Use French or lose it, study says

[Grumpy Cat]

Most Acadians and other francophones in Nova Scotia remain optimistic about the future of French in the province, but a "strong majority" of those surveyed for a new study said they prefer to use English in public settings.

The study, released Monday, found that 90 per cent of 600 francophones surveyed said they were unlikely to ask for government services in French unless prompted in some way.

Kenneth Deveau, the study’s main author, said the findings suggest the province must do a better job of letting the province’s 30,000 francophones know when services are offered in their mother tongue.

"There’s generations of socialization at play," said Deveau, a professor with Universite Sainte-Anne.

"We’ve been programmed to assume that the language of service in Nova Scotia is in English, as is the case in most Canadian provinces."

Deveau’s study, prepared for the Office of Acadian Affairs, included six recommendations aimed at improving services for the province’s French-speaking minority.

Among other things, the study says Nova Scotia should make all road signs, government forms and office signs bilingual.

As well, the study says the government should promote French-language service by asking service providers to greet the public in both languages and wear special pins that indicate they are bilingual.

"If you add visual prompts . . . nine out of ten francophones say that, yes, they’d be apt to continue in French," he said.

Deveau said he didn’t know how much these changes would cost, but he insisted it wouldn’t be much, citing federal studies that show provision of bilingual services require very little money.

"A lot of these things don’t cost very much," he said. "Saying, "hello bonjour’ doesn’t cost a cent."

Desire Boudreau, president of Acadian Federation of Nova Scotia, also said the costs would be minimal.

"This is probably one way that we can help the francophone people become more aware of the advantages of the French language." he said.

In 2004, the province passed legislation guaranteeing services in French from designated department and agencies. The French Language Act also declared the province’s commitment to preserving and expanding its Acadian and francophone community.

However, Deveau’s study found that francophones in the province generally had little contact with the French language outside of their personal relationships.

As well, most of the respondents confirmed that French played a modest role in their schooling, especially at the secondary and postsecondary levels. And the majority of respondents said they rarely turned to French-language media for information.

Still, half the respondents thought that French and English are equally important in their region and that the usage of the French language will remain the same or will improve over the next 20 years.

The report says Nova Scotia francophones are being assimilated at such a rapid rate that the community will not be able to maintain itself indefinitely. It says the province has to act now "since the community cannot afford many more delays."

"The assimilation rate in this country is alarming, outside of New Brunswick and Quebec," said Deveau. "If we really want to maintain this country as we know it we really have to be pro-active with the places that we reserve for French in this country."

The Nova Scotia government issued a statement saying the study shows the province is on the right track.

"The province has made significant efforts to improve government services to Acadian and francophone Nova Scotians over the last few years," said Vaughne Madden, chief executive officer of Acadian Affairs.

She said the province’s "Bonjour!" program encourages government employees to offer services in French.

However, Deveau said the government’s efforts represent a "work in progress."

http://thechronicleherald.ca/Canada/1170114.html

[Wulfhere]

I hate French. It was imposed on my people for hundreds of years, and even today the ability to speak it is regarded as something to be proud of, rather than abhored. Let it die out.

[Tolleson]

French will never die in Canada. My family will do their part to ensure the continuation of their heritage and respect to their ancestors. :thumb001:

[Luern]

I hate French. It was imposed on my people for hundreds of years, and even today the ability to speak it is regarded as something to be proud of, rather than abhored. Let it die out.

I assume that only aristocrats spoke French, not the common people.

[Psychonaut]

I hate French. It was imposed on my people for hundreds of years, and even today the ability to speak it is regarded as something to be proud of, rather than abhored. Let it die out.

You know what? I do believe that the word which best describes such a hater is of French origin...


DOUCHE

[Solwyn]

One of the things that could be done in Nova Scotia, would be to institute lessons in Acadian French in the school system, instead of Parisian French. It's not what gets spoken in this country, but it is what we're taught in school. I think it might go a long way for kids to be introduced to a language that is still spoken in their area, whether they belong to that ethnic group or not. Since French is an official language of this country, it is win-win.

Start in the schools while they're young. My education about my Acadian heritage consisted of learning about spinning and farming on a field trip in grade 4. It was as if the Acadians suddenly disappeared with the advent of modern technology. Introduce kids to Acadian figures in culture - hey!!! - like my cousin JP Cormier and his fine musical stylings:) Or people like writer "La Sagouine" Antoinine Maillet - I never heard of her until I got to university. Merging media a bit might be helpful, too. It's nice that there is CBC and Radio Canada, and various radio stations to cater to different groups, but most folks in the mainstream anglo community and the majority of the other ethnic groups popping up in this country, are blithely unaware of what is available to them through the French media. It will open them up to a whole world of activity that they are otherwise ignorant of, in their own backyard.

The dialects of Nova Scotia are fading quickly, whether it's "Cape Bretonese" (very much like Scot's English), Gaelic, or Acadian French. If the govt won't help this erosion, then it is up to each and every parent out there to ensure that their child learns at home - and if the parent does not know then they should educate themselves so that they can pass it on.

[Wulfhere]

I assume that only aristocrats spoke French, not the common people.

That's true, and English literature and culture was destroyed. French was used in courts of law and the universities. If you wanted to get on, you needed to speak it.

[Wulfhere]

You know what? I do believe that the word which best describes such a hater is of French origin...


DOUCHE

I don't even know what that word means, and nor do I care. I much prefer good Old English words like cunt. The French can't even swear properly.

[Osweo]

I much prefer good Old English words like cunt.
Now that you come to mention it, that word does suit you far better than Psychonaut's proposal.

I apologise to all Franco-Canadiens, Acadiens in particular, for my ill-mannered and ignorant countryman. :( Funny thing is, I entertained similar notions once - when I was about fourteen. You're what, Wulfy; over forty? :rolleyes:

***

I must say this attitude surprised me:

The study, released Monday, found that 90 per cent of 600 francophones surveyed said they were unlikely to ask for government services in French unless prompted in some way.
The most familiar near parallel to me is that of Welsh. in my experience, Welsh speakers are very ready to complain if official material in their own country is not delivered in both languages. That even the most fluent Cambrophones all too often then go on to read the English parallel text is by the by. ;)

Solwyn has made good suggestions, especially with the need to focus on from-below initiatives, but some investigation of how official policy has helped in Wales might be worthwhile reading for anyone active in this sphere. :thumbs up

[Grumpy Cat]

I must say this attitude surprised me:

The most familiar near parallel to me is that of Welsh. in my experience, Welsh speakers are very ready to complain if official material in their own country is not delivered in both languages. That even the most fluent Cambrophones all too often then go on to read the English parallel text is by the by. ;)


Well, I guess people are under the assumption that folks don't speak French. And I am one of those folks who prefers to use English in public settings, it's something that has been ingrained for generations here. I noticed a lot of NS Acadians (myself included) don't use French on social networking sites like Facebook and Twitter, even when communicating with other Acadians. I hope this technology is not a detriment to the language.

I don't ask for service in French, it's too much of a pain, since staff would probably have to find someone who was bilingual and I just don't have time for that. Plus, it would probably irritate people and make a scene. Screw that.


The French can't even swear properly.

I may not be able to swear, but at least I'm not a creepy 40-something year old who has a fetish for underage blonde virgins doing squats. But hey, at least you keep your paedophilia in your own race, instead of the more common ones who fly to Thailand for child hookers.

Mon dieu tabarnac!

[Wulfhere]

I may not be able to swear, but at least I'm not a creepy 40-something year old who has a fetish for underage blonde virgins doing squats. But hey, at least you keep your paedophilia in your own race, instead of the more common ones who fly to Thailand for child hookers.

Mon dieu tabarnac!

Since when has a 16-year-old been underage, eh?

[Grumpy Cat]

Since when has a 16-year-old been underage, eh?

You're in your 40s, you're a creep. Get some help, seriously.

[Wulfhere]

You're in your 40s, you're a creep. Get some help, seriously.

I don't need help, I've got all the assistance I need. At least I'm doing something, unlike most of the people here.

[Grumpy Cat]

I don't need help, I've got all the assistance I need. At least I'm doing something, unlike most of the people here.

Yeah, taking advantage of vulnerable teenage girls is sure "doing something".

[Wulfhere]

Yeah, taking advantage of vulnerable teenage girls is sure "doing something".

You have literally no idea what you're talking about.

[Grumpy Cat]

You have literally no idea what you're talking about.

I think I do. I can just picture the girls you have in your Daughters of Fyra group. Depressed, vulnerable, and fragile, because no girl in her right frame of mind would agree to do that. You're a predator. I bet your hard drive is well stocked child pornography too.

[Wulfhere]

I think I do. I can just picture the girls you have in your Daughters of Fyra group. Depressed, vulnerable, and fragile, because no girl in her right frame of mind would agree to do that. You're a sick creep. I bet your hard drive is well stocked child pornography too.

That sounds like a rather serious allegation.

As for the girls in our group, I assure you we're giving them far, far more than anyone else ever would have.

[Grumpy Cat]

T

As for the girls in our group, I assure you we're giving them far, far more than anyone else ever would have.

"We're". LOL. Yeah right. Just you. And what are you giving them? The same kind of things Charles Manson and Jim Jones gave their followers?

That sentence right there is indicative that you're a predator.

[Wulfhere]

"We're". LOL. Yeah right. Just you. And what are you giving them? The same kind of things Charles Manson and Jim Jones gave their followers?

That sentence right there is indicative that you're a predator.

As I understand it, Charles Manson and Jim Jones gave death and destruction to their followers. What we're doing is giving life. But why bother arguing with ignorance?

[Grumpy Cat]

As I understand it, Charles Manson and Jim Jones gave death and destruction to their followers. What we're doing is giving life. But why bother arguing with ignorance?

Again with "we're". LOL. You're not fooling me, it's just YOU.

I don't call forcing someone to abstain from sex, wear a uniform, and do 1200 knee bends "life". You probably picked up some vulnerable,depressed, possibly drug addicted girls who came from bad families off the streets because they're easier to control. I know your type. Sick.

[Psychonaut]

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=3985&stc=1&d=1267664236

[Grumpy Cat]

^^^ rofl

[Wulfhere]

Again with "we're". LOL. You're not fooling me, it's just YOU.

I don't call forcing someone to abstain from sex, wear a uniform, and do 1200 knee bends "life". You probably picked up some vulnerable,depressed, possibly drug addicted girls who came from bad families off the streets because they're easier to control. I know your type. Sick.

I founded the order, yes - back in 1985. So I'm in charge. What's your problem?

I assure you we have better ways of getting girls than picking them up off the street. By bringing them up from birth, for example.

[Grumpy Cat]

I founded the order, yes - back in 1985. So I'm in charge. What's your problem?

My problem is that I think you're a sick fuck. And considering the rep points I have gotten from my past few posts, I'm not the only person on the forum who thinks that.


I assure you we have better ways of getting girls than picking them up off the street. By bringing them up from birth, for example.

Ah. So you're like that inbred polygamous sect in Texas? Nice.

[Wulfhere]

My problem is that I think you're a sick fuck. And considering the rep points I have gotten from my past few posts, I'm not the only person on the forum who thinks that.



Ah. So you're like that inbred polygamous sect in Texas? Nice.

You honestly have no fucking idea, do you?

[Psychonaut]

My problem is that I think you're a sick fuck. And considering the rep points I have gotten from my past few posts, I'm not the only person on the forum who thinks that.

You're not alone. ;)

Middle aged guys who use fictional documents to form cults that allow them to surround themselves with young girls who they then clothe in skimpy outfits and oversee them exercising their unclad legs for hours each day is indeed really fucking creepy. It's just as creepy as Michael Jackson's antics.

[Wulfhere]

You're not alone. ;)

Middle aged guys who use fictional documents to form cults that allow them to surround themselves with young girls who they then clothe in skimpy outfits and oversee them exercising their unclad legs for hours each day is indeed really fucking creepy. It's just as creepy as Michael Jackson's antics.

Do you think I've got nothing better to do than watch them for hours each day? Why on earth would I want to?

[Treffie]

The most familiar near parallel to me is that of Welsh. in my experience, Welsh speakers are very ready to complain if official material in their own country is not delivered in both languages. That even the most fluent Cambrophones all too often then go on to read the English parallel text is by the by. ;)

Solwyn has made good suggestions, especially with the need to focus on from-below initiatives, but some investigation of how official policy has helped in Wales might be worthwhile reading for anyone active in this sphere. :thumbs up

Most services are available in both English and Welsh now :)

[Grumpy Cat]

Most services are available in both English and Welsh now :)

Yeah, services aren't available in French in Nova Scotia, unless you go to a French-speaking area, really. I think. I have never really tried.

Thanks for bringing this thread back on track BTW. :D

[Baron Samedi]

That sounds like a rather serious allegation.

As for the girls in our group, I assure you we're giving them far, far more than anyone else ever would have.

All 2 inches?

:thumb001:

[Guapo]

All 2 inches?

:thumb001:

:lol00002::rotfl::whoo:

[Solwyn]

This was a great thread, was being the operative word. I'm not sure where all this other stuff came from but I'm sure that someone can enlighten me, off thread.

When I get home tonight I'll post more where I left off the other day.

:)

[Treffie]

All 2 inches?

:thumb001:

:twwp:

[poiuytrewq0987]

:twwp:

I concur.

[Liffrea]

Originally Posted by Wulfhere
That's true, and English literature and culture was destroyed.

Lol, have you ever read Middle English literature?

Chaucer? Sir Gawain and the Green Knight? The Cloud of Unknowing?

Now I’ll admit I do have a nostalgic “what if” moment regarding 1066 but that’s all it is, instead of banging on about the Normans English folks should be more concerned that our own people are increasingly ignorant of their own culture and history. My nephew doesn’t even know what happened at Dunkirk, WTF goes on in schools today?

[Grumpy Cat]

This was a great thread, was being the operative word. I'm not sure where all this other stuff came from but I'm sure that someone can enlighten me, off thread.

When I get home tonight I'll post more where I left off the other day.

:)

Sorry, I ruined my own thread by essentially turning it into an episode of "Dateline". Maybe the mods can move the correspondence between myself and Wulfhere into another thread and call it "To Catch a Pedophile".

So about the state of Acadian French in Nova Scotia? Please bring this thread back on track.

[Solwyn]

Sorry, I ruined my own thread by essentially turning it into an episode of "Dateline". Maybe the mods can move the correspondence between myself and Wulfhere into another thread and call it "To Catch a Pedophile".

So about the state of Acadian French in Nova Scotia? Please bring this thread back on track.

HAHAHAHAHA.....Dateline. That is funny!!!!

You were mentioning that you don't ask for service in French because it is too much of a hassle. Now I don't know about the provincial level but I know at the federal level most employees have to be bilingual. Not all of them mind you, for example I have a friend who is a computer programmer and he isn't required to be (which is good, because I've heard him try to speak French and it makes my ears crinkle in pain) bilingual but his job doesn't see him dealing with the public.

My Quebecois friends need to look away for a moment......Well no, you don't, LOL.....just kidding, don't leave the room:D

When I worked for DFAIT (passport office) in the late 90s and early 00s, our regional manager who was Quebecois and based in Montreal was quite thrilled to announce to us the complete elimination of all English speaking positions in Nova Scotia within DFAIT. They would be replaced by the "bilingual imperative" designation. Now this wasn't so shit hot for the (mostly) anglo employees in a (like it or not) mostly anglo province, and I personally didn't feel it was warranted when half our staff was Acadian, including the office manager at the time. What happened next was an absolute gong show. Everyone had to take a French language test and compete for their job with the outside world. Most of the ACADIAN employees, who had been happily filling bilingual slots, some for decades, were FAILED on their french tests and told they weren't "french enough". Most of the Acadian public who applied as well were told the same thing.

OK.....the FRENCH Acadians didn't speak enough French to communicate effectively with anyone else other than another slang-speaking Acadian. That is a problem. Before anyone gets their knickers in a knot, let me tell you that I got to listen to my officially designated bilingual coworkers speak in their language and it was 80% badly pronounced English. Chiac is not French, sorry, but it ain't. "No maman, je suis in the HOFFICE dis passport" said the young man to his mother as he spoke to her on his cell phone and demanded a bilingual speaker from me:D I remember thinking, "I went to university so I could talk to YOU???"

Overnight, Quebecois people started showing up to take the jobs. I was laid off at about that time anyway because I was moving to the Annapolis Valley so I didn't bother to pay too much attention after that. Things like this get trumped up in the "Quebec vs Canada" arguments that are used to fan fear all over the country, but the fact is, many Quebecois are bilingual and more Canadians outside of Quebec are not bilingual than are.

Now I've heard Acadian French - not the Chiac slang - and it's beautiful. One day I'd like to really dive in and learn it, although the chances of that are slim out here in Manitoba. I've often wondered if there isn't an immersion program somewhere in The Maritimes specific to Acadian French dialect, but I haven't found one so far.

As for it being a hassle, hassle away!!!! The immigrants to this country have no problem with demanding that the axis of the universe be tilted in their favour. Ditto for the First Nations and Metis. You are a born and bred citizen with rights, in a country that is supposed to be bilingual from sea to shining sea. If it is a hassle it's because not enough of us are insisting on it. It IS easier to function in English in Nova Scotia but that doesn't always make it right.

Acadians are one of the OLDEST lock, stock, and barrel uniquely CANADIAN ethnic groups around, but one of the quietest. There's a greater likelihood that Muslim immigrants will get the call to prayer in Atlantic Canada before Acadians see their brand of French preserved, because guess who is louder. If we don't stand up and shake our collective fist, and start rattling political chains then the powers that be will simply think we don't care and then POOF!!! We fade away to nothing.

[Grumpy Cat]

Interesting you bring that up. I was educated in English K-12, but went to a francophone university. When I started, I didn't pass the French entrance exam, so I was put in the French as a second language program for a semester. It was really depressing. See, in ways I think Acadian should be considered a different language. It is like Old French. I've said this before it's like the difference between Dutch and Afrikaans, and they are considered separate languages although very closely related and mutually intelligable.

The problem with shaking the political chains: when we do it, we are whiners or troublemakers. When other groups do it, they're fighting for their rights. There's a double-standard there. I'd rather not start a scene. There was a day, when I was younger, but I am too old for that, and I'm antisocial so I'd like to get stuff done as quickly as possible. And as the article said, it's generations of socialization at play here.