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Yuffayur
01-18-2015, 12:43 PM
Nearly two decades after the ancient skeleton called Kennewick Man was discovered on the banks of the Columbia River, the mystery of his origins appears to be nearing resolution.

Genetic analysis is still under way in Denmark, but documents obtained through the federal Freedom of Information Act say preliminary results point to a Native-American heritage.

The researchers performing the DNA analysis “feel that Kennewick has normal, standard Native-American genetics,” according to a 2013 email to the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, which is responsible for the care and management of the bones. “At present there is no indication he has a different origin than North American Native American.”

If that conclusion holds up, it would be a dramatic end to a debate that polarized the field of anthropology and set off a legal battle between scientists who sought to study the 9,500-year-old skeleton and Northwest tribes that sought to rebury it as an honored ancestor.

In response to The Seattle Times’ records request, geochemist Thomas Stafford Jr., who is involved in the DNA analysis, cautioned that the early conclusions could “change to some degree” with more detailed analysis. The results of those studies are expected to be published soon in a peer-reviewed scientific journal. Stafford and Danish geneticist Eske Willerslev, who is leading the project at the University of Copenhagen, declined to discuss the work until then.

But other experts said deeper genetic sequencing is unlikely to overturn the basic determination that Kennewick Man’s closest relatives are Native Americans.

The result comes as no surprise to scientists who study the genetics of ancient people, said Brian Kemp, a molecular anthropologist at Washington State University. DNA has been recovered from only a handful of so-called Paleoamericans — those whose remains are older than 9,000 years — but almost all of them have shown strong genetic ties with modern Native Americans, he pointed out.

“This should settle the debate about Kennewick,” Kemp said.

Establishing a Native-American pedigree for Kennewick Man would also add to growing evidence that ancestors of the New World’s indigenous people originated in Siberia and migrated across a land mass that spanned the Bering Strait during the last ice age. And it would undermine alternative theories that some early migrants arrived from Southeast Asia or even Europe.

It’s not clear, though, whether the upcoming study will provide tribes the legal ammunition they need to reclaim what they call “The Ancient One.”

Controversy flared over the skeleton almost from the moment in 1996 when two students stumbled across human bones near the Southeastern Washington town of Kennewick.

Bothell archaeologist James Chatters, the first scientist to examine the skeleton, said the skull looked “Caucasoid,” not Native American. A facial reconstruction that bore a striking resemblance to Capt. Jean-Luc Picard (actor Patrick Stewart) of the television series “Star Trek: The Next Generation,” further inflamed members of local tribes, who argued that the remains were rightfully theirs under the Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act.

After eight years of litigation, a federal appeals court ruled in 2004 that Kennewick Man’s extreme age made it impossible to establish a clear link to any existing Northwest tribes.

A scientific team led by Douglas Owsley, a physical anthropologist at the Smithsonian Institution, won the right to study the skeleton, which is stored at the University of Washington’s Burke Museum of Natural History and Culture.

The results, including a new facial reconstruction based on more thorough analysis of the skull, were published last year in a 669-page book. Owsley, the lead author, told Northwest tribal members in 2012 that he remains convinced Kennewick Man was not Native American.

In an interview last week, Owsley explained that he bases that conclusion on the shape of the skull, which doesn’t look anything like the skulls of modern Native Americans. Its narrow brain case and prominent forehead more closely resemble Japan’s earliest inhabitants and people whose genetic roots are in Southeast Asia, not Siberia and other parts of Northeast Asia.

“His origins are going to go back to coastal Asia,” Owsley said.

That wouldn’t preclude the possibility of some distant, shared ancestry with Native Americans, he added. But chemical analysis of the bones suggests Kennewick Man ate a lot of marine mammals, which means he probably spent most of his life along the coast of Alaska or British Columbia, not on the Columbia Plateau where his bones were discovered, Owsley said.

With its ability to settle questions about lineage, DNA analysis has become one of the most powerful tools for the study of the ancient world, said Peter Lape, curator of archaeology at the Burke Museum. “This is yet another case where genetics are really revolutionizing the way we think about ancestry and calling into question older scientific methods that rely on looking at the shape of bones,” he said.

Nevertheless, the majority of visitors he encounters at the museum still have the impression that Kennewick Man is Caucasian. “That initial media storm from 1996 just kind of stuck,” Lape said.

Chatters, the man who kicked up that storm, changed his mind after studying the 13,000-year-old skeleton of a young girl discovered in an underwater cave in Mexico. As with Kennewick Man and other remains of the earliest prehistoric Americans, the shape of the girl’s skull was unusual. But DNA analysis proved that she shared a common ancestry with modern Native Americans, originating with the people who migrated into the land mass called Beringia beginning about 15,000 years ago.

“The result from Kennewick is the same one we’re getting from the other early individuals,” Chatters said. “It’s what I expected.”

Attempts to extract DNA from Kennewick Man’s bones in the late 1990s failed. But the technology has advanced so much since then that researchers recently succeeded in analyzing the genome of a 130,000-year-old Neanderthal from a single toe bone.

Willerslev’s Danish lab is a world leader in ancient DNA analysis. Last year, he and his colleagues reported the genome of the so-called Anzick boy, an infant buried 12,600 years ago in Montana. He, too, was a direct ancestor of modern Native Americans and a descendant of people from Beringia.

Until details of the Kennewick analysis are published, there’s no way to know what other relationships his genes will reveal, Kemp said. It may never be possible to link him to specific tribes, partly because so few Native Americans in the United States have had their genomes sequenced for comparison.

“My feeling is once you get the Kennewick genome, there are going to be people lining up to find out if they’re related to him,” he said.

Members of Northwest tribes visit the Burke Museum regularly to pay their respects to The Ancient One, and continue to press for his reburial.

Willerslev met with tribal representatives in Montana before analyzing the Anzick boy’s DNA. Last summer, after those studies were done, he joined tribal members — including several Northwest veterans of the Kennewick Man wars — as they reinterred the boy’s bones on a sagebrush-covered slope near the spot where he was discovered.


http://media.tri-cityherald.com/smedia/2014/08/25/14/15/1bkJ3P.AuSt.13.jpg

http://nmnh.typepad.com/.a/6a01156e4c2c3d970c01b8d05c6506970c-pi

http://thumbs.media.smithsonianmag.com//filer/51/9f/519fea8a-a215-48fe-ba09-fae09a0bb3e3/kennewick-hero.jpg__800x600_q85_crop.jpg


Source:http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2025488002_kennewickdnaxml.html

Kamal900
01-18-2015, 01:31 PM
The guy look very Ainu looking, and really, its not surprising considering that the Ainu people are paleo-mongoloid. Euro centric supremacists tend to paint the man as an early white Caucasian native American to justify colonialism.

Longbowman
01-18-2015, 01:35 PM
Surprise surprise! to no-one but American white supremacists.

StonyArabia
01-18-2015, 01:37 PM
The guy look very Ainu looking, and really, its not surprising considering that the Ainu people are paleo-mongoloid. Euro centric supremacists tend to paint the man as an early white Caucasian native American to justify colonialism.


Indeed nothing more and nothing less. I never believed the BS he was a white man because it sounded like a Eurocentric fairy tale, luckily DNA confirms that he was a Native American. Some Native American in the pacific coast tend to look similar to the Ainu. Da white man being native to the Americas is a myth and always was with genetics this is confirmed.

Longbowman
01-18-2015, 01:38 PM
inB4 NWO scientists are lying to us. Can't wait for them to release the genome.

Yuffayur
01-18-2015, 01:56 PM
The guy look very Ainu looking, and really, its not surprising considering that the Ainu people are paleo-mongoloid. Euro centric supremacists tend to paint the man as an early white Caucasian native American to justify colonialism.

+1





Indeed nothing more and nothing less. I never believed the BS he was a white man because it sounded like a Eurocentric fairy tale, luckily DNA confirms that he was a Native American. Some Native American in the pacific coast tend to look similar to the Ainu. Da white man being native to the Americas is a myth and always was with genetics this is confirmed.

Agree with you there is a study on EA including Ainus, they're East Asians, not caucasoid or other BS.





inB4 NWO scientists are lying to us. Can't wait for them to release the genome.

Same here, I'm waiting for his DNA.

Insuperable
01-18-2015, 02:02 PM
Indeed nothing more and nothing less. I never believed the BS he was a white man because it sounded like a Eurocentric fairy tale, luckily DNA confirms that he was a Native American. Some Native American in the pacific coast tend to look similar to the Ainu. Da white man being native to the Americas is a myth and always was with genetics this is confirmed.

Why "luckily"? Are you Native American? I would expect at least for Latin Americans to open this thread a post a comment or two, but no.

StonyArabia
01-18-2015, 02:32 PM
Why "luckily"? Are you Native American? I would expect at least for Latin Americans to open this thread a post a comment or two, but no.

No I am not Native American, but my best friend is Native American from the Cree tribe. I am just against Eurocentric myths that justify colonialism and imperialism.

Neanderthal
01-18-2015, 02:35 PM
how odd. the skull is perfectly caucasoid but the genome is native american :wink the 13k remains of the yucatan's girl had an odd head shape because it was deliberately modified, and does look nothing like kennewick man, which looks not deformed, but cromagnid. as an anthropologist in formation, i can tell you, there's a lot of agendas trying to be push around, there are no good or bad guys, just different interests. this article tries to excuse the odd cranial shape so badly, that i'm in suspicion

Longbowman
01-18-2015, 04:16 PM
inB4 NWO scientists are lying to us. Can't wait for them to release the genome.


how odd. the skull is perfectly caucasoid but the genome is native american :wink the 13k remains of the yucatan's girl had an odd head shape because it was deliberately modified, and does look nothing like kennewick man, which looks not deformed, but cromagnid. as an anthropologist in formation, i can tell you, there's a lot of agendas trying to be push around, there are no good or bad guys, just different interests. this article tries to excuse the odd cranial shape so badly, that i'm in suspicion

Tacitus
01-18-2015, 04:18 PM
I need Melonhead's take on this.

Longbowman
01-18-2015, 04:23 PM
I need Melonhead's take on this.

Scientists are deceiving us. Can you not see with your own eyes that Kennewick Man was a British Isles Neanderthal?

Neanderthal
01-18-2015, 04:27 PM
Scientists are deceiving us. Can you not see with your own eyes that Kennewick Man was a British Isles Neanderthal?

uh, yes they often do

implying scientist are objective observing machines :lmao

Furnace
01-18-2015, 04:28 PM
Ainus are more of an intermediate though, not really mongoloid nor caucasoid, but some sort of a mix.

StonyArabia
01-18-2015, 04:30 PM
Ainus are more of an intermediate though, not really mongoloid nor caucasoid, but some sort of a mix.

Not really they are closer to Veddiods, who in turn are closer to Mongoloids. Ainu and Veddiods are often classified as proto-Mongoloid.

Longbowman
01-18-2015, 04:30 PM
uh, yes they often do

implying scientist are objective observing machines :lmao

Implying Melonhead is an objective observational machine?

The genome will be released and we'll see for ourselves.

TheForeigner
01-18-2015, 04:38 PM
The anthropologist that first said he was Caucasoid, reanalyzed the skull and skeleton and said he was similar to Polynesians and Ainu peoples. Those peoples have some craniofacial similarities with Caucasians and that is it.

Smeagol
01-18-2015, 06:02 PM
The anthropologist that first said he was Caucasoid, reanalyzed the skull and skeleton and said he was similar to Polynesians and Ainu peoples. Those peoples have some craniofacial similarities with Caucasians and that is it.

Yeah, basically they are intermediate between Caucasoid, and Mongoloid, and probably predate either as a distinct race. (and Polynesians also have Melanesian admixture) Kennewick Man is the same thing. People who call Amerindians pure Mongoloids are deluding themselves.

Gauthier
01-18-2015, 06:02 PM
Right on. I'm waiting for them to reveal his haplogroups.

Neanderthal
01-18-2015, 06:03 PM
Implying Melonhead is an objective observational machine?

The genome will be released and we'll see for ourselves.

never said i did

Yuffayur
01-18-2015, 06:10 PM
Ainus are more of an intermediate though, not really mongoloid nor caucasoid, but some sort of a mix.

Genetically they're East Eurasians, they are close to other East Asians.

Artek
01-18-2015, 06:11 PM
Right on. I'm waiting for them to reveal his haplogroups.
If not Q1a, then possibly C when it comes to Y-DNA. I would be really surprised if anything other was present.

Smeagol
01-18-2015, 06:14 PM
Old World sources of the first New World human inhabitants: A comparative craniofacial view
C. Loring Brace*†,
A. Russell Nelson*‡,
Noriko Seguchi*,
Hiroaki Oe§,
Leslie Sering*,
Pan Qifeng¶,
Li Yongyi‖, and
Dashtseveg Tumen**

Author Affiliations

Communicated by Kent V. Flannery, University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, MI
Abstract

Human craniofacial data were used to assess the similarities and differences between recent and prehistoric Old World samples, and between these samples and a similar representation of samples from the New World. The data were analyzed by the neighbor-joining clustering procedure, assisted by bootstrapping and by canonical discriminant analysis score plots. The first entrants to the Western Hemisphere of maybe 15,000 years ago gave rise to the continuing native inhabitants south of the U.S.--Canadian border. These show no close association with any known mainland Asian population. Instead they show ties to the Ainu of Hokkaido and their Jomon predecessors in prehistoric Japan and to the Polynesians of remote Oceania. All of these also have ties to the Pleistocene and recent inhabitants of Europe and may represent an extension from a Late Pleistocene continuum of people across the northern fringe of the Old World. With roots in both the northwest and the northeast, these people can be described as Eurasian. The route of entry to the New World was at the northwestern edge. In contrast, the Inuit (Eskimo), the Aleut, and the Na-Dene speakers who had penetrated as far as the American Southwest within the last 1,000 years show more similarities to the mainland populations of East Asia. Although both the earlier and later arrivals in the New World show a mixture of traits characteristic of the northern edge of Old World occupation and the Chinese core of mainland Asia, the proportion of the latter is greater for the more recent entrants.

Prehistoric and Recent Components of East Asia Compared with the Rest of the Old World.

A brief test of such expectations is shown by the placement of the Late Pleistocene samples at both the western and the eastern ends of the Old World when they are compared with the regional representatives used in Fig. 1. To give a fuller representation of the living human form at the eastern edge of the Old World, Mongols from north central East Asia, Southeast Asians, and Ainus off the northeast edge of the continent were added to produce the pattern of resemblances and differences shown in Fig. 2. The Late Pleistocene sample from eastern Asia was made up of one individual from just under 30,000 years ago at the Upper Cave at Zhoukoudian just west of Beijing, China (27), and two individuals of just under 20,000 years ago at Minatogawa, Okinawa (52, 53). The sample is very small and consists of males only, so the groups used to construct Fig. 2 were restricted to males from each of the populations represented. The added Mongol and Southeast Asian samples cluster with the Chinese samples used in Fig. 1, but the East Asian Pleistocene and the Ainu samples cluster with the European Upper Paleolithic and latterly with modern Europe itself before showing any linkage with the rest of the world.

Comparison of Late Pleistocene and Recent Components of East Asia and the Northwestern Part of the Old World.

Because the configurations represented in Africa, South Asia, and Australia/Melanesia are never linked with European, Asian, Oceanic, or New World samples, they were removed from the analyses when Oceanic and Western Hemisphere groups were being compared with the Old World. Fig. 3 shows the linkages and distinctions made when northern samples from Europe, Mongolia, China, and the Ainu of Japan are compared with Southeast Asia, Polynesia, and prehistoric groups in both Europe (Upper Paleolithic) and Japan (Jomon). The prehistoric Jomon and the Ainu of Japan are actually closer to the prehistoric and living European groups than to the core populations of continental Asia. The Polynesians of Oceania are close to being in between the European and Asian ends of the spectrum. Along with the Ainu and the Jomon, they could be described as Eurasian.

The fact that Late Pleistocene populations in northwest Europe and northeast Asia show morphological similarities suggests that there may have been actual genetic ties at one time. Those morphological similarities can still be shown between Europe and the descendants of the aboriginal population of the Japanese archipelago, i.e., the Ainu. This similarity provides some basis for the long-time claim that the Ainu represent an "Indo-European," "Aryan," or "Caucasoid" "type" or "race" (54, 55), however unfortunate those designations and their implications may be.

Demhat
01-18-2015, 07:35 PM
Genetically they're East Eurasians, they are close to other East Asians.

Genetically they are 2/5 ANE (pred. West Eurasian) and 3/5 East Eurasian. The reason why they cluster closer to East Eurasians though, is because of the additional basal Eurasian admixture in modern West Eurasians which drifts them away.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-jlF6eSOWmnk/VFwpvCk9MjI/AAAAAAAAJ1o/lkmfDp204OU/s1600/F2.large.jpg

Harkonnen
01-18-2015, 08:49 PM
The study Dooku posted looks very interesting.


The fact that Late Pleistocene populations in northwest Europe and northeast Asia show morphological similarities suggests that there may have been actual genetic ties at one time. Those morphological similarities can still be shown between Europe and the descendants of the aboriginal population of the Japanese archipelago, i.e., the Ainu. This similarity provides some basis for the long-time claim that the Ainu represent an "Indo-European," "Aryan," or "Caucasoid" "type" or "race" (54, 55), however unfortunate those designations and their implications may be.

However they're conclusions look dead wrong to me.

http://www.pnas.org/content/98/17/10017/F2.large.jpg

So according to the study, the Ainu, in world wide comparison, are actually more similar UP Europeans than what modern Europeans are, as is the 30k old Peking man. Also notice that the so called caucasoid Somalis and South Asians cluster with Africans and Melanesians.

Though in a intra Eurasian comparison Euro UP starts to cluster with modern Euros in exclusion of Ainu and rest of the posse.

Basically imo you could then say that this study disproves the existence of caucasoid race.

Harkonnen
01-18-2015, 09:40 PM
I mean here of course that in genetic sense Ainu are very much East Eurasians, who have just retained the early OOA CM-like phenotype. Btw I think I saw recently some PCA where Ainu clustered further apart from Westies then what the regular East Asians. That of course is not because they would actually be genetically more distant to West than say Japanese. It is just a proof of the massive drift they must have gone thru.

So let me recap. Ainu cluster there with UP Europe and the 30k Zhoukoudian man. Now let's remember the Tianyuan man (also from Beijing just like Zhouk) who was 10k older than Zhoukodian, and equidistant to North Euros and East Eurasians, as was Ust-Ishim from much further Northwest, but of similar age. This to me strongly hints that the Peking Man must be already on the ENA side genetically (24k Mal'ta was on the Western side), yet physically he is very similar to UP Europe and Ainu. This of course makes perfect sense. The Ainu as hunter gatherers have retained the early physical form due to their evolutionary conservative culture; they are a relic type. The mongoloid phenotype is really not so much a adaption to cold, but a product of the early neolithisation of East Asia. Is is sort of massively reduced Ainu-CM type.

Harkonnen
01-18-2015, 09:51 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if this were true at all, actually. Though I'm not versed in the Ainu lore (lotsa bullshit about them also flies around the net) so I cannot say with certainty about this particular group.

Is there any aDNA, y and mt on old/pure Ainu that's reliable?

If I remember correctly they belong mostly Y D.

Artek
01-18-2015, 09:52 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if this were true at all, actually. Though I'm not versed in the Ainu lore (lotsa bullshit about them also flies around the net) so I cannot say with certainty about this particular group.

Is there any aDNA, y and mt on old/pure Ainu that's reliable?
D for y-DNA, subgroups of M and D for mtDNA.

Demhat
01-18-2015, 09:57 PM
D for y-DNA, subgroups of M and D for mtDNA.

yDNA D is also found in Kalash and Tibetans.

I said it in the past, I think Ainu have preserved a proto Eurasian look which was much more widespred before the East and West Eurasian division. I believe yDNA E, F, D, C respresent early proto Eurasians. it is also these Haplogroups which are very close relatives.

So as Valtaves said and from what we see from East Eurasians who preserved more archaic features, the proto East Eurasians might probably have been more "Australoid/Amerindian like, before their look reduced and changed.

Harkonnen
01-19-2015, 07:48 AM
I believe yDNA E, F, D, C respresent early proto Eurasians. it is also these Haplogroups which are very close relatives.



Well you just basically named all the modern Eurasian haplogroups. D and E are bros, just like C and F are brothers. DE and CF then are cousins. This is how I would explain the familial relationships.

F is the superdaddy of the vast majority of Eurasian haplogroups (G, H, I, J, Q, R, N, O, etc). So a person who has a y-dna R, then belongs to y-dna F. It is just that because F has been so vastly more succesful compared to C, D, E; that it has become extremely diverse and widespread, and thus in order of clarity it's various subclades have been given their own 'alphabet'.
I'm not sure if you are implying this, but sometimes people seem to have the strange idea that if you have for example C haplo; you have a old haplo. When in fact you should look at the subclade of C to see if that's really true.

Another example. The split between the C in Japan, and the C in Australia happened much further back in time than the split between R and Q, yet people seem to think that just because of the C, the aborigines must share a close contact with the Japanese. Remember the naming scheme is largely arbitrary, its just somebody behind a desk decided not to give the various subclades of C or E, their own letter, when they easily could have actually deserved one.

Notice also that Africa has only 'two letters' A and B (if we now ignore E and the residue R1b, meaning here haplos that are completely African specific in their modern distribution). The African A and B are insanely diverse, and if a Afrocentrist would say, that it is only due to Eurocentrism, that Africa has not been given more letters. I would have to agree with him.

Han Cholo
01-19-2015, 07:56 AM
Kennewick man was just a Native American with (not so pseudo) Caucasoid features as a result of high ANE admix.

Amerindian is essentially East Eurasian (an archaic form of it, perhaps a bit like Ainus) + Ancient North Eurasian + fragments of South Asian perhaps. It shouldn't come as a surprise that their features resemble distinct arrangements of these 3 components.

TheForeigner
01-19-2015, 09:25 AM
Kennewick man was just a Native American with (not so pseudo) Caucasoid features as a result of high ANE admix.

Amerindian is essentially East Eurasian (an archaic form of it, perhaps a bit like Ainus) + Ancient North Eurasian + fragments of South Asian perhaps. It shouldn't come as a surprise that their features resemble distinct arrangements of these 3 components.

Why South Asian too? And did these components arrived with separate unmixed peoples or in solution already, directly from Siberia?

Demhat
01-19-2015, 09:34 AM
Well you just basically named all the modern Eurasian haplogroups. D and E are bros, just like C and F are brothers. DE and CF then are cousins. This is how I would explain the familial relationships.



I basically named the fathers of all Eurasian Haplogroups, because these Haplogroups are bros and as such represent a "proto Eurasian" groups. And thats basically why I have listed them.

Hevo
01-19-2015, 09:57 AM
If not Q1a, then possibly C when it comes to Y-DNA. I would be really surprised if anything other was present.

R*?;) But yeah it's probably Q or C.

Artek
01-19-2015, 10:08 AM
R*?;) But yeah it's probably Q or C.
Heh :D. I've searched this thesis that found R in Natives some time ago and it was found to be completely European and very recent( introduced with last 300 years). Also other haplogroups were found like I, J etc. So it debunks R* Solutreans in America.

Yuffayur
01-19-2015, 05:57 PM
Genetically they are 2/5 ANE (pred. West Eurasian) and 3/5 East Eurasian. The reason why they cluster closer to East Eurasians though, is because of the additional basal Eurasian admixture in modern West Eurasians which drifts them away.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-jlF6eSOWmnk/VFwpvCk9MjI/AAAAAAAAJ1o/lkmfDp204OU/s1600/F2.large.jpg

Which source says that Ainu people are 2/5 ANE and 3/5 EEA ??




ANE (pred. West Eurasian)

Mal'ta boy plot with Between Europeans and Native Americans, he's rather a mix of EEA(40-45%) and WEA (55-60%).

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Va8sH8ho66k/Uo0OKBpX4fI/AAAAAAAAJZo/RLd9i4JYpv4/s1600/pca.png

http://lh3.ggpht.com/-WPN5riOY_Cw/Ur6VFta1XbI/AAAAAAAAAUA/TVgvyG1xee0/s1600/Lazaridis2014_EDF3_K6_ancient.png

Demhat
01-19-2015, 08:38 PM
Which source says that Ainu people are 2/5 ANE and 3/5 EEA ??

Sorry, I meant the Amerindians.



Mal'ta boy plot with Between Europeans and Native Americans, he's rather a mix of EEA(40-45%) and WEA (55-60%).

I actually answered this question in my post. If you actually red the whole statement, the question would be obsolute.
here

The reason why they cluster closer to East Eurasians though, is because of the additional basal Eurasian admixture in modern West Eurasians which drifts them away.

There is second Eurasian element in West Eurasians which is neither West or East Eurasia, but part of a different Eurasian wave. And this "basal Eurasian" admixture drifts away modern West Eurasians. That is also the case with Ush_Ishim.


This suggests that the population to which the Ust’-Ishim individual belonged diverged from the ancestors of present-day West Eurasian and East Eurasian populations before—or simultaneously with—their divergence from each other. The finding that the Ust’-Ishim individual is equally closely related to present-day Asians and to 8,000- to 24,000-year-old individuals from western Eurasia, but not to present-day Europeans, is compatible with the hypothesis that present-day Europeans derive some of their ancestry from a population that did not participate in the initial dispersals of modern humans into Europe and Asia11.

So it seems that the Ust'-Ishim individual belonged to the same branch as Asians and WHG/ANE and modern Europeans are less like it because they also have "Basal Eurasian" admixture which they inherited via the EEF in the model of Lazaridis et al.
http://dienekes.blogspot.de/2014/10/high-coverage-genome-from-45000-year.html




The map which you quoted simply shows to which modern groups there is an affinitiy to MA1. Which is basically West Eurasians + Amerindians. But the reason for that is a different as you thing. 1. Malta =/= ANE, Malta genome in Amerindians does not prove it is part East Eurasian, otherwise ANE would be found in significant frequency in other East Eurasians too, what it isn't. It is rather a proof that ANE played a role in the formation of the Amerindian genome. This is why I quoted the map made by Lazaridis/Dienekes.

ANE is pred. West Eurasian and played a role in the formation of some East Eurasians, such as Amerindians.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-jlF6eSOWmnk/VFwpvCk9MjI/AAAAAAAAJ1o/lkmfDp204OU/s1600/F2.large.jpg

Peikko
01-19-2015, 08:55 PM
Physical anthropology epic fail again.

blogen
01-19-2015, 09:02 PM
First DNA tests say Kennewick Man was Native American.

What a surprise! (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?102860-Classify-Kennewick-Man&p=2115158&viewfull=1#post2115158) :D

nicalandia
05-03-2015, 09:32 PM
how odd. the skull is perfectly caucasoid but the genome is native american :wink the 13k remains of the yucatan's girl had an odd head shape because it was deliberately modified, and does look nothing like kennewick man, which looks not deformed, but cromagnid. as an anthropologist in formation, i can tell you, there's a lot of agendas trying to be push around, there are no good or bad guys, just different interests. this article tries to excuse the odd cranial shape so badly, that i'm in suspicion

Silvid Native american can have a very Caucasoid looking skulls

Óttar
05-03-2015, 09:54 PM
Then why does he have facial hair? Facial hair is a Caucasoid trait.

nicalandia
05-03-2015, 09:58 PM
Then why does he have facial hair? Facial hair is a Caucasoid trait.

its the Artist that gave him the facial hair in the forensic reconstruction, :)

Weedman
05-03-2015, 10:12 PM
No I am not Native American, but my best friend is Native American from the Cree tribe. I am just against Eurocentric myths that justify colonialism and imperialism.
that's social-anthropology (sociology)

not true, physical anthropology and genetics too

Black Wolf
05-25-2015, 02:18 AM
I am not surprised.

Longbowman
05-25-2015, 02:36 AM
I am not surprised.

Only WNs and romanticists are.

StonyArabia
05-25-2015, 02:55 AM
Then why does he have facial hair? Facial hair is a Caucasoid trait.

Not really the Ainu are not Caucasoid they have strong beards. Same with Australian Aborgines. Typical Amerindians don't grow beard, but Aleut and Inuit seem to grow beards. They might have lost the beard due to natural selection. Although some Amerindian group like the Haida do show beard growth. To say facial hair is Caucasoid trait is with all due respect laughable.

rhiannon
05-25-2015, 05:22 AM
The genome will be released and we'll see for ourselves.

Leo Iscariot
05-25-2015, 05:50 AM
http://slackbastard.anarchobase.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/muh-e1418461373633.jpg

nicalandia
05-31-2015, 07:20 PM
http://slackbastard.anarchobase.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/muh-e1418461373633.jpg
salty much?

http://files.enjin.com.s3.amazonaws.com/382770/modules/forum/attachments/salty_1415587652.png

Leo Iscariot
06-01-2015, 09:09 PM
salty much?

http://files.enjin.com.s3.amazonaws.com/382770/modules/forum/attachments/salty_1415587652.png

Perhaps, but not salty enough to bump a week old thread just to call someone else salty.