Should Christians support Israel?

[3Feb]

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[poiuytrewq0987]

http://media.fakeposters.com/results/2009/07/28/51ewqacdcv.jpg

[Radojica]

http://media.fakeposters.com/results/2009/07/28/51ewqacdcv.jpg


No it wasn't :rolleyes:

[Murphy]

The short answer is 'no'.

[Eldritch]

Do you conduct real-life interactions with your friends and family exclusively by showing them YouTube videos, too?

[Hrolf Kraki]

Someone give me the gist of the videos, please! :p

I'm no Christian, but it makes sense to me that Christians should support Israel. Their religion ultimately stems from the Jewish people, and they've shared the same enemy for centuries.

[Murphy]

I'm no Christian, but it makes sense to me that Christians should support Israel. Their religion ultimately stems from the Jewish people, and they've shared the same enemy for centuries.

A good reason why we shouldn't is because orthodox Christianity has a completely different view on what exactly Israel is compared to the Jews. To a Christian, Israel is spiritual and is not tied to a piece of land, Israel is the Church. To a Jew, Israel is his material kingdom here to provide of his material wealth and existance and not his spiritual. The entire modern Talmudic-Jewish faith is simple materialism.

[Majar]

they've shared the same enemy for centuries.

What makes you think that?

[Loki]

Should Christians support Israel?


Yes, if they want to remain true to this Middle-Eastern religion's roots.

[Murphy]

Yes, if they want to remain true to this Middle-Eastern religion's roots.

And who are you, an atheist with no connection to any Abrahamic faith, to dictate to us Christians how to be good Christians?

[Loki]

And who are you, an atheist with no connection to any Abrahamic faith, to dictate to us Christians how to be good Christians?

I am Loki. Because I can. ;)

[Smaland]

Yes, if they want to remain true to this Middle-Eastern religion's roots.

Spiritually, the roots of Christianity and Judaism are quite different. From a doctrinal standpoint, Christianity is founded upon the Bible, but Judaism is based upon the Babylonian Talmud. Although they claim it as one of their holy books, the Old Testament (the Torah) is just window dressing to the Jews; the Talmud is what they follow.

One example of how the Bible and the Talmud are different is in their respective attitudes towards the sacrifice of children to the idol Molech. This practice is sternly condemned by the Bible, but the Talmud has this to say:
He who gives of his seed to Molech incurs no punishment unless he delivers it to Molech and causes it to pass through the fire. If he gave it to Molech but did not cause it to pass through the fire, or the reverse, he incurs no penalty, unless he does both (Talmud, Sanhedrin 64a).

[Hrolf Kraki]

What makes you think that?

Muslims have been the enemies of Christians and Jews for centuries. What makes me think that? History. The Qu'ran. What else should I say?

[Majar]

Muslims have been the enemies of Christians and Jews for centuries. What makes me think that? History. The Qu'ran. What else should I say?

Jewish and Muslim relations have not been wholly negative for centuries. Jews fleeing Catholic persecution mostly settled in Muslim-dominated areas. Jews settled in large numbers in Central Asia and Arab countries, and the Sephardic "Golden Age" happened while they were living under Islamic rule.

[Hrolf Kraki]

Jewish and Muslim relations have not been wholly negative for centuries. Jews fleeing Catholic persecution mostly settled in Muslim-dominated areas. Jews settled in large numbers in Central Asia and Arab countries, and the Sephardic "Golden Age" happened while they were living under Islamic rule.

I realize that Muslim regimes in the past have acted honorably towards nonbelievers, but on a whole they seem to be at odds, especially these days. I don't recall where right now, but it even says in parts of the Qu'ran that the Jew is their mortal enemy, etc. I'll see if I can find the particular sutra.

[Radojica]

I will rather support Muslims than Jews. Why? Not because I hate Jews or anything similar, but Muslims in general are more noble and decent people than Jews. That is only my opinion, which might be the product of some stereotypes, or my personal experience.

Jews did suffer during the history, especially during the WWII, that is true, but same did the Muslims, yet Muslims are not acting like Jews which are acting or are on very good way to become someone who they hated so much, Nazis...

[Fortis in Arduis]

I think that that Jews should support Israel.

[Hrolf Kraki]

I will rather support Muslims than Jews. Why? Not because I hate Jews or anything similar, but Muslims in general are more noble and decent people than Jews. That is only my opinion, which might be the product of some stereotypes, or my personal experience.

Jews did suffer during the history, especially during the WWII, that is true, but same did the Muslims, yet Muslims are not acting like Jews which are acting or are on very good way to become someone who they hated so much, Nazis...

More noble??? What? Have you seen the way Muslims treat their own women? Not to mention most of the Arab world consists of Muslim extremists.

Albert Einstein was a Jew. Remember Relativity?


If I made a list of all the most important scientific achievements of the last 300 years, I'd bet there'd be ten times as many Jewish contributors than Muslim, even though demographically Muslims far outnumber Jews. Gee, I wonder why...

[Radojica]

More noble??? What? Have you seen the way Muslims treat their own women? Not to mention most of the Arab world consists of Muslim extremists.

Albert Einstein was a Jew. Remember Relativity?


If I made a list of all the most important scientific achievements of the last 300 years, I'd bet there'd be ten times as many Jewish contributors than Muslim, even though demographically Muslims far outnumber Jews. Gee, I wonder why...

Albert Einstein was a fraud. His wife, Mileva Maric wrote this theory, since Einstein was very poor in math ;). Google about that, you will see. Might not be true, but might be in the end ;).

BTW, he treated her very bad, both her and their children, he did not take care about them.

And about Muslims way of treating women, well, don't know do you like to generalize and to think that All Muslims are acting like Talibans, but I assure you that is not the case. Muslim has the obligation to treat his wife in the best possible way. Sure, they beat their wives and might even kill them, but tell me, Christians don't do that, Jews don't do that? It has to do with person, not religion. I grew up in the family where I was seeing that on daily basis, but I never smacked or beaten my girlfriend.


Not to mention most of the Arab world consists of Muslim extremists.
This is such a horse shit and you know that. Billion of Muslims are extremists?! :lol:

[SuuT]

Christians should support Israel, non-Christians should support Israel, dogs and cats should support Israel, your brother's second cousin's flatmate should support Israel, and everyone should support Israel twice on Sundays.


Do your part. (http://www.cyrusfoundation.org/)

[poiuytrewq0987]

Christians should support Israel, non-Christians should support Israel, dogs and cats should support Israel, your brother's second cousin's flatmate should support Israel, and everyone should support Israel twice on Sundays.


Do your part. (http://www.cyrusfoundation.org/)

I think the Jews discredited themselves when Isaac said "four corners of Earth". :jump0000:

[Treffie]

More noble??? What? Have you seen the way Muslims treat their own women? Not to mention most of the Arab world consists of Muslim extremists.


LOL :D Please don't allow your mind to be seduced by images that ALL muslims are suicide bombers. As much as I hold Islam in disdain (same goes for Christianity and Judaism), I know that most Muslims (like Christians) are quite happy to get on with their lives without thinking of bombing the US ;)

[poiuytrewq0987]

LOL :D Please don't allow your mind to be seduced by images that ALL muslims are suicide bombers. As much as I hold Islam in disdain (same goes for Christianity and Judaism), I know that most Muslims (like Christians) are quite happy to get on with their lives without thinking of boming the US ;)

We need to create a Christian suicide bomber brigade to have Christian extremism catch up!

IN NAME OF JESUS AND GOD! *BOOM*

[Radojica]

We need to create a Christian suicide bomber brigade to have Christian extremism catch up!

IN NAME OF JESUS AND GOD! *BOOM*


o_12E1EN6fs

:thumbs up :rofl:

[Hrolf Kraki]

LOL :D Please don't allow your mind to be seduced by images that ALL muslims are suicide bombers. As much as I hold Islam in disdain (same goes for Christianity and Judaism), I know that most Muslims (like Christians) are quite happy to get on with their lives without thinking of bombing the US ;)

Re-read my post. You bolded it. I didn't say terrorist; I said extremist. I suggest reading Ayaan Hirsi Ali's Infidel. She tells all about growing up in the Muslim world. Disgusting.

[Hrolf Kraki]

Albert Einstein was a fraud. His wife, Mileva Maric wrote this theory, since Einstein was very poor in math ;). Google about that, you will see. Might not be true, but might be in the end ;).

Oh give me a fucking break!! I encourage you to read a book on anything to do with theoretical physics by any author. Einstein will be mentioned. His contributions to science are invaluable.



And about Muslims way of treating women, well, don't know do you like to generalize and to think that All Muslims are acting like Talibans, but I assure you that is not the case. Muslim has the obligation to treat his wife in the best possible way. Sure, they beat their wives and might even kill them, but tell me, Christians don't do that, Jews don't do that? It has to do with person, not religion. I grew up in the family where I was seeing that on daily basis, but I never smacked or beaten my girlfriend.

This is such a horse shit and you know that. Billion of Muslims are extremists?! :lol:

Why don't you read some books by people who have actually LIVED in the Muslim world? They don't paint such a pretty picture. Forced marriages and so forth. Shit, just look at their age of consent for sex. It's like 8 years old.

[Treffie]

Re-read my post. You bolded it. I didn't say terrorist; I said extremist. I suggest reading Ayaan Hirsi Ali's Infidel. She tells all about growing up in the Muslim world. Disgusting.

She also stated that the majority of Muslims are moderate.

[Hrolf Kraki]

She also stated that the majority of Muslims are moderate.

In the Middle East? Or in Europe/America? The ones I've met here in America seemed at least moderate to me, but I'm referring to the Middle East.

[Treffie]

In the Middle East? Or in Europe/America? The ones I've met here in America seemed at least moderate to me, but I'm referring to the Middle East.

She's obviously referring to her homeland - Somalia. I do agree with her though, that Islam justifies killing/murder.

[Hrolf Kraki]

She's obviously referring to her homeland - Somalia. I do agree with her though, that Islam justifies killing/murder.

Well she talks about her dad and how although he's still somewhat of a nut, he was much more moderate than some of the other Somalians. Either way, the atrocities committed upon not only Muslim men and women, but also to small children is beyond deplorable. It's blatantly obvious that they're stuck in the dark ages...


Don't get me wrong though; they have potential. I've read their histories. They've made some great accomplishments. But these days all they do is fawn over their precious religion. :rolleyes:

[Radojica]

Oh give me a fucking break!! I encourage you to read a book on anything to do with theoretical physics by any author. Einstein will be mentioned. His contributions to science are invaluable.

And just because he is mention he is someone who should not be doubt :D?

I don't doubt in Einstein, on contrary, I find him quite intrigue and great person, but you chose wrong person for comparing.



At the age of twenty-one Mileva entered the Swiss Federal Polytechnic in 1896, the same year as Einstein, who was three-and-a-half years younger than Mileva. She was, in that year, the only woman beginning studies in the mathematical section of the School for Mathematics and Science teachers.
While married to Mileva Maric at the age of 26, Einstein published in 1905 three fundamental contributions to three different areas of physics, a unique event in the history of science. In 1921, Einstein received the Nobel Prize for those contributions.
Mileva entered Einstein's life in a crucial period of his scientific achievements and helped him in his endeavor. Einstein's marriage to Mileva was an intellectual partnership. Einstein admired Mileva's calm independence and intellectual ambitions. He consider himself lucky to have founded Mileva, "a creature who is my equal and who is strong and independent as I am" said Einstein.
Einstein continues to discuss the topics of his scientific interest with Mileva and with his friends Michele Besso and Marcel Grossman.
While working on the subject of electrodynamics of moving bodies, Einstein wrote to Mileva about "our work on relative motion".
Einstein was reading together with Mileva, the classic works of Boltzmann, Drude, Helmholtz, Herz, Kirchkoff and Osward. This reading had an important role on his education.
Einstein and Mileva shared common interested in physics and science.
Mileva spend her winter semester 1897-1898 in Heidelberg, Germany. In her letter to Einstein written from Heidelberg, Mileva expressed her fascination with a lecture of the German physicist Phillip Lenard about the relationship between the velocity of molecules and the distance traversed by it between collisions, a topic relevant in Einstein's studies of Brownian motion.
Mileva contributions to the Einstein success story will be further elicitated in important volumes of the "Collected Papers of Albert Einstein".
"The Love Letters, Albert Einstein and Mileva Maric" shed a light on this great woman Mileva Maric and her contributions to the success in the life and scientific achievements of one of the greatest men in history - Albert Einstein.

http://www.teslasociety.com/Mileva.htm

(http://www.teslasociety.com/Mileva.htm)



Why don't you read some books by people who have actually LIVED in the Muslim world? They don't paint such a pretty picture. Forced marriages and so forth. Shit, just look at their age of consent for sex. It's like 8 years old.

Why don't you read something about Serbia and the rest of the Balkans? You might even find out that Serbs and Muslims are living in this region a couple of centuries than the existence of USA.

You have forced marriages in all parts of the world still, even in Europe, that is not solely Muslim heritage.
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[Hrolf Kraki]

Everyone ethnicity has famous people. Show me the list of Muslim Noble laureates.

[Aramis]

Is Aziz Ansari muslim? He is awesome anyway.

http://2xnice.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/shag_008.jpg

[anonymaus]

Is Aziz Ansari muslim? He is awesome anyway.

http://2xnice.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/shag_008.jpg

RAAAAAAAANDY.

With EIGHT As.

[MandM]

i dont support jews or muslims, but i have 2 agree with Hrolf Kraki, the arabs arent more nobel, then the jews, i dont know what cave u have been hidding in Radojica, but the arabs behave like wild animals, i dint say that there isint some who are good, but must off them, they dont whant to integrate into society, the what all there laws to be in the west, there women view, do i even have to comment on that, most off them live on the tax payers, the steal they rape, and the cant blame on society, becouse here in sweden they have all the chanses in the world to get a jobb and be a good cityzen,

[Boudica]

Lol, I'm not religious. But isn't Israel referred to as 'the promise land', in Christianity?

[Hurrem sultana]

i dont support jews or muslims, but i have 2 agree with Hrolf Kraki, the arabs arent more nobel, then the jews, i dont know what cave u have been hidding in Radojica, but the arabs behave like wild animals, i dint say that there isint some who are good, but must off them, they dont whant to integrate into society, the what all there laws to be in the west, there women view, do i even have to comment on that, most off them live on the tax payers, the steal they rape, and the cant blame on society, becouse here in sweden they have all the chanses in the world to get a jobb and be a good cityzen,

that has nothing to do with islam,christian arabs are not better.

I dont like the arabs either and i am a muslim

[Hurrem sultana]

first of all,islam is like christianty,,,a religion of many different nations,,there are asians,africans,europeans..all kinds of different cultures in islam.Judaism is also a nationalty

So you can not compare muslims=jews.

[MandM]

my opinion was just on the arabs not muslims as a hole groupe

[ikki]

Lol, I'm not religious. But isn't Israel referred to as 'the promise land', in Christianity?

That would be The Kingdom of Jerusalem.
israel is just jews, a pest along with muslims that must be fumigated before it can be the holy kingdom of christianity.

[Stars Down To Earth]

that has nothing to do with islam,christian arabs are not better.
Well, Christian Arabs tend to be marginally better than their Muslim kin sometimes, though not by much.

But yes, you're right in broad strokes - Arabs are not savage because they're Muslims; they are Muslim because they are savages.

[Joe McCarthy]

Christians have no reason to support Israel.

[Argyll]

It doesn't really make sense to me. All of the major Abrahamic religions are fighting over it, claiming that it is theirs. From what I understand from history, Jews were the ones who founded that city/country.

In speaking of the christian religion of itself, they should. In the christian religion, one is supposed to love unconditionaly, so yes, the more or less have to support it out of christians being 'good willed'.

[Kataphraktoi]

No they shouldn't, the rule of the House of David passed to Christ, and the Talmudic Jews of today are not the successors of the Covenant. Christian Zionists are dual covenant heretics.

[Osweo]

Maybe they should consider it when the Israelis start supporting THEM? :lightbul:

[Derelict]

I say they should, just because I bloody hate islam.

[Monolith]

that has nothing to do with islam,christian arabs are not better.

Christian Lebanese, for example, are quite different from their Muslim countrymen.

[Odoacer]

There is no theological reason for Christians to support Israel over any other nation-state in the world; there is no theological reason for Christians to give any special support to Jews over any other of the peoples of the world.


Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed. (Romans 9:6-8)

[Arrow Cross]

Did Israelites support Christ?

[Mordid]

Muslims send rockets to Israel's Land and kill innocent people for no specific reason.

This land belongs to Israel and the great Jews who live there.

Muslims can go to their Arab countries where they belong.

[derange]

It would have been good if the soviet union had have encompassed Israel. Then perhaps they would have leveled holy mounts and places and wiped all trace of these problems from the world.:D