Strong genetic admixture in the Altai at the Middle Bronze Age[...] Hollard et al.2014

[Artek]

Strong genetic admixture in the Altai at the Middle Bronze Age revealed by uniparental and ancestry informative markers

Abstract

The Altai Mountains have been a long term boundary zone between the Eurasian Steppe populations and South and East Asian populations. To disentangle some of the historical population movements in this area, 14 ancient human specimens excavated in the westernmost part of the Mongolian Altai were studied. Thirteen of them were dated from the Middle to the End of the Bronze Age and one of them to the Eneolithic period. The environmental conditions encountered in this region led to the good preservation of DNA in the human remains. Therefore, a multi-markers approach was adopted for the genetic analysis of identity, ancestry and phenotype markers.

Mitochondrial DNA analyses revealed that the ancient Altaians studied carried both Western (H, U, T) and Eastern (A, C, D) Eurasian lineages.

In the same way, the patrilineal gene pool revealed the presence of different haplogroups (Q1a2a1-L54, R1a1a1b2-Z93 and C), probably marking different origins for the male paternal lineages. To go further in the search of the origin of these ancient specimens, phenotypical characters (ie: hair and eye colour) were determined. For this purpose, we adapted the HIrisPlex assay recently described to MALDI-TOF mass spectrometry. In addition, some ancestry informative markers were analyzed with this assay. The results revealed mixed phenotypes among this group confirming the probable admixed ancestry of the studied Altaian population at the Middle Bronze Age. The good results obtained from ancient DNA samples suggest that this approach might be relevant for forensic casework too.

Source: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1872497314001161

EDIT

Y-DNA:
4 x R1a-Z93
3 x Q-L54
1 x C-M130

mtDNA:
T1a
H7e*
H1b
H or U(?)
U4
D5a2
C4a1
2 x D
D2
A

[Artek]

Detailed info added. Autosomal results will be published later.



I wonder if they will show diversity or it's just a uniparental one.

[Fire Haired]

Detailed info added. Autosomal results will be published later.



I wonder if they will show diversity or it's just a uniparental one.

I bet they will be most similar to someone of mixed east European and Mongolian ancestry. This is great news because now we will finally have Autosomal markers that are without of doubt descended of early Indo Europeans.

[Anglojew]

I bet they will be most similar to someone of mixed east European and Mongolian ancestry. This is great news because now we will finally have Autosomal markers that are without of doubt descended of early Indo Europeans.

Yes Q and R are caucasoid. They may have mixed with Mongoloids as they travelled east but most of those regions were caucasoid until well into the Bronze Age so this is unclear. The assumption that we can use contemporary populations to extrapolate ancient ones racial characteristics is quite wrong as It ignores both major and minor and small and massive migrations of populations.

[Fire Haired]

Yes Q and R are caucasoid. They may have mixed with Mongoloids as they travelled east but most of those regions were caucasoid until well into the Bronze Age so this is unclear. The assumption that we can use contemporary populations to extrapolate ancient ones racial characteristics is quite wrong as It ignores both major and minor and small and massive migrations of populations.

We can't assume central Asia and Siberia were west Eurasian/Caucasoid(don't forget about basal Eurasian admixture, so the term Caucasiod may be to simple) until the bronze age. There is prove in Ancient DNA (http://www.ancestraljourneys.org/mesolithicdna.shtml) that is not the case, and the baraba steppe of Siberia during the Neolithic and bronze age (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDIQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.theapricity.com%2Fforum%2Fsho wthread.php%3F119347-Population-History-of-the-Baraba-Forest-Steppe-from-the-Neolithic-Iron-age&ei=CKyPU_6jCYKXqAbfp4BQ&usg=AFQjCNH1B1PE0Ygg-mzYL4tcDJcNIQfKRg&sig2=KdcbRZkUxYRU06AcbL4i2Q&bvm=bv.68445247,bs.1,d.cGU) the was mixed east and west Eurasian ancestry, but primarily eastern. There is alot of Siberian-specific and American-specific genetic diversity which proves they had east Asian ancestors in Siberia since the Upper Palaeolithic. Siberians and Amerindians are essentially a mix between west Eurasians(ANE) and east Asians who lived in Siberia during the Upper Palaeolithic.

[Äijä]

Wish we would get some N1c samples from these times, they are hiding somewhere.

[Fire Haired]

Wish we would get some N1c samples from these times, they are hiding somewhere.

N1c has been found in China from 3000YBP and in royal graves from medieval Hungary(paternal lines came from Finno-Urgics from eastern Europe).

[Anglojew]

We can't assume central Asia and Siberia were west Eurasian/Caucasoid(don't forget about basal Eurasian admixture, so the term Caucasiod may be to simple) until the bronze age. There is prove in Ancient DNA (http://www.ancestraljourneys.org/mesolithicdna.shtml) that is not the case, and the baraba steppe of Siberia during the Neolithic and bronze age (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDIQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.theapricity.com%2Fforum%2Fsho wthread.php%3F119347-Population-History-of-the-Baraba-Forest-Steppe-from-the-Neolithic-Iron-age&ei=CKyPU_6jCYKXqAbfp4BQ&usg=AFQjCNH1B1PE0Ygg-mzYL4tcDJcNIQfKRg&sig2=KdcbRZkUxYRU06AcbL4i2Q&bvm=bv.68445247,bs.1,d.cGU) the was mixed east and west Eurasian ancestry, but primarily eastern. There is alot of Siberian-specific and American-specific genetic diversity which proves they had east Asian ancestors in Siberia since the Upper Palaeolithic. Siberians and Amerindians are essentially a mix between west Eurasians(ANE) and east Asians who lived in Siberia during the Upper Palaeolithic.

I've seen lots of studies on here stating that ancient Central Asia was Caucasoid.

[Äijä]

N1c has been found in China from 3000YBP and in royal graves from medieval Hungary(paternal lines came from Finno-Urgics from eastern Europe).

I ment in Europe and what is their autosomal mix compared to today.

[Fire Haired]

I've seen lots of studies on here stating that ancient Central Asia was Caucasoid.

I agree Central Asia was mainly Caucasoid(ANE and WHG) from the Upper Palaeolithic-bronze age but the east Asians had always been around that area and recently with Turks and Mongols east Asian ancestry has become dominate in central Asia. The Indo Iranians though were not native to central Asia they arrived from eastern Europe in the bronze age.

[Fire Haired]

I ment in Europe and what is their autosomal mix compared to today.

No autosomal DNA was sampled. The origin Uralic people in Europe and Y DNA N1c1 will probably be figured out in the next few years with ancient DNA. Also, these bronze age Mongolian's western ancestry is probably very similar to modern northeast Europeans, including Finno-Urgics, because they originated around the same area as did Slavs, Balts, and Finno-Urgics.

[Anglojew]

I agree Central Asia was mainly Caucasoid(ANE and WHG) from the Upper Palaeolithic-bronze age but the east Asians had always been around that area and recently with Turks and Mongols east Asian ancestry has become dominate in central Asia. The Indo Iranians though were not native to central Asia they arrived from eastern Europe in the bronze age.

Q and R developed around Central Asia.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ef/Haplogroup_F_%28Y-DNA%29.PNG

The Indo-European people ruled the area up to the Bronze age according to Herodotus (1200-600 BCE was the end of the Bronze Age in that region)

http://www.cais-soas.com/CAIS/Images2/Maps/Achaemenid_and_Iranic_Peoples_in_the_Ancient_World .PNG

Q1b (at least) at least was IE (and we know present in Scythian populations)

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/t31/1483774_186091991592269_1920299087_o.jpg

[Artek]

I bet they will be most similar to someone of mixed east European and Mongolian ancestry. This is great news because now we will finally have Autosomal markers that are without of doubt descended of early Indo Europeans.
Chuvash, Komi, Mari? What are your types?

[blogen]

Nothing new. The measured paleoanthropological data manifested this before with decades already at the Soviet times.

[blogen]

N1c has been found in China from 3000YBP and in royal graves from medieval Hungary(paternal lines came from Finno-Urgics from eastern Europe).

From which royal graves?

[Artek]

Nothing new. The measured paleoanthropological data manifested this before with decades already at the Soviet times.
I've heard that anthropology was very developed in the Soviet Union. Their reconstructions are quite impressive, given that they couldn't back it up with genetics.

[blogen]

I've heard that anthropology was very developed in the Soviet Union. Their reconstructions are quite impressive, given that they couldn't back it up with genetics.

The genetics is a handicapped science for the history. The archaeology, the physical anthropology and the genetics are the auxiliary sciences of the history, but the genetics produces only few real results and these results are almost useless, since this is suitable for the description of a population's movement with big scale only or onto the examination of single persons' lineage.

[Fire Haired]

Chuvash, Komi, Mari? What are your types?

I could to be totally wrong but it does seem that east Europeans have alot of common ancestry other Europeans lack. The Baltic component in Eurogenes K13, east European component in Dv3, north European components are centered in eastern Europe while Mediterranean components are much more popular in western Europe and partly descend from west European-specific WHG.