Self-Determination or Territorial Integrity?

[Joe McCarthy]

The CSA regarded itself as rightfully independent, hence it wasn't treason.

Yeah, the usual loophole argument against the treason charge. Nonetheless, it was waging war against the United States, and actively sought to bring in foreign powers onto our soil to assist them in rebellion.

Getting the French involved in North America could have untold consequences. Just look what they've done to Canada.

[Padre Organtino]

This question has no meaning in the New World except for Quebec.

Well, if the current trends continue we may witness those separatist movements inside US as well. And I don't have only Southerners in my mind.

[Anarch]

As it was the Confederacy committed treason by actively seeking foreign intervention. They offered Napoleon III cotton at cut rate prices if he'd help break the naval blockade of New Orleans. The French only declined because the British refused to help them.

Waging some dumb guerilla campaign would of course been entirely unnecessary and implausible had the blasted Confederates not seceded in the first place.

Following this line of logic, the United States of America should never have seceeded from the British Empire. Breaking a naval blockade is entirely different from one side encouraging the active expansion of French colonies at the expense of the other.

[Joe McCarthy]

The Chinese are 10,000 times more our enemy than Russia, and I'm sure they'd love to see a secessionist movement in the USA.

I certainly wouldn't go that far. Don't let the fact that they're white blind you to reality.

While I'm sure the chinks wouldn't mind seeing us break up, I'm unaware of any prominent figure in the Chinese government saying so publicly, unlike Russia.

[Joe McCarthy]

Following this line of logic, the United States of America should never have seceeded from the British Empire.

Apples and oranges. The British Empire had surrendered sovereignty by declaring us outside the protection of the law. In the case of the American Revolution rebellion was necessary to restore law and order.

[Anarch]

Yeah, the usual loophole argument against the treason charge. Nonetheless, it was waging war against the United States, and actively sought to bring in foreign powers onto our soil to assist them in rebellion.

Getting the French involved in North America could have untold consequences. Just look what they've done to Canada.

If I recall correctly, the French provided assistance to American insurgents during the independence war.

Apples and oranges. The British Empire had surrendered sovereignty by declaring us outside the protection of the law. In the case of the American Revolution rebellion was necessary to restore law and order.

And what exactly was the attitude of Lincoln towards the South's rebels?

[Joe McCarthy]

If I recall correctly, the French provided assistance to American insurgents during the independence war.

Naturally, but in that case it was the United States doing it, which is to say the French would have been unable to gain a foothold with a rebel faction on US soil.

And what exactly was the attitude of Lincoln towards the South's rebels?

Lincoln too was restoring law and order.

[Sarmatian]

I certainly wouldn't go that far. Don't let the fact that they're white blind you to reality.

While I'm sure the chinks wouldn't mind seeing us break up, I'm unaware of any prominent figure in the Chinese government saying so publicly, unlike Russia.

Could you please name an example of such Russian government figure.

[riverman]

I think it depends on the country. A country that is basically one nationality, such as the U.S.A., should for logical reasons, (although argued by some), retain it's borders, and there is a use for a Federal government. On the other hand, countries, nations that are built through merely accomadating other ethnicities, who oppose each other should of course have the right to separate themselves from a quasi-nationhood.

[Joe McCarthy]

Could you please name an example of such Russian government figure.

Igor Panarin and Vladimir Zhironovsky, both of whom are Russian expansionists and envision Russia reclaiming Alaska after a US breakup.