R1b1a2 in Kosovo (Albanian)

[Gashi91]

Hi Theapricity.com! I am new in this forum, here are my results:

FTDNA Family Finder:
Europe Finnish, French, Orcadian, Romanian, Russian 23.20% ±12.89%
Europe (Southern European) Tuscan 76.80% ±12.89%

YDNA: R1b1a2a1 L150
mtDNA: U5b2a1a

I am ethnic Albanian from the Republic of Kosovo with roots (4-5 generations) from Northern Albania (Y-DNA).
Sa per Shqiptar ne ket forum te interesuar jom nga fisi Gashi, nga veriu Shqiperisë qe kufizohet me fiset Krasniqi dhe Bytyqi.

[alb0zfinest]

Congrats on the results, and welcome to the forum.

[cally]

Congrats and welcome :)

[1stLightHorse]

Interesting, i think there is some other R1b albos here.

[cally]

I just checked gedmatch and we are related!! Hi cousin
where in Kosovo are you from?

out of 1500 relatives, you are my closest one :)

[Skerdilaid]

I just checked gedmatch and we are related!! Hi cousin
where in Kosovo are you from?

out of 1500 relatives, you are my closest one :)

Closer then Bubu, because I believe he comes from quite close to where you come from?

[Gashi91]

I just checked gedmatch and we are related!! Hi cousin
where in Kosovo are you from?

out of 1500 relatives, you are my closest one :)

Then cousin it is, hehe.. How did you find that out?
My fathers family are from a village called Qabiq (where they have lived in 2-3 generations), its close to the city of Klinë - easy to find on Google maps.
However as I mentioned above, they came to Kosovo from Northern Albania. They first arrived in some village(-s) in Gjakova, then they traveled to a village close to Suhareka (Therandë), later on to a village called 'Mleqan' and finally 'Qabiq'.

[Kastrioti1443]

Welcome Highlander!

[cally]

Then cousin it is, hehe.. How did you find that out?
My fathers family are from a village called Qabiq (where they have lived in 2-3 generations), its close to the city of Klinë - easy to find on Google maps.
However as I mentioned above, they came to Kosovo from Northern Albania. They first arrived in some village(-s) in Gjakova, then they traveled to a village close to Suhareka (Therandë), later on to a village called 'Mleqan' and finally 'Qabiq'.

Awesome!
I went on "one to many" matches and you were the first public match it just said "Gashi" and your haplogroups.
My family are from Suhareka too, so maybe the relation is there. :)

[Gashi91]

Awesome!
I went on "one to many" matches and you were the first public match it just said "Gashi" and your haplogroups.
My family are from Suhareka too, so maybe the relation is there. :)

Ok, it may be. Would be interesting to find out.

[Skerdilaid]

Then cousin it is, hehe.. How did you find that out?
My fathers family are from a village called Qabiq (where they have lived in 2-3 generations), its close to the city of Klinë - easy to find on Google maps.
However as I mentioned above, they came to Kosovo from Northern Albania. They first arrived in some village(-s) in Gjakova, then they traveled to a village close to Suhareka (Therandë), later on to a village called 'Mleqan' and finally 'Qabiq'.

Welcome! I know where your village is.

[alb0zfinest]

Welcome! I know where your village is :naughty:.

Stalker status :D

[Skerdilaid]

Stalker status :D

What lol? I did a lot of hunting in my younger days:p

[KrashNick]

Welcome = Mireseerdhe :D .

[Chieftain]

Welcome, I'm an ancient northern albanian if you got any questions.

[Black Wolf]

Welcome to the forum and thanks for sharing your genetic results! Always nice to see new people here who are interested in genetics.

[kuqezi]

Hi Theapricity.com! I am new in this forum, here are my results:

FTDNA Family Finder:
Europe Finnish, French, Orcadian, Romanian, Russian 23.20% ±12.89%
Europe (Southern European) Tuscan 76.80% ±12.89%

YDNA: R1b1a2a1 L150
mtDNA: U5b2a1a

I am ethnic Albanian from the Republic of Kosovo with roots (4-5 generations) from Northern Albania (Y-DNA).
Sa per Shqiptar ne ket forum te interesuar jom nga fisi Gashi, nga veriu Shqiperisë qe kufizohet me fiset Krasniqi dhe Bytyqi.


So theoretically all Gashi should be R1b1a2a1 if they all to have a common ancestor, right?

[cally]

So theoretically all Gashi should be R1b1a2a1 if they all to have a common ancestor, right?
There is a Gashi from Kosovo on 23andme with Y-DNA haplogroup I1.

[Stefan_Dusan]

There is a Gashi from Kosovo on 23andme with Y-DNA haplogroup I1.

I'm related to that one. Maybe even this Gashi in the thread.

[cally]

I'm related to that one. Maybe even this Gashi in the thread.

From what I can see on gedmatch, OP is related to me and Geni who also happens to be R1b. You can check to see if you find your name :)

[Stefan_Dusan]

From what I can see on gedmatch, OP is related to me and Geni who also happens to be R1b. You can check to see if you find your name :)

How do I do that?

[cally]

How do I do that?

Go on "one-to-many" matches

[Gashi91]

So theoretically all Gashi should be R1b1a2a1 if they all to have a common ancestor, right?

If, yes. But as far as I know not all from the 'Gashi clan' are related.

[Stefan_Dusan]

If, yes. But as far as I know not all from the 'Gashi clan' are related.

Not everyone in tribe has to be related but everyone in clan needs to be. Gashi is a Kosovo tribe, you being from Northern Albania would have had male ancestor absorbed into the tribe, and you would not be related to the original founder through your male line. However, through female line maybe.

[Gashi91]

Not everyone in tribe has to be related but everyone in clan needs to be. Gashi is a Kosovo tribe, you being from Northern Albania would have had male ancestor absorbed into the tribe, and you would not be related to the original founder through your male line. However, through female line maybe.

Clan/Tribe, I thought it was the same. I don't agree with you. The Gashi tribe came from Northern Albania to what is today Kosovo.

[Skerdilaid]

Clan/Tribe, I thought it was the same. I don't agree with you. The Gashi tribe came from Northern Albania to what is today Kosovo.

Gashi Clan originates in Kosova, prior to Turk arrival. From Kosova they moved to Herzegovina, and from Herzegovina into what is now Montenegro. The brother Clan PalBardhi (BjeloPavlic) stayed there, and Gashi moved back into Kosova. You are right, not all Gashi come from the same male ancestor, because there have been brotherhoods that have joined the Clan. So I guess Gashi can be called Tribe, by Stefan's definiton:D

[Gashi91]

Gashi Clan originates in Kosova, prior to Turk arrival. From Kosova they moved to Herzegovina, and from Herzegovina into what is now Montenegro. The brother Clan PalBardhi (BjeloPavlic) stayed there, and Gashi moved back into Kosova. You are right, not all Gashi come from the same male ancestor, because there have been brotherhoods that have joined the Clan. So I guess Gashi can be called Tribe, by Stefan's definiton:D

Sure a lot I did not know. Thank you! Do you have any source so I can 'approve' your claim?

[kuqezi]

The Gashi tribal base remains in the northeastern tip of Albania. The northern part of Tropoja. From there they expanded into Kosovo along with the rest of the highland tribes. All the recognized tribes in Kosovo are based out of northern Albania where their bases remain and clan members there maintain the old tribal-territorial organizational structure that was lost for the most part when they began to migrate to Kosovo. Tribe affiliation in Kosovo lost most of its highland aspects and served mostly as a reference of origin.

[alb0zfinest]

I don't know much about Gashi, but I had a friend with that last name, and a very distant cousin of mine is married to a gashi, both of those individuals live in Kosove.

[Skerdilaid]

Sure a lot I did not know. Thank you! Do you have any source so I can 'approve' your claim?

It precisely originated in Drenica. No I don't have sources, this is how the old folk sang its history.


Edit, what I am saying also adds up by the whom Gashi can marry and such.

[Skerdilaid]

The Gashi tribal base remains in the northeastern tip of Albania. The northern part of Tropoja. From there they expanded into Kosovo along with the rest of the highland tribes. All the recognized tribes in Kosovo are based out of northern Albania where their bases remain and clan members there maintain the old tribal-territorial organizational structure that was lost for the most part when they began to migrate to Kosovo. Tribe affiliation in Kosovo lost most of its highland aspects and served mostly as a reference of origin.

Depends in what region, Drenica for example kept its Fis tradition very much like the Northern Albanians did. Few other regions in Kosova did too, for example today if you want to get married to a girl, the elderly will investigate with Fis she hails prior to approval.

[safinator]

Welcome.

Just checked some of your autosomal scores on Gedmatch and seems you're a little bit more Northern than the average.

[Kastrioti1443]

The Gashi tribal base remains in the northeastern tip of Albania. The northern part of Tropoja. From there they expanded into Kosovo along with the rest of the highland tribes. All the recognized tribes in Kosovo are based out of northern Albania where their bases remain and clan members there maintain the old tribal-territorial organizational structure that was lost for the most part when they began to migrate to Kosovo. Tribe affiliation in Kosovo lost most of its highland aspects and served mostly as a reference of origin.

Gashi is a Kosova tribe, originated there, in Tropoja originates Krasniqi and partialy Shala Tribe. Berisha Tribe originates in Puka.

[ChocolateFace]

Gashi is a Kosova tribe, originated there, in Tropoja originates Krasniqi and partialy Shala Tribe. Berisha Tribe originates in Puka.

Gashi originates from Dukagjin. I actually have relation to them from a few hundred years back.

[Kastrioti1443]

Gashi originates from Dukagjin. I actually have relation to them from a few hundred years back.

No. Gasho originates from western parts of Kosovoa, nothing to do with Dukagjin.

[ChocolateFace]

No. Gasho originates from western parts of Kosovoa, nothing to do with Dukagjin.

Gashi originated from a brother whose father was from dukagjin and he went into Kosov.

[The Illyrian Warrior]

Welcome.

You said you're part of Gashi tribe, what I know for sure about Gashi tribe is most widespread tribe along with Berisha tribe (my maternal side) in Kosova however about tribes/clans Skerdilaid is much more informative than the rest us. :)

[kuqezi]

Toplana holds a sinister record; its annual death-rate from gunshot wounds is double that of most other Christian tribes. It is a very old tribe. Shlaku and Gashi are both offshoots of it. Shlaku and Toplana are both small and Christian; Gashi, all Moslem, is reported to be rich, and consists of 800 houses. Its territory is as yet almost entirely unexplored.

http://digital.library.upenn.edu/women/durham/albania/albania.html

[Skerdilaid]

Toplana holds a sinister record; its annual death-rate from gunshot wounds is double that of most other Christian tribes. It is a very old tribe. Shlaku and Gashi are both offshoots of it. Shlaku and Toplana are both small and Christian; Gashi, all Moslem, is reported to be rich, and consists of 800 houses. Its territory is as yet almost entirely unexplored.

http://digital.library.upenn.edu/women/durham/albania/albania.html

Neither Shlaku or Toplana are Clans.

[kuqezi]

Neither Shlaku or Toplana are Clans.

The people of Toplana were driven to their present mountain stronghold from Vasojevitch in Montenegro about 1450, being pushed out by immigrants from Herzegovina.

Coon, The Mountains of Giants p.45

[kuqezi]

45464

[kuqezi]

45465

Notice where it says Malsia E Jakoves in between the E and S in the word JAKOVES. That is the Gashi tribal base, within the north Albanian highlands.

[Skerdilaid]

The people of Toplana were driven to their present mountain stronghold from Vasojevitch in Montenegro about 1450, being pushed out by immigrants from Herzegovina.

Coon, The Mountains of Giants p.45

I know that came from Coon, but Coon did not know too much about the Albo Fis. Anyways, those sound like families to me, or place names, and you can find those place names even in Kosova.

We all know the Fis names, I don't have to repeat them here.

[kuqezi]

Well at least the brotherhoods united under the Toplana bajrak considered themselves of the same fis. There are sources showing this its up to you to disprove that.

[kuqezi]

Coon knew a lot about the different fisat. He even corrected Edith Durham in some of her errors regarding them and their structure.

[Skerdilaid]

Toplana and Shlaku could only be nen fis, that's about it, or it could be a regional term. Shlak ose Shlaka is sort of a gravel that is found in Balkans, and you can find it as toponym in all Albo lands, toplana I am not sure what it means, but gives me Slavic vibes...

[Stefan_Dusan]

Toplana and Shlaku could only be nen fis, that's about it, or it could be a regional term. Shlak ose Shlaka is sort of a gravel that is found in Balkans, and you can find it as toponym in all Albo lands, toplana I am not sure what it means, but gives me Slavic vibes...

Toplana is related to heat in Serbian and used to name everything from heating companies or to hot springs in the mountains. I have no idea why someone would use this as name unless they came near hot spring and just picked their location.

[Skerdilaid]

Toplana is related to heat in Serbian and used to name everything from heating companies or to hot springs in the mountains. I have no idea why someone would use this as name unless they came near hot spring and just picked their location.

Thanks! Most likely a toponym then, just like I thought. There are no Albanian that have such a tribe, but some young folk misunderstand things.

[kuqezi]

Toplana is also a last name in Kosovo, as is Shllaku (not Shlaku). Dushmani is also a very old tribe.. Older than most. It was first recorded in the first decades of Ottoman rule of the area. Even though dushman is a non-Albanian word and means enemy doesn't mean they were non-Albanian. Likely they were a fierce enemy of the Turks and came to be known by that name.

The reason Toplana (keep in mind in Malsi its only a small tribe of one bajrak) is little represented in Kosovo for example probably has to do with having the highest death rate of all Alb tribes 49% due to being in blood with nearly everyone around them. Theres little room for emigration for such a tribe.

[kuqezi]

Also you cannot judge tribes in the Malsi by their representation in Kosovo. For example my fis Sopi is a small fis from around Topojan in Luma which wasn't noticed by either Durham or Coon, whereas in Kosovo it expanded hugely and is almost everywhere.

[The Illyrian Warrior]

Since you guys keep discussion about fis/tribes can I ask with OP approval about Morina tribe where did they originate from, and how they kept spreading in Kosova or were they just Kosovan native?

[kuqezi]

Morina originates in Northern Albania just like the rest of the clans, their own tales of origin not withstanding. Kosova was never a tribal area of its own but a territory dominated by extensions of highland tribes.

[kuqezi]

Nuk kam njohuri te medha per gjenezen e fiseve si linden e njejta pyetje do te ishte si linden emrat e vendeve te ndryshme e tj .Sa per fisin SOP ose Sopian apo Sopaj jan nen fis i fisit morin bashk me Shoshin jam shum i sigurt per ket

http://www.forumishqiptar.com/threads/4230-Mbi-origjinën-e-disa-fiseve-në-Shqipëri/page33

^ Thats something that ties those two fisa together but who knows what source he got it from.

[Gashi91]

For those of you who have their DNA profiles with FTDNA, please make sure to join the Albanian project.
https://www.familytreedna.com/public/Abanian_DNA_Poject/default.aspx

[Ice]

frequency data of R1b-M269xL23 versus the total population sampled

Kosovo___________________________ 7.9%
Germany__________________________ 5.3%
Macedonia________________________ 5.1%
Serbia___________________________ 4.4%
Lezgis (Northeast Caucasus)______ 3.2%
Switzerland Northeast____________ 3.1%
Italy____________________________ 2.9%
Iran_____________________________ 2.7%
Romanians________________________ 2.7%
Bashkirs South-Bashkortostan_____ 2.5%
Bashkirs Southeast-Bashkortostan_ 2.4%
Poland___________________________ 2.4%
Tabasarans-Northeast Caucasus____ 2.3%
Turkey-Cappadocia________________ 2.2%
Crete____________________________ 2.1%
Switzerland-Lower Rhone__________ 2.0%
Turkey___________________________ 1.9%
Herzegovina______________________ 1.4%
Bosnia___________________________ 1.3%
Greece___________________________ 1.2%
Germany South____________________ 1.1%
Slovenia_________________________ 1.0%
Germany West_____________________ 1.0%
Hungary__________________________ 0.9%
Italy North______________________ 0.8%
Italy South______________________ 0.8%
Russians Northern Russia_________ 0.8%
Jordan: Amman & Dead Sea_________ 0.7%
Ukraine West_____________________ 0.6%