker]

Actually since the end of WOII America played a role in uniting Europe. Starting from the Marshall Plan, where America practically demanded that European nations must form some kind of economic cooperation before they received money from the USA. The reason why they had an interest in an united Europe is simple, it is more easily to deal with one minister of foreign affairs then with a few dozen.

But a real European Union would be a competitor that would very likely no longer feel the need to lean on America. 700 million Europeans leaning on 300 million Americans ? Don't be daft, mate. Particularly not if there was a European Army.

And the PVV, as you know, has been branded as an anti-American party in diplomatic cables. Because Wilders does not supports Americas military operations. in the Middle East and calls for a pull back of Dutch forces.

While the PVV receives funding from neo-conservatives in the U.S.A and Israel ? And proven as well and was elected to the European Parliament on an anti-European platform ?

It would be all the more a sign that the U.S is backing two sides of the same coin then.

[Joe McCarthy]

Remember that those diplomatic cables come from the Obama administration. Wilders has supporters among the neo-con right, but also opponents, as well as other anti-Islam conservatives, along with contacts in the Pentagon, which is mostly a conservative bastion.

In other words, America is not a monolith... no more than 'Jewry' is.

[The Lawspeaker]

Right, Joe.

Besides the one institution that actually rules America is not even elected. The Fed. Reserve and the like. The AIPAC controls a lot in American politics and what kind of people are those ? Exactly.. they are Jews.

Or would you say that Ben Bernanke is a Christian ?

[Joe McCarthy]

Right, Joe.

Besides the one institution that actually rules America is not even elected. The Fed. Reserve and the like. The AIPAC controls a lot in American politics and what kind of people are those ? Exactly.. they are Jews.

Or would you say that Ben Bernanke is a Christian ?

AIPAC is mostly the domain of right-wing Jews of the sort most likely to support Wilders. The Fed tends to have a lot of Jews around it because Jews tend to be found in the financial sector to the tune of around 30% in the US. I'm personally unfamiliar with Bernanke's politics though. Greenspan was a disciple of Ayn Rand.