Yulia Tymoshenko released as country lurches towards split

[Kazimiera]

Yulia Tymoshenko released as country lurches towards split

Former prime minister's release and Viktor Yanukovych's fall from power leaves country dangerously divided

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/2/22/1393086223038/Yulia-Tymoshenko-011.jpg

Ukraine's former prime minister Yulia Tymoshenko was freed from custody on Saturday, as President Viktor Yanukovych's fall from power threatened to leave Ukraine dangerously split.

Parliament in Kiev voted to remove the president from power and called elections for 25 May, while politicians from the south and east of the country said they would not recognise the authority of the capital.

Security forces left the streets and public buildings unguarded, and the president's offices and residence were vacant. Protesters moved into the vacuum, setting up their own checkpoints.

MPs heard held an emergency session in which they elected a new speaker and new ministers and voted for the release of Tymoshenko. The former prime minister was released from a hospital in Kharkiv and is expect to fly to Kiev.

Many of the MPs for southern and eastern Ukraine were absent from the session. Instead hey were at a pre-scheduled congress of regional politicians in Kharkiv, where the president was also believed to be.

The new interior minister, Arsen Avakov, declared that the police were now behind the protesters they had fought for days, with 77 people killed and leaving central Kiev with the look of a war zone while central authority crumbled in western Ukraine.

Members of the protesters' "self-defence" militia guarded the grounds of Yanukovych's residence outside Kiev.

The disintegration of Yanukovych's government marks a setback for the Russian president, Vladimir Putin, who had counted on the Ukrainian leader to bring the country into a Eurasian union of former Soviet-bloc nations.

A senior security source said Yanukovych was still in Ukraine, but was unable to say whether he was in Kiev. An ally was quoted as saying he was in the country's generally pro-Russian east.

The Unian news agency cited Anna Herman, an MP close to Yanukovych, as saying the president was in the north-eastern city of Kharkiv, in a mainly Russian-speaking province.

The government, still led by a Yanukovych ally, said it would ensure a smooth handover of power to a new administration.

"The cabinet of ministers and ministry of finance are working normally," the government said in a statement. "The current government will provide a fully responsible transfer of power under the constitution and legislation."

Yanukovych, who enraged much of the population by turning away from the European Union to cultivate closer relations with Russia three months ago, made sweeping concessions in a deal brokered by European diplomats on Friday after days of pitched fighting in Kiev, with police snipers gunning down protesters.

But the deal, which called for early elections by the end of the year, was not enough to satisfy demonstrators, who want Yanukovych out immediately in the wake of the bloodletting.

Parliament has acted quickly to implement the deal, voting to restore a constitution that curbs the president's powers and to change the legal code to allow Tymoshenko to go free. On Saturday, MPs voted to speed up her release by eliminating a requirement that the president approve it.

The speaker of parliament, a Yanukovych loyalist, resigned and parliament elected Oleksander Turchynov, a close Tymoshenko ally, as his replacement.

Two protesters in helmets stood at the entrance to the president's Kiev office. Asked where the state security guards were, Mykola Voloshin said: "I'm the guard now."

Dmytro Pylipets, 32, a doctor from Kharkiv who was wearing military fatigues and helmet, said: "I think Yanukovych is frightened and panicking. I feel we are almost there. The Maidan revolution is almost done."

Tymoshenko's release could transform Ukraine by giving the opposition a unifying leader and potential future president, although Vitali Klitschko and others also have claims.

She was jailed by a court under Yanukovych over a natural gas deal with Russia she arranged while serving as premier. The EU had long considered her a political prisoner, and her freedom was one of the main demands it had for closer ties with Ukraine during years of negotiations that ended when Yanukovych abruptly turned towards Moscow in November.

In a sign of the quick transformation, the interior ministry responsible for the police swung behind the protests. It said it served "exclusively the Ukrainian people and fully shares their strong desire for speedy change".

Avakov told Ukraine's Channel 5 TV: "The organs of the interior ministry have crossed to the side of the protesters, the side of the people."

Leaders of Ukraine's Russian-speaking eastern provinces, however, voted to challenge anti-Yanukovych steps measures taken by parliament in Kiev. Eastern regional politicians meeting in Kharkiv adopted a resolution saying the measures "in such circumstances cause doubts about their ... legitimacy and legality.

"The central state organs are paralysed. Until constitutional order and lawfulness are restored … we have decided to take responsibility for safeguarding constitutional order, legality, citizens' rights and their security on our territories."

The governor of Kharkiv, Mikhaylo Dobkin, told the meeting: "We're not preparing to break up the country. We want to preserve it."

Yanukovych's concessions on Friday ended 48 hours of violence that had turned the centre of Kiev into an inferno of blazing barricades. Without enough loyal police to restore order, the authorities had resorted to placing snipers on rooftops who shot demonstrators in the head and neck.

The foreign ministers of France, Germany and Poland negotiated the concessions, in what the Kremlin's envoy acknowledged as superior diplomacy.

Yanukovych, 63, a former Soviet regional transport official with two convictions for assault, did not smile during a signing ceremony at the presidential headquarters on Friday.


Source: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/feb/22/yulia-tymoshenko-released-ukraine-lurches-split

[Kiyant]

Letting a crminal out again...........

[glass]

Letting a crminal out again...........
come on man
United_Energy_Systems_of_Ukraine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Energy_Systems_of_Ukraine) is forgotten past
she is pure democrat now:D

[Hweinlant]

Julia is no answer for Ukraine, she knows it, everyone knows it and what is most important, the Right Sector knows it. What I found most interesting is that Julia actually did show genuine remorse for her crimes by asking remorse from Maidan. I think she was genuine. That will not help her for getting into presidential office as it's the guys in the Right Sector who are calling the shots now. Will they find Yanukovych and hang him at Maidan is good question. Julia probably will get to keep her life, despite being corrupted oligarch-politician but Yanuk, I think they will hang him.

[Yaroslav]

This is outrageous. She is a total fraud. Putin must invade.

[Hweinlant]

This is outrageous. She is a total fraud. Putin must invade.

She is, but nowhere near as much as Putin.

[Yaroslav]

She is, but nowhere near as much as Putin.

lol

[Hweinlant]

lol

Yanukovych is small fish compared to Vladimir Vladimirovych. Yanukovych didn't have that much time to steal, his net worth is "only" in hundreds of millions of €. Julia didn't get to steal much more than tens of millions of €. Vladimir Vladimirovych is in class of his own. He is likely the wealthiest person/thief on earth.

The Richest lists him as second wealthiest person on earth but I think he is uno.

http://www.therichest.com/top-lists/top-250-richest-people-in-the-world/
http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/politician/president/vladimir-putin-net-worth/

Vladimir Putin, net worth 75 billion dollars. Most successful mafia boss ever.

[Acquisitor]

Julia is no answer for Ukraine, she knows it, everyone knows it and what is most important, the Right Sector knows it. What I found most interesting is that Julia actually did show genuine remorse for her crimes by asking remorse from Maidan. I think she was genuine. That will not help her for getting into presidential office as it's the guys in the Right Sector who are calling the shots now. Will they find Yanukovych and hang him at Maidan is good question. Julia probably will get to keep her life, despite being corrupted oligarch-politician but Yanuk, I think they will hang him.

I don't trust her, I think its a strategy. She has had enough time to design a perfect return strategy. She may not take the president's office but she could still get quite high.

ps. she looks horrible.

[Acquisitor]

Yanukovych is small fish compared to Vladimir Vladimirovych. Yanukovych didn't have that much time to steal, his net worth is "only" in hundreds of millions of €. Julia didn't get to steal much more than tens of millions of €. Vladimir Vladimirovych is in class of his own. He is likely the wealthiest person/thief on earth.

The Richest lists him as second wealthiest person on earth but I think he is uno.

http://www.therichest.com/top-lists/top-250-richest-people-in-the-world/
http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/politician/president/vladimir-putin-net-worth/

Vladimir Putin, net worth 75 billion dollars. Most successful mafia boss ever.

Imagine his job, having absolute power in his country, and giving bribes to foreigners who he has interest in. although that $75b figure is likely bs, no idea how they calculated that.

[Hweinlant]

I don't trust her, I think its a strategy. She has had enough time to design a perfect return strategy. She may not take the president's office but she could still get quite high.

ps. she looks horrible.

Well, she is a crook. No doubt about that. She looked ill, sitting in wheelchair. Her movement looked strange. She might have a cancer of sort. The hairlock looks fake. After 2 years in jail all her hair should brown (no bleeching).

http://i57.tinypic.com/25s0kkg.png
http://i62.tinypic.com/xmil91.png

We'll see in few days if it was all for show.

[Acquisitor]

Well, she is a crook. No doubt about that. She looked ill, sitting in wheelchair. Her movement looked strange. She might have a cancer of sort. The hairlock looks fake. After 2 years in jail all her hair should brown (no bleeching)..

Doing russiaprussia impression:

"PEOPLE LEAVING RUSSIAN PRISONS DONT LOOK LIKE SHIT, EVEN OUR PRISONS ARE SUPERIOR TO YOUR WESTERN SCUM"

http://blogs.ft.com/the-world/files/2013/12/458847341.jpg

[Hweinlant]

Imagine his job, having absolute power in his country, and giving bribes to foreigners who he has interest in. although that $75b figure is likely bs, no idea how they calculated that.

75bn is likely underestimate. It's calculated from his assumed share of Gazprom&co annual turn over. Vlad's true number 2 is not Medvedev but a Finnish citizen Gennady Timchenko. His company, Gunvor, takes care (= takes 10%) of Gazprom exports. There are other companies like that, tapping into Russian raw material exports. I don't think Vlad really thinks of that stuff anymore, when you have billions and billions that prolly doesn't motivate anymore. He must look already into history pages, how will they treat him.

[RussiaPrussia]

lol she got fat

[Acquisitor]

75bn is likely underestimate. It's calculated from his assumed share of Gazprom&co annual turn over. Vlad's true number 2 is not Medvedev but a Finnish citizen Gennady Timchenko. His company, Gunvor, takes care (= takes 10%) of Gazprom exports. There are other companies like that, tapping into Russian raw material exports. I don't think Vlad really thinks of that stuff anymore, when you have billions and billions that prolly doesn't motivate anymore. He must look already into history pages, how will they treat him.

$75b is likely a conservative figure yes, he could have much more. It's likely that he will never be audited during his lifespan, it's also possible that he will go down in history the way most Russians see him at this moment. A savior of some kind, for example a figure similar to Brezhnev who provided a prolonged period of stability and relative wealth, but only better than Brezhnev who was a wreck for the second half of his long term and who wasn't appreciated nearly as much as Putin is at this moment.

Some Russians say "Putin is what we deserve and what we need". It's possible that they are right.

[Hweinlant]

$75b is likely a conservative figure yes, he could have much more. It's likely that he will never be audited during his lifespan, it's also possible that he will go down in history the way most Russians see him at this moment.


It wholly depends on Navalny. No official Russian inquiry will be made, not even after Putin-era. If Navalny will ever get any sort of official seat things might take a different route.



A savior of some kind, for example a figure similar to Brezhnev who provided a prolonged period of stability and relative wealth, but only better than Brezhnev who was a wreck for the second half of his long term and who wasn't appreciated nearly as much as Putin is at this moment.


Difference would be that Brezhnev didn't have to steal, he had it all by default and couldn't get anything more as the system was different. Brezhnev's wealth was states wealth, not his own. If average Ivan would know how much Vlad has in his sleeve.. It'd be revolution. Yanuk's personal zoos and golden toilets are petty little things compared to Vlad.



Some Russians say "Putin is what we deserve and what we need". It's possible that they are right.

They likely are. Slavish people with low self-esteem. They are afraid of the 90's, stability with gun point is better than no stability at all.

[Acquisitor]

btw, if something can damage Putin's regime then its a trend change on the commodity markets. Last year oil was stable and Russia borrowed quite a lot of money on the international markets while adding less to the reserves. So the country borrowed more than it saved. It means that the country is already living beyond its means. If oil falls by just $20 Putin will have a problem, a serious one. Maybe if/when Iran enters the international market again the prices could fall, the US could become oil exporting country as well. It would be interesting to see what Putin's strategy would be in this case.

[Acquisitor]

It wholly depends on Navalny. No official Russian inquiry will be made, not even after Putin-era. If Navalny will ever get any sort of official seat things might take a different route.

I dont think Navalny has a chance to take a seat for as long as the Czar is in the Kremlin, come on, they will just imprison or kill him. It would be very interesting to see how far the system and United Russia would go to defend itself should a serious crisis occur though.




Difference would be that Brezhnev didn't have to steal, he had it all by default and couldn't get anything more as the system was different. Brezhnev's wealth was states wealth, not his own. If average Ivan would know how much Vlad has in his sleeve.. It'd be revolution. Yanuk's personal zoos and golden toilets are petty little things compared to Vlad.

yes but I was talking about the place in history..




They likely are. Slavish people with low self-esteem. They are afraid of the 90's, stability with gun point is better than no stability at all.

oil was $9-15 in the 90's vs $100-110 now, is it really so hard for some Ivans to see the reason why the country has grown so much. If Vladimir was able to sell the growth as his personal achievement to the majority of the russians then its quite an accomplishment.

[Hweinlant]

btw, if something can damage Putin's regime then its a trend change on the commodity markets. Last year oil was stable and Russia borrowed quite a lot of money on the international markets while adding less to the reserves. So the country borrowed more than it saved. It means that the country is already living beyond its means. If oil falls by just $20 Putin will have a problem, a serious one. Maybe if/when Iran enters the international market again the prices could fall, the US could become oil exporting country as well. It would be interesting to see what Putin's strategy would be in this case.

Russia's economy is already in recession. RF gdp only grew 1.5% in 2013 and much (all) of that came from overspending to Sochi2014. Without spending all those excess billions to Sochi they would have had negative growth.

All of the early 2014 money has been flowing out of Russia. Only reason keeping them afloat has been EUR:USD ratio, keeping EUR too strong (=getting too much money per 1 USD). Ruble is close to trash currency already. Ukrainian situation is not helping them. This will eventually mean that selling oil&gas to EU will make less profits and yet imports cost much more. As Russia is heavily dependent on the imports, people can afford less.

http://www.fxexchangerate.com/charts/rub-eur-90-day-exchange-rates-history-chart.png

[Yaroslav]

Yanukovych is small fish compared to Vladimir Vladimirovych. Yanukovych didn't have that much time to steal, his net worth is "only" in hundreds of millions of €. Julia didn't get to steal much more than tens of millions of €. Vladimir Vladimirovych is in class of his own. He is likely the wealthiest person/thief on earth.

The Richest lists him as second wealthiest person on earth but I think he is uno.

http://www.therichest.com/top-lists/top-250-richest-people-in-the-world/
http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/politician/president/vladimir-putin-net-worth/

Vladimir Putin, net worth 75 billion dollars. Most successful mafia boss ever.

Rothschild Jews have 500 trillion, idiot.

[Hweinlant]

Rothschild Jews have 500 trillion, idiot.

OK, that justifies Vlad stealing from Russians. Thanks, I got it all now. Or did you mean that Vlad is farm-hand of Rothschields ?

[Yaroslav]

OK, that justifies Vlad stealing from Russians. Thanks, I got it all now. Or did you mean that Vlad is farm-hand of Rothschields ?

Putin is puppet of Rothschilds, but not as bad as Tymoshenko. He is more autonomous.

[Kiyant]

Why do some guys here have a fetish for the Rothschilds like they controll the world?

[Hweinlant]

Putin is puppet of Rothschilds, but not as bad as Tymoshenko. He is more autonomous.

OK, lol.

[Acquisitor]

Rothschild Jews have 500 trillion, idiot.

if you cant keep up with a conversation and throw random crap into it, then don't join the conversation at all.

yes the jews stole $500T from white christians, you are right, now fo.

[Acquisitor]

Putin is puppet of Rothschilds, but not as bad as Tymoshenko. He is more autonomous.

Oh :D

I had no idea how powerful jews were, but it appears that they control even Putin. First they kill christ, then they steal $500T :\

[Kiyant]

Oh :D

I had no idea how powerful jews were, but it appears that they control even Putin. First they kill christ, then they steal $500T :\

Yaroslav thought(or still thinks) that im a demon

[Acquisitor]

Yaroslav thought(or still thinks) that im a demon

and I'm that painted guy with psychopathic eyes.

[Kiyant]

and I'm that painted guy with psychopathic eyes.

Nice

[zhaoyun]

I don't trust any politicians but she's definitely the hottest female politician in the world.

[Empecinado]

Why do some guys here have a fetish for the Rothschilds like they controll the world?

Because along with other powerful families are the ones who controll the world.

[Kiyant]

Because along with other powerful families are the ones who controll the world.

:picard1:

[RussiaPrussia]

Russia's economy is already in recession. RF gdp only grew 1.5% in 2013 and much (all) of that came from overspending to Sochi2014. Without spending all those excess billions to Sochi they would have had negative growth.

All of the early 2014 money has been flowing out of Russia. Only reason keeping them afloat has been EUR:USD ratio, keeping EUR too strong (=getting too much money per 1 USD). Ruble is close to trash currency already. Ukrainian situation is not helping them. This will eventually mean that selling oil&gas to EU will make less profits and yet imports cost much more. As Russia is heavily dependent on the imports, people can afford less.

http://www.fxexchangerate.com/charts/rub-eur-90-day-exchange-rates-history-chart.png

idiot it means less finnish and eu exports to russia because youre too expensive now while russia will be cheaper, and the most funny thing is it means also more profit from oil revenues which are in dollars but will be more worth as russian government will be able to buy a hell lot more in rubles with these euros and dollars. learn basic economics.

I was advocating ruble devaluation since a whole year and hoped it will come one day. You europeans and americans are printing money like crazy to devalue your currency and making us a dumping ground for your cheap quality products. Well this is ending now.

[Empecinado]

:picard1:

You are right, are average people who controll the world, democracy and so on.

http://spd.fotolog.com/photo/29/3/109/yelous/1288035207448_f.jpg

[Kiyant]

You are right, are average people who controll the world, democracy and so on.

http://spd.fotolog.com/photo/29/3/109/yelous/1288035207448_f.jpg

They have influence but they dont controll the world.
Also why do you think "families" controll the world together?

[Yaroslav]

if you cant keep up with a conversation and throw random crap into it, then don't join the conversation at all.

yes the jews stole $500T from white christians, you are right, now fo.

Predurok, negadyay.

[Acquisitor]

idiot it means less finnish and eu exports to russia because youre too expensive now while russia will be cheaper, and the most funny thing is it means also more profit from oil revenues which are in dollars but will be more worth as russian government will be able to buy a hell lot more in rubles with these euros and dollars. learn basic economics.

I was advocating ruble devaluation since a whole year and hoped it will come one day. You europeans and americans are printing money like crazy to devalue your currency and making us a dumping ground for your cheap quality products. Well this is ending now.

without all this "you" crap (which is ironically also relevant for a German citizen in Germany lol) your posts would look a bit firmer. Think about it.

[Yaroslav]

I don't trust any politicians but she's definitely the hottest female politician in the world.

You must be sick. She is a skinny harlot.

[Acquisitor]

Russia's economy is already in recession. RF gdp only grew 1.5% in 2013 and much (all) of that came from overspending to Sochi2014. Without spending all those excess billions to Sochi they would have had negative growth.

All of the early 2014 money has been flowing out of Russia. Only reason keeping them afloat has been EUR:USD ratio, keeping EUR too strong (=getting too much money per 1 USD). Ruble is close to trash currency already. Ukrainian situation is not helping them. This will eventually mean that selling oil&gas to EU will make less profits and yet imports cost much more. As Russia is heavily dependent on the imports, people can afford less.

yes I saw that, it would be interesting to follow it all in the future :) how will Putin try to sell the recession to the nation especially if commodities fall in price. He will blame Europe+US as he always does, but will it be enough ? unlikely.

we might find it out one day.

[RussiaPrussia]

Yanukovych is small fish compared to Vladimir Vladimirovych. Yanukovych didn't have that much time to steal, his net worth is "only" in hundreds of millions of €. Julia didn't get to steal much more than tens of millions of €. Vladimir Vladimirovych is in class of his own. He is likely the wealthiest person/thief on earth.

The Richest lists him as second wealthiest person on earth but I think he is uno.

http://www.therichest.com/top-lists/top-250-richest-people-in-the-world/
http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/politician/president/vladimir-putin-net-worth/

Vladimir Putin, net worth 75 billion dollars. Most successful mafia boss ever.

whats so bad about that a european is top 2? Its more frightening to me that this list is dominated by americans only, almost.

[RussiaPrussia]

This is outrageous. She is a total fraud. Putin must invade.

freeing her is good news for Russias future

[Acquisitor]

whats so bad about that a european is top 2? Its more frightening to me that this list is dominated by americans only, almost.

US is a perfect country to run business in, the word "business" is a sacred word in the US and has been for a long time now. Notice that many names on the list represent new billionaires from the hightech sector, people who helped to shape the IT industry.

hats off for the US for creating such an environment where one can achieve great success without stealing natural resources like its the case in Russia where everything belonged to the nation just 23 years ago but today is in the hands of selected few.

[RussiaPrussia]

US is a perfect country to run business in, the word "business" is a sacred word in the US and has been for a long time now. Notice that many names on the list represent new billionaires from the hightech sector, people who helped to shape the IT industry.

hats off for the US for creating such an environment where one can achieve great success without stealing natural resources like its the case in Russia where everything belonged to the nation just 23 years ago but today is in the hands of selected few.

the US is perfect country to rob the world with their Dollar and NSA dominance and propaganda making you believing that

[glass]

if election is fair she would win, despite all her past.

[Hweinlant]

if election is fair she would win, despite all her past.

I very much doubt that. Maidan's self-defence even reminded her and Yatsenyuk yesterday that the revolution is not about them.

http://euromaidanpr.wordpress.com/2014/02/23/euromaidan-self-defense-stops-yatsenyuk-and-tymoshenko-at-the-airport-kyiv-ukraine/

[Empecinado]

US is a perfect country to run business in, the word "business" is a sacred word in the US and has been for a long time now. Notice that many names on the list represent new billionaires from the hightech sector, people who helped to shape the IT industry.

hats off for the US for creating such an environment where one can achieve great success without stealing natural resources like its the case in Russia where everything belonged to the nation just 23 years ago but today is in the hands of selected few.

Not anymore:



Incorporating a business takes five days on average, but the overall cost of meeting regulatory requirements has increased by over $60 billion since 2009, with more than 130 new regulations imposed.

http://www.heritage.org/index/country/unitedstates

[glass]

I very much doubt that. Maidan's self-defence even reminded her and Yatsenyuk yesterday that the revolution is not about them.

there are too many (stupid?) people who think (once again...) new president would turn Ukraine into heaven, so they would vote Timoshenko because of her 'heroic' time in jail. Also she can get votes in the east, because for easterners it would be either Timoshenko or bandera fanboy. Right Sector already used western politicians for their own plans. Western plan was Yatsenyuk as prime minister and Yanukovich as president untill new one (Timoshenko) is elected. Right Sector ruined this plan. If radicals take power for themselves it would be very hard for west continue to support democratic changes in Ukraine. Timoshenko is also best available choice for Russia, because she is business woman and she knows how to work with Putin.

[Fortis in Arduis]

What are the chances of a radical right movement taking or sharing power?

Their presence in the protests suggests that they were being excluded from the democratic process.

Answers from lesbian, transsexual anime freaks are not required.

[Loki]

Imagine his job, having absolute power in his country, and giving bribes to foreigners who he has interest in. although that $75b figure is likely bs, no idea how they calculated that.

It is because of his 4.5% stake in Gazprom.

[Loki]

Yulia Timoshenko, Ukraine's Nelson Mandela. She should write a book called "Long Walk to Freedom". :rolleyes:

[Sarmatian]

Yulia Timoshenko, Ukraine's Nelson Mandela. She should write a book called "Long Walk to Freedom". :rolleyes:

Did Nelson Mandela stole millions of dollars from his people too? :rolleyes:

[Hweinlant]

there are too many (stupid?) people who think (once again...) new president would turn Ukraine into heaven, so they would vote Timoshenko because of her 'heroic' time in jail. Also she can get votes in the east, because for easterners it would be either Timoshenko or bandera fanboy. Right Sector already used western politicians for their own plans. Western plan was Yatsenyuk as prime minister and Yanukovich as president untill new one (Timoshenko) is elected. Right Sector ruined this plan. If radicals take power for themselves it would be very hard for west continue to support democratic changes in Ukraine. Timoshenko is also best available choice for Russia, because she is business woman and she knows how to work with Putin.

Some Russian politicians have already started to cheer for Julia. Probably sending signals to eastern Ukraine. This might have exact opposite effect at the western Ukraine. Also the Right Sector is now force to reckon. Politicians know that there exists a group that will hold them responsible, guys who are ready to execute them if they go back to old ways. Julia doesn't yet get it but Yatsenyuk was visibly scared yesterday.

Apparently Yanuk tried to get support from Vlad yesterday and Vlad told him to f***off.

[glass]

Yulia Timoshenko, Ukraine's Nelson Mandela. She should write a book called "Long Walk to Freedom". :rolleyes:
She is ukrainian Berezovsky


Some Russian politicians have already started to cheer for Julia. Probably sending signals to eastern Ukraine. This might have exact opposite effect at the western Ukraine. Also the Right Sector is now force to reckon. Politicians know that there exists a group that will hold them responsible, guys who are ready to execute them if they go back to old ways. Julia doesn't yet get it but Yatsenyuk was visibly scared yesterday.

Apparently Yanuk tried to get support from Vlad yesterday and Vlad told him to f***off.
How all of this lower Timoshenko chance to be elected?
It is obviously dealing with this armed insurgents will be major problem for new president, but majority of voters is ordinary people from around Ukraine, some Right Sector guy will not outplay Timoshenko. Like i said if election is fair Timoshenko win, if election is not fair armed Right Sector guy put somebody in charge...

[Loki]

Did Nelson Mandela stole millions of dollars from his people too? :rolleyes:

I was being sarcastic :laugh:

Anyway, Putin's income:

http://i59.tinypic.com/rm71vp.png

[Loki]

I owned shares in Gazprom and Rosneft 10 years ago, but I sold it to go into short-term trading. Biggest mistake ever :rolleyes:

[Hweinlant]

How all of this lower Timoshenko chance to be elected?


Isn't that obvious ? If Moscow starts to cheer too loud for Julia, she will be seen as too Pro-Moscow in eyes of Ukrainians.



It is obviously dealing with this armed insurgents will be major problem for new president...

It will be very easy. All the president has to do is 1) Don't steal 2) Rule with law 3) Make sure there are effective measures against others stealing/corruption. With Julia's track record all 3 will be extremely difficult.

[Sarmatian]

Isn't that obvious ? If Moscow starts to cheer too loud for Julia, she will be seen as too Pro-Moscow in eyes of Ukrainians.

Don't you still understand that the largest part of the country have positive or neutral attitude towards Moscow?


It will be very easy. All the president has to do is 1) Don't steal 2) Rule with law 3) Make sure there are effective measures against others stealing/corruption. With Julia's track record all 3 will be extremely difficult.

Seems easy if you're Finn but Ukrainians are different. Corruption doesn't come from a few dishonest individuals, it comes from acceptance of masses. If you're as a Finn asked by some governing official to pay a bribe you're most likely to tell him to fuck off even if you can afford the bribe. But most of Ukrainians will gladly pay if they have enough money and that's what drives the corruption. An Ukrainian can proclaim any shit on public but as soon as interactions are down to 1 on 1 they can turn to act against their own words in an instant if there is some gain for them in it.

[Hweinlant]

Don't you still understand that the largest part of the country have positive or neutral attitude towards Moscow?


No they don't. Most parts of Ukrainian society want to get out of Moscow's orbit. Ukrainian nationalism is diametrically opposite to Moscow's sphere of influence.



Seems easy if you're Finn but Ukrainians are different. Corruption doesn't come from a few dishonest individuals, it comes from acceptance of masses. If you're as a Finn asked by some governing official to pay a bribe you're most likely to tell him to fuck off even if you can afford the bribe. But most of Ukrainians will gladly pay if they have enough money and that's what drives the corruption. An Ukrainian can proclaim any shit on public but as soon as interactions are down to 1 on 1 they can turn to act against their own words in an instant if there is some gain for them in it.

1) I would tell him to fuck off and I would make sure he has no job after that.
2) You are being Ukrainophobe
3) Hundred Ukrainians just died when they battled against the corrupt regime.

[Sarmatian]

No they don't. Most parts of Ukrainian society want to get out of Moscow's orbit. Ukrainian nationalism is diametrically opposite to Moscow's sphere of influence.

1) I would tell him to fuck off and I would make sure he has no job after that.
2) You are being Ukrainophobe
3) Hundred Ukrainians just died when they battled against the corrupt regime.

I'm not Ukrainophobe, I'm realist. I have ancestry from there and some of my relatives live there, I know mentality of these people. There are sure some honest people but they are few and it's extremely hard for them to stay this way because of social pressure from corrupted majority. The most bizarre thing is that corrupted majority don't even realizing how their everyday attitudes builds up into one big pile of corrupted shit and sincerely blaming others for being crooks and thieves.

[Hadouken]

MILF!

[Kuvayi_Milliye]

This revolution "business" got out-dated and boring now. Same images, same kind of concept. They pick a character as a symbol and try to create drama over it. Just like the video of a Ukranian girl who keeps talking about "freedom, support us" and crap like that. It has been flooding all over the internet. Whats the result? A country which is about to split. The "freedom fighter" protesters took over Kiev and the other parts of the country dont recognize it. Chaos, loss of life and probably nothing will change as a result. They wont get richer, more democratic or free. Same kind of slavery under different labels. A big pile of bullsh*t.

[Pure ja]

Seems easy if you're Finn but Ukrainians are different. Corruption doesn't come from a few dishonest individuals, it comes from acceptance of masses. If you're as a Finn asked by some governing official to pay a bribe you're most likely to tell him to fuck off even if you can afford the bribe.

Everything is relative. Finns act abroad a bit differently than they do at home. Finnish businessmen do give bribes in Russia and in Estonia, for example, if "necessary". So there is a need for a critical mass to support open and honest transactions.

And I am sure that bribery also exists within Finland itself, it is just at a (much) lower level.