European component in Caucasus

[TheForeigner]

How come all transcaucasian and north caucasus groups have such large european genetic components? Also how about european genetic components in a bunch of west and central asian groups? Does this prove indo-european origin in europe or did cro magnons expanded to caucasus and western asia too?

[Illancha]

Does this prove indo-european origin in europe or did cro magnons expanded to caucasus and western asia too?
Caucasians are much more ancient than modern day Europeans, just like the Basques, and are not Indo-European. It is much more likely that the Europeans of today have a Caucasian component, not the other way around.

[Fire Haired]

Caucasians are much more ancient than modern day Europeans, just like the Basques, and are not Indo-European. It is much more likely that the Europeans of today have a Caucasian component, not the other way around.

It is impossible for one people group to be older or ancestral to another. You are simplifying populations by their language and ignoring the complex genetic origins they all have including Caucasian speaking people.

[War Chef]

Because somehow early Proto-Indo-European people infiltrated north Caucasian society. Because of low P-I-E y-DNA (R1a) and high P-I-E mtDNA (U2, U5) it seems it was mostly P-I-E women who contributed to the European component in Caucasians. Either they were refugees of original P-I-E expansion conflicts up north or they were victims of abductions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bride_kidnapping#Dagestan.2C_Chechnya_and_Ingushet ia

http://i62.tinypic.com/rkuesj.png
http://i62.tinypic.com/2gua0yr.png

I think the latter is more possible, especially since N-E Caucasians are a bit more European than N-W Caucasians, coincidentally N-E Caucasians also are the only ones who practice bridal abduction.

http://i57.tinypic.com/2s67gb4.jpg

[Austrvegr]

Caucasians are mostly refugees to the Caucasus mountains from the Near East + a small European admixture from Eastern Europe.

[interes]

Because somehow early Proto-Indo-European people infiltrated north Caucasian society. Because of low P-I-E y-DNA (R1a) and high P-I-E mtDNA (U2, U5) it seems it was mostly P-I-E women who contributed to the European component in Caucasians. Either they were refugees of original P-I-E expansion conflicts up north or they were victims of abductions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bride_kidnapping#Dagestan.2C_Chechnya_and_Ingushet ia

http://i62.tinypic.com/rkuesj.png
http://i62.tinypic.com/2gua0yr.png

I think the latter is more possible, especially since N-E Caucasians are a bit more European than N-W Caucasians, coincidentally N-E Caucasians also are the only ones who practice bridal abduction.

http://i57.tinypic.com/2s67gb4.jpg

No why West Georgians are more European than all North Caucassians

[Damião de Góis]

They're mostly "caucasian" by a long way. For example:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ArJDEoCgzRKedEY4Y3lTUVBaaFp0bC1zZlBDcTZEY lE#gid=0

[Illancha]

I think the latter is more possible, especially since N-E Caucasians are a bit more European than N-W Caucasians, coincidentally N-E Caucasians also are the only ones who practice bridal abduction.
What? Circassians are famous for bridal abductions too.


Caucasians are mostly refugees to the Caucasus mountains from the Near East + a small European admixture from Eastern Europe.
Refugees... sure if you're talking about Turkic and Iranic migrants.

[blogen]

Caucasians are much more ancient than modern day Europeans, just like the Basques, and are not Indo-European. It is much more likely that the Europeans of today have a Caucasian component, not the other way around.

The ancestors of the Basques were presumably Bronze age colonists from the Near East. But they are definitely not mesolithic origin peoples.

[blogen]

How come all transcaucasian and north caucasus groups have such large european genetic components? Also how about european genetic components in a bunch of west and central asian groups? Does this prove indo-european origin in europe or did cro magnons expanded to caucasus and western asia too?

They expanded towards Europe since the neolithic. The "european genetic components" were Near and Middle Eastern originally. Mostly.

[Smeagol]

They expanded towards Europe since the neolithic. The "european genetic components" were Near and Middle Eastern originally. Mostly.

What about the North European component? Is that Mesolithic, or partially Neolithic Middle Eastern too?

[blogen]

What about the North European component? Is that Mesolithic, or partially Neolithic Middle Eastern too?

Mostly mesolithic in Scandinavia.

[Blazkowicz]

They are a mix of basal eurasian and ANE component mostly.

[War Chef]

What? Circassians are famous for bridal abductions too.


Yes but I wrote:


N-E Caucasians also are the only ones who practice bridal abduction.


Practice =/= practiced


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yvLzsvPln8?

I guess it must be of much deeper importance to N-E Caucasian culture if they still maintain the tradition to this day.

[Illancha]

I guess it must be of much deeper importance to N-E Caucasian culture if they still maintain the tradition to this day.
More like the "tradition" has propagated beyond what used to be deemed acceptable since the country is being run by a criminal class.

I've mentioned before that in the past it used to be different. When a couple fell in love and wanted to get married, but the parents of either side refused, the daughter would run away with the help of the husband. This is what used to be called kidnapping and it only happened within the community, there is no history of forcefully stealing brides of a different ethnicity. To call it a tradition is also erroneous because it was never something that was looked on kindly, most of the time it is described as a bad habit, at best you could say the stance was neutral. Nowadays it has taken on a much more literal meaning due to the general lawlessness of the region.

[Cleitus]

Caucasians are much more ancient than modern day Europeans, just like the Basques, and are not Indo-European. It is much more likely that the Europeans of today have a Caucasian component, not the other way around.

http://www.richardcassaro.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Aryan-Homeland-After-the-Flood.jpg :picard2:

[Illancha]

http://www.richardcassaro.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Aryan-Homeland-After-the-Flood.jpg :picard2:
Yes, and what exactly is that map supposed to tell me?

[Cleitus]

Yes but I wrote:



Practice =/= practiced


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yvLzsvPln8?

I guess it must be of much deeper importance to N-E Caucasian culture if they still maintain the tradition to this day.

Such filthy subhumans.

[TheForeigner]

Didn't the mirditi albanian tribe kidnapped their brides from rival clans into the 20th century? I read it in old book about ottoman empire at turn of last century.

[TheForeigner]

Mostly mesolithic in Scandinavia.

He was referring to north european genetic component in caucasus and not what genetic element is dominant in scandinavians.