PDA

View Full Version : Noteworthy Europeans with YDNA Haplogroup E1b1b



Longbowman
12-18-2013, 03:20 PM
The various strands of Hap. E1b1b as found in Europe constitute the third most common group of YDNA clades in Europe, after the R1 clades (R1a and R1b of course) and the original I clades. It seems to predate R in Europe, R being associated with the Indo-European invasions of c. ~3,000BC and E1b1b being associated with the spread of agriculture during the Neolithic from Anatolia at the latest (c. ~5,500BC). Like I and R, E is found all over Europe - at consistent, but low (normaly <10%) frequencies, with the exceptions of the Balkans where it in places like southern Greece, Macedonia and Albania it approaches 50%, and isolated areas like Galicia where it hits double digits. Anyhow, here's a list of 10 people with the illustrious E1b1b lineage:

1. The Wright Brothers (E1b1b1a2 (V13))

Hailing from North Carolina of English ancestry, the Wright Brothers are known for having a very successful bike shop. These small-business owners are thus role models for all E1b1b Europeans out there. They did spend a little bit too much of their free time dicking around with powered flight and ultimately ended up creating the first aeroplane and putting humanity on its path to the skies and beyond. Sadly neither one ever procreated - possibly, neither one ever even got laid - so their superior E1b1b genes were not passed on to the next generation. Still, noteworthy individuals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wright_Brothers
http://www.wright-dna.org/dna/OtherResults.html

2. Napoleon (E1b1b1c1* (E-M34*))

Looking aside his obvious shortcomings, or shortcomings which is another good pun because he probably had a micropenis, Napoleon was quite noteworthy. Despite being French, he managed to invade most of Europe, except Britain of course. He also invaded Egypt, found the Rosetta Stone, and failed to invade Russia before it was cool. Yes, he was a bit of a bloodthirsty maniac, but still.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleon
http://www.ccsenet.org/journal/index.php/jmbr/article/view/10609

3. Adolf Hitler (E1b1b1 (E-M35))

Continuing the trend of E1b1b being associated with bloodthirsty tyrants (to be clear, Napoleon > Hitler), it seems the Fuehrer himself was E1b1b, which seemed funny to some uninformed people because E1b1b traces back to Africa perhaps as recently as 25,000 years ago and thus Adolf was black, lol. Obviously, this is a bit of a silly point, and E1b1b is found in German and Austrian native populations at an incidence of ~9% (although if you go back far enough, yes, all haplogroups share a common ancestor). The second claim was 'lol he's Jewish lol' because some Jews have E1b1b, but then, a lot more Jews have R1a and R1b. Anyhow, our boy Adolf was famous for being a colossal dickhead and effecting the loss of German East Prussia, Upper Silesia and elsewhere to the Soviets, in addition to his actions resulting in the partitioning of Germany into a Western and Communist zone.

http://www.knack.be/nieuws/wetenschap/hitler-was-verwant-met-somaliers-berbers-en-joden/article-normal-10083.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler

4. Albert Einstein (E1b1b1b2* (E-Z830))

Why yes, possibly the cleverest person ever was a carrier of E1b1b. This is just further proof that E1b1b as carried by Europeans is the superior YDNA haplogroup. For those not in the know, Albie discovered relativity and some other dorky science stuff that probably got him some serious wedgies in Gymnasium.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein
http://www.familytreedna.com/public/G2c/default.aspx?section=ysnp
http://www.haplozone.net/e3b/project/kitnum/N65053

5. William Hartley (E1b1b1c1 (M34))

Basically every E1b1b carrier was either a dictator or a scientist (which makes total sense as they came to Europe as invasive technological innovators), and the second Anglo on the list comes under the second category. Despite being of the superior E1b1b1c1 variety, and being English, Hartley is probably the least well known on this list so far. Regardless, his medical discoveries form the basis of our understanding of our own hearts and circulatory systems.

http://www.familytreedna.com/public/HARVEY/default.aspx
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Harvey

6. Lyndon B. (LBJ) Johnson (E1b1b1 (E-M35))

Ever thought to yourself, 'Vietnam was a great war. I wish there were someone I could thank for the US involvement in it!' Well, now you can - it's America's 37th president, Democrat LBJ. Once again, the man was of English extraction, though his ancestors clearly couldn't cut it in the homeland. Unlike Hartley and the Wright Brothers, he came from the slightly less superior 'genocidey' branch of the E1b1b family, which he shared with Hitler. No drawing unkind comparisons, please...

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~hjohnson/New%20Index/Pesidential%20DNA/presidential_dna.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyndon_B._Johnson

7. Michelangelo (E1b1b1 (E-M35))

Not the turtle mutant, but rather the chap who painted the Sistine Chapel.

8. Sir David Attenborough (E1b1b1-(M35))

Returning to the English theme, the world's best narrator and nature documentary maker pertains, of course, to the E1b1b clade. Sir David's family hail from Nottinghamshire, which makes him better than you, unless you're also English, but that's superfluous to the point.

http://www.e1b1b1-m35.info/2013/04/sir-david-attenborrough-e1b1b1-m35.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Attenborough

9. Loki (E1b1b1a1 - (EV13))

All hail our Glorious Leader.

Gospodine
12-18-2013, 03:29 PM
6. Lyndon B. (LBJ) Johnson (E1b1b1 (E-M35))

Not surprised about LBJ's result. E-M35 accounts for around 20% of Ashkenazi and Sephardi Y-DNA lineages and there is a persistent rumour he has roots from Sephardic Texan Jews (who arrived as Marranos/Crypto-Conversos from Spain into Spanish Texas); hence his pivotal role in allowing the Israeli attack on the USS Liberty to continue unabated even after direct pleas from the US Navy to intervene (quote/unquote "I want that goddamn ship going to the bottom.") and his diehard support for Israel, which at the time was rather unprecedented for an American President (at least openly).

That is in addition to his highly subversive nature in opening America's borders, collaborating to assassinate JFK and being an all-round Globalist stooge; hence his ancestry comes as absolutely no surprise to me.

Something tells me Fidel Castro would also be some kind of E1b1b carrier too; also, self-admittedly, hailing from Spanish Marranos and not surprisingly being another well-known subversive.

Longbowman
12-18-2013, 03:36 PM
Not surprised about LBJ's result. E-M35 accounts for around 20% of Ashkenazi and Sephardi Y-DNA lineages and there is a persistent rumour he has roots from Sephardic Texan Jews (who arrived as Marranos/Crypto-Conversos from Spain into Spanish Texas); hence his pivotal role in allowing the Israeli attack on the USS Liberty to continue unabated even after direct pleas from the US Navy to intervene (quote/unquote "I want that goddamn ship going to the bottom.") and his diehard support for Israel, which at the time was rather unprecedented for an American President (at least openly).

All that besides is highly subversive nature in opening America's borders, collaborating to assassinate JFK and being an all-round Globalist stooge; and his ancestry is absolutely no surprise to me.

I sincerely doubt this, but moving beyond the conspiracy stuff and focussing on the genetics, Johnson was of paternal English descent and E1b1b is found amongst Jews, but it's not overly common: J is 45%, R is 25%, G is 15%, E is 15% (all values approximate, of course). His being of paternal Jewish descent is simply very unlikely compared to the more obvious explanation that he was just descended from English E1b1b carriers (E1b1b is ~2.5% in England, other examples I gave were Hartley, Attenborough and the Wright Brothers).

Which is not to say I like him, of course.

*Edit* So, the study I could find with the largest number of subjects (442, Behar 2004) on YDNA clades in AJs had these results:

J: 38% (divided evenly between J1 and J2)
R: 17.5% (slightly more R1b than R1a, interestingly)
E: 16.1% (all European (E1b1b))
G: 7.7% (all G2)
Q1b: 5.2%

That totals 85.3%, so I guess the remaining 14.7% would be mainly I with some minor Asian clades.

Tropico
12-18-2013, 03:40 PM
Umm you forgot me. ;)

Longbowman
12-18-2013, 03:40 PM
Umm you forgot me. ;)

Hell, I forgot me.

Tropico
12-18-2013, 03:43 PM
Hell, I forgot me.

The youth of the forum, the future of Earth, the E1b1b kids. The cool kids.

Gospodine
12-18-2013, 03:48 PM
but moving beyond the conspiracy stuff

Uh-oh spaghetti-ohs... dropping the "C" word like an FBI spokesperson.

From a cursory glance, there's actually a lot of parallels in the lives of these seemingly disparate individuals; many of whom were not what they appeared to be and many of whom, we obviously know to have had a profound impact on the course of human history.


Johnson was of paternal English descent

And maternal Jewish descent; there are bonafide public records of his Jewish maternal ancestors. Hence according to Jewish law, he's a Jew.


His being of paternal Jewish descent is simply very unlikely compared to the more obvious explanation that he was just descended from English E1b1b carriers (E1b1b is ~2.5% in England, other examples I gave were Hartley, Attenborough and the Wright Brothers).

Oh that's much more likely... :rolleyes: 2.5%? Holy shit, let me get out my calculator. So E and J are not common Jewish haplogroups despite representing a combined 60% of Jewish Y-DNA lineages according to your rather conservative guesstimates?

Longbowman
12-18-2013, 04:01 PM
[QUOTE]Uh-oh spaghetti-ohs... dropping the "C" word like an FBI spokesperson.

We won't convince each other on this, that's why I'm not engaging in the debate.


From a cursory glance, there's actually a lot of parallels in the lives of these seemingly disparate individuals; many of whom were not what they appeared to be and many of whom, we obviously know to have had a profound impact on the course of human history.


I agree.


And maternal Jewish descent; there are bonafide public records of his Jewish maternal ancestors. Hence according to Jewish law, he's a Jew.


Maternal, not paternal. Your YDNA clade can only come from your father's father's father, etc.


Oh that's much more likely... :rolleyes: 2.5%? Holy shit, let me get out my calculator. So E and J are not common Jewish haplogroups despite representing a combined 60% of Jewish Y-DNA lineages according to your rather conservative guesstimates?

It's much more likely considering his ancestry, you fool :)

Guesstimates? I've posted statistics. If you like I can post the sources.

And yeah, 60% combined, but when J accounts for the overwhelming majority of that...it's like saying, '85% of Britons are R and G' when R is 80%.

Fire Haired
01-18-2014, 09:46 PM
The various strands of Hap. E1b1b as found in Europe constitute the third most common group of YDNA clades in Europe, after the R1 clades (R1a and R1b of course) and the original I clades. It seems to predate R in Europe, R being associated with the Indo-European invasions of c. ~3,000BC and E1b1b being associated with the spread of agriculture during the Neolithic from Anatolia at the latest (c. ~5,500BC). Like I and R, E is found all over Europe - at consistent, but low (normaly <10%) frequencies, with the exceptions of the Balkans where it in places like southern Greece, Macedonia and Albania it approaches 50%, and isolated areas like Galicia where it hits double digits. Anyhow, here's a list of 10 people with the illustrious E1b1b lineage:

1. The Wright Brothers (E1b1b1a2 (V13))

Hailing from North Carolina of English ancestry, the Wright Brothers are known for having a very successful bike shop. These small-business owners are thus role models for all E1b1b Europeans out there. They did spend a little bit too much of their free time dicking around with powered flight and ultimately ended up creating the first aeroplane and putting humanity on its path to the skies and beyond. Sadly neither one ever procreated - possibly, neither one ever even got laid - so their superior E1b1b genes were not passed on to the next generation. Still, noteworthy individuals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wright_Brothers
http://www.wright-dna.org/dna/OtherResults.html

2. Napoleon (E1b1b1c1* (E-M34*))

Looking aside his obvious shortcomings, or shortcomings which is another good pun because he probably had a micropenis, Napoleon was quite noteworthy. Despite being French, he managed to invade most of Europe, except Britain of course. He also invaded Egypt, found the Rosetta Stone, and failed to invade Russia before it was cool. Yes, he was a bit of a bloodthirsty maniac, but still.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleon
http://www.ccsenet.org/journal/index.php/jmbr/article/view/10609

3. Adolf Hitler (E1b1b1 (E-M35))

Continuing the trend of E1b1b being associated with bloodthirsty tyrants (to be clear, Napoleon > Hitler), it seems the Fuehrer himself was E1b1b, which seemed funny to some uninformed people because E1b1b traces back to Africa perhaps as recently as 25,000 years ago and thus Adolf was black, lol. Obviously, this is a bit of a silly point, and E1b1b is found in German and Austrian native populations at an incidence of ~9% (although if you go back far enough, yes, all haplogroups share a common ancestor). The second claim was 'lol he's Jewish lol' because some Jews have E1b1b, but then, a lot more Jews have R1a and R1b. Anyhow, our boy Adolf was famous for being a colossal dickhead and effecting the loss of German East Prussia, Upper Silesia and elsewhere to the Soviets, in addition to his actions resulting in the partitioning of Germany into a Western and Communist zone.

http://www.knack.be/nieuws/wetenschap/hitler-was-verwant-met-somaliers-berbers-en-joden/article-normal-10083.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler

4. Albert Einstein (E1b1b1b2* (E-Z830))

Why yes, possibly the cleverest person ever was a carrier of E1b1b. This is just further proof that E1b1b as carried by Europeans is the superior YDNA haplogroup. For those not in the know, Albie discovered relativity and some other dorky science stuff that probably got him some serious wedgies in Gymnasium.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein
http://www.familytreedna.com/public/G2c/default.aspx?section=ysnp
http://www.haplozone.net/e3b/project/kitnum/N65053

5. William Hartley (E1b1b1c1 (M34))

Basically every E1b1b carrier was either a dictator or a scientist (which makes total sense as they came to Europe as invasive technological innovators), and the second Anglo on the list comes under the second category. Despite being of the superior E1b1b1c1 variety, and being English, Hartley is probably the least well known on this list so far. Regardless, his medical discoveries form the basis of our understanding of our own hearts and circulatory systems.

http://www.familytreedna.com/public/HARVEY/default.aspx
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Harvey

6. Lyndon B. (LBJ) Johnson (E1b1b1 (E-M35))

Ever thought to yourself, 'Vietnam was a great war. I wish there were someone I could thank for the US involvement in it!' Well, now you can - it's America's 37th president, Democrat LBJ. Once again, the man was of English extraction, though his ancestors clearly couldn't cut it in the homeland. Unlike Hartley and the Wright Brothers, he came from the slightly less superior 'genocidey' branch of the E1b1b family, which he shared with Hitler. No drawing unkind comparisons, please...

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~hjohnson/New%20Index/Pesidential%20DNA/presidential_dna.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyndon_B._Johnson

7. Michelangelo (E1b1b1 (E-M35))

Not the turtle mutant, but rather the chap who painted the Sistine Chapel.

8. Sir David Attenborough (E1b1b1-(M35))

Returning to the English theme, the world's best narrator and nature documentary maker pertains, of course, to the E1b1b clade. Sir David's family hail from Nottinghamshire, which makes him better than you, unless you're also English, but that's superfluous to the point.

http://www.e1b1b1-m35.info/2013/04/sir-david-attenborrough-e1b1b1-m35.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Attenborough

9. Loki (E1b1b1a1 - (EV13))

All hail our Glorious Leader.

Adolf Hitler would be very disappointed if he learned he had Y DNA E1b1b, he would probably much rather have a typical Germanic haplogroup like R1b S21, I1, or I2a2. E was probably originally from sub Sahara Africa and it came to Europe with swarthy farmers from the near east not blonde haired and blue eyed "aryans". Maybe he would respect Jews more if he learned was apart of the same ancient lineage as Albert Einstein who was a Jew. Since E1b1b is very rare in Britain and northwest Europe period I am surprised the wright brothers and Lyndon Johnson had E1b1b. MI am very surprised by all the famous E1b1b members. I am sure there were are many more from the Balkans like possibly Alexander the Great. Plenty of Egyptian pharaohs for sure had E1b1b because it dominates north Africa today.

The Y DNA of famous leaders is no different from the peasants, unless there were many royal lines. I know almost nothing about royalty in Europe but click here the house of Bourbon had Y DNA R1b Z31 and I heard from Maciamo that some royal house in Spain had the same haplogroup. It is under "Germanic" R1b S21 and that subclade specifically is very popular in the homeland of the Franks. So I don't maybe Frankish paternal lineages were very popular in royalty throughout Europe.

I always think of E1b1b as a strange foreign haplogroup but my haplogroup R1b L11 traces back to the near east even more recently than yours. It expanded extremely rapidly about 5,000-3,000 years ago possibly with Indo Europeans conquering all the Neolithic descended people like Otzi and Gok4. My haplogroup I think may be under Df27(which is under P312) or is a very rare subclade of R1b L11 or P312. My lineage I think is English but my great grandfather said our family was originally Scotch Irish but my great uncle says he also mentioned English. Either way probably from the Brittonic Celts and migrated along with R1b L21 to Britain.

Longbowman
01-18-2014, 09:52 PM
Adolf Hitler would be very disappointed if he learned he had Y DNA E1b1b, he would probably much rather have a typical Germanic haplogroup like R1b S21, I1, or I2a2. E was probably originally from sub Sahara Africa and it came to Europe with swarthy farmers from the near east not blonde haired and blue eyed "aryans". Maybe he would respect Jews more if he learned was apart of the same ancient lineage as Albert Einstein who was a Jew. Since E1b1b is very rare in Britain and northwest Europe period I am surprised the wright brothers and Lyndon Johnson had E1b1b. MI am very surprised by all the famous E1b1b members. I am sure there were are many more from the Balkans like possibly Alexander the Great. Plenty of Egyptian pharaohs for sure had E1b1b because it dominates north Africa today.

The Y DNA of famous leaders is no different from the peasants, unless there were many royal lines. I know almost nothing about royalty in Europe but click here the house of Bourbon had Y DNA R1b Z31 and I heard from Maciamo that some royal house in Spain had the same haplogroup. It is under "Germanic" R1b S21 and that subclade specifically is very popular in the homeland of the Franks. So I don't maybe Frankish paternal lineages were very popular in royalty throughout Europe.

I always think of E1b1b as a strange foreign haplogroup but my haplogroup R1b L11 traces back to the near east even more recently than yours. It expanded extremely rapidly about 5,000-3,000 years ago possibly with Indo Europeans conquering all the Neolithic descended people like Otzi and Gok4. My haplogroup I think may be under Df27(which is under P312) or is a very rare subclade of R1b L11 or P312. My lineage I think is English but my great grandfather said our family was originally Scotch Irish but my great uncle says he also mentioned English. Either way probably from the Brittonic Celts and migrated along with R1b L21 to Britain.

Alexander was probably E1b1b considering where he was from but he had no descendants and we don't have his body so we can't know. These are just proven examples, I'm sure there have been plenty more (Tesla, maybe?) especially, as you say, in the Balkans, where we're the majority. Most Pharaohs were E1b1b although Tutankhamun was apparently R1b. E1b1b isn't particularly Jewish though it is not uncommon in Jews (~20%) - it's far more common in the Balkans where it peaks in Kosovo at ~55%. It's found throughout Europe even in Britain (there's an E1b1b1c clade unique to the British Isles, for example) at around 2-3.5% and Southern Scandinavia. But yeah, perhaps he would have done - we'll never know.

R1b is common throughout Western Europe, yes - but as you say, it's invasive, and more recent than E1b1b or even G and J in Europe. E1b1b and I have just been marginalised by the incredible success of R1a and R1b.

Smeagol
01-18-2014, 09:56 PM
Alexander was probably E1b1b considering where he was from

He was probably R1a. Also, E1b1b, has nothing to do with sub-saharan africans, it's West Eurasian.

Cleitus
01-18-2014, 09:57 PM
You forgot to add me to

Longbowman
01-18-2014, 09:59 PM
He was probably R1a. Also, E1b1b, has nothing to do with sub-saharan africans, it's West Eurasian.

Also a possibility. Statistically I'd put money on E1b1b but R1a would be my number 2 choice. Maybe I2.

The Illyrian Warrior
01-18-2014, 10:00 PM
I see all great minds have carried this oldest dating European haplogroup.....Proud being part among the bests. :)

Longbowman
01-18-2014, 10:00 PM
You forgot to add me to

I would have done if I'd know your Y-DNA ;)

Longbowman
01-18-2014, 10:00 PM
I see all great minds have carried this oldest dating European haplogroup.....Proud being part among the bests. :)

All the great minds...and Hitler :P

Cleitus
01-18-2014, 10:00 PM
I would have done if I'd know your Y-DNA ;)

E-V13

The Illyrian Warrior
01-18-2014, 10:01 PM
All the great minds...and Hitler :P

Well, can't say he wasn't but he used in wrong way. :p

Fire Haired
01-18-2014, 10:04 PM
We conquered you guys back in the bronze age. This thread tells me there are to many of unpure and inferior E1b1b people left and are making an effect on our society. The only answer is extermination of all non R1b L11 lineages. Our ancestors thought they exterminated the inferior lineages in west Europe but that was before DNA was discovered. After exterminated all non R1b L11 lineages we must make the Basque language extinct since it is not an Indo European language. Hitler had some good ideas but he himself was not a pure Aryan, he was practically a Jew so my great grandfather killed him. There are so many inferior peoples in America many it sickens me. Some are not even European!!!!

This is a E1b1b slave my uncle in Germany executed because he asked for his freedom and claimed not all greatness comes from western Indo Europeans.
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=43506&d=1390085364

Longbowman
01-18-2014, 10:07 PM
We conquered you guys back in the bronze age. This thread tells me there are to many of unpure and inferior E1b1b people left and are making an effect on our society. The only answer is extermination of all non R1b L11 lineages. Our ancestors thought they exterminated the inferior lineages in west Europe but that was before DNA was discovered. After exterminated all non R1b L11 lineages we must make the Basque language extinct since it is not an Indo European language. Hitler had some good ideas but he himself was not a pure Aryan, he was practically a Jew so my great grandfather killed him. There are so many inferior peoples in America many it sickens me. Some are not even European!!!!

This is a E1b1b slave my uncle in Germany executed because he asked for his freedom and claimed not all greatness comes from western Indo Europeans.
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=43506&d=1390085364

You think you can stop us? We have the military genius of Napoleon and the scientific brilliance of Einstein. Wir sind der waehre Herrenvolk!

Buddy up with your Indian brethren, we'll use our Arabic and African hordes. It's crunch time, punks.

Oneeye
01-18-2014, 10:08 PM
http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af164/AnthroBot/gif/1321857736080.gif (http://media.photobucket.com/user/AnthroBot/media/gif/1321857736080.gif.html)

Fire Haired
01-18-2014, 10:08 PM
Can everyone here with E1b1b give me their address so I can kill you and prevent you from passing on an inferior lineage? I usually kill inferior people with a long sword or if I want the job done quickly I use an assault rifle.

The Illyrian Warrior
01-18-2014, 10:11 PM
He was probably R1a. Also, E1b1b, has nothing to do with sub-saharan africans, it's West Eurasian.

Probability Alexander the Great being more R1a compared with E1b1b is slim, first reason is him being in epicenter of E1b1b where he was born, second as study says which I found interesting about E1b1b is those personalities who carried this subclade were either genius (Alexander had reputation of being extraordinary in military strategy skills) or dictator like Hitler was, even in this case you need high intelligence or special skills to have in control entire population also backing you up.

Longbowman
01-18-2014, 10:12 PM
Probability Alexander the Great being more R1a compared with E1b1b is slim, first reason is him being in epicenter of E1b1b where he was born, second as study says which I found interesting about E1b1b is those personalities who carried this subclade were either genius (Alexander had reputation of being extraordinary in military strategy skills) or dictator like Hitler was, even in this case you need high intelligence or skill to have in control entire population also backing you up.

All great military commanders were E1b1b. All great scientists and inventors, too.

The Illyrian Warrior
01-18-2014, 10:22 PM
All great military commanders were E1b1b. All great scientists and inventors, too.

Which says alot. :)

Interesting enough, my country Kosova is a hot-spot even in Balkans for carrier of this subclades and at same time having the highest in Europe.
http://imageshack.com/a/img34/9263/cruh.png

Oneeye
01-18-2014, 10:27 PM
http://www.quickmeme.com/img/a4/a4e9e1ed79931b0d6ef90512e0dad1e283e0b8e98be193e109 80d189c78b33b6.jpg

The Illyrian Warrior
01-18-2014, 10:40 PM
Don't go any further than here, how come most creative, intelligent and universal members are E1b1b carrier (not trying to praise myself here since I don't know my Y-DNA for sure). :)

Fire Haired
01-18-2014, 10:42 PM
You think you can stop us? We have the military genius of Napoleon and the scientific brilliance of Einstein. Wir sind der waehre Herrenvolk!

Buddy up with your Indian brethren, we'll use our Arabic and African hordes. It's crunch time, punks.

Indian brethren????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I refuse to even speak to those darkies. They have a lot of R1a Z93 because our Indo European relatives used their women for pleasure when they were not killing inferior races or creating civilization. After they pleasured themselves with Indian women of their choose, they usually killed the women but some escaped and gave birth to mutts. Arabs would be a challenging they did conquer almost all of the middle east and north Africa. During the Crusades if you impure Europeans didn't get in our way there wouldn't be any Arabs today. I will buddy up with Slavs and Balts.

Longbowman
01-18-2014, 10:48 PM
Indian brethren????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I refuse to even speak to those darkies. They have a lot of R1a Z93 because our Indo European relatives used their women for pleasure when they were not killing inferior races or creating civilization. After they pleasured themselves with Indian women of their choose, they usually killed the women but some escaped and gave birth to mutts. Arabs would be a challenging they did conquer almost all of the middle east and north Africa. During the Crusades if you impure Europeans didn't get in our way there wouldn't be any Arabs today. I will buddy up with Slavs and Balts.

Know that between 2 and 10% of non-Balkan populations are E1b1b. You'll have saboteurs round every corner. Muahaha!

The Illyrian Warrior
01-18-2014, 10:56 PM
Know that between 2 and 10% of non-Balkan populations are E1b1b. You'll have saboteurs round every corner. Muahaha!

Balkans is no route for R1a/b carrier, we make their life a living hell if they dare to cross on us....Great warriors mixing with geniuses is lethal combo for every single one. Also us being the first in Europe, I don't think they're in position to feel themselves as privileged in our continent, bro. :cool:

Fire Haired
01-18-2014, 11:01 PM
He was probably R1a. Also, E1b1b, has nothing to do with sub-saharan africans, it's West Eurasian.
There are a lot of possibilities, E1b1b is much more popular than R1a in the Balkans so more likely E1b1b. Y DNA E itself probably originated in sub Sahara Africa.

Fire Haired
01-18-2014, 11:03 PM
All great military commanders were E1b1b. All great scientists and inventors, too.

in reality there is a little chance your Y DNA haplogroup effects your character.

Longbowman
01-18-2014, 11:04 PM
in reality there is a little chance your Y DNA haplogroup effects your character.

Indeed.

The Illyrian Warrior
01-18-2014, 11:06 PM
in reality there is a little chance your Y DNA haplogroup effects your character.

But it does affect each individuals to some extent mentality and personality wise.

Longbowman
01-18-2014, 11:08 PM
But it does affect each individuals to some extent mentality and personality wise.

It's around 1% of your autosomal genetics. Your Y-DNA determines your masculine sexual traits, I believe, so it's quite important. Indirectly, then, it has a huge effect, but not a direct one.

The Illyrian Warrior
01-18-2014, 11:14 PM
It's around 1% of your autosomal genetics. Your Y-DNA determines your masculine sexual traits, I believe, so it's quite important. Indirectly, then, it has a huge effect, but not a direct one.

I think it does affect our life more than we might think, still we don't know genetic good enough how it works to come in final conclusion, also seeing great minds carry out this sub-clades wouldn't call a coincidence or something to be ignored about the role of Y-DNA in human personality.

Fire Haired
01-18-2014, 11:27 PM
But it does affect each individuals to some extent mentality and personality wise.

Do you have evidence?

Fire Haired
01-18-2014, 11:28 PM
It's around 1% of your autosomal genetics. Your Y-DNA determines your masculine sexual traits, I believe, so it's quite important. Indirectly, then, it has a huge effect, but not a direct one.

The percentage in overall ancestry varies and is complicated. I doubt Y DNA effects your masculine sexual traits or anything else.

Longbowman
01-18-2014, 11:29 PM
The percentage in overall ancestry varies and is complicated. I doubt Y DNA effects your masculine sexual traits or anything else.

I think it does. It's what separates us from women.

The Illyrian Warrior
01-18-2014, 11:29 PM
Do you have evidence?

Look my above post what I've said, and go on first page to get a clue what I've talked about.

cally
01-19-2014, 12:04 AM
David Attenborough is awesome :thumb001:

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 12:05 AM
David Attenborough is awesome :thumb001:

Because he's E1b1b ;)

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 01:33 AM
I think it does. It's what separates us from women.
I know our Y chromosome that still doesn't mean people with Eb1b have different personalities than people with R1b.

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 01:34 AM
Because he's E1b1b ;)

He isn't anymore because I just chopped his head off and sacrificed him to Celtic gods who have R1b L11. One down millions to go.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 01:45 AM
He isn't anymore because I just chopped his head off and sacrificed him to Celtic gods who have R1b L11. One down millions to go.

There are probably about 900 million of us. Good luck, R1b suckhole. The Celtic Gods are cognates of the more famous E1b1b Greek Gods anyway. For Zeus!

Jackson
01-19-2014, 02:30 AM
Troublemakers the lot of you. Coming here, taking our U women, and genociding!! And even farming! :mad:Terrible.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 02:33 AM
Troublemakers the lot of you. Coming here, taking our U women, and genociding!! And even farming! :mad:Terrible.

Can't we team up against those bastard R1bs and R1as? They did exactly the same EXCEPT on a much larger scale AND they didn't introduce any farming! :mad:

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 02:40 AM
There are probably about 900 million of us. Good luck, R1b suckhole.


Where coming for you E1b1b people. You can't hide behind those shields forever. We are nearly 50% of west Europeans.
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=43513&d=1390102622

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 02:41 AM
Where coming for you E1b1b people. You can't hide behind those shields forever. We are nearly 50% of west Europeans.
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=43513&d=1390102622

We're North Africa, the Balkans, 10% of Iberians...we have people in every corner of the globe. We're the innovators, the scientists, the generals, the presidents. For E1b1b!

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 03:11 AM
Troublemakers the lot of you. Coming here, taking our U women, and genociding!! And even farming! :mad:Terrible.

Y DNA I still exists? You are like an endangered species, first me and my R1b L11 brothers will put you guys in a zoo and then sacrifice you to our gods.

Maybe the farmers had similar traditions when it comes to conquered women as we do. We kill practically all that are not between the ages of 14-34 or just not attractive. We take the sexually attractive ones and do as we please. There isn't much U5, U4, U*, and U2e in Neolithic European mtDNA so they probably killed off most of your women also. I don't think the farmers conquered you guys because their weak cowards.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 03:13 AM
Y DNA I still exists? You are like an endangered species, first me and my R1b L11 brothers will put you guys in a zoo and then sacrifice you to our gods.

Maybe the farmers had similar traditions when it comes to conquered women as we do. We kill practically all that are not between the ages of 14-34 or just not attractive. We take the sexually attractive ones and do as we please. There isn't much U5, U4, U*, and U2e in Neolithic European mtDNA so they probably killed off most of your women also. I don't think the farmers conquered you guys because their weak cowards.

K is an offshoot of U though. Added together they're 20% or so.

Kale
01-19-2014, 03:20 AM
Excellent thread. You've listed, whether they used it for good or evil, 10 brilliant minds of history, proudly sporting their E1b1b glory.

I've already written the sequel to this thread...

"Noteworthy Europeans with YDNA Haplogroup R1"
Everybody else who's ever done anything ever except for those 10 guys that other guy said.
:p

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 03:22 AM
Excellent thread. You've listed, whether they used it for good or evil, 10 brilliant minds of history, proudly sporting their E1b1b glory.

I've already written the sequel to this thread...

"Noteworthy Europeans with YDNA Haplogroup R1"
Everybody else who's ever done anything ever except for those 10 guys that other guy said.
:p

Haha, link :)

Of course there were doubtless hundreds of other guys (such as Alex the Great) we just can't prove it. We don't have DNA samples for everyone, sadly.

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 03:23 AM
We're North Africa, the Balkans, 10% of Iberians...we have people in every corner of the globe. We're the innovators, the scientists, the generals, the presidents. For E1b1b!

How many people live in north Africa? Its a lifeless desert, you and ten guys named Mohammed can't do much. There are many of us in the USA, Germany, France, UK, Ireland, many powerful nations. If you want a war against people with mainly Indo European descended Y DNA you have to also mess with Russia. At all times even when you go to get your mourning tea are surrounded by R1b L11. Your teachers, friends, relatives, random people you see on the street, girlfriend's father, etc. we are the majority in Britain.

United E1b1b army of north Africa.
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=43514&d=1390105396

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 03:24 AM
How many people live in north Africa? Its a lifeless desert, you and ten guys named Mohammed can't do much. There are many of us in the USA, Germany, France, UK, Ireland, many powerful nations. If you want a war against people with mainly Indo European descended Y DNA you have to also mess with Russia. At all times even when you go to get your mourning tea are surrounded by R1b L11. Your teachers, friends, relatives, random people you see on the street, girlfriend's father, etc. we are the majority in Britain.

United E1b1b army of north Africa.
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=43514&d=1390105396

Ten suicide bombers named Mohammed. We'll strike fear into your hearts.

Also, North Africa has like 200,000,000 people.

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 03:25 AM
Haha, link :)

Of course there were doubtless hundreds of other guys (such as Alex the Great) we just can't prove it. We don't have DNA samples for everyone, sadly.

E1b1b is a small minority in most of Europe so not many great ones. Maybe you will find some famous E1b1b people in north Africa. King Tut was R1b, sorry.

Kale
01-19-2014, 03:27 AM
Fun fact: If the USA stopped exporting food, 500 million Africans would die in one year. GF HG E.

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 03:29 AM
Ten suicide bombers named Mohammed. We'll strike fear into your hearts.

Also, North Africa has like 200,000,000 people.

I never said anything about suicide bombers, raciest!!!!!! There are probably more nukes in R1 dominated nations than bombs in north Africa. You might kill a few hundred of us but we will exterminate you all.
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=43515&d=1390105764

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 03:30 AM
Fun fact: If the USA stopped exporting food, 500 million Africans would die in one year. GF HG E.

What evidence do you have 500 million would die. I do think Americans and westerns give away a lot.

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 03:31 AM
K is an offshoot of U though. Added together they're 20% or so.

There is a lot of non European U one of those is K aka U8b2. I just realized were both members of haplogroup U, don't hate you as much as when I only though of your dirty and sandy E1b1b.

Kale
01-19-2014, 03:31 AM
I forget where I heard it. It was in school though. So there's about a 3% chance its right!

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 03:34 AM
I forget where I heard it. It was in school though. So there's about a 3% chance its right!

I am sure it helps Africans a lot.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 03:40 AM
There is a lot of non European U one of those is K aka U8b2. I just realized were both members of haplogroup U, don't hate you as much as when I only though of your dirty and sandy E1b1b.

Yes, I have indigenous European mtDNA, just like Oetzi.

But hey! E1b1b is more indigenous than R1b is.

Overall I am more indigenous than you are to these shores.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 03:59 AM
More E1b1b European superhumans:

Benito Mussolini (E-M35 (E1b1b1))

Continuing the trend of fascist dictators being from the E1b1b superclade, we have Italian dictator and creator of Il Fascismo, Il Duce, who made the trains run on time and didn't believe in the concept of a pure race. The man presided over the strongest period in the history of modern Italy. He then lost it all. Fun fact: my cousin won the MC fighting Mussolini in Italy.

http://hamitic.wordpress.com/famous-hamitics-persons-of-halopgroup-e/#Mussolini
www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benito_Mussolini

The Borghese family (E-M35 (E1b1b1))

The Borghese family, which was the most powerful in Italy in the 15th and 16th centuries and included Popes, dukes, senators, socialites, and murderers, was E-M35 too.

www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borghese_Family

Johann Korn

FF Coppola (E-M35 (E1b1b1))

The director of the Godfather films, sometimes considered the best ever made, was also of the might E1b1b1 clan - the clade of innovators and artistic geniuses. The man won5 academy awards and 2 palme d'ors.

www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Ford_Coppola

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 04:10 AM
Yes, I have indigenous European mtDNA, just like Oetzi.

But hey! E1b1b is more indigenous than R1b is.

Overall I am more indigenous than you are to these shores.

E1b1b has been in Europe longer than R1b. K though came in the Neolithic while my lineage U5 has been in Europe for well over 30,000 years(proven by ancient mtDNA). Just because you have mtDNA U doesn't mean it descends from European hunter gatherers. Overall we probably have around the same percentages of hunter gatherer ancestry. My dad scored 40% med and 35% north European in Geno 2.0.

Loschbour, the Motolas, and St. Forvar genomes are the most ingenious European. Below is Loschbour's skull.
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=43516&d=1390108159

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 04:15 AM
More E1b1b European superhumans:

Benito Mussolini (E-M35 (E1b1b1))

Continuing the trend of fascist dictators being from the E1b1b superclade, we have Italian dictator and creator of Il Fascismo, Il Duce, who made the trains run on time and didn't believe in the concept of a pure race. The man presided over the strongest period in the history of modern Italy. He then lost it all. Fun fact: my cousin won the MC fighting Mussolini in Italy.

http://hamitic.wordpress.com/famous-hamitics-persons-of-halopgroup-e/#Mussolini
www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benito_Mussolini (http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benito_Mussolini)

The Borghese family (E-M35 (E1b1b1))

The Borghese family, which was the most powerful in Italy in the 15th and 16th centuries and included Popes, dukes, senators, socialites, and murderers, was E-M35 too.

www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borghese_Family (http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borghese_Family)

Johann Korn

FF Coppola (E-M35 (E1b1b1))

The director of the Godfather films, sometimes considered the best ever made, was also of the might E1b1b1 clan - the clade of innovators and artistic geniuses. The man won5 academy awards and 2 palme d'ors.

www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Ford_Coppola (http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Ford_Coppola)

Mussolini and Hitler had M35!!!!!!!! They probably both heirs of some evil ruler, like Alexander the Great.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 04:23 AM
E1b1b has been in Europe longer than R1b. K though came in the Neolithic while my lineage U5 has been in Europe for well over 30,000 years(proven by ancient mtDNA). Just because you have mtDNA U doesn't mean it descends from European hunter gatherers. Overall we probably have around the same percentages of hunter gatherer ancestry. My dad scored 40% med and 35% north European in Geno 2.0.

Loschbour, the Motolas, and St. Forvar genomes are the most ingenious European. Below is Loschbour's skull.
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=43516&d=1390108159

Yes, U5 is indigenous, but most K is also indigenous (as you know, K is a descendant of U).

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 05:50 AM
Yes, U5 is indigenous, but most K is also indigenous (as you know, K is a descendant of U).
K came to Europe in the Neolithic. mtDNA U=European hunter gatherer is incorrect.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 11:38 AM
K came to Europe in the Neolithic. mtDNA U=European hunter gatherer is incorrect.

K is pretty young (12,000 years), it could have come in during the Neolithic, true. Still it peaks in Western Europe (France, Belgium, UK).

The Illyrian Warrior
01-19-2014, 12:19 PM
E1b1b are smart enough to manipulate hordes of brainless R1a/b, and when there is a need for back up can count on deadly warriors straight from Balkans and elsewhere.

Wouldn't wish on anyone to mess with super-intelligent people who build ancient Egypt, Greece, Roman & Byzantine empire, neither can't mess with deadly war-like superior build up body....Its just to much. ;)

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 01:28 PM
K is pretty young (12,000 years), it could have come in during the Neolithic, true. Still it peaks in Western Europe (France, Belgium, UK).

Doubt its that young since there are plenty of over 7,000 years old K1a samples in Europe. There are also some K samples that are around 9,000 years old in Syria. Just do a little research on ancient European mtDNA and you will see it is obvious K came in the Neolithic.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 01:37 PM
Doubt its that young since there are plenty of over 7,000 years old K1a samples in Europe. There are also some K samples that are around 9,000 years old in Syria. Just do a little research on ancient European mtDNA and you will see it is obvious K came in the Neolithic.

A good spread over 7,000 years ago is too old for the Neolithic. K1a pride :)

Allegedly K arose in Western Asia. Do you have any good sources on the issue?

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 05:57 PM
A good spread over 7,000 years ago is too old for the Neolithic. K1a pride :)

Allegedly K arose in Western Asia. Do you have any good sources on the issue?

Just do a tiny little bit of research on Neolithic Europe and you will learn many areas of Europe were already farming 7,000 years ago, we have their mtDNA and plenty had K1a. K1a along with many other haplogroups that are common in modern Europeans are absent in pre historic European hunter gatherers but common in pre historic European farmers. I know that K basically only exists in west Asia, Europe, and north Africa and I know it came from west Asia to Europe in the Neolithic so it definitely didn't originate in Europe. I don't know anything about K in north Africa so I guess that is a possibly place of origin. Overall west Eurasian mtDNA haplogroups are usually more diverse in west Asia so I am assuming K is also and that it originated there.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 06:02 PM
Just do a tiny little bit of research on Neolithic Europe and you will learn many areas of Europe were already farming 7,000 years ago, we have their mtDNA and plenty had K1a. K1a along with many other haplogroups that are common in modern Europeans are absent in pre historic European hunter gatherers but common in pre historic European farmers. I know that K basically only exists in west Asia, Europe, and north Africa and I know it came from west Asia to Europe in the Neolithic so it definitely didn't originate in Europe. I don't know anything about K in north Africa so I guess that is a possibly place of origin. Overall west Eurasian mtDNA haplogroups are usually more diverse in west Asia so I am assuming K is also and that it originated there.

Conflicting evidence. K comes from U8 which is common among Basques. Some think it's from Italy.


Haplogroup U8[edit]
U8a: The Basques have the most ancestral phylogeny in Europe for the mitochondrial haplogroup U8a, a rare subgroup of U8, placing the Basque origin of this lineage in the Upper Palaeolithic. The lack of U8a lineages in Africa suggests that their ancestors may have originated from West Asia.[5]
U8b: This clade has been found in Italy and Jordan.[5]
Haplogroup K[edit]
Haplogroup K makes up a sizeable fraction of European and West Asian mtDNA lineages. It is now known it is actually a subclade of haplogroup U8b'K,[5] and is believed to have first arisen in northeastern Italy. Haplogroup UK shows some evidence of being highly protective against AIDS progression.[21]


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_U_(mtDNA)#Haplogroup_U8

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 06:15 PM
As you can see, K is commoner in Britain and Northwest Europe than anywhere else:

http://www.vizachero.com/images/hapKmap.png

which make sense as it comes from also-western U8.

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 06:56 PM
As you can see, K is commoner in Britain and Northwest Europe than anywhere else:

http://www.vizachero.com/images/hapKmap.png

which make sense as it comes from also-western U8.

Maciamo made a very informative article about mtDNA K on Eupedia click here (http://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_K_mtDNA.shtml) to view. U8b2=K not U8=K, mtDNA U8 has been found in a 31,155 year old mtDNA sample in Czech republic along with two pre U5's but that doesn't mean K probably originated in Europe. Maciamo says your subclade is one of three typical Jewish ones and ma major subclade in Ashkenazi Jews who have about 30% K. My Nazi grandfather would kill me if he knew I was posting to a Jew.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 07:00 PM
Maciamo made a very informative article about mtDNA K on Eupedia click here (http://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_K_mtDNA.shtml) to view. U8b2=K not U8=K, mtDNA U8 has been found in a 31,155 year old mtDNA sample in Czech republic along with two pre U5's but that doesn't mean K probably originated in Europe. Maciamo says your subclade is one of three typical Jewish ones and ma major subclade in Ashkenazi Jews who have about 30% K. My Nazi grandfather would kill me if he knew I was posting to a Jew.

K1a1b1a is basically exclusively Jewish but it's also basically exclusively European Jewish. Genetically it's European: http://www.nature.com/ncomms/2013/131008/ncomms3543/full/ncomms3543.html

It's actually the largest of four clades - all European - that are responsible for 40% of AJ/SJ maternal ancestry.

Maciamo's article is good but as I say, it remains undecided whether K is European or West Asian. Certainly it's most common in the West, but so it R1b, which is also West Asian in origin. What is certain is most of the subclades developed in Europe as opposed to outside it.

Your Nazi grandfather is cordially invited to come to England and fight my British Army veteran grandfather. Although it would be funnier if he fought my European Jewish WWII refugee grandfather.

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 07:02 PM
There is Mesolithic sample from Blätterhöhle, Germany(8652 ± 58 BC) that is reported as U/K. I wonder if that means it had the ancestral form of K or if it was K. Doubt it was K and if it is not ancestral to most K in Europe today.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 07:03 PM
There is Mesolithic sample from Blätterhöhle, Germany(8652 ± 58 BC) that is reported as U/K. I wonder if that means it had the ancestral form of K or if it was K. Doubt it was K and if it is not ancestral to most K in Europe today.

Regardless it would show K in Europe predates 5,000BC significantly. Remember it's the descendant of U.

HellLander87
01-19-2014, 07:06 PM
K was found in mesolithic Greece.

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 07:10 PM
K1a1b1a is basically exclusively Jewish but it's also basically exclusively European Jewish. Genetically it's European: http://www.nature.com/ncomms/2013/131008/ncomms3543/full/ncomms3543.html

It's actually the largest of four clades - all European - that are responsible for 40% of AJ/SJ maternal ancestry.

Maciamo's article is good but as I say, it remains undecided whether K is European or West Asian. Certainly it's most common in the West, but so it R1b, which is also West Asian in origin. What is certain is most of the subclades developed in Europe as opposed to outside it..



K1a1b1a might have originally been European it is still a more typically Jewish haplogroup even though they got through inter marriage originally. Maybe K originated in Europe(really doubt it) but most K including K1a came in the Neolithic. I am basing my opinion on ancient mtDNA I don't know enough about modern distribution to say anything.


Your Nazi grandfather is cordially invited to come to England and fight my British Army veteran grandfather. Although it would be funnier if he fought my European Jewish WWII refugee grandfather.

I think he would rather fight the Jewish one but he still has bad blood for British. They came so close to defeating Britain and creating an unstoppable German empire.

Pretty much everyone fought during WWII in Britain right? I was joking about having the Nazi grandfather that would be cool if I did though. Most German Americans or children of German immigrants surprisingly supported America over Germany during WWI and WWII.

HellLander87
01-19-2014, 07:12 PM
German Americans or children of German immigrants surprisingly supported America over Germany in WWI and WWII.
These people are called traitors.

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 07:15 PM
These people are called traitors.

They supported their new country. I think most saw how evil the Nazis were and in WWI the Germans were still not the good guys.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 07:16 PM
K1a1b1a might have originally been European it is still a more typically Jewish haplogroup even though they got through inter marriage originally. Maybe K originated in Europe(really doubt it) but most K including K1a came in the Neolithic. I am basing my opinion on ancient mtDNA I don't know enough about modern distribution to say anything.



I think he would rather fight the Jewish one but he still has bad blood for British. They came so close to defeating Britain and creating an unstoppable German empire.

Pretty much everyone fought during WWII in Britain right? I was joking about having the Nazi grandfather that would be cool if I did though. Most German Americans or children of German immigrants surprisingly supported America over Germany during WWI and WWII.

Ethnically European Jews are more European than they are Levantine, although their European DNA isn't overwhelming (50-60%). Maternally it's 80-90%. K1a1b1a is Western European in origin.

Hey, why should we have let Germany create an unstoppable empire? We're the champions of having Empires. Screw your imaginary Nazi grandfather.

Yes, pretty much every male (and some females) of fighting age, minus 10-15%, most of which were miners. Miners got draft exemption because we needed the raw materials.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 07:17 PM
These people are called traitors.

If an immigrant came to your country but supported their country of origin in a war you'd call them a traitor. If you call America your home, America comes first.

Fire Haired
01-19-2014, 07:23 PM
Ethnically European Jews are more European than they are Levantine, although their European DNA isn't overwhelming (50-60%). Maternally it's 80-90%. K1a1b1a is Western European in origin.

Hey, why should we have let Germany create an unstoppable empire? We're the champions of having Empires. Screw your imaginary Nazi grandfather.

Yes, pretty much every male (and some females) of fighting age, minus 10-15%, most of which were miners. Miners got draft exemption because we needed the raw materials.

In admixtures European, north African, and Yemenite Jews usually look close to 40% Palestinian. That study that claims 80-90% of their maternal lineages are European is very debatable. I though Jewisness was passed down from the mother, so that wouldn't make any sense.

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 07:27 PM
In admixtures European, north African, and Yemenite Jews usually look close to 40% Palestinian. That study that claims 80-90% of their maternal lineages are European is very debatable. I though Jewisness was passed down from the mother, so that wouldn't make any sense.

40% Levantine*. Most of the remaining 60% is European and most of that is maternal.

Judaism has only been passed down maternally since the 1300s. Before that it was paternal; Karaite Jews still use the paternal method. Furthermore, once you convert to Judaism, you're a full Jew, so assuming the women converted to Judaism there'd have been no problem anyway: remember during the 1st and 2nd centuries the Jews converted millions of Roman citizens.

kabeiros
01-19-2014, 07:42 PM
*Edit* So, the study I could find with the largest number of subjects (442, Behar 2004) on YDNA clades in AJs had these results:

J: 38% (divided evenly between J1 and J2)
R: 17.5% (slightly more R1b than R1a, interestingly)
E: 16.1% (all European (E1b1b))
G: 7.7% (all G2)
Q1b: 5.2%

That totals 85.3%, so I guess the remaining 14.7% would be mainly I with some minor Asian clades. I have the Behar paper, this are the y-dna haplogroups of Askenazi Jews (442 samples):

E(xE1b1b) : 3 (0.7%)
E1b1b : 87 (19.7%)
F: 4 (0.9%)
G(xG2a) : 33 (7.7%) - mostly G2c but some G1 too
G2a : 9 (2,2%)
I : 18 (4.1%)
J1 : 84 (19.0%)
J2 : 84 (19.0%)
T : 9 (2.0%)
L : 1 (0.2%)
P (xQ1b, R1): 2 (0.5%) - probably R2 or Q1a
Q1b : 23 (5.2%)
R1 (xR1a,R1b) : 6 (1.4%) - R1 is the parental haplogroup of R1a and R1b and is extremely rare nowadays, scarcely found in central Asia and south west Asia
R1a : 33 (7.5%)
R1b : 44 (10.0%)

kabeiros
01-19-2014, 07:49 PM
What I find interesting about Ashkenazi y-dna is some rare haplogroups that they share with Iranians and Afghanis (G2c, Q1b1a, R1*, R1a-Z2122). Is this an ancient connection of Jews and Persians or more recent and related to Khazars (who most probably were an amalgamation of Turkic and Iranian tribes)?

Longbowman
01-19-2014, 07:53 PM
What I find interesting about Ashkenazi y-dna is some rare haplogroups that they share with Iranians and Afghanis (G2c, Q1b1a, R1*, R1a-Z2122). Is this an ancient connection of Jews and Persians or more recent and related to Khazars (who most probably were an amalgamation of Turkic and Iranian tribes)?

Some studies suggest Jews are more closely related to northern ME groups such as Indo-Europeans like Armenians than to southern Levantines, so perhaps. It ties in with the origin myth of descent from Ur of the Chaldees via the southern Caucus. Regardless by your stats they seem pan-Mediterranean with an Eastern focus and some Caucasian input, inkeeping with a Levantine group subjected to a lot of European admixture (25-40%) plus some later 'Khazar' and Asian admixture.

MINARDOWICZ
02-17-2014, 03:41 PM
The youth of the forum, the future of Earth, the E1b1b kids. The cool kids.

DOOOOON'T HOP SKIDDELY INSULT ME MADAR CHOOOODDD!

AndreasMeyer
02-17-2014, 04:39 PM
The various strands of Hap. E1b1b as found in Europe constitute the third most common group of YDNA clades in Europe, after the R1 clades (R1a and R1b of course) and the original I clades. It seems to predate R in Europe, R being associated with the Indo-European invasions of c. ~3,000BC and E1b1b being associated with the spread of agriculture during the Neolithic from Anatolia at the latest (c. ~5,500BC). Like I and R, E is found all over Europe - at consistent, but low (normaly <10%) frequencies, with the exceptions of the Balkans where it in places like southern Greece, Macedonia and Albania it approaches 50%, and isolated areas like Galicia where it hits double digits. Anyhow, here's a list of 10 people with the illustrious E1b1b lineage:....
I'd get how they determined this for the recent examples. But how did they do that for the examples that are not recent?

Were they guessing?

Longbowman
02-17-2014, 05:05 PM
I'd get how they determined this for the recent examples. But how did they do that for the examples that are not recent?

Were they guessing?

No.

A lot of it is ascertained by sequencing the genomes of skeletons from ancient sites. Or analysis of population genetics.

AndreasMeyer
02-17-2014, 05:16 PM
No.

A lot of it is ascertained by sequencing the genomes of skeletons from ancient sites. Or analysis of population genetics.
With the skeleton I can follow, but population genetics. What, if that individual was kind of an exception?

Longbowman
02-17-2014, 05:18 PM
With the skeleton I can follow, but population genetics. What, if that individual was kind of an exception?

Say if every Icelander were R1b, we could tell most original Icelanders were R1b.

Hanibalas Lekteris
02-17-2014, 05:24 PM
E: 16.1% (all European (E1b1b))


E-M34 isn't exactly a clade I'd label "European", same thing for E-V22.

Longbowman
02-17-2014, 05:27 PM
E-M34 isn't exactly a clade I'd label "European", same thing for E-V22.

Caucasoid is probably more accurate. Still both those haplogroups have European subclades.

Fire Haired
02-17-2014, 05:27 PM
With the skeleton I can follow, but population genetics. What, if that individual was kind of an exception?

When it gets constant you know that first individual you tested was not an exception. A Mesolithic man from England(Cheddar man) was found to be a member of mtDNA U5 back in 1999(human genetics through DNA at that time was very young and probably not many in the public knew about it) and I am pretty sure at that time he was the first or one of the first mtDNA samples from a pre historic European hunter gatherer. We now know he was not an exception because the majority of mtDNA samples of pre historic European hunter gatherers from many different sites all acroos Europe have U5.

Fire Haired
02-17-2014, 05:34 PM
Caucasoid is probably more accurate.

I prefer west Eurasian, Caucasoid is offensive and if you prefer Caucasoid your a raciest troll and should be banned.

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=44653&d=1392662031

AndreasMeyer
02-17-2014, 05:35 PM
Say if every Icelander were R1b, we could tell most original Icelanders were R1b.
That would be an educated guess, but we are also talking about individuals in the distant past here. And the haplogroup of a certain individual in the past would be another educated guess. It's different from having an actual blood sample at hand.

Longbowman
02-17-2014, 05:35 PM
I prefer west Eurasian, Caucasoid is offensive and if you prefer Caucasoid your a raciest troll and should be banned.

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=44653&d=1392662031

BRB banning myself.

E1b1b1c1a, for example (my clade) has Levantine, European, and European-Jewish subclades, so Caucasoid is the most accurate.

Longbowman
02-17-2014, 05:37 PM
That would be an educated guess, but we are also talking about individuals in the distant past here. And the haplogroup of a certain individual in the past would be another educated guess. It's different from having an actual blood sample at hand.

You mean like guessing Alexander as E1b1b? Sure. But E1b1b is a safe guess, especially considering a lot of the non-E1b1b except I2 would have been introduced to the area a thousand years or more after his death.

Fire Haired
02-17-2014, 06:09 PM
That would be an educated guess, but we are also talking about individuals in the distant past here. And the haplogroup of a certain individual in the past would be another educated guess. It's different from having an actual blood sample at hand.

If modern day Irish have over 80% R1b P312 that means without almost any doubt Irish 2,000 years ago also had 80% R1b P312. I think you doubt to much.

Geni
02-17-2014, 06:10 PM
The various strands of Hap. E1b1b as found in Europe constitute the third most common group of YDNA clades in Europe, after the R1 clades (R1a and R1b of course) and the original I clades. It seems to predate R in Europe, R being associated with the Indo-European invasions of c. ~3,000BC and E1b1b being associated with the spread of agriculture during the Neolithic from Anatolia at the latest (c. ~5,500BC). Like I and R, E is found all over Europe - at consistent, but low (normaly <10%) frequencies, with the exceptions of the Balkans where it in places like southern Greece, Macedonia and Albania it approaches 50%, and isolated areas like Galicia where it hits double digits. Anyhow, here's a list of 10 people with the illustrious E1b1b lineage:

1. The Wright Brothers (E1b1b1a2 (V13))

Hailing from North Carolina of English ancestry, the Wright Brothers are known for having a very successful bike shop. These small-business owners are thus role models for all E1b1b Europeans out there. They did spend a little bit too much of their free time dicking around with powered flight and ultimately ended up creating the first aeroplane and putting humanity on its path to the skies and beyond. Sadly neither one ever procreated - possibly, neither one ever even got laid - so their superior E1b1b genes were not passed on to the next generation. Still, noteworthy individuals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wright_Brothers
http://www.wright-dna.org/dna/OtherResults.html

2. Napoleon (E1b1b1c1* (E-M34*))

Looking aside his obvious shortcomings, or shortcomings which is another good pun because he probably had a micropenis, Napoleon was quite noteworthy. Despite being French, he managed to invade most of Europe, except Britain of course. He also invaded Egypt, found the Rosetta Stone, and failed to invade Russia before it was cool. Yes, he was a bit of a bloodthirsty maniac, but still.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleon
http://www.ccsenet.org/journal/index.php/jmbr/article/view/10609

3. Adolf Hitler (E1b1b1 (E-M35))

Continuing the trend of E1b1b being associated with bloodthirsty tyrants (to be clear, Napoleon > Hitler), it seems the Fuehrer himself was E1b1b, which seemed funny to some uninformed people because E1b1b traces back to Africa perhaps as recently as 25,000 years ago and thus Adolf was black, lol. Obviously, this is a bit of a silly point, and E1b1b is found in German and Austrian native populations at an incidence of ~9% (although if you go back far enough, yes, all haplogroups share a common ancestor). The second claim was 'lol he's Jewish lol' because some Jews have E1b1b, but then, a lot more Jews have R1a and R1b. Anyhow, our boy Adolf was famous for being a colossal dickhead and effecting the loss of German East Prussia, Upper Silesia and elsewhere to the Soviets, in addition to his actions resulting in the partitioning of Germany into a Western and Communist zone.

http://www.knack.be/nieuws/wetenschap/hitler-was-verwant-met-somaliers-berbers-en-joden/article-normal-10083.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler

4. Albert Einstein (E1b1b1b2* (E-Z830))

Why yes, possibly the cleverest person ever was a carrier of E1b1b. This is just further proof that E1b1b as carried by Europeans is the superior YDNA haplogroup. For those not in the know, Albie discovered relativity and some other dorky science stuff that probably got him some serious wedgies in Gymnasium.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein
http://www.familytreedna.com/public/G2c/default.aspx?section=ysnp
http://www.haplozone.net/e3b/project/kitnum/N65053

5. William Hartley (E1b1b1c1 (M34))

Basically every E1b1b carrier was either a dictator or a scientist (which makes total sense as they came to Europe as invasive technological innovators), and the second Anglo on the list comes under the second category. Despite being of the superior E1b1b1c1 variety, and being English, Hartley is probably the least well known on this list so far. Regardless, his medical discoveries form the basis of our understanding of our own hearts and circulatory systems.

http://www.familytreedna.com/public/HARVEY/default.aspx
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Harvey

6. Lyndon B. (LBJ) Johnson (E1b1b1 (E-M35))

Ever thought to yourself, 'Vietnam was a great war. I wish there were someone I could thank for the US involvement in it!' Well, now you can - it's America's 37th president, Democrat LBJ. Once again, the man was of English extraction, though his ancestors clearly couldn't cut it in the homeland. Unlike Hartley and the Wright Brothers, he came from the slightly less superior 'genocidey' branch of the E1b1b family, which he shared with Hitler. No drawing unkind comparisons, please...

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~hjohnson/New%20Index/Pesidential%20DNA/presidential_dna.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyndon_B._Johnson

7. Michelangelo (E1b1b1 (E-M35))

Not the turtle mutant, but rather the chap who painted the Sistine Chapel.

8. Sir David Attenborough (E1b1b1-(M35))

Returning to the English theme, the world's best narrator and nature documentary maker pertains, of course, to the E1b1b clade. Sir David's family hail from Nottinghamshire, which makes him better than you, unless you're also English, but that's superfluous to the point.

http://www.e1b1b1-m35.info/2013/04/sir-david-attenborrough-e1b1b1-m35.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Attenborough

9. Loki (E1b1b1a1 - (EV13))

All hail our Glorious Leader.


Clar, Ave, Loki fiat voluntas tua ,benedictionis tua da nobis hodie et ne nos inductas in tentationem sed libera nos a malo ..

Fire Haired
02-17-2014, 06:11 PM
You mean like guessing Alexander as E1b1b? Sure. But E1b1b is a safe guess, especially considering a lot of the non-E1b1b except I2 would have been introduced to the area a thousand years or more after his death.

That's debatable. Alexander was an Indo European I think there is a good chance there was R1a M417 in Greece in his time, it is bad to assume all in the Balkans is from Slavic migrations.

Longbowman
02-17-2014, 06:13 PM
That's debatable. Alexander was an Indo European I think there is a good chance there was R1a M417 in Greece in his time, it is bad to assume all in the Balkans is from Slavic migrations.

It is almost undeniable that the overwhelming majority of pre-Roman, Anatolian and Slavic migration-era Balkans would have been E1b1b or in some areas I2. He could have been R1a; he could also have been J2, G2a or even T; it is most likely he was E1b1b.

Fire Haired
02-17-2014, 06:15 PM
BRB banning myself.

E1b1b1c1a, for example (my clade) has Levantine, European, and European-Jewish subclades, so Caucasoid is the most accurate.

Seriously I do prefer west Eurasian, because it is more exact and has a less chance of becoming an inaccurate term because of new finds.

Longbowman
02-17-2014, 06:16 PM
Seriously I do prefer west Eurasian, because it is more exact and has a less chance of becoming an inaccurate term because of new finds.

I'm just a born risk-taker.

Fire Haired
02-17-2014, 06:18 PM
It is almost undeniable that the overwhelming majority of pre-Roman, Anatolian and Slavic migration-era Balkans would have been E1b1b or in some areas I2. He could have been R1a; he could also have been J2, G2a or even T; it is most likely he was E1b1b.

What R1a subclades are in the Balkans? Not everyone in the Balkans had E1b1b. I2a1b3 L61.1, J2b, and R1b L23 were probably also popular.

Longbowman
02-17-2014, 06:20 PM
What R1a subclades are in the Balkans? Not everyone in the Balkans had E1b1b. I2a1b3 L61.1, J2b, and R1b L23 were probably also popular.

In Alex's area of the Balkans, E1b1b is 40-50% today. R is not that common and I would say mainly attributable to latter-day Slavic migrations. R1b isn't common.

AndreasMeyer
02-17-2014, 07:05 PM
If modern day Irish have over 80% R1b P312 that means without almost any doubt Irish 2,000 years ago also had 80% R1b P312. I think you doubt to much.
But that does not mean that with certainty a specific Irish person 1000 years ago had R1b P312. It's just an educated guess.

Longbowman
02-17-2014, 07:06 PM
But that does not mean that with certainty a specific Irish person 1000 years ago had R1b P312. It's just an educated guess.

No one's pretending Paddy X. or Alex the Great were definitely R1b and E1b1b respectively, we'd just be mildly surprised if they weren't.

Fire Haired
02-17-2014, 07:21 PM
But that does not mean that with certainty a specific Irish person 1000 years ago had R1b P312. It's just an educated guess.

Of course about 20% of the population does not have R1b P312 but there is a much higher possibility a random Irish person 1,000 years ago did have R1b P312. Doubt should not stop progress.

Hanibalas Lekteris
02-17-2014, 08:42 PM
Caucasoid is probably more accurate. Still both those haplogroups have European subclades.

As far as E-M34 goes, I'm pretty sure all non-Jewish clusters contain both European & Middle Eastern individuals (going by experience).
E-V22 seems even more North African actually.

But both could indeed have spread in Europe during the Neolithic, I wouldn't be surprised to find such these clades in European samples dating back to the Neolithic.

However, there isn't much warranting a European genesis for Jewish E-M34 and E-V22.

Longbowman
02-17-2014, 09:33 PM
As far as E-M34 goes, I'm pretty sure all non-Jewish clusters contain both European & Middle Eastern individuals (going by experience).
E-V22 seems even more North African actually.

But both could indeed have spread in Europe during the Neolithic, I wouldn't be surprised to find such these clades in European samples dating back to the Neolithic.

However, there isn't much warranting a European genesis for Jewish E-M34 and E-V22.

E1b1b1c1a is pretty small, but according to this (http://www.haplozone.net/wiki/index.php?title=E-M34)project there appears to be a large European cluster, a large Levantine one, and three small Jewish ones.

I suspect Jewish E1b1b1c1a or at least most Jewish E1b1b1c1a is Levantine but we may perhaps never know. However, all three Jewish clades seem to be comprised entirely of European Jewish - a mixture of Ashkenazis, Sephardics, and Italkim - which suggests at the least a post-Babylonian exile origin.

E1b1b1c1a is a small clade though and I doubt anyone will do any serious genetic studies on it in the near future.

Yuffayur
06-20-2014, 10:00 PM
How many people live in north Africa? Its a lifeless desert, you and ten guys named Mohammed can't do much. There are many of us in the USA, Germany, France, UK, Ireland, many powerful nations. If you want a war against people with mainly Indo European descended Y DNA you have to also mess with Russia. At all times even when you go to get your mourning tea are surrounded by R1b L11. Your teachers, friends, relatives, random people you see on the street, girlfriend's father, etc. we are the majority in Britain.

United E1b1b army of north Africa.
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=43514&d=1390105396

Destroyed the Visigothic R1b & I in Iberia lool.

poiuytrewq0987
09-26-2016, 07:28 PM
The various strands of Hap. E1b1b as found in Europe constitute the third most common group of YDNA clades in Europe, after the R1 clades (R1a and R1b of course) and the original I clades. It seems to predate R in Europe, R being associated with the Indo-European invasions of c. ~3,000BC and E1b1b being associated with the spread of agriculture during the Neolithic from Anatolia at the latest (c. ~5,500BC). Like I and R, E is found all over Europe - at consistent, but low (normaly <10%) frequencies, with the exceptions of the Balkans where it in places like southern Greece, Macedonia and Albania it approaches 50%, and isolated areas like Galicia where it hits double digits. Anyhow, here's a list of 10 people with the illustrious E1b1b lineage:


A lot of these results are scratching the surface since they only go as far as M-35 or so. That's still a very broad category, need more specific subclades that could tell us the terminal Y-DNA.

cosmoo
09-26-2016, 07:35 PM
I seriously doubt Hitler is E1b based on testing of his alleged cousin.
It's like tests of well-known white supremacists who almost always (falsely) turn out to have Negro aDNA component when tested.

Etain
09-26-2016, 08:51 PM
All males
Is it rare for white women to be e1b?

Wulf
09-26-2016, 08:55 PM
I seriously doubt Hitler is E1b based on testing of his alleged cousin.
It's like tests of well-known white supremacists who almost always (falsely) turn out to have Negro aDNA component when tested.

HITLER WAS A BASTARD CHILD NOBODY KNOWS HIS REAL FATHER

JBoscherville
09-26-2016, 09:03 PM
All males
Is it rare for white women to be e1b?

Oh you.

Etain
09-26-2016, 09:04 PM
Oh you.

that was a srs question

Longbowman
09-26-2016, 09:33 PM
I seriously doubt Hitler is E1b based on testing of his alleged cousin.
It's like tests of well-known white supremacists who almost always (falsely) turn out to have Negro aDNA component when tested.

OK but E1b1b is pretty common in Bavaria, isn't SSA, and isn't ADNA.

Longbowman
09-26-2016, 09:33 PM
All males
Is it rare for white women to be e1b?

Yes, extremely rare.

Oneeye
09-26-2016, 09:40 PM
that was a srs question

Transgendered women do, but not cisgendered. :rofl_002:

cosmoo
09-26-2016, 09:43 PM
OK but E1b1b is pretty common in Bavaria, isn't SSA, and isn't ADNA.

IKR, but you know those sensationalistic claims, like "biggest anti-Semite ever carried Afro-Semitic haplogroup", and similar bullshit... he may have carried E1b or any other haplogroup, it's just very probable that his tested "cousin" is actually not related to him at all.

Longbowman
09-26-2016, 09:48 PM
IKR, but you know those sensationalistic claims, like "biggest anti-Semite ever carried Afro-Semitic haplogroup", and similar bullshit... he may have carried E1b or any other haplogroup, it's just very probable that his tested "cousin" is actually not related to him at all.

I don't think this is correct at all, although the moronic and insulting headlines were indeed stupid.

Etain
09-26-2016, 09:58 PM
Transgendered women do, but not cisgendered. :rofl_002:

oh ok i get it

poiuytrewq0987
09-26-2016, 09:58 PM
OK but E1b1b is pretty common in Bavaria, isn't SSA, and isn't ADNA.

What's also interesting is my closest matches on Ysearch.org are a Pole and two Slovenes. They're not so close relatives-wise but are on the top out of all matches on the list. I only got 4 Albanian matches, but at very few markers maybe only eight. The results are leading me to believe that my Y-DNA subclade may be of a predominantly Slavic type. I would be surprised if that wasn't the case.

mongrel
04-17-2017, 12:51 PM
epik