Huge genetical study about Central Asians and Afghans

[Sky earth]

http://dienekes.blogspot.de/2013/10/afghan-mega-paper-di-cristofaro-et-al.html

94% of the chromosomes are distributed within the following 9 main haplogroups: R-M207 (34%), J-M304 (16%), C-M130 (15%), L-M20 (6%), G-M201 (6%), Q-M242 (6%), N-M231 (4%), O-M175 (4%) and E-M96 (3%). Within the core haplogroups observed in the Afghan populations, there are sub-haplogroups that provide more refined insights into the underlying structure of the Y-chromosome gene pool. One of the important sub-haplogroups includes the C3b2b1-M401 lineage that is amplified in Hazara, Kyrgyz and Mongol populations. Haplogroup G2c-M377 reaches 14.7% in Pashtun, consistent with previous results [31], whereas it is virtually absent from all other populations. J2a1-Page55 is found in 23% of Iranians, 13% of the Hazara from the Hindu Kush, 11% of the Tajik and Uzbek from the Hindu Kush, 10% of Pakistanis, 4% of the Turkmen from the Hindu Kush, 3% of the Pashtun and 2% of the Kyrgyz and Mongol populations. Concerning haplogroup L, L1c-M357 is significantly higher in Burusho and Kalash (15% and 25%) than in other populations. L1a-M76 is most frequent in Balochi (20%), and is found at lower levels in Kyrgyz, Pashtun, Tajik, Uzbek and Turkmen populations. Q1a2-M25 lineage is characteristic of Turkmen (31%), significantly higher than all other populations. Haplogroup R1a1a-M198/M17 is characterized by its absence or very low frequency in Iranian, Mongol and Hazara populations and its high frequency in Pashtun and Kyrgyz populations.

Some interesting things:

- The Kyrgyz are genetically closer to Mongols than Kazakhs

- Pashtuns from Pakistan cluster closer to the Indus Basin than to Central Asia

- Hazaras are a mixed Eurasian population though many people in Anthroforums believe that they're pure Mongols who speak a Persian language. Besides that they cluster genetically the closest with Uyghurs

- Tajiks are genetically Central Asian though many people seem to believe that they're genetically closer to Persians. Surprisingly they cluster the closest with Turkmens

- Turkmens carry predominantly haplogroup Q

http://dienekes.blogspot.de/2013/10/afghan-mega-paper-di-cristofaro-et-al.html

[StonyArabia]

It make sense this study, a lot of Pashtuns do look to have Indid strains, especially those in Pakistan. As for the Hazaras their not pure Mongol, but rather a mix of Iranic and Mongol at least this what they claim. Tajiks from Tajikstan are more Mongoloid this why they cluster with Turkmens, but the Tajiks from Afghanistan do look Caucasoid and probably are genetically close to Persians. From all the Iranic groups that are close to Persians it's the Kurds. This could be that the other Iranic speakers just go their language via small elite or they used it as lingua franca.

[Sky earth]

More things I have noticed.

- Turkmens from Afghanistan seem to be much more Mongoloid influenced than those from Turkmenistan

- Uzbeks seem to cluster everywhere. Some are closer to Tajiks and Turkmens while some are closer to Hazaras and Uyghurs. 1 sample clusters even closer to the Indus Basin. I asume that they have the
highest genetic diversity in Central Asia

[MarkyMark]

Do they have any info on the relationship between the Turkmens of Turkmenistan and the Turkmens of Turkey?

[Sky earth]

Do they have any info on the relationship between the Turkmens of Turkmenistan and the Turkmens of Turkey?

No they haven't but Turkmens don't cluster with Anatolian Turks because Turkmens are too much Mongoloid and South Asian influenced while Turks have more genetical Southwest Asian, Mediterranian and European influences

[ButlerKing]

http://dienekes.blogspot.de/2013/10/afghan-mega-paper-di-cristofaro-et-al.html

94% of the chromosomes are distributed within the following 9 main haplogroups: R-M207 (34%), J-M304 (16%), C-M130 (15%), L-M20 (6%), G-M201 (6%), Q-M242 (6%), N-M231 (4%), O-M175 (4%) and E-M96 (3%). Within the core haplogroups observed in the Afghan populations, there are sub-haplogroups that provide more refined insights into the underlying structure of the Y-chromosome gene pool. One of the important sub-haplogroups includes the C3b2b1-M401 lineage that is amplified in Hazara, Kyrgyz and Mongol populations. Haplogroup G2c-M377 reaches 14.7% in Pashtun, consistent with previous results [31], whereas it is virtually absent from all other populations. J2a1-Page55 is found in 23% of Iranians, 13% of the Hazara from the Hindu Kush, 11% of the Tajik and Uzbek from the Hindu Kush, 10% of Pakistanis, 4% of the Turkmen from the Hindu Kush, 3% of the Pashtun and 2% of the Kyrgyz and Mongol populations. Concerning haplogroup L, L1c-M357 is significantly higher in Burusho and Kalash (15% and 25%) than in other populations. L1a-M76 is most frequent in Balochi (20%), and is found at lower levels in Kyrgyz, Pashtun, Tajik, Uzbek and Turkmen populations. Q1a2-M25 lineage is characteristic of Turkmen (31%), significantly higher than all other populations. Haplogroup R1a1a-M198/M17 is characterized by its absence or very low frequency in Iranian, Mongol and Hazara populations and its high frequency in Pashtun and Kyrgyz populations.

Some interesting things:

- The Kyrgyz are genetically closer to Mongols than Kazakhs

- Pashtuns from Pakistan cluster closer to the Indus Basin than to Central Asia

- Hazaras are a mixed Eurasian population though many people in Anthroforums believe that they're pure Mongols who speak a Persian language. Besides that they cluster genetically the closest with Uyghurs

- Tajiks are genetically Central Asian though many people seem to believe that they're genetically closer to Persians. Surprisingly they cluster the closest with Turkmens

- Turkmens carry predominantly haplogroup Q

http://dienekes.blogspot.de/2013/10/afghan-mega-paper-di-cristofaro-et-al.html


What the hell but Kazakhs have like 63% Haplogroup C3 with 41% Caucasian maternal where as Kyrgyz have like 63% R1a1 with 42.6% Caucasian maternal.

How is Kyrgyz more closer to mongol?????? Kyrgyz obviously have more western Eurasian haplogroups ancestors.


I can never understand Turks genetic. Just what is the true genetic legacy of Turks. Please tell me God !!!


R1a1 is obviously a indo-european marker what I don't understand is Mongoloid with R1a1. Already predate the Turks existance? why do we have women pure Europoid where as males with high R1a1 Mongoloid males. Are Kyrgyz even the result of Mongoloid intermixing with Caucasoids?

I'm surprised by the burials of Mongoloid males in Siberia with high R1a1.



Pazyryk culture



" Though almost 3000 miles separate the Scythian Empire from Pazyryk, both belonged to a world shared by peoples of different origins and languages (in one burial the man is of Mongoloid, the woman of Indo-European type) with a common burials of Europoid females and part Mongoloid males. "


Anayino culture

Sculptural reconstruction of men Lugovskyi burial
Ananyino culture. Gypsum. MMGerasimov work.


" Reconstruction of the mounds number 5, 6 show burial Stone Barn in racial make women Ural mixed type men - striking features of Central Asian Mongoloid."

http://www.imageup.ru/img195/1641901/tyurk1.jpg

http://www.imageup.ru/img195/1641909/f-u1.jpg

[ButlerKing]

Could it be that these Turkic invaders were actually just Mongoloid type males with R1a1?

Why is that there is so many burials of mixed Mongoloid men with pure Caucasoid women. Could it be that R1a1 predate the Turk language and culture? especially before it's expansion.

[ButlerKing]

Even the Bulgars who are said to be Turkified Iranic Sarmatian or possibly Turkic mixed with Sarmatian.

So not only in Turkic but also in Iranic population. Perharps this R1a1 already predated the Turks existance properly even during the neolithic times.



"An examined population from an abandoned medieval cemetery showed mixed in anthropological terms with brachicranial Caucasoid type as the primary representatives followed by the Mongoloid admixed type. Women's were not significantly different from men but were more Caucasoid than men. Apparently, carriers of Mongoloid elements was a male part of the population that came to this territory as conquerors.[75] This finding is consistent with a model in which the Turkic languages were gradually imposed in Central Asia and East European Plain on Scythian and Uralic peoples with relatively little genetic admixture, another possible example of a language shift through elite dominance.[76][77] Ibn Fadlan, who visited Volga Bulgaria in the 10th century, describes the appearance of the Bulgars as "ailing" (pale) and "not ruddy" like the Rus' people.[78] "



]I truely believe Central Asian Turks today are result of R1a predominately Mongoloid males with Caucasian women. Even Bulgars who are mixture of Turkic and Iranic had males males who were predominately Caucasian with substantial Mongoloid appereance but females were pure caucasian.

Facial reconstruction of Bulgar male

http://s59.radikal.ru/i166/0807/88/f750ddb7501a.jpg


Facial reconstruction of Bulgar female


http://s41.radikal.ru/i091/0811/b8/48745460128a.jpg

[AndreiUralian]

What the hell but Kazakhs have like 63% Haplogroup C3 with 41% Caucasian maternal where as Kyrgyz have like 63% R1a1 with 42.6% Caucasian maternal.

How is Kyrgyz more closer to mongol?????? Kyrgyz obviously have more western Eurasian haplogroups ancestors.


I can never understand Turks genetic. Just what is the true genetic legacy of Turks. Please tell me God !!!


R1a1 is obviously a indo-european marker. Yet what I don't understand this, this Mongoloid with R1a1 already predate the Turks existance? why do we have Caucasoid women with 15% East Eurasian mtDNA and are almost pure Europoid where as males with high R1a1 look like almost pure Mongoloid males
Are Kyrgyz even the result of Mongoloid intermixing with Caucasoids?

I'm surprised by the burials of Mongoloid males in Siberia with high R1a1.



Pazyryk culture



" Though almost 3000 miles separate the Scythian Empire from Pazyryk, both belonged to a world shared by peoples of different origins and languages (in one burial the man is of Mongoloid, the woman of Indo-European type) with a common burials of Europoid females and part Mongoloid males. "


Anayino culture

Sculptural reconstruction of men Lugovskyi burial
Ananyino culture. Gypsum. MMGerasimov work.


" Reconstruction of the mounds number 5, 6 show burial Stone Barn in racial make women Ural mixed type men - striking features of Central Asian Mongoloid."

http://www.imageup.ru/img195/1641901/tyurk1.jpg

http://www.imageup.ru/img195/1641909/f-u1.jpg

Well its actually true that the so called anatolian-turks migrated to the east then foward central asia they contributed mongoloid and samoyedic admixture as when they contatcted with the Altaic people who where Haplogroup C and the Samoyedic (native) where Q whenever the anatolian-turks where J2 carriers as the original (Ujgurs,kabars,tatars) but as later on they got intermariging through the native people with N,Q,R1a and some of them C. many people confuse the Term Turkic means turkified nations but not anatolian-turkid. such as the Volga-Bolghars where Uralic (Finno-Volgid) then they got mongolized under goldens horde influence and today they have only 10% of altaic (mongoloid) admixture whenever the rest is Uralic and a little bit of Sytchian

[Anglojew]

G-M201 & Q-M242 Jewish-Pashtun/Jewish-Turkmen brotherhood.

[ButlerKing]

Well its actually true that the so called anatolian-turks migrated to the east then foward central asia they contributed mongoloid and samoyedic admixture as when they contatcted with the Altaic people who where Haplogroup C and the Samoyedic (native) where Q whenever the anatolian-turks where J2 carriers as the original (Ujgurs,kabars,tatars) but as later on they got intermariging through the native people with N,Q,R1a and some of them C. many people confuse the Term Turkic means turkified nations but not anatolian-turkid. such as the Volga-Bolghars where Uralic (Finno-Volgid) then they got mongolized under goldens horde influence and today they have only 10% of altaic (mongoloid) admixture whenever the rest is Uralic and a little bit of Sytchian

Turkish eastern Eurasian paternal DNA depending on the province.

Haplogroup N the highest can reach 10%
Haplogroup C3 the highest can reach 5%
Haplogroup Q the highest can reach 6%
Haplogroup O the highest can reach 1%


However in other provinces this reaches 0-2% but how knows if much of their R1a1 and R1b were already hybrisized with Mongoloid not to mention that Mongoloid mtDNA in Turkey ranges like 4.99% to 10%.

I used to think Turks with haplogroup Q is the true Turkic marker. However given the huge number of haplogroup R1a1. I have reason to believe Turks were a race of R1a1, Q, N. Central Asians have significant 10-20% haplogroup Q showing they have significant presence

and much of the R1a1 in central Asian turks and Turkey would have come from Mongoloid like turks.

This explains why the Tuvans and Khotons have such high R1a1 ( 30% to 82% ) and yet still look strongly mongoloid it isn't because their mtDNA is mostly Mongoloid they also have 25% to 45% western Eurasian mtDNA yet they look so mongoloid.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/70/Haplogroup_Q_(Y-DNA).PNG

[ButlerKing]

I'm surprised by just how Mongoloid looking these Khotons are despite having 82% R1a1 and 45% western Eurasian mtDNA.

You would think they at least look more Caucasian but they seem more asiatic looking but they are heavily asiatic.

http://www.jamesseithphotography.com/People-Faces/Faces-People-Mongolia/i-576dqvp/3/S/OldMenandHorse-S.jpg
http://www.sci.hokudai.ac.jp/~tkatoh/Khoton_Mongolian_480x360.jpg

[AndreiUralian]

I'm surprised by just how Mongoloid looking these Khotons are despite having 82% R1a1 and 45% western Eurasian mtDNA.

You would think they at least look more Caucasian but they seem more asiatic looking but they are heavily asiatic.

http://www.jamesseithphotography.com/People-Faces/Faces-People-Mongolia/i-576dqvp/3/S/OldMenandHorse-S.jpg
http://www.sci.hokudai.ac.jp/~tkatoh/Khoton_Mongolian_480x360.jpg

Well your quite right but in reality the Volga Bolghars (Tatars) cherkess and Ujgurs are just mongolized turks (anatolid-turks) the real turks (anatolians) are the haplogroup j2 carriers who after all spreaded to central asia and then on diffrent parts of the world, so here is a list of Haplogroups representing the carriers Race:
Haplogroup R1a1=Sytchians
Haplogroup N= Uralic,Finno-Ugrians
Haplogroup C= Altaic (mongoloids)
Haplogroup Q= Samoyedic (Native)
Haplogroup R1b=Tocharians,celts
Haplogroup J2= anatolian-turkid
Acctually turkic means turkified (anatolized) nations but still they where mongolized when they contacted with haplogroup C Altaic people acctually you should check out this video it will explain more:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBYP6joXLo8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vK4YfLiYJ_c

[ButlerKing]

Well your quite right but in reality the Volga Bolghars (Tatars) cherkess and Ujgurs are just mongolized turks (anatolid-turks) the real turks (anatolians) are the haplogroup j2 carriers who after all spreaded to central asia and then on diffrent parts of the world, so here is a list of Haplogroups representing the carriers Race:
Haplogroup R1a1=Sytchians
Haplogroup N= Uralic,Finno-Ugrians
Haplogroup C= Altaic (mongoloids)
Haplogroup Q= Samoyedic (Native)
Haplogroup R1b=Tocharians,celts
Haplogroup J2= anatolian-turkid
Acctually turkic means turkified (anatolized) nations but still they where mongolized when they contacted with haplogroup C Altaic people acctually you should check out this video it will explain more:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBYP6joXLo8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vK4YfLiYJ_c

Tocharians were all R1a ( Tarim mummies ) and they spoke Indo-Iranian languages. Who said they were R1b? even in uyghurs today R1a and J2 dominate, not R1b.


N is Uralic , C is Mongolic, Q is Siberian but all of them are Mongoloid.

N, C, Q are found in 50 - 97% of some Mongoloid population and tribes and still show 0% Caucasian admixture.

Where as any Mongoloid population with R1b , R1a, J2 always shows caucasian admxiture no matter how mongoloid they look.

By the way video of the picture is a Hmong girl who lives in Southeast Asia laos, they have 0% Caucasian genes but are blonde due to malnutrition. how is that related with uyghurs?


Their from the same family in Laos.

http://s16.postimg.org/55pdeswyt/Blond_Asia6.jpg
http://affability.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/2855455513_d3d620b914.jpg

[Black Wolf]

Interesting to see Y-DNA haplogroup at 13% among the Hazara of the Hindu Kush. This study also found J2a among the Hazaras at around 16.6%. In both studies haplogroup J2a is the second most common haplogroup found among the Hazaras after haplogroup C.

http://dienekes.blogspot.ca/2012/03/rare-look-at-y-chromosomes-of.html

[ButlerKing]

Interesting to see Y-DNA haplogroup at 13% among the Hazara of the Hindu Kush. This study also found J2a among the Hazaras at around 16.6%. In both studies haplogroup J2a is the second most common haplogroup found among the Hazaras after haplogroup C.

http://dienekes.blogspot.ca/2012/03/rare-look-at-y-chromosomes-of.html

It is show that J2a is only 4% or 8% in other studies though. C3 being 40% and R1b being 32%

Hazara Sengupta et al. (2006),
10/25 = 40% C3-M217
1/25 = 4% I2b1b-M379
1/25 = 4% J2a-M410
2/25 = 8% O3-M122
1/25 = 4% Q1a1-M120
1/25 = 4% Q1b-M378
8/25 = 32% R1b1b1-M73
1/25 = 4% R2-M124

[Black Wolf]

It is show that J2a is only 4% or 8% in other studies though. C3 being 40% and R1b being 32%

Hazara Sengupta et al. (2006),
10/25 = 40% C3-M217
1/25 = 4% I2b1b-M379
1/25 = 4% J2a-M410
2/25 = 8% O3-M122
1/25 = 4% Q1a1-M120
1/25 = 4% Q1b-M378
8/25 = 32% R1b1b1-M73
1/25 = 4% R2-M124

How many studies show that? You seem to have only posted one here the Sengupta one.

[AndreiUralian]

It is show that J2a is only 4% or 8% in other studies though. C3 being 40% and R1b being 32%

Hazara Sengupta et al. (2006),
10/25 = 40% C3-M217
1/25 = 4% I2b1b-M379
1/25 = 4% J2a-M410
2/25 = 8% O3-M122
1/25 = 4% Q1a1-M120
1/25 = 4% Q1b-M378
8/25 = 32% R1b1b1-M73
1/25 = 4% R2-M124

Yes they are quite great examples, but it only that most of the original Uigurs where not so mongoloid they where turkic-anatolid so haplogroup J2 carriers and some of them with R1a1 when they contacted with the Sytchians and after all they moved over central asia and then they got their mongoloid admixture from Haplogroup C and Q carriers who where most of them the native Altaic and Samoyedic (sibero-american) people where they intermarried so still some of them R1a and J2 is quite predomenant

[Black Wolf]

Yes they are quite great examples, but it only that most of the original Uigurs where not so mongoloid they where turkic-anatolid so haplogroup J2 carriers and some of them with R1a1 when they contacted with the Sytchians and after all they moved over central asia and then they got their mongoloid admixture from Haplogroup C and Q carriers who where most of them the native Altaic and Samoyedic (sibero-american) people where they intermarried so still some of them R1a and J2 is quite predomenant

This is off topic but I see that your mtDNA haplogroup is also U5. Welcome to the club. :)