Marriage between different Europids?

[Östsvensk]

I couldn't find a thread about this matter when I searched (and I searched quite long ;) ).

There is a thread about this subject on Skadi, so I thought the question could be brought up here too.

If you vote the third option, please elaborate. I would choose that option, and thus will do. :)

As the alternative says, only if the two types are somewhat close to each other and falls into the "indigenous" category of a country.

My family is quite "mixed" itself, with my father being very Nordid with some West Baltid influences (thus making him a "homemade Trønder" type). I would think that my paternal grandmother is a North-Atlantid (very Nordid with dark hair) and that my maternal grandfather is a textbook Dalo-Nordid, more or less. My Baltid phenotype comes from my maternal grandmother. I don't know my paternal grandfathers type since I've never met him and there are only bad pictures of him, but judging from those pictures, he seemed to have been at least mesocephalic. My younger brother reminds much of our father, though he has green eyes (father has blue). Other than that, I have uncles and aunts falling into the Borreby category. :)

This of course makes me "partial". My family falls within the Northern (both North-Western and North-Eastern) category, so I'd have to say that I wouldn't be against a marriage between a Faelid / Brünn and a Nordid for instance. Neither I wouldn't be against a Baltid / West Baltid marrying a Borreby or Nordid.

But when it would come to cases like Mediterranid + Borreby or Dinarid + Nordid... Well, at least I could say that I wouldn't recommend it.

[Tabiti]

Well, I doubt that there are any Europeids here who aren't a result of inbreeding between different subraces or are not going to "perform" such inbreeding in future.

Myself I'm a result of Pontid (my mother) and Pontisized Mesocephal Dinarid (my father). So, I'm a Dinarized Pontid.
Should I search for a similar mate? I think no. There are more important factors to determine the right partner for you.
Of course it's better to marry with someone from your ethnicity. As I said in other thread it would be better for a French Alpinid, for example, to marry French Atlantid, than Italian Alpinid.

[Anthropos]

I couldn't find a thread about this matter when I searched (and I searched quite long ;) ).

There is a thread about this subject on Skadi, so I thought the question could be brought up here too.

If you vote the third option, please elaborate. I would choose that option, and thus will do. :)

As the alternative says, only if the two types are somewhat close to each other and falls into the "indigenous" category of a country.

My family is quite "mixed" itself, with my father being very Nordid with some West Baltid influences (thus making him a "homemade Trønder" type). I would think that my paternal grandmother is a North-Atlantid (very Nordid with dark hair) and that my maternal grandfather is a textbook Dalo-Nordid, more or less. My Baltid phenotype comes from my maternal grandmother. I don't know my paternal grandfathers type since I've never met him and there are only bad pictures of him, but judging from those pictures, he seemed to have been at least mesocephalic. My younger brother reminds much of our father, though he has green eyes (father has blue). Other than that, I have uncles and aunts falling into the Borreby category. :)

This of course makes me "partial". My family falls within the Northern (both North-Western and North-Eastern) category, so I'd have to say that I wouldn't be against a marriage between a Faelid / Brünn and a Nordid for instance. Neither I wouldn't be against a Baltid / West Baltid marrying a Borreby or Nordid.

But when it would come to cases like Mediterranid + Borreby or Dinarid + Nordid... Well, at least I could say that I wouldn't recommend it.

Are you sure that this preoccupation with race is not parasiting on your intellect?

[SuuT]

But when it would come to cases like Mediterranid + Borreby or Dinarid + Nordid... Well, at least I could say that I wouldn't recommend it.

Why? :)

[Tabiti]

Why? :)
Because he's not sure about the result since the differences between that subracial types? However, Dinarid + Nordid doesn't looks so weird, since it can produce Noric :D

P.S. If inheritance of certain physical traits was so simple thing...

[Östsvensk]

Why? :)

Most people would probably call it Nordicism. However, I wouldn't, since I wrote "generally".

I am for preserving European peoples, and that means I want to preserve the Swedes (as well as I want to preserve the Serbs) and the phenotypes that can be found within the Swedish people. Since there basically are no Dinarid Swedes, and the fact that a marriage between a Dinarid and a Nordid most probably would mean that it was about a marriage between a different European and a Swede, it would go against my views a little. :)

However, I could understand why an American would have different views about the subject, since they probably have more diversity when it comes to phenotypes.

[Brännvin]

The important thing is to marry a woman of their own ethnicity and culture, to be possible. :D ;)

[la bombe]

Err... you do realize that typology is pseudo-science BS right?

[SuuT]

However, I could understand why an American would have different views about the subject, since they probably have more diversity when it comes to phenotypes.

Would you understand a European or even another Swede that finds that a bit whacky? :)

Also, are you anti-Dinarid, or something? :) I mean, if there was a mass influx of Dinarids to Sweden, would it all fall apart? :D

[Comte Arnau]

As the alternative says, only if the two types are somewhat close to each other and falls into the "indigenous" category of a country.


Closer? In what sense? Because a Nordid is closer metrically to a Mediterranid than to an Alpine.

And 'indigenous'? You can find any Europid subtype indigenously all over Europe.

Is there any population/country in Europe where there is one single discrete subtype?

[SuuT]

I'm not trying to be an asshole E.S.:), I'm just genuinely curious at these things:). People should be with whomever they wish; and the law of attraction usually places 'like' with 'like' so, ultimately, the question you pose seems moot (to me): It's just a very slippery slope.

[Östsvensk]

Err... you do realize that typology is pseudo-science BS right?

Phenotypes are not races, of course I know that, but they still show diversity and often symbolizes a persons ancestry (not always though).


Would you understand a European or even another Swede that finds that a bit whacky? :)

Also, are you anti-Dinarid, or something? :) I mean, if there was a mass influx of Dinarids to Sweden, would it all fall apart? :D

You mean if my friends would find it whacky that I was against a Swede marrying a Dinarid Albanian? I don't think so, since they often agrees on me with sticking to each etnicity.

About the last question, that has already happened. Why don't you ask Brännvin if the "Dinarids" in Landskrona have made the country flourish or not. ;) :p

More seriously, no I am not anti-Dinarid.


so, we're talking against marriages between people of different nationalities, not only subraces ;)

Thanks for the rep. Yes, at least I do. Though I decided to use other terms since some people are against different phenotypes intermarrying too (look at the voting on Skadi for instance).


Closer? In what sense? Because a Nordid is closer metrically to a Mediterranid than to an Alpine.

And 'indigenous'? You can find any Europid subtype indigenously all over Europe.

Is there any population/country in Europe where there is one single discrete subtype?

Read my posts again please. "Indigenous" types in each country, which means that I am talking about ethnicity.

[Stefan]

I think it depends on the country these Europeans(or descendants) are from, and how mixed their ancestry is. If they are descendants it shouldn't matter at all.In the U.S it is tough enough trying to stay pure Europid. If you are going to get picky with sub-race you aren't going to end up anywhere. Most Americans, like myself, are heavily mixed europeans anyway. Now if you are a full Nordid(phenotypically), and you want to retain your features, and you wouldn't want to mix with say an Alpinid, then it is fine. The same thing could be said in vice-versa. That is your choice.
It shouldn't be a problem that is pushed though.I think more people care about National Preservation when they don't have to worry about European preservation. They want their children to marry the same Nationality as them.

I for one will not stay exclusive to my sub-race though.That is because my children could already come out looking a totally different sub-race due to my varied ancestry. Actually, I could be considered a combination of sub-races that have the same phenotypical effect of a Dinarid opposed to having a long line of Dinarid ancestry. So it depends on the person, and it really isn't important from the start. I think people have the right to choose whether or not they want to stay pure to that level.

[Anthropos]

I am sure you can find Swedish 'dinarics' if you try harder. Lundman, old nutty professor, recorded occurences of hook-nosed individuals, in his opinion resembling Turks, in remote places in Dalarna where no foreign influx was known.

[SuuT]

You mean if my friends would find it whacky that I was against a Swede marrying a Dinarid Albanian? I don't think so, since they often agrees on me with sticking to each etnicity.

AHHT! You went and did it!:comp26: You started this whole question with whether or not Europid subraces should 'mingle' with one another; then you added a nationality; and then called the whole thing an ethnicity:sad_shakefist:.

*Europeans take note: You do this at least as much as Americans.


About the last question, that has already happened. Why don't you ask Brännvin if the "Dinarids" in Landskrona have made the country flourish or not. ;) :p

Because I already know what he'll say:D. Anyway, you did it again:rolleyes:: the problems of Landskrona have to do with Dinarids?. And besides, there are Dinariform individuals indigenous to Sweden and greater Scandinavia: Dinarisation is a process.

[Östsvensk]

I am sure you can find Swedish 'dinarics' if you try harder. Lundman, old nutty professor, recorded occurences of hook-nosed individuals, in his opinion resembling Turks, in remote places in Dalarna where no foreign influx was known.

They do exist, but I would say they are few. A larger amount can probably be dinaricized though, I guess.

Anyway, in that case I wouldn't be against. But that is my opinion and no ones else. Some people might have different views. :)

[Kadu]

I am sure you can find Swedish 'dinarics' if you try harder. Lundman, old nutty professor, recorded occurences of hook-nosed individuals, in his opinion resembling Turks, in remote places in Dalarna where no foreign influx was known.

I would have guessed the existence of such types in the regions bordering the sea, it would definitely be easier to explain such occurence due the Megalithic raiders during the Chalcolithic/Bronze age. But Dalarna is a inland region bordering Norway, it's definitely way more puzzling.

[Östsvensk]

AHHT! You went and did it!:comp26: You started this whole question with whether or not Europid subraces should 'mingle' with one another; then you added a nationality; and then called the whole thing an ethnicity:sad_shakefist:.

*Europeans take note: You do this at least as much as Americans.


Anyway, in that case I wouldn't be against. But that is my opinion and no ones else. Some people might have different views. :)


Because I already know what he'll say:D. Anyway, you did it again:rolleyes:: the problems of Landskrona have to do with Dinarids?. And besides, there are Dinariform individuals indigenous to Sweden and greater Scandinavia: Dinarisation is a process.

Considering that I put smileys and wrote "more seriously" afterwards, I thought my sarcasm was obvious. It seems that I was wrong though...

[SuuT]

I would have guessed the existence of such types in the regions bordering the sea, it would definitely be easier to explain such occurence due the Megalithic raiders during the Chalcolithic/Bronze age. But Dalarna is a inland region bordering Norway, it's definitely way more puzzling.

Actually insofar as Dinarisation is a process, it should be expected in mountainous and pre-mountainous regions which boded nicely for the animal stock of ancient populations, the decendants of these ancient herding populations surviving in Dalarna.

[Brännvin]

Because I already know what he'll say:D.

Ding dong, american :D, you've none idea of my opinions, so do not try anything there out of your ass, american ;) :D..

[Kadu]

Actually insofar as Dinarisation is a process, it should be expected in mountainous and pre-mountainous regions that bode nicely for the animal stock of the decendants of ancient herding populations like those of Dalarna.

I know it's a process but i thought it was implicit in Anthropos post that they are dark pigmented too.
But actually "Dinarics" are common in coastal zones here though.

[Grey]

If Dinaricisation is a process then can there be a Dinarid subrace, or only Dinaricised subraces?

[SuuT]

If Dinaricisation is a process then can there be a Dinarid subrace, or only Dinaricised subraces?

Kick ass question. Personally, I think it's all process; however, some processess have stabilised more than others. I'm sure others have other opinions.

[Crimson Guard]

Well, we are all products of such unions,lol. How the heck can one be mirco-racist enough to pretend phenotype mixing hasnt occurred or to somehow create a segregation of the phenotypes?! I would say they're clinically insane then if thats the case with some people. Europe is a quagmire of variation and has been since the dawn of time. Many types in Europe are actually a product of hybridization between two or more Phenotypes, plus we need to take into account the effects of environmental adaptation ect.

The "North-Atlantid" itself btw is a composite type in nature, a mingling of Mediterranean and Nordic:


So is the North-Atlantid subrace (the North-Occidental race of Deniker), which is like the primary type, but has much darker hair. Above all in the oceanic parts of Great Britain the North-Atlantid subrace is also very high in blood type gene r and low in blood type gene p.--(Bertil Lundman)


The Spanish Basques belong predominantly to a Mediterranean subrace, which is also rather closely related to the North-Atlantid subrace of the Nordid race.(Bertil Lundman)

http://carnby.altervista.org/lundraces/lundman-races2.htm


Races: A study of the problems of race formation in man (1950; with Garn and Birdsell):

http://i653.photobucket.com/albums/uu253/Tyranos/COonRaces.jpg



4.Northwest European--Most of Scandinavia, much of the British Isles, Northern France, the Benelux countries, and northwest Germany is inhabited by a population characterized by medium to tall stature, medium build, brown hair, mixed or blue eyes, light skin, straight to wavy hair of moderate abundance, and facial features intermediate between the fine chiselling of the Nordic or Mediterranean and the broader, fleshier Alpine (Plate 2). As types in this population one finds Nordics, Mediterraneans, and stocky, large-headed, broad-faced, often hairy individuals who may have such paleanthropic characters as large teeth and heavy brow ridges. This third type apparently recapitulates in some degree the pre-agricultural population of this region. Western Irish, Scots, Norwegians from the central coast, Swedes from new Goteberg, and certain other local groups deviate srongly in the direction of this type.


The northwest European race is also found as the characteristic form of the major breeding unit in the United States and Canada, New Zealand, Australia, and white South Africa. The white American mean falls so close to it that no further designation is needed. [p.120]


Although [the Nordic] is common as a type, few populations in Europe or elsewhere can be called Nordic in the strict sense. Most which other authors have called Nordic fall into our Northwest European category. [pp. 129-131]


___________

Coon did away with the Upper Paleolithic types of 1939 and adapted Deniker's scheme and also Hooton's.

From TROE Glossary:



NORTHWESTERN. A name given by Deniker to a blue-eyed dark-haired racial element in Ireland, which he considered to be a segment of the Atlanto-Mediterranean race. See p. 283.

http://s1.zetaboards.com/anthroscape/topic/1759941/1/#new



5.Dark, mesocephalic, tall race, Littoral or Atlanto-Mediterranean race, so styles because it is found in a pure or mixed state along the shores of the Mediterranean from Gibraltar to mouth of the Tibur, and on several points of the Atlantic coast, from the straits of Gibraltar to the mouth of the Guadalquivair, on the Bay of Biscay, in the lower valley of the Loire, ect. It is not met with anywhere at a greater distance that 120 or 150 miles from the sea. This Littoral race is still little studied; it is distinguished by its moderate dolichocephaly or mesocephaly (ceph. ind. on living subjects 79 to 80), by its stature above the average (im. 66), and very deep colouring of the hair and eyes. It corresponds pretty well with the "Mediterranean race" of Houze, and with the Cro-Magnon race of certain authors. It is probably with the Littoral race that we must connect a secondary so-called North-Western race, tall, sub-dolichocephalic, with chestnut hair, often almost brown. It found chiefly in a the north-west of Ireland(Fig. 93), in Wales(Fig. 19) and the east of Belgium.

http://s1.zetaboards.com/anthroscape/topic/945429/1/#new

[Angantyr]

Barring personality and love which we all agree are important....

I think it is more important for me to marry someone of a specific phenotype in order to preserve the phenotype, rather than a person of a specific linguistic or cultural background.

[Kadu]

If Dinaricisation is a process then can there be a Dinarid subrace, or only Dinaricised subraces?

As you may know "sub-races" failed to represent the actual phenotypical spectrum of countries because they described very specific types, normally extreme types, i.e. the Nordid type versus the Dalofaelid one when in reality most individuals are somewhere in the middle, phenotypical variation works as a clinal process with more variables than the ones i gave as example though.
So a dinaricised individual in an extreme manner maybe called Dinaric but in reality it doesn't happen as few individuals have such aberrant features.

[Lahtari]

Should blue eyed people marry brown eyed people? Should tall, medium and short people marry only other people of same height? Should public workers be allowed to procreate with workers from private sector?

For me this question sounds as silly as the above. If one marries a foreigner, the children will be half-foreign and that will have an effect on their identity. The more exotic the foreigner, the stronger the effect. Some arbitrary categories have nothing to do with it.

I wonder how those who intend basing their choice of a spouse on outdated science would act if they had a child that would look foreign due to a set of rare alleles combining just by chance? Would they disown the child right away or just when he/she marries an average looking compatriot? :D


Should I search for a similar mate? I think no. There are more important factors to determine the right partner for you.

And actually human are pre-programmed to prefer people who look relatively similar (preferring their own genetic stock), but not too similar to avoid incest.

[Crimson Guard]

If Dinaricisation is a process then can there be a Dinarid subrace, or only Dinaricised subraces?

Dinarics are hybridized composite type. Also the practice of cradling/head binding confused anthologists in the past.


The Dinaric-Mediterranean type F1 is the higher more Mediterranean version found in Lower Egypt or Anatolia; F2 is the broader bigger-faced more Dinaroid version, rarely with less curved occiput; and F3 is the low-headed East Balkan version with some Iranian face features. Type F4, with its more Iranian face and short vault and with little occipital bulge diverges toward the Armenoid of Bunak and others. Note that type F never has the "flat" occiput of Dinaric and Armenoid types; this occiput is probably artificial (head-bounding) in any case.(Lawrence Angel)

http://dienekes.110mb.com/texts/angeltypes/


Here is Coon's description of the Dinaric:


Dinaric: A tall, brachycephalic type of intermediate pigmentation, usually planoccipital, and showing the facial and nasal prominence of Near Eastern peoples. The basic population of the whole Dinaric-Alpine highlands from Switzerland to Epirus, also in the Carpathians and Caucasus, as well as Syria and Asia Minor. Apparently a brachycephalized blend in which Atlanto-Mediterranean and Cappadocian strains are important, with Alpine acting as the brachycephalizing agent in mixture. Borreby and Corded elements, also Nordic, appear to be involved in some regions.

and here is his Armenoid:


Armenoid: A similar brachycephalic composite type, with the same head form as the Dinaric, but a larger face and nose. The pigmentation is almost entirely brunet, the pilous development of beard and body abundant, the nose high rooted, convex, and the tip depressed, especially in advanced age. The difference between the Armenoid and the Dinaric is that here it is the Irano-Afghan race which furnishes the Mediterranean element, brachycephalized by Alpine mixture

[Matritensis]

To answer to the OP,there's nothing one can do about it.It has happened uncountable times in Europe before and it will continue to happen.We can only affect those things at an individual level.I'm sure that the pre-Indoeuropean Europe looked racially different than nowaday´s.Besides,one of the effects of different phenotypes meeting is very frequently a high degree of curiosity that leads easily to plain attraction.

[Östsvensk]

Should blue eyed people marry brown eyed people?

In my opinion it depends here. I would be critical to it if the brown-eyed partner wouldn't carry the blue-eyed gene. But of course, basically all Swedes with brown eyes do carry the gene, so when looking at these kinds of marriages within the own ethnic group, it wouldn't be much of a matter.


Should tall, medium and short people marry only other people of same height?

Short people should marry very tall people. :)

[Stefan]

@Crimson Guard, that makes absolute sense to me. My father could be classified as a Gentile Med with Cro-Magnid influence( I don't know if there is a name for that), which he gets from his mother being very Alpinid or Berid, his father from what I observed being Gentile or Small Med with some southern Atlantid influence, while my mother is an Alpinid with Nordid influence and to some she looks Bruenn. I am what some consider "textbook" Dinarid. So it is definitely what seems to be a group of mixtures, mainly Med and Alpinid.

[Crimson Guard]

@Crimson Guard, that makes absolute sense to me. My father could be classified as a Gentile Med with Cro-Magnid influence( I don't know if there is a name for that), which he gets from his mother being very Alpinid or Berid, his father from what I observed being Gentile or Small Med with some southern Atlantid influence, while my mother is an Alpinid with Nordid influence and to some she looks Bruenn. I am what some consider "textbook" Dinarid. So it is definitely what seems to be a group of mixtures, mainly Med and Alpinid.


Initially I thought you looked "Jewish" to be honest, but clearly you wouldn't be outve place in say, Liverpool. ;)

But more seriously, Yeah I would say your Dinarized-Mediterranean type, could be Italiano. Have you tried the Racial calculator?

http://s1.zetaboards.com/anthroscape/topic/920171/1/

*The 2nd one:Caucasoid Subrace Calculator

The sub-races in the database are:

Proto-Europoid
Mediterranoid
Alpinoid
Irano-Nordoid
Dinaroid

*Ladogans metrically fall under the proto-Europids in there. Real classifications are based on metric measurements.

[Stefan]

http://s1.zetaboards.com/anthroscape/topic/920171/1/

*The 2nd one:Caucasoid Subrace Calculator

.

edit: Right results now.
Head Length:175
Head Breadth:138
Head Height:110
Minimum Frontal:105
Bizygomatic:125
Bigonial:95
Total Facial Height:115
Upper Facial Height:80
Nasal Height:60
Nasal Breadth:30



Warning, entered minimum frontal appears to be too low

1 warning messages were generated. Warning messages may indicate that one or more of your dimensions are of unusual size. Alternatively they may point to a flaw in your measurement technique.

Results of Racial Analysis

Terminology is according to Vallois (1965).Endocranial volume is estimated according to the Lee-Pearson formula (Comas, 1960).Brain weight is estimated according to Welcker's capacity/cranial capacity tables (Baker, 1974)..

Your cephalic index is: 78.9 (mesocephalic)
Your height/length index is: 62.9 (hypsicephalic)
Your height/breadth index is: 79.7 (metriocephalic)
Your facial index is: 92 (leptoprosopic)
Your upper facial index is: 64 (leptene)
Your nasal index is: 50 (hyperleptorrhine)
Your estimated endocranial volume is: 1101 cc (oligocephalic)
Your estimated brain weight is: 978 gr

Euclidean Distance Mahalanobis Distance Cosine Similarity
Proto-Europoid: 65 190 -0.8
Mediterranoid: 19 33 0.62
Alpinoid: 39 96 -0.52
Irano-Nordoid: 22 49 0.56
Dinaroid: 31 88 0.04

Your classification is Mediterranoid (using Euclidean distance), Mediterranoid (using Mahalanobis distance), and Mediterranoid (using Cosine similarity).

According to Euclidean Distance:

You are metrically closest to Plate 21, Figure 5 (distance = 5)
You are metrically furthest from Plate 5, Figure 1 (distance = 120)

According to Mahalanobis Distance:

You are metrically closest to Plate 21, Figure 5 (distance = 4)
You are metrically furthest from Plate 5, Figure 1 (distance = 350)

According to Cosine Similarity:

You are metrically closest to Plate 21, Figure 5 (similarity = 0.92)
You are metrically furthest from Plate 6, Figure 5 (similarity = -0.877)

The five types listed in the results of your racial analysis represent five clusters discovered in a multivariate analysis of 152 individuals whose anthropometric measurements are given in the photographic supplement of Coon (1939). The names of the five clusters are arbitrary labels corresponding to traditional designations. They are based on metrical similarity based on nine variables of the head, and should not be interpreted as denoting "races".

Read more about Caucasoid Metric Types.

References

Baker, J. R. (1974) Race, Oxford University Press, New York and London.
Coon, C. S. (1939) The Races of Europe, MacMillan, New York.
Vallois, H. V. (1965) "Anthropometric Techniques", Current Anthropology 6(2): 127-143.
Comas, J. (1960) Manual of physical anthropology, Thomas, Springfield, Ill.

[Treffie]

Why? :)

Cos he's a nutjob? :)

[jerney]

I mated with a woggish med so what do you think?

[Brännvin]

Cos he's a nutjob? :)

Chill out man! :eek:

This is problem when are you still a teenager? :wink

[Crimson Guard]

[B][I][U]I think I did it wrong because it says everything appears to be too low.

[B][I][U]I was using a ruler(really a meter stick) and really just rounded by 5s because I couldn't be exact when measuring my face so I don't know how accurate it is. Here is my classification thread.

Yeah, your supposed you use calipers. A measuring tape really isnt the correct way of doing it. Although it may give you atleast a good idea of what you. A CI of 80 is truly more Brachycephalic, or at the very extreme border of Mesocephalic(normally indices of 78-79 is mesocephalic but I've seen some authors include indices of 80-81). A mesocephal would suggest an Alpine increment in most European instances. So if your CI is 80, then a Dinarid type you'll be.

[Östsvensk]

Cos he's a nutjob? :)

Thanks.

Why do some get all angry when someone says that he thinks that the European tribes should stick within their own?

[Kadu]

I think I did it wrong because it says everything appears to be too low.

What I entered
My head breadth - 60mm
Minimal Frontal- 55mm
Bizygomatic- 75mm
Nasal Breadth - around 12mm
Bigonial - 35mm
Head Length - 75mm
Head Height - 60mm
Nasal Height - 27mm
Total Facial Height - 73mm
Upper Facial Height- 43mm


Measure that again Stefan it's all wrong. Measure your head against a wall for profile measurements and with two cans or bottles for frontal measurements.

[Anthropos]

Racial preservation is really up to individual decisions, generally speaking. A discussion about it can only be this interesting.

[Absinthe]

I say it depends on the individual cases.

For me the most important thing is to be culturally and mentally compatible above all.

For example, there are blond/blue eyed southerners, that doesn't mean they can get along very easily with scandinavians.

Whereas a couple of two, let's say, Germans, can be subracially different but they have more in common than a blond German with a blond Russian. I hope you know what I mean.

In any case...it's always up to the couple to decide if they're compatible or not. :)

[Brännvin]

For me the most important thing is to be culturally and mentally compatible above all.


So would you say yes hypothetically for a Nigerian raised Greek? ;)

[Mesrine]

Fixed.


In any case...it's always up to time to decide if they're compatible or not. :)

[Absinthe]

So would you say yes hypothetically for a Nigerian raised Greek? ;)
I don't think a Nigerian raised Greek can be culturally Greek as a Greek, if you know what I mean...:)

[Stefan]

I rounded again. Yep, I did something wrong the first time, because that is a huge difference. I still get similar results though.

Head Length:175
Head Breadth:138
Head Height:110
Minimum Frontal:105
Bizygomatic:125
Bigonial:95
Total Facial Height:115
Upper Facial Height:80
Nasal Height:60
Nasal Breadth:30



Warning, entered minimum frontal appears to be too low

1 warning messages were generated. Warning messages may indicate that one or more of your dimensions are of unusual size. Alternatively they may point to a flaw in your measurement technique.

Results of Racial Analysis

Terminology is according to Vallois (1965).Endocranial volume is estimated according to the Lee-Pearson formula (Comas, 1960).Brain weight is estimated according to Welcker's capacity/cranial capacity tables (Baker, 1974)..

Your cephalic index is: 78.9 (mesocephalic)
Your height/length index is: 62.9 (hypsicephalic)
Your height/breadth index is: 79.7 (metriocephalic)
Your facial index is: 92 (leptoprosopic)
Your upper facial index is: 64 (leptene)
Your nasal index is: 50 (hyperleptorrhine)
Your estimated endocranial volume is: 1101 cc (oligocephalic)
Your estimated brain weight is: 978 gr

Euclidean Distance Mahalanobis Distance Cosine Similarity
Proto-Europoid: 65 190 -0.8
Mediterranoid: 19 33 0.62
Alpinoid: 39 96 -0.52
Irano-Nordoid: 22 49 0.56
Dinaroid: 31 88 0.04

Your classification is Mediterranoid (using Euclidean distance), Mediterranoid (using Mahalanobis distance), and Mediterranoid (using Cosine similarity).

According to Euclidean Distance:

You are metrically closest to Plate 21, Figure 5 (distance = 5)
You are metrically furthest from Plate 5, Figure 1 (distance = 120)

According to Mahalanobis Distance:

You are metrically closest to Plate 21, Figure 5 (distance = 4)
You are metrically furthest from Plate 5, Figure 1 (distance = 350)

According to Cosine Similarity:

You are metrically closest to Plate 21, Figure 5 (similarity = 0.92)
You are metrically furthest from Plate 6, Figure 5 (similarity = -0.877)

The five types listed in the results of your racial analysis represent five clusters discovered in a multivariate analysis of 152 individuals whose anthropometric measurements are given in the photographic supplement of Coon (1939). The names of the five clusters are arbitrary labels corresponding to traditional designations. They are based on metrical similarity based on nine variables of the head, and should not be interpreted as denoting "races".

Read more about Caucasoid Metric Types.

References

Baker, J. R. (1974) Race, Oxford University Press, New York and London.
Coon, C. S. (1939) The Races of Europe, MacMillan, New York.
Vallois, H. V. (1965) "Anthropometric Techniques", Current Anthropology 6(2): 127-143.
Comas, J. (1960) Manual of physical anthropology, Thomas, Springfield, Ill.

[Östsvensk]

I say it depends on the individual cases.

For me the most important thing is to be culturally and mentally compatible above all.

For example, there are blond/blue eyed southerners, that doesn't mean they can get along very easily with scandinavians.

Whereas a couple of two, let's say, Germans, can be subracially different but they have more in common than a blond German with a blond Russian. I hope you know what I mean.

In any case...it's always up to the couple to decide if they're compatible or not. :)

I guess you are right. It's quite easy for me to talk about this when Swedes are quite homogeneous, both looking at the "Nordish"-term and at genome studies. For example, in Finland the genetic gap between Western Finns and Eastern Finns is larger than the genetic gap between Western Finns and Eastern Swedes. So I guess you could argue it's better for a Western Finn to marry a Swede or a Northern German to marry a Scandinavian over a Southern German.

I wouldn't reason like that, but I'm sure it can make things complicated to some.

[Brännvin]

I don't think a Nigerian raised Greek can be culturally Greek as a Greek, if you know what I mean...:)



For me the most important thing is to be culturally and mentally compatible above all.


I know what it means, in fact, he would not to be a complete Greek, perhaps only close culturally for a Greek ;), but you still did put the racial preference above all, I do not condemn you for it, I probably would do it too :D.

[Östsvensk]

but you still did put the racial preference above all, I do not condemn you for it, I probably would do it too :D.

I'm sorry, but I could never be with a woman of another race. To me, it wouldn't matter if this person was assimilated/adopted or not. As well as I couldn't be with a woman with heavy diseases that could make an offsprings life difficult.

[Brännvin]

I'm sorry, but I could never be with a woman of another race.

You mean only race, not ethnicity and culture?

Okej, then who would you prefer a hot Dutch woman or an ugly Swedish farmer girl from Värmland? :D ;)

[Mesrine]

I'm sorry, but I could never be with a woman of another race. To me, it wouldn't matter if this person was assimilated/adopted or not. As well as I couldn't be with a woman with heavy diseases that could make an offsprings life difficult.

Are you comparing the two? Because a healthy woman of another race would make you viable children.

[Östsvensk]

You mean only race, not ethnicity and culture?

Okej, then who would you prefer a hot Dutch woman or an ugly Swedish farmer girl from Värmland? :D

I meant Northern stock, of course. Wrote a little too fast there. As well as I couldn't be with an Aboriginal woman, neither I couldn't be with a "Caucasoid" Iranian woman. :)

Hey, Värmland girls can usually be quite good-looking and they most often have quite a nice mentality (not the ones into motors etc of course, they are too extreme to me).

Rather this...

(These are all Värmland pictures.)

http://i36.tinypic.com/1y1lcy.jpg
http://i33.tinypic.com/2872jxc.jpg
http://i33.tinypic.com/2utjlo0.jpg

...than a cocaine snorting model from Stockholm. :thumbs up

Of course, a Dutch girl with a good menality would work too. :)


Are you comparing the two? Because a healthy woman of another race would make you viable children.

I don't compare them, but what I meant was that I would rather not have children then.

[Mesrine]

I don't compare them, but what I meant was that I would rather not have children then.

Rather no children at all than mixed ones? OK, that's a choice. :shrug:

[Loki]

Should different Europids marry and have children?


Fact is, it happens every day and there is nothing anyone can do about it. Whether they should or should not is merely fictional speculation on internet forums.

[Brännvin]

Hey, Värmland girls can usually be quite good-looking and they most often have quite a nice mentality (not the ones into motors etc of course, they are too extreme to me).
...than a cocaine snorting model from Stockholm. :thumbs up

That's why I meant; Värmland girls :D So you can have them (are nice) while I want the model girls from Stockholm, a matter of taste ;)



Of course, a Dutch girl with a good mentality would work too. :)

:nono:

As a nationalist boy, you must to be faithfully to the Swedish women. :P

[Poltergeist]

Rather no children at all than mixed ones? OK, that's a choice. :shrug:

Fuxism seems to be spreading.

[Loxias]

I think a population of a defined place has a certain spectrum of types that it can produce. It can even be said of a family. Two alpinid parents could very well have a dinaric and a nordic child in communities where the spectrum of potential types is wide (like France).
If some peole want to marry the same type, why not, but it doesn't mean their children will not present a different type.

[Humanophage]

I have trouble naming a European ethnicity which would be utterly devoid of noticeable influences of all European sub-races, or at the very least metrically or pigmentation-wise similar ones (e.g., Alpinids instead of Baltids, Pontids instead of Meds per se, Keltic Nordids instead of Dinarids, etc.) I don't think any mix would be really all that exotic, so I don't see the dilemma.

Naturally, I am referring to Europids proper rather than those obviously influenced by non-Europeans, such as Baltids with Mongoloid features or extremely dark Dinarids bordering Armenoid. It is only then that the problem of personal relations arises. And I'm not certain if anyone would consider such matters when one is already contemplating a marriage, which implies being attracted to the racially dubious person in question - an act of 'betrayal' in itself.

[Grey]

Fact is, it happens every day and there is nothing anyone can do about it. Whether they should or should not is merely fictional speculation on internet forums.

That's a pretty defeatist attitude, isn't it? Just because it is happening doesn't mean it should. There are many events that happen every day that leave things worse off than before.

I'm not saying that I'm against subracial mixing (I'd be a hypocrite if I were) but I can agree that I'd rather, for example, non-Swedes stay out of Sweden & non-English stay out of England, for the most part, especially if they're of a completely alien subrace.

[Loxias]

I think the question is more about, for instance : should a Borreby Englishman marry a dark Atlantid Englishwoman. Both exist in the country, are of similar culture, ethnicity and history. Yet they represent very different ends of the Europid spectrum.

[chap]

This question is more applicable perhaps to the Scandinavian countries which can contain two different yet indigenous population groups (for example, Swedes & Saami).

[Grey]

This question is more applicable perhaps to the Scandinavian countries which can contain two different yet indigenous population groups (for example, Swedes & Saami).

I think it's acceptable for a Swede to have Saami blood and vice versa, though it's not something that should be encouraged in modern times so that the two groups may remain distinct instead of merging and losing those characteristics which distinguish them.

I guess that's why I'm more comfortable with Old Stock Americans having a certain amount of Injun blood than I am with them having Italian blood.

[Kadu]

I guess that's why I'm more comfortable with Old Stock Americans having a certain amount of Injun blood than I am with them having Italian blood.

At least that way it makes some sense to consider yourself a "nativist".

[Östsvensk]

That's why I meant; Värmland girls :D So you can have them (are nice) while I want the model girls from Stockholm, a matter of taste ;)

Since most seem to be pro of this, I will go to Värmland and look for a very Nordid woman which I will have many beautiful children with. The children will all be ideals in the Fourth Reich (that will come when people had enough of multicultirality). My aim should be that my oldest boy will be on propaganda posters. :D


:nono:

As a nationalist boy, you must to be faithfully to the Swedish women. :P

Dutch people are assimilable. ;)

[chap]

I think it's acceptable for a Swede to have Saami blood and vice versa, though it's not something that should be encouraged in modern times so that the two groups may remain distinct instead of merging and losing those characteristics which distinguish them.

Amorsite (http://www.amorsite.shorturl.com/) is studying in Sweden, he suggests Saami ancestry is diffused throughout the entire country, albeit to a much greater extent in the north.

[Ankoù]

Atlantids who have children with Cromagnids or Nordids with Alpinids... it always has been like that. But an important mixing between local phenotype with Dinarid (for exemple, I have nothing special against them) would be wrong, that could changed the face of my country. But afterall, it's not a big deal, today the first problem is racial and cultural, not sub-racial.

[Loxias]

Dinaricisation is not that rare in French individuals.

[Ankoù]

I only care about Brittany. :wink
BTW Dinarids are mostly present in SE France (Provence) and I was talking about Dinarid like you find in South-eastern Europe.

[Loxias]

I worked in Burgundy for a while and I was surprised at the large amounts of dinarics there, I was in a very rural area, and everyone was local, and nearly everyone was heavily dinaricised.
Also, it's a present component in Southwest, and I have some purely Normand friends who are very dinaricised (although very blond at the same time).

[Troll's Puzzle]

Amorsite (http://www.amorsite.shorturl.com/) is studying in Sweden, he suggests Saami ancestry is diffused throughout the entire country, albeit to a much greater extent in the north.

If the anthropological genius known as 'Amorsite' says so, then it must be true.

Why did Amorsite choose to study in Sweden? did the hopes of finding a pure Halstatt like himself for a bride make his decision?

[Östsvensk]

Why did Amorsite choose to study in Sweden? did the hopes of finding a pure Halstatt like himself for a bride make his decision?

There there now. According to AMORSITE, such types do not exist. The only type that exists is the Nordic race. :D :lol00002:

[Anthropos]

Is marriage between different racialists possible?

[Östsvensk]

Is marriage between different racialists possible?

How do you mean now? You mean if it's possible for a Nordic Nordicist and a Nordic pan-Europeanist to marry? :D

[chap]

Well, it's simply his observation; he runs a website on typology and he lives in Sweden, so I wouldn't dismiss him completely if he has noticed features characteristic of Lapps in Swedes.

[Anthropos]

How do you mean now? You mean if it's possible for a Nordic Nordicist and a Nordic pan-Europeanist to marry? :D

Yes, sort of. Do their particularistic worldviews stand in the way? Are people, who could otherwise belong together rather easily, split by racialist convictions?

[Eldritch]

Err... you do realize that typology is pseudo-science BS right?

I must be missing something here. Why hasn't anyone taken you to task for this one yet?

[Brännvin]

Dutch people are assimilable. ;)

Not just beautiful girls, they also know how make a good beer ;)!

And Cornelis Vreeswijk too :D :thumb001:

----------



Err... you do realize that typology is pseudo-science BS right?

Hehe.. everyone knows how typology is an outdated science;), in fact a pseudoscience, replaced by population genetics, and genome analysis, but it's still fun for some to discuss it in forums, personal sites and blogs :D. Actually it don't hurt...

[Hussar]

I worked in Burgundy for a while and I was surprised at the large amounts of dinarics there, I was in a very rural area, and everyone was local, and nearly everyone was heavily dinaricised.
Also, it's a present component in Southwest, and I have some purely Normand friends who are very dinaricised (although very blond at the same time).


Still with this thing about Dinarid race. It doesn't exist.

[Troll's Puzzle]

Well, it's simply his observation; he runs a website on typology and he lives in Sweden, so I wouldn't dismiss him completely if he has noticed features characteristic of Lapps in Swedes.

there's this afrocentrics guy, who has a website on black egypt, and a published book on ancient black egypt, and has visited africa, and is lecturer in black studies in an american university, so I wouldn't dismiss him completely when he said ancient egyptians were black, and 'fallen' satanic white devils stole culture and science from them, then covered it up and held the black man down ever since.

Did Amorsite tell you how his quest for a subracially compatible Halstatt for himself goes? obviously all such women would throw themselves at his feet in recognition of his pure and compatable genes. Or has he been frustrated in finding someone as genetically superior as himself by the unexpectedly high level of lapp admixture in sweden?

[nohypocrisy]

After watching all those hordes of rednecks in the US, I wouldn't recommend it :D

[Östsvensk]

Did Amorsite tell you how his quest for a subracially compatible Halstatt for himself goes? obviously all such women would throw themselves at his feet in recognition of his pure and compatable genes. Or has he been frustrated in finding someone as genetically superior as himself by the unexpectedly high level of lapp admixture in sweden?

I think there is a picture of AMORSITE somewhere. Some claims he is fat and/or has a pig nose. Can anyone confirm any of those claims? :p

By the way, if AMORSITE came here, he would most probably vote "no" (since he was among one of the inspirations of me starting this thread). :D

[Atlas]

I was too lazy to read the eight first pages.

That's a good topic of discussion but it certainly isn't a priority, at least for most Europeans.

Beauty.
Intelligence.
Sense of humor.
Geographic proximity.
Interesting...

...And why not good in bed are the main things... except for radical nordicist like Inese (no offence girl) who wouldn't date a guy below Berlin on the Europe map.

Other than that, Tabiti is on the money... most of us, even in Europe have been mixed over the last decades, that's true for most Europe - immigration between europeans, eh, it's easier to date an italian catholic for a german girl than a muslim turk, no ?

I don't understand why this thread is in the racial tragedy subforum.

[Ariets]

I find that thread to be hilariously stupid

[Bard]

I voted yes because I love northern countries and people, I hope to marry someone in the north but anywhere in europe is ok.

[lei.talk]

Should blue eyed people marry brown eyed people? Should tall, medium and short people marry only other people of same height? Should public workers be allowed to procreate with workers from private sector?

And actually human are pre-programmed to prefer people who look relatively similar (preferring their own genetic stock), but not too similar to avoid incest.



http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/87/Borzoi_female.jpg/250px-Borzoi_female.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borzoi)

perhaps the question is
should the environment be encouraged
in which one sub-species develops a neurotic or hormonally driven attachment
to a different and distinct one?


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/27/Short-haired-Dachshund.jpg/250px-Short- (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dachshund)


does it really matter how mongrels breed?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cb/Collie-Whippet-Mischling.JPG/200px-Collie- (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mixed-breed_dog)

[SwordoftheVistula]

Should public workers be allowed to procreate

No

[Brynhild]

I voted yes because of my mixed ethnicity. Contrary to popular belief, Northern and Southern Europeans have interacted (fuck the word mate, that's either your friend or what the four-legged variety do to procreate) for at least the last millennia - this might suggest compatibility on some other level.

Australia was founded as a multicultural nation to begin with, in a matter of speaking - English, Irish, Scots and Germans. It would explain why we don't have this nitpicky attitude in regards to specific types of race. When I started going out with the father of my children, I didn't look at the shape of his head, nor classify him in any anthropological way at all. We both seemed to understand on some deeper level that we were compatible.

Frankly, I can't understand the nonsense of it all. I have to wonder, how far will this attitude go before the more racial purists realise that, at some point, they would need to drop their standards to ensure the survival of their race? It certainly limits your chances of finding somebody who could be more compatible to you than you would realise.

[NordicPower]

I don't see any problem with mixing certain European ethnicities, as long as the types are matching and correspondingly harmonious together. I generally like males who look a bit exotic (to me) in the European sense, I don't want someone who looks exactly the same as myself. It would be like dating my brother or so. This should be of northern or central Europe. I am not compatible with other cultures (like southern and eastern Europe, Irish or French) and I have little understanding of those kinds of people and how their minds work, and that is a crucial element in having a successful long term relationship.

If there are going to be children involved, care must be taken that they maintain a sense of cultural identity, so that it is not replaced with McCulture.

[Fortis in Arduis]

This thread is ridiculous.

Who but the most stupid could consider themselves wise enough to arbitrate such matters?

I am going to sit and say, I approve of this union, but not that one, because I am an 'informed' racist?

What a pile of horse shit! lol :p

[Falkata]

I approve, there are many hot girls around there in the rest of Europe, i dont wanna close any door :D

[Majar]

All these subdivisions, etc are totally arbitrary and vary heavily according to individual perceptions and understanding. I think we can agree there are Caucasoid subraces like Nordid, Alpinid, Dinarid, Baltid, Uralid, Mediterranid, etc. But all these other sub-sub-sub groups are just Dungeons and Dragons Nerdish nitpickery.

The idea that siblings born of the same parents (with the exception of 1-in-a-billion cases of one white twin, one black twin) belong to different "races" is ludicrous nonsense. You inherit different features from grandparents, great grandparents, or even throwbacks to long ago ancestors, and these can combine with parent's features to create a look which approximate some population you have no connection with. Being "Pontid" doesn't mean anything, it surely does not mean your origins lay in the Pontic-Caspian steppe (unless you have genealogical evidence which shows that in fact it does).

[Jarl]

I couldn't find a thread about this matter when I searched (and I searched quite long ;) ). There is a thread about this subject on Skadi, so I thought the question could be brought up here too. If you vote the third option, please elaborate. I would choose that option, and thus will do. :)

As the alternative says, only if the two types are somewhat close to each other and falls into the "indigenous" category of a country.

My family is quite "mixed" itself, with my father being very Nordid with some West Baltid influences (thus making him a "homemade Trønder" type). I would think that my paternal grandmother is a North-Atlantid (very Nordid with dark hair) and that my maternal grandfather is a textbook Dalo-Nordid, more or less. My Baltid phenotype comes from my maternal grandmother. I don't know my paternal grandfathers type since I've never met him and there are only bad pictures of him, but judging from those pictures, he seemed to have been at least mesocephalic. My younger brother reminds much of our father, though he has green eyes (father has blue). Other than that, I have uncles and aunts falling into the Borreby category. :)

This of course makes me "partial". My family falls within the Northern (both North-Western and North-Eastern) category, so I'd have to say that I wouldn't be against a marriage between a Faelid / Brünn and a Nordid for instance. Neither I wouldn't be against a Baltid / West Baltid marrying a Borreby or Nordid.

But when it would come to cases like Mediterranid + Borreby or Dinarid + Nordid... Well, at least I could say that I wouldn't recommend it.


You are using here typological terms, and then you relate them to some concept of "combaitbility" and "affinity"...


I think there is a gross, major misconception here that needs to be explained. It is about typology versus genetics. What is compatible? What do you mean by types closer to each other? Is a Spanish Nordid closer to a Swedish Nordid than a Swedish Tydal? I think me and Gooding have already stumbled across this question here:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11720&page=6

What is a type? It is literally a set of few basic biometric measurements. Nothing more. These are complex, continuous traits which are affected by dozens of genes with large effects and probably thousands others with smaller effect. Similarities among individuals can be due to chance, and caused genes common in most human populations - a mark of their common root. Individual Somalis and Japanese can have Head and Facial Indices just like certain individuals from Sweden or Ireland - however it has nothing to do with close genetic affinity. As a matter of fact, these similarities might be even caused by very different sets of alleles that, put together, have a similar effect on phenotype via two different mechanisms.


So I will quote myself again:


Originally Posted by Gooding:
What a fascinating discussion! My question at this point is simply this: Is there a truly Nordid phenotype without minor influences from other groups that might reside in the same country?


No. There is no and there has never been any "true Nordid" exemplar. It is a myth. A "Nordid type" is a function of the population we select it from at any given time.


A Nordid phenotype is a natural product of Nordic genepool. Some indiviuals might be more typical and cluster near to the mean, thus recapitulating the avarage phenotype of Nordic nations. Some may be more extreme, like platinum blondes, and they recapitulate not the avergae character, but the specificity - the traits which are most specific and exclusive/most common in Nordic nations.



Gooding:

It seems that the majority of any population in the world today will be of an "intermediate" physical type. This question is more concerned about what outward physique rather than any deep DNA or 23andme $400.00 questions.Thoughts?


There has never been any other type than "intermediate" coz there has never been any homogenous races of human clones - all alike - which subsequently blended together.


Every human population has a great internal variability. It has always been like that. That is the way of evolution. Greater variability = greater genetic resources and potential to adapt when environment is changing.


Even any two parents can produce a considerable variation in their offspring by recombining different parts of their genomes. No two sets of genes are the same. No two phenotypes are the same. Genomes work together. As a unity.

No genes are irrelevant. A gene encoding some enzyme or a CNV like a microsatelltie might still influence expression of other genes and contribute towards the phenotype. All genes contribute to the phenotype.


That is why a Nordic Swede will be genetically more related to Swedes, not Somalis, or Nordic Poles or Finns. Some gene frequencies vary a lot, and products of a Nordic genepools are exclusive to that genepool. It is virtually not possible for, say a Baltic or Slavic genepool to produce exactly the same genotype as the Nordic genepool would produce... And some superficial, crude similarities in cranial index will not change the image.


So all you Baltic, Slavic or Iberian, or whatever wannabe-Nordics, can now quit with thinking that a longer face will make you more "assimilable" or "Scandinavian-like"... No. It will not. The ugliest, most neanderthal-like Swedish Cro-Magnid is still a genuine manifestation of the Nordic genepool, much more than some continental, riffian, Baltic, Slavic or Somali "Nordics".

[Lahtari]

All these subdivisions, etc are totally arbitrary and vary heavily according to individual perceptions and understanding. I think we can agree there are Caucasoid subraces like Nordid, Alpinid, Dinarid, Baltid, Uralid, Mediterranid, etc. But all these other sub-sub-sub groups are just Dungeons and Dragons Nerdish nitpickery.

The idea that siblings born of the same parents ... belong to different "races" is ludicrous nonsense. You inherit different features from grandparents, great grandparents, or even throwbacks to long ago ancestors

True. And since siblings can also "belong" to a different typological Caucasoid subrace, as well as children and their parents and grandparents, it makes those so-called Caucasoid subraces D&D nitpickery as well. There's only subpopulations that have a range of typical phenotypes their members are likely to express.

[Brännvin]

The idea that siblings born of the same parents (with the exception of 1-in-a-billion cases of one white twin, one black twin) belong to different "races" is ludicrous nonsense.

True, modern genetic evidence that, but what does this have to do if I want to get married and to have sex with a woman phenotypically similar to me? :coffee: :wink :D

[Jarl]

True, modern genetic evidence that, but what does this have to do if I want to get married and to have sex with a woman phenotypically similar to me? :coffee: :wink :D

What is "similar"? Facial index and hair colour? But then we are talking about some artifical "compatibility" which is entirely based on biometric similarity, and has very little to do with genetic affinity.

[Amarantine]

just if they are tall, strong and blond:p:p

[Ariets]

i think that marriage between europids its sick, yuck! :D

[Lahtari]

i think that marriage between europids its sick, yuck! :D

True. One night stand gangbangs with black homosexual dwarves is how God meant it to be. :D

[Rachel]

Should blue eyed people marry brown eyed people? Should tall, medium and short people marry only other people of same height? Should public workers be allowed to procreate with workers from private sector?

For me this question sounds as silly as the above. If one marries a foreigner, the children will be half-foreign and that will have an effect on their identity. The more exotic the foreigner, the stronger the effect. Some arbitrary categories have nothing to do with it.

I wonder how those who intend basing their choice of a spouse on outdated science would act if they had a child that would look foreign due to a set of rare alleles combining just by chance? Would they disown the child right away or just when he/she marries an average looking compatriot? :D



And actually human are pre-programmed to prefer people who look relatively similar (preferring their own genetic stock), but not too similar to avoid incest.


I agree with all of this and wish to bring up another question that may be more relevent. If not ill delete the comment. If so much inbreeding and mixing of cultures have happened over a large period of time is the question really whether europeans should marry europeans but rather : Why did our ancestors not place enough importance on marrying someone from the same cultral background? It seems that it is too late to marry some one of pure european stock.

Or maybe it should be reversed to play the race card. should whites marry whites? or is racial breeding okay?

I don't mean to throw this topic off course, these are just the questions that came to mind when i read the topic and some of the replies.

[Ibericus]

well, If it is something minoritary I don't really care, but obviously I want to preserve our Iberian blood, the same way a german wants to preserve Germanic blood,etc It's Natural

[Majar]

I definitely recommend bringing a set of calipers, a tape measure, an eye color chart, a hair color chart, a skin color chart, a 100-question racial purity survey, a high definition digital camera, a 23andme DNA collection kit, and the complete works of Carleton S. Coon with you on every date. It would also be helpful to ask your date to bring frontal and profile photos of their parents, grandparents and other close kin so you can spend some time racially classifying them with the aid of a magnifying glass between the main course and dessert.

[Sigrid]

I agree with all of this and wish to bring up another question that may be more relevent. If not ill delete the comment. If so much inbreeding and mixing of cultures have happened over a large period of time is the question really whether europeans should marry europeans but rather : Why did our ancestors not place enough importance on marrying someone from the same cultral background? It seems that it is too late to marry some one of pure european stock.

Or maybe it should be reversed to play the race card. should whites marry whites? or is racial breeding okay?

I don't mean to throw this topic off course, these are just the questions that came to mind when i read the topic and some of the replies.

Whites should only marry other Whites, in my opinion. The whole idea here is ethnic European preservation. To date and mate outside of your race is like racial genocide. It's sick and disgusting. A mixed race child is not beautiful; it's an abomination.

OK, I'm starting to go off topic here ...

[Jarl]

Marry me! :P

[Sigrid]

Marry me! :P

Silly boy ... tsk tsk tsk.

[Óttar]

One sec, let me ask my wiener's opinion.

[Nationalitist]

To date and mate outside of your race is like racial genocide.

No it's not.

[Sigrid]

No it's not.

You may not want to preserve your genes, but most of us do.

[Óttar]

You may not want to preserve your genes, but most of us do.
How would he not be preserving his genes? :cool:

[Sigrid]

How would he not be preserving his genes? :cool:

If you pro-create with someone of a different race, your genes will very rarely, if at all, present themselves in your children. Is that not important in the preservation of one's ethnic European traits? Are we not on this forum because we believe in the preservation of our ethnic Europeanness?

[nisse]

If you pro-create with someone of a different race, your genes will very rarely, if at all, present themselves in your children. Is that not important in the preservation of one's ethnic European traits? Are we not on this forum because we believe in the preservation of our ethnic Europeanness?

Your genes will *definitely* present themselves in your children, lol. That's how fertilization works, we're all haploid ;)

"Ethnic" refers to culture, not biology and genetics :wink

[Stefan]

"Ethnic" refers to culture, not biology and genetics :wink

I would say it refers to both. You need both a common or similar ancestral origin and a cultural foundation.

[Sigrid]

Your genes will *definitely* present themselves in your children, lol. That's how fertilization works, we're all haploid ;)

OK, I'm not a retard. But my genes would not present themselves in an outward representation (the traits) if I pro-created with a black person. Let's be honest. And you know what I mean - the child would not be blonde, etc.


"Ethnic" refers to culture, not biology and genetics :wink

I'm not stupid. ;)

[nisse]

I would say it refers to both. You need both a common or similar ancestral origin and a cultural foundation.
If a Saami/Finnish/Russian/English orphan is adopted by a Norwegian family and knows nothing of his birth parents/culture, grows up as a Norwegian, speaking Norwegian, celecrating all Norwegian holidays, etc, etc - are you really telling me that that kid will not be 100% ethnic Norwegian?

If you are, I'm just going to say I disgaree with your usage, btw ;)


OK, I'm not a retard. But my genes would not present themselves in an outward representation (the traits) if I pro-created with a black person. Let's be honest. And you know what I mean - the child would not be blonde, etc.
I know quite a few quadroons with blonde hair/light eyes...would a half black or quarter black partner be acceptable? Since the children are plonde and all...

My reason for not supporting interethnic (and even more so) interracial mixing (in most cases) is that I'm concerned that the child would find it hard to integrate into European society (assuming it's fairly monoethnic), because of the xenophobia they will inevitably face, and because the foreign parent will (obviously) not be a carrier of that culture. Especially if their mixed parentage is obvious, the child may grow up culturally confused and may be pretty miserable, which I would not wish upon any child.

[Sigrid]

If a Saami/Finnish/Russian/English orphan is adopted by a Norwegian family and knows nothing of his birth parents/culture, grows up as a Norwegian, speaking Norwegian, celecrating all Norwegian holidays, etc, etc - are you really telling me that that kid will not be 100% ethnic Norwegian?

If you are, I'm just going to say I disgaree with your usage, btw ;)

I know quite a few quadroons with blonde hair/light eyes...would a half black or quarter black partner be acceptable? Since the children are plonde and all...

My reason for not supporting interethnic (and even more so) interracial mixing (in most cases) is that I'm concerned that the child would find it hard to integrate into European society (assuming it's fairly monoethnic), because of the xenophobia they will inevitably face, and because the foreign parent will (obviously) not be a carrier of that culture. Especially if their mixed parentage is obvious, the child may grow up culturally confused and may be pretty miserable, which I would not wish upon any child.

I believe that you and I are just going to have to go the easy route and "agree to disagree," for we can discuss this day and night, and I doubt either one of us is going to budge.

I think that much of this discussion has to do with subjective beliefs on what one's ethnicity is, as I believe someone has to be all of that definition, not just some of it.

No, I would never advocate having a child with someone not of my race. It's just my belief system. I won't force it on anyone, but I won't apologize for my belief system, either.

I absolutely do not support interethnic mixing (as in, a White mixing with a Black) for that reason, as well as other reasons. I wish no misery on any child.

[Stefan]

If a Saami/Finnish/Russian/English orphan is adopted by a Norwegian family and knows nothing of his birth parents/culture, grows up as a Norwegian, speaking Norwegian, celecrating all Norwegian holidays, etc, etc - are you really telling me that that kid will not be 100% ethnic Norwegian?

If you are, I'm just going to say I disgaree with your usage, btw ;)


I would think the child would be "100%" culturally and "100%" nationally Norwegian, but their ethnic origins are from somewhere else. It is the same way I'm American, but my ethnic origins are from Europe, opposed to say, an Asian-American whose Ethnic origins are from another place, but they are also culturally American. In the same way none of us would fit in "Ethnically" in those origin places as we don't have the cultural connection. So basically what I'm saying is Ancestral connection + Cultural Connection = Ethnicity. The importance of each of these and what qualifies the ethnic group is subjective, but both of these are important aspects in my opinion.

[nisse]

I would think the child would be "100%" culturally and "100%" nationally Norwegian, but their ethnic origins are from somewhere else. It is the same way I'm American, but my ethnic origins are from Europe, opposed to say, an Asian-American whose Ethnic origins are from another place, but they are also culturally American. In the same way none of us would fit in "Ethnically" in those origin places as we don't have the cultural connection. So basically what I'm saying is Ancestral connection + Cultural Connection = Ethnicity. The importance of each of these and what qualifies the ethnic group is subjective, but both of these are important aspects in my opinion.


I'm just going to say I disgaree with your usage.

Just out of curiocity: what would be that child's ethnicity, by your definition?

:D

[Stefan]

Just out of curiocity: what would be that child's ethnicity, by your definition?

:D

Nationally Norwegian of foreign(Saami/Finnish/Russian/English) ancestry, is sufficient. Or if the group was common enough in Norway, then they would just be Norwegian, as that is a group that has been there for a while and has assimilated and is part of the standard population. I'm sure if you chose a more divided nation, based around forced unions, and strong nationalism it would be somewhat more apparent. The reason why there has to be ancestral similarity is because of acceptance. That is all an Ethnic Group really is, acceptance based on similarity. Chances are somebody who is drastically different in appearance will be treated as different, even if there is a forced facade formed to make it look otherwise. This happens until the other group becomes common enough for it not to matter.

[nisse]

Nationally Norwegian of foreign(Saami/Finnish/Russian/English) ancestry, is sufficient.
That doesn't answer the question....so I take it you'd say the poor chap has no ethnicity :(


The reason why there has to be ancestral similarity is because of acceptance. That is all an Ethnic Group really is, acceptance based on similarity. Chances are somebody who is drastically different in appearance will be treated as different, even if there is a forced facade formed to make it look otherwise.
Most people belonging to the ethnicities I proposed would not look so drastically different as to suggest foreign ancentry, provided the person walks and talks like a Norwegian. They probably wouldn't look "typical" but they would be within the spectrum...

Consider Bjork - pure Icelandic, no foreign element...would you say that she's not ethnically Icelandic because she looks somewhat different?

[Stefan]

That doesn't answer the question....so I take it you'd say the poor chap has no ethnicity :(
Even though it isn't described with a single word, it is still an ethnicity. Ethnicities actually can be found within each other, so it is that person's choice in what they want to recognize as, but they sure need to be accepted as that would defeat the purpose of an ethnicity if somebody was forced into it.


Most people belonging to the ethnicities I proposed would not look so drastically different as to suggest foreign ancentry, provided the person walks and talks like a Norwegian. They probably wouldn't look "typical" but they would be within the spectrum...

Consider Bjork - pure Icelandic, no foreign element...would you say that she's not ethnically Icelandic because she looks somewhat different?

I was thinking more of outside Europe with that. Phenotype inside of a race should never be used to associate people in groups in my opinion as they overlap so much.

[Loki]

"Marriage between different Europids?"

Simply unacceptable :no:

[Pallantides]

Many Norwegians have some Scottish, Finnish, German, Saami, Swedish or Danish ancestry, both distant and more recent. I don't see any problem with that. It would be stupid going around worrying that your spouse might have had a Finnish or Saami great great grandfather.
Also I have dated outside my own ethnic group and I'll most likely continue to do so in the future.




Consider Bjork - pure Icelandic, no foreign element...would you say that she's not ethnically Icelandic because she looks somewhat different?

Björk is a godess, that explain her etheral and outworldly appearance, wich is difficult for mere mortals to comprehend.

[Johnston]

"Marriage between different Europids?"

Simply unacceptable :no:How about rape, as in rape and pillage? Carrying off the women? No marriage with them, just take the mistresses, and make bastard offspring? Do they have to lead viking raids for their own booty?:D


Many Norwegians have some Scottish, Finnish, German, Saami, Swedish or Danish ancestry, both distant and more recent. I don't see any problem with that. It would be stupid going around worrying that your spouse might have had a Finnish or Saami great great grandfather.
Also I have dated outside my own ethnic group and I'll most likely continue to do so in the future.




Björk is a godess, that explain her etheral and outworldly appearance, wich is difficult for mere mortals to comprehend.As Frederick is laying out in Define Germanic, genetic clusters exist for a reason.

[Loki]

How about rape, as in rape and pillage? Carrying off the women? No marriage with them, just take the mistresses, and make bastard offspring? Do they have to lead viking raids for their own booty?:D


Well if you put it that way ... why the hell not. :)

[Pallantides]

As Frederick is laying out in Define Germanic, genetic clusters exist for a reason.

I have spoken with many of the Norwegians who participate in both Dodecad and the Eurogenes project and many of them have some documented foregin ancestry, but we still form or own little seperate Scandinavian cluster club, with some variation in affinity with other populations.;)

[Johnston]

I have spoken with many of the Norwegians who participate in both Dodecad and the Eurogenes project and many of them have some documented foregin ancestry, but we still form or own little seperate Scandinavian cluster club, with some variation in affinity with other populations.;)I was merely agreeing with you.:tongue

[Agrippa]

I think the question is phrased in a problematic way, because I wouldn't say "should", which sounds to me almost like an order, but "could" or "allowed to".

As for the latter, I think it is idiotic to forbid marriages between different subraces of the Europid race, as long as talking about the indigenous types of a region AT LEAST.

In Europe you can find practically every European Europid racial type everywhere.

Talking about more or less valuable traits, that's an Eugenic issue and should be achieved with Eugenic measures, rather than limiting personal choices with little to no biological results and bad societal and personal consequences in too many cases - if ignoring the fact, that the most valuable or problematic traits being, in most cases, not race type specific anyway.

I only see a problem, if a valuable and regionally adapted racial type, let's say Nordid, being replaced and substituted by less valuable and less regional adapted racial forms - due to very disproportionate birth rates in - or massive genflow (mass immigration) into the popualtion.

But then again, I wouldn't fight that with such individual restrictions, but a general population and immigration policy, as well as Eugenic measures, like explained already - and again, the most important traits being not race type specific.

I could ask the same question with even more seriousness, if talking about two potential mates, of which one is very attractive, healthy, fertile, intelligent, group oriented, social, idealistic etc. and this person might marry and produce children with an unattractive, sick, less fertile, dumb, asocial and corrupt individual - of the same subrace.

That would be much worse, from every point of view, than two valuable individuals from different subraces mating...

[Loki]

"Marriage between different Europids?"

Simply unacceptable :no:

Just to clarify - I was actually joking. :p

[billErobreren]

Sure

[Star Valley]

If marriage between amongst different Europeans concern a person, they probably are not yet fit to agree to marriage in the first place. It displays a weakness/unstable thought that needs to be addressed before entirely committing to a lifetime of responsibility and unconditional love. In other words, their real priorities regarding marriage needs to be set; this is the least important demand that needs to be made. Each to his own (it is a personal choice). Still, there are many elements of marriage that need to come first before raising concern about marriage between different Europids.

[Östsvensk]

I think I was drunk or something when I made this thread. Can't remember, as it surely was a while ago. In any way, I can't possibly have been serious. :D

And even the administrator himself bumped it. ;)

[Moonbird]

I think I was drunk or something when I made this thread. Can't remember, as it surely was a while ago. In any way, I can't possibly have been serious. :D

And even the administrator himself bumped it. ;)

Well, I must say I was a bit surprised about your views when I read the thread's opening post :confused:

[Curtis24]

I have no problem with marriages between different European Europids. When it comes to a European marrying a Mideasterner or Indian, though, the non-European should be exceptional in some way.

[Raikaswinþs]

yet another LOL thread for the community.

[rhiannon]

A mixed race child is not beautiful; it's an abomination.
It is a child. And, no, the child is NOT an abomination, it is your views which are the abomination here, for regardless of my own opinions on whether or not interracial relationships are okay or not okay, I would NEVER EVER say such a hurtful thing about a child.


My reason for not supporting interethnic (and even more so) interracial mixing (in most cases) is that I'm concerned that the child would find it hard to integrate into European society (assuming it's fairly monoethnic), because of the xenophobia they will inevitably face, and because the foreign parent will (obviously) not be a carrier of that culture. Especially if their mixed parentage is obvious, the child may grow up culturally confused and may be pretty miserable, which I would not wish upon any child.
This eloquently explains why I would never have considered having children with a man outside of my race.

As for subraces? Eh. I agree with a few of the PPs who make mention of our human tendency to feel attraction to those individuals which are similar enough genetically, but not-so-similar as to be incestuous. Thus, I really don't see any issues with intermarriage between differing subraces, and to a smaller extent, different races, assuming that the interracial stuff is kept to a low level, overall.

It is our instinct to propagate our own kind, as it were.

[Boudica]

Lol.. Of course it's alright. Europids are genetically white, imo that is all that matters. Everyone is mixed with different European groups, no one is pure of any one particular European group, that is bullshit.

edit: There are certain circumstances though. I can definitely see how marriages of people from certain cultures may cause trouble.. For example an Albanian man that marries a Serbian woman.. Talk about a lively family reunion, yikes...

[Curtis24]

Well, the problem with the Mideasterners, are their value systems and the generally lower intelligence. I guess you could argue they have higher proportions of the viscose(mesomorph)/low intelligence schizothymes type also, which can unstable a society. Turkey has basically been exporting those types of people to Europe for decades now, and the results haven't been good.

[billErobreren]

I find it laughable how some Americans simply voted "no" or "depends" lmao really? how many of us can say we're pure bred anything? not many. I mean great, at least we get to vote but come on :D

[Laudanum]

Lol.. Of course it's alright. Europids are genetically white, imo that is all that matters.

God, you're so American. :bounce

[Moonbird]

It is a child. And, no, the child is NOT an abomination, it is your views which are the abomination here, for regardless of my own opinions on whether or not interracial relationships are okay or not okay, I would NEVER EVER say such a hurtful thing about a child.


It's of course the parents who should be blamed, not the child. Putting a child to this world without thinking any further about the consequences is reprehensible. A child of mixed racial origin will be rootless and a stranger everywhere.

But, as an answer to the poll question, I don't see any problems with marriages between different European phenotypes.

[Turkey]

It should probably be avoided so that we keep our diversity and avoid a european melting pot. It's not such a big deal in Australia or America etc.

[Rattfink]

Well, I must say I was a bit surprised about your views when I read the thread's opening post :confused:

Oh, baby Grynda! I'm more surprised at you by saying such crap here (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showpost.php?p=511593&postcount=150)
yeah big lol, I wonder if you really believe in McCulloch's nordish daug! :rolleyes2:

[Moonbird]

Oh, baby Grynda! I'm more surprised at you by saying such crap here (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showpost.php?p=511593&postcount=150)
yeah big lol, I wonder if you really believe in McCulloch's nordish daug! :rolleyes2:

Common causes sometimes makes strange bedfellows :wink

[antonio]

I'm not a big fan of losing (specially so accelerated) racial intraeuropean identities but I'm myself a product of those kind of admixtures: 950 Km at our little Asian peninsule is not like going the next corner.

Solution is difficult. Reinforcing frontiers even on decent people would help a lot, although with the almost negigible colateral damage of shooting to death European economy. :D

[Falkata]

Erasmus exchange programmes are destroying the racial intraeuropean particularities :D

[Comte Arnau]

It's just a matter of putting more consciousness on the child's upbringing. Both parents should speak to the child in their respective native tongues, regardless of the language they use between them. It'd be highly recommendable to travel to the other's country with relative frequency (countries in Europe are not that far from each other), so that the child felt strongly connected to both cultures and didn't feel any as alien. And of course, both cuisines should be represented at home! :D No matter which one is better, any will be rather than letting the child go to a Mac's.

[The Lawspeaker]

Inter-European marriages are still a kind of mixing and I therefore look at it as a kind of race-mixing. However.. if done within moderation it should not pose much problems.

[Ibericus]

Im for the preservation of all ethnicities, but I think at a small scale level between europeans is not important. The offsrping of two europeans is genetically european.

[Boudica]

God, you're so American. :bounce

Thanks :D

[The Lawspeaker]

Im for the preservation of all ethnicities, but I think at a small scale level between europeans is not important. The offsrping of two europeans is genetically european.
... while is there no such thing as a "European". There is no European nation, no European people, no European language. There is a European cultural zone but that doesn't influence ethnicity. A child from a Dutchman and a Danish woman is.. what ? A half-blood. :)

It's quite funny though that a lot of people that are against a "European Superstate" (whatever that may mean) are keen to use the word "European"when it comes to race.

[Comte Arnau]

A child from a Dutchman and a Danish woman is.. what ? A half-blood. :)


Yeah. Difficult to distinguish the genes, though, because both have the letter D in them. :coffee:

[The Lawspeaker]

Yeah. Difficult to distinguish the genes, though, because both have the letter D in them. :coffee:
Yes and ? So it's only GENES that are important to you ? Not the two cultures, not the two languages ? Not the fact that the parents came from TWO DIFFERENT NATIONS ?

[Comte Arnau]

Yes and ? So it's only GENES that are important to you ? Not the two cultures, not the two languages ? Not the fact that the parents came from TWO DIFFERENT NATIONS ?

Er... it was you who mentioned blood, not me. Actually I couldn't care less about the genes.

And two cultures, two languages, two nations, are a privilege to a child. Only stupid parents would make a problem out of it.

[The Lawspeaker]

Er... it was you who mentioned blood, not me. Actually I couldn't care less about the genes.

And two cultures, two languages, two nations, are a privilege to a child. Only stupid parents would make a problem out of it.
So that means that you wouldn't have a problem with let's say a child of an African immigrant and a local Catalan girl ? :coffee:

[Ibericus]

So that means that you wouldn't have a problem with let's say a child of an African immigrant and a local Catalan girl ? :coffee:
He was talking in a european context. Anyways, not always is a privilege like he says, sometimes it creates identity problems.

[The Lawspeaker]

He was talking in a european context. Anyways, not always is a privilege like he says, sometimes it creates identity problems.
What "European" context ? The cultural zone that is Europe where there are, despite of it's Christian background, considerable differences between Sweden and Italy, between Russia and Ireland ?

[Falkata]

What "European" context ? The cultural zone that is Europe where there are, despite of it's Christian background, considerable differences between Sweden and Italy, between Russia and Ireland ?


Obviously, but the differences aren´t as huge as between Norway and Botswana or between Greece and Indonesia

[The Lawspeaker]

Obviously, but the differences aren´t as huge as between Norway and Botswana or between Greece and Indonesia
But there are still differences and sometimes those differences are profound and should not be underestimated. What I just point out is the hypocrisy of people suddenly being so "European" when it suits them while normally rejecting every kind of European cooperation.

[Piparskeggr]

I should think that any Europids could intermarry, but also think that those of most similar features will be best suited to each other.

[Logan]

Myself, I've documented 19c. Swedish and Irish into whatever was already awash in the English.

I suppose I'm little different than my progenitors. I am more interested in physical attraction, and mental compatibility than some idealised physical type.

[_______]

any europid who loves me and i love in return and who is european will do. blue eyes is a bonus, as is height and high cheekbones.

[Comte Arnau]

In fact, any European who makes deep research into his ancestors will see some come from different ethnicities, even if neighbour ones. People instinctly know it is wise to widen your circles to prevent serious endogamy.

[Mercury]

What "European" context ? The cultural zone that is Europe where there are, despite of it's Christian background, considerable differences between Sweden and Italy, between Russia and Ireland ?



Yeah it is pretty hard to define Europe. Geographically, there probably isn't a European continent. It's Eurasia. Religiously-- not all European nations are Christian. Many so are so secular that there isn't a real connection. I guess if we define Europeans by racially Europid people then some Lebs, Turks, & Indians may also have to be included.

[Ibericus]

Yeah it is pretty hard to define Europe. Geographically, there probably isn't a European continent. It's Eurasia. Religiously-- not all European nations are Christian. Many so are so secular that there isn't a real connection. I guess if we define Europeans by racially Europid people then some Lebs, Turks, & Indians may also have to be included.
Europe is West Eurasia. And no, Lebs, Turks or Indians are far from being in the european genetical ccluster.

[Raikaswinþs]

No what I pointed out is the hypocrisy of people being overtly critical of mixing but don't see harm in mixing within a European context while for the most part they scorn of European togetherness (which I consider to be hypocrisy as there are no such thing as a European nation or a European people and I have seen the differences in mindset between several European countries myself) and while you may not have developed any issues.. there are plenty of those that do. The inter-European marriage in my family btw (Dutch/Italian) didn't last but their son is a very intelligent guy that speaks three languages fluently.

And when it comes to "slandering your mother's memory: you know very well that I would never do that. What I tried to point out is the bla bla bla trying to don't sound like an ass again bla bla bla:thumb001:



http://images.wikia.com/batman/images/d/dd/TommyLeeJones.jpg

[The Lawspeaker]

http://images.wikia.com/batman/images/d/dd/TommyLeeJones.jpg
Must be an "ouch"for you. :thumb001:

[_______]

Not you in particular but if you want to be called a hypocrite then it's fine with me. Whoever thinks that the shoe fits him/her can wear it. :D.. I am more pointing towards certain people here that have a tendency to be against any form of European cooperation (you know who they are) but are very pro-European mixing because then it suddenly "doesn't matter as we're all European". :thumb001:

who are these? they sound lame!

[The Lawspeaker]

who are these? they sound lame!
I won't mention names because I value my account. You have been here long enough to know I mean. :coffee:

So to the Eurosceptic "all mixing is wrong" National Sovereignty crowd: either you're against even European cooperation and European mixing of any sort whatsoever or you aren't because you can't have your cake and eat it. Look.. I am inclined to go along with certain all-Europe ideas and I don't really mind European (or any) mixing if done in a responsible manner (that means that if there are some mixes that are less then 5 percent of the population so the majority of the genetic and cultural pool stays intact) because it wouldn't be a problem AT ALL if it wasn't for mass immigration. As a matter of fact I still find it insane that inter-European migration laws are usually much more stiff and rigid then those that are to keep out non-Western immigrants.

If it wasn't for them flooding Europe we wouldn't have those discussions at all.

[Turkey]

Is this the thread for Sicilians who want breed with Danish?:icon_lol:

[Johnston]

Traditionally, only rich and well-connected aristocrats had foreign marriages, as did the merchants. All the peasants were inbred, and this meant a development of a national stereotypical phenotype, to which rulers and mercantilists did not belong. In fact, I have the same surname in my ancestry 3x at least, 2x in the 19th century and 1x in the 20th century. Most peasants would only breed in the same valley or what-have-you. Everybody outside of such a nexus would be foreign, whether or not they were European, let along of the same country.

[Osweo]

LoL, I wonder what non-Dutch ethnicity Civis's next new squeeze will be from? :p

[johngaunt]

I voted yes because of my mixed ethnicity. Contrary to popular belief, Northern and Southern Europeans have interacted (fuck the word mate, that's either your friend or what the four-legged variety do to procreate) for at least the last millennia - this might suggest compatibility on some other level.

Australia was founded as a multicultural nation to begin with, in a matter of speaking - English, Irish, Scots and Germans. It would explain why we don't have this nitpicky attitude in regards to specific types of race. When I started going out with the father of my children, I didn't look at the shape of his head, nor classify him in any anthropological way at all. We both seemed to understand on some deeper level that we were compatible.

Frankly, I can't understand the nonsense of it all. I have to wonder, how far will this attitude go before the more racial purists realise that, at some point, they would need to drop their standards to ensure the survival of their race? It certainly limits your chances of finding somebody who could be more compatible to you than you would realise.

Shit, maybe thats where Im going wrong, everytime I meet a girl I like, I take her to my room and start measuring her head and get my pigmentation chart out :p

[safinator]

Nothing bad with it.

[Hevneren]

Well, since we can't tell people who to love, and Euro/Euro relationships are preferable to Euro/non-Euro relationships, I don't think it's detrimental to Europe if - say - a Swede and an Italian have kids, as long as we remember to carry on the culture and lineage of our peoples as well.

It's not like if a few people marry and have kids across European cultures, then everyone will start doing it. Europe won't turn into the United States. We've had mixing through the millennia. The Norse mixed with Celts, for example. Romans likely mixed with local populations where they were. Yet, we still have unique cultures and ethnicities in Europe.

[Damião de Góis]

There isn't any country for mixed europids, so these mixed couples will have to make a choice and settle in one country... then it's just a matter of integration and assimilation.

[mymy]

I don't see any problem about it. Of course people can't live in two countries, so they will have to make some choice. Except of that it's all matter of understanding and tolerance, but even so, you have to make compromises in every relation, also in relations with people of your nationality.
Children of mixed European background also have benefits, they usually speak more languages and can accept best from both cultures. Of course they will probably identify the most with society in what they live.

[Magyar the Conqueror]

My mother is Ukrainian, my father is Hungarian.
We have never had problems with it, if anything it has been beneficial to me.

I can call myself Hungarian or Ukrainian, I can support the Hungarian or Hungarian sports teams, I have access to both cultures and languages, etc etc.

[dralos]

it's today all hip and cool being mixed,but i'm happy with being pure and i'm sure my family will stay pure till eternity

[YouAreWrong Leonidas]

Well, since we can't tell people who to love, and Euro/Euro relationships are preferable to Euro/non-Euro relationships, I don't think it's detrimental to Europe if - say - a Swede and an Italian have kids, as long as we remember to carry on the culture and lineage of our peoples as well.

It's not like if a few people marry and have kids across European cultures, then everyone will start doing it. Europe won't turn into the United States. We've had mixing through the millennia. The Norse mixed with Celts, for example. Romans likely mixed with local populations where they were. Yet, we still have unique cultures and ethnicities in Europe.

much!! this have through to my perspection congruently! will to most post, so for unlikely.

[Comte Arnau]

There isn't any country for mixed europids, so these mixed couples will have to make a choice and settle in one country... then it's just a matter of integration and assimilation.

Well, a French and a German can always decide to go and settle in Luxembourg. :p

What's more, a Portuguese and a Catalan can always decide to go and settle in Andorra. :laugh:

[Damião de Góis]

Well, a French and a German can always decide to go and settle in Luxembourg. :p

What's more, a Portuguese and a Catalan can always decide to go and settle in Andorra. :laugh:

I have one half german friend. But he is just one of the guys, his german part is never an issue and i actually have no idea if he speaks german or not, it never crossed my mind to ask. In his case his family chose Portugal and forgot about Germany.

[Redar14]

I accept polish-russian, polish- ukrainian or polish-slovak marriages but I don't accept marriages between Poles and europeans who are totally exotic for us (for example Italians, Greeks or Celts).

[mymy]

I don't understand you people when you say "you accept something or don't" and when you say "something will never happen in your family". It's okay when you talk about yourself, but when it comes about other people, no one really ask you or care do you accept or not. And you can't guarantee that your kids will marry person of same ethnicity. Of course you raise your kids and have influence on them, but you can't decide for them and tell him what to think.
As for myself, no matter who i will marry, i plan to raise kids on more neutral way and make them learn themselves and create their opinion, rather than make them be slaves of one society.

[Damião de Góis]

I don't understand you people when you say "you accept something or don't" and when you say "something will never happen in your family". It's okay when you talk about yourself, but when it comes about other people, no one really ask you or care do you accept or not. And you can't guarantee that your kids will marry person of same ethnicity. Of course you raise your kids and have influence on them, but you can't decide for them and tell him what to think.
As for myself, no matter who i will marry, i plan to raise kids on more neutral way and make them learn themselves and create their opinion, rather than make them be slaves of one society.

It's because this forum atracts people who are very attached to their ethnicity. So most people here will be against mixed marriages. Still, in our globalized world, people will tend to be more mixed anyway.

[mymy]

It's because this forum atracts people who are very attached to their ethnicity. So most people here will be against mixed marriages. Still, in our globalized world, people will tend to be more mixed anyway.

Of course, but after all, we are here mostly Europeans. I don't see other Europeans like something unwanted in family...

[zack]

I don't understand you people when you say "you accept something or don't" and when you say "something will never happen in your family". It's okay when you talk about yourself, but when it comes about other people, no one really ask you or care do you accept or not. And you can't guarantee that your kids will marry person of same ethnicity. Of course you raise your kids and have influence on them, but you can't decide for them and tell him what to think.
As for myself, no matter who i will marry, i plan to raise kids on more neutral way and make them learn themselves and create their opinion, rather than make them be slaves of one society.

You can only try to raise your kids right,but if they go against your teachings and wishes then you can always disown them. :thumbs up

[Comte Arnau]

In his case his family chose Portugal and forgot about Germany.


It's because this forum atracts people who are very attached to their ethnicity.

You see, if I happen to have a child with my gf, I'll make him feel proud of his Danish side, even if we lived in here most of the time. Her mother would only speak to him in Danish and he would be constantly in contact with that culture. I don't understand those parents who let their children forget about part of their ethnic background.

And both of us are as attached to our ethnicities as we can be. I am the proof. :D

[PetiteParisienne]

As long as both people in question share the same core values, I don't see why not.

[Germanicus]

As long as both people in question share the same core values, I don't see why not.

I disagree, you should stick to your own nationality.

[mymy]

I disagree, you should stick to your own nationality.

Values and way of thinking are more important than nationality. In my opinion.

[GeistFaust]

As an American mutt I really have no room to speak, and probably also given the fact that I would only get in a relation with another American mutt of similar background.

I personally think it depends on closely related the people are as to the validity of the marriage, and the affinity they share with each other in a cultural and biological sense.


Ethnic-Mixing has been happening in Europe forever between different ethnic groups, but especially between people who share affinities with each other.


I personally would prefer if people tried to remain as pure as possible, but people are going to be people, and if they want to marry someone of a different ethnicity let them.


A traditionalist though could say that allowing them to do could open the doors for inter-racial marriages in the future, but I think a lot of it is all "relative."

[GeistFaust]

I disagree, you should stick to your own nationality.

I agree with Germanicus from a philosophical and historical perspective overall, and I know that he has wisdom and experience to make such a judgment.

[Magyar the Conqueror]

Nowadays there is no such thing as "pure", maybe in the northern countries.

A mix of people =gives you are Russian, a different Combination of mixes gives you a Ukrainian, another combination gives you a Pole, etc etc.

[Mordid]

I accept polish-russian, polish- ukrainian or polish-slovak marriages but I don't accept marriages between Poles and europeans who are totally exotic for us (for example Italians, Greeks or Celts).
Celts have in common with Slavs than you think. I've dated Scottish girl for a month. Does that make me race traitor? Of course, according to your worthless opinion. I guess I am pan-European lover whore. :D

People are people and it does not matter the phenotype. What matters to them is that they LOVE each other.

[Comte Arnau]

There's no such thing as pure anywhere, but even less in Europe.

Even isolated parts like Iceland are Viking-Celt mutts. :)

[Redar14]

Nowadays there is no such thing as "pure", maybe in the northern countries.

A mix of people =gives you are Russian, a different Combination of mixes gives you a Ukrainian, another combination gives you a Pole, etc etc.

Yes but some nations are total foreign for themselves and they shouldn't mixed each other. We are Europeans not Americans and We should protect our ethnicity and national identity!

[Damião de Góis]

There's no such thing as pure anywhere, but even less in Europe.

Even isolated parts like Iceland are Viking-Celt mutts. :)

I don't agree, there's a reason genetic plots like these are still possible.

http://news.sciencemag.org/sciencenow/assets/2008/09/02/200890221.jpg

If everyone was mixed, the plot above with be a mess.

[Mordid]

Yes but some nations are total foreign for themselves and they shouldn't mixed each other. We are Europeans not Americans!
Americans are totally mixed of many races..

[Comte Arnau]

I don't agree, there's a reason genetic plots like these are still possible.

http://news.sciencemag.org/sciencenow/assets/2008/09/02/200890221.jpg

If everyone was mixed, the plot above with be a mess.

How many of those plots are totally isolated?

Of course I wasn't meaning that the situation in Europe is like that of a colonial country, fortunately. What I meant is that things as 'pure' as that tribe that's been discovered some weeks ago in the remote jungle of eastern Peru are rather hard to find here. Fortunately too, because radical inbreeding would have been detrimental to our progress.

[Hevneren]

I feel somewhat conflicted on this issue, because on one hand I'm a proud Norwegian and I want to see cultural diversity and identity preserved, but on the other hand I respect other cultures and I wouldn't deny myself to love someone just because they had a different culture and nationality from me.

Let's say I'm abroad and I meet a Greek/Russian/Hungarian (etc) girl, and she's very kind, we share much in common and we evolve feelings for each other. Should I tell this girl to get lost because she isn't Norwegian? I don't think I would do that. :shrug:

[zack]

Celts have in common with Slavs than you think. I've dated Scottish girl for a month. Does that make me race traitor? Of course, according to your worthless opinion. I guess I am pan-European lover whore. :D

People are people and it does not matter the phenotype. What matters to them is that they LOVE each other.

You are aware that those are the same arguments people in favor of interracial relationships make right? :eek:

[Damião de Góis]

How many of those plots are totally isolated?

They all look like that.


Of course I wasn't meaning that the situation in Europe is like that of a colonial country, fortunately. What I meant is that things as 'pure' as that tribe that's been discovered some weeks ago in the remote jungle of eastern Peru are rather hard to find here. Fortunately too, because radical inbreeding would have been detrimental to our progress.

Yes, what i was saying was that Europe's ethnicities are all well defined genetically. For example, someone who was a mix of portuguese and something else wouldn't cluster with the rest of portuguese. So in that sense we can talk about "purity".

[Stars Down To Earth]

It depends what sort of Europids the spouses are. Degrees of separation, and all that.

That said, I don't think it will damage the nation as long as only a small minority of the population is doing it. The vast majority, however, should marry within the ethnic group. I'm against all sorts of mass immigration into my country, even Europid immigrants, for the same reason. (Also, all my relationships except for one have been with girls native to the British Isles.)


I've dated Scottish girl for a month. Does that make me race traitor?
Yes, it does, Wzladczyczszlaw. What really surprises me is not the Polish defilement of my Celto-Germanic countrywoman, but the astounding fact that you managed to get a date. ;)

(And yes, I know that me and Mordid actually share the same name, only he spells his with a "w".) :tongue

[Redar14]

Let's say I'm abroad and I meet a Greek/Russian/Hungarian (etc) girl, and she's very kind, we share much in common and we evolve feelings for each other. Should I tell this girl to get lost because she isn't Norwegian? I don't think I would do that. :shrug:

I see that you are not truly nationalist. Love for own nations should be stronger
than personal feelings.

[Mordid]

You are aware that those are the same arguments people in favor of interracial relationships make right? :eek:
Not at all.

[Man of Steel]

Europid is a synonym for Caucasian I think? I don't think we should mix with the Arabs.

[zack]

Not at all.

We are just people. Love is love. :confused:

[Styggnacke]

I don't have any problem with it on a small scale, but on a large scale it can be threatening for the ethnic identity. I have no other intentensions than marrying a Swedish woman, by the way. It's in my opinion better in many aspects to marry one from your own group.

[GeistFaust]

Love should have certain boundaries put on it, and I know some people don't like to hear this, but its the cold truth to the situation. You can't just marry outside of your traditional background, and expect to benefit yourself.


You will do more good to yourself consciously and self-consciously by respecting the background of your forefathers by making it your imperative duty to preserve and protect it. Its basically like letting some foreign bloodline, which previous ancestors might have even fought against, into your own bloodline.


Its not acceptable, and to do so is unfortunately seen as a positive thing by those caught in a blind illusion produced by the false optimism of the age. We have to also blame the shanty and shaky grounds of Christian morals and principles as they pertain to their modern framework.

A man shows himself that he truly loves himself when he only enters into a relationship with a similar biological mold. Abandoning a tradition unfortunately is seen a positive thing in today's hyper liberal and Laissez Faire world where everything and anything can pass.


Traditional and Conservative principles should not contradict with liberal and Laissez Faire principles, but should aid in regulating them and keeping them in check. This is under the condition that they conform to the criteria and rules we lay down in the process of applying them to our life.

[PetiteParisienne]

I disagree, you should stick to your own nationality.

I understand and respect that.

[Phil75231]

Voted "Yes".


Lots of people on here are a mix of different things (especially "colonials"), so I see this as yet another pointless thread.

[mymy]

Celts have in common with Slavs than you think. I've dated Scottish girl for a month. Does that make me race traitor? Of course, according to your worthless opinion. I guess I am pan-European lover whore. :D

People are people and it does not matter the phenotype. What matters to them is that they LOVE each other.

Right. Love, understanding, mutual respect, similar values... I don't believe i will say this, but... You guys should learn from Mordid. :coffee:

[Duke]

It must be avoided, since it destroys nation awareness from offspring, and replaces it with sense of multiculturalism instead

[Hevneren]

I see that you are not truly nationalist. Love for own nations should be stronger
than personal feelings.

I would say that I am, because I a) love my people and culture, b) want us to be free and independent and c) believe it's good to preserve cultural diversity in Europe (and elsewhere). However, because I feel this way I also have respect for other peoples/cultures.

Also, if I were to fall for a non-Norwegian European I would make sure to carry my culture with me, and if we have a child I'd teach him/her about my culture, and I'd want my woman to do the same, as my love and the mother of my child(ren).

[rashka]

I voted for It Depends.

[Corraidh]

I appreciate all European peoples but I'd stick with Irish/British gals, me'self.

[Osweo]

Celts have in common with Slavs than you think. I've dated Scottish girl for a month.

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01276/susan-280_1276793a.jpg

Gotta admire the PoleWale's guts. :suomut:

[rhiannon]

As an American mutt I really have no room to speak, and probably also given the fact that I would only get in a relation with another American mutt of similar background.

Yep. I so totally understand, Geist:) This is exactly what I did:)

[StonyArabia]

Marriage between different European groups has occurred since the beginning of times. Though often it was limited. Though some people want to be limited because it would ensure it would not be a threat to ethnic stability, but if the European person adoptes the host culture of the country he is residing and that of his spouse, their certainly nothing wrong with it, but it depends on the people's choice, though the North American setting is of course different.

[Luke]

I voted no but I think it's okay in select instances. As in a Swedish person and a displaced Swedish American or a German and a white Russian or a white French and a white Serb.

I don't see a dark Italian with a white British person as being okay. Or a dark Russian with a white Swedish person. Those are clearly problems.

[CelticViking]

Phil75231
Voted "Yes".
Lots of people on here are a mix of different things (especially "colonials"), so I see this as yet another pointless thread.



Duke
It must be avoided, since it destroys nation awareness from offspring, and replaces it with sense of multiculturalism instead



Originally Posted by GeistFaust
As an American mutt I really have no room to speak, and probably also given the fact that I would only get in a relation with another American mutt of similar background.

There were Celtic people in: England,Cornwall,Scotland,Wales,Ireland,France,Net herlands,Germany,
Austria,Switzerland, Iceland & Greenland.
There were Germanic people in:
England,Cornwall,Scotland,Wales,Ireland,France,Net herlands,Germany,
Austria,Switzerland, Iceland & Greenland.
Before Celtic and Germanic people moved to USA,Canada,South Africa, Australia and New Zealand.

Germanic people in Romania (Transylvanian Saxons), Russia(Volga Germans) and Germans in and Czech and Poland and Hungary.

Celtic people in Poland and hungary.

As for eye colour. There are brown eyed to blue eyed people in all those countries. Same with different hair colour, height and weight,

As for Anthropological Taxonomy
Northern Atlantid, Keltic Nordid, Anglo Saxon and Brunn have been marrying for years.

Peter Crouch and Abigail Clancy
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40931

Andrew Upton and Cate Blanchett

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41760

Nicole Kidman and Tom Cruise

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-15693.html

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3160

Lucy Lawless and Hayley Westernra are Keltic/Atlantid + Brunn

There have been many wars:
Wars between Viking and Anglo Saxon
Wars between Germany,France and England.
Wars beteen Scotland, Ireland and England.
Wars between South Africa and England
Wars between USA and England.
New Zealand and Australia did have problems between Irish and English. Austrians/Germans were banned from New Zealand.
There was World War 1 and World war 2.
Canada has problems between French and English.

Celtic and Germanic people need to make peace with each other.

[Osweo]

I voted no but I think it's okay in select instances. As in a Swedish person and a displaced Swedish American or a German and a white Russian or a white French and a white Serb.

I don't see a dark Italian with a white British person as being okay. Or a dark Russian with a white Swedish person. Those are clearly problems.
:rolleyes2:

Here in the real world, we're not mad on distinguishing between the pigmentation within European nations. If you're an Italian or Greek, you're a fellow European, and I don't give a fuck how brown you are and how big your nose might be.

[dralos]

There were Celtic people in: England,Cornwall,Scotland,Wales,Ireland,France,Net herlands,Germany,
Austria,Switzerland, Iceland & Greenland.
There were Germanic people in:
England,Cornwall,Scotland,Wales,Ireland,France,Net herlands,Germany,
Austria,Switzerland, Iceland & Greenland.
Before Celtic and Germanic people moved to USA,Canada,South Africa, Australia and New Zealand.

Germanic people in Romania (Transylvanian Saxons), Russia(Volga Germans) and Germans in and Czech and Poland and Hungary.

Celtic people in Poland and hungary.


As for Anthropological Taxonomy
Northern Atlantid, Keltic Nordid, Anglo Saxon and Brunn have been marrying for years.

Peter Crouch and Abigail Clancy
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40931

Andrew Upton and Cate Blanchett

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41760

Nicole Kidman and Tom Cruise

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-15693.html

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3160

Lucy Lawless and Hayley Westernra are Keltic/Atlantid + Brunn

There have been many wars:
Wars between Viking and Anglo Saxon
Wars between Germany,France and England.
Wars beteen Scotland, Ireland and Scotland.
Wars between South Africa and England
Wars between USA and England.
World War 1 and World war 2.
Celtic and Germanic people need to make peace with each other.
you're forgetting kosova,here were also celts

[Insuperable]

Preservation of cultural diversity in Europe should be common sense. France for French, Germany for Germans, Croatia for Croats. Without cultural diversity Europe would stop being Europe.

So I am against marriages but I am for friendships among countries and for mutual helping.

[Siegfried]

I myself am a product of interbreeding between different Europids, so I don't think it's a terrible thing. I don't think any of the Europid races will die out, but I still don't advocate it on large scale. As long as their not non-Europeans, I'm open to most.

[Insuperable]

I read some time ago on some nordicist forum ( i think it was skadi ) that
Nordic + Dinaric = Nobel prize winner
I do not know if that is true but if it is I am for intermarriages between these two subraces

[dralos]

I read some time ago on some nordicist forum ( i think it was skadi ) that
Nordic + Dinaric = Nobel prize winner
I do not know if that is true but if it is I am for intermarriages between these two subraces
sturmgewehr is nordic/dinaric:D

[Insuperable]

sturmgewehr is nordic/dinaric:D

I am not that into this racial theory bullshit but I am sure they did not mean on just any dinaric. Maybe there are germanic dinaric I do not know I am probably talking nonsense

[Lumi]

Well, tough cookies, Whitebastard. Why? Because as far as I am concerned, when it comes to it, I'll be marrying my boyfriend, who is Finnish.
I am not sticking around in this country. Hell to the no. And besides, I have Swedish roots and so does he.

So, back on topic, yes. I think they should marry and have kids.

[Bakura]

Girl that I like is Norid-Baltid and I'm Norid-Baltid.

[Didriksson]

I think when to people decide to get married they should take into consideration all the pluses and minuses that a mixed marriage could have. It doesn't matter if they both are Europeans, because to build a happy family life cultural aspects are more important than the genetic ones. Imagine, Spanish guy marries a Finnish girl, they both speak different languages and despite the fact that they both are Europeans, their cultures and mentalities are really different. Ofc, there are a lot of couples like that, but in such marriages one side usually takes over the other - culturally, linguistically, ect. This really scares me, because I wouldn't be ready to give up all the things that define who I am - culture, language, traditions, ect.

[Lumi]

I think when to people decide to get married they should take into consideration all the pluses and minuses that a mixed marriage could have. It doesn't matter if they both are Europeans, because to build a happy family life cultural aspects are more important than the genetic ones. Imagine, Spanish guy marries a Finnish girl, they both speak different languages and despite the fact that they both are Europeans, their cultures and mentalities are really different. Ofc, there are a lot of couples like that, but in such marriages one side usually takes over the other - culturally, linguistically, ect. This really scares me, because I wouldn't be ready to give up all the things that define who I am - culture, language, traditions, ect.

I'm happy to give up the English language. I'm happy to learn Finnish. I'm happy to move there and adopt a new culture.
My Dad did it when he married my StepMum. He's Scottish and she is Swedish, and he's happy to be Swedish, just as I'd be happy to be Finnish.
You can't make a generalisation. Everyone is different.

[Didriksson]

I am not against mixed marriages, but I don't think that they are for me, I love my culture, traditions and language too much. :) + I am a representative of a really small nation, so it is really important to me that we preserve it. :)

[Edgard]

I'm happy to give up the English language. I'm happy to learn Finnish. I'm happy to move there and adopt a new culture.
My Dad did it when he married my StepMum. He's Scottish and she is Swedish, and he's happy to be Swedish, just as I'd be happy to be Finnish.
You can't make a generalisation. Everyone is different.

You wont catch me giving up English although I will learn Polish for reasons of utility and general interest. Also you should not give it up as teaching English could be a nice job for you in Finland.

As you may have guessed I am for inter European marriage in some cases but preferably not in large numbers and preferably between nationalities and individuals with a similar appearance and culture.

[Mosov]

My mother is Ukrainian, my father is Hungarian.
We have never had problems with it, if anything it has been beneficial to me.

I can call myself Hungarian or Ukrainian, I can support the Hungarian or Hungarian sports teams, I have access to both cultures and languages, etc etc.

You think it's more important for your mother or father to be Hungarian?

[Lumi]

You wont catch me giving up English although I will learn Polish for reasons of utility and general interest. Also you should not give it up as teaching English could be a nice job for you in Finland.

As you may have guessed I am for inter European marriage in some cases but preferably not in large numbers and preferably between nationalities and individuals with a similar appearance and culture.

If I'm teaching anything, it will be Earth Science, thank you very much.

[Edgard]

If I'm teaching anything, it will be Earth Science, thank you very much.

In Finnish?

[Lumi]

In Finnish?

Maybe.
Maybe both in Finnish and English. It's a requirement that I learn Finnish when I move acorss there.

[Didriksson]

Maybe.
Maybe both in Finnish and English. It's a requirement that I learn Finnish when I move acorss there.

Good luck with learning Finnish. :)

[Lumi]

Good luck with learning Finnish. :)

It's surprisingly easy.

[Peyrol]

I voted no but I think it's okay in select instances. As in a Swedish person and a displaced Swedish American or a German and a white Russian or a white French and a white Serb.

I don't see a dark Italian with a white British person as being okay. Or a dark Russian with a white Swedish person. Those are clearly problems.

Definitely better these two categories than a 100% pure blodeblueyed obese white trash ignorant american redneck :rolleyes:

[Wanderlust]

Definitely better these two categories than a 100% pure blodeblueyed obese white trash ignorant american redneck :rolleyes:

Yeah, well, that was Austin's sockpuppet #100.

[Raikaswinþs]

I will hardly refuse love because of race or nationality. Love is hard enough to find, and it will never come the way you expect it to come.

This said, its is much more likely that you find love of your own race/nationality if your country is not filled with foreigners.

I can also understand and appreciate those who prefer to stay local and protect their phenotype and culture.

Anyway, as I will always say, there is no need to worry about the dangers of race mixing if your country is not demographically challenged by hordes of foreigners.

No European country is yet in a situation where Europeans make less than 90% of the population, but in the big fat global euro economies they should implement much harder immigration controls and force assimilation if they don't want to become US or Brazil replicas.

[Sabinae]

LOL@ "darkrussian" :lmao

For the sake of it... White Russian also exists:
http://gtvdesign.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/white-russian.jpg

[Osweo]

No European country is yet in a situation where Europeans make less than 90% of the population,
SOME age demographics in too many localities ARE in a far worse situation, however. I wouldn't want to be 15 in Slough or Rochdale, indeed. :(

[sturmwalkure]

I'd consider marrying a European of a different background than I. I've got Romance, Slavic, Germanic and Celtic roots -- so my children would be ethnically mixed no matter who I marry. :p Whether be be Austrian, Greek, or an ethnically mixed American mutt like me. :D

[Mosov]

In terms of appearance, marriage between different Europids is fine as long as the mix can fit in both environments. When it comes to culture, in my view, you are close to one culture than the other.

[Kalitas]

As long as you breed blonde blue eyed children, I find no problem

[dralos]

no way,keep it pure

[Belenus]

I have no problem with inter-European mixed relationships. We've all got a shared history to one extent or another. The fact that our nations have all been interacting and competing on the level of peers for centuries is enough for me to accept other Europids as valid potential mates.

Especially if you come from a nation that has a rich and accomplished background, that's already a big plus in my books. Of course without physical attractiveness and a charismatic personality to back that up, it's not worth much. But still, it's important to me.

[Edgard]

In terms of appearance, marriage between different Europids is fine as long as the mix can fit in both environments. When it comes to culture, in my view, you are close to one culture than the other.

That is a very good point both me and my wife can pass without question in both Poland and Britain until we speak (she is Polish). In appearance we fit the medium point.

[Supreme American]

I'd consider marrying a European of a different background than I. I've got Romance, Slavic, Germanic and Celtic roots -- so my children would be ethnically mixed no matter who I marry. :p Whether be be Austrian, Greek, or an ethnically mixed American mutt like me. :D

I'm 1/4 American Colonial mutt, it really doesn't matter. Other 3/4 is German.