Origin of Brachycephaly

[Hamlet]

Virtually all early hominid skulls dug up are dolichocephalic. Both the Neanderthal and Cro-Magnon skulls are dolichocephalic - the main two contributors to the European race. How did brachycephaly come about? There is a correlation, between the cephalic index of a race and that race's IQ (the higher the cephalic index, the higher the IQ) - here's how. Brachycephalic skulls have a greater cranial capacity (1520cc) compared to mesocephalic (1475cc) and dolichocephalic skulls (1403 cc), and this in turn correlations strongly with brain size (1181 cc, 1144 cc and 1135cc respectively). This in turn correlates with IQ, as you can see from the graph below (for general races).

My question - as brachycephalic humans are, on the whole, as established, smarter, would it be fair to say that, as early hominids were almost exclusively dolichocephalic, what makes us humans smarter is that the more brachycephalic early hominids were smarter, and thus, according to the general rule of natural selection, survived, and reproduced (and then the brain size would have shrunken, as it has in the last several millenia (for some reason)).

https://stuffliberalshate.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/iq-cranial-capacity.png

Here are probably the most heralded German philosophers in history - all of whom are brachycephalic.

http://s21.postimg.org/sro7ksx2v/skull.jpg

EDIT: I understand Europe lacked brachycephaly until, relatively speaking, very recently, however the point still stands - where did brachycephaly come from, and why?

[Not a Cop]

Western H-G, aka Cromagnids had much bigger cranial capacity than modern humans yet were dolichocephalic.

[Hamlet]

Western H-G, aka Cromagnids had much bigger cranial capacity than modern humans yet were dolichocephalic.

Agreed, but that does not contradict my point. When they become more brachycephalic, their cranial capacity would have increased. However, as you correctly point out, modern humans have a far lesser cranial capacity. That is why I mentioned how "the brain size would [then] have shrunken, as it has in the last several millenia (for some reason)." Our brains are shrinking even to this day, and there are various theories, but, genetically speaking, nobody really knows why.

[Not a Cop]

Agreed, but that does not contradict my point. When they become more brachycephalic, their cranial capacity would have increased.

Not really, for example if brachycephalisation would've been caused by decrease of head length, CC would've decreased, if by increase of width CC would've increased.

[Hamlet]

Not really, for example if brachycephalisation would've been caused by decrease of head length, CC would've decreased, if by increase of width CC would've increased.

Both would have occurred, but, "given a cavity of oval or elliptical form with elastic walls, the more its contents are increased the greater will be the tendency to assume a spherical shape."

[Hamlet]

I suppose it may be an oversimplification, but brachycephalic humans have a wider but shorter skull (and brain), so, looking at the image below, those with brachycephaly would have larger frontal lobes, however they would also have shorter occipital lobes. This means that whilst the decrease in size of the occipital lobe would result in a lesser spatial intelligence, the increase in size of the frontal lobe would result in a greater verbal intelligence (I am aware of the many exceptions to this rule, such as the fact that Mongoloids have a smaller occipital lobe, yet have a greater spatial intelligence, but, in general, the rule applies).

http://www.midbrainpower.in/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/neuroanatomy_large.jpg

[Linebacker]

Brachycephaly is progressive,it didn't originate,it evolved.

Cro-Magnon men evolved at some point(probably during Mesolithic) to have broader heads with less length.

[rojos94]

http://www.ancestraljourneys.org/images/headshape.jpg

[Stimpy]

Brachycephaly is progressive,it didn't originate,it evolved.

Cro-Magnon men evolved at some point(probably during Mesolithic) to have broader heads with less length.

What's progressive or not is kind of vague. Almost all ancient human remains found were dolichocephalic but then again many apes are brachycephalic.

I think large amounts of brachycephaly came to Europe with near-eastern migrations. Skull shape has always varied a bit though.

[rojos94]

...

[Anthony PV]

I think the shape of your skull is linked to the shape of your body: leptomorphic (tall and lanky) humans have dolichocephalic skulls while endomorphic (broad and stocky) humans have brachycephalic skulls; the same way a stocky bulldog has a brachycephalic skull while a lanky greyhound has a dolichocephalic skull. According to Richard D Fuerle from 'Erectus Walks Amongst Us', both the shape of your skull and your body seem to be influenced by the weather in which your ancestors lived... ↓
The long, narrow skull [...] (dolichocephalic) loses heat the fastest and the more spherical skull [...] (brachycephalic) better retains heat.

I don't think Neanderthal and Cro-Magnon men were reputed to have dolichocephalic skulls... Maybe some of them had this type of skull but since these two hominids were forced to live in cold Ice-Age Europe, my guess is they were probably brachycephalic. What differentiates them is how they got this type of skull.

It is funny that you think brachycephalic people had bigger brains than dolichocephalic people... Because the early racial theorists seemed to have thought the opposite... According to them, the Nordic and the Mediterranean races who produce the best scientists, the best political leaders and the best artists are both dolichocephalic while the brachycephalic Alpine race produces nothing more than 'brainless peasants'... :p


Anthropological historiosophy derives from Joseph Arthur [comte de] Gobineau (1816-1882) who, in his most important work « Essai sur l'inégalité des races humaines » (1853-55) invented the theory of the hierarchy of races. Civilisation is condemned to decline if races mix. If the highest race, that of long-headed blondes, had been settled at one of the poles, the centre of civilisation would have been there. Vacher de Lapouge went even further, asserting that France declined because the short-headed had seized power there. In order to preserve a high level of civilisation, it would not be a bad thing to exterminate "lower" races. Gobineau even considered a caste system desirable.


[Feliks Koneczny, On the plurality of Civilizations, 1931]

[Amud]

Actually, Neanderthals had an average cephalic index of around 80. Overall, as a population they could be considered borderline between mesocephalic and brachycephalic, with some of them being brachycephelic. They also had a larger cranial volume than modern humans.

The Old Man of Cro-Magnon (which is actually a completely unique skull that looks nothing like other Paleolithic Europeans) was dolichocephalic but still had a larger cranial volume than modern humans.

[Not a Cop]

I think the shape of your skull is linked to the shape of your body: leptomorphic (tall and lanky) humans have dolichocephalic skulls while endomorphic (broad and stocky) humans have brachycephalic skulls; the same way a stocky bulldog has a brachycephalic skull while a lanky greyhound has a dolichocephalic skull. According to Richard D Fuerle from 'Erectus Walks Amongst Us', both the shape of your skull and your body seem to be influenced by the weather in which your ancestors lived... ↓

There is not much of connection- Paleolithic euros were dolichocephalic and had very strong body build, while dinaroids you can currently find on Balkans are brachycephalic and rather leptomorphic.

[Anthony PV]

There is not much of connection- Paleolithic euros were dolichocephalic and had very strong body build, while dinaroids you can currently find on Balkans are brachycephalic and rather leptomorphic.

I don't know who are the Paleolithic euros you're talking about... According to Carleton S Coon, Dinarics are the result of a mix of the 'Mediterranean' and 'Alpine' races while according to Jan Czekanowski, they are the result of a mix of the 'Nordic' and 'Armenoid' races... I guess they inherited the lanky build of the first and round skull of the second... It just shows that multiple factors influence who you are because the various ancestors who compose your genealogic tree evolved differently from one another... According to Hans Friedrich Karl Gunther, Dinarics are good warriors... and good musicians! :p

[Linebacker]

What's progressive or not is kind of vague. Almost all ancient human remains found were dolichocephalic but then again many apes are brachycephalic.

I think large amounts of brachycephaly came to Europe with near-eastern migrations. Skull shape has always varied a bit though.

Im willing to go with Anthony's point that skull shape goes along with the body bones setup.

Tall and skinny/lanky people who are vertical growers will have thinner and longer skulls.Broad people with less height who are horizontal growers with a meaty built will have Brachycephalic heads.

I actually haven't seen a strongman competitor or generally big stocky guy with a long and narrow head,even though some of them can be pretty tall as well.All of them are brachy.

[Hamlet]

Actually, Neanderthals had an average cephalic index of around 80. Overall, as a population they could be considered borderline between mesocephalic and brachycephalic, with some of them being brachycephelic. They also had a larger cranial volume than modern humans.

The Old Man of Cro-Magnon (which is actually a completely unique skull that looks nothing like other Paleolithic Europeans) was dolichocephalic but still had a larger cranial volume than modern humans.

I may be wrong, but I'm pretty confident the Neanderthal cephalic index ranges from 70-75, making them dolichocehphalic.

For your second point: Agreed, but that does not contradict my point. When they (Cromagnids) become more brachycephalic, their cranial capacity would have increased. However, as you correctly point out, modern humans have a far lesser cranial capacity. That is why I mentioned how "the brain size would [then] have shrunken, as it has in the last several millenia (for some reason)." Our brains are shrinking even to this day, and there are various theories, but, genetically speaking, nobody really knows why.

[Hamlet]

Brachycephaly is progressive,it didn't originate,it evolved.

Cro-Magnon men evolved at some point(probably during Mesolithic) to have broader heads with less length.

Exactly my point - did they slowly adopt brachycephaly as the smarter men prospered and reproduced more?

[Linebacker]

Exactly my point - did they slowly adopt brachycephaly as the smarter men prospered and reproduced more?

No I think it was more of a climate adaptation thing.See,Cro-Magnon men originated in Africa.Thats where they got their originally dolichocephalic crania.We can see that even today most of root Africans(Negroids) are very well dolichocephalic.

SO what happened is these Cro-Magnons who came to Europe met face to face with a cold icy climate that was completely opposite to the one they originated from.So thats where they started to evolve.Slowly,it didn't happen overnight,but apart from other features made to resist cold temperatures they also started to move towards shorter and broader heads - To Mesocephaly,and then after thousands of years - Brachycephaly.

We have fossils that can back this theory,like the Oberkassel man from Germany,who is around 14,000 years old(Late Mesolithic) and is high Mesocephalic by index approaching Brachycephaly. http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=3409&stc=1&d=1261058396

Complete Brachycephal form probably was acheived in the Baltic area,since Baltids today are some of the most CM people and they are predominantly Brachycephalic.Other phenotypes with Cro-Magnon roots are also Brachycephalic as default,like Borreby,Alpinids,Uralic types and some others.

[Hamlet]

No I think it was more of a climate adaptation thing.See,Cro-Magnon men originated in Africa.Thats where they got their originally dolichocephalic crania.We can see that even today most of root Africans(Negroids) are very well dolichocephalic.

SO what happened is these Cro-Magnons who came to Europe met face to face with a cold icy climate that was completely opposite to the one they originated from.So thats where they started to evolve.Slowly,it didn't happen overnight,but apart from other features made to resist cold temperatures they also started to move towards shorter and broader heads - To Mesocephaly,and then after thousands of years - Brachycephaly.

We have fossils that can back this theory,like the Oberkassel man from Germany,who is around 14,000 years old(Late Mesolithic) and is high Mesocephalic by index approaching Brachycephaly. http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=3409&stc=1&d=1261058396

Complete Brachycephal form probably was acheived in the Baltic area,since Baltids today are some of the most CM people and they are predominantly Brachycephalic.Other phenotypes with Cro-Magnon roots are also Brachycephalic as default,like Borreby,Alpinids,Uralic types and some others.

Ah, very convincing :clap2:. I would go further to say that as a result of this shift to brachycephaly, Europeans gained a higher IQ. This would also explain why Mongoloids have the highest IQ, as they likely originated slightly north of the Himalayas - obviously a very cold region, and far colder than in even the northernmost regions of Scandinavia.

http://www.globalwarmingart.com/images/a/aa/Annual_Average_Temperature_Map.jpg

[Hamlet]

I think the shape of your skull is linked to the shape of your body: leptomorphic (tall and lanky) humans have dolichocephalic skulls while endomorphic (broad and stocky) humans have brachycephalic skulls; the same way a stocky bulldog has a brachycephalic skull while a lanky greyhound has a dolichocephalic skull. According to Richard D Fuerle from 'Erectus Walks Amongst Us', both the shape of your skull and your body seem to be influenced by the weather in which your ancestors lived... ↓

I don't think Neanderthal and Cro-Magnon men were reputed to have dolichocephalic skulls... Maybe some of them had this type of skull but since these two hominids were forced to live in cold Ice-Age Europe, my guess is they were probably brachycephalic. What differentiates them is how they got this type of skull.

It is funny that you think brachycephalic people had bigger brains than dolichocephalic people... Because the early racial theorists seemed to have thought the opposite... According to them, the Nordic and the Mediterranean races who produce the best scientists, the best political leaders and the best artists are both dolichocephalic while the brachycephalic Alpine race produces nothing more than 'brainless peasants'... :p

The great minds of recent times have been mainly sub-brachycephalic/brachycephalic, so I am inclined to disagree. To quote the wonderful 'BookGremlin' from his post on forumbiodiversity.com:

"One can imagine the shock an intelligent German reader suffered when he remembered that many of the great German heroes from Bismarck down to Hindenburg and Hitler were brachycephalics and even hyperbrachycephalics, and that the three greatest philosophers Germany has produced-Leibniz, Kant, and Schopenhauer-had round heads in the most extreme form (Leibniz, skull index 90.3[!]; Kant, skull index 88.5; Schopenhauer, head index 90.0 [!]). Something had to be done about this rift between bare anthropological facts and the demands of the racial theory as preached and popularized by people like Ammon, Rose, Gunther, Fischer, Lenz, and others." (Weidenreich, 1945)

http://s21.postimg.org/sro7ksx2v/skull.jpg

Exactly where did the idea Nordics have long-skulls even come from? That should be addressed before getting into link between cephalic index and intelligence. No Europeans have mean dolichocephalic indices:

http://s8.postimg.org/qgu0pdpzp/555.jpg

Note 2 figures are added when measuring the living head (cephalic index) compared to skull.

Dolichocephaly is therefore < 77.

The lowest (rounded) European mean cephalic index is 77, found for example among the Portugese. So by mean CI, no European population is dolichocephalic. The most long skulled are still borderline mesocephaly."

[Drawing-slim]

Whatever Goethe was that should be the peak of progressiveness, and I don't think he was brachycephalic.

[Hamlet]

Whatever Goethe was that should be the peak of progressiveness, and I don't think he was brachycephalic.

One example does not contradict my point.

[Herr Abubu]

Whatever Goethe was that should be the peak of progressiveness, and I don't think he was brachycephalic.

Actually, Goethe was also brachycephalic and described as being of Dinaric racial type by "race scientists."

[Hamlet]

Actually, Goethe was also brachycephalic and described as being of Dinaric racial type by "race scientists."

There we go - brachycephaly>dolichocephaly. Add Einstein to the list too, why not? von Neumann too, etcetera etcetera.

[Proto-Shaman]

http://www.theapricity.com/snpa/bilder/guntherciworld.jpg

[Hamlet]

http://www.theapricity.com/snpa/bilder/guntherciworld.jpg

Yes?

[Roy]

Western H-G, aka Cromagnids had much bigger cranial capacity than modern humans yet were dolichocephalic.

Our brains/heads are getting progressively smaller since 10000 BP (the ending of the Last Glacial Period) yet we are arguably smarter than our ancestors. Brain capacity should not be taken as the most important determinant of intelligence or anything else.

[Hamlet]

Our brains/heads are getting progressively smaller since 10000 BP (the ending of the Last Glacial Period) yet we are arguably smarter than our ancestors. Brain capacity should not be taken as the most important determinant of intelligence or anything else.

Yes, but there is certainly a correlation between brain size and IQ (see chart on the thread-starting post). I still think this theory is very convincing (dolichocephaly->brachycephaly due to cold, and as a bi-product IQ increases). Makes sense too, Mongoloids experienced more cold, thus higher CI, thus higher IQ (and all of these premises are without a doubt correct).

[Proto-Shaman]

Yes?
I was just trying to figure out a common connection between the black shadowed regions in this map.

[Hamlet]

I was just trying to figure out a common connection between the black shadowed regions in this map.

This is only for general races, may I add. The correlation isn't that strong that it would work for sub-races - once one goes down to such a level, other factors take place (such as the fact that natural selection favoured the intelligent in Western Europe to a greater extent than in South-Eastern Europe).

[Hamlet]

I was just trying to figure out a common connection between the black shadowed regions in this map.

This is only for general races, may I add. The correlation isn't that strong that it would work for sub-races - once one goes down to such a level, other factors take place (such as the fact that natural selection favoured the intelligent in Western Europe to a greater extent than in South-Eastern Europe).

[Stimpy]

Im willing to go with Anthony's point that skull shape goes along with the body bones setup.

Tall and skinny/lanky people who are vertical growers will have thinner and longer skulls.Broad people with less height who are horizontal growers with a meaty built will have Brachycephalic heads.

I actually haven't seen a strongman competitor or generally big stocky guy with a long and narrow head,even though some of them can be pretty tall as well.All of them are brachy.

I think that has more to with that the best and strongest strongmen have such extreme amounts of muscle mass in the neck and upper back, usually carry alot of fat etc. that you can't really see their skull under all the soft tissue. Steroid use also causes soft tissue/muscle to grow in the face/jaw etc.

Actually a dolichocephalic skullshape is probably the most typically ''masculine''. More men than women are dolichocephalic. A large amount of growth hormone and testosterone in the womb/early life often creates a (large and rugged) dolichocephalic skullshape. Extremely dolichocephalic women are often considered horse faced/masculine.
Of course there are other factors as well though, you can have a high/low testosterone face wether you're dolichocephalic or brachycephalic.

East-Asians are probably some of the most brachycephalic people there is and they're stereotyped as not being very naturally strong.

[Hamlet]

I think that has more to with that the best and strongest strongmen have such extreme amounts of muscle mass in the neck and upper back, usually carry alot of fat etc. that you can't really see their skull under all the soft tissue. Steroid use also causes soft tissue/muscle to grow in the face/jaw etc.

Actually a dolichocephalic skullshape is probably the most typically ''masculine''. More men than women are dolichocephalic. A large amount of growth hormone and testosterone in the womb/early life often creates a (large and rugged) dolichocephalic skullshape. Extremely dolichocephalic women are often considered horse faced/masculine.
Of course there are other factors as well though, you can have a high/low testosterone face wether you're dolichocephalic or brachycephalic.

East-Asians are probably some of the most brachycephalic people there is and they're stereotyped as not being very naturally strong.

I don't think this is why - the theory that we shifted to brachycephaly due to the cold climate (brachycephalic heads lose heat more slowly) is far more convincing.

[Übermensch]

We have to remeber that neanderthals and mesolithics had larger brains and heads, for istance Neanderthals had (without texture) an head lenght of 212 mm and an head breadht of 158 mm, huge measuraments on averege an a cranial capacity ranging from 1,500 to 1800 cc.
Cromagnons had even larger brains with a mean head lenght of 198 mm (without texture) a breadht o 142,2 mm and an height of 135,8 mm, with texture the measuraments should be around 203 mm for the lenght, 153 mm for the breadht and 140 mm for the height, so they had huge head.
Propably brachicephalization is an adaptation due to neanderthal admixture (increase in head size) and the gradual arrival of neolithic farmers.
Neolithic farmers though had a thin dolicocephalic skull, a Borreby or a Faelid would be likely brachi-mesocephalic but very large headed (averege borreby 165 mmx201 mm averege faelid 165 mmx215 mm).

[Stimpy]

I don't think this is why - the theory that we shifted to brachycephaly due to the cold climate (brachycephalic heads lose heat more slowly) is far more convincing.

Very unlikely.
There's actually no huge quickly occuring life/death selection against cold climate - you just put on more clothes.
And that brachycephaly would occur so quickly and recently because of that - no way. Brachycephaly/dolichocephaly doesn't even affect that amount heat loss in any way, your overall size does, and even that isn't the most important factor.

Like you first stated - most ancient hominids were dolichocephalic - Neanderthals who lived in Europe for 300,000+ years were too. Why would Brachycephaly be selected for so recently? It seems to correlate slightly with agriculture and settlement if anything.

It's actually the opposite in many places.


Dolichocephalic ''cold adapted'' Northern Amerindian.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-m63r4XlOgo4/TwcJjAd2T0I/AAAAAAAAByo/zZlH6xuD3ds/s1600/Chief+Wolf+Robe.jpg


Brachycephalic ''heat adapted'' Southern Amerindian.¨
http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/zz138/yoyochickenkfc/purelookingamerindianfrombrazilyanomami_zpse0c8623 f.jpg

[Hamlet]

Very unlikely.
There's actually no huge quickly occuring life/death selection against cold climate - you just put on more clothes.
And that brachycephaly would occur so quickly and recently because of that - no way. Brachycephaly/dolichocephaly doesn't even affect that amount heat loss in any way, your overall size does, and even that isn't the most important factor.

Like you first stated - all ancient hominids were dolichocephalic - Neanderthals who lived in Europe for 300,000+ years were too. Why would Brachycephaly be selected for so recently? It seems to correlate slightly with agriculture and settlement if anything.

It's actually the opposite in many places.


Dolichocephalic ''cold adapted'' Northern Amerindian.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-m63r4XlOgo4/TwcJjAd2T0I/AAAAAAAAByo/zZlH6xuD3ds/s1600/Chief+Wolf+Robe.jpg


Brachycephalic ''heat adapted'' Southern Amerindian.¨
http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/zz138/yoyochickenkfc/purelookingamerindianfrombrazilyanomami_zpse0c8623 f.jpg

According to Wikipedia:


Kenneth L. Beals of the Department of Anthropology at Oregon State University said that the indigenous people of the Americas have cephalic indexes that are an exception to Allen's rule, since the indigenous people of the hot climates of North and South America have cold-adapted, high cephalic indexes. Beals said that these peoples have not yet evolved the appropriate cephalic index for their climate, being, comparatively, only recently descended from the cold-adapted Arctic Mongoloid.

[Linebacker]

I think that has more to with that the best and strongest strongmen have such extreme amounts of muscle mass in the neck and upper back, usually carry alot of fat etc. that you can't really see their skull under all the soft tissue. Steroid use also causes soft tissue/muscle to grow in the face/jaw etc.

Actually a dolichocephalic skullshape is probably the most typically ''masculine''. More men than women are dolichocephalic. A large amount of growth hormone and testosterone in the womb/early life often creates a (large and rugged) dolichocephalic skullshape. Extremely dolichocephalic women are often considered horse faced/masculine.
Of course there are other factors as well though, you can have a high/low testosterone face wether you're dolichocephalic or brachycephalic.

East-Asians are probably some of the most brachycephalic people there is and they're stereotyped as not being very naturally strong.

I would drop that very quickly.Even I have a good amount of flesh on my neck and it contributes to my more flat appearance.Yet I still score a Brch CI(15,7cm head breadth,19cm lenght)

Strongmen(and stocky guys in general) have an incredible head breadth,like some examples I will post below,who looks at least 17cm in skull breadth.When your head is that broad,there is little chance you would score anything but brachycephalic,unless your head is also a foot long.

https://www.lietuva.lt/uploads/news/images/342_2d6b02314d87948228aa05d5d9328963.jpg
http://captainjacked.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/IMG_4274.jpg
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-IIpfTv-MH8Y/AAAAAAAAAAI/AAAAAAAAACA/YSipqNPbq5I/photo.jpg
http://leanhybridmuscle.com/access/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/MariuszPudzianowski.jpg

[Stimpy]

I would drop that very quickly.Even I have a good amount of flesh on my neck and it contributes to my more flat appearance.Yet I still score a Brch CI(15,7cm head breadth,19cm lenght)

Strongmen(and stocky guys in general) have an incredible head breadth,like some examples I will post below,who looks at least 17cm in skull breadth.When your head is that broad,there is little chance you would score anything but brachycephalic,unless your head is also a foot long.


Of course there's many brachycephalic strongmen, probably even the majority. The reasons I stated just apply to a few ones. Hafthor Björnsson, whom you posted f.ex.

Here he is before his strongman career really started, at age 20. Looks dolichocephalic to me.
http://i.imgur.com/JUqz8jD.jpg

Here, next to some more ''normal'' people to compare skull shape.
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/f0/88/eb/f088eb9cb66b59fd38565e01435b6522.jpg

[Not a Cop]

According to Wikipedia:

Ok, so if brachycephalicy is connected to cold adaptation why then most brachycephalic europoids are balkanites, central euros, anatolians and caucasians, while north euros range within mesocephalicy?

[Cleitus]

What's progressive or not is kind of vague. Almost all ancient human remains found were dolichocephalic but then again many apes are brachycephalic.

I think large amounts of brachycephaly came to Europe with near-eastern migrations. Skull shape has always varied a bit though.

There are no Brachycephalic apes, all apes are doliocephalic.

[Cleitus]

Very unlikely.
There's actually no huge quickly occuring life/death selection against cold climate - you just put on more clothes.
And that brachycephaly would occur so quickly and recently because of that - no way. Brachycephaly/dolichocephaly doesn't even affect that amount heat loss in any way, your overall size does, and even that isn't the most important factor.

Like you first stated - most ancient hominids were dolichocephalic - Neanderthals who lived in Europe for 300,000+ years were too. Why would Brachycephaly be selected for so recently? It seems to correlate slightly with agriculture and settlement if anything.

It's actually the opposite in many places.


Dolichocephalic ''cold adapted'' Northern Amerindian.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-m63r4XlOgo4/TwcJjAd2T0I/AAAAAAAAByo/zZlH6xuD3ds/s1600/Chief+Wolf+Robe.jpg


Brachycephalic ''heat adapted'' Southern Amerindian.¨
http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/zz138/yoyochickenkfc/purelookingamerindianfrombrazilyanomami_zpse0c8623 f.jpg
They cant be compared to Brachycephalic Europeans, also they have much smaller heads regardless of the fact that they are considered brachycephalic.

[Hamlet]

Ok, so if brachycephalicy is connected to cold adaptation why then most brachycephalic europoids are balkanites, central euros, anatolians and caucasians, while north euros range within mesocephalicy?

1) I claimed this applied to the general races
2) Even so, this can be attributed to more Alpine admixture, and the Alpines are more Mongoloid (think Hunnic invasions into Europe - the Huns absorbed many Mongols into their community).

[Hamlet]

Very unlikely.
There's actually no huge quickly occuring life/death selection against cold climate - you just put on more clothes.
And that brachycephaly would occur so quickly and recently because of that - no way. Brachycephaly/dolichocephaly doesn't even affect that amount heat loss in any way, your overall size does, and even that isn't the most important factor.

Like you first stated - most ancient hominids were dolichocephalic - Neanderthals who lived in Europe for 300,000+ years were too. Why would Brachycephaly be selected for so recently? It seems to correlate slightly with agriculture and settlement if anything.

It's actually the opposite in many places.


Dolichocephalic ''cold adapted'' Northern Amerindian.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-m63r4XlOgo4/TwcJjAd2T0I/AAAAAAAAByo/zZlH6xuD3ds/s1600/Chief+Wolf+Robe.jpg


Brachycephalic ''heat adapted'' Southern Amerindian.¨
http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/zz138/yoyochickenkfc/purelookingamerindianfrombrazilyanomami_zpse0c8623 f.jpg

Also, Amerindian migrations are far more recent

[Cleitus]

1) I claimed this applied to the general races
2) Even so, this can be attributed to more Alpine admixture, and the Alpines are more Mongoloid (think Hunnic invasions into Europe - the Huns absorbed many Mongols into their community).

Alpinids are much older.

[Hamlet]

Alpinids are much older.

What do you mean by that?

EDIT: I now understand.

[Hamlet]

Alpinids are much older.

Any figures about that claim?

[Not a Cop]

1) I claimed this applied to the general races
2) Even so, this can be attributed to more Alpine admixture, and the Alpines are more Mongoloid (think Hunnic invasions into Europe - the Huns absorbed many Mongols into their community).

1) Could you explain a bit futher?

2)East Eurasian genetical influence in central europe does not exceed 1%.

[Hamlet]

1) Could you explain a bit futher?

2)East Eurasian genetical influence in central europe does not exceed 1%.

1) Well, the theory doesn't apply itself well for sub-races - don't want to be pedantic.

2) Bullshit - the Hunnic migrations (and some Near Eastern migrations, although these are grossly exaggerated) were the main instigators of brachycephaly in Europe, and the Huns are originally from Eastern Central Asia and Western East Asia - basically what is now Mongolia (hence the brachycephaly):

http://s155239215.onlinehome.us/turkic/29Huns/MErdyHunAnabasisBokovenko1993.jpg

[DarknessWin]

Im willing to go with Anthony's point that skull shape goes along with the body bones setup.

Tall and skinny/lanky people who are vertical growers will have thinner and longer skulls.Broad people with less height who are horizontal growers with a meaty built will have Brachycephalic heads.

I actually haven't seen a strongman competitor or generally big stocky guy with a long and narrow head,even though some of them can be pretty tall as well.All of them are brachy.


So the dolicochephalic Arnold Schwarzenegger and Dolph Lundgren are not well build , they must be skinny weak ...
Also Albanians who are the most bracychephalic people in europe must be the smarter and the most well build :picard2:

Lets destroy your crap once more, Albanians have the lowest IQ in european union and also they are leptomorphic as hell.

You are really full of crap

[Linebacker]

So the dolicochephalic Arnold Schwarzenegger and Dolph Lundgren are not well build , they must be skinny weak ...
Also Albanians who are the most bracychephalic people in europe must be the smarter and the most well build :picard2:

Lets destroy your crap once more, Albanians have the lowest IQ in european union and also they are leptomorphic as hell.

You are really full of crap

Well I'd say Albanians are much better physically than Greeks are.

Don't need to be a rocket scientist to see that.And your constant butthurt towards them consolidates it.

[Wrong]

So the dolicochephalic Arnold Schwarzenegger and Dolph Lundgren are not well build , they must be skinny weak ...
Also Albanians who are the most bracychephalic people in europe must be the smarter and the most well build :picard2:

Lets destroy your crap once more, Albanians have the lowest IQ in european union and also they are leptomorphic as hell.

You are really full of crap Arnold has a flat occiput and is therefore far from dolicho. Both he and Dolph Lundgren used TRT & steroids.

Brachycephalism in Dinaric terms has a tendency towards taller height and more robusticy.

[DarknessWin]

Well I'd say Albanians are much better physically than Greeks are.

Don't need to be a rocket scientist to see that.And your constant butthurt towards them consolidates it.

Albos and bulgarians are more leptomorphic and shorter than Greeks moron.

You tell us that the dolicochephalic Vikings and Slavs were weak and your forefather huns were strong??

Bulgarians = Huns, go back to the steppes you fucking asian bracychephalic shit

[Linebacker]

Double wrong for him,not just Arnold has a flat occuput,Dolph also has one

Very clear in his shorter hair pictures

http://sizedoesntmatter.com/wp-content/uploads/Screen-Shot-2012-07-17-at-4.56.16-PM.png

Dolph and a fully dolicho
http://cdn.moviestillsdb.com/sm/0c5951c479cec690c1e83dc1a0868d57/the-expendables-3.jpg

[Wrong]

Double wrong for him,not just Arnold has a flat occuput,Dolph also has one

Very clear in his shorter hair pictures

http://sizedoesntmatter.com/wp-content/uploads/Screen-Shot-2012-07-17-at-4.56.16-PM.png

Dolph and a fully dolicho
http://cdn.moviestillsdb.com/sm/0c5951c479cec690c1e83dc1a0868d57/the-expendables-3.jpgThe same can be said for the heavier UFC fighters. Mostly short, wide skulls among them. Brachycephalism is clearly superior, I say this despite being mostly Mesocephalic.

[Linebacker]

The same can be said for the heavier UFC fighters. Mostly short, wide skulls among them. Brachycephalism is clearly superior, I say this despite being mostly Mesocephalic.

The internet-hoplite is who you should explain that to,he seems to be in a ball of confusion.

[DarknessWin]

Arnold has a flat occiput and is therefore far from dolicho. Both he and Dolph Lundgren used TRT & steroids.

Brachycephalism in Dinaric terms has a tendency towards taller height and more robusticy.


Arnold is pure Dolicochephalic

a close photo

http://cdn.rsvlts.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/arnold-schwarzenegger-a-ete-designe-comme.jpg

Lundgren

http://www.theplace2.ru/archive/dolph_lundgren/img/44e5688913f62be8_lar.jpg

boyka

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/2d/e1/46/2de146296bf0f58402e3f377862e32f8.jpg

More Testosterone = Dolicochephalic . women way more bracychephalic in general

Ancient Slavs = Dolicochephalic

"If the evidence of literary sources makes the early Slavs Nordic in stature and pigmentation, that of ostcology makes them the same in the metrical and morphological sense. In brief, all of the earliest Slavic skeletal material, dating mostly from the eighth to the eleventh centuries, falls, by ,groups if not as individuals, into one or more of the Nordic categories already found to be characteristic of Iron Age Indo-Europeanspeaking peoples.

That from Poland, the eastern half of which was included in the home of the Slavic peoples before their period of dispersion, is not very abundant. Altogether less than 40 male crania may be assembled, and few of these have complete measurements. These skulls are all predominantly dolichocephalic; the mean cranial index is 73, and not a single round-headed example is included. Among these Polish skulls are some notably long and large specimens Nvith long. narrow faces. The noses of the ,group, as a whole, are fully leptorrhine. On the whole, the ancestral Slavs of Poland were Nordics, within the range of the Indo-European group; these skulls lean to the longer- and larger-headed Corded extreme, and resemble in many respects, the Hannover series, and by extension, the Anglo-Saxons.

The Slavs who invaded Styria between the seventh to ninth centuries are basically the same as those in Germany, and fall very close to an older Keltic mean.107 They formed, without question, a mixed group and included in their number a minority of round-headed forms. Some of the Slavic crania from Styria, recalling the Polish prototype, are extremely large and powerful. We have, unfortunately, no data with which to trace the further progress of the southern Slavs into the Dinaric mountain stronghold, and thence into Old Serbia and the Kossovo plain. We rnay, however, study a third Slavic movement, that which penetrated Russia.

The skulls of these invaders belong to a generalized Nordic form, with a cranial index of 75 to 76, and an intermediate vault height. The Ukrainian skulls from the eighth to the ninth centuries A.D. do not greatly diverge from this general standard, but the early Slavic crania from the Moscow region in Russia, dated from the eleventh to twelfth centuries A.D., are, in fact, almost purely dolichocephalic, with a mean cranial index of 73.5.

On the whole, the Slavic racial type, as exemplified by skeletal series from Poland, Germany, Bohemia, Austria, and Russia, was reasonably uniform. In view of its geographical location, the Polish group probably represents most nearly the original form, while those who expanded southward and westward absorbed local Keltic and other Indo-European-speaking populations. The Slavs, like all the other Indo-European-speaking peoples whom we have been able to trace, were originally Nordic, and there is no suggestion in their early remains, in the regions studied, of the numerically predominant brachycephalic racial increments which today are considered typically Slavic. However, the Slavs who migrated to southern Hungary, like the Germanic Gepidae before them, mixed with a local short-statured, broad-faced, and broad-nosed brachycephalic people, who, antedating the historic arrival of the Magyars, were descended from the central Asiatic Avars. Most of the Slavs retained their original dolichocephalic cranial form until at the earliest the thirteenth, and the latest the fifteenth, century. At that time, those who inhabited Russia and central Europe grew progressively brachycephalic, at a rapid but consistent rate. Well-documented series from Bohemia and the Moscow government show how this change progressed from century to century, so that normal means of 73 to 75 rose as high as 83 by the nineteenth. Few Slavs were spared this change, which was parallel to that which affected the southern Germans and other peoples of central and eastern Europe. Although it took place in the full light of late mediaeval and modern history, no one fully satisfactory explanation has vet been offered."



So the modern Slavs are mixed with Avars, bracycephalic in Europe came with Huns and Bulgars from the steppes


Nazi's about the matter :

Georges Vacher de Lapouge (1854–1936), one of the pioneers of scientific theories in this area and a theoretician of eugenics, who in L'Aryen et son role social (1899 - "The Aryan and his social role") divided humanity into various, hierarchized, different "races", spanning from the "Aryan white race, dolichocephalic", to the "brachycephalic" "mediocre and inert" race

Also Dolichocephalic skulls have larger visual cortex material - translating to increased visual IQ - the only important form of intelligence there is.

Dolichocephalic individuals are also overrepresented among ruling classes, revolutionaries and criminals - brachycephalism being a slave's condition.
See the work of Cesare Lombroso as well as page 97 of the following book:

books.google.com/books?isbn=1572300531


This thread is full of crap , the pure europeans are dolicochephalic end of the story

[Wrong]

Wrong. Male skulls have browridges, that's the thing that differs the length. Females have narrower heads on average.

Arnold has a flat occiput, frontal pictures prove nothing. He could be hyper-brachy if we didn't know his side profile.

[DarknessWin]

The same can be said for the heavier UFC fighters. Mostly short, wide skulls among them. Brachycephalism is clearly superior, I say this despite being mostly Mesocephalic.

you are wrong most of them are dolicochephalic, only brazilians and mexicans are brachy

mc gregor and luke rockhold the best champions:

https://themaclife.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/mcgregor.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/78/b4/28/78b428067febffcdf551801134b3a2fb.jpg

[Wrong]

you are wrong most of them are dolicochephalic, only brazilians and mexicans are brachy

mc gregor and luke rockhold the best champions:

https://themaclife.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/mcgregor.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/78/b4/28/78b428067febffcdf551801134b3a2fb.jpgRockhold is a middleweight and has a weak chin, plus he got knocked out by Bisping who is arguably average UFC fighter. Conor is lightweight and got slapped around by Nate Diaz who fights like a drunken man.

[Wrong]

Brachycephaly won

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/FqNE8U5RzxY/maxresdefault.jpg

[DarknessWin]

Wrong. Male skulls have browridges, that's the thing that differs the length. Females have narrower heads on average.

Arnold has a flat occiput, frontal pictures prove nothing. He could be hyper-brachy if we didn't know his side profile.

LOL, ok go kill yourslef you know nothing about anthropology.
Arnold is hyper-Dolicochephalic and not just dolicochaphalic

Also womens have rounder faces , they have narrower but also shorter head and that made most of them brachy

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-kO6XjGBL-5s/T7TE-0cc6HI/AAAAAAAACMU/KLQ3dTOH5SU/s1600/TESTOSTERONA+CLOILET+%25285%2529.png

[DarknessWin]

Brachycephaly won

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/FqNE8U5RzxY/maxresdefault.jpg

HAHAHAHAHA man you are idiot or something ??
The Aryan Dolicochephalic Stipe Miocic knocked out Nigger Brachy Alistair in first round

[DarknessWin]

Rockhold is a middleweight and has a weak chin, plus he got knocked out by Bisping who is arguably average UFC fighter. Conor is lightweight and got slapped around by Nate Diaz who fights like a drunken man.

McGregor and Rockhold are both UFC champions, woke up

[Vm95]

Depends which kind of bracycephaly ,there is no relation between the dinarid/alpin/baltid bracycephaly which is due to impairment to the head shape and the one gained through robustity..