The "ginger" gene

[NamelessOne]

I mean the redhead gene the UK are making such a fuss about.
They say that it's a recessive gene and it's very hard to transmit unless both parents are redheaded.

It's only a celtic thing or it's true for all?
For example is there a difference between a 100% celt ginger with frekels,transparent skin and green eyes and a slavic redhead with red hair light skin and eyes?

I for example have reddish blond hair,but no frekels and the skintone of a typical blond person. I have no celtic ancestry what so ever.So do i fall into the category of the redheaded people of celtic descent?
They(the uk) present gingerness as a genetical fault/defect...do the slavic redheads/germanic redheads fall into the same category(as far as genes are concerned).

Picture of a redhead russian:
http://gdb.rferl.org/4CEE67B5-495E-4739-9594-EF46BFE6B958_mw800_mh600.jpg

Picture of celtic kids:
http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/06_01/ginger2NNP0106_468x320.jpg
So do celtic peoples genes correspond for redhair are the same with the genes of non-celtic people?
Sorry if you don't get what i am saying, i am pretty tired.

[Wölfin]

The two parents don't need to be redheads, rather the two parents have to have the redhead gene/allele. I know a family, the father is a brunet (jewish) and the mother is blonde (french-canadian)... All three kids are redheads, but varying shades. First is auburn/dark red and has no freckles, the second my friend is strawberry blonde/orange and has almost translucid skin with freckles and the third has freckles on his face but almost brown hair.

The ginger gene is present in most caucasian populations, and I think it is a single gene. However the varying populations have various % chances of producing a redhead. A Scottish person has about a 20% chance of having a ginger kid (if I recall correctly) with an other Scotsmen, regardless of whether they are ginger or not.

I think what gives the typical "redhead skin" is something else, not the hair gene itself, since there exists people with a typical redhead complexion (with or without freckles) but not with red hair.

[Black Turlogh]

I'm quite sure red hair is not necessarily indicative of "Celtic" ancestry. I'd read somewhere that it was a trait passed from Neanderthals, though I haven't any idea whether it's true or not.

[la bombe]

No, it is not a "Celtic" trait, it can be found in variety of populations (there's a high percentage of Ashkenazi Jews with red hair for example), including some in Asia and Africa, although at much, MUCH lower frequencies than in Northwestern Europeans. As Laurentian explained, it doesn't take two red-haired parents, it just takes two parents who both carry copies of the recessive gene that causes the mutation for red hair. I myself have red hair as does my mother, and neither of her parents had red hair, but black and brown, respectively.

[Stefan]

My grandmother and my aunt have "reddish" brown hair, but not necessarily the lighter color you are describing. My grandmother does have a lot of continental Celtic ancestry(Bretagne-France, Asturias - Spain, and Galacia - Spain which is where she was born). Both of her parents had dark brown and medium brown hair as far as I have been told. Here is a picture of her hair color if you are interested.

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=3039&stc=1&d=1256322684

I definitely do not think it is exclusive to Celts(which encompasses a very broad group of many sub-races by the way.) Pretty much just a stereotype imo.

[Gooding]

I've asked that question for years, partly seeking answers to my own identity crisis. How the hell can two brunettes, one born to a brunette mother and a strawberry blond father and one born to two jet black haired brunettes, have a fair skinned, freckled strawberry blond son?Is it even an ethnic marker or an individual variation? Genes are fucked up things to try to explain sometimes..

[Wölfin]

I've asked that question for years, partly seeking answers to my own identity crisis. How the hell can two brunettes, one born to a brunette mother and a strawberry blond father and one born to two jet black haired brunettes, have a fair skinned, freckled strawberry blond son?Is it even an ethnic marker or an individual variation? Genes are fucked up things to try to explain sometimes..

What? How can you have an identity crisis over red hair?

Anyway considering red hair is a recessive genes, it can stay dormant for generations on end. Amongst humans it is quite difficult to breed out certain traits and genes because they've long since been propagated lol. The fact that you have one strawberry blonde grandfather on one side simply increases the chances of the two alleles matching up, esp since in Europeans and in certain ethnic groups the incidence of red hair is much higher.

[Gooding]

What? How can you have an identity crisis over red hair?

Anyway considering red hair is a recessive genes, it can stay dormant for generations on end. Amongst humans it is quite difficult to breed out certain traits and genes because they've long since been propagated lol. The fact that you have one strawberry blonde grandfather on one side simply increases the chances of the two alleles matching up, esp since in Europeans and in certain ethnic groups the incidence of red hair is much higher.

I know it sounds silly, but I'd just wondered why I hadn't gotten the hair color of my father, mother and sister, as I was under the impression that darker colored hair was supposed to dominate over lighter. The information provided here does shed some light on the topic, though.Thank you.:)

[Skandi]

I have the same both of my parents are brown and so are 3 of my grandparents the remaining one being dark blond. My closest relative with red tinges would be a great aunt, it's amazing how it hides! However my present bf is also red and green eyed (mine are blue) we don't have too many options if we were to have children!

[Septentrion]

I'm quite sure red hair is not necessarily indicative of "Celtic" ancestry. I'd read somewhere that it was a trait passed from Neanderthals, though I haven't any idea whether it's true or not.
The Neanderthal connection has finally recently being denied! Our Homo-Sapien Sapiens ancestors didn't mate with Neanderthals, rather underwent the same process of de-pigmentation as them then later acquired red-hair.

[Septentrion]

No, it is not a "Celtic" trait, it can be found in variety of populations (there's a high percentage of Ashkenazi Jews with red hair for example), including some in Asia and Africa, although at much, MUCH lower frequencies than in Northwestern Europeans. As Laurentian explained, it doesn't take two red-haired parents, it just takes two parents who both carry copies of the recessive gene that causes the mutation for red hair. I myself have red hair as does my mother, and neither of her parents had red hair, but black and brown, respectively.
I myself have sandy hair and a freckly complexion, though I'm Flemish. However they probably called it Celtic gene, because it was so prevalent among them people.

[Bellbeaking]

I myself have sandy hair and a freckly complexion, though I'm Flemish. However they probably called it Celtic gene, because it was so prevalent among them people.

Do you enjoy being so?

[JanRonneus]

I myself have sandy hair and a freckly complexion, though I'm Flemish. However they probably called it Celtic gene, because it was so prevalent among them people.

Fucking idiot! You call yourself Flemish when you are only 1/16.

You are half English from Lincolnshire, Yorkshire West-riding, and Rutland.

You have stated on City-Data that your rufosity as well as the rufosity of your two other red-haired siblings comes from your father‘s side.

„Excuse me, my hair is light auburn was more red as a child. Of my three siblings, two more have red to orange hair, freckles and greenish-blue eyes and my other sibling has now mousy hair which was very blonde as a child and blue eyes. It seems like most of us inherited our red hair from my paternal side which is fully English. My paternal ancestors were originally from Lincolnshire and Yorkshire. We all are possessors of two MC1R gene variants. I am a redhead and I am proud of it. I have never claimed to be Irish, I have numerously times said that my ancestry lineage is Anglo-Saxon and Dutch, which is quite Germanic. Though red hair among the Dutch is obviously much less common than among the English. My mother is of Dutch descent and speaks fluently Dutch too, so do I. Ha!ha!ha! skin phototype II makes up 50% of the Irish population and skin type I makes up 26%, now that's a scientific fact. Amongst the the Dutch, since red hair is less common, we see that red hair and skin type I and II are much les frequent than amongst the Brits/Irish. Nevertheless many Dutch people are blonde-headed, especially those from the north.“

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/forum/europe/2276672-there-really-places-scandinavia-99-blondes-50.html#post38650035#ixzz5kpI1UJmO

[Dick]

wtf is going on here

[Ayetooey]

I had someone go through my FTDNA raw data; don't have any of the "ginger genes" snps that ftdna tests. I test negative on dna portal also.

[JanRonneus]

wtf is going on here

Septentrion is being exposed for good.

[♥ Lily ♥]

https://media1.giphy.com/media/9J5jUAKsF7Wq0sKjjy/giphy.gif

[♥ Lily ♥]

There's 20 million red hair gene carriers in the British Isles... https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2401346/Ginger-genes-Research-reveals-20MILLION-red-hair-gene-carriers-Britain-Ireland.html and we got our lily skin and freckles from the MC1R gene. I got my red hair from my English maternal grandfather (he was a strawberry blond although his extremely tall and freckled eldest son is ginger.) Some foreign people in the UK have asked me if I'm Irish or Scottish... but I'm from south-west England.

Percentage of red hair gene carriers in the British Isles. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2401346/Ginger-genes-Research-reveals-20MILLION-red-hair-gene-carriers-Britain-Ireland.html
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/08/24/article-2401346-1B7041FC000005DC-552_634x757.jpg

[nittionia]

I have the ginger gene lol
https://i.imgur.com/h5LLZUq.jpg

[♥ Lily ♥]

Freckles 'sunkisses' are extremely common here too... and it's not just our redheads who have them. I've seen plenty of blonds and light brunette people with lots of freckles here too.

University academic, spokesperson, supermodel, and movie actress Lily Cole is from Devon in south-west England and she also has ginger hair and lots of freckles.

My sisters and nieces also have very fair skin with freckles that burns easily in the sun. I use very high (factor 110 skin protection) sunblock all year round along with sun hats and sun parasols during the English summer months to prevent burning. Applying lots of sunscreens all over my body each morning is like a religion to me. I wear high protection on my lips and hair too, along with special gloves in the summer and long SPF protective clothing and I frequently wear sunglasses in the winter months too.

Using high SPF sunblocks helps to reduce freckles in the summer. Reports show that thousands of British people spend hundreds of pounds each year having their freckles surgically lasered off as we tend to feel self-conscious about having freckles. (Some people grow out of their childhood freckles by the time they're an adult, but many keep hundreds of our tiny freckles all our life.)

My mum and my dad still have all their freckles and my very tall grandfather had his all his life too. My Irish descent and very tall maternal grandmother was able to get a deep tan in the sun and she never burned and she didn't have any freckles. So I got my pale skin from my English maternal grandfather and from my mother and from my father's side too. Both of my fair skinned parents and my pale sisters and grandfather and uncles and maternal cousins all burn quickly in the sun.

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/8c/23/fe/8c23fea423a5757442f7616759064658--lily-cole-freckles.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/736x/2c/7b/c9/2c7bc9a42574e6ae0bb3065377d6b85f.jpg
http://cosmouk.cdnds.net/cm/14/30/53d58e5a04815_-_freckles-lily-cole.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-okpjWsAWh2w/UKZXD5zy41I/AAAAAAAAFKU/xKYl2c9QK_8/s1600/Vogue-UK-Dec-2004-Pantomime-PhotosBy-Tim-Walker-ScannedBy-Perlefine-04.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-znAYqzHk5eY/UERfXoIy8kI/AAAAAAAAFhs/7R-B5iYz6QE/s1600/Lily+Cole-1.jpg
http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/9000000/Lily-Cole-masquerade-9022512-445-443.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzeUfhqGo1E&frags=pl%2Cwn

[Blondie]

Ginger hair is beautiful :)

[JanRonneus]

https://media1.giphy.com/media/9J5jUAKsF7Wq0sKjjy/giphy.gif

Septentrion is an American. He is only 1/16 Flemish and Half English. That is why he is so obsessed with British people.

If he was really a full Fleming like he claims on this forum, he would be more focused on Flemish people.

[Rædwald]

https://i.postimg.cc/tgJgHYHM/mc1r.png

I do not carry the Gene according to yourdnaportal, however my brother is red-haired, my father had a red beard (before becoming grey) and all of my father's sisters were red-haired with the exception of one blond.

You can see the presence of this in my facial hair as well, funny how this works.

[♥ Lily ♥]

It's the rarest hair colour in the world (only 2% of the world's population has red hair,) with the highest percentage of redheads found in the British Isles and Ireland.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eI5WJ0dWWPE&frags=pl%2Cwn

[♥ Lily ♥]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBWEf4OCNLM&frags=pl%2Cwn

[♥ Lily ♥]

Septentrion is an American. He is only 1/16 Flemish and Half English. That is why he is so obsessed with British people.

If he was really a full Fleming like he claims on this forum, he would be more focused on Flemish people.

I don't care where he's from... whether he's American or European... so what if he's an American?! I like Septentrion... he's a great poster at dealing with the posters who troll the English, Scottish, Welsh, and Irish... and he's one of my favourite posters, so leave him alone.

[JanRonneus]

https://i.postimg.cc/5tr29b4N/IMG-20181109-150431.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/tgJgHYHM/mc1r.png

I do not carry the Gene according to yourdnaportal, however my brother is red-haired, my father had a red beard (before becoming grey) and all of my father's sisters were red-haired with the exception of one blond.

You can see the presence of this in my facial hair as well, funny how this works.

What about rs1805006 (D84E)? It’s less common, but it’s still a possibility.

[Matty74]

I carry the gene for red hair. My niece has red hair AND blue eyes, several of my cousins and an aunt have red hair as well. Not sure about their eyes though.

[JanRonneus]

I carry the gene for red hair. My niece has red hair, several of my cousins and an aunt have red hair as well.

Which variants do you carry? R151C (rs1805007), R160W (rs1805008), D294H (rs1805009), and/or D84E (rs1805006)?

[Matty74]

Which variants do you carry? R151C (rs1805007), R160W (rs1805008), D294H (rs1805009), and/or D84E (rs1805006)?

rs11547464

[JanRonneus]

rs11547464

Interesting. That one is even rarer than rs1805006.

It’s more common in Southern European redheads based on the data I have.

[Matty74]

Which variants do you carry? R151C (rs1805007), R160W (rs1805008), D294H (rs1805009), and/or D84E (rs1805006)?


I'm not sure where the red hair gene comes from. Most of my ancestry is either from Southwestern Norway or Lower Saxony (Emden, Leer, Schleswig/Slesvig, Uelzen and Windheim) and Mecklenburg. I did have a great grandmother from Slesvig in Denmark near Haderslev. There's some Irish in there but I'm not sure where, but I think it's mostly related to my Norwegian ancestry. My great-grandparents were from Madla Norway, which is near Stavanger.

[JanRonneus]

I'm not sure where the red hair gene comes from. Most of my ancestry is either from Southwestern Norway or Lower Saxony (Emden, Leer, Schleswig/Slesvig, Uelzen and Windheim) and Mecklenburg. I did have a great grandmother from Slesvig in Denmark near Haderslev. There's some Irish in there but I'm not sure where, but I think it's mostly related to my Norwegian ancestry. My great-grandparents were from Madla Norway, which is near Stavanger.

The red hair gene is MC1R and is common to mammals.

The variant alleles that are the cause of red hair in humans are very old, but specific to our species unlike the gene (MC1R).

According to BritiansDNA Redhead Project the two most common MC1R variants associated with red hair R151C and R160W may be 70,000 years old, originating in Middle-Paleolithic West Asia. D294H is much younger, and is thought to originate among Upper-Paleolithic Europeans about 30,000 years ago.

The other variants I have no idea about.

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/mace-lab/genetic-ancestry/guff_pages/guff_documents/Red-Head_Project.pdf

[Rædwald]

What about rs1805006 (D84E)? It’s less common, but it’s still a possibility.

rs1805006 C;C

rs1805007 C;C

rs1805008 C;C

rs1805009 G;G

Homozygous right across the board

[Matty74]

I read somewhere that there was a neanderthal connection, but I didn't really read it that closely.

[JanRonneus]

rs1805006 C;C

rs1805007 C;C

rs1805008 C;C

rs1805009 G;G

Homozygous right across the board

One of your parents may have been carriers, you just didn’t inherit a copy of the recessive allele.

[JanRonneus]

I read somewhere that there was a neanderthal connection, but I didn't really read it that closely.

No. None of the variants associated with red hair in our species have been found in any Neanderthal sample to date.

They may have had redheads, just not redheads with the same MC1R genotype as modern humans.

[Rædwald]

One of your parents may have been carriers, you just didn’t inherit a copy of the recessive allele.

I think that both of them have to be carriers, as my brother is a redhead. We have the same parents of course, but I understand how this could still be.

[Matty74]

Interesting, I’m not the most educated person on that particular topic. I’m learning as I go.

[JanRonneus]

I think that both of them have to be carriers, as my brother is a redhead. We have the same parents of course, but I understand how this could still be.

Both you parents could certainly be carriers. In that case it would be less likely that you would not be a carrier than be a carrier, though.

[Septentrion]

Septentrion is an American. He is only 1/16 Flemish and Half English. That is why he is so obsessed with British people.

If he was really a full Fleming like he claims on this forum, he would be more focused on Flemish people.

So that’s the reason that you’re giving for not to be Flemish? Ha!ha!ha! You’re hilarious.

[Melkiirs]

So that’s the reason that you’re giving for not to be Flemish? Ha!ha!ha! You’re hilarious.

That was me Septentrion. The actual Jan Ronneus (not that account) was the German anthrotard who has been aware of you since before you were registered here. He was the guy who exposed your saxonwold account on city-data.com to me back in 2019.

https://www.quora.com/profile/Jan-Ronneus

Was he wrong all along and just resentful for some reason? Perhaps he just thought you were darkwashing or otherwise misrepresenting Germans. I'm open to the truth now.

[Grace O'Malley]

I carry one variant for red hair. While I do not have red hair I have a reddish tinge to my hair. On my paternal side I have many relatives including 1st cousins with red hair.

https://i.imgur.com/bUv6AGx.png

[Melkiirs]

I carry one variant for red hair. While I do not have red hair I have a reddish tinge to my hair. On my paternal side I have many relatives including 1st cousins with red hair.

Is it R160W (rs1805008)? I think you mentioned carrying that variant before but I could have misremembered.

[Sheppey]

I mean the redhead gene the UK are making such a fuss about.
They say that it's a recessive gene and it's very hard to transmit unless both parents are redheaded.

It's only a celtic thing or it's true for all?




For my own part, I agree with those who think that the tribes of Germany are free from all taint of inter-marriages with foreign nations, and that they appear as a distinct, unmixed race, like none but themselves. Hence, too, the same physical peculiarities throughout so vast a population. All have fierce blue eyes, red hair, huge frames, fit only for a sudden exertion. They are less able to bear laborious work. Heat and thirst they cannot in the least endure; to cold and hunger their climate and their soil inure them.
-
--Complete Works of Tacitus. Tacitus. Alfred John Church. William Jackson Brodribb. Lisa Cerrato. edited for Perseus. New York. : Random House, Inc. Random House, Inc. reprinted 1942.


https://i.postimg.cc/LXtg9tHr/england.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/hv0HmjDv/lily2.jpg

[Grace O'Malley]

Is it R160W (rs1805008)? I think you mentioned carrying that variant before.

Yes that's the one. :) I have one of my first cousins tested at ancestry who has the red hair but I don't think he has really looked at his dna results much. His daughter who has red hair also is tested at MyHeritage. It would be interesting to see their results but I haven't asked them about it. They live in Ireland so I haven't really had any discussion about it just the genealogy side of things.