Greece has 40 billion barrels of oil, and thousands of tons of Gold and Uranium

[poiuytrewq0987]

x8M-rJULXlo

[RoyBatty]

More evidence that politicians are puppets and in the pocket of the elites. By keeping Greece out of the market supplies will be tighter = higher profits for the big corporations. It keeps Greece financially weakened and dependent (and therefore subservient). The big corporations will of course want to exploit these resources at some point but it will be on conditions favouring them and not the Greek state.

Our countries are controlled by a self-serving criminal class. Freedom, equality and democracy are illusions.

[ikki]

greek politics, or how to keep fooling everyone all the time :D

[poiuytrewq0987]

greek politics, or how to keep fooling everyone all the time :D

The politics in Greece actually reminds me of how things are done in Russia except on a smaller scale.

[RoyBatty]

The politics in Greece actually reminds me of how things are done in Russia except on a smaller scale.

Imo things work a bit different in Russia. Imo the mentality there is perhaps more Central Asian in the sense that powerful and organised oligarchs and clans tend to have spheres of influence and power and control the country.

We all know Medvedev is a little puppet ruler with no real clout. On the other hand, Putin has clout but the reason why is because he has connections with many of the people who count. Without their backing he'd be a nobody as well.

Greece on the other to me looks more like a State which is manipulated by Greek political stooges on behalf of Western countries, banks, oligarchs and corporations.

The difference is that Russia is more independent from outside rule, exploitation and interference whilst Greece is completely under the thumb. It wasn't always the case of course. In the 1990's under Yeltsin Russia's situation was more similar to Greece's situation today.

[Absinthe]

Greece on the other to me looks more like a State which is manipulated by Greek political stooges on behalf of Western countries, banks, oligarchs and corporations.

I want that printed on a t-shirt :thumb001:

(better yet, tattooed on my butt :p)

[poiuytrewq0987]

Imo things work a bit different in Russia. Imo the mentality there is perhaps more Central Asian in the sense that powerful and organised oligarchs and clans tend to have spheres of influence and power and control the country.

We all know Medvedev is a little puppet ruler with no real clout. On the other hand, Putin has clout but the reason why is because he has connections with many of the people who count. Without their backing he'd be a nobody as well.

Greece on the other to me looks more like a State which is manipulated by Greek political stooges on behalf of Western countries, banks, oligarchs and corporations.

The difference is that Russia is more independent from outside rule, exploitation and interference whilst Greece is completely under the thumb. It wasn't always the case of course. In the 1990's under Yeltsin Russia's situation was more similar to Greece's situation today.

That is, of course until when the Greeks decide to exploit the natural resources there that will be enough to pay their debt ten times over? And possibly, propel Greece into regional power status as a result of that. Which I believe is against the wishes of NATO who, you have said before, doesn't want a major power in the Balkans.

[RoyBatty]

I want that printed on a t-shirt :thumb001:

(better yet, tattooed on my butt :p)

Call me. 555-I-TATT-YOU

[RoyBatty]

That is, of course until when the Greeks decide to exploit the natural resources there that will be enough to pay their debt ten times over? And possibly, propel Greece into regional power status as a result of that. Which I believe is against the wishes of NATO who, you have said before, doesn't want a major power in the Balkans.

There appears to be all kinds of issues at work here and one of them is the classic "chicken-and-egg" problem.

To start up a mining or drilling operation costs money and requires expertise of companies already in the game, unless you want to reinvent the wheel.

Those companies are typically large multinational corporations. They're often financed / owned by, in-debt to guess who... da banks. (and guess who controls the banks....)

It also seems like Greece's politicians are being encouraged (by you-know-who) not to start exploiting these deposits just yet. The same forces who'd be discouraging the Greek politicians would also have major influence with the Banks and the Miners. See the pattern?

So.... for Greece to "go-it-alone" they'd need Politicians who're not p@wned by the USA/EU and financial & engineering partners who're not p@wned by the usual Banks and Corporations.

Even if the Greeks managed to somehow get rid of the usual corrupt politicians their choices for partners are limited to Russia and China (perhaps?). Russia is already somewhat in the pocket of the Banking / Mining mafia but OK, they are at least still somewhat independent. Russia's mining and drilling technology is probably not the most sophisticated or efficient.

NATO (I'm specifically referring to the senior NATO partners) certainly doesn't want a powerful Greece or powerful ANYBODY (even from within their own ranks) which could potentially challenge their authority or make independent decisions.

The USA, France and UK want a bunch of "yes" countries who do as they're told. Keeping them dumbed down, making sure that their industrial / scientific capabilities are inhibited and their military capabilities are confined to mostly the donkey work and in supplying cannon fodder is what it's all about.

[poiuytrewq0987]

So.... for Greece to "go-it-alone" they'd need Politicians who're not p@wned by the USA/EU and financial & engineering partners who're not p@wned by the usual Banks and Corporations.

They need to do just that, f&ck the big corporations who'd just steal the profit from Greeks.

[The Lawspeaker]

More evidence that politicians are puppets and in the pocket of the elites. By keeping Greece out of the market supplies will be tighter = higher profits for the big corporations. It keeps Greece financially weakened and dependent (and therefore subservient). The big corporations will of course want to exploit these resources at some point but it will be on conditions favouring them and not the Greek state.

Our countries are controlled by a self-serving criminal class. Freedom, equality and democracy are illusions.

This thread deserves a BUMP. More (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33053) about Greece and natural resources.

[Rochefaton]

If you have 350-400 billion Euros worth of debt and 5-6 billion Euros worth of gold, you are still in deep trouble.

If Greece has so much oil, then why were they producing more barrels per day 20-30 years ago than they are now? Did they just get tired of extracting it? Did they decide they wanted to ruin their economy and the Eurozone just for the lulz?

http://eu22.eu/chart/primary-production-of-crude-oil/primary-production-of-crude-oil-13.png

I would be willing to bet the Greeks have more olive oil ready for consumption than crude oil. Having crude oil underground, and having it ready for distribution is two different things.

[Xyresic]

If you have 350-400 billion Euros worth of debt and 5-6 billion Euros worth of gold, you are still in deep trouble.

If Greece has so much oil, then why were they producing more barrels per day 20-30 years ago than they are now? Did they just get tired of extracting it? Did they decide they wanted to ruin their economy and the Eurozone just for the lulz?

http://eu22.eu/chart/primary-production-of-crude-oil/primary-production-of-crude-oil-13.png

I would be willing to bet the Greeks have more olive oil ready for consumption than crude oil. Having crude oil underground, and having it ready for distribution is two different things.The oil is unprovable reserves. The Aegean is mostly international waters, so Greece would have to come to an agreement with Turkey to split oil in the international waters.

Even if there is oil to the south of Crete there would be huge logistical challenges to bring the oil to the Greek mainland. There are really deep trenches to the south of Crete running along the southern Aegean islands and there are multiple fault lines there as well.

Greece is better off trying to make biodiesel out of their olive oil.

Your also forgetting that some petroleum company like BP, Shell or Texaco would probably take anywhere between 30% to 70% cut of the windfall.

[Petros Houhoulis]

If you have 350-400 billion Euros worth of debt and 5-6 billion Euros worth of gold, you are still in deep trouble.

If Greece has so much oil, then why were they producing more barrels per day 20-30 years ago than they are now? Did they just get tired of extracting it? Did they decide they wanted to ruin their economy and the Eurozone just for the lulz?

http://eu22.eu/chart/primary-production-of-crude-oil/primary-production-of-crude-oil-13.png

I would be willing to bet the Greeks have more olive oil ready for consumption than crude oil. Having crude oil underground, and having it ready for distribution is two different things.

Because the oil in underwater and expensive to drill. Prohibitive while the oil price was $25 per barrel a decade ago.

It is more that certain that Prime minister Simitis literally stopped research in natural resources several years back. We just got the confirmation.

[Petros Houhoulis]

The oil is unprovable reserves. The Aegean is mostly international waters, so Greece would have to come to an agreement with Turkey to split oil in the international waters.

Even if there is oil to the south of Crete there would be huge logistical challenges to bring the oil to the Greek mainland. There are really deep trenches to the south of Crete running along the southern Aegean islands and there are multiple fault lines there as well.

Greece is better off trying to make biodiesel out of their olive oil.

Your also forgetting that some petroleum company like BP, Shell or Texaco would probably take anywhere between 30% to 70% cut of the windfall.

The Aegean is mostly Greek waters or international waters surrounded by Greek islands. You'll get none of that oil for sure.

The oil south of Crete is no different than the oil in the gulf of Texas. Beyond that, the first to be drilled would be the natural gas which is above the oil in most of the cases.

Cyprus is already in the works for producing and selling natural gas, much to the displeasure of Turkey...

[Xyresic]

The Aegean is mostly Greek waters or international waters surrounded by Greek islands. You'll get none of that oil for sure.The Aegean is a bit more international waters/high seas than Greek waters. Whats for sure is that Greece wont expand its territorial waters in the Aegean and Greece will have to come to an agreement to split any gas and oil found in those international waters WITH TURKEY (not with Nambia or Canada or other irrelevant parties).


The oil south of Crete is no different than the oil in the gulf of Texas. Beyond that, the first to be drilled would be the natural gas which is above the oil in most of the cases.Its very different actually. The trench just south of Crete is of a similar depth to the deepest parts (where the gas and oil isn't extracted from) of the Gulf of Mexico. Plus there are multiple fault lines - the area is prone to earthquakes.


Cyprus is already in the works for producing and selling natural gas, much to the displeasure of Turkey...Probably at least a decade away, if they can finance it by then. Your acting like South Cyprus is about to sell gas any day now. How do you think the gas will reach mainland Europe anyway? Its far more logistical and economical to ship the gas to Europe via Turkey.

[Petros Houhoulis]

The Aegean is a bit more international waters/high seas than Greek waters. Whats for sure is that Greece wont expand its territorial waters in the Aegean and Greece will have to come to an agreement to split any gas and oil found in those international waters WITH TURKEY (not with Nambia or Canada or other irrelevant parties).

Its very different actually. The trench just south of Crete is of a similar depth to the deepest parts (where the gas and oil isn't extracted from) of the Gulf of Mexico. Plus there are multiple fault lines - the area is prone to earthquakes.

Probably at least a decade away, if they can finance it by then. Your acting like South Cyprus is about to sell gas any day now. How do you think the gas will reach mainland Europe anyway? Its far more logistical and economical to ship the gas to Europe via Turkey.

International waters closer to Greece than Turkey shall be exploited by Greece. You can whine all you like. Only those waters closer to Turkey than Greece shall be exploited by Turkey.

You threatened Cyprus multiple times about the gas and oil fields. In any case the E.U. made a fuss about it and you should know by now that if Cyprus owes money to the E.U., the E.U. would not like to lose it from Turkey. The exact same applies for Greece.

Neither Cyprus not Greece shall have to finance anything. International companies are awarded contracts and make the financing on their own. This is how it works worldwide.

In 10 years from now or tomorrow, with fault lines or without them, that oil shall get out and we shall profit. Whine all you like...

[Loki]

International waters closer to Greece than Turkey shall be exploited by Greece. You can whine all you like. Only those waters closer to Turkey than Greece shall be exploited by Turkey.


Give the Trojans what the Trojans are due.

[Petros Houhoulis]

Give the Trojans what the Trojans are due.
They shall get what is closer to their coastline than our coastline.

[Virtuous]

Malta soon find oil, Malta soon take Sicily.

....is it the sound of "Freedom" rolling that I hear?

damn :)

[Petros Houhoulis]

Malta soon find oil, Malta soon take Sicily.

....is it the sound of "Freedom" rolling that I hear?

damn :)

I'd like to see an invasion of Sicily by Malta...

Does Malta have an army?

[Linet]

I would bet :Cash: on Malta :smokin:

[kabeiros]

Give the Trojans what the Trojans are due. So Greeks from Asia Minor will get the oil and gas which is close to the Turkish coast? I like this idea, can you elaborate on how we should do it? I have papers that prove my grandfather's origins from Marmara region, so I guess that I qualify for a Trojan...