'Lowland Scots was the ruin of Scotland'

[antonio]

Some years, ago, at knowing Scot existence, I got a text on it and, frankly, it seemed to me just dialectal English written in an alternative way. At Spain full languages with further distance from Spanish (like the Aragonese spoken for half of my XIXth ancestors) are denied as independent entities for many with no remorse at all, even in their craddle lands.

In addition it's really a pity that original Celtic languages from Scotland, probably fair different from Gaelic have dissapeared without a trace.

Hence my conclusion is that current Scotland main diferential factor from England is a dirty viscose liquid very used as energy source.

[Albion]

By THOSE standards, the English are not native to England! Scotland is only CALLED 'Scotland' cos of these Gaels.

Yeah, really if it wasn't for the invasions of the Dark Ages there'd be none of the ethnicities there are no apart from perhaps the Irish.
Incoming Germanics set in motion the formation of England, Gaels in Scotland and the English also indirectly helped form the Welsh by confining the British Celtic culture to Cambria, Cornwall and formerly Rheged and Strathclyde too.

I didn't read the shite in the opening post's quote, but IF Lowlanders have ruined Scotland, then it's purely the fault of the Gaels themselves, for annexing so much Anglo-Cumbrian territory. Or for letting their Kings get so anglicised.

Yeah, we want Lothian back!

As a descendant of a Lowland Scotch peasant family who used to make Magister Eckhart's ancestors' porridge and wipe their arses for them, I say this attack on the Scots 'language' is an affront to Bernician sentiment and demand reparations!

Without the Gaelic and Germanic invasions, Picts would probably still exist in Scotland and Britons in Lowland Scotland, England and Wales, probably still divided though by political boundaries.
The Lowland Scots probably aren't pure Anglian anyway, no doubt there'll be some of the Britons in their ancestry.
Bernicia and Deira and Northumbria as a whole were never noted for their Anglo-Saxon purity, quite the opposite.
Lowland Scotland and Northern England's Marches will be much the same genealogically - Angles and assimilated Cumbric-speaking Britons.

[Albion]

Some years, ago, at knowing Scot existence, I got a text on it and, frankly, it seemed to me just dialectal English written in an alternative way.

That is basically what it is. It's a collection of Northern English dialects written phonetically, not forced into the rigid spelling systems of Southern English dialects which set the standard of writing.
Because it's classed as a separate language they can write it however they feel like even if it does just look like dyslexic English sometimes.

[antonio]

That is basically what it is. It's a collection of Northern English dialects written phonetically, not forced into the rigid spelling systems of Southern English dialects which set the standard of writing.

It's curious how all languages at British isles (as Celtics as Germanics) suffered since early Middle Ages massive processes of fonetic alterations whilst caused big gaps between speech and writing. Unfortunatelly we will never known the factors who operated.

Because it's classed as a separate language they can write it however they
feel like even if it does just look like dyslexic English sometimes.

Maybe it's worth to mention that many foreigner users of English (not only dislexics in our native languages ) are really fed up with all your complexities (even at Greek loans your scholars kept i.e. etimological PH instead of F, or TH instead of T) ....so, in fact i recall i then think of it, maybe will be worth abandoning the English of the Queen for the easier and more natural Scot, and is almost relieving that at least your dislexicals relatives consider your writing difficult (WTF not simply F) as hell

[Allenson]

Hmm, interesting position the author takes here. Couple lines that really stood out to me:

The people who spoke Lowland 'Scots' considered themselves English and English-speaking

English speaking maybe but I very much doubt that the Scots speakers of yore thought of themelves as English. That sounds just plain silly to me.

And this one:

Without the Scots of Dàl Riada, there would be no country called Scotland in the north of Britain

No, it might still be called Pictland.

Did Trog write that? (Actually, I think she identifies with the Picts as well as the Dal Riada Scots...)

[Albion]

It's curious how all languages at British isles (as Celtics as Germanics) suffered since early Middle Ages massive processes of fonetic alterations whilst caused big gaps between speech and writing. Unfortunatelly we will never known the factors who operated.



Maybe it's worth to mention that many foreigner users of English (not only dislexics in our native languages ) are really fed up with all your complexities (even at Greek loans your scholars kept i.e. etimological PH instead of F, or TH instead of T) ....so, in fact i recall i then think of it, maybe will be worth abandoning the English of the Queen for the easier and more natural Scot, and is almost relieving that at least your dislexicals relatives consider your writing difficult (WTF not simply F) as hell

Well it was standardised by stuck-up educated rich people, so they made it quirky to suit their own interest.

French loan words go against English norms too, like 'champagne', in English it should be rendered as 'cham-pag-un' or something like that, instead it becomes more like 'sham-pain' when it is spelt nothing like that.

We nees a simpler system, I agree. Just not Scots.

I quite like Middle English - you really see a lot of development in it as well as features modern English has sadly lost and there's a lot of differences between dialects too.
A feature English has largely lost which I like is word endings such as '-en' and '-eth' - "He spoketh".

Modern standard English mainly evolved from London speech derived from the South and East Midlands, but in a few cases some Northern dialect features prevailed.
I read a good book about it, I think it was called 'The stories of English'.

I think we should go back to middle English, a better version of the language altogether.

Modern and Middle English are the same language, Old English is drastically different, alien almost alien sadly.

We should go back to the speech of Shakespear and Chaucer!

[Albion]

It's curious how all languages at British isles (as Celtics as Germanics) suffered since early Middle Ages massive processes of fonetic alterations whilst caused big gaps between speech and writing. Unfortunatelly we will never known the factors who operated.



Maybe it's worth to mention that many foreigner users of English (not only dislexics in our native languages ) are really fed up with all your complexities (even at Greek loans your scholars kept i.e. etimological PH instead of F, or TH instead of T) ....so, in fact i recall i then think of it, maybe will be worth abandoning the English of the Queen for the easier and more natural Scot, and is almost relieving that at least your dislexicals relatives consider your writing difficult (WTF not simply F) as hell

[Graham]

By THOSE standards, the English are not native to England! Scotland is only CALLED 'Scotland' cos of these Gaels.

I didn't read the shite in the opening post's quote, but IF Lowlanders have ruined Scotland, then it's purely the fault of the Gaels themselves, for annexing so much Anglo-Cumbrian territory. Or for letting their Kings get so anglicised.

Yep, Saint Margaret of Scotland or Margaret of Wessex and Queen Margaret of Scotland Being a good example. She done alot for the country.


The ruin of Scotland was the Darien Scheme. Taking woolen bonnets to Panama. jesus! Bunch of fools.

[Osweo]

English speaking maybe but I very much doubt that the Scots speakers of yore thought of themelves as English. That sounds just plain silly to me.

It wasn't 'Scots' in 'Yore'. They called it 'English', using spellings like 'Inglis' and were quite straightforward about it until the early modern period.

From 500 till 933 there was NO question about their Englishness, of course! Northern England's greatest saint was from the Lammermuirs, after all.

[Albion]

The ruin of Scotland was the Darien Scheme. Taking woolen bonnets to Panama. jesus! Bunch of fools.

Agreed.

I'm sure the Kuna natives would have loved them in the tropical climate.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuna_people

The Kuna somehow have a swastika flag which they claim to be an ancient symbol of theirs too! (scroll down):

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuna_Yala