I would like to hear your opinion on a personal matter.

[Loki]

My advice, if you want to retain and continue in this job: submit to their wishes. The alternative is worse, almost always.

The only other viable alternative is to look for a new job, and when you have found one, you can tell your bosses exactly what's on your mind on the last day.

[gixajo]

What are some examples, situations etc?

The important thing is the general idea that emerges from a theoretical case, not the particular case, I don't think the details contribute anything to the case.

I made the thread more to know the opinions of people here than to ask for advice on what to do. I already know what most likely I'm going to do.

The people closest to me tell me not to do what they fear that I will end up doing that is just being a kamikaze of my interests, and sacrifice part of them for the sake of an idealism that many consider very laudable but stupid.

But hey, even knowing me they still love and accept me, they already know how I am and it´s suppose that is part of my little remaining attractiveness as person.

Precisely this "stupid idealism" is what scares my bosses, since this "idealism" interferes with the rules they try to impose on me, and it makes me someone "unpredictable" in terms of how far I can go ruled and controlled by it.

It must be part of the midlife crisis, before I was more obedient.

[Nurzat]

after many years of office work in which I saw many situations and almost no colleague ever supported me in situations versus managers, while I sometimes spoke for others, well, at my new job (over 2 years into this job already) I just mind my own business and though my boss is annoying and likes to be always right and all that, I let him be while ignoring his and colleagues' rants and bad moments, like I don't care, and although it wasn't easy at first, I trained myself not to care and work has lowest emotional priority for me - I hold to it and do my job to a level they cannot complain too much, but it is not my life, as it used to be in the periods when I worked even 16 hours a day sometimes, because it was not worth it and colleagues, even friends, always see for their own situation and don't risk it to help you if a situation arises, so screw them, just have a normal fair relationship to everybody and if they don't harass you just let them be, say "ok boss" and then ignore it and he will be the one frustrated when he sees you do your job but you don't give a fuck about him, it will put him to his place, he will feel he is not your boss, just your superior at work, he will know emotionally he has nothing on you

[Insuperable]

So you are saying that in a situation like this, what we have to do is play the fool by ignoring your principles and the blind man by not reacting to injustices to emerge as unscathed as possible ?

Wouldn't the decent thing be to confront what is unfair with honesty and sincerity even if this brings us harm?

They taught me that above discipline and above my interests is honor.

Can you 'confront' them diplomatically, with curiosity, you know, without any sign of confront?

The important thing is the general idea that emerges from a theoretical case, not the particular case, I don't think the details contribute anything to the case.

I made the thread more to know the opinions of people here than to ask for advice on what to do. I already know what most likely I'm going to do.

The people closest to me tell me not to do what they fear that I will end up doing that is just being a kamikaze of my interests, and sacrifice part of them for the sake of an idealism that many consider very laudable but stupid.

But hey, even knowing me they still love and accept me, they already know how I am and it´s suppose that is part of my little remaining attractiveness as person.

The reason why I asked is because you said that you argued with many bosses. Is it possible that you are wrong? The premise of the thread is that you are right and that bosses are wrong. If so people already gave you a good advice.

[catgeorge]

I've faced and argued with many bosses, and this it's starting to take its toll on me.

They are letting people who were well below me on the ladder get benefits ahead of me.

I have the "moral support" of the majority of my colleagues, but in this context I know in advance that no one is going to expose their interests to defend me.

About "bosses" they have no problem with me being part of the team, but they first want to subject me to their rules; they see me as potentially problematic for their interests because I am contesting decisions that I believe are unfair.

They have made it quite clear to me that I do not have enough strength to face them, so they have gone from insinuating to me "that's not going well" and are beginning to tell me straight "if you continue like this you are going to have to look for another place, you are so replaceable like anyone."

So I am faced with the usual dilemma... Do I remain faithful to my principles and risk fighting or do I protect my interests by submitting to their rules, even if I consider them unfair?

What would you do?

Pending on what skills you have but I could easily tell my employer to go and shove his head up his ass to see if it fits if I felt mistreated and get another job. Or you can slowly chip away and be self sufficient - you won't make much most likely but will be enough to be self sufficient. You just need a basic skill to get customers there are billions of people in the world.

[protos]

So you are saying that in a situation like this, what we have to do is play the fool by ignoring your principles and the blind man by not reacting to injustices to emerge as unscathed as possible ?

Wouldn't the decent thing be to confront what is unfair with honesty and sincerity even if this brings us harm?

They taught me that above discipline and above my interests is honor.

Yes. You are not owner of that job. You already shown your concerns and if the owner (or board of directors, shareholders whoever you work for) is fine with having shortsighted managers then it means they don't really care for their employees (they care for profit anyway, but some companies care for employees as well).

So the trust and care should be mutual, and you're not rich and you should be thinking about yourself and your family, and not waste time with dumbasses.

[gixajo]

Pending on what skills you have but I could easily tell my employer to go and shove his head up his ass to see if it fits if I felt mistreated and get another job. Or you can slowly chip away and be self sufficient - you won't make much most likely but will be enough to be self sufficient. You just need a basic skill to get customers there are billions of people in the world.

The problem is not finding another job or not, that doesn't worry me.

The dilemma is between "fighting" or "submitting for comfort."

[catgeorge]

The problem is not finding another job or not, that doesn't worry me.

The dilemma is between "fighting" or "submitting for comfort."

Well it depends on the individual I suppose - I am not engineered to submit to anything and fighting over something this silly makes no sense.

[gixajo]

Well it depends on the individual I suppose - I am not engineered to submit to anything and fighting over something this silly makes no sense.

That is a very utilitarian and very prosaic position. But I suppose you mean "you have to be pragmatic."

[nittionia]

It depends how you fight back. If you are doing something that can bite you back later on, then you will end up more harmed than them and that is useless. If it is something than you can feel satisfied about and prepared to move on, maybe it is worth it