YAP in South Indian tribes: ancestral DE-M1* haplotypes?

[Siginulfo]

http://hygienecentral.org.uk/pdf/Cordaux%20Forensic.pdf

This study by Cordaux et al. (2004) has not been cited very often in forum discussions or in scholarly researches regarding haplogroup DE. Most scholars declared that YAP was absent from India, except for some areas at the extreme North and East of the Peninsula. Cordaux et al. demonstrate that YAP is also present in some enclaves in South India (2 out of 30 Koragas).
The study also provides haplotypes for the two YAP haplotypes. Because the authors did not test for further sub-clades other than YAP, I have tried to predict their phylogenetic position among haplogroup DE's clades by comparing them to D*, D1, D2 and D3 haplotypes, and also to the few DE* haplotypes available in the literature, but I got no clear result, except maybe a similarity to DE* haplotypes. I put the haplotypes in YHRD for comparison, but neither of them matched another haplotype. The haplotypes are therefore unique and not shared with any known population.
In conclusion, the haplotype's phylogenetic position is unknown at present, but a suggestion could be given that we are in presence of DE* ancestral haplotypes. What are your thoughts?

[Kale]

Interesting? Yes. Surprising? No. D being East Asia, E being Africa...not many spots in between there. India makes really the only sense, and if you consider the coastal migration model, South India is the only spot left.

[Siginulfo]

Haplogroup DE must have originated somewhere in Eurasia for sure. On the basis of the underived samples so far found or known, the place of origin should be comprised in an area extending from Guinea-Bissau to South India. In fact, there is 1 haplotype from Guinea-Bissau, 6 from Nigeria, 1 from Syria (in a FTDNA project) and several from Tibet and, possibly 2 from South India. I tend to think that DE originated in or around India, because 1) this country is a gathering point for many ancient haplogroups and because 2) mtDNA M, which is Asian-specific, is present at high frequency both among the Andaman Islanders (100% Y-DNA D* and 100% mtDNA M) and in North and East Africa. In the African continent, mtDNA M1 and U6 are linked to an Eurasian back-migration in UP times (and likely the paternal counterpart was E*).

[Kale]

What other possibilities are there? That is really the only way everything fits together.

[Mortimer]

doesnt tell me much

[Artek]

I can't say anything useful, having such short Y-STR.
Thesis is obviously obsolete in every meaning of this word.

[Siginulfo]

I can't say anything useful, having such short Y-STR.
Thesis is obviously obsolete in every meaning of this word.

Obsolete, yeah, but certainly not dead. DE* almost certainly originated in Asia, and there is a high probability that this was also the case for E-M96* and several of its sub-clades. E-M96* is not an exclusive of Africa, it has been found in some parts of Europe (notably in the Balkans), Anatolia, the Levant, Saudi Arabia. Plus, the only real case of underived E-M215* was found in Khorasan, North-East Iran. The previously identified cases in Ethiopia and Yemen were found to be in the E-M35 sibling clade, E-M281. Moreover, E-M2, the dominant sub-clade of E in sub-Saharan Africa is said by geneticists to have originated in North Africa, therefore in proximity of Eurasia. Geneticists also suggest that E-M75, aka E2 probably originated in East Africa, which, together with North Africa is in proximity of Eurasia. All of this suggests that most of the ancestral clades of E-M96, and E-M96 itself, probably originated in Asia, specifically in the Levant.

[Artek]

Obsolete, yeah, but certainly not dead. DE* almost certainly originated in Asia, and there is a high probability that this was also the case for E-M96* and several of its sub-clades. E-M96* is not an exclusive of Africa, it has been found in some parts of Europe (notably in the Balkans), Anatolia, the Levant, Saudi Arabia. Plus, the only real case of underived E-M215* was found in Khorasan, North-East Iran. The previously identified cases in Ethiopia and Yemen were found to be in the E-M35 sibling clade, E-M281. Moreover, E-M2, the dominant sub-clade of E in sub-Saharan Africa is said by geneticists to have originated in North Africa, therefore in proximity of Eurasia. Geneticists also suggest that E-M75, aka E2 probably originated in East Africa, which, together with North Africa is in proximity of Eurasia. All of this suggests that most of the ancestral clades of E-M96, and E-M96 itself, probably originated in Asia, specifically in the Levant.

Never said anything on the contrary. E is a sign of back-migration into Africa by a logic. I just wouldn't back myself up with that thesis.

[Germaniac]

It's more than proved E-M96* and most E sub clades are of an Eurasian origin. African DNA is solely A, B and those new more primitive clades found there. Also, this supports the theory that there are not a single human species, but rather multiple origins for very similar species.