why do african countries do bad

[Mortimer]

can you think of any reason except race. i think mostly because of civil wars, there is no peace and stability, which is start to have prosperity.

[Neanderthal]

To be honest it's all related to genetic capabilities. I think Africans could use some help, but not in the shape of money or humanitarian aid, rather development plans and education.

[nose]

noreuropeans could climb down the tree, i dont see why the niggers cant

[KidMulat]

Creating artificial borders cutting tribal, state, and ethnic lines; colonial favoritism of particular groups, the concentration of wealth to said favored groups primarily in the hands of European educated children of local elites who worked with European powers, then the resulting oligarchy.

Wars resulting from favored groups and marginalized groups; internal factions of power groups fighting for power; the effects of extraction economies during colonial era building the least amount of infrastructure to bring the nations wealth to trading hubs for export; debts to world banks, interests so high original debt being re-paid several times over; top down approaches in GDP (although now its beginning to shift to bottom-up economic uplifting); brain drains; expensive everything, average middle class apartments in Accra/Lagos/Luanda can cost hundreds of thousands of dollars US



noreuropeans could climb down the tree, i dont see why the niggers cant

Socio indio

[Smeagol]

Probably because they're run by coons. Seriously people can make all the excuses they want. Actually read about the African Leaders after decolonization, and what they did. A bunch of deranged darkie dictators for the most part, way worse than Stalin, or Hitler, or whatever. The kind of rulers you can only expect from the dark continent.

[Neanderthal]

Creating artificial borders cutting tribal, state, and ethnic lines; colonial favoritism of particular groups, the concentration of wealth to said favored groups primarily in the hands of European educated children of local elites who worked with European powers, then the resulting oligarchy.

Wars resulting from favored groups and marginalized groups; internal factions of power groups fighting for power; the effects of extraction economies during colonial era building the least amount of infrastructure to bring the nations wealth to trading hubs for export; debts to world banks, interests so high original debt being re-paid several times over; top down approaches in GDP (although now its beginning to shift to bottom-up economic uplifting); brain drains; expensive everything, average middle class apartments in Accra/Lagos/Luanda can cost hundreds of thousands of dollars US




Socio indio

In a way I agree with you Mulat. You cannot expect a population with different ideologies and ways to view life, customs, peculiarities, etc, do well in a system invented by/for Europeans. So measuring both populations capabilities is a bit arbitrary. Although, I don't agree with you with laying all the blame to Europeans. Part of intelligence is also solving problems and finding ways to surpass obstacles.

[Isleño]

can you think of any reason except race. i think mostly because of civil wars, there is no peace and stability, which is start to have prosperity.

This topic will turn into a shitstorm, lol. Get ready.

[KidMulat]

In a way I agree with you Mulat. You cannot expect a population with different ideologies and ways to view life, customs, peculiarities, etc, do well in a system invented by/for Europeans. So measuring both populations capabilities is a bit arbitrary. Although, I don't agree with you with laying all the blame to Europeans. Part of intelligence is also solving problems and finding ways to surpass obstacles.


Ghana gained independence as the first free nation in Africa in the year 1957; tell me how long do you expect a mostly rural, agrarian, highly heterogenous continent to turn out?

How many border wars have occurred in Europe? How many ethnically and culturally based wars occurred so that independent homogenous nations could form? How many dealt with inter-religious conflicts and what were the human, financial, and societal costs?

If we are to truly look at Africa for what it is; a continent of over 500 major ethnic groups fiercely defending their homelands what can be expected with artificial borders created without their input in mind in only 200 or so years?

Though one can say that the middle classes of most nations are far more willing to accept and work with what they have as nations the amount of accumulated knowledge and know how of the world they contain is lost and far from reach among the masses.

Beyond that there is a serious effect of colonialism that still survives, every person around the age of 50 or 60 was around during time periods of great economic and social marginalization of their former rulers.

[KidMulat]

This topic will turn into a shitstorm, lol. Get ready.

Yep I know :-/

[Virtuous]

Did Europids get some sort of Mother Theresa intervention to help save their multiple hunter gatherer asses?

Are Niggers, supposedly equal to us, less capable of sustaining themselves from the plentiful they have? Supposedly no.

[Neanderthal]

Ghana gained independence as the first free nation in Africa in the year 1957; tell me how long do you expect a mostly rural, agrarian, highly heterogenous continent to turn out?

How many border wars have occurred in Europe? How many ethnically and culturally based wars occurred so that independent homogenous nations could form? How many dealt with inter-religious conflicts and what were the human, financial, and societal costs?

If we are to truly look at Africa for what it is; a continent of over 500 major ethnic groups fiercely defending their homelands what can be expected with artificial borders created without their input in mind in only 200 or so years?

Though one can say that the middle classes of most nations are far more willing to accept and work with what they have as nations the amount of accumulated knowledge and know how of the world they contain is lost and far from reach among the masses.

Beyond that there is a serious effect of colonialism that still survives, every person around the age of 50 or 60 was around during time periods of great economic and social marginalization of their former rulers.

I acknowledge all this; my question is: What you propose to solve this? We don't have time machines yet, so that's excluded.

[Han Cholo]

Blaming everything to colonialism is lame. Paraguay and El Salvador were blasted to near extinction and overkill through independence, civil wars and other conflicts, despite being unimportant places. Nowadays they are in better state than most of Africa, even North Africa. Then look at Haiti...

[MarkyMark]

Lack of infrastructure and high disease rates.

[zhaoyun]

Creating artificial borders cutting tribal, state, and ethnic lines; colonial favoritism of particular groups, the concentration of wealth to said favored groups primarily in the hands of European educated children of local elites who worked with European powers, then the resulting oligarchy.

Wars resulting from favored groups and marginalized groups; internal factions of power groups fighting for power; the effects of extraction economies during colonial era building the least amount of infrastructure to bring the nations wealth to trading hubs for export; debts to world banks, interests so high original debt being re-paid several times over; top down approaches in GDP (although now its beginning to shift to bottom-up economic uplifting); brain drains; expensive everything, average middle class apartments in Accra/Lagos/Luanda can cost hundreds of thousands of dollars US




Socio indio

All of these factors. Plus the fact that many of these societies had not reached a level of development that allowed massive state organization, or national identities when they were colonized. So these are critical factors that denote how strong a state is, and thus, how well it can manage development.

[Mortimer]

good that kidmulat is here, he knows alot about africa, and gives important insight and information. a sane mind among idiots and assholes.

[KidMulat]

I acknowledge all this; my question is: What you propose to solve this? We don't have time machines yet, so that's excluded.

Gosh that's a very broad question for so many intricate pieces.

Each nation would have to be looked at individually and worked on by the consensus of the people represented by traditional leader, national academics/artist and especially women of urban and rural communities.

I want to say "Re-arrange the borders" but recognize the consequences of that with various current warring and political factions, so too must we consider the current nation states are trying to work within the framework of the previous European powers/borders/infrastructure and so the various debts and resources traditionally used to alliviate said debt might be at risk of being taken away by nations who have the ability to regenerate on their own and might very well be in danger of crippling any economic improvement for generations to come.

Part of me believes the debt incurred on independence should be removed but recognize this might create a vaccuum to increase the income of various oligarchies through increased extractive practices or be put to use in environmentally destructive processes.

Personally its not best for me to suggest, I am an American.

Though again I feel women of every socio-economic strata must have their words be put centerstage in this conversation; an education that is culturally informed and intrinsically interconnected with the needs of today and the possibilities of tomorrow be put into place; and the land with which they derive needed sustanance, income, and wealth be stewarded with regenerative practices should be the first three things to occur.

I don't want to see another Groundnut Scheme so I am hesitant to say much else lol

[KidMulat]

Blaming everything to colonialism is lame. Paraguay and El Salvador were blasted to near extinction and overkill through independence, civil wars and other conflicts, despite being unimportant places. Nowadays they are in better state than most of Africa, even North Africa. Then look at Haiti...

El Salvador and Paraguay are nations that have extremely different histories and are largely hellholes; I lived with enough el Salvadoran undocumented minors to know that much.

[KidMulat]

All of these factors. Plus the fact that many of these societies had not reached a level of development that allowed massive state organization, or national identities when they were colonized. So these are critical factors that denote how strong a state is, and thus, how well it can manage development.

Exactly; although a time machine is not allowed had many of the pre-existing nation states and ethno-states remained intact and properly acculturated to world economies the continent as a whole would be a much different picture than what it is today.

[Han Cholo]

El Salvador and Paraguay are nations that have extremely different histories and are largely hellholes; I lived with enough el Salvadoran undocumented minors to know that much.

Still better than Africa, HDI:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0b/UN_Human_Development_Report_2013.svg/863px-UN_Human_Development_Report_2013.svg.png
As you can see, only Lybia, Egypt and Algeria which are the top African states (and largely Caucasoid) are on the level of El Salvador and Paraguay.

Literacy rates:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/39/WorldMapLiteracy2011.png

People living under a dollar:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1d/Percentage_population_living_on_less_than_1_dollar _day_2007-2008.png

Life expectancy:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/75/Life_Expectancy_2005-2010_UN_WPP_2006.PNG

Certainly, they are true shitholes by our American standards, but in Africa they'd be the most developed.

[KidMulat]

Still better than Africa, HDI:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0b/UN_Human_Development_Report_2013.svg/863px-UN_Human_Development_Report_2013.svg.png
As you can see, only Lybia, Egypt and Algeria which are the top African states (and largely Caucasoid) are on the level of El Salvador and Paraguay.

Literacy rates:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/39/WorldMapLiteracy2011.png

People living under a dollar:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1d/Percentage_population_living_on_less_than_1_dollar _day_2007-2008.png

Life expectancy:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/75/Life_Expectancy_2005-2010_UN_WPP_2006.PNG

Certainly, they are true shitholes by our American standards, but in Africa they'd be the most developed.

You are literally comparing apples to oranges right now; not only that you are basically playing a game right now, this is not about "they have is bad but its still better than those people" this is talking about the foundations with which these nations stand on.

El Salvador is dealing with a multitude of issues that need repairing; they have drug wars, essentially a fascist puppet government and is still a banana republic leaving a very large impoverish population fleeing to the United States and Belize, and a rather minimal amount of resources.

It is no paradise and cannot be compared to an entire continent; it really is a hell though, when I say I lived with undocumented El Salvadorian minors I really mean it they were allowed to stay in S.F. and went into the same programs I went through when I left home.

Hearing their stories of death, stagnation and struggle to leave their home are just as valid as the refugees coming from Somalia, Eritrea, Sudan.

[Han Cholo]

You are literally comparing apples to oranges right now; not only that you are basically playing a game right now, this is not about "they have is bad but its still better than those people" this is talking about the foundations with which these nations stand on.

Comparing totally measurable cyphers is not comparing apples and oranges. The foundations of Paraguay and El Salvador were blurry. Paraguay was basically a conglomeration of wastelands in border areas. El Salvador was just a backpark in New Spain.



El Salvador is dealing with a multitude of issues that need repairing; they have drug wars, essentially a fascist puppet government and is still a banana republic leaving a very large impoverish population fleeing to the United States and Belize, and a rather minimal amount of resources.

Of course, but still significantly better than most nations in Africa, and of course Haiti.



It is no paradise and cannot be compared to an entire continent; it really is a hell though, when I say I lived with undocumented El Salvadorian minors I really mean it they were allowed to stay in S.F. and went into the same programs I went through when I left home.

Hearing their stories of death, stagnation and struggle to leave their home are just as valid as the refugees coming from Somalia, Eritrea, Sudan.

Of course, if you wish to turn it into a unmeasurable, intangible thing, except that the bolded ones are far more fucked up. Using big words and scapegoats won't dissolve the stats.

[Aviator]

No, I cannot think of any reasons for Africa's pitiful condition that do not ultimately stem from race.

[KidMulat]

Comparing totally measurable cyphers is not comparing apples and oranges. The foundations of Paraguay and El Salvador were blurry. Paraguay was basically a conglomeration of wastelands in border areas. El Salvador was just a backpark in New Spain.



Of course, but still significantly better than most nations in Africa, and of course Haiti.



Of course, if you wish to turn it into a unmeasurable, intangible thing, except that the bolded ones are far more fucked up. Using big words and scapegoats won't dissolve the stats.


I think the difference between you and I on the matter of geopolitics is nuance. I do not see statistics in a vacuum, I see them them as being informed by larger and dynamic forces at play. Neither do I see statistics like the ones you grabbed from Wikipedia in the way one sees the stats of a videogame character.

Overall I think that it is comparing apples and oranges; the history of colonialism, land usage, power groups and wealth distribution even on the macro scale of continents varies dramatically, comparing things country by country? Far to complex to say they are like-and-like

Also MS-13 is not a joke, it is not a petty gang, they are warlords trying to gain power through force, death and fear the same as elsewhere plain and simple.

[Felix Volkbein]

Because they're filled with Africans.

[Felix Volkbein]

Still better than Africa, HDI:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0b/UN_Human_Development_Report_2013.svg/863px-UN_Human_Development_Report_2013.svg.png
As you can see, only Lybia, Egypt and Algeria which are the top African states (and largely Caucasoid) are on the level of El Salvador and Paraguay.

Literacy rates:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/39/WorldMapLiteracy2011.png

People living under a dollar:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1d/Percentage_population_living_on_less_than_1_dollar _day_2007-2008.png

Life expectancy:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/75/Life_Expectancy_2005-2010_UN_WPP_2006.PNG

Certainly, they are true shitholes by our American standards, but in Africa they'd be the most developed.

Central American countries outside of Costa Rica are mostly fucked as well. The immigrants we get from those countries are worthless. Not only was there lots of mixing with Negroes to destroy the gene pools, but the Amerindians in that region were probably decadent from the tropical climate. That also applies to swathes of Colombia and Venezuela, for the same reasons.

I would definitely say that some Amerindian/Mestizo countries like Peru are leagues ahead of any sub-Saharan country though.

[Han Cholo]

Central American countries outside of Costa Rica are mostly fucked as well. The immigrants we get from those countries are worthless. Not only was there lots of mixing with Negroes to destroy the gene pools, but the Amerindians in that region were probably also decadent from the tropical climate. That also applies to certain parts of Colombia and Venezuela, for the same reasons.

Most Salvadorians, Guatemalans, Nicaraguans are not largely SSA admixed. More than Mexico perhaps though, but certainly not on Venezuela or Colombia level. Obviously a country in constant strife can never be truly developed. And as the stats show, they're only comparable to North Africa perhaps. Still leagues above SSA.



I would definitely say that some Amerindian/Mestizo countries like Peru are leagues ahead of any sub-Saharan country though.

Certainly not everything in central america outside Costa Rica is worthless. Many Mexicans have this idea, but isn't completely right.

[Armando Esteban Quito]

I think the difference between you and I on the matter of geopolitics is nuance. I do not see statistics in a vacuum, I see them them as being informed by larger and dynamic forces at play. Neither do I see statistics like the ones you grabbed from Wikipedia in the way one sees the stats of a videogame character.

Overall I think that it is comparing apples and oranges; the history of colonialism, land usage, power groups and wealth distribution even on the macro scale of continents varies dramatically, comparing things country by country? Far to complex to say they are like-and-like

Also MS-13 is not a joke, it is not a petty gang, they are warlords trying to gain power through force, death and fear the same as elsewhere plain and simple.

So basically what you're saying is that you argue with an appeal to emotion rather than logic (e.g.: statistics, facts, irrefutable data) ? There are a lot of countries that developed as a result of colonialism. Why is it only Africa remained in the stone age?

[robertsmith]

May be most of the smart Black people were killed by Whites during their presence in Africa. :rolleyes:

[Aviator]

Seriously though, imagine how nice parts of that continent could be if blacks weren't there. I mean, look at South Africa, that place was supposedly a paradise before the Apartheid ended.

[Felix Volkbein]

So basically what you're saying is that you argue with an appeal to emotion rather than logic (e.g.: statistics, facts, irrefutable data) ? There are a lot of countries that developed as a result of colonialism. Why is it only Africa remained in the stone age?

Why did you Thumbs Down my posts in this thread when you don't seem to disagree with me? Press the wrong button?

[Isleño]

How thick is your skin?

[armenianbodyhair]

There are so many factors, the world is a very complicated place. Anyone who looks at the state of the world and cares to evaluate it on only one factor is either extremely ignorant or they have an agenda.

[Felix Volkbein]

Ghana gained independence as the first free nation in Africa in the year 1957; tell me how long do you expect a mostly rural, agrarian, highly heterogenous continent to turn out?



I'll note that the shift to agriculture that occurred in Europe, Asia, and parts of the Americas likely selected for higher intelligence and foresight, which later allowed those regions to develop the advanced cultures they did. Further selection probably took place among high-density urban populations, a stage reached by most Eurasians and some Amerindians, but not by sub-Saharan Africans.

Most sub-Saharan Africans never even got as far as the agricultural phase, and even the ones that did practice some agriculture got nowhere near as far as the Eurasians and some Amerindians did. This means that sub-Saharan Africans in their current state are not genetically equipped for advanced civilization. They were never put through the "Malthusian wringer" that most non-African populations endured, which selected for higher intelligence.

[KidMulat]

So basically what you're saying is that you argue with an appeal to emotion rather than logic (e.g.: statistics, facts, irrefutable data) ? There are a lot of countries that developed as a result of colonialism. Why is it only Africa remained in the stone age?

How can you seriously read that sentence and forget the most important part of it "in a vacuum" that is to say decontextualized and separate from historical and contemporary stimuli :picard2:

Secondly: Stone Age? Save for Khoisan Africa was Iron Age.

[Scandalf]

Complicated. North Africa did develope. Maybe your question is specifically related to sub Saharian Africa? Maybe the Ghana civilization and it's collapse might give some clues.

[Incal]

Not everybody is suited for Western values and way of life. Africans just can't grasp it. They should just give up and go back to their original ways, they'd be happier and do better.

[Incal]

Complicated. North Africa did develope. Maybe your question is specifically related to sub Saharian Africa? Maybe the Ghana civilization and it's collapse might give some clues.

Really? All the things I read from the place are rather sad and devastating. You see tons of North Africans trying to reach Europe and from the testimonies of some members here who have been there (Europeans, not biased muslims), the place seems to be rather depressing and hopeless.

[Han Cholo]

Really? All the things I read from the place are rather sad and devastating. You see tons of North Africans trying to reach Europe and from the testimonies of some members here who have been there (Europeans, not biased muslims), the place seems to be rather depressing and hopeless.

Lybia was quite developed. Obviously now it has gone to shit.

[KidMulat]

I'll note that the shift to agriculture that occurred in Europe, Asia, and parts of the Americas likely selected for higher intelligence and foresight, which later allowed those regions to develop the advanced cultures they did. Further selection probably took place among high-density urban populations, a stage reached by most Eurasians and some Amerindians, but not by sub-Saharan Africans.

Most sub-Saharan Africans never even got as far as the agricultural phase, and even the ones that did practice some agriculture got nowhere near as far as the Eurasians and some Amerindians did. This means that sub-Saharan Africans in their current state are not genetically equipped for advanced civilization. They were never put through the "Malthusian wringer" that most non-African populations endured, which selected for higher intelligence.

Far in the agricultural phase? What do you mean?

The Congo was largely uninhabited until 7,000 BCE, up until that point most forms of domesticable crops grew in the semi-arid Sahel a relatively thin belt precariously perched between two extreme climatic zones and looking at a 10k year perspective one that is fraught with extreme climate shifts itself; sorghum, rice, pearl millet along with African cattle, goats and sheep were there moving and expanding throughout the various wet and dry phases of the region.

Their form of rice cultivation was impressive enough to astound and perplex the Portuguese who believed it had to be the work of Asians or Arabs, it also was perceived as a great enough to model implement tidal and mangrove rice plantations throughout the New World using African farmers along the Rice Coast.

There is actually few records of agricultural lack; Ibn Battuta spoke of the abundance of food in Sahelian Africa and it was enough to supply not only the people of the Medieval empires of Gao, Ghana, and Mali but also fueled much of the Sudan belt from the Atlantic coast to West highlands of Ethiopia.

It is also confusing that you would speak of agriculture as if it were a literal thought or "invention"; agriculture and the process of domestication is the result of millennia long interactions and partnerships between humans, animals and wild plants.

The plants selected could not withstand the humid lowland tropics of more than half the continent and tsetse fly killed off nearly all animals (and many humans) from settling almost half the continent as well,

Beyond that, this simplistic and uninformed blurb of yours has little actual backing; the societal evolution from tribes and chieftains to multi-tiered and class based states and stratified societies are not a hallmark of intelligence, its a result of a culture of consolidation and resource control.

[Incal]

Lybia was quite developed. Obviously now it has gone to shit.

Dunno man. I wouldn't believe everything I read from progressive sources. I think when people say "Lybia was quite developed" they mean to North African standards but I wouldn't really like to live in a fanatical dictatorship where you could disappear any given day for just disagreeing in any way with the regime. I think it's similar when people say "Turkey is a secular country" what in reality they mean is "Turkey is secular for Islamic standards" which in the end doesn't mean much, all the turks I met in Germany were way more into religion than any other people from other faiths I met.

[Han Cholo]

Dunno man. I wouldn't believe everything I read from progressive sources. I think when people say "Lybia was quite developed" they mean to North African standards but I wouldn't really like to live in a fanatical dictatorship where you could disappear any given day for just disagreeing in any way with the regime. I think it's similar when people say "Turkey is a secular country" what in reality they mean is "Turkey is secular for Islamic standards" which in the end doesn't mean much, all the turks I met in Germany were way more into religion than any other people from other faiths I met.

By developed I don't mean freedom of expression and other issues. I'm using official data of HDI, housing records, GDP, life standards, etc.. Lybia had the higher development in the whole Africa, and even some outside it like Lebanon, Syria, Turkey, etc..

Furthermore, Lybia is far more desertic and hostile than all other North African states like Egypt or Morocco, and it was still far better than them. More merit, not to mention being a non-aligned country.

[Linet]

1. Europeans who want them to stay undeveloped so they can get their resources for nothing http://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/prestonjjrtr/Smileys%20Summer/bth_7_16_2.gif
2.Corruption :wof:
3.The great mass is uneducated and strife for survival due to lack of basic civil structure (schools,hospitals,water suply etc)

[robertsmith]

Everything boils down to the question: whether he/she is happy and gets enough food and sleep?

Poverty rate of Latinos in Mexico is way lower than in the US, and if happiness rate (well made-up terminology) of Mexico Latinos is higher too then Mexico is a better place for average Mexican.
However, humans are so obsessed with redundant wealth and luxuries and most non-Europeans wanna live like average European/American :picard2:

[Felix Volkbein]

It is also confusing that you would speak of agriculture as if it were a literal thought or "invention"; agriculture and the process of domestication is the result of millennia long interactions and partnerships between humans, animals and wild plants.


Which involves intelligence. Unless you think the plants and animals instructed humans on how to properly farm and domesticate them.



The plants selected could not withstand the humid lowland tropics of more than half the continent and tsetse fly killed off nearly all animals (and many humans) from settling almost half the continent as well,

Beyond that, this simplistic and uninformed blurb of yours has little actual backing; the societal evolution from tribes and chieftains to multi-tiered and class based states and stratified societies are not a hallmark of intelligence, its a result of a culture of consolidation and resource control.

They are a sign of greater complexity, which reflects the intelligence of the population. Yes, your race is less evolved. The reasons don't really matter. That's just how it is.

[KidMulat]

Which involves intelligence. Unless you think the plants and animals instructed humans on how to properly farm and domesticate them.



They are a sign of greater complexity, which reflects the intelligence of the population. Yes, your race is less evolved. The reasons don't really matter. That's just how it is.


The companionship between two or more species is not something that can be encapsulated as quantifiable intelligence; it is something that can occur simply be feeding ones self.

There is the conscious effort in creating better conditions by clearing brush, agitating soil and increasing fertility but that is some done by every human group; it occurred in California, Southern Australia, Japan, South Africa, etc.... Without the supposed hallmarks of "proper" agriculture to occur.

There is no "instruction" needed; plants and animals have their own innate "desire" to multiple and as such will continue to alter themselves as a response to better suit anthropomorphic manipulation over long periods of time.

How do you not know this?

Complexity in what way? If anything the social processes are the same, it is merely the way in which those processes are bound and controlled that create the way a given society is formed.

You can say I am less evolved but you've yet to say anything to show that other than say "your race is less evolved"; if that is your only response (which unsurprisingly seems to be the case lol) you are just not worthy of having a real conversation about the African continent and its people.

[Felix Volkbein]

There is no "instruction" needed; plants and animals have their own innate "desire" to multiple and as such will continue to alter themselves as a response to better suit anthropomorphic manipulation over long periods of time.

How do you not know this?

Are you really this braindead? How can anyone read this and not burst out laughing? Well, you are a nigger after all.


Complexity in what way? If anything the social processes are the same, it is merely the way in which those processes are bound and controlled that create the way a given society is formed.

You can say I am less evolved but you've yet to say anything to show that other than say "your race is less evolved"; if that is your only response (which unsurprisingly seems to be the case lol) you are just not worthy of having a real conversation about the African continent and its people.

More advanced social structures require hierarchies. This is because they rely on a division of labor, and in more advanced societies, some tasks are much more intellectually demanding than others and require more intelligent people. These people end up in charge of the less intelligent people. If you thought about it for a moment, the reasons would be obvious, but I know I'm asking a lot from a nigger brain.

[Theron]

I'll list some reasons, not necessarily in order of importance: disease; poor critical thinking; hostility towards rival ethnic groups who have fallen under the same nation state; inability to rule the nation state effectively; extreme jealousy of the successful, acceptance of corruption and herd mentality that I believe is either deeply ingrained in their culture or genetic.

Africans are very militaristic and tribalistic - the slave trade was pioneered by African chiefs well before any European set foot here. The Africans are not very welcoming of their own kind too - I can assure you no theories of humanism developed here.

[KidMulat]

Are you really this braindead? How can anyone read this and not burst out laughing? Well, you are a nigger after all.



More advanced social structures require hierarchies. This is because they rely on a division of labor, and in more advanced societies, some tasks are much more intellectually demanding than others and require more intelligent people. These people end up in charge of the less intelligent people. If you thought about it for a moment, the reasons would be obvious, but I know I'm asking a lot from a nigger brain.

Oh that's adorable; people still believe in Darwin's theories of domestication lol

http://i62.tinypic.com/f264cl.jpg

How old are you and what books have you been reading lol

Social stratification results in the diversification of occupations and therefore creates specialization; that however is not the impetus of hierarchy. Hierarchy and consolidation of people and resources in and of itself is a cultural response to a myriad of factors, it however is not a sign of superior intelligence.

Stay on that Bell curve hype though, Darwinists are so anachronistic :thumb001:

[Sidi Atlas]

Complicated. North Africa did develope.
Not enough. The colonial borders did have a very negative impact, which still can be felt today.

http://www.reocities.com/Athens/3240/maghreb.jpg

The Maghreb region is one of the regions were there is the least cooperation between neighboring states. They are constantly working against each other (particularly Morocco and Algeria, were the border is completely sealed). It's quite sad because ethnically and culturally they are practically the same people.

[Sidi Atlas]

Really? All the things I read from the place are rather sad and devastating. You see tons of North Africans trying to reach Europe and from the testimonies of some members here who have been there (Europeans, not biased muslims), the place seems to be rather depressing and hopeless.
North Africans crossing the border illegally are not that numerous. Mostly it are Sub Saharan Africans and then Middle Eastern refugees (Iraq, Syria), North Africans and South Asians.

I'm pretty sure that there tons more Latin Americans crossing borders illegally to the US.

[Scandalf]

Really? All the things I read from the place are rather sad and devastating. You see tons of North Africans trying to reach Europe and from the testimonies of some members here who have been there (Europeans, not biased muslims), the place seems to be rather depressing and hopeless.

Actually (and I see them every day) they are mostly Sub-Saharian Africans who cross the desert before jumping on the rafts. Many are from Eritrea and Somalia (they almost seem to be the majority by now).

[Äijä]

Genes.

[Fortis in Arduis]

Post-colonial interference in African affairs continues. Mercenaries are employed, French vs. British, much of it ugly, and, I would assume a lot more.

European colonial powers installed traitor governments. Ethnically heterogenous nation states are still held in place by force. Foreign religions are causing inter and intra-ethnic strife.

Possibly the best nations in Africa are the happier kingdoms, running their affairs by their own indigenous style of governance.

Prior to this, some of the colonies were some of the happier places to be, but this does not mean that they were ideal, or that colonial systems of government are appropriate for Africa.

[Incal]

North Africans crossing the border illegally are not that numerous. Mostly it are Sub Saharan Africans and then Middle Eastern refugees (Iraq, Syria), North Africans and South Asians.

I'm pretty sure that there tons more Latin Americans crossing borders illegally to the US.

Well according to member Peyrol, his city is full of them. Also, zillions of Algerians in France, Moroccans in the Netherlands, etc. The most developed country in NA seems to be Tunisia.

Most of the ones who cross the US borders are Central Americans and their numbers must be similar to North Africans.

[Sidi Atlas]

Well according to member Peyrol, his city is full of them. Also, zillions of Algerians in France, Moroccans in the Netherlands, etc. The most developed country in NA seems to be Tunisia.

Most of the ones who cross the US borders are Central Americans and their numbers must be similar to North Africans.
No, they are not similar at all. There are more than 50 million Latinos/Hispanics in the US. There are at max 6 million North Africans in Europe.

Most North Africans came by legal ways to Europe, from post WWII to the early 1970's as laborers (and later family reunification). Spain and Italy allowed new workers during their economic boom in the 1990's and 2000's. There is an element that did came illegally to Europe, like those not leaving when their visa documents expired. From my experience only a few, the most desperate, came to Europe with ragtag boats. And it seems they all ended up in Peyrol's city.

[Incal]

No, they are not similar at all. There are more than 50 million Latinos/Hispanics in the US. There are at max 6 million North Africans in Europe.

Most North Africans came by legal ways to Europe, from post WWII to the early 1970's as laborers (and later family reunification). Spain and Italy allowed new workers during their economic boom in the 1990's and 2000's. There is an element that did came illegally to Europe, like those not leaving when their visa documents expired. From my experience only a few, the most desperate, came to Europe with ragtag boats. And it seems they all ended up in Peyrol's city.

Legal or not, they all wanted to leave their countries of origin. No future there.

[StonyArabia]

North Africans crossing the border illegally are not that numerous. Mostly it are Sub Saharan Africans and then Middle Eastern refugees (Iraq, Syria), North Africans and South Asians.

I'm pretty sure that there tons more Latin Americans crossing borders illegally to the US.

Most Iraqis go to the Americas, very very very few of us go to Europe.

[Isleño]

Really? All the things I read from the place are rather sad and devastating. You see tons of North Africans trying to reach Europe and from the testimonies of some members here who have been there (Europeans, not biased muslims), the place seems to be rather depressing and hopeless.
But I will say, although most of North Africa is not economically on par with Europe, most of North Africa is not in the shape of Sub-Saharan countries.

[GrebluBro]

As I always say, their average natural intelligence is lower than many of the other races in socio-economic and educational aspects.

[Isleño]

No, they are not similar at all. There are more than 50 million Latinos/Hispanics in the US. There are at max 6 million North Africans in Europe.

Most North Africans came by legal ways to Europe, from post WWII to the early 1970's as laborers (and later family reunification). Spain and Italy allowed new workers during their economic boom in the 1990's and 2000's. There is an element that did came illegally to Europe, like those not leaving when their visa documents expired. From my experience only a few, the most desperate, came to Europe with ragtag boats. And it seems they all ended up in Peyrol's city.

Most of the illegal immigrants reaching the Canary Islands (Spain) are Sub-Saharan Africans in boats. I have family there and they've told me about this.

[Empecinado]

No, they are not similar at all. There are more than 50 million Latinos/Hispanics in the US. There are at max 6 million North Africans in Europe.

Most North Africans came by legal ways to Europe, from post WWII to the early 1970's as laborers (and later family reunification). Spain and Italy allowed new workers during their economic boom in the 1990's and 2000's. There is an element that did came illegally to Europe, like those not leaving when their visa documents expired. From my experience only a few, the most desperate, came to Europe with ragtag boats. And it seems they all ended up in Peyrol's city.

Most of them entered illegally here.

[Borna]

Saying Africa is poor because of harsh environment is stupid. We have all seen what Boers did once they settled.

Race, race and only race.

[Theron]

Saying Africa is poor because of harsh environment is stupid. We have all seen what Boers did once they settled..

The amount of resources here is astonishing. So is the beautiful climate, amount of quality land and opportunity for farming.

http://www.capetown.at/heritage/history/images/flags.JPG

"The Republic of South Africa that we know of today has not been created by wishful thinking. We have created it at the expense of intelligence, sweat and blood." - P.W. Botha

The fact is that it takes hard work to use resources and create success. It requires ingenuity, creativity and planning. It requires a certain way of thinking and a certain spirit.

[Cleitus]

Gentical inferiority nothing other.

[Borna]

The amount of resources here is astonishing. So is the beautiful climate, amount of quality land and opportunity for farming.

http://www.capetown.at/heritage/history/images/flags.JPG

"The Republic of South Africa that we know of today has not been created by wishful thinking. We have created it at the expense of intelligence, sweat and blood." - P.W. Botha

The fact is that it takes hard work to use resources and create success. It requires ingenuity, creativity and planning. It requires a certain way of thinking and a certain spirit.

Who knows how economically strong South Africa would be if faggots didn't stop it.

[Sidi Atlas]

Most of them entered illegally here.
Spain and Italy perhaps. But they are not the majority in Europe.

[Sidi Atlas]

Legal or not, they all wanted to leave their countries of origin. No future there.
Obviously, just like all the Latinos in the US or the earlier European migrants to the new world.

[Arcadefire]

I feel like this is a bait thread. African countries for the most part dont fair too well economically because the concept of a country itself is a foreign one. It was created by the previous colonials. Now what you have is rival tribes fighting for the money from the natural resources, rather than working togethr for the good of the country. This is the most dumbed down answer i can give. I minored in African economics during my university days.

There are countries within africa who are set to rocket past the industrial revolution and grow exponentially (with the help of the Chinese). Africa probably has higher ceiling in economic growth than all the continents combined btw.

[Styrian Mujo]

Africa should be put under European rule again,it would be better for the Africans and European nations could benefit from it aswell. Basically Europeans need resources and Africans need order and stability. The native Africans could be used as cheap labor and gather neccessary resources while the Europeans keep them in line with a strong millitary and political preasance. In my opinion they should not even have a proper monetary system but rather be payed with basic material necesseties like food and fuel etc.

[GrebluBro]

There are countries within africa who are set to rocket past the industrial revolution and grow exponentially (with the help of the Chinese). Africa probably has higher ceiling in economic growth than all the continents combined btw.

1000 => 1100 (100 points up, 10% growth). This is European or non-SSA country
100 => 150 (only 50 points up :(, but 50% growth :clap:) This is Sub-saharan

Screw you exponential growth logic

1000 vs 100 => 1100 vs 150 mean nothing, don't go blind by GDP growth rate

[Theron]

. Now what you have is rival tribes fighting for the money from the natural resources, rather than working togethr for the good of the country. I minored in African economics during my university days.

With all due respect, subjects like these have Marxoid written all over them. You're right that the nation state is foreign concept to them, but the idea that they would work 'for the good of the country' in its absence is ludicrous. African history is wrought with conflict as great as Europe's except battle losses resulted in an entire tribe being wiped out or enslaved. Heard of the Mfecane?


There are countries within africa who are set to rocket past the industrial revolution and grow exponentially (with the help of the Chinese). Africa probably has higher ceiling in economic growth than all the continents combined btw.

Most of the fastest growing economies are in Africa, an interesting statistic coupled with their birth rates which will outstrip any growth.

[Arcadefire]

1000 => 1100 (100 points up, 10% growth). This is European or non-SSA country
100 => 150 (only 50 points up :(, but 50% growth :clap:) This is Sub-saharan

Screw you exponential growth logic

Okay except, there are countries in Africa like Nigeria whose economy is already larger than most of the countries in the world. They also have one of the largest oil reserves, big man power and a stable government. Open a book and explore the world around you , you simpleton. I am not saying that Nigeria is a developed country btw before you use that as a leverage to make retarded claims.

[Ultra]

Most Iraqis go to the Americas, very very very few of us go to Europe.
:lol00002:


Are you even serious? There are almost more Iraqis living in Sweden alone than in the whole United States of America and Canada combined! :rotfl:

[Arcadefire]

With all due respect, subjects like these have Marxoid written all over them. You're right that the nation state is foreign concept to them, but the idea that they would work 'for the good of the country' in its absence is ludicrous. African history is wrought with conflict as great as Europe's except battle losses resulted in an entire tribe being wiped out or enslaved. Heard of the Mfecane?



Most of the fastest growing economies are in Africa, an interesting statistic coupled with their birth rates which will outstrip any growth.

Yes ofcourse, I am not saying that the situation is without any flaws. But lets be honest here most of whats goin on in Africa (in terms of development) is often not the type of Africa that gets shown in western media. What emerging African economies need right now is probably a working governing model.

It worked for Japan, and South Korea in the past.

[Sidi Atlas]

Most Iraqis go to the Americas, very very very few of us go to Europe.
In Scandinavia and England the number of Middle Easterners (Iraqis, Syrians and Palestinians) have grown quite fast over the past years. Usually they go through Turkey and Greece, but from Libya as well.

[Theron]

Yes ofcourse, I am not saying that the situation is without any flaws. But lets be honest here most of whats goin on in Africa (in terms of development) is often not the type of Africa that gets shown in western media. What emerging African economies need right now is probably a working governing model.

It worked for Japan, and South Korea in the past.

But Japan and South Korea are homogeneous. African countries are made up of competing ethnic groups more often than not. East Asian culture also encourages hard work and resilience, and those 2 countries received billions from the U.S to develop, it's not comparable at all.

Africa needs more than a 'working government model', it needs an overhaul of its way of thinking.

[Arcadefire]

But Japan and South Korea are homogeneous. African countries are made up of competing ethnic groups more often than not. East Asian culture also encourages hard work and resilience, and those 2 countries received billions from the U.S to develop, it's not comparable at all.

Africa needs more than a 'working government model', it needs an overhaul of its way of thinking.

All that you are saying are things that come with the improvement of ones quality of life. The governments are corrupted and thus do not use the money to uplift their own people.

Did you know that the oil reserves in equatorial guinea can rival the ones in Middle east (all the while having less population)? So all that is stopping the HDI from growing is proper government. Do you know how long it took for United Arab Emirates to go from a deserted waste lant do the skyscraper filled Arabic state you see for your self today?

So , if the Arabs can do it (who btw did not have a concept of country wither and were more tribalistic in nature like the Africans) why not the Africans? People here are going to tell me that it is simply because they are Black, and that is something I cannot agree with.

[StonyArabia]

Are you even serious? There are almost more Iraqis living in Sweden alone than in the whole United States of America and Canada combined!

Yeah Iraqi Assyrian, Kurds, possibly Turkmens and Persians, who have nothing to do with Iraqi Bedouins. I am more familiar with where Iraqi Bedouins migrate than you. Most migrated to Saudi Arabia btw and or the Americas. Just because they are Iraqis it does not mean I am related to them.



In Scandinavia and England the number of Middle Easterners (Iraqis, Syrians and Palestinians) have grown quite fast over the past years. Usually they go through Turkey and Greece, but from Libya as well.

Sure but many of them are Assyrian,Kurds, and other ethnic groups from Iraq Persians for example, I am not related to any of them on genetic or cultural level. I am more related to Saudis, ethnic Jordanians, Emiratis, Yemenites. Iraqi Bedouins have migrated to Saudi Arabia, UAE or the Americas this a fact. We barely have any large community in Europe. You should know Iraq is quite multiethnic. When I speak about Iraqis I am speaking about the Bedouin community, since Kurds don't identify as such only it suits them, well Turkmens identify as Turks, Assyrians don't identity as such, the only exception is the sizable Persian community, but they are Persian, and most them migrated to Sweden with the rise of Saddam. So how am I related to these ethnic groups?

[Theron]

All that you are saying are things that come with the improvement of ones quality of life. The governments are corrupted and thus do not use the money to uplift their own people.

Why are the governments corrupted? It's clearly a cultural issue as it occurs from the tip of Africa where I'm writing from to Ras ben Sakka.


Did you know that the oil reserves in equatorial guinea can rival the ones in Middle east (all the while having less population)? So all that is stopping the HDI from growing is proper government. Do you know how long it took for United Arab Emirates to go from a deserted waste lant do the skyscraper filled Arabic state you see for your self today?

I work in petroleum supplies, I think I'm well versed. If you're going to reference oil reserves, at least do it properly. Nigeria by far has the largest proven oil reserves in Africa, but still only a fraction of the UAE (which, in turn, has a modest percentage of Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia or Venezuela).

To harness oil reserves one needs massive capital investment and an enormous amount of machinery and human capital, none of which Africa has or can attract due to civil disobedience and uneasy investment conditions for foreigners.


So , if the Arabs can do it (who btw did not have a concept of country wither and were more tribalistic in nature like the Africans) why not the Africans? People here are going to tell me that it is simply because they are Black, and that is something I cannot agree with.

How will their reserves be unlocked with no rule of law or civil order, meaning no investment can take place? Oil doesn't magically flow out of the ground.

Take Nigeria - they churn out a sizable number of barrels today, yet after forty years of companies like Shell being present there their population has not benefited at all. The reason being that they're run by corrupt military veterans who favour certain ethnic groups. Nigeria has been producing oil since before Dubai had any skyscrapers.

[StonyArabia]

UAE does not depend on Oil, they just used oil wisely to start their country.

The economy of the United Arab Emirates is the second largest in the Arab world (after Saudi Arabia), with a gross domestic product (GDP) of $377 billion (AED1.38 trillion) in 2012. The United Arab Emirates has been successfully diversifying the economy. 71% of UAE's total GDP comes from non-oil sectors. Oil accounts for only 2% of Dubai's GDP.

They just have had smart leadership and may God bless Sheikh Zayed. Also the tribes in the UAE do power sharing with the system of the Emirates hence why it's stable and successful compared to others than the area. They follow non-Western political tool but the Bedouin way and this what has made them successful, unlike the governments/ideologies which is modeled after a European one and hence why it failed. People should have their own form government and what suit them best.

[Theron]

UAE does not depend on Oil, they just used oil wisely to start their country.

Where did anyone claim such? I was referencing their enormous oil reserves which, in collusion with OPEC, allowed them constant budget surpluses in order to diversify.


They just have had smart leadership and may God bless Sheikh Zayed. Also the tribes in the UAE do power sharing with the system of the Emirates hence why it's stable and successful compared to others than the area. They follow non-Western political tool but the Bedouin way and this what has made them successful, unlike the Baathism which is modeled after a European one and hence why it failed.

UAE is a success story because of its oil reserves coupled with smart leadership. To deny that it was their oil reserves that put them in a good position on the world stage is delusional.

[GrebluBro]

Okay except, there are countries in Africa like Nigeria whose economy is already larger than most of the countries in the world. They also have one of the largest oil reserves, big man power and a stable government. Open a book and explore the world around you , you simpleton. I am not saying that Nigeria is a developed country btw before you use that as a leverage to make retarded claims.

Apply the same logic for the per-capita GDP or average income.. Size of the economy doesn't matter. India is the third largest economy in the world (in PPP)..It means nothing. China's progress is exaggerated a little though.

Average European per-capita GDP is 25 times as much as average SSA or Nigeria.
But I took just 10 times here.


1000 => 1100 (100 points up, 10% growth). This is European or non-SSA country
100 => 150 (only 50 points up :(, but 50% growth :clap:) This is Sub-saharan

Screw you exponential growth logic
1000 vs 100 => 1100 vs 150 mean nothing, don't go blind by GDP per-capita growth rate

[Graine]

Yeah, UAE doesn't depend on oil anymore. UAE has the most diversified economy in the Middle East http://www.emirates247.com/business/uae-most-diversified-economy-in-middle-east-2012-01-23-1.438934

[Graine]

UAE is a success story because of its oil reserves coupled with smart leadership. To deny that it was their oil reserves that put them in a good position on the world stage is delusional.No one denied that

[StonyArabia]

Where did anyone claim such? I was referencing their enormous oil reserves which, in collusion with OPEC, allowed them constant budget surpluses in order to diversify.

Some people claim, that all the rich Middle Eastern nation depend on the oil, on here, but this not true. I know that's what you meant, but I was only showing to my points who keep saying that they depend on the da oil, usually from people who seem to be envious or believe that Middle Easterners are inferior and without the oil wealth everything goes down the drain but this is simply not true at all. As shown by the way how the UAE economy has become diversified, which has led to even to the start of industrialization.


UAE is a success story because of its oil reserves coupled with smart leadership. To deny that it was their oil reserves that put them in a good position on the world stage is delusional.

Indeed they have very intelligent leadership because they use their own system which fits with their cultural and national ideal. Not all systems are going to work in different setting and this why often fail. For example the UAE leadership does power-sharing, thus everyone participates in the government and decision making this in itself shows why it became success story. Yes the oil was the start, no one denies this, which has made them start their nation, but to say that it's only an oil sheikhdom is false. All of the Arabian Gulf states have diverse economy, with only Saudi Arabia but even than it's slowly creating a diverse economy, for example this desertwaste land is now is starting to have an agricultural section, and even small industries. The Saudi monarchy itself might change the way it behaves and adopted the UAE Bedouin model of governance, rather than relic of an Ottoman model.

[Rojava]

CAPITALISM and feudalism.

It's precisely the reason why they are doing bad. The rich will get richer, the other 99.99% have to stick to poverty and working like slaves. In fact, where is the success of Capitalism anywhere in the world?

[Theron]

Some people claim, that all the rich Middle Eastern nation depend on the oil, on here, but this not true. I know that's what you meant, but I was only showing to my points who keep saying that they depend on the da oil, usually from people who seem to be envious or believe that Middle Easterners are inferior and without the oil wealth everything goes down the drain but this is simply not true at all. As shown by the way how the UAE economy has become diversified, which has led to even to the start of industrialization.

Yes they've been very clever and strategic. They've invested in their future, and if I was any emerging economy with oil reserves I would consult with them for sure.


Indeed they have very intelligent leadership because they use their own system which fits with their cultural and national ideal. Not all systems are going to work in different setting and this why often fail. For example the UAE leadership does power-sharing, thus everyone participates in the government and decision making this in itself shows why it became success story. Yes the oil was the start, no one denies this, which has made them start their nation, but to say that it's only an oil sheikhdom is false. All of the Arabian Gulf states have diverse economy, with only Saudi Arabia but even than it's slowly creating a diverse economy, for example this desertwaste land is now is starting to have an agricultural section, and even small industries. The Saudi monarchy itself might change the way it behaves and adopted the UAE Bedouin model of governance, rather than relic of an Ottoman model.

I think you've got a good point. Unfortunately it seems that finding an adaptable model for Africa is going to very difficult or nearly possible. The Arabians in general have found a good form of governance, not that I agree with its moral foundations. They've managed to build efficient modern economies out of sand dunes, however their class-based model means wealth has trickled down at a slower rate than they've grown. It's all about striking a balance, but I fear that Africa's cultural and ethnic problems will make it very difficult to find a workable model.

[Ultra]

Yeah Iraqi Assyrian, Kurds, possibly Turkmens and Persians, who have nothing to do with Iraqi Bedouins. I am more familiar with where Iraqi Bedouins migrate than you. Most migrated to Saudi Arabia btw and or the Americas. Just because they are Iraqis it does not mean I am related to them.
But you said 'Iraqis', not 'Iraqi Bedouins' idiot. Your 'Iraqi Bedouins' are a minority population in Iraq.

[someone1337]

because they are a barbaric subhumans.

[Äijä]

I feel like this is a bait thread. African countries for the most part dont fair too well economically because the concept of a country itself is a foreign one. It was created by the previous colonials. Now what you have is rival tribes fighting for the money from the natural resources, rather than working togethr for the good of the country. This is the most dumbed down answer i can give. I minored in African economics during my university days.

There are countries within africa who are set to rocket past the industrial revolution and grow exponentially (with the help of the Chinese). Africa probably has higher ceiling in economic growth than all the continents combined btw.

They would as colonies.

[Arcadefire]

They would as colonies.

Perhaps. But none of those governments in Africa are stupid enough to just hand over the keys to their country to foreign governments. Although, one can say that colonialism does exist but in the form of Capitalism. And thats something which I dont mind. Its a dog eat dog world right? Dont be surprised if you see countries that are "leased out" to fortune 500 corps like Walmart , Apple and Honda.

This has infact started to take place not just in Africa but even places where you would least least expect like Mid west America, Russia and hell, even China. Truth of the matter is that multinational corps in the not not far future will be more powerful than governments themselves.

[Arcadefire]

Capitalism is not for the weak. Its for those who embrace the challenge and competition. So anyone who is going to come at me with your communist/socialist/religious talks ... save the talk.

[Anglojew]

can you think of any reason except race. i think mostly because of civil wars, there is no peace and stability, which is start to have prosperity.

Culture and religion. Christian countries do better than Muslim ones. A good example of a successful African country is Botswana.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a4/GDP_per_capita_%28current%29%2C_%25_of_world_avera ge%2C_1960-2012%3B_Zimbabwe%2C_South_Africa%2C_Botswana%2C_Za mbia%2C_Mozambique.png

[KidMulat]

Culture and religion. Christian countries do better than Muslim ones. A good example of a successful African country is Botswana.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a4/GDP_per_capita_%28current%29%2C_%25_of_world_avera ge%2C_1960-2012%3B_Zimbabwe%2C_South_Africa%2C_Botswana%2C_Za mbia%2C_Mozambique.png

Botswana is a homogenous extremely mineral rich nation with less than 5 presidents; I'd say De beers still owns Botswana in large part and that it is an example of what I was talking about.