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Sikeliot
06-02-2014, 03:54 AM
First 3 are obviously of recent European descent, and would be white Brazilians.

http://i57.tinypic.com/2m7yq68.jpg




http://i62.tinypic.com/54jb5x.jpg




http://i62.tinypic.com/6gzvw0.jpg

curupira
06-02-2014, 04:34 AM
First 3 are obviously of recent European descent, and would be white Brazilians.

I think you should just post their results instead of making comments. Did they say to you they identified as "white Brazilians"? I've shared with someone from Rio Grande do Norte who scored >90% euro who identified himself as "mixed", i.e, "pardo" to me. I have scored like that too, and I don't identify as "white Brazilian".

curupira
06-02-2014, 05:07 AM
This is the result of a Brazilian from the interior of Piauí, Northeast Brazil:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/df/Brazil_State_Piaui.svg/350px-Brazil_State_Piaui.svg.png
http://i60.tinypic.com/2ia7nrp.jpg

This is the result of a Brazilian from the interior of Rio Grande do Norte, Northeast Brazil:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d9/Brazil_State_RioGrandedoNorte.svg/350px-Brazil_State_RioGrandedoNorte.svg.png
http://i57.tinypic.com/157k9kh.jpg

This is the result of a Brazilian from Aracaju, capital of Sergipe, Northeast Brazil:

http://www.guiaviagem.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Mapa-de-Sergipe.-Wikip%C3%A9dia-Raphael-Lorenzeto-de-Abreu.png
http://i61.tinypic.com/fu9fyp.jpg

This is the result of a Brazilian from Recife, capital of Pernambuco, Northeast Brazil:

http://www.blogodisea.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/pernambuco-brasil.png
http://i57.tinypic.com/2ypbsid.jpg

Iroczor
06-02-2014, 05:12 AM
Wow a lot of those you posted score more amerindian than african. Are they of colonial ancestry?

curupira
06-02-2014, 05:13 AM
Yes, they are all of mostly colonial ancestry.


Wow a lot of those you posted score more amerindian than african. Are they of colonial ancestry?

curupira
06-02-2014, 05:17 AM
This is the result of a Brazilian from Paraná, Southern Brazil (these usually show up more recent european ancestry and from other sources other than Iberia):

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-parana.jpg
http://i61.tinypic.com/34fm97c.jpg

This is the result of a Brazilian from the interior of Rio Grande do Sul, Southern Brazil:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-rio-grande-do-sul.jpg
http://i61.tinypic.com/2ytts1d.jpg

Iroczor
06-02-2014, 05:20 AM
Curupira

Whats the highest Amerindian admixed and African admixed brazilian person you have seen on 23andme?

curupira
06-02-2014, 05:25 AM
Highest native american? ~20%, someone from the interior of São Paulo state. Highest african? ~80%, from Bahia. The result from Bahia I referred to:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-bahia.jpg
http://i59.tinypic.com/uaqa8.jpg


Curupira

Whats the highest Amerindian admixed and African admixed brazilian person you have seen on 23andme?

curupira
06-02-2014, 11:56 AM
Composition results of a Brazilian from Ceará and Pernambuco (Northeast Brazil):

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-ceara.jpg
http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/pe%20mapa-pernambuco.jpg
http://i62.tinypic.com/2eqdjyh.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from the interior of Rio de Janeiro state:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-rio-de-janeiro.jpg
http://i62.tinypic.com/1z556km.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from Rio de Janeiro city, the capital of Rio de Janeiro state:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-rio-de-janeiro.jpg
http://i58.tinypic.com/2mpagyd.jpg

Composition results of another Brazilian from Rio de Janeiro city:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-rio-de-janeiro.jpg
http://i58.tinypic.com/2nvfbz8.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from the interior of São Paulo state:

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-sao-paulo.jpg
http://i59.tinypic.com/313gepg.jpg

Composition results of another Brazilian from the interior of São Paulo state:

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-sao-paulo.jpg
http://i59.tinypic.com/2mcwu88.jpg

Argentano
06-02-2014, 04:15 PM
Pretty cool thread

curupira
06-02-2014, 08:44 PM
Results of someone from Rio Grande do Sul, Southern Brazil:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-rio-grande-do-sul.jpg
http://i61.tinypic.com/16jnhpf.jpg

Results of someone from Rio Grande do Sul, Southern Brazil (of XIX century German Brazilian background)

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-rio-grande-do-sul.jpg
http://i58.tinypic.com/2aje135.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from São Paulo state (interestingly, he has both Lebanese and Italian ancestries):

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg
http://i62.tinypic.com/9u7l95.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from São Paulo state:

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg
http://i57.tinypic.com/16c2h39.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from the state of Bahia:

http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/ba%20mapa-bahia.jpg
http://i58.tinypic.com/28cogp5.jpg

Kazimiera
06-02-2014, 08:52 PM
VERY interesting thread. Thank you. :)

Lucinho
06-07-2014, 02:05 AM
How different do people from Nigeria, Angola and Mozambique escore? I mean, for you to know where your African ancestors came from

Selurong
06-07-2014, 01:34 PM
Hmm it seems that Brazilians have little Amerindian compared to much African. I wonder what compositions from the Amazon look like?

MINARDOWICZ
06-07-2014, 01:45 PM
Hmm it seems that Brazilians have little Amerindian compared to much African. I wonder what compositions from the Amazon look like?

Lots of higher native influence.

Selurong
06-07-2014, 02:00 PM
Lots of higher native influence.

That doesn't seem to be the case with the other samples here. In Sikeliot's first quote, yes the Amerind is there but in the subsequent samples...

Meh. :P

MINARDOWICZ
06-07-2014, 02:06 PM
That doesn't seem to be the case with the other samples here. In Sikeliot's first quote, yes the Amerind is there but in the subsequent samples...

Meh. :P

What about Belem???

Selurong
06-07-2014, 02:15 PM
What about Belem???

Oh you. :rolleyes:

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/oh+you.+oh_abef1c_3725180.jpg

MINARDOWICZ
06-07-2014, 03:14 PM
Oh you. :rolleyes:

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/oh+you.+oh_abef1c_3725180.jpg

What? I know people from there and I have seen some who FOR SURE have HIGH native (above mestizo).

curupira
06-08-2014, 01:36 AM
How different do people from Nigeria, Angola and Mozambique escore? I mean, for you to know where your African ancestors came from

Lucinho, so far not very diferent. It is good in showing up Khoisan ancestry, but it lumps West Africans and Central Africans Niger Congo speakers in one basic group, which makes sense, given the Bantu expansion. On 23andme, I have shared with both Nigerians and Congolese, f.e, and their scores are basically the same. Central and South Africans do show a little more Khoisan. Hopefully, they will update it so that others can finally track from where their ancestors came. On 23andme, for now, one can also learn about it if he finds cousins in Africa.

Isleño
06-08-2014, 01:42 AM
Most of these results are similar to white Americans from the U.S..

MINARDOWICZ
06-08-2014, 01:45 AM
Most of these results are similar to white Americans from the U.S..

Makes sense. Lots of Germanic influence.

Isleño
06-08-2014, 01:55 AM
Makes sense. Lots of Germanic influence.

But if you look at them, many have high Southern European scores, so I would say their scores are more in line with white Americans of Italian/Portuguese/Spanish/Greek heritages. But still, very similar to white Americans.

Lucinho
06-09-2014, 09:46 PM
Makes sense. Lots of Germanic influence.

Only a small percentage of Brazilians actually have German ancestry

Sikeliot
06-09-2014, 10:39 PM
Here is someone from inland near the Amazon:

http://i58.tinypic.com/517zvr.jpg

MINARDOWICZ
06-09-2014, 10:40 PM
Only a small percentage of Brazilians actually have German ancestry

Some of the results here had SIGNIFICANT Germanic... did you not see that one result? Looked like a TRUE white American... Not a S euro even.

Lucinho
06-09-2014, 10:42 PM
Some of the results here had SIGNIFICANT Germanic... did you not see that one result? Looked like a TRUE white American... Not a S euro even.

Mostly in the South. Outside of that area actually very few Brazilians score any Germanic admixture

Smeagol
06-09-2014, 10:53 PM
Most of these results are similar to white Americans from the U.S..

Not really true, a lot of them don't even have over 90 percent European...

curupira
06-09-2014, 11:20 PM
Composition results of a Brazilian from the states of Minas Gerais and Espírito Santo (with both more recent and colonial ancestries):

Espírito Santo state:
http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-espirito-santo.jpg

Minas Gerais state:
http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-minas-gerais.jpg

http://i58.tinypic.com/k0o94h.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from São Paulo state of both recent and older (colonial ancestries):

São Paulo state (a cousin of mine on 23andme):

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-sao-paulo.jpg

http://i62.tinypic.com/j5xg89.jpg

curupira
06-09-2014, 11:36 PM
This result is very interesting, I can't post the face of the person, but his look reminds me of that of Neymar, somewhat, he is from the states of Paraná and São Paulo:

Paraná state:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0e/Parana_in_Brazil.svg/250px-Parana_in_Brazil.svg.png

São Paulo state:

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-sao-paulo.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/s3n436.jpg

Sikeliot
06-09-2014, 11:37 PM
This result is very interesting, I can't post the face of the person, but his look reminds me of that of Neymar, somewhat, he is from the states of Paraná and São Paulo:

http://i60.tinypic.com/s3n436.jpg


This is close to what I anticipate the average Brazilian in my town to score if they were tested.

curupira
06-09-2014, 11:40 PM
Composition results of a Brazilian from Rio de Janeiro state, who also has more recent Lebanese ancestry:

Rio de Janeiro state:
http://www.quetalviajar.com/images/mapas/mapa-rio-de-janeiro.jpg

http://i62.tinypic.com/2yxjh44.jpg

curupira
06-09-2014, 11:46 PM
Composition results of a Brazilian who has more recent Jewish ancestry (I have not managed to find which is the Brazilian state she was born in):

http://i59.tinypic.com/ir2arl.jpg

Yehiel
06-09-2014, 11:57 PM
almost all of them have ashkenaz ancestry and north african/middle eastern, this combination usually points to Sephardi and i remember reading that up to 30% of latin americans have Sephardi ancestry.

curupira
06-10-2014, 12:00 AM
Yes, but the last one I posted has recent Ashkenazi ancestry though. So far, from what I have seen, New Christian input is higher on average in Mexico.


almost all of them have ashkenaz ancestry and north african/middle eastern, this combination usually points to Sephardi and i remember reading that up to 30% of latin americans have Sephardi ancestry.

Isleño
06-10-2014, 02:37 AM
Not really true, a lot of them don't even have over 90 percent European...

No, it is true, really. Out of 25 results posted here, 15 were in the range of white Americans. 11 were above 90% and the other 4 ranged between 84-89% all of which are still in the range for white Americans. So 15 out of 25 means the majority of Brazilian results posted here are similar to white Americans. Right?

Smeagol
06-10-2014, 04:21 AM
No, it is true, really. Out of 25 results posted here, 15 were in the range of white Americans. 11 were above 90% and the other 4 ranged between 84-89% all of which are still in the range for white Americans. So 15 out of 25 means the majority of Brazilian results posted here are similar to white Americans. Right?

It would be extremely rare for a White American to score less than 90 percent European, that's definitely not really in the range for White Americans. In fact The majority of White Americans score 98 percent European or higher.

Isleño
06-10-2014, 04:37 AM
It would be extremely rare for a White American to score less than 90 percent European, that's definitely not really in the range for White Americans. In fact The majority of White Americans score 98 percent European or higher.
White Americans can score in the late 80's. It may be more common to be 90%+, but certainly not impossible, therefore within the range. There are some that score less than 90%+, I've seen it myself. And I disagree that most score 98% or higher, I've seen more that were less than 98% in most of the ones I've seen from several different DNA databases. But I understand you disagree, but can you provide proof of what you said?

Isleño
06-10-2014, 04:50 AM
almost all of them have ashkenaz ancestry and north african/middle eastern, this combination usually points to Sephardi and i remember reading that up to 30% of latin americans have Sephardi ancestry.

Actually a little less than half of them had Ashkenazi show up, the number of them being 14 of out of 25 of the results posted here. But out of that 14, 13 was less than 1%, with the great majority (9 of them) being 1/10th of 1% (0.1%). One was less than 0.1%, nine were 0.1%, two were 0.2, two were 0.3, one was 0.4, one was 0.8% and one actually had significant enough Jewish ancestry to be considered part Jewish and that was 21.2%. Also, less than 1%, especially 1/10th of 1% is in the margin of error, and could possibly be statistical noise instead of actual Jewish ancestry.

As for North African ancestry, 25 out of 25 had North African ancestry. Among those 25, the majority scoring a single percentage scored 0.2% (7 of them), more scored this percentage than any other percent. In second came 0.4% (4 of them). A couple scored between 0.5% and 1%, 6 of them scored between 1.1% and 1.8%. Only 2 scored higher than 1.8% and the scores for those two were 4.1% and 4.6%. Out of the 25, most of them scored less than 1% North African.

Isleño
06-10-2014, 05:01 AM
i remember reading that up to 30% of latin americans have Sephardi ancestry.

Do you have a source for that number?

Yehiel
06-10-2014, 10:11 AM
Do you have a source for that number?

I looked it up and i mispoke it is portugal, and the number is 19.8%
.

Isleño
06-10-2014, 10:58 AM
This is close to what I anticipate the average Brazilian in my town to score if they were tested.

In your town only or in general including those of Brazil? In Brazil, whites are the largest single race and make up half of the population of Brazil.

curupira
06-10-2014, 12:58 PM
Results of a Brazilian from the states of Piauí and Ceará:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-piaui.jpg
http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-ceara.jpg

http://i61.tinypic.com/10ghf2q.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from Minas Gerais (she also has more recent Italian ancestry):

The state of Minas Gerais:

http://www.minasgerais.com.br/wp-content/themes/portal-setur/images/mapa-sobre.jpg

http://i61.tinypic.com/316w7t2.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from the state of Bahia:

http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/ba%20mapa-bahia.jpg

http://i59.tinypic.com/rt298o.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from Pernambuco:

Pernambuco state:

http://comps.canstockphoto.com/can-stock-photo_csp9784266.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/2czf4ur.jpg

Isleño
06-10-2014, 01:00 PM
Results of a Brazilian from the states of Piauí and Ceará:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-piaui.jpg
http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-ceara.jpg

http://i61.tinypic.com/10ghf2q.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from Minas Gerais (she also has more recent Italian ancestry):

The state of Minas Gerais:

http://www.minasgerais.com.br/wp-content/themes/portal-setur/images/mapa-sobre.jpg

http://i61.tinypic.com/316w7t2.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from the state of Bahia:

http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/ba%20mapa-bahia.jpg

http://i59.tinypic.com/rt298o.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from Pernambuco:

Pernambuco state:

http://comps.canstockphoto.com/can-stock-photo_csp9784266.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/2czf4ur.jpg
2 whites and 2 mulattoes (of the quadroon type).

curupira
06-10-2014, 01:02 PM
Results of a Brazilian from Paraná:

The state of Paraná:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-parana.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/mifosm.jpg

curupira
06-10-2014, 01:05 PM
2 whites and 2 mulattoes (of the quadroon type).

They are 4 Brazilians who have all three ancestries, European, African and Native American, in different degrees. "White" and "mulatto" are not only outdated words, they don't really describe the whole of the ancestral background of these individuals. But I'm not here to derail the thread but only to post the results.

Results of a Brazilian whose ancestry is from Mato Grosso do Sul, Rio Grande do Sul and Pernambuco:

http://i60.tinypic.com/2rxg00k.jpg

Map of Mato Grosso do Sul:

http://www.sopassagemdeonibus.com/images/mapas/mapa-mato-grosso-do-sul.jpg

Map of Rio Grande do Sul:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-rio-grande-do-sul.jpg

Map of Pernambuco:

http://comps.canstockphoto.com/can-stock-photo_csp9784266.jpg

Isleño
06-10-2014, 01:09 PM
They are 4 Brazilians who have all three ancestries, European, African and Native American, in different degrees. "White" and "mulatto" are not only outdated words, they don't really describe the whole of the ancestral background of these individuals. But I'm not here to derail the thread but only to post the results.
White and mulatto are still used throughout the world. The white Brazilians results are just like the white American results. Trivial admixture doesn't mean anything. Maybe those words are outdated where you live, but not where I live, so that's why I use them.

curupira
06-10-2014, 01:16 PM
They are outdated, yes. Read modern anthropology and sociology researchers, particularly in the US. "White" and "mulatto" are words invented by europeans during colonialism. As Tagore well put it, they are names made up by europeans to call other peoples and themselves. The results I posted show details of the ancestry of Brazilians, and you just reduced them to a couple of outdated words, erasing the native american ancestry, f.e. Someone who is 61% euro, 28% african and 5% native in ancestry is something else other than "mulatto".

As I said, this thread is about posting results, so please don't derail it, ok?


White and mulatto are still used throughout the world. The white Brazilians results are just like the white American results. Trivial admixture doesn't mean anything. Maybe those words are outdated where you live, but not where I live, so that's why I use them.

Smaug
06-10-2014, 01:22 PM
Composition results of a Brazilian from Ceará and Pernambuco (Northeast Brazil):

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-ceara.jpg
http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/pe%20mapa-pernambuco.jpg
http://i62.tinypic.com/2eqdjyh.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from the interior of Rio de Janeiro state:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-rio-de-janeiro.jpg
http://i62.tinypic.com/1z556km.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from Rio de Janeiro city, the capital of Rio de Janeiro state:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-rio-de-janeiro.jpg
http://i58.tinypic.com/2mpagyd.jpg

Composition results of another Brazilian from Rio de Janeiro city:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-rio-de-janeiro.jpg
http://i58.tinypic.com/2nvfbz8.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from the interior of São Paulo state:

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-sao-paulo.jpg
http://i59.tinypic.com/313gepg.jpg

Composition results of another Brazilian from the interior of São Paulo state:

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-sao-paulo.jpg
http://i59.tinypic.com/2mcwu88.jpg

From what towns in São Paulo are they from?

curupira
06-10-2014, 01:25 PM
^ The fully euro is from Taquaritinga, Uchoa, and Ibirá, interior of São Paulo state (Spanish and Italian ancestors who arrived here by the end of the XIX century and beginning of the XX century). The other one is from Vinhedo and Louveira, also interior of São Paulo state.


Composition results of a Brazilian from the interior of São Paulo state:

Composition results of another Brazilian from the interior of São Paulo state:

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-sao-paulo.jpg
http://i59.tinypic.com/2mcwu88.jpg

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-sao-paulo.jpg
http://i59.tinypic.com/313gepg.jpg

Isleño
06-10-2014, 01:26 PM
They are outdated, yes. Read modern anthropology and sociology researchers, particularly in the US. "White" and "mulatto" are words invented by europeans during colonialism. As Tagore well put it, they are names made up by europeans to call other peoples and themselves. The results I posted show details of the ancestry of Brazilians, and you just reduced them to a couple of outdated words, erasing the native american ancestry, f.e. Someone who is 61% euro, 28% african and 5% native in ancestry is something else other than "mulatto".

As I said, this thread is about posting results, so please don't derail it, ok?

Relax. There is free speech here. White and mulatto are still used in the world. In my country, white is used as an official race. I said that the white Brazilian results were like white American results. The 2% ancestries and the 0.3% ancestries are trivial. White and mulatto are social race descriptions, not scientific race. They are used all over the world. I will continue to use them. There is nothing wrong or disrespectful by using them.

Smaug
06-10-2014, 01:42 PM
^ The fully euro is from Taquaritinga, Uchoa, and Ibirá, interior of São Paulo state (Spanish and Italian ancestors who arrived here by the end of the XIX century and beginning of the XX century). The other one is from Vinhedo and Louveira, also interior of São Paulo state.

Yeah, that northern part of São Paulo around São José do Rio Preto, together with Rieirão Preto received a strong European immigration, mostly Spanish and Italians.

Smaug
06-10-2014, 01:43 PM
Relax. There is free speech here. White and mulatto are still used in the world. In my country, white is used as an official race. I said that the white Brazilian results were like white American results. The 2% ancestries and the 0.3% ancestries are trivial. White and mulatto are social race descriptions, not scientific race. They are used all over the world. I will continue to use them. There is nothing wrong or disrespectful by using them.

"Branco" (White) is also used as a official race here.

Isleño
06-10-2014, 01:45 PM
"Branco" (White) is also used as a official race here.
You know, I had thought so, I've seen that before, but didn't want to get into a big ordeal. Thanks for the heads up.

Isleño
06-10-2014, 01:48 PM
Yeah, that northern part of São Paulo around São José do Rio Preto, together with Rieirão Preto received a strong European immigration, mostly Spanish and Italians.

What areas of Brazil are known to have the largest concentration of whites? I've heard in the south there are more whites.

curupira
06-10-2014, 01:56 PM
Interesting results of a Brazilian, both his yDNA and his mtDNA are specific of SSA africa! I haven't seen it with anyone else so far, in an otherwise highly non african background over 98% non african! His family comes from the following places in Brazil: Rio de Janeiro; Brasilia; São Paulo; and Belém in Pará.

http://i59.tinypic.com/2qnnkhl.jpg

Smaug
06-10-2014, 02:02 PM
What areas of Brazil are known to have the largest concentration of whites? I've heard in the south there are more whites.

Parts of the South and São Paulo. I used of have a thread about my region Ribeirão Preto, but it was accidentally deleted. I will repost it later, but for now I've got this:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?119529-White-Brazilians

curupira
06-10-2014, 02:03 PM
This is his yDNA haplogroup: E1b1a8a! This is his mtDNA haplogroup: L3e3b!


Interesting results of a Brazilian, both his yDNA and his mtDNA are specific of SSA africa! I haven't seen it with anyone else so far, in an otherwise highly non african background over 98% non african! His family comes from the following places in Brazil: Rio de Janeiro; Brasilia; São Paulo; and Belém in Pará.

http://i59.tinypic.com/2qnnkhl.jpg

Isleño
06-10-2014, 03:09 PM
This is his yDNA haplogroup: E1b1a8a! This is his mtDNA haplogroup: L3e3b!

I've seen a white American from 23andme that had a Native American yDNA and an African mtDNA and he was 98.4% European. In my opinion, autosomal counts more.

curupira
06-10-2014, 03:14 PM
In my opinion, autosomal counts more.

Sure it does, autosomal is what really matters, since it shows the whole sum of the ancestors, but I was just pointing out it was an interesting combination, quite unusual.

Isleño
06-10-2014, 03:20 PM
Sure it does, autosomal is what really matters, since it shows the whole sum of the ancestors, but I just pointing out it was an interesting combination, quite unusual.

Yes it is quite unusual.

Smeagol
06-10-2014, 07:40 PM
White Americans can score in the late 80's. It may be more common to be 90%+, but certainly not impossible, therefore within the range. There are some that score less than 90%+, I've seen it myself. And I disagree that most score 98% or higher, I've seen more that were less than 98% in most of the ones I've seen from several different DNA databases. But I understand you disagree, but can you provide proof of what you said?

I can't give any links now, but no if a White American scores less than 90 percent European, they are recently mixed, not White probably. And yes, the majority of White Americans score 98 percent or more European and this is something 23andme acknowledges. I don't know why you keep insisting otherwise. Nonwhite ancestry is more common as a whole in some Southern states, especially ones like Louisiana, but think about it, the average Colonial stock Northerner will not score any Amerindian, or SSA DNA, and neither will immigrants from Europe who came after the Civil War, Therefore what you're saying is impossible. And I've seen White American 23and me results so I know what I'm saying is true.

Most Southerners don't even have any significant Non White ancestry. Maybe a small percentage of Indian, but that's usually it. Negro ancestry is not common, and when it is present it's usually 2 percent or less.

Isleño
06-10-2014, 09:52 PM
I can't give any links now, but no if a White American scores less than 90 percent European, they are recently mixed, not White probably. And yes, the majority of White Americans score 98 percent or more European and this is something 23andme acknowledges. I don't know why you keep insisting otherwise. Nonwhite ancestry is more common as a whole in some Southern states, especially ones like Louisiana, but think about it, the average Colonial stock Northerner will not score any Amerindian, or SSA DNA, and neither will immigrants from Europe who came after the Civil War, Therefore what you're saying is impossible. And I've seen White American 23and me results so I know what I'm saying is true.

Most Southerners don't even have any significant Non White ancestry. Maybe a small percentage of Indian, but that's usually it. Negro ancestry is not common, and when it is present it's usually 2 percent or less.

Well that's your experience. It's not the only experience. I've also seen many 23andme results, plus results from 2 other DNA companies. Most of the results I've seen are not 98% Euro. They were not. They fluxuated within the 90+ range usually, but I did see some that were in the late 80's. The ones in the late 80's were from the south. And it wasn't anything recent, we are talking old stock. So if there are people like this in the U.S. (not just the south, because Native American gets more substantial in places like Arizona, Colorado, and the west and places like Wyoming, Montana, etc.) So it's within the white American range. Just because you may have not seen them, doesn't make them nonexistant. I can honestly say most white Americans are in the 90%+ range, but there are some that are in the late 80's. They exist. Most of the ones I've seen were from the south.

curupira
06-10-2014, 11:08 PM
Results of a Brazilian from the state of São Paulo (a cousin of mine, and 1/4 Italian too):

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg

http://i62.tinypic.com/dm2s1d.jpg

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 01:08 AM
In your town only or in general including those of Brazil? In Brazil, whites are the largest single race and make up half of the population of Brazil.

They are not. The majority here is non-White. Many people whiten themselves in censuses

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 01:09 AM
White Americans can score in the late 80's. It may be more common to be 90%+, but certainly not impossible, therefore within the range. There are some that score less than 90%+, I've seen it myself. And I disagree that most score 98% or higher, I've seen more that were less than 98% in most of the ones I've seen from several different DNA databases. But I understand you disagree, but can you provide proof of what you said?

Probably the ones with Southern Italian ancestry who score some Middle-Eastern admixture, right?

curupira
06-11-2014, 01:19 AM
Results of a Brazilian from Juiz de Fora, interior of the state of Minas Gerais (also has more recent Italian ancestry, with older Brazilian ancestry):

http://www.minasgerais.com.br/wp-content/themes/portal-setur/images/mapa-sobre.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/rardds.jpg

Results of a Brazilian whose ancestry is from Bahia and Ceará (Northeast Brazil):

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-ceara.jpg
http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/ba%20mapa-bahia.jpg

http://i62.tinypic.com/qyfeiv.jpg

Isleño
06-11-2014, 02:47 AM
Probably the ones with Southern Italian ancestry who score some Middle-Eastern admixture, right?

That's not what I was referring to. The one's I've seen were in the late 80's in Euro with about substantial amount of Native American and black. The ones I've seen of Italian ancestry didn't have much Mideast, it was trivial.

Isleño
06-11-2014, 02:49 AM
They are not. The majority here is non-White. Many people whiten themselves in censuses

I was going by the U.S. CIA Factbook about Brazil. I'm sure it's possible. So you think mulato is more and white is second?

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 02:50 AM
That's not what I was referring to. The one's I've seen were in the late 80's in Euro with about substantial amount of Native American and black. The ones I've seen of Italian ancestry didn't have much Mideast, it was trivial.

Well, maybe the ones you saw in the late 80s were of Latin American ancestry

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 03:05 AM
I was going by the U.S. CIA Factbook about Brazil. I'm sure it's possible. So you think mulato is more and white is second?

Yeah. The CIA data was based on the 2000 Brazilian census. Many people here call themselves whites but are brown, and many people call themselves brown and are black

Isleño
06-11-2014, 03:13 AM
Looks like a great many of the results here are whites.

Isleño
06-11-2014, 03:14 AM
Yes but what do they look in the face? Whites can be olive complexion.

curupira
06-11-2014, 03:19 AM
Yes but what do they look in the face? Whites can be olive complexion.

These are the results of an autosomal study which took into account the proportions of "white", "pardo" and "black" Brazilians. Since it measured actual ancestry, and it took into account the proportions of self reported categories to the census, and their actual ancestry, it is a better guess than everything else IMO.

This study specifically aimed describing the composition of the country with samples from nearly all regions (almost 1000 samples), with "white", "pardo" and "black" samples according to their respective proportions. The samples came for the most part from blood donors (http://www.amigodoador.com.br/estatisticas.html), which for the most part belong to the poorest classes of Brazil, therefore socio-economic levels mirror somewhat the situation of Brazil, where most people belong to the lower strata of society.

It has found out what many already knew, that "whites", "pardos" and "blacks" generally have all three ancestral components, namely: European, SSA African and Native American ancestries in varying degrees.

The results could be within the ballpark; however many parts of Northeast Brazil, North Brazil, Southeast Brazil and Southern Brazil did not provide samples, so a grain of salt must be taken. Besides, not too many markers were tested, which may have skewed the results somewhat anyway, but not too much (I got the same results at 23andme which I got with their methodology, f.e, and from what I have seen their methodology works relatively fine on average, only with greater margins of error than one would get with many more markers).

The composition of Brazil:

http://i49.tinypic.com/bydlu.png


The Genomic Ancestry of Individuals from Different Geographical Regions of Brazil Is More Uniform Than Expected

Estimates of the “total ancestry” of different regions of Brazil

Since both the census proportions of each color category and the trihybrid ancestry of Brazilians vary according to region, we decided to merge the two sets of data and estimate what we have called the “total ancestry” of a given region. This has the advantage of circumventing the different regional semantics of what it means “to be” White, Brown or Black. To calculate the total ancestry we simply multiply the proportions of a given ancestry in a given color category by the census proportion of that color category in the specific region to arrive at an ancestry estimation regardless of color.

In order to show how the calculation of the “total ancestry” was done, let us take the example of European ancestry in the North region (state of Pará) using the data from Table 2. In that state, White, Brown and Black individuals have average European ancestry of 0.782, 0.686 and. 0.524 respectively. Since for the state of Pará the census shows the relative proportions of the same three colors above as 0.210, 0.736 and 0.055, the weighted European ancestry, which is now independent of color, will be (0.782×0.210) + (0.686×0.736) + (0.524×0.055) = 0.697.

The “total ancestry” estimates thus calculated for all regions are shown in the rightmost column of Table 2. The calculation could not be performed for two of the samples, Ceará and Santa Catarina, because they lacked data on one or more color categories.

The results obtained showed that there is in fact a smaller level of variability between the different regions than had been observed in the census data of color categories or in the ancestry proportions of the different color classes (Fig. 1). In all regions studied the European ancestry surfaced as uniformly preponderant, with proportions of 69.7%, 60.6%, 73.7% and 77.7%, respectively (Table2). This suggests that the populations of different regions of Brazil are ancestrally more similar than previously realized.


Total ancestries

To eschew the use of color categories we decided to try to estimate the general ancestry proportions of the different regional samples independent of color categories. To do that, we multiplied the proportions of a given ancestry in a given color category by the census proportion of that color category in the specific region, to arrive at ancestry estimation independent of color. Once such a correction was performed on the basis of the relative proportion of Amerindian, European and African ancestries, there emerged a higher level of uniformity than expected. In all regions studied the European ancestry was predominant, with proportions being ranging from 60.6% in the Northeast to 77.7% in the South (Figure 3). The African proportion was highest in the Northeast (30.3%), followed in decreasing order by the Southeast (18.9%), South (12.7%), and North (10.9%). On the other hand, the Amerindian proportion was highest in the North (19.4%), while relatively uniform in the other three other regions.

This is novel genetic information about the Brazilian people that needs to be placed on a historical and phylogeographical context. First, we will compare them with our previous observations with uniparental genetic markers in Brazilians.
http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0017063?imageURI=info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0017063.g002

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 03:21 AM
Looks like a great many of the results here are whites.

Of course. Brazilian upper class is mostly white or off-white. And Brazilians who can offord to buy an international genetic study are more likely to have more European ancesry than the average working-class mass

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 03:22 AM
Yes but what do they look in the face? Whites can be olive complexion.

Many of them look obviously non-white. Brazilian soccer player Ronaldo already claimed to be White in an interview

http://cdn1.sempretops.com/wp-content/uploads/820.jpg

curupira
06-11-2014, 03:28 AM
I come from the lower classes, as many of the Brazilians tested on 23andme (and I scored on the 95+ range, with an almost entirely colonial background and coming from the most African region - the mining region - in one of our most African states, Minas Gerais). I personally know examples of many who come from the lower classes, who scored similarly. This is my grandmother, she lived in a very poor neighbourhood in Belo Horizonte (one would say "vila" not to say "favela"), and so did her sister (you can tell it just by looking at her house on this pic, she is the woman to the far right):

http://i59.tinypic.com/2ch4byx.jpg


Of course. Brazilian upper class is mostly white or off-white. And Brazilians who can offord to buy an international genetic study are more likely to have more European ancesry than the average working-class mass

curupira
06-11-2014, 03:32 AM
Luckily we now have genetic tests and they measure real ancestry. I know people who scored >90% european who were listed as "pardo" in the census. And it varies by place. In Brasília, according to a top IBGE expert, no matter how "white" people are, they declare themselves as "white" to the census:


"A população local, por mais branca que seja a sua pele, se classifica como parda porque vê os brancos como os funcionários públicos que vieram de fora".
http://noticias.terra.com.br/educacao/voce-sabia/qual-a-diferenca-entre-preto-pardo-e-negro,395c952757b7e310VgnVCM5000009ccceb0aRCRD.htm l


'The local population, no matter how white their skin, classifies herself as 'pardo' since they see whites as public servants who come from somewhere else'



Many of them look obviously non-white. Brazilian soccer player Ronaldo already claimed to be White in an interview
http://noticias.terra.com.br/educacao/voce-sabia/qual-a-diferenca-entre-preto-pardo-e-negro,395c952757b7e310VgnVCM5000009ccceb0aRCRD.htm l

StonyArabia
06-11-2014, 03:33 AM
^ I always thought your were a Southern Brazilian because you look European/White and had very little admixture.

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 03:38 AM
I come from the lower classes, as many of the Brazilians tested on 23andme (and I scored on the 95+ range, with an almost entirely colonial background and coming from the most African region - the mining region - in one of our most African states, Minas Gerais). I personally know examples of many who come from the lower classes, who scored similarly. This is my grandmother, she lived in a very poor neighbourhood in Belo Horizonte (one would say "vila" not to say "favela"), and so did her sister (you can tell it just by looking at her house on this pic, she is the woman to the far right):

http://i59.tinypic.com/2ch4byx.jpg

70% of the poor population in Brazil is composed of Blacks and Brown, according to the census. Do not pretend that miserable people here look like you grandma.

Anyway, ur grandma looked healthy and she at least had a house to live, million of Brazilians are starving

curupira
06-11-2014, 03:42 AM
By saying 70% are "Blacks and Brown" you are distorting it heavily. Firstly, only ~7% of the Brazilian population reported to the census as 'black', I agree that the percentage is higher, but not much higher, if speaking about the whole country. The 'pardos' vary immensely in ancestry (many are quite euro, some more significant native, and many substantially african). And if 46% of the Brazilians tell the census they are 'whites', 30% belonging to the poorest group does not make a big difference.

The vast majority of my relatives are poor. The majority of Brazilians are poor. It is not because the elite is almost wholly european that the majority of largely euro influenced individuals will be there in the elite.


70% of the poor population in Brazil is composed of Blacks and Brown, according to the census. Do not pretend that people miserable people here look like you grandma

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 03:44 AM
And most Brazilians have a poor background, virtually all whites have a poor background (European immigrants were poor). The difference is that most white people in Brazil managed to move upward socially, while the majority of Blacks and Brown remained poor. And these limitations were strongly influenced by skin color, as lighter skinned Brazilians had better opportunities to get a better job and were more likely to go to school and be educated. I suggest you to study a little more about history of Brazil

curupira
06-11-2014, 03:49 AM
In some ways the description you did makes sense, but in others it does not, in my opinion. As I said, having spent my lifetime here I can tell you that a great many largely euro influenced Brazilian individuals live in poverty, no matter if up until today bias took place to select 'whiter looking' individuals to work in banks, television, etc (anyway, we now have affirmative action to end this). The leftwing discourse is backed up by history, I agree, but it is not the whole thing, nor an absolute truth.


And most Brazilians have a poor background, virtually all whites have a poor background (European immigrants were poor). The difference is that most white people in Brazil managed to move upward socially, while the majority of Blacks and Brown remained poor. And these limitations were strongly influenced by skin color, as lighter skinned Brazilians had better opportunities to get a better job and were more likely to go to school and be educated. I suggest you to study a little more about history of Brazil

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 03:50 AM
By saying 70% are "Blacks and Brown" you are distoring it heavily. Firstly, only ~7% of the Brazilian population reported to the census as 'black', I agree that the percentage is higher, but not much higher, if speaking about the whole country.

Yes, its much higher, including in your beloved Northeast, the blackest region of Brazil, except your beloved Ceará :picard2:



The 'pardos' vary immensely in ancestry (many are quite euro, some more significant native, and many substantially african).


What matters you what you look like, not ancestry. Nobody is gonna ask you a genetic study on the streets. Most browns have high African ancestry and minor Amerindian, except in the North and in your beloved Ceará or Goiás....kkkkkkkkkkkkk



And if 46% of the Brazilians tell the census they are 'whites', 30% belonging to the poorest group does not make a big difference.


Many of the poor who claim to be White are as White as Ronaldo, the soccer player. White-looking people among real poor people in Brazil are very few, except in the South and your grandmother


The vast majority of my relatives are poor. The majority of Brazilians are poor. It is not because the elite is almost wholly european that the majority of largely euro influenced individuals will be there in the elite.

Funny, a few months ago you claimed Brazil was a paradise under PT administration...ashamed to support them after all those corruption scandals and street protests? :picard2:

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 03:52 AM
In some ways the description you did makes sense, but in others it does not, in my opinion. As I said, having spent my lifetime here I can tell you that a great many largely euro influenced Brazilian individuals live in poverty, no matter if up until today bias took place to select 'whiter looking' individuals to work in banks, television, etc (anyway, we now have affirmative action to end this). The leftwing discourse is backed up by history, I agree, but it is not the whole thing, nor an absolute truth.
lol, most Brazilians are "euro-influenced"...there is a big difference between looking white and having any euro ancestry. You seem typically Brazilian, trying to white-wash everybody who happens to have any Euro ancestry. You use the one-drop rule in the opposite way lol

curupira
06-11-2014, 03:52 AM
Many of the poor who claim to be White are as White as Ronaldo, the soccer player. White-looking people among real poor people in Brazil are very few, except in the South and your grandmother


All my relatives are from the same region as my grandmother, and they are have endured poverty for many generations.

curupira
06-11-2014, 03:54 AM
I am just trying to tell the truth. I have not increased nor diminished the ancestry of anybody. I look for real ancestry.


lol, most Brazilians are "euro-influenced"...there is a big difference between looking white and having any euro ancestry. You seem typically Brazilian, trying to white-wash everybody who happens to have any Euro ancestry. You use the one-drop rule in the opposite way lol

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 03:56 AM
All my relatives are from the same region as my grandmother, and they are have endured poverty for many generations.

Cant u read? A century ago virtually everybody in Brazil were poor, including the recently arrived European immigrants. The difference is that, since then, most whites moved upward socially, while most Blacks and Brown remained poor. Claiming that you have a poor background is just pathetic, because everybody in Brazil has a poor background. What matters is the socio-economic situation now, not a century ago.

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 03:57 AM
I am just trying to tell the truth. I have not increased nor diminished the ancestry of anybody. I look for real ancestry.

You look for European ancestry and only.

curupira
06-11-2014, 03:57 AM
Yes, its much higher, including in your beloved Northeast, the blackest region of Brazil, except your beloved Ceará :picard2:

"Blackest" but still around ~70% non african according to the genetic studies. In 1965, American researchers found out the Northeast of Brazil to be 65% european, 25% african, and 9% native american (Human Biology, vol 37, number 1, led by the geneticists D. F. Roberts e R. W. Hiorns). Belo Horizonte is likely more African than that, and I have no problems with it, my family lives there, and I like it very much! :)

Isleño
06-11-2014, 03:59 AM
These are the results of an autosomal study which took into account the proportions of "white", "pardo" and "black" Brazilians. Since it measured actual ancestry, and it took into account the proportions of self reported categories to the census, and their actual ancestry, it is a better guess than everything else IMO.

This study specifically aimed describing the composition of the country with samples from nearly all regions (almost 1000 samples), with "white", "pardo" and "black" samples according to their respective proportions. The samples came for the most part from blood donors (http://www.amigodoador.com.br/estatisticas.html), which for the most part belong to the poorest classes of Brazil, therefore socio-economic levels mirror somewhat the situation of Brazil, where most people belong to the lower strata of society.

It has found out what many already knew, that "whites", "pardos" and "blacks" generally have all three ancestral components, namely: European, SSA African and Native American ancestries in varying degrees.

The results could be within the ballpark; however many parts of Northeast Brazil, North Brazil, Southeast Brazil and Southern Brazil did not provide samples, so a grain of salt must be taken. Besides, not too many markers were tested, which may have skewed the results somewhat anyway, but not too much (I got the same results at 23andme which I got with their methodology, f.e, and from what I have seen their methodology works relatively fine on average, only with greater margins of error than one would get with many more markers).

The composition of Brazil:

http://i49.tinypic.com/bydlu.png


http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0017063?imageURI=info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0017063.g002

But this study takes from the lowest socioeconomic strata, which of course will show higher levels of admixture. But what about the lower middle class, middle class, upper middle class and the rich? I'm sure their levels are more like these white Brazilians we are seeing here. Also, notice in the south the samples still showed to be whites. With that in mind, we'd need to find out how many people live below the poverty level and near it. This would make a substantial difference. This study is pointing out that it's sampling from the lowest socioeconomic strata which we know will have more admixture. I think we need to look for a better and wider population DNA study. I will look for one, but I will probably do the research tomorrow, it's late here.

curupira
06-11-2014, 03:59 AM
Well, it is simple. A minority of Brazilians is rich. The vast majority of the population, no matter if "white", "pardo" or "black", lives in poverty. It is not because the tiny elite is almost wholly european derived that the majority of largely euro influenced Brazilian individuals will be found there. It is not!


Cant u read? A century ago virtually everybody in Brazil were poor, including the recently arrived European immigrants. The difference is that, since then, most whites moved upward socially, while most Blacks and Brown remained poor. Claiming that you have a poor background is just pathetic, because everybody in Brazil has a poor background. What matters is the socio-economic situation now, not a century ago.

curupira
06-11-2014, 04:01 AM
But what about the lower middle class, middle class, upper middle class and the rich? .

The very rich, our billionaires, are almost entirely European, Near eastern, with one or two Chinese thrown in. A much greater % of Jews is to be found among them than in the general population, also.

curupira
06-11-2014, 04:04 AM
I look for the truth bro! :thumb001:


You look for European ancestry and only.

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 04:06 AM
"Blackest" but still around ~70% non african according to the genetic studies. In 1965, American researchers found out the Northeast of Brazil to be 65% european, 25% african, and 9% native american (Human Biology, vol 37, number 1, led by the geneticists D. F. Roberts e R. W. Hiorns), found out the average the Northeastern Brazilian to be predominantly European in ancestry (65%), with minor but important African and Native American contributions (25% and 9%). Belo Horizonte is likely more African than that, and I have no problems with it, my family lives there, and I like it very much! :)

lol nobody is denying that the main component in the Northeast is European, do not worry about it. The difference is that there is a great non-White component, mostly African, and not Amerindian like you claim/wish. But, since you follow the one-drop theory any drop on euro admixture makes people white, I still dont know why only 25% of Northeastern claim to be white in the census. kkkkkkk


And yes, Belo Horizonte has many black people but, unlike the northeast, it also has a substancial white population, even though the majority is brown. Neverthless, all outsiders who come to BH claim that the native women are among the most beautiful in Brazil, while in your beloved Northeast tourists usually say Northeasterns are ugly...:picard2: In the and, what matters is beauty, and not what region is whiter or not, because it doesnt matter to anyone, only to retards

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 04:08 AM
Well, it is simple. A minority of Brazilians is rich. The vast majority of the population, no matter if "white", "pardo" or "black" lives in poverty. It is not because the tiny elite is almost wholly european derived that the majority of largely euro influenced Brazilian individuals will be found there. It is not!

Wrong. Brazil now has a consistent upper middle-class, and its mostly white or off-white. The lower middle-class, or Class C, is mostly brown with many whites and some blacks. The lower classes are mostly brown/black.

ps: a few months ago you claimed few Brazilians were poor after the years of PT administration :picard2: ashamed of your supporting past? kkk

curupira
06-11-2014, 04:08 AM
What did you smoke? Where did I claim that a drop of euro admixture would turn people "white"? On this thread, I argued with another poster I don't subscribe to the use of the words "white", "pardo" or "black". Obviously those individuals are multiracial, but it is interesting to learn what are the general outlines of their ancestral composition. That is called looking for the truth.


lol nobody is denying that the main component in the Northeast is European, do not worry about it. The difference is that there is a great non-White component, mostly African, and not Amerindian like you claim/wish. But, since you follow the one-drop theory any drop on euro admixture makes people white, I still dont know why only 25% of Northeastern claim to be white in the census. kkkkkkk


And yes, Belo Horizonte has many black people but, unlike the northeast, it also has a substancial white population, even though the majority is brown. Neverthless, all outsiders who come to BH claim that the native women are among the most beautiful in Brazil, while in your beloved Northeast tourists usually say Northeasterns are ugly...:picard2: In the and, what matters is beauty, and not what region is whiter or not, because it doesnt matter to anyone, only to retards

curupira
06-11-2014, 04:10 AM
This is what I had said on this thread:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?127989-Brazilian-23andme-results!/page5


They are outdated, yes. Read modern anthropology and sociology researchers, particularly in the US. "White" and "mulatto" are words invented by europeans during colonialism. As Tagore well put it, they are names made up by europeans to call other peoples and themselves. The results I posted show details of the ancestry of Brazilians, and you just reduced them to a couple of outdated words, erasing the native american ancestry, f.e. Someone who is 61% euro, 28% african and 5% native in ancestry is something else other than "mulatto".

curupira
06-11-2014, 04:13 AM
The lower classes are mostly brown/black.

30% of the poorest Brazilians reported to the census as "whites". That's not very different from the 46% regarding the whole population.

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 04:14 AM
What did you smoke? Where did I claim that a drop of euro admixture would turn people "white"? On this thread, I argued with another poster I don't subscribe to the use of the words "white", "pardo" or "black". Obviously those individuals are multiracial, but it is interesting to learn what are the general outlines of their ancestral composition. That is called looking for the truth.

You replaced the term "white" by "European ancestry" which, in the end, is the same stuff or an euphemism. And yes, you use the one-drop theory, since you dedicate your life with this pathetic crusade to european-wash Brazil as if would make us better at foreign people eyes. It makes me conclude that you are too much worried about foreign people opinion, reflecting your "complexo de vira-lata"

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 04:15 AM
30% of the poorest Brazilians reported to the census as "whites". That's not very different from the 46% regarding the whole population.

Half of these poor "whites" look like Ronaldo or darker. :picard2: Real white-looking Brazilians are largely concentrated in the middle-upper class

Isleño
06-11-2014, 04:15 AM
I look for the truth bro! :thumb001:

Yes, I'm looking for the truth also. Here in the U.S., I've met quite a few Brazilians, and they were whites most of them, some were pardo. I've seen pics of crowds in Brazil where there were many whites. Of course this has a lot to do with area and class, just as it does in the U.S.. But I will search for a more comprehensive study, because this one that was posted is using samples from only the lowest socioeconomic strata and we know that most whites will not be in that. Also, we need to find out how much of the population lives below or at the poverty line or near it. This will make a difference too. This is a bunch of work that takes some time, but tomorrow I will look into it because it's late here in my section of my country.

curupira
06-11-2014, 04:17 AM
The look of Ronaldo is more common in Rio, Minas and Bahia. Not really in many other parts of Brazil. My relatives come from the lowest classes of Brazil, as those of many other people of other Brazilians who scored high euro on 23andme and elsewhere.

As I said, I come from the lower classes, as many of the Brazilians tested on 23andme (and I scored on the 95+ range, with an almost entirely colonial background and coming from the most African region - the mining region - in one of our most African states, Minas Gerais). I personally know examples of many who come from the lower classes, who scored similarly. This is my grandmother, she lived in a very poor neighbourhood in Belo Horizonte (one would say "vila" not to say "favela"), and so did her sister (you can tell it just by looking at her house on this pic, she is the woman to the far right):

http://i59.tinypic.com/2ch4byx.jpg


Half of these poor "whites" look like Ronaldo or darker. :picard2: Real white-looking Brazilians are largely concentrated in the middle-upper class

Lucinho
06-11-2014, 04:21 AM
The look of Ronaldo is common in Rio, Minas and Bahia. Not really in many other parts of Brazil. My relatives come from the lowest classes of Brazil, as those of many other people of other Brazilians who scored high euro on 23andme and elsewhere.

As I said, I come from the lower classes, as many of the Brazilians tested on 23andme (and I scored on the 95+ range, with an almost entirely colonial background and coming from the most African region - the mining region - in one of our most African states, Minas Gerais). I personally know examples of many who come from the lower classes, who scored similarly. This is my grandmother, she lived in a very poor neighbourhood in Belo Horizonte (one would say "vila" not to say "favela"), and so did her sister (you can tell it just by looking at her house on this pic, she is the woman to the far right):

http://i59.tinypic.com/2ch4byx.jpg
Why are you posting the same text again? Well, I'm leaving... I want to preserve my sanity. I'm afraid your problem can affect me though osmosis!

curupira
06-11-2014, 04:23 AM
Because you came back again with an outlandish claim, trying to erase the substantial number of highly euro in ancestry Brazilian individuals who live in poverty. Since that's the condition of many of them, having witnessed it myself, I feel that's an important point to make.


Why are you posting the same text again? Well, I'm leaving... I want to preserve my mental illness. I'm afraid your problem can affect me though osmosis!

curupira
06-11-2014, 11:07 AM
To keep on topic, a few more Brazilian results:

Composition results of a Brazilian (unknown location, and a cousin of mine; people of Japanese ancestry aren't really uncommon in certain places)

http://i58.tinypic.com/521l3r.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian whose ancestry is from Rio de Janeiro, Pará (Northern Brazil), and also from Rio Grande do Norte and Ceará (Northeast Brazil):

http://i58.tinypic.com/scsu2e.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from Rio de Janeiro state:

Rio de Janeiro state:

http://www.quetalviajar.com/images/mapas/mapa-rio-de-janeiro.jpg

http://i61.tinypic.com/35c2weg.jpg

Sikeliot
06-11-2014, 09:13 PM
http://i61.tinypic.com/aau0jd.jpg

curupira
06-11-2014, 11:11 PM
^ That one just accepted my invitation. His ancestry is from Rio Grande do Sul, Minas Gerais and Rio de Janeiro.

curupira
06-12-2014, 12:41 AM
An interesting result of a Brazilian from São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro and Minas Gerais (he has recent Lebanese and Italian ancestries, as well as more distant Portuguese and Irish ones):

http://i62.tinypic.com/2qknloo.jpg

The states of São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro and Minas Gerais:

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg
http://www.quetalviajar.com/images/mapas/mapa-rio-de-janeiro.jpg
http://www.minasgerais.com.br/wp-content/themes/portal-setur/images/mapa-sobre.jpg

curupira
06-12-2014, 05:15 PM
* Composition results of a Brazilian from Pernambuco and Bahia (Northeast Brazil) as well as from Minas Gerais; and half of her ancestry is English, quite visible on her results:

http://i60.tinypic.com/250knq8.jpg

* Composition results of a Brazilian from Bahias and Alagoas (Northeast Brazil):

The state of Alagoas:

http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/al%20mapa-alagoas.jpg

The state of Bahia:

http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/ba%20mapa-bahia.jpg

http://i61.tinypic.com/332rkti.jpg

* Composition results of a Brazilian from Santa Catarina (mainly Portuguese ancestry but he also reports German and Italian ancestries):

The state of Santa Catarina:

http://www.mundoeducacao.com/upload/conteudo/santa%20catarina.jpg

http://i59.tinypic.com/wu5ahl.jpg

RMuller
06-12-2014, 11:50 PM
How much Amerindian,Euro,SSA do you think Neymar would score on 23andme?
What Latino countries do you think he can pass in???

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/si/dam/assets/130611221816-neymar-barcelona-single-image-cut.jpg


http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2014/0308/soc_g_neymar01jr_576x324.jpg


https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRQKCbWT33Ro8NUmDzXSC_Es4bKE8A9S mU0NRfjRpuuCrW6HcLU

http://ukzambians.co.uk/home/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/neymar.jpg

https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRf5rEsPg7KY1qRCzN1_qe40mMAl8I--d2DaQIdPoeQ15lm1xfbsQ

http://www.tipsteacher.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Neymar-wallpapers-2014-fwc.jpg

curupira
06-13-2014, 01:28 AM
How much Amerindian,Euro,SSA do you think Neymar would score on 23andme?

I'd guess he'd score somewhere between 50% to 60% euro, the rest african, and some minor native american. I have posted a result here which could be similar to his: http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?127989-Brazilian-23andme-results!/page3 (at the bottom of the page).

By the way, these are the parents of Neymar (his mother at least looks quite pred. euro):

http://i57.tinypic.com/i5d8hc.jpg

And his father looks just very mixed:

http://i60.tinypic.com/2469amu.jpg

Argentano
06-13-2014, 03:16 AM
A more clear photo of neymars mother

http://gatasnegrasbrasileiras.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/mc3a3enadineopaineymareairmc3a3rafaela2.jpg

curupira
06-13-2014, 11:41 AM
I had not seen that pic of his mother. I'd still believe Neymar's ancestry to be something like 50%-60% euro, 40%-50% african and <10% native american. Here other pics of his mother (with the links showing her as his mother in the pics I'm posting):

Link proving the woman in the pic is his mother (http://www.redebomdia.com.br/blog/detalhe/2645/Mae+de+Neymar+e+discreta)
http://www.diariosp.com.br/diariosaopaulo/upload/blog_conteudo/1324212686neymar_mae_raphaelmesquita_div_60310x316 .jpg

The link proving the woman in the pic is his mother (http://entretenimento.r7.com/famosos-e-tv/fotos/relaxa-bruna-neymar-curte-festa-com-a-mae-no-rio-21072013)
http://img.r7.com/images/2013/07/21/09_52_29_913_file?dimensions=780x536&no_crop=true


A more clear photo of neymars mother

RMuller
06-13-2014, 02:47 PM
A more clear photo of neymars mother

http://gatasnegrasbrasileiras.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/mc3a3enadineopaineymareairmc3a3rafaela2.jpg

Neymar looked very black as a kid.

RMuller
06-13-2014, 02:51 PM
I had not seen that pic of his mother. I'd still believe Neymar's ancestry to be something like 50%-60% euro, 40%-50% african and <10% native american.

Neymar's dad looks to be 50-60% SSA. Neymar is probably around 30% SSA.

Smaug
06-13-2014, 03:06 PM
^ I always thought your were a Southern Brazilian because you look European/White and had very little admixture.

South Brazil is not the only part of Brazil where Whites can be found. Actually, the most European state in Brazil, São Paulo, is not in Southern Brazil.

Smaug
06-13-2014, 03:11 PM
Funny, a few months ago you claimed Brazil was a paradise under PT administration...ashamed to support them after all those corruption scandals and street protests? :picard2:

You registered last month. Gotcha. :D

Smaug
06-13-2014, 03:15 PM
An interesting result of a Brazilian from São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro and Minas Gerais (he has recent Lebanese and Italian ancestries, as well as more distant Portuguese and Irish ones):

http://i62.tinypic.com/2qknloo.jpg

The states of São Paulo, Rio de Janeiro and Minas Gerais:

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg
http://www.quetalviajar.com/images/mapas/mapa-rio-de-janeiro.jpg
http://www.minasgerais.com.br/wp-content/themes/portal-setur/images/mapa-sobre.jpg

Irish! Very nice!

Antimage
06-13-2014, 03:20 PM
Neymar would score a lot less than 50% black...I think he isn't more than 30%black.
his father looks like a balanced mulatto and his mother is predominantly european, do the math. Aside from his negro hair(wich he straightens) ,neymar doesn't look negro. Yesterday when I was watching brazil vs croatia match my mother saw neymar and he said "that guy looks a bit like that spanish singer iglesias something"

curupira
06-13-2014, 09:13 PM
Results of an interesting relatively close cousin of mine (on 23andme), from Belo Horizonte, Minas Gerais (my parent's home). She is half Ashkenazi Jewish, half colonial Brazilian:

http://i61.tinypic.com/2hyj72t.jpg

curupira
06-15-2014, 12:43 AM
Results of a Brazilian from the interior of Ceará (and my cousin on 23andme):

The state of Ceará:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7c/Ceara_in_Brazil.svg/250px-Ceara_in_Brazil.svg.png

http://i62.tinypic.com/sqgnjc.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from São Paulo and Paraná states:

The state of São Paulo:

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-sao-paulo.jpg

The state of Paraná:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0e/Parana_in_Brazil.svg/250px-Parana_in_Brazil.svg.png

http://i62.tinypic.com/16kp1lw.jpg

alpha
06-16-2014, 03:21 AM
48224

curupira
06-16-2014, 02:59 PM
^ Ashkenazi Jewish results are not really representative, they're a very small number. I posted one result of a half Ashkenazi Jewish result because I found its colonial ancestry (Brazilian side) interesting. I could have posted 100% Jewish results from Brazil, but Jews are a group of their own.

Results of a Brazilian who has more recent Italian ancestry, but also older ancestors in Brazil too, from São Paulo state:

State of São Paulo:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-sao-paulo.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/11h574l.jpg

Lemonhead
06-16-2014, 08:22 PM
South Brazil is not the only part of Brazil where Whites can be found. Actually, the most European state in Brazil, São Paulo, is not in Southern Brazil.

I thought the most European state in Brazil was Santa Catarina.

Smaug
06-16-2014, 10:27 PM
I thought the most European state in Brazil was Santa Catarina.

Not really.

Lucinho
06-17-2014, 06:40 PM
I thought the most European state in Brazil was Santa Catarina.

Yes it is. The ancestry of people in Santa Catarina is 80% European, according to this genetic study. São Paulo's ancestry is only 62.9% European and 25.5% African and 11.6% Amerindian http://www.plosone.org/article/fetchObject.action?uri=info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0075145.g003&representation=PNG_M

curupira
06-17-2014, 09:11 PM
There is another study on São Paulo too, which shows a higher input (~80% too):


The Unweighted Pair-Group Method with Arithmetic Mean (UPGMA) tree constructed based on genetic distances revealed that the present population was grouped with Europeans, and separated from African and Amerindian populations. Estimates of admixture components based on the gene identity method revealed 79% European, 14% African, and 7% Amerindian contributions to this Brazilian population sample. Am. J. Hum. Biol. 18:702–705, 2006. © 2006 Wiley-Liss, Inc.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ajhb.20474/abstract

Historically, São Paulo state received far many more european immigrants than the whole of Southern Brazil, and both São Paulo state and Southern Brazil had about the same populations by the time substantial immigration to Brazil began.

São Paulo state alone received the vast majority of immigrants (about 1.2 million Italian immigrants and certainly the majority of the almost 800000 Spaniards who came to Brazil).


Dos cerca de 1,5 milhão de italianos que imigraram para o Brasil entre os anos de 1875 e 1935, 1,2 milhão deles foram para São Paulo, 100 mil para o Rio Grande do Sul, 60 mil para Minas Gerais, 25 mil para o Espírito Santo, 25 mil para Santa Catarina e 20 mil para o Paraná
http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imigra%C3%A7%C3%A3o_italiana_no_Brasil


In the state of São Paulo, destination of the majority of Spanish immigrants (about 75% of the total), 60% were from Andalusia,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Brazilian


Yes it is. The ancestry of people in Santa Catarina is 80% European, according to this genetic study. São Paulo's ancestry is only 62.9% European and 25.5% African and 11.6% Amerindian http://www.plosone.org/article/fetchObject.action?uri=info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0075145.g003&representation=PNG_M

curupira
06-19-2014, 10:37 PM
Composition results of a Brazilian from São Paulo state:

State of São Paulo:

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-sao-paulo.jpg

http://i62.tinypic.com/20hvfac.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from Minas Gerais:

Minas Gerais state:
http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-minas-gerais.jpg

http://i59.tinypic.com/lxqc2.jpg

Lucinho
06-20-2014, 07:02 PM
Historically, São Paulo state received far many more european immigrants than the whole of Southern Brazil, and both São Paulo state and Southern Brazil had about the same populations by the time substantial immigration to Brazil began.


But in the following decades São Paulo received millions of non-white migrants, mostly from the Northeast, while Southern Brazil virtually never received any internal migration, except North Paraná that received many people from São Paulo.

The same goes for Rio de Janeiro, which received many more Europeans than the South, but Rio already had a large non-White population and it also received a large number of migrants from the Northeast as well.

So, the South remained more European in ancestry than both Rio or São Paulo

curupira
06-20-2014, 10:10 PM
Not really. Northeast Brazilian immigration is a recent phenomenon, from the 70's onwards. And São Paulo also received immigrants from other places, like from Paraná. That's why if you have a look at genetic studies, the difference isn't significant at all.


But in the following decades São Paulo received millions of non-white migrants, mostly from the Northeast, while Southern Brazil virtually never received any internal migration, except North Paraná that received many people from São Paulo.

The same goes for Rio de Janeiro, which received many more Europeans than the South, but Rio already had a large non-White population and it also received a large number of migrants from the Northeast as well.

Lucinho
06-22-2014, 02:15 AM
edit

Lucinho
06-22-2014, 02:16 AM
lol, you're each day more stupid and ridiculous. Northeast migration is huge since the 1930s. São Paulo had a huge white majority before the mass migration of Northeasterns. Many of the non-whites there are northeastern and their children. And also, São Paulo received large number of African slaves during the coffee cycle, whereas Africa slavery was very limited in Santa Catarina

And São Paulo is much less white than Santa Catarina, according to the census Santa Catarina is 85% white and São Paulo is only 63%, there is a 22% difference. . You probably have never been to any of these states.

curupira
06-22-2014, 01:07 PM
I have been to both states, several times (likely a lot more than you). São Paulo state received many more european (and near eastern) immigrants than Santa Catarina. Northeast migration to São Paulo really took off in the 70's. And even then the average northeast Brazilian is not that far or entirely different from the average of either São Paulo or Santa Catarina. The census is not really reliable. Genetic studies are safer since they measure actual ancestry. Self reported ancestry and actual ancestry are two different things. According to a genetic study from 2011, 'pardos' from Fortaleza, f.e, are 75% european on average, whereas 'whites' from Santa Catarina would be 86% european (http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0017063)

You clearly need to study more. Northeast migration to Southeast Brazil only became important in the 60's, not in the 30's.


Devido principalmente ao problema da exploração social e do trabalho na economia rural nordestina, relacionada e eventualmente justificada pela seca, somados com a grande oferta de empregos de outras regiões principalmente nas décadas de 60, 70 e 80, em especial na região Sudeste, verificou-se um pronunciado fluxo migratório de parte da população nordestina para outras regiões do país.
http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Migra%C3%A7%C3%A3o_nordestina

http://i61.tinypic.com/11hgcpj.png




lol, you're each day more stupid and ridiculous. Northeast migration is huge since the 1930s. São Paulo had a huge white majority before the mass migration of Northeasterns. Many of the non-whites there are northeastern and their children. And also, São Paulo received large number of African slaves during the coffee cycle, whereas Africa slavery was very limited in Santa Catarina

And São Paulo is much less white than Santa Catarina, according to the census Santa Catarina is 85% white and São Paulo is only 63%, there is a 22% difference. . You probably have never been to any of these states.

Lemonhead
07-12-2014, 01:40 AM
http://oi62.tinypic.com/1zvsutg.jpg

curupira
07-24-2014, 04:23 PM
Composition results of a Brazilian from the interior of São Paulo state (of immigrant Spanish/Andalusian - and Italian backgrounds; though rarely talked about, Brazil received many Spanish immigrants after the independence of Latin America, many more than Germans, f.e; most of these Spaniards settled in São Paulo state. Spanish immigration was the third largest among immigrant groups in Brazil; about 750,000 immigrants entered Brazil from Spanish ports; a number smaller only than that of Argentina and Cuba after the independence of Latin American countries):

http://i57.tinypic.com/34yvgux.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from Ceará (the highest native american score among Brazilians I have seen so far on 23andme):

http://i989.photobucket.com/albums/af18/oditous2/Americas/JVCeara_zps7953c866.jpg~original

Composition results of a Brazilian whose ancestors (Luso-Brazilian) come from Pernambuco, Rio and São Paulo (and he is also 1/8 English):

http://i62.tinypic.com/e1b1qv.jpg

curupira
07-27-2014, 02:12 PM
Results of a Brazilian from Amazonas (Northern Brazil), with ancestors in Ceará & Pernambuco. Many Northeast Brazilians migrated to Northern Brazil. That was actually the first great migration of Northeast Brazilians. There were droughts in the XIX century, a few major ones by the end of it, so many settled there.
´
http://www.brasilescola.com/upload/e/mapa-amazonas.jpg
http://i989.photobucket.com/albums/af18/oditous2/AMCEPE_zpsc5e44477.jpg~original

Composition results of a Brazilian from Alagoas (mtDNA haplogroup is european, in spite of a quite diverse background):

http://www.mundoeducacao.com/upload/conteudo/alagoas.jpg
http://i62.tinypic.com/2h6u9lf.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from the interior of São Paulo state (my cousin, he lists a few famous colonial surnames from São Paulo state):

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg
http://i57.tinypic.com/2chmeps.jpg

curupira
07-31-2014, 10:38 PM
From São Paulo state, a 1/4 Portuguese and also of recent Italian ancestry:

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg
http://i61.tinypic.com/23hknit.jpg

From the state of Santa Catarina, European ancestry mentioned was Azorean:

http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/sc%20mapa-santa-catarina%20.jpg
http://i61.tinypic.com/122ddoh.jpg

From Natal, the capital of Rio Grande do Norte (Northeast Brazil):

http://www.brasilescola.com/upload/e/mapa-rio-grande-do-norte.jpg
http://i57.tinypic.com/w9vf60.jpg

curupira
08-04-2014, 03:06 PM
2 more:

A Brazilian who is half Lebanese, part Italian, but also of older ancestry (shown by Iberian score and his 0.7% native american ancestry), from São Paulo and Minas Gerais:

http://i60.tinypic.com/2uyk5n4.jpg

A Brazilian who listed Spanish and Italian surnames, but also of older ancestry (shown by the native american ancestry score, 0.3%), the state from which her family hails from was not specified:

http://i60.tinypic.com/s6n3ie.jpg

curupira
08-04-2014, 09:26 PM
From Salvador, the capital of Bahia:

http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/ba%20mapa-bahia.jpg
http://i57.tinypic.com/mmwpwj.jpg

From the interior of São Paulo state, mainly Italian ancestry, but also has minor colonial roots:

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg
http://i59.tinypic.com/ofc2gh.jpg

Feral
08-08-2014, 05:39 PM
y u doin dis, forum! dis trid is tu lon! I don't wanna do the average in dis one, someone else would have to. :v

Brighton
08-08-2014, 06:19 PM
y u doin dis, forum! dis trid is tu lon! I don't wanna do the average in dis one, someone else would have to. :v

Don't worry mate, already did

curupira
08-09-2014, 01:41 AM
Brazilian of recent Spanish and Italian ancestries, but clearly has older ancestries coming from Brazil (from São Paulo state):

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg
http://i61.tinypic.com/2e23uj9.jpg

Brazilian from Santa Catarina (he mentioned to me German ancestry, but his results show a very predominant degree of Portuguese ancestry, and at least partly coming from colonial times, judging by the little native american score):

http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/sc%20mapa-santa-catarina%20.jpg
http://i60.tinypic.com/ffbgiq.jpg

This one is half Italian, half colonial Brazilian (a cousin on 23andme), from São Paulo state:

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg
http://i62.tinypic.com/14ifn1w.jpg

Another half Italian, half colonial Brazilian, from São Paulo state too:

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg
http://i57.tinypic.com/298yz5.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from São Paulo and Minas Gerais states:

http://mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg
http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-minas-gerais.jpg
http://i57.tinypic.com/10ib8ut.jpg

Brighton
08-09-2014, 07:40 PM
Many Brazilians with British/Irish! Wouldn't have expected so!

Haven't you found Mulattos from Piaui, Bahia, etc.?? :P

curupira
08-09-2014, 08:41 PM
I have posted Brazilians from Piauí and Bahia here, just look on this thread (beginning on the 1st page).


Many Brazilians with British/Irish! Wouldn't have expected so!

Haven't you found Mulattos from Piaui, Bahia, etc.?? :P

curupira
08-09-2014, 09:02 PM
Results of a Brazilian from Minas Gerais:

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-minas-gerais.jpg
http://i61.tinypic.com/adbv6c.jpg

Results of a Brazilian from Pernambuco and Paraíba (Northeast Brazil):

http://mochileiro.tur.br/pb%20imagem%20mapa-paraiba.jpg
http://mochileiro.tur.br/pe%20mapa-pernambuco.jpg
http://i57.tinypic.com/4g4yfq.jpg

curupira
08-13-2014, 04:29 AM
Haven't you found from Piau?? :P

Besides those I have posted already, here is another one who has just accepted my invitation, from Piauí and Ceará, Northeast Brazil:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ec/Piaui_in_Brazil.svg/250px-Piaui_in_Brazil.svg.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cd/Brazil_State_Ceara.svg/300px-Brazil_State_Ceara.svg.png
http://i62.tinypic.com/2hfjf4n.png

Brighton
08-13-2014, 04:38 AM
Besides those I have posted already, here is another one who has just accepted my invitation, from Piauí and Ceará, Northeast Brazil:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ec/Piaui_in_Brazil.svg/250px-Piaui_in_Brazil.svg.png
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cd/Brazil_State_Ceara.svg/300px-Brazil_State_Ceara.svg.png
http://i62.tinypic.com/2hfjf4n.png

Cool beans

Wouldn't have guessed people from Piaui were that European!

curupira
08-13-2014, 04:39 AM
Northeast Brazil is very badly misrepresented, particularly by Southern and Southeast Brazilians. Look for Piauí (or its capital Teresina), Ceará (or its capital Fortaleza), Rio Grande do Norte, Pernambuco, Northeast Brazilian states, on 23andme. You'll see it.


Cool beans

Wouldn't have guessed people from Piaui were that European!

Brighton
08-13-2014, 04:45 AM
Northeast Brazil is very badly misrepresented, particularly by Southern and Southeast Brazilians. Look for Piauí (or its capital Teresina), Ceará (or its capital Fortaleza), Rio Grande do Norte, Pernambuco, Northeast Brazilian states, on 23andme. You'll see it.

Haha alright!

curupira
08-13-2014, 12:15 PM
Composition results of a Brazilian from Rio Grande do Sul:

http://www.brasilescola.com/upload/e/mapa-rio-grande-do-sul.jpg

http://i61.tinypic.com/314xfmv.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from Minas Gerais:

http://www.combateadengue.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/mapa-minas-gerais.jpg

http://i58.tinypic.com/feqbnc.png

Bell Beaker
09-04-2014, 12:47 PM
To who doesn't know Brazilian people, from this results would think that Brazilian people are mainly white! :cool:

curupira
09-04-2014, 12:48 PM
According to genetic studies, Brazilians are mainly european, not as high as the average 23andme result, but even so, pretty much so.

This study from 2011 specifically aimed describing the composition of the country with samples from nearly all regions (almost 1000 samples), with "white", "pardo" and "black" samples according to their respective proportions. The samples came for the most part from blood donors (http://www.amigodoador.com.br/estatisticas.html), which for the most part belong to the poorest classes of Brazil, therefore socio-economic levels mirror somewhat the situation of Brazil, where most people belong to the lower strata of society.

It has found out what many already knew, that "whites", "pardos" and "blacks" generally have all three ancestral components, namely: European, SSA African and Native American ancestries in varying degrees.

http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0017063?imageURI=info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0017063.g002
http://i59.tinypic.com/v7cqj9.png

Brazil, according to a 2013 study (the main difference from the 2011 study: the 2013 was based on random urban samples, the 2011 study was based on 'white', 'pardo' and 'black' samples according to their respective proportions. On this, the 2011 study may have had a better strategy. On the other hand, the 2013 studied focused on the urban population, which as they mentioned accounts for the vast majority of the Brazilian population):

http://www.plosone.org/article/fetchObject.action?uri=info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjour nal.pone.0075145&representation=PDF

http://i44.tinypic.com/29lil3b.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/15nsqw3.jpg


To who doesn't know Brazilian people, from this results would think that Brazilian people are mainly white! :cool:

Bell Beaker
09-04-2014, 12:52 PM
According to genetic studies, Brazilians are mainly european, not as high as the average 23andme result, but even so, pretty much so.

Too me a White person as to be somehow 92/93% European. Many Brazilians here score even higher then 95% in some States outside the South and São Paulo.

True White/European Brazilian is not high then 30%.

There isn't more?

curupira
09-04-2014, 12:55 PM
I'm speaking of the composition of Brazil, the whole of it, which is what really matters. European genes account for the majority of the genes of the Brazilian population gene pool, with a large african and a smaller but somewhat significant native american ancestry (particularly in some regions). As for individuals who score over 90% euro, they're found throughout Brazil.


Too me a White person as to be somehow 92/93% European. Many Brazilians here score even higher then 95% in some States outside the South and São Paulo. ?

Bell Beaker
09-04-2014, 01:05 PM
I'm speaking of the composition of Brazil, the whole of it, which is what really matters. European genes account for the majority of the genes of the Brazilian population gene pool, with a large african and a smaller but somewhat signifcant native american ancestry (particularly in some regions). As for individuals who score over 90% euro, they're found throughout Brazil.

Strange. From 1500 to 1822, about 700,000 Portuguese Colonizers (white ones) emmigrated to Brazil. From that same period i think that Black Slaves was at least 4 times bigger. There are stats who say that bettween 1550 and 1850 (300 years), 3,5 million Black slaves arrived at Brazil. I know that from the 1870's to the 1950's 4 million Europeans arrived, but i still think that the average Brazilian has 60%/70% of European blood is too high!

curupira
09-04-2014, 01:08 PM
It is not strange at all. ~75% of the Africans who came to Brazil were males, with a life expectancy of about 10 years.


Os escravos homens, jovens, mais fortes e saudáveis eram os mais valorizados. Havia um grande desequilíbrio demográfico entre homens e mulheres na população de escravos. No período 1837-1840, por exemplo, os homens constituíam 73,7% e as mulheres apenas 26,3% da população escrava. Os navios negreiros embarcavam mais homens do que mulheres. Além disto, os donos de escravos não se preocupavam com a reprodução natural da escravaria, porque era mais barato comprar escravos recém trazidos pelo tráfico internacional do que gastar com a alimentação de crianças. O número de crianças era inferior, de 3% a 6% dos embarcados.
http://cefargrupo5.blogspot.com/2010/11/o-trafico-negreiro.html


Os maus tratos, as excessivas horas de trabalho e a má alimentação faziam com que um escravo adulto tivesse uma expectativa de vida de, no máximo, dez anos.
http://www.mundoeducacao.com/historiadobrasil/escravidao-no-brasil.htm

As Saint Hilaire himself put it: 'an infinity of blacks died without having issue' (in 'Trip to the province of São Paulo', page 69, Livraria Itatiaia Editora Ltda, 1976).

Besides, Brazil was populated by native americans, it was not empty. The European males who came here controlled the territory and had a higher reproductive success. Some regions were never really hit by the colonization, like Northern Brazil, parts of the Central West and other parts of Northeast Brazil.

Later on, between 4 to 5 million europeans, not mentioning Near Easterners and even East Asians arrived. The results make sense, and the studies themselves explain it.


Strange. From 1500 to 1822, about 700,000 Portuguese Colonizers (white ones) emmigrated to Brazil. From that same period i think that Black Slaves was at least 4 times bigger. There are stats who say that bettween 1550 and 1850 (300 years), 3,5 million Black slaves arrived at Brazil. I know that from the 1870's to the 1950's 4 million Europeans arrived, but i still think that the average Brazilian has 60%/70% of European blood.

Bell Beaker
09-04-2014, 01:15 PM
I know the Native history. But i expected more Black influence on Brazilian pool gene. And Brazilian Average Pardos with Native Blood is significant lesser than Mexican Pardos one.

What you think about Pele, is he full Black? It seems to be? And Ronaldinho? To me he is 85-90% Black.

curupira
09-04-2014, 01:18 PM
People like Pelé are a minority even in our most african states: Rio, Minas Gerais and Bahia. Even then, Pelé would likely not score over 90% african. One would have to see his results to be sure though. Ronaldinho is more mixed, much less african than that.


What you think about Pele, is he full Black? It seems to be? And Ronaldinho? To me he is 85-90% Black.

Bell Beaker
09-04-2014, 01:20 PM
People like Pelé are a minority even in our most african states: Rio, Minas Gerais and Bahia. Even then, Pelé would likely not score over 90% african. One would have to see his results to be sure though. Ronaldinho is more mixed, much less african than that.

Ok. Is there any full Black African in Brazil? There are some few Afro-Americans who are.

curupira
09-04-2014, 01:22 PM
African input in Brazil is largely exaggerated, both out of ignorance and out of malice. Africans were employed in significant numbers only in some places, like coastal Northeast (sugar plantations), the mining region of Minas Gerais, the cottom boom in Maranhão, and later on during the coffee boom in the XIX century (Rio, part of São Paulo and part of Minas). It is present in most of Brazil, but at lower levels. And even at the core region, that dynamic I have mentioned (lower life expectancy added to an overwhelmingly male slave population) reduced their impact. Which is present nonetheless and important, but it would have been even more so had that dynamic not been present.


I know the Native history. But i expected more Black influence on Brazilian pool gene..

curupira
09-04-2014, 01:25 PM
I haven't seen any fully African American on 23andme. The very highest are at the lower 90's. Most fall in the 70% to 90% african range. The highest African result in Brazil I have seen so far is about 80%, and I have posted it on the first page. It is the result of a person from Bahia.


Ok. Is there any full Black African in Brazil? There are some few Afro-Americans who are.

curupira
09-06-2014, 09:38 PM
A few more who accepted my invitations... since Brazil is a country with a continental size, it is informative to post their ancestral locations too:

This one was born in Brazil, to Portuguese parents, but he has not informed where he was born in Brazil:

http://i57.tinypic.com/2nw0olk.jpg

This one has ancestors coming from São Paulo and Rio (in Southeast Brazil), Rio Grande do Sul (in Southern Brazil) and Pernambuco and Ceará (in Northeast Brazil) but he did not inform where he was born in Brazil:

http://i58.tinypic.com/24o3tpj.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from São Paulo state (all 4 grandparents were born in Portugal):

http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg

http://i58.tinypic.com/1cdxi.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from São Paulo (part Ashkenazi, largely Italian and also colonial Brazilian):

http://www.mochileiro.tur.br/SP%20mapa2.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/t0gvpv.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from the state of Rio Grande do Sul (in Southern Brazil):

http://www.duplipensar.net/images/geografia/mapa-rio-grande-do-sul.jpg

http://i57.tinypic.com/v64y2e.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from Belo Horizonte, the capital of the state of Minas Gerais:

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-minas-gerais.jpg

http://i61.tinypic.com/107nhoi.jpg

Composition results of a Brazilian from Minas Gerais, but from a particular region within Minas Gerais called "triângulo mineiro" (the "triangle"):

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-minas-gerais.jpg

The "triangle":

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3d/MinasGerais_Meso_TrianguloMineiroAltoParaiba.svg/300px-MinasGerais_Meso_TrianguloMineiroAltoParaiba.svg.p ng

http://i60.tinypic.com/e5qws8.jpg

Composition results of another Brazilian from the "triângulo mineiro" in Minas Gerais:

http://www.qualddd.com/images/mapas/mapa-minas-gerais.jpg

The "triangle":

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3d/MinasGerais_Meso_TrianguloMineiroAltoParaiba.svg/300px-MinasGerais_Meso_TrianguloMineiroAltoParaiba.svg.p ng

http://i60.tinypic.com/1231vk4.jpg

EdAlencar
10-30-2014, 07:54 AM
Here's my Ethic Makeup from Family Tree DNA:

http://angelro.org/odin/ftdna.png

77% European
- 70% Southern Europe
- 7% Scandinavia
10% African
- 9% West Africa
- 1% East Central Africa
6% New World
- 6% Native American
5% Middle Eastern
- 4% North Africa
- 1% Eastern Middle East
2% East Asian
- 2% Northeast Asia

My family comes from theses places (Ceará, Paraíba, Pernambuco and Alagoas), I also marked the region:

http://angelro.org/odin/estados.png

And here are some pics of me:

https://scontent-a-atl.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/10580074_10204336621356624_1889018416339812693_n.j pg?oh=2e2ec81f15892c2e1c41fede46e58ea4&oe=54F29C92

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/10492318_10204147198661175_7288881953184741924_n.j pg?oh=95ec52abea892d3182e6573ff01035c3&oe=54EF1A32&__gda__=1424605732_e5a0c63e105045c57b81752138aab8b 8

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/v/t1.0-9/578144_4006604684486_603296645_n.jpg?oh=0b716d4574 89e5b247b4922afd380381&oe=54EBB8A1&__gda__=1424682526_f624ce165fee41b598ebb81920132c7 b

http://angelro.org/odin/eutoronto.jpg

I know this topic is specifically about 23andme, but since I couldn't test my autosomal DNA there, I purchased from FTDNA instead. I am the only Brazilian in this thread with more than 3% Scandinavian DNA and I wonder why that is. Is Family Tree DNA inflating my Scandinavian DNA in comparison with 23andme? I found many cousins in Norway, Sweden and Finland, one of them looked a lot like my aunts:

http://angelro.org/odin/finnish.jpg

The Finnish lady marked in red.

http://angelro.org/odin/finnish2.jpg

Finnish (3rd-5th) cousin (again) on the left, my aunt on the right. Her family never left Finland, as far as she could remember.

Argentano
10-30-2014, 03:01 PM
curupira according to what most brazilians ib the site say brazil is around 30 % white...do u agree?

i know you have seen a lot of 23andme results and tests

curupira
10-30-2014, 04:39 PM
It depends on what you call "white". From what I have seen, you seem to consider as "white" over 90% european people. I guess it is hard to estimate, I wouldn't dare to make a guess. There are many people like that, since the country has a large population, but as for the percentage, speaking of the country as a whole, I would not know. It is a minority anyway, more likely a smaller than a larger minority IMO (I'm not speaking only based on 23andme but also on my observations - as a person who traveled extensively throughout Brazil - as well as studying history, genealogy, etc; and I'm not claiming to be right, it is just a guess). I prefer to speak of Brazil in terms of its components, speaking of the country as a whole, since people have offspring in a rather freely way.


curupira according to what most brazilians ib the site say brazil is around 30 % white...do u agree?

i know you have seen a lot of 23andme results and tests

Tobi
10-30-2014, 04:43 PM
Here's my Ethic Makeup from Family Tree DNA:

http://angelro.org/odin/ftdna.png

77% European
- 70% Southern Europe
- 7% Scandinavia
10% African
- 9% West Africa
- 1% East Central Africa
6% New World
- 6% Native American
5% Middle Eastern
- 4% North Africa
- 1% Eastern Middle East
2% East Asian
- 2% Northeast Asia

My family comes from theses places (Ceará, Paraíba, Pernambuco and Alagoas), I also marked the region:

I know this topic is specifically about 23andme, but since I couldn't test my autosomal DNA there, I purchased from FTDNA instead. I am the only Brazilian in this thread with more than 3% Scandinavian DNA and I wonder why that is. Is Family Tree DNA inflating my Scandinavian DNA in comparison with 23andme? I found many cousins in Norway, Sweden and Finland, one of them looked a lot like my aunts:


The Finnish lady marked in red.


Finnish (3rd-5th) cousin (again) on the left, my aunt on the right. Her family never left Finland, as far as she can remember.

Northeast Brazil has some dutch influence, that's why you can score some scandinavian blood, imo.

EdAlencar
11-01-2014, 10:25 PM
Eu já percebi isso, algumas pessoas do nordeste ainda hoje possuem uma aparência um tanto distintiva, claramente não vem de antepassados europeus da península ibérica. E tem gente que ainda diz que os holandeses não deixaram raízes no Brasil, Hahaha

Você fez o teste ainda no Brasil ou no Canadá?

No Brasil... Só volto ao Canadá em Abril. :D Infelizmente a 23andme não envia kits ao Brasil. Eu desisti dela porque usar uma empresa intermediária pra receber e repassar meu kit ao Brasil ia demorar demais.

Also
11-01-2014, 10:29 PM
"Maid of the Mist" xD

I've been on that same boat like a decade ago.

Tobi
11-01-2014, 10:33 PM
No Brasil... Só volto ao Canadá em Abril. :D Infelizmente a 23andme não envia kits ao Brasil. Eu desisti dela porque usar uma empresa intermediária pra receber e repassar meu kit ao Brasil ia demorar demais.

Eu pensei em usar a Shipito para conseguir o kit a principio, mas pelo que eu pesquisei o problema é conseguir enviar de volta aos Estados Unidos. O kit da Family Tree pode ser despachado sem problemas então?

DanielJ1eH
11-01-2014, 10:36 PM
Muds.

Those results look like mixed soup. Brazil is a perfect example of what America will soon become if it doesn't kick the hordes of non-whites out.

Also
11-01-2014, 10:40 PM
Muds.

Those results look like mixed soup. Brazil is a perfect example of what America will soon become if it doesn't kick the hordes of non-whites out.

USA, not America.

EdAlencar
11-02-2014, 01:43 AM
Eu pensei em usar a Shipito para conseguir o kit a principio, mas pelo que eu pesquisei o problema é conseguir enviar de volta aos Estados Unidos. O kit da Family Tree pode ser despachado sem problemas então?

Sim, não tive problema nenhum. :p


Muds.

Those results look like mixed soup. Brazil is a perfect example of what America will soon become if it doesn't kick the hordes of non-whites out.

:picard2:

diogosalazar
02-21-2015, 04:25 PM
USA, not America.

I feel your pain, but it depends on where you live and/or the language you're using... Take a look at this (yep a little long but worth it):


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVMZC4y4zXU

Or if you're in a hurry: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVMZC4y4zXU&feature=youtu.be&t=12m21s

It depends on your POV; there is no central authority to determine what is the correct nomenclature.

SupaThug
02-21-2015, 04:36 PM
First 3 are obviously of recent European descent, and would be white Brazilians.

They have recent european ancestry for sure,their high amount of italian shows it,but you can find many 100% colonials who score as or more european than them.

Aodhan
02-22-2015, 05:34 PM
I can't order a 23and me in Brazil ): there is any other ancestry genetic test that I can order?

Brighton
02-24-2015, 12:55 AM
I can't order a 23and me in Brazil ): there is any other ancestry genetic test that I can order?

Family Tree I think.. don't know how accurate it is though, cos it seems 23andme is the most accurate in the market..

Maybe wait until you go to America or Europe?

Mobby
08-27-2015, 01:52 AM
By seeing most of this results it seems that if we exclude people with any recent European ancestry in Latin America, Brazilians would be the Latin Americans with most European Admixture....

Surprised to see +95% European results in the Northeast and even North of the Country.

spanish catalan
08-27-2015, 01:58 AM
They have recent european ancestry for sure,their high amount of italian shows it,but you can find many 100% colonials who score as or more european than them.

genetica europeia tem dominancia sobre a genetica amerindia?

SupaThug
08-27-2015, 02:02 AM
genetica europeia tem dominancia sobre a genetica amerindia?

Claro que não,pelo menos nunca ouvi falar dessa teoria.Não faz o menor sentido!

Mobby
08-27-2015, 02:21 AM
genetica europeia tem dominancia sobre a genetica amerindia?

Em todas as regiões do Brasil, ascendência Europeia (Portuguesa fora do Sul e São Paulo) ultrapassa os 50%.

O Brasil é mescigenado mas não é o festival multi-racial que todas as pessoas acham que o Brasil é. Talvez se a maioria das pessoas e até próprios Brasileiros dessem a sua opinião acerca das origens do povo Brasileiros muitos diriam:"A maioria de nós provavelmente é 1/3 Europeu, 1/3 Nativo e 1/3 Negro".

Quando existem Pardos que têm até 80% de ascendência Europeia.

Gostaria de saber como seria a admixture média de um Brasileiro do Sul e de São Paulo se não tivesse ocorrido a massiva imigração Europeia (e posterior migração Nordestina a partir dos anos 70).

SupaThug
08-27-2015, 02:25 AM
Em todas as regiões do Brasil, ascendência Europeia (Portuguesa fora do Sul e São Paulo) ultrapassa os 50%.

O Brasil é mescigenado mas não é o festival multi-racial que todas as pessoas acham que o Brasil é. Talvez se a maioria das pessoas e até próprios Brasileiros achassem das origens do povo Brasileiros muitos diriam:"A maioria de nós provavelmente é 1/3 Europeu, 1/3 Nativo e 1/3 Negro".

Quando existem Pardos que têm até 80% de ascendência Europeia.

Gostaria de saber como seria a admixture média de um Brasileiro do Sul e de São Paulo se não tivesse ocorrido a massiva imigração Europeia (e posterior migração Nordestina a partir dos anos 70).

Porque só o Sul e São Paulo?No Rio de Janeiro,em Minas Gerais e no Espírito Santo houve significativa imigração não portuguesa.Principalmente o Espírito Santo.

Mobby
08-27-2015, 02:35 AM
Porque só o Sul e São Paulo?No Rio de Janeiro,em Minas Gerais e no Espírito Santo houve significativa imigração não portuguesa.Principalmente o Espírito Santo.

Porque quase toda a gente de São Paulo ou do Sul tem ascendencia das recentes hordas Europeias. Enquanto esses estados não....

Minas Gerais só recebeu imigração não portuguesa significativa no sul.

SupaThug
08-27-2015, 02:41 AM
Porque quase toda a gente de São Paulo ou do Sul tem ascendencia das recentes hordas Europeias. Enquanto esses estados não....

Minas Gerais só recebeu imigração não portuguesa significativa no sul.

Não é verdade,muita gente em São Paulo não tem ascendência europeia recente,tem muito filho de nordestino por aqui,isso sem contar os descendentes dos 800,000 paulistas que já estavam aqui antes do período da imigração!No Espírito Santo 65% da população tem alguma ascendência italiana,em São Paulo são em torno de 30%!

Blake
08-27-2015, 02:43 AM
No Espírito Santo 65% da população tem alguma ascendência italiana,em São Paulo são em torno de 30%!

Wikipédia. :rolleyes:

SupaThug
08-27-2015, 02:46 AM
Wikipédia. :rolleyes:

Sim eu peguei da Wikipedia,mas os dados mesmo que um pouco exagerados para o Espírito Santo,fazem sentido.

Blake
08-27-2015, 02:47 AM
Sim eu peguei da Wikipedia,mas os dados mesmo que um pouco exagerados para o Espírito Santo,fazem sentido.

Faz sentido porque esta na Wikipedia, lógica entendida. Não!

SupaThug
08-27-2015, 02:48 AM
Faz sentido porque esta na Wikipedia, lógica entendida. Não!

http://www.revistadehistoria.com.br/secao/capa/buona-gente-capixaba

Mobby
08-27-2015, 02:48 AM
Não é verdade,muita gente em São Paulo não tem ascendência europeia recente,tem muito filho de nordestino por aqui,isso sem contar os descendentes dos 800,000 paulistas que já estavam aqui antes do período da imigração!No Espírito Santo 65% da população tem alguma ascendência italiana,em São Paulo são em torno de 30%!

???? Lol....

SupaThug
08-27-2015, 02:49 AM
???? Lol....

O que tem de engraçado...leia isso:http://www.revistadehistoria.com.br/secao/capa/buona-gente-capixaba

Blake
08-27-2015, 02:51 AM
???? Lol....

No Brasil o que mais existe é estimativa.

Thunder_shock
08-27-2015, 04:44 AM
What would you say Pele's ancestry composition is?

Blake
08-27-2015, 04:47 AM
What would you say Pele's ancestry composition is?

Black-Black.

Thunder_shock
08-27-2015, 04:52 AM
Black-Black.
Maybe there's some native American in there.
http://www.goltv.tv/images/imagenes_blogs/Pele-Santos.jpg

Blake
08-27-2015, 04:53 AM
Maybe there's some native American in there.
http://www.goltv.tv/images/imagenes_blogs/Pele-Santos.jpg

Maybe, Maybe not.

Mobby
08-27-2015, 12:42 PM
O que tem de engraçado...leia isso:http://www.revistadehistoria.com.br/secao/capa/buona-gente-capixaba

Como é que um estado que é que o mais recebeu imigrantes Italianos (70%) tem mais que um Estado isolado e insignificante.

Além de que essa teoria de Nordestinos diluirem o sangue Brasileiro é falácia já que segundo o que vi aqui, muitos casam-se com esses Nordestinos (imensos resultados de São Paulo com um alto score Italiano e uns 10%/20%/30% nativo/SSA)

SupaThug
08-27-2015, 02:09 PM
Como é que um estado que é que o mais recebeu imigrantes Italianos (70%) tem mais que um Estado isolado e insignificante.

Além de que essa teoria de Nordestinos diluirem o sangue Brasileiro é falácia já que segundo o que vi aqui, muitos casam-se com esses Nordestinos (imensos resultados de São Paulo com um alto score Italiano e uns 10%/20%/30% nativo/SSA)

São Paulo recebeu 70% dos italianos mas também recebeu 90% dos espanhóis,junto com o Rio de Janeiro recebeu a maior parte dos portuguese recentes,o maior número de nordestinos,e por aí vai.E como já disse,existiam 800,000 pessoas aqui antes do período da imigração.

SupaThug
08-27-2015, 02:09 PM
Maybe there's some native American in there.
http://www.goltv.tv/images/imagenes_blogs/Pele-Santos.jpg

Mostly SSA,some european and some amerindian!

Blake
08-27-2015, 03:23 PM
São Paulo recebeu 70% dos italianos mas também recebeu 90% dos espanhóis,junto com o Rio de Janeiro recebeu a maior parte dos portuguese recentes,o maior número de nordestinos,e por aí vai.E como já disse,existiam 800,000 pessoas aqui antes do período da imigração.

Recebeu, mas eles se deslocaram.


23andme não quer dizer muita coisa em relação à demografia do país, ainda mais que você pode escolher o teste ou enviesar a maneira como você a mostra... serve mais para falar: Olha! Tem nordestinos que são europeus! O nordeste (sul/sudeste/norte) é ______________ (subestimado/superestimado) e abrir espaço para fazer apontamentos que lhe convém.

curupira
09-02-2016, 01:34 PM
The compilation which had been posted went missing. Here are the results of 174 random Brazilian samples on 23andme:

http://i67.tinypic.com/xp55km.jpg

curupira
09-02-2016, 01:40 PM
Additionally, the poster VLHMS had made this analysis:


So recently curupira was a very nice guy and let me run some analyses in the data he collected from brazilian 23andme results.

I got 159 users with both results and location available (there might be more, I'm doing this automatically and the location is in non-formatted text, so I might have missed someone just because his location is written in unexpected formatting).

Here are the averages by state:
State: BA Sample Size:9 Euro:75.80 MENA:1.36 NA:2.52 SSA:19.28 S. Asian:0.03 Ocean.:0.00
State: PR Sample Size:8 Euro:85.55 MENA:0.66 NA:7.10 SSA:5.55 S. Asian:0.04 Ocean.:0.00
State: RS Sample Size:14 Euro:88.60 MENA:0.45 NA:3.68 SSA:6.54 S. Asian:0.04 Ocean.:0.00
State: PB Sample Size:5 Euro:86.56 MENA:1.46 NA:5.20 SSA:5.30 S. Asian:0.02 Ocean.:0.00
State: PA Sample Size:6 Euro:67.53 MENA:1.35 NA:18.05 SSA:10.27 S. Asian:0.00 Ocean.:0.00
State: PE Sample Size:10 Euro:83.54 MENA:0.85 NA:4.93 SSA:9.07 S. Asian:0.04 Ocean.:0.00
State: RN Sample Size:2 Euro:87.05 MENA:1.00 NA:5.50 SSA:3.90 S. Asian:0.15 Ocean.:0.00
State: RO Sample Size:1 Euro:90.50 MENA:1.10 NA:6.60 SSA:0.60 S. Asian:0.00 Ocean.:0.00
State: RJ Sample Size:17 Euro:88.26 MENA:0.79 NA:3.01 SSA:6.85 S. Asian:0.02 Ocean.:0.01
State: AM Sample Size:2 Euro:79.00 MENA:0.90 NA:14.25 SSA:3.95 S. Asian:0.05 Ocean.:0.00
State: AL Sample Size:3 Euro:84.03 MENA:0.63 NA:6.07 SSA:7.57 S. Asian:0.00 Ocean.:0.00
State: CE Sample Size:7 Euro:76.43 MENA:1.17 NA:8.79 SSA:11.44 S. Asian:0.03 Ocean.:0.00
State: GO Sample Size:6 Euro:76.88 MENA:0.65 NA:8.85 SSA:11.87 S. Asian:0.00 Ocean.:0.00
State: ES Sample Size:7 Euro:80.23 MENA:1.14 NA:4.51 SSA:13.24 S. Asian:0.07 Ocean.:0.00
State: MG Sample Size:21 Euro:85.08 MENA:3.23 NA:3.96 SSA:6.53 S. Asian:0.02 Ocean.:0.00
State: PI Sample Size:1 Euro:89.40 MENA:0.60 NA:4.60 SSA:3.10 S. Asian:0.00 Ocean.:0.00
State: MA Sample Size:2 Euro:80.95 MENA:1.00 NA:6.90 SSA:9.35 S. Asian:0.15 Ocean.:0.00
State: SP Sample Size:24 Euro:89.27 MENA:1.83 NA:5.18 SSA:2.23 S. Asian:0.02 Ocean.:0.00
State: MT Sample Size:1 Euro:94.10 MENA:0.00 NA:3.00 SSA:2.40 S. Asian:0.00 Ocean.:0.00
State: MS Sample Size:2 Euro:85.20 MENA:2.40 NA:6.50 SSA:4.35 S. Asian:0.00 Ocean.:0.00
State: SC Sample Size:9 Euro:88.84 MENA:0.80 NA:6.04 SSA:2.96 S. Asian:0.00 Ocean.:0.00
State: SE Sample Size:2 Euro:89.10 MENA:0.80 NA:2.50 SSA:6.15 S. Asian:0.00 Ocean.:0.00

Note: The users have more than one different states assigned to them, so deciding which one to use can impact strongly the averages of the results with less sample size. The way I did (slightly technical explanation ahead) is choosing among the options the state that, so far, had less results assigned to it, I did this to try to give representation to as many different states as possible. This is a greedy approach and it is evident that will not optimize the "representation", however it is way quicker to do than to implement an optimal algorithm (which I don't know what would be, maybe it's NP-complete).


As you can see, when you start dividing the data too much the sample size becomes too small and the numbers less meaningful, so I grouped it by big regions to get more meaningful results (the North and the Center-west still don't have any enough users though):
Region:North Sample Size:9 Euro:72.63 MENA:1.22 NA:15.93 SSA:7.79 S. Asian:0.01 Ocean.:0.00
Region:Northeast Sample Size:41 Euro:81.49 MENA:1.08 NA:5.17 SSA:10.62 S. Asian:0.04 Ocean.:0.00
Region:Center-West Sample Size:9 Euro:80.64 MENA:0.97 NA:7.68 SSA:9.14 S. Asian:0.00 Ocean.:0.00
Region:Southeast Sample Size:69 Euro:86.83 MENA:1.93 NA:4.21 SSA:5.79 S. Asian:0.03 Ocean.:0.00
Region:South Sample Size:31 Euro:87.88 MENA:0.61 NA:5.25 SSA:5.24 S. Asian:0.03 Ocean.:0.00

You can see which states are in each region in the map above, each one has a different color.

Brazilian states:

http://i66.tinypic.com/16k7y11.jpg

Brazilian regions (Norte: North; Nordeste: Northeast; Centro Oeste: Central West; Sudeste: Southeast; Sul: South):

https://static.todamateria.com.br/upload/52/40/524057d4384e8-regioes-brasileiras.jpg

de Burgh II
09-02-2016, 06:49 PM
Very interesting! :nod:

Spyy
09-02-2016, 07:29 PM
Rapaz, pior que li esse tópico inteiro

Esse Lucinho é fake do Blake?

Paulista
09-02-2016, 10:30 PM
Rapaz, pior que li esse tópico inteiro

Esse Lucinho é fake do Blake?

Acho que não. O primeiro perfil do curitibano foi o "Brasileiro".

O que você achou dos resultados? O mais curioso é a quantidade de nordestinos com mais ancestralidade européia do que alguns sulistas. Talvez porque há/houve mais endogamia na classe média e média alta do Nordeste do que no Sul.

meninodeengenho
09-02-2016, 11:11 PM
Acho que não. O primeiro perfil do curitibano foi o "Brasileiro".

O que você achou dos resultados? O mais curioso é a quantidade de nordestinos com mais ancestralidade européia do que alguns sulistas. Talvez porque há/houve mais endogamia na classe média e média alta do Nordeste do que no Sul.

Classe média/média alta/alta nordestina é bem endógama. Eles normalmente casam entre si e são parentes. Vários deles são de origem colonial, descedentes de senhores de engenhos, militares e burocratas, porém também vários são descendentes de imigrantes recentes, principalmente de Portugal e Espanha.
Porém existe uns nordestinos do Sertão que saem como mais de 90% europeu. Uma mãe de um amigo meu, no começo dessa febre de testes de ancestralidade génetica, fez o teste e saiu como 93% européia. Ela é de uma família pobre do sertão de Pernambuco. Claro que esses casos não são frequentes.
A Ivete Sangalo mesmo é de uma família um tanto pobre do interior baiano e ela é 97% européia.

Paulista
09-02-2016, 11:41 PM
Classe média/média alta/alta nordestina é bem endógama. Eles normalmente casam entre si e são parentes. Vários deles são de origem colonial, descedentes de senhores de engenhos, militares e burocratas, porém também vários são descendentes de imigrantes recentes, principalmente de Portugal e Espanha.
Porém existe uns nordestinos do Sertão que saem como mais de 90% europeu. Uma mãe de um amigo meu, no começo dessa febre de testes de ancestralidade génetica, fez o teste e saiu como 93% européia. Ela é de uma família pobre do sertão de Pernambuco. Claro que esses casos não são frequentes.
A Ivete Sangalo mesmo é de uma família um tanto pobre do interior baiano e ela é 97% européia.

Mas também não são atípicos. Existem muitos vilarejos no sertão nordestino que são compostos por descendentes de portugueses que ainda praticam a endogamia. O Nordeste é bem heterogêneo, todavia. Há diferença não só entre estados, mas também entre microrregiões/cidades. Existem municípios com forte influência africana, outros com forte influência européia. É um lugar muito interessante!

meninodeengenho
09-02-2016, 11:52 PM
Mas também não são atípicos. Existem muitos vilarejos no sertão nordestino que são compostos por descendentes de portugueses que ainda praticam a endogamia. O Nordeste é bem heterogêneo, todavia. Há diferença não só entre estados, mas também entre microrregiões/cidades. Existem municípios com forte influência africana, outros com forte influência européia. É um lugar muito interessante!

Sem dúvida é um lugar muito interessante. Existem munícipios que são conhecidos pela endogamia entre os brancos. E ainda contribui muito o fato de que muitos nordestinos do Sertão tem uma mentalidade mais preconceituosa. Não é incomum uma família branca deserdar uma filha que casou com um não-branco.
Os munícipios com forte influência africana ficam normalmente no Litoral, onde se localizavam os engenhos. As fazendas de criação de gado normalmente usavam mão de obra cabloca, embora eles também tivessem escravos. Por exemplo, o Recôncavo Baiano é o centro da cultura africana no Brasil e era a região onde se concentravam os engenhos. Já no Sertão da Bahia, você terá mais cablocos e tri-raciais, devido ao fato de lá ter sido centro da atividade pecúaria.
A exceção é o Maranhão, onde o cultivo de algodão predominou. Você vai encontrar pretos no litoral e no interior.

Obs: os engenhos predominaram no litoral, por causa do solo de massapé

Bell Beaker
03-28-2018, 04:17 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_Pv7lL6LGA

"O meu avô era negro", no máximo era quadroon lol :lol:

90,8% Europeu é suficiente para ser Branco no Brasil, aqui e em praticamente todo o globo.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybont4He3as&t=179s

Este aqui é totalmente Europeu mas tem ascendência Ashkenazi ou Levantina. Provavelmente deve ter algum avô/ó judeu ou libanês.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 04:32 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_Pv7lL6LGA

"O meu avô era negro", no máximo era quadroon lol :lol:

90,8% Europeu é suficiente para ser Branco no Brasil, aqui e em praticamente todo o globo.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybont4He3as&t=179s

Este aqui é totalmente Europeu mas tem ascendência Ashkenazi ou Levantina. Provavelmente deve ter algum avô/ó judeu ou libanês.

80% Euro também é o suficiente, pois os brancos Brasileiros daqueles tests do Argentino são mais ou menos isso.

QUICAS
03-28-2018, 04:38 PM
Acho que não. O primeiro perfil do curitibano foi o "Brasileiro".

O que você achou dos resultados? O mais curioso é a quantidade de nordestinos com mais ancestralidade européia do que alguns sulistas. Talvez porque há/houve mais endogamia na classe média e média alta do Nordeste do que no Sul.

É comum algumas pessoas q nunca subiram ao Nordeste pensar que os Nordestinos são todos pardos como a maioria dos seus imigrantes. Mas a verdade é que existem uma grande minoria bastante européia, geralmente brancos coloniais de classe média e classe alta. Em todos os Estados, mas com destaque para RN, CE, PB e PE.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 04:53 PM
E quadroon ele não era msm lol
Quadroon no Brasil não é visto como negro, negros são pessoas de tons da Tais Araújo > Lazaro Ramos. Passou disso é chamado de moreninho, moreno e coisas do tipo. Ele deveria ser escuro o suficiente pra ser chamado de negro por ela, mas geneticamente bastante Europeu. Os negros BR são em média 40% Europeu.
E há casos de negros "escuros" serem chamados de morenos também. Nesse video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dITpEAZjMlw

O público ta perguntando se a Solange é negra, mulata ou morena e ela responde: Acho que sou negra.
https://conteudo.imguol.com.br/c/esporte/2013/11/21/ex-bbb-13-aline-mattos-sera-ring-girl-na-61-edicao-do-jungle-fight-que-acontece-neste-sabado-em-campos-dos-goytacazes-rj-1385039892151_1920x1280.jpg

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 05:03 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTwCqnLA3LU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHrZGR6DfT4

Bell Beaker
03-28-2018, 05:09 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cw9pjmX9HBc

Este aqui está entre os 80 e os 85% Europeu, o Norte Africano neste caso se incorpora no Europeu, o West Asian também visto que esses genes foram transmitidos via Europa (Peninsula Ibérica).

Provavelmente esse rapaz teria um resultado muito parecido ao de um Kaká desta vida.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 05:16 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cw9pjmX9HBc

Este aqui está entre os 80 e os 85% Europeu, o Norte Africano neste caso se incorpora no Europeu, o West Asian também visto que esses genes foram transmitidos via Europa (Peninsula Ibérica).

Provavelmente esse rapaz teria um resultado muito parecido ao de um Kaká desta vida.

Ele é só 7% ssa, embora tenha mais ssa que a menina Mineira q vc postou

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 05:18 PM
Eu detesto esse povo mt miscigenado q se diz negro. Lembro da Amanda no BBB falando q é negra
uma velha no reality chamou ela de moreninha e isso mexeu com o psicologico da Amanda :lol:
https://www.otvfoco.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Amanda_sai_BBB15.jpg
O pai dela é Armenio, a mãe é negra Brasileira q parece tri racial pred ssa
http://s2.glbimg.com/XFBMczmXj-4xq3cMNsdM03zkL9A=/620x0/top/s.glbimg.com/jo/eg/f/original/2015/05/13/mg_6051.jpg

Chaos One
03-28-2018, 05:24 PM
Eu falo que o threshold de fenótipo branco fica entre 70%-80% quando tri-racial, e pode até diminuir pra quase 50% se a mistura do outro lado não for SSA e as misturas do Oriente Médio e do Norte da África forem minoritárias dentro desse pack de 50% não Europeu.

Eu sou um exemplo disso, pelo menos por vivência. Sou 75%-80% Caucasoid e pra todos os efeitos passei como branco em todos os locais que viajei na Europa e EUA (ainda que foi só no Sul da Europa). Quando fui pro Marrocos achando que ia ser tratado como nativo, me colocavam como turista aonde eu fosse.

Obs: Threshold no sentido de ainda poder ter o fenótipo, não que todo mundo que tenha isso vai ter. Um 80% Caucasoid/20% SSA pode ter ou não ter, vira literalmente fator sorte.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 05:26 PM
Eu falo que o threshold de fenótipo branco fica entre 70%-80% quando tri-racial, e pode até diminuir pra quase 50% se a mistura do outro lado não for SSA e as misturas do Oriente Médio e do Norte da África forem minoritárias dentro desse pack de 50% não Europeu.

Eu sou um exemplo disso, pelo menos por vivência. Sou 75%-80% Caucasoid e pra todos os efeitos passei como branco em todos os locais que viajei na Europa e EUA (ainda que foi só no Sul da Europa). Quando fui pro Marrocos achando que ia ser tratado como nativo, me colocavam como turista aonde eu fosse.

Tu é quanto % ssa/nativo? Qualquer criatura com uma pele não negra, e nem muito escura é tido como branco no Brasil. A Selena Gomez aqui seria branca. Aqui tem muitos brancos e muitos white pardos.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 05:27 PM
O fiscal do IBGE mesmo pergunta tua cor de pele, não ancestralidade. Roberto Grande com toda certeza marca branco.

Chaos One
03-28-2018, 05:28 PM
Tu é quanto % ssa/nativo? Qualquer criatura com uma pele não negra, e nem muito escura é tido como branco no Brasil. A Selena Gomez aqui seria branca. Aqui tem muitos brancos e muitos white pardos.

10% SSA, 7% Nativo e mais uns 3% de Asiático.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 05:34 PM
10% SSA, 7% Nativo e mais uns 3% de Asiático.

Eu devo ser 10-14% Nativo, sou bisneto de india. Se eu for mais de 68% ssa eu ficarei surpreso, pois minha familia é totalmente miscigenada. Meu avô paterno era escurão, minha avó paterna era clara, e minha mãe é chamada de moreninha, tem o cabelo grande e cacheado. Meus irmãos são mais claros que eu, minha mãe também é. E tenho primos com aparencia igual da Anitta, e outros com cara de indios/full black.

Chaos One
03-28-2018, 05:40 PM
Eu devo ser 10-14% Nativo, sou bisneto de india. Se eu for mais de 68% ssa eu ficarei surpreso, pois minha familia é totalmente miscigenada. Meu avô paterno era escurão, minha avó paterna era clara, e minha mãe é chamada de moreninha, tem o cabelo grande e cacheado. Meus irmãos são mais claros que eu, minha mãe também é. E tenho primos com aparencia igual da Anitta, e outros com cara de indios/full black.

Então, é que existem dois aspectos curiosos no meio dessa discussão toda.

Assim como existem brancos que acham que o cara pra ser branco tem que ser 100% geneticamente Europeu (o que é impossível, visto que populações comuns da Europa tem West Asian e East Med nas próprias composições lol), não dá pra tabelar negros apenas aqueles que tem 100% de SSA.

A questão é que tem gente no Brasil que tem certo receio em ser taxado de Pardo talvez por passar uma ideia de vira-lata ao invés de te colocar em um especto social que permita criar uma identidade. Não existe identidade parda no Brasil, e pardos que entram no famoso "depois das 6h da tarde" ficam em uma linha tênue entre se taxar como negros ou como mestiços.

Se a mistura é Ameríndia é mais fácil, até porque o preconceito contra pessoas mestiças de Branco/Índio é bem menor do que Branco/Negro. A novela das 9 atual abordou isso de uma forma muito engraçada, porque a personagem racista lá não queria que o filho casasse com uma negra, mas o outro filho namorava uma mameluca e ela não via problema algum quanto a isso.

Se a pessoa é tri-racial mas consegue se encaixar em um grupo e fugir do pardo, ela foge.

Pra piorar, ainda bem meu caso, que falo que sou mestiço e reclamam falando que isso é besteira e eu sou branco.

Bell Beaker
03-28-2018, 05:40 PM
Eu devo ser 10-14% Nativo, sou bisneto de india. Se eu for mais de 68% ssa eu ficarei surpreso, pois minha familia é totalmente miscigenada. Meu avô paterno era escurão, minha avó paterna era clara, e minha mãe é chamada de moreninha, tem o cabelo grande e cacheado. Meus irmãos são mais claros que eu, minha mãe também é. E tenho primos com aparencia igual da Anitta, e outros com cara de indios/full black.

Provavelmente tu vais obter resultados parecidos a este mano.....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkijZGJClJg

Ele neste caso é ~70% SSA, 29% Europeu e 1% Native. Tu provavelmente vais ter um pouco mais Native e um pouco menos Europeu.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 05:45 PM
Então, é que existem dois aspectos curiosos no meio dessa discussão toda.

Assim como existem brancos que acham que o cara pra ser branco tem que ser 100% geneticamente Europeu (o que é impossível, visto que populações comuns da Europa tem West Asian e East Med nas próprias composições lol), não dá pra tabelar negros apenas aqueles que tem 100% de SSA.

A questão é que tem gente no Brasil que tem certo receio em ser taxado de Pardo talvez por passar uma ideia de vira-lata ao invés de te colocar em um especto social que permita criar uma identidade. Não existe identidade parda no Brasil, e pardos que entram no famoso "depois das 6h da tarde" ficam em uma linha tênue entre se taxar como negros ou como mestiços.

Se a mistura é Ameríndia é mais fácil, até porque o preconceito contra pessoas mestiças de Branco/Índio é bem menor do que Branco/Negro. A novela das 9 atual abordou isso de uma forma muito engraçada, porque a personagem racista lá não queria que o filho casasse com uma negra, mas o outro filho namorava uma mameluca e ela não via problema algum quanto a isso.

Se a pessoa é tri-racial mas consegue se encaixar em um grupo e fugir do pardo, ela foge.

Pra piorar, ainda bem meu caso, que falo que sou mestiço e reclamam falando que isso é besteira e eu sou branco.

O meu avô paterno não gostava de negras do tipo dele, pois ele era negão mesmo. Minha avó era super clara, e ele gostou dela por isso, ele era racista.
E quanto a novela: O filho dela namorava a Melissa, eu criei um thread aqui sobre a Melissa e falaram que ela é octoroon
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/ENV8Z9bam-M/maxresdefault.jpg
Mas ela era vista como branca na novela, assim como o filho da racista que é um castizo.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 05:48 PM
Familia da minha avó mt menos gostava dele :lol:
Segundo meu avô, a familia dela dizia q ele era um negro preguiçoso e sem futuro. No fim, ele saiu de MG com ela e ainda trouxe a familia dela p morar no RIO. Mas os irmãos da minha avó se casaram com pardos, e uma teve filho com um portugues q transou por aí(o filho dela sequer conheceu o pai, mas ela diz q era portugues)

Chaos One
03-28-2018, 05:50 PM
O meu avô paterno não gostava de negras do tipo dele, pois ele era negão mesmo. Minha avó era super clara, e ele gostou dela por isso, ele era racista.
E quanto a novela: O filho dela namorava a Melissa, eu criei um thread aqui sobre a Melissa e falaram que ela é octoroon

Mas ela era vista como branca na novela, assim como o filho da racista que é um castizo.

Eu acho que ela é mais do que Octoroon. Tá mais pra Quadroon.

As vezes acho que o pessoal daqui acredita piamente que qualquer traço mínimo de genética SSA/Ameríndia já muda completamente os traços da pessoa. A minha esposa é Octoroon e ela se passa como Norte-Europeia em qualquer lugar. Tem um certo exagero aí.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 05:52 PM
Familia da minha avó mt menos gostava dele :lol:
Segundo meu avô, a familia dela dizia q ele era um negro preguiçoso e sem futuro. No fim, ele saiu de MG com ela e ainda trouxe a familia dela p morar no RIO. Mas os irmãos da minha avó se casaram com pardos, e uma teve filho com um portugues q transou por aí(o filho dela sequer conheceu o pai, mas ela diz q era portugues)

Não conhece o pai porque foi só uma aventura, nunca foram nem namorados

Chaos One
03-28-2018, 05:54 PM
Não conhece o pai porque foi só uma aventura, nunca foram nem namorados

A história da sua família foi contada pelo Nelson Rodrigues? lol

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 05:57 PM
A história da sua família foi contada pelo Nelson Rodrigues? lol

Sei lá. Meu avô q contava essa história do quanto sofreu pra namorar minha avó por ser mt negro e a familia dela sendo clara, bem educada e coisas do tipo. Mas meu tio metade Portugues parece castizo, e é surdo. O outro q parecee quadroon msm(é dele q to falando.)

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 06:02 PM
Provavelmente tu vais obter resultados parecidos a este mano.....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkijZGJClJg

Ele neste caso é ~70% SSA, 29% Europeu e 1% Native. Tu provavelmente vais ter um pouco mais Native e um pouco menos Europeu.

Ele parece a Diana Ross.

Token
03-28-2018, 06:29 PM
Provavelmente tu vais obter resultados parecidos a este mano.....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkijZGJClJg

Ele neste caso é ~70% SSA, 29% Europeu e 1% Native. Tu provavelmente vais ter um pouco mais Native e um pouco menos Europeu.

Eu já vi o rosto do Heathers (em uma foto de má qualidade, btw), e ele parece ser consideravelmente mais Europeu. Eu apostaria em algo como 50% SSA, 10% nativo americano e 40% Europeu.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 06:32 PM
Eu já vi o rosto do Heathers (em uma foto de má qualidade, btw), e ele parece ser consideravelmente mais Europeu. Eu apostaria em 50% SSA, 10% nativo americano e 40% Europeu.

Sim, a foto que eu te mostrei foi a mesma que enviei pra alguns intimos. Eu só havia postado metade do rosto neste forum, na verdade, só aparecia o olho. Mesmo assim, vários retardados me classificaram.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 06:40 PM
O avô da minha mãe era branco, possivelmente loiro, minha irmã tem cabelo castanho claro e crespo. Cabelo dela é mais claro q de mts Europeus desse forum, é tipo isto aqui
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRVZmSDebF6lO7l50zDqJ3LcvlJ5fXou poShsVLzeZavWpUWDjn
Aqui no Rio é lotado de negras com esse tom de cabelo, e é natural

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 06:45 PM
Parece q no Cabo Verde as pessoas tbm tem cabelos claros
https://ficase.cv/images/alimento5.jpg
http://www.alicepasquini.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/AlicePasquini_FogoCape-Verde_20142.jpg

Bell Beaker
03-28-2018, 07:30 PM
Parece q no Cabo Verde as pessoas tbm tem cabelos claros
https://ficase.cv/images/alimento5.jpg
http://www.alicepasquini.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/AlicePasquini_FogoCape-Verde_20142.jpg

Se isso é a tua definição de cabelo claro..... :lol:

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 07:33 PM
Se isso é a tua definição de cabelo claro..... :lol:

Certamente é castanho claro. Enquanto meds geralmente tem um castanho mais escuro q o deles. Esse por exemplo é mais escuro
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/63/c7/9c/63c79c915ce44eca21ee470edab49b6b.jpg

Compare
https://www.mmo.co.mz/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/Kid-17.jpg

https://ikesaki.vteximg.com.br/arquivos/ids/183179-1000-1000/coloracao-cor-ton-5.0-castanho-claro-2526.06.jpg?v=636034313471900000
https://lojasrede.fbitsstatic.net/img/p/tintura-creme-cor-e-ton-castanho-escuro-3-0-121248/292954.jpg?w=460&h=460&v=no-change

alnortedelsur
03-28-2018, 07:35 PM
It looks like my 23Andme results would be very average among southern Brazilian whites.

Cool thread!

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 07:40 PM
https://www.clickgratis.com.br/fotos-imagens/fotos-de-criancas-negras/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuY2xpY2tncmF0aXMuY29tLmJyL2ZvdG9zLW ltYWdlbnMvZm90b3MtZGUtY3JpYW5jYXMtbmVncmFzL2FIUjBj RG92TDNkM2R5NXdaWEp2YkdFdGJtVm5jbUV1WTI5dEwySnNiMm N2ZDNBdFkyOXVkR1Z1ZEM5MWNHeHZZV1J6THpJd01UTXZNRFF2 WWpGa05qRTJOamRtWkRnME9EUTBOREUxWmpkaFpEbGtZMkZtWl dGbE1URXVhbkJuLmpwZw==.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-6JuNmni4fNU/V_zn35xxVII/AAAAAAAAGek/8iZ-b1FE1kM_RmZlUAK-NZmOjVkkHH3GwCLcB/s1600/6636-sete-meninas-crespas.jpg
Castanho claro

Bell Beaker
03-28-2018, 07:46 PM
Certamente é castanho claro. Enquanto meds geralmente tem um castanho mais escuro q o deles. Esse por exemplo é mais escuro
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/63/c7/9c/63c79c915ce44eca21ee470edab49b6b.jpg

Compare
https://www.mmo.co.mz/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/Kid-17.jpg

https://ikesaki.vteximg.com.br/arquivos/ids/183179-1000-1000/coloracao-cor-ton-5.0-castanho-claro-2526.06.jpg?v=636034313471900000
https://lojasrede.fbitsstatic.net/img/p/tintura-creme-cor-e-ton-castanho-escuro-3-0-121248/292954.jpg?w=460&h=460&v=no-change

Japoneses e Amerindios reconditos em zonas onde nunca se misturaram com Europeus são os grupos etnicos com o cabelo mais escuro.

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/_fvMmtgX9Xf0/SOAjTNqjo5I/AAAAAAAACMA/gAXW7kyYSGs/s400/Poemas+Amer%C3%ADndios+-+Sioux.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Vz4bH7Z6Vqw/VVepMbCNUzI/AAAAAAAAJDU/Zan43ePDD7Y/w520-h362-no/Cortes%2Bde%2BCabelos%2Be%2BPenteados%2Bque%2Bos%2 Basi%25C3%25A1ticos%2Badoram%2B7.jpg

Deve ser algum factor Siberiano já que Japas e Amerindios têm um ancestral comum.

Negros têm o cabelo castanho escuro, excepto certas isolações genéticas em ilhas do pacífico e do Atlântico

Mediterraneos são variados e há vários tipos de Mediterrânicos, os do sul ou seja do Norte de África são Bi-Raciais ou Caucasoides tendendo para Porto Riquenho, Levantinos são Caucasoides mas com influência da Peninsula Arábica.

Euro-Mediterranicos geralmente têm o cabelo castanho normal e castanho escuro e claro em variantes mais ou menos iguais.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 07:49 PM
Japoneses e Amerindios reconditos em zonas onde nunca se misturaram com Europeus são os grupos etnicos com o cabelo mais escuro.

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/_fvMmtgX9Xf0/SOAjTNqjo5I/AAAAAAAACMA/gAXW7kyYSGs/s400/Poemas+Amer%C3%ADndios+-+Sioux.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Vz4bH7Z6Vqw/VVepMbCNUzI/AAAAAAAAJDU/Zan43ePDD7Y/w520-h362-no/Cortes%2Bde%2BCabelos%2Be%2BPenteados%2Bque%2Bos%2 Basi%25C3%25A1ticos%2Badoram%2B7.jpg

Deve ser algum factor Siberiano já que Japas e Amerindios têm um ancestral comum.

Negros têm o cabelo castanho escuro, excepto certas isolações genéticas em ilhas do pacífico e do Atlântico

Mediterraneos são variados e há vários tipos de Mediterrânicos, os do sul ou seja do Norte de África são Bi-Raciais ou Caucasoides tendendo para Porto Riquenho, Levantinos são Caucasoides mas com influência da Peninsula Arábica.

Euro-Mediterranicos geralmente têm o cabelo castanho normal e castanho escuro e claro em variantes mais ou menos iguais.

Aqui no Rio negros na maioria tem cabelo castanho claro
https://www.clickgratis.com.br/fotos-imagens/fotos-de-criancas-negras/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuY2xpY2tncmF0aXMuY29tLmJyL2ZvdG9zLW ltYWdlbnMvZm90b3MtZGUtY3JpYW5jYXMtbmVncmFzL2FIUjBj RG92TDNkM2R5NXdaWEp2YkdFdGJtVm5jbUV1WTI5dEwySnNiMm N2ZDNBdFkyOXVkR1Z1ZEM5MWNHeHZZV1J6THpJd01UTXZNRFF2 WWpGa05qRTJOamRtWkRnME9EUTBOREUxWmpkaFpEbGtZMkZtWl dGbE1URXVhbkJuLmpwZw==.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-6JuNmni4fNU/V_zn35xxVII/AAAAAAAAGek/8iZ-b1FE1kM_RmZlUAK-NZmOjVkkHH3GwCLcB/s1600/6636-sete-meninas-crespas.jpg
Se encaixam perfeitamente nesta embalagem
https://ikesaki.vteximg.com.br/arquivos/ids/183179-1000-1000/coloracao-cor-ton-5.0-castanho-claro-2526.06.jpg?v=636034313471900000
E já vi vários brancos com o cabelo mais escuro que o deles. Minha irmã tem cabelo castanho claro tbm, meu irmão teve até os 9 anos.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 07:53 PM
https://mundonegro.inf.br/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/vQjlKvS.jpg
A do lado esquerdo tem castanho um pouco escuro, a do lado direito não.

Latinus
03-28-2018, 08:03 PM
E quadroon ele não era msm lol
Quadroon no Brasil não é visto como negro, negros são pessoas de tons da Tais Araújo > Lazaro Ramos. Passou disso é chamado de moreninho, moreno e coisas do tipo. Ele deveria ser escuro o suficiente pra ser chamado de negro por ela, mas geneticamente bastante Europeu. Os negros BR são em média 40% Europeu.
E há casos de negros "escuros" serem chamados de morenos também. Nesse video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dITpEAZjMlw

O público ta perguntando se a Solange é negra, mulata ou morena e ela responde: Acho que sou negra.
https://conteudo.imguol.com.br/c/esporte/2013/11/21/ex-bbb-13-aline-mattos-sera-ring-girl-na-61-edicao-do-jungle-fight-que-acontece-neste-sabado-em-campos-dos-goytacazes-rj-1385039892151_1920x1280.jpg

Não entendi. Essa foto ai é da Aline Mattos, não da Solange. E até onde eu sei ela (Aline Mattos) sempre se identificou como negra, o que ela é.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 08:05 PM
Não entendi. Essa foto ai é da Aline Mattos, não da Solange. E até onde eu sei ela (Aline Mattos) sempre se identificou como negra, o que ela é.

A foto de baixo é da Aline, erro meu. Mas no video é a Solange dizendo que é negra, após o Bial dizer que vários estão perguntando se ela é mulata, morena ou negra. Assista.

Latinus
03-28-2018, 08:07 PM
Aqui no Rio negros na maioria tem cabelo castanho claro
https://www.clickgratis.com.br/fotos-imagens/fotos-de-criancas-negras/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuY2xpY2tncmF0aXMuY29tLmJyL2ZvdG9zLW ltYWdlbnMvZm90b3MtZGUtY3JpYW5jYXMtbmVncmFzL2FIUjBj RG92TDNkM2R5NXdaWEp2YkdFdGJtVm5jbUV1WTI5dEwySnNiMm N2ZDNBdFkyOXVkR1Z1ZEM5MWNHeHZZV1J6THpJd01UTXZNRFF2 WWpGa05qRTJOamRtWkRnME9EUTBOREUxWmpkaFpEbGtZMkZtWl dGbE1URXVhbkJuLmpwZw==.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-6JuNmni4fNU/V_zn35xxVII/AAAAAAAAGek/8iZ-b1FE1kM_RmZlUAK-NZmOjVkkHH3GwCLcB/s1600/6636-sete-meninas-crespas.jpg
Se encaixam perfeitamente nesta embalagem
https://ikesaki.vteximg.com.br/arquivos/ids/183179-1000-1000/coloracao-cor-ton-5.0-castanho-claro-2526.06.jpg?v=636034313471900000
E já vi vários brancos com o cabelo mais escuro que o deles. Minha irmã tem cabelo castanho claro tbm, meu irmão teve até os 9 anos.

Mas como o cabelo deles é muito encaracolado, a cor não chama tanto atenção. Btw, esse cabelo da embalagem de tintura tá mais para castanho escuro ou no máximo médio.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 08:10 PM
Mas como o cabelo deles é muito encaracolado, a cor não chama tanto atenção. Btw, esse cabelo da embalagem de tintura tá mais para castanho escuro ou no máximo médio.

Sempre perguntam se minha irmã pinta os cabelos...

Latinus
03-28-2018, 08:23 PM
E sim, asiáticos e ameríndios puros possuem o cabelo mais escuro, um preto azulado. Brancos costumam ter no máximo um castanho escuro que pode até ser confundido com preto, mas no sol sua verdadeira tonalidade, castanha, fica bem visível. Outra característica comum do cabelo mongoloide é o fio ser mais grosso que o caucasiano ou africano. O cabelo deles tende a espetar e ter aparência de duro dependendo do comprimento.
http://i.imgur.com/DPcRdWp.jpg

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 08:23 PM
A mais negra do BBB era a Vanessa, que namorou um Portugues que participou do reality. Li que estão casados até hoje
https://extra.globo.com/incoming/18044191-0c7-1fc/w640h360-PROP/x1serginho.jpg.pagespeed.ic.x2PBCFQrvD.jpg

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 08:26 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQUp3_-VWWI
Era Portugues-Frances

Latinus
03-28-2018, 08:27 PM
A mais negra do BBB era a Vanessa, que namorou um Portugues que participou do reality. Li que estão casados até hoje
https://extra.globo.com/incoming/18044191-0c7-1fc/w640h360-PROP/x1serginho.jpg.pagespeed.ic.x2PBCFQrvD.jpg

Mulher feia da porra. A tal da Aline Mattos é uma negra que possui seus atrativos estéticos, mas essa ai é o cão chupando manga com diarreia.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 08:28 PM
Mulher feia da porra. A tal da Aline Mattos é uma negra que possui seus atrativos estéticos, mas essa ai é o cão chupando manga com diarreia.

Rainha que ficou em segunda lugar, quase ganhou.

Heather Duval
03-28-2018, 08:30 PM
A Thais Ventura do BBB2 ta acabadissima...
https://extra.globo.com/incoming/7470217-67c-071/w448/thais-ventura,-bbb-2-(1).JPG
https://s.yimg.com/uu/api/res/1.2/fvVsfyhYkCNrEXPNsDKL1g--~B/aD0zMTU7dz02MzA7c209MTthcHBpZD15dGFjaHlvbg--/http://media.zenfs.com/pt-BR/blogs/notas-omg/Thais2_montagem_131108.jpg
http://www.osul.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/thais2-328x500.jpg