Italy Is the Ticking Time Bomb: Economist

[poiuytrewq0987]

Since the 1970s, the Government has consistently lived beyond its means and public debt has risen to around 115 percent of GDP – broadly in line with the Greek ratio. And since joining the euro, Italy has steadily lost competitiveness," Bootle wrote. "We think that it might take a decade or more of stagnant or falling wages to restore full competitiveness.”

The only chance of Italy getting its debt-to-GDP ratio below 100 percent would be for it to run a budget surplus of 5 percent over 15 years.

“If doubts grow over whether the Government is willing or able to do this, Italy could fall into a so-called 'debt trap.' Under this scenario, rising borrowing costs lead the debt-to-GDP ratio to increase at an accelerating rate, leaving the Government with no choice but to default.”

http://www.cnbc.com/id/38101763/

[Austin]

A friend of my parents went to Italy recently and complained when she went to the hospital for a broken leg and they gave her stretches from WW2....

[Vasconcelos]

Japan's debt is going above 200% of GDP and you don't see US news complaining, I wonder why.

[poiuytrewq0987]

A friend of my parents went to Italy recently and complained when she went to the hospital for a broken leg and they gave her stretches from WW2....

Don't fix what ain't broken?

[Hussar]

Japan's debt is going above 200% of GDP and you don't see US news complaining, I wonder why.



I'd like to rad some hipothesis on that........but i think i know the answer.

[Foxy]

A friend of my parents went to Italy recently and complained when she went to the hospital for a broken leg and they gave her stretches from WW2....

Be silent, please. Italian hospitals are one of the best in the world and we pay nothing for our healthcare.

[Falkata]

Be silent, please. Italian hospitals are one of the best in the world and we pay nothing for our healthcare.

How is that possible? :confused: Berlusconi is paying?

[Foxy]

How is that possible? :confused: Berlusconi is paying?

Nope, he wants to privatize them. But at the moment we have an efficient social state, which give us good hospitals and schools without paying. Then, like in every country, there are hospitals which work better and hospitals which work less good, but when a member of my family needed an important operation, he has been recovered in one of the best hospitals (the Gemelli of Rome, which is also the personal hospital of the Pope) and he paid nothing and he's still living, so...
For the same operation, in the USA he would have paid something like 100.000 US $, here it was free.

[Foxy]

A friend of my parents went to Italy recently and complained when she went to the hospital for a broken leg and they gave her stretches from WW2....

And told by an American is even more ridicolous as many Americans come to Italy to operate, as in the USA many people are not able to pay the high tariffs for healthcare. It's a shame for you, as you are the richest country of the world and many your citizens risk to don't have access to the healthcare without falling into debts.

[poiuytrewq0987]

Japan's debt is going above 200% of GDP and you don't see US news complaining, I wonder why.

Well, the Japanese economy is already huge to begin with. They can afford to have a massive debt but that kind of spending is unsustainable over a long period though. I wonder what they're doing to attain that much debt.

[Falkata]

Nope, he wants to privatize them. But at the moment we have an efficient social state, which give us good hospitals and schools without paying. Then, like in every country, there are hospitals which work better and hospitals which work less good, but when a member of my family needed an important operation, he has been recovered in one of the best hospitals (the Gemelli of Rome, which is also the personal hospital of the Pope) and he paid nothing and he's still living, so...
For the same operation, in the USA he would have paid something like 100.000 US $, here it was free.

We have the same system here, and i guess is the same for the rest of Europe. But we pay it, actually we pay it too much for it. Do you really think it is free? :D
Nothing is free, doctors dont work for free and the devices, technology and stuff aren´t free neither.
Your family already paid that operation with abusive taxes during all its life.

[Foxy]

We have the same system here, and i guess is the same for the rest of Europe. But we pay it, actually we pay it too much for it. Do you really think it is free? :D
Nothing is free, doctors dont work for free and the devices, technology and stuff aren´t free neither.
Your family already paid that operation with abusive taxes during all its life.

Yes, taxation is high, but presses more the high class than the low class. So, if I have to pay 40 euros more than a person who has neither the bread to ear but am sure that also the poorest family of my nation will receive healthcare and school, I am willing to do it.
On the contrary in the US if you have money to assure your life you are safe (and I don't think that the insurance has different prices for riches and poors), otherwise you could have troubles.
In Italy some sectors are not free, like dentists. Indeed when a person must go to the dentist he pays at least 2000 euros for a complete treatment. And do you know what doesn it happen???

....

The dentist comes to you and tell you: - Do you want to pay 2000 euros and receive the receipt or pay 1500 euros and avoiding the taxation? - .
So do everyone who has got a private business, but, if you are the client who has to pay 2000 euros, what would you do? :confused:

[Falkata]

Yes, taxation is high, but presses more the high class than the low class. So, if I have to pay 40 euros more than a person who has neither the bread to ear but am sure that also the poorest family of my nation will receive healthcare and school, I am willing to do it.
On the contrary in the US if you have money to assure your life you are safe (and I don't think that the insurance has different prices for riches and poors), otherwise you could have troubles.
In Italy some sectors are not free, like dentists. Indeed when a person must go to the dentist he pays at least 2000 euros for a complete treatment. And do you know what doesn it happen???

....

The dentist comes to you and tell you: - Do you want to pay 2000 euros and receive the receipt or pay 1500 euros and avoiding the taxation? - .
So do everyone who has got a private business, but, if you are the client who has to pay 2000 euros, what would you do? :confused:

I dont want to have a "daddy goverment" deciding how i have to invest my money, I´m old enough and I know more about economy than the 99% of the politicians.
With all the money that the goverment steals to the people in Europe for the public health care system, we could have awesome private insurances btw

[poiuytrewq0987]

Yes, taxation is high, but presses more the high class than the low class. So, if I have to pay 40 euros more than a person who has neither the bread to ear but am sure that also the poorest family of my nation will receive healthcare and school, I am willing to do it.
On the contrary in the US if you have money to assure your life you are safe (and I don't think that the insurance has different prices for riches and poors), otherwise you could have troubles.
In Italy some sectors are not free, like dentists. Indeed when a person must go to the dentist he pays at least 2000 euros for a complete treatment. And do you know what doesn it happen???

....

The dentist comes to you and tell you: - Do you want to pay 2000 euros and receive the receipt or pay 1500 euros and avoiding the taxation? - .
So do everyone who has got a private business, but, if you are the client who has to pay 2000 euros, what would you do? :confused:

2000 euros for what? A simple cleaning of your teeth or an operation?

[Tony]

We have the same system here, and i guess is the same for the rest of Europe. But we pay it, actually we pay it too much for it. Do you really think it is free? :D
Nothing is free, doctors dont work for free and the devices, technology and stuff aren´t free neither.
Your family already paid that operation with abusive taxes during all its life.
Healthcare in Italy isn't free at all , only the miserable don't pay anything , in my region (healthcare is mostly administered regione-wise) there's a limit fixed at 8000€/year , that means that your household must not be above 8000€ of income per year...:rolleyes2:
as regards to medicine there are some you pay for and some for free but the trend is that less and less is really for free.
Last year I had to go to the dentist 12 times , I paid in the whole 380€.
The best year , when really almost anything was for free , has been the 80s.



A friend of my parents went to Italy recently and complained when she went to the hospital for a broken leg and they gave her stretches from WW2....
It depend wich city she went , usually the hospitals in the south are indecent (the money are wasted to produce fake jobs for the unemplyed and not for real doctors and medicine...) while those in the north are good and someone even excellent.

Japan's debt is going above 200% of GDP and you don't see US news complaining, I wonder why.
The problem is that Japan has the second largest public debt in the world but also the second largest economy after USA , we have the third largest debt but are only the 7th economy in the world.

The economic history of Italy says that we only really grew in the 50s , 60s , after that we doped the economy thruo debt and devaluation of our old currency (lira) , in the 90s when we entered the EMS and then adopted € and signed Maastricht Treaty those tricks has became impossible to do again.
That's why it's now almost 20 years we really don't grow anymore.

[poiuytrewq0987]

The economic history of Italy says that we only really grew in the 50s , 60s , after that we doped the economy thruo debt and devaluation of our old currency (lira) , in the 90s when we entered the EMS and then adopted € and signed Maastricht Treaty those tricks has became impossible to do again.
That's why it's now almost 20 years we really don't grow anymore.

Clearly the trick to fixing the Italian economy is to drop the euro in favor of the lira. ;) :D

[Tony]

Clearly the trick to fixing the Italian economy is to drop the euro in favor of the lira. ;) :D
Mmm no , with a weak devalued currency like a new lira we would meet even greater difficulties in the loans market , in order to make others buy our bonds we would have to give them much more interest than we do now with the €.