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View Full Version : 'Holocaust Denial' Laws are Disgraceful



European Knight
01-21-2015, 11:49 AM
David Irving, the controversial British historian, was arrested in Austria on November 11 for a 16-year-old violation of that country's "Holocaust denial" statute. He has now been formally charged, and if found guilty could face years in prison.

His case is by no means unique. In Germany, France, Austria, Belgium, Switzerland and several other European countries, as well as in Israel, it is a crime publicly to dispute the official version of Holocaust history.

The list of those who have been fined, imprisoned, or forced into exile for "denying the Holocaust" includes Robert Faurisson and Roger Garaudy in France, Siegfried Verbeke in Belgium, Juergen Graf and Gaston-Armand Amaudruz in Switzerland, and Guenter Deckert, Hans Schmidt and Fredrick Toben in Germany.

On November 8 the trial in Germany of "Holocaust denier" Ernst Zundel began with a dramatic clash between his attorneys and the presiding judge. And a few days later Germar Rudolf, a German citizen, was deported from Chicago to his homeland, where he likewise faces years of imprisonment for "denying the Holocaust."

Tony Blair's government considered introducing a "Holocaust denial" statute in Britain, but eventually rejected the idea. Italy, Ireland, Norway, Denmark and Sweden are among the other European countries that have declined to enact such laws.

Some people may be offended by those who play down Jewish death and suffering during World War II. But free and open societies protect even offensive speech. That's why western countries defend the right of their citizens, for example, to praise Communism or promote atheism.

"Holocaust denial" laws violate ancient and universal standards of justice. They criminalize even factual or truthful statements that "play down" or "whitewash" the Holocaust. They are selective and one-sided. In countries where they are on the books, the Holocaust is the only chapter of history that cannot be freely discussed. They inhibit historical inquiry and restrict free speech. They are a disgrace, and should be repealed.

http://www.ihr.org/news/112705HoloDenial.html

Anglojew
01-21-2015, 12:09 PM
I don't think Holocaust denial should be a crime. It's just as fascist as the Nazis for the state to tell people what to think. It would be far better for Jews to put those resources towards investigating actual neo-Nazis, lefitsts and/or Jihadists actively engaged in violence against Jews and others.

Anthropos
01-21-2015, 12:27 PM
I don't think Holocaust denial should be a crime.

I agree. Anti-denial laws pose a threat to science and to scientific understanding of history. Anyone who values scientific investigation should realize that. But people make exceptions because they are horrified, and because they are ready to sacrifice science for the sake of looking good morally in the eyes of others. It doesn't matter to me what any of the scientists and others opposing denial laws are saying; whether they make sense or not. It's the principles of science that are at stake here, and with them an integral part of human existence, human curiosity and thinking.

ShannonFlynn
03-03-2015, 04:05 AM
Overall flexibility regarding dialog is the lifeblood of a civilised society, without having which in turn zero different liberties that people cherish will be possible.

Prisoner Of Ice
03-03-2015, 04:28 AM
Evidence is actually pretty clear once you dig into it, which came as somewhat of a surprise to me considering how much stink there is about it. There was no such thing as a german 'death camp'. But at the same time they did kill a lot of jews who were never taken to a camp at all, there's bugged conversations of german generals talking about ethnic cleansing orders. All the 'evidence' for extermination camps came out of soviet union, though, so should be no surprise it's bullshit.

Ironically, the US set up to what amounts to death camps where millions of german prisoners were starved to death. The soviets starved 90% of their prisoners to death in gulags as well, and a huge chunk of its own population especially orthodox christians.

3 million died in combat on german side but the country lost 20 million altogether in spite of forced deportation of many germany diasporan people to germany, plus nongerman migration to east germany.

Wadaad
03-03-2015, 04:31 AM
Maybe Charlie Hebdo need to make a cartoon denying the holocaust, but they wont...

Longbowman
03-03-2015, 04:40 AM
Maybe Charlie Hebdo need to make a cartoon denying the holocaust, but they wont...

If they did, no Jews would shoot up their office, though.

No sacred cows. They're welcome to in my books.

Desaix DeBurgh
03-03-2015, 04:46 AM
If they did, no Jews would shoot up their office, though.

No sacred cows. They're welcome to in my books.


No, they wouldn't 'shoot up the office' but maybe liberal Jewish lawyers would work behind the scenes to continue to make such denial against the law or 'hate speech'. No offense LongBowMan but I take AngloJew's sincerity at face value while yours seems more ostensible. Of course if most Jews were like AngloJew I would be a philo-semite and never criticize jews but lets face it most Jews are not like AngloJew he is an outlier. BTW, since I drank a shitload of single malt scotch whisky I feel the need to append to every post I make tonight that I am totally wasted. Also, for whatever it is worth, I talked to an orthodox Jew today at a bus station who said : "I was very bright and would go far in life " for whatever that is worth; We talked about similar college classes we took even though years apart generationally etc..

Darth Revan
03-03-2015, 04:47 AM
Maybe Charlie Hebdo need to make a cartoon denying the holocaust, but they wont...

BAHAHAH, likely to happen :laugh:
The EDL will also complain about Jewish immigration and PEGIDA will highlight how Menorah monuments shouldn't be allowed in public parks.

Prisoner Of Ice
03-03-2015, 04:52 AM
If they did, no Jews would shoot up their office, though.

No sacred cows. They're welcome to in my books.

It's more scary to me that the law would throw you in jail than that some nut might shoot you.

I might get shor for some of the crap I say on here by some people if they had the guts, but having to worry before you open your mouth about jail time is another story.

It's funny to me that none of the myriad crimes all the immigrants do to french natives matter until they attack some leftist mouthpiece. There's not really a muslim problem, their problem is they let in a ton of 'refugees' from unstable violent areas. Of course now they get to experience the same.