Britain is more French than it thinks

[Anglojew]

There was no migration of Normans from France to England. Huguenots, yes.

Yes, it was really a migration of what would become Anglo-Norman aristocrats but William did bring 10,000 men with him. There are literally hundreds of very prominant Anglo-Norman families. I can trace one line of descent personally from a Breton knight who arrived with William (many of the "Normans" were actually Bretons) unfortunately one of my ancestors brother's murdered (Saint) Thomas Becket (but as I understand it he thought he was being loyal to the King).

[Anglojew]

I wouldn't call a few thousand a migration. It's misleading.

I think because they played so prominant a role in the future of English and England it has to be called a migration. 10,000 approximately was quite a lot 1000 years ago especially considering they basically replaced the whole upper classes (and clergy).

[Loki]

I think because they played so prominant a role in the future of English and England it has to be called a migration. 10,000 approximately was quite a lot 1000 years ago especially considering they basically replaced the whole upper classes (and clergy).

It's not comparable with Anglo-Saxon and Danish migrations, though. Not even close.

[Prisoner Of Ice]

It's not comparable with Anglo-Saxon and Danish migrations, though. Not even close.

That was beyond migration, that was outright replacement. Not too many times in europe has that much replacement happened...if any? At least not ones we can pin down so easily, obviously roman empire falling was a big deal, both in east and west.

[Anglojew]

It's not comparable with Anglo-Saxon and Danish migrations, though. Not even close.

That's true but it's an important element in the makeup of English language and culture so can't be ignored.

[Jackson]

That was beyond migration, that was outright replacement. Not too many times in europe has that much replacement happened...if any? At least not ones we can pin down so easily, obviously roman empire falling was a big deal, both in east and west.

It has happened many times in Europe, and many times across the world.

[Rudel]

Gallo is the forgotten "language" in Brittany. They'd rather be Celts nowadays.

Breton nationalists would go at length about how Gallo has to be eradicated. Well, they also say that French Nationalism actually turns you gay (not shitting you).

I wouldn't call a few thousand a migration. It's misleading.

Most of the "great invasions" actually have that kind of scale. They generally impact genetics less than we think (which tend to follow long-time and smooth population movements much more).

What was the population of England at the time? Like 2 million? And this an invading elite as well it would have been very noticeable. Then you have the population bottleneck during after the black death that took out half the population of England and forced the aristocracy to marry out and commoners to work their way up, creating the first nouveau riche merchant class.

And more importantly, accelerating dramatically the rise of the English language.

Yes, it was really a migration of what would become Anglo-Norman aristocrats but William did bring 10,000 men with him. There are literally hundreds of very prominant Anglo-Norman families. I can trace one line of descent personally from a Breton knight who arrived with William (many of the "Normans" were actually Bretons) unfortunately one of my ancestors brother's murdered (Saint) Thomas Becket (but as I understand it he thought he was being loyal to the King).

There was probably a movement of population after Hastings anyway. And yes, a good part of the "Normands" were from Brittany, Poitou, Maine, Vexin etc.

[Jackson]

Breton nationalists would go at length about how Gallo has to be eradicated. Well, they also say that French Nationalism actually turns you gay (not shitting you).


Most of the "great invasions" actually have that kind of scale. They generally impact genetics less than we think (which tend to follow long-time and smooth population movements much more).


And more importantly, accelerating dramatically the rise of the English language.


There was probably a movement of population after Hastings anyway. And yes, a good part of the "Normands" were from Brittany, Poitou, Maine, Vexin etc.

Certainly a lot of migration followed the Norman conquest, although a lot of it wasn't specifically Norman. For example in one area in southern Wales Flemish was the most common language spoken there at one point. And apparently a lot of Bretons went to Lincolnshire too for example, can't remember everything but certainly it had some impact, although not nearly as big as previous migrations.