Slavery?

[The Lawspeaker]

What are your ideas towards the institution of slavery and indentured servitude (long since passed into history) ?

I personally think that slavery is revolting and that no man should be the property of his fellow man but I do think that someone who is in serious debt to someone (to a private person of equal standing- not a bank) or who has committed a serious crime should be put to work in order to pay of his debt (to society). But an indentured servant should be treated as a human being, not as a slave and cannot be "sold". If the person who the servant is in debt with wants to cease the status then that servant should be released.

[Liffrea]

Slavery can be as much a state of mind as it can be physical shackles. Many people are no better than it, many are content to be it, but that’s the mark of man.

[Sol Invictus]

Fuck slavery. I think it takes a sort of mentally ill person to want to do that sort of thing. If you owe someone money who can't pay it, then find some other way of paying it off on a voluntary basis. If the person peaces out leaving himself indebted to you then that should say something about that person's honour.

[Daos]

I find that some (most?) people are so moronic and useless that the only way they can contribute to society in any way is by being put to forced labour (slavery).

But then again, we're all slaves (more or less) for the plutocrats, so who cares what we think?

[Grumpy Cat]

Fuck slavery. I think it takes a sort of mentally ill person to want to do that sort of thing. If you owe someone money who can't pay it, then find some other way of paying it off on a voluntary basis. If the person peaces out leaving himself indebted to you then that should say something about that person's honour.

Seconded. Slavery is a barbaric practice.

[poiuytrewq0987]

I love being a slave.

http://manicomiomundo.files.wordpress.com/2008/10/dominatrix.jpg

[anonymaus]

It's among the worst things humans have done to other humans--and most groups have done it to their own people first.

[Arrow Cross]

Ah can't see enuff guilt, crackaz! Getcho asses back here an' moan a bit mo' 'bout how yo ancistos were eevul mothafuckas 'n' shitz.

[blan]

its a horrible practice that most all cultures have been responsible for at one point in history.
it hurts many people and creates social and political problems and issues for hundreds and thousands of years to come.

[Psychonaut]

Slavery, of one sort of another, is integral to debt—you cannot have the latter without the former. Men who want will always be beholden to men who lend, and he who is beholden is a slave to the will of another. Emancipate yourself by living simply, within your means. Enslave yourself by buying the lie that you deserve to live like the wealthy.

[Austin]

It's fine and was deemed fine within every single civilization and culture in the known world.

I suspect it will return many times over before humanity departs this universe, this is only a lapse in the norm of slavery to humanity, things will return to normal soon enough I've no doubt.

[blan]

perhaps you are right but dont be suprised at the resentment, violence, and turmoil that it will breed,
i can not think of anytime when slavery had no consequence to the slave or the master or its future generations


It's fine and was deemed fine within every single civilization and culture in the known world.

I suspect it will return many times over before humanity departs this universe, this is only a lapse in the norm of slavery to humanity, things will return to normal soon enough I've no doubt.

[Austin]

perhaps you are right but dont be suprised at the resentment, violence, and turmoil that it will breed,
i can not think of anytime when slavery had no consequence to the slave or the master or its future generations

I just support the practice, it jibes well with my overall sense of structure and placement, morality does not play a role in my ideological beliefs as long as my racial/cultural brethren are on top. It is true yes there are consequences, but that is true of everything. Some of my ancestors were hanged by confederate enlistment forces due to having come from a serf-like existence in Germany from which they immigrated and in toe refused to fight against the Union for slavery.

Yet I still support and like the idea of slavery, my views and support are mine and mine alone and I am free to have them. Due to racial dominance of European descendants in America I live in a nice home, drive a nice car, am treated fairly by the police, have good employment and am assured my children will receive the same more than likely.

I don't care if non-European descent people do not have the same rights and opportunities. It is Europeans and their descendants cultures/laws and inventions which afforded me and those like me our prosperity, it is hence fair that we remain on top. The other races/cultures are mere leeches, they do not warrant equality with me and my brethren, and anyone who argues such disgusts me to no end.

[blan]

well i can argue every point you made and i have not problem with you being disgusted by me.
People who are truly prideful of there race should not support slavery,
there were and are so many poor whites in this world.
in fact there are more poor whites in the usa than poor blacks.
why would you support slavery that would only take away from more labor for your own people.
the problem with racial tensions in the usa between whites and blacks and other parts of the world are often result of slavery.
i have heard you mention many times how you dislike blacks in your country they would not be there if there if slavery was not practiced.
and your racial cultural brethren should be your family/ancestors and the fact that there murder is treated in such a trivial way by you disturbs me.
they should anger you.
this is nt a question of race really because thousands and thousands of whites were affected by slavery and there ancestors are as well.
many whites were put into chains and some treated even worse than the blacks as in the case of irish and scottish slaves.
those are your racial kin and you should want to protect them.
i am not making a moral argument i am making on of logic.
you could as easily be pushed into a the class of those with less and be treated as a slave,
the systems that incorprate slavery rarely care if you are of there culture.
the french enslaved the accadian peoples and treated them as dirt.
the french government watched its people starve while the aristocratic governments of the 16th and 17th century lived with over whelming wealth.
as did the english empires.
i love my culture and people but hate those who who use opression for there own gain.
thats why your country fought the british.
if driving a nice car and having a nice place means more to you than your culture then ithink there is a problem.
please dont take my statments as attacks or with much offense but i think your mind set is what fuels many blacks to feel justified in there hate towards all whites.
i live much better than 80-90 percent of the people where i live and i am not ashamed of that because i work for my money and i get it threw my wits and will and sweat but never would i try to harm others simply to feel more comfortable.


I just support the practice, it jibes well with my overall sense of structure and placement, morality does not play a role in my ideological beliefs as long as my racial/cultural brethren are on top. It is true yes there are consequences, but that is true of everything. Some of my ancestors were hanged by confederate enlistment forces due to having come from a serf-like existence in Germany from which they immigrated and in toe refused to fight against the Union for slavery.

Yet I still support and like the idea of slavery, my views and support are mine and mine alone and I am free to have them. Due to racial dominance of European descendants in America I live in a nice home, drive a nice car, am treated fairly by the police, have good employment and am assured my children will receive the same more than likely.

I don't care if non-European descent people do not have the same rights and opportunities. It is Europeans and their descendants cultures/laws and inventions which afforded me and those like me our prosperity, it is hence fair that we remain on top. The other races/cultures are mere leeches, they do not warrant equality with me and my brethren, and anyone who argues such disgusts me to no end.

[Austin]

well i can argue every point you made and i have not problem with you being disgusted by me.
People who are truly prideful of there race should not support slavery,
there were and are so many poor whites in this world.
in fact there are more poor whites in the usa than poor blacks.
why would you support slavery that would only take away from more labor for your own people.
the problem with racial tensions in the usa between whites and blacks and other parts of the world are often result of slavery.
i have heard you mention many times how you dislike blacks in your country they would not be there if there if slavery was not practiced.
and your racial cultural brethren should be your family/ancestors and the fact that there murder is treated in such a trivial way by you disturbs me.
they should anger you.
this is nt a question of race really because thousands and thousands of whites were affected by slavery and there ancestors are as well.
many whites were put into chains and some treated even worse than the blacks as in the case of irish and scottish slaves.
those are your racial kin and you should want to protect them.
i am not making a moral argument i am making on of logic.
you could as easily be pushed into a the class of those with less and be treated as a slave,
the systems that incorprate slavery rarely care if you are of there culture.
the french enslaved the accadian peoples and treated them as dirt.
the french government watched its people starve while the aristocratic governments of the 16th and 17th century lived with over whelming wealth.
as did the english empires.
i love my culture and people but hate those who who use opression for there own gain.
thats why your country fought the british.
if driving a nice car and having a nice place means more to you than your culture then ithink there is a problem.
please dont take my statments as attacks or with much offense but i think your mind set is what fuels many blacks to feel justified in there hate towards all whites.
i live much better than 80-90 percent of the people where i live and i am not ashamed of that because i work for my money and i get it threw my wits and will and sweat but never would i try to harm others simply to feel more comfortable.

I still like slavery. I don't look at it from a moral point of view, any idea can be compromised near completely by applying a certain set of morals to it, yet that doesn't invalidate the idea or practice because a set of people deem it immoral.

Also the argument that blacks wouldn't be here if it wasn't for slavery, yes this is true. Yet it is also true that most European colonists wouldn't be here in America if it wasn't for a slavery-like indentured servant practice indebted to their wealthy aristocratic European plantation lords. The point is mute really, there are consequences to slavery just as with anything, this I do not deny yet that doesn't invalidate slavery as a system in the slightest.

If slavery had never ended there wouldn't be a problem with blacks now would there? You Europeans could still be shipping them to us on your slaving ship lanes making great profits, how bad would that be?

[Sol Invictus]

I think that people that support the idea of slavery understand very little of our own situation and current crisis.

[blan]

you keep stating that i base all my arguments on morals and i am stating logic.
if you base you opinions on race and culture as you said before you would not support slavery.
yes many great empires were built because of it i know egypt, the usa, the west indies, europe, rome, but it does not aid all of your racial kin only a percentage,



I still like slavery. I don't look at it from a moral point of view, any idea can be compromised near completely by applying a certain set of morals to it, yet that doesn't invalidate the idea or practice because a set of people deem it immoral.

Also the argument that blacks wouldn't be here if it wasn't for slavery, yes this is true. Yet it is also true that most European colonists wouldn't be here in America if it wasn't for a slavery-like indentured servant practice indebted to their wealthy aristocratic European plantation lords. The point is mute really, there are consequences to slavery just as with anything, this I do not deny yet that doesn't invalidate slavery as a system in the slightest.

If slavery had never ended there wouldn't be a problem with blacks now would there? You Europeans could still be shipping them to us on your slaving ship lanes making great profits, how bad would that be?

[Austin]

I think that people that support the idea of slavery understand very little of our own situation and current crisis.

Well I disagree. There's plenty of fodder for slavery now without having to go to high-priced European slavers, not that there are any anymore.

[anonymaus]

There's plenty of fodder for slavery now

Those advocating totalitarianism, slavery, or suicide should show the courage of their convictions by offering to first be subjected to their ideas. ;)

[Austin]

Those advocating totalitarianism, slavery, or suicide should show the courage of their convictions by offering to first be subjected to their ideas. ;)

You are just a moral defeatist!

[blan]

again you think every argument against slavery is based on religious morality,
did you know that many old empires practiced child molestation? the greeks, romans, ect. we as a people have done away with such practice because it is wrong and counter productive to a civil social order,
its logic as well as moral to do away with perverse and harmful practice,
the romans also would kill people for amusement, woman children, theree were practices of beastiality,
there are many practices that we have left them in the past and for good reasons, slavery included



You are just a moral defeatist!

[Liffrea]

Originally Posted by Psychonaut
Slavery, of one sort of another, is integral to debt—you cannot have the latter without the former. Men who want will always be beholden to men who lend, and he who is beholden is a slave to the will of another. Emancipate yourself by living simply, within your means. Enslave yourself by buying the lie that you deserve to live like the wealthy.

It’s a good philosophy, and I agree, I myself learned the hard way about debt, today I do not have a bank account (just a basic building society pay in account, if there was one near me I would join a credit union), cheque book, debit card or credit card. If I don’t have hard cash I don’t buy it, if I want I save or do with out. The one concession I had before I lost my job was my ISA and shares, they made me money, so I was happy!

The problem is that so much of modern society takes for granted that you have some means of credit. People look at you strange if you tell them you don’t have a credit card, in some stores you can’t actually purchase items unless it is on credit.

[Austin]

again you think every argument against slavery is based on religious morality,
did you know that many old empires practiced child molestation? the greeks, romans, ect. we as a people have done away with such practice because it is wrong and counter productive to a civil social order,
its logic as well as moral to do away with perverse and harmful practice,
the romans also would kill people for amusement, woman children, theree were practices of beastiality,
there are many practices that we have left them in the past and for good reasons, slavery included

I am aware it is immoral, extremely so, but this is not a moral world or universe, morality is a human creation and is extremely subjective.

Yet slavery is an extremely profitable, cohesive system. It is --not-- just a form of indebtedness. Half of the U.S. economy used to be based off slavery. Many great olden empires and kingdoms were built/run on slavery for hundreds of years. The original White House was built by slaves. To say slavery is some ignorant system for unsophisticated cultures is simply wrong, actually if you trace every major dominant civilization and or culture they ALL had massive institutions of slavery of some form. The world you live in and prosper in enough to attack slavery and its supporters was built by it literally and figuratively in some form.

Slavery is a good grease on which to run a civilization that otherwise could not exist. Slavery also creates a very strong class-system which strengthens and maintains a society and protects it from negative insular change such as lesser, undeserving entities making claims of status.

[blan]

so if its profitable then do it? so murder, child molestation, extreme sexual perversion, theft, and harming others for profit is fine and good as long as it makes you rich?
sorry but that is not the culture and way of life i will teach my children and it is not the way i will live my life.
If you feel that this is a a good example of european culture then you justify afrocentrists who deem all whites as evil and feeling they have the right to topple our culture


I am aware it is immoral, extremely so, but this is not a moral world or universe, morality is a human creation and is extremely subjective.

Yet slavery is an extremely profitable, cohesive system. It is --not-- just a form of indebtedness. Half of the U.S. economy used to be based off slavery. Many great olden empires and kingdoms were built/run on slavery for hundreds of years. The original White House was built by slaves. To say slavery is some ignorant system for unsophisticated cultures is simply wrong, actually if you trace every major dominant civilization and or culture they ALL had massive institutions of slavery of some form. The world you live in and prosper in enough to attack slavery and its supporters was built by it literally and figuratively in some form.

Slavery is a good grease on which to run a civilization that otherwise could not exist. Slavery also creates a very strong class-system which strengthens and maintains a society and protects it from negative insular change such as lesser, undeserving entities making claims of status.

[Aramis]

Slavery is for slaves.

[Bloodeagle]

Western man has evolved past the slave trade.
Technology is mostly to blame.

[blan]

And Isnt wonderful slave labor can be done by machines while skilled work goes to us and we make profit for are wits and hard work.
it makes sense,
slavery regardless of morality is senseless, when we have machines that can do the same work



Western man has evolved past the slave trade.
Technology is mostly to blame.

[Foxy]

To answer this question we should stop reasoning with our modern criteria, which are essentialy based on the enlightment values.
If you think that slavery is a substitute of prison and if you enslave only people who have committed some crimes and put them to work for a private owner instead that for the public state, I could also be in favour. Especially here in Italy where people who commit crimes are left from the prison after 10 years for a murder becouse "we have not enough space in prisons", well, I DO AM in favour.

So, in short: slavery of common people, agains.
Slavery of criminals: in favour.

[Lulletje Rozewater]

Slavery, of one sort of another, is integral to debt—you cannot have the latter without the former. Men who want will always be beholden to men who lend, and he who is beholden is a slave to the will of another. Emancipate yourself by living simply, within your means. Enslave yourself by buying the lie that you deserve to live like the wealthy.:thumbs up:thumbs up:thumbs up:thumbs up Agreed

Democracy is slavery too.
On the other hand slavery is a natural phenomenon amongst insects such as bees and parasites are everywhere. The Alpha and Omega concept.

[Aramis]

...

- posted in the wrong thread, please delete my post -

[Austin]

And Isnt wonderful slave labor can be done by machines while skilled work goes to us and we make profit for are wits and hard work.
it makes sense,
slavery regardless of morality is senseless, when we have machines that can do the same work

NoNoNo Slavery -IS NOT- just an economic system nor does it solely function as such. It is also an extremely effective, passive enforcer of the dominant culture and its people.


Slavery serves to enforce various roles and norms in society. When you have a slave class, the general citizenry feels a greater sense of worth and dignity, seeing as at least they are not slaves and are above that institution.

When you have a racially-based slavery, the one which I prefer, you not only have the above but you also have a societal, mass-racial mentality that maintains and buffers the non-slave race in an elevated mental position from the rest.

The result is that the slave-owning race better protects its culture, tends to care more about its culture, as well as having an elevated sense of racial identity over the nothingness most feel today intermixed with the slaves descendants.

[blan]

reallllyyyy??? then why did Haiti go threw a revolt resulting in the fleeing of thousands of whites and mullatos while thousands and thousands more where slaughtered?
why did Jamaica have revolts resulting in towns being burned to the ground while whites were killed in the hundreds?
why did strong holds of maroons attack white towns and pillage on a regular basis?
why did harpers ferry happen in the usa?
why did the kkk form? because the the racial tensions and issues that were ramped in the south after the civil war.
why are there massive cities like memphis TN dominated by blacks and new orleans that have in recent times seen race riots?
so far i have not seen one positive result from anything you speak of?
even if goverments refuse to allow emancipation there is pain and suffering on whites regardless, if you really want slavery then move to a black country were it is being practiced.
Any white preservationist will tell you slavery was not in our best interest.
so it seems you have shifted your economic argument to ways of dominant alpha male mentality.
everything you have stated is unfounded and if you knew your history then you know that whites suffered under this system as well.
blacks rarely attack the slave masters.
the masters have all the protection in the world.
middle class whites and some poor suffer the brunt of the attacks more than the master who has the means to flee and all the security in the world.
maybe you have better social connections than me, maybe you have more money, if that is the case then you base your ideas on class, and then we are not allies i would be forced to be in arms with those of my class regardless of there color and ethnic background.
your ideas tear whites caucasian people apart and you fail to bring us together.




NoNoNo Slavery -IS NOT- just an economic system nor does it solely function as such. It is also an extremely effective, passive enforcer of the dominant culture and its people.


Slavery serves to enforce various roles and norms in society. When you have a slave class, the general citizenry feels a greater sense of worth and dignity, seeing as at least they are not slaves and are above that institution.

When you have a racially-based slavery, the one which I prefer, you not only have the above but you also have a societal, mass-racial mentality that maintains and buffers the non-slave race in an elevated mental position from the rest.

The result is that the slave-owning race better protects its culture, tends to care more about its culture, as well as having an elevated sense of racial identity over the nothingness most feel today intermixed with the slaves descendants.

[Liffrea]

Originally Posted by Klepzeiker
Democracy is slavery too.

'None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free'
Goethe

[Austin]

Looking at slavery through a lens of pure morality is to misunderstand the entire concept of the institution because the argument that a people/civilization who practice slavery were/are all immoral is nonsense.

Slavery wherever it was practiced and will be practiced in the future encompasses much more than just free labor, it is a deep system that touches and transforms everything not always in a negative light. People have been zombified by the media today on the reality of slavery with a white-washed morality-ignorance which is sad because there is nothing more subjective than morality.

Case in point on morality being subjective, many if not all slaving civilizations key argument for slavery was that it was their moral obligation to instill values and a sense of merit to lesser beings through slavery. One could very easily argue that for black Africans now in the West driving around Mercedes and living in mansions that the institution of slavery was indeed a very moral act.

[anonymaus]

there is nothing more subjective than morality.

http://www.cheninfo.com/photos/d/16951-2/The+kid+table.jpg

[Murphy]

[. . .] because there is nothing more subjective than morality.

Why do you even pretend to be a Christian?

[The Lawspeaker]

Unfortunately slavery as a practice ( and a heinous and barbaric one at it) and slave trade persist to this very day. Even under our own noses. For instance: human trafficking (one of the causes of illegal immigration) which includes the trade in girls and women.

Pimping and loverboys that force teenage girls into prostitution are an example of that. But also the coffee, the tea, the chocolate, tobacco are usually "tainted products" as they are (for a large part) produced on plantations outside of Europe that are still using a kind of slave labour. Or the clothes that we wear, the cellphones that we use: made in sweat shops. I remember that even a farm right in our own country were indicted with neglect and the virtual use of slave labour only a couple of years (http://www.rnw.nl/english/article/slavery-drama-dutch-village-someren) ago (I am not kidding you) -- this usually concerns Polish or Romanian workers The minerals that are in the phones or in the pc - the gold, diamonds. I remember Blood Diamond a couple of years ago and it was a real eye opener. During civil wars in f.i Sierra Leone, the Congo and in Ivory Coast coltan (used in cellphones), gold, silver, diamonds were all mined using slave labour and this heinous practice continues to this very day.

It is estimated that (around the world) 12 to 27 million people are still working and living as slaves.

[Magister Eckhart]

An absolute necessity for a healthy society, but there are qualifications to that statement. I will expand on this later, I have to get some sleep now.

[Sally]

It is contrary to the dignity of a human person to bought, sold or exchanged like merchandise. It is repulsive, at least to me.


Slavery can be as much a state of mind as it can be physical shackles.

I agree with Liffrea's statement wholeheartedly. In addition, I think many people are enslaved today, they just aren't physically shackled. Furthermore, I don't think freedom necessarily implies the right to do or say everything.

[Libertas]

An absolute necessity for a healthy society, but there are qualifications to that statement. I will expand on this later, I have to get some sleep now.

You really have some explaining to do if you can EVER justify slavery!

[rhiannon]

What are your ideas towards the institution of slavery and indentured servitude (long since passed into history) ?

I personally think that slavery is revolting and that no man should be the property of his fellow man but I do think that someone who is in serious debt to someone (to a private person of equal standing- not a bank) or who has committed a serious crime should be put to work in order to pay of his debt (to society). But an indentured servant should be treated as a human being, not as a slave and cannot be "sold". If the person who the servant is in debt with wants to cease the status then that servant should be released.

Well-stated. I agree completely:)

[Magister Eckhart]

Now then, I promised to expand this post and I certainly plan to do so. I have no doubt many here have been utterly repulsed by the suggestion – all the believers in the modern ideas of “human rights” and “human dignity”, egalitarianism and humanitarianism squirmed and fumed at such a disgusting idea. Indeed, how broken and pointless is their ideology, if there is no such thing as equal dignity and equal rights.

But I submit to you all that there are not, and there never have been. Too often have I repeated myself here regarding the nature of equality being a spiritual, not a physical or social property; the modernists have worked so hard to bring heaven down to earth they have debased the very idea, and now what was formerly a glorious and wholesome ideal – the “brotherhood of mankind” – has become little more than a materialist and socialist rallying-cry. It’s offensive, but apparently despite this none but very few are offended by it. Why am I repeating myself again? Believe me, I do weary of hearing my own voice sometimes, but without this prelude I cannot properly defend the institution of slavery.

I will begin by saying that slavery has only been considered a social evil for around 200 years in a small backwater on the globe populated by men with hands made soft by wealth and leisure and minds made soft by the same. I speak, of course, of our own heartland: the realm of decadence and of cultural creosote, Europe. I speak of the arrogance of these men, of the “Enlightenment” – a name saturated in vanity—who believed that they had brought an end to history with their glorious future with liberty, fraternity, and equality for the world. Millennia of history and human wisdom cast aside by these “new men”. New they were, and original. True to the absolute nature of their civilization, they were men more totally divorced from reality and more totally decadent than any previous agents of entropy in any civilization yet to arise among mankind.

Slavery, the state of servitude and of submission, is a natural state for the greater portion of mankind. Inequality is the rule that governs order, for order derives from a simple dialectic of the ruled and the rulers – of subjects and sovereign. Slavery is nothing more or less than an extension of this; to imagine as some sort of special case neglects a number of simple facts. Slavery is a state of being bound; are we not bound by law? Slavery is a state of being in service to another; do we not all serve someone or something? Slavery is a state of being unable to make certain choices; yet are we not all bound by society and by others in terms of our choices. A slave must look to his master to wed, and indeed I must look to government to make a contract, if that contract is to mean anything socially and legally. Slavery is not an exceptional state, it is merely a different degree of this simple relationship of service and responsibility found in all orderly societies.

History also tells us that slavery has been with mankind for almost as long as our consciousness has been with us. The Egyptians kept slaves, as did our ancestors the Norse, the Spartans, the Persians – there was slavery in China, in India, in Japan. In East and in West, a caste of slaves bound to their social state below others made up a defining part of all societies, only to be cast aside by the West with the rise of material ideologies. It is a natural state, a natural occurrence –or, if one prefers, an ordained occurrence. Whether or not God enters into it, it would seem that slavery is part of the human condition.

Why, then, is slavery necessary to a healthy society? Let us look to slavery specifically. Slavery exists, ultimately, in only three forms in all human history: mercantile slavery, cultural slavery, and social slavery. Mercantile slavery is slavery that arises from the merchant caste because it is a sale of goods; men make money at it. This is the type of slavery that occurs in Africa and that spread to Europe and its colonies. Cultural slavery is slavery that is defined by cultural realities, that is so entrenched in a culture that it cannot be divorced therefrom; it is tied to myth, to race, to ritual, and to religion. This is the type of slavery we see among the Spartans, and also the state of the Sudra in India. Social slavery is slavery that arises from the state of society; in almost all cases, this is a slavery into which one enters voluntarily – it is a contractual form of slavery. This is found in indentured servitude as well as in European serfdom.

We might say of mercantile slavery that it is the most detestable form of slavery, since it is a form of slavery by which human beings are exploited by other human beings for commercial gain specifically – this is entirely the point of mercantile slavery. It is detestable indeed, but only as detestable as the mentality that creates it – for mercantile thinking, that is to say the materialism of the merchant, is entirely devoted to the exploitation of one man by another for the latter’s specifically material gain. This is the spirit of Capitalism; in this way, this form of slavery is little more than the Capitalism of Slavery; indeed, one might go as far as to say that it is represented both by the enslavement of the Negro in America, racially singled out for economic reasons, as well as the binding nature of employment to mines during the late 19th and early 20th centuries, in which the miner lived on company property, unable to make demands of his employer, and bound entirely by his employer, forced to purchase from company stores, living in company housing, and guaranteed nothing except a salary that went right back to the company. Even the serf was in a superior position to these poor souls, who served as little more than commodities or at best tools of their “employers”. Likewise, slaves captured in war as spoils of war fall into this category: stripped of their freedom because they become treasure, and then traded as goods and treated as such. This sort of slavery is allowed to survive only because it is preceded by two superior forms of slavery.

It is in social and in cultural slavery that the key to slavery’s social value resides. Social slavery, slavery by contract, is an important part of the governance of men – it plays this role willingly, and gives order to society. The spirit of social slavery is ultimately a contract of mutual responsibility; the serf or servant becomes such because it benefits him and his master, and binds himself to master or to land for the sake of his security. This is what the serf did—he bound himself to a Lord and to land permanently to grant the security of mutual responsibility to his family. Bound to servitude, he was a slave, for he was unfree, but he was free, in a manner of speaking, from the dangers and risks of freemen. This sort of slavery especially speaks to the core of slavery as a social institution: the slave-mind knows of nothing but slavery – he craves it, he is driven by it and to it, indeed, he ekes it. If he is not enslaved in body, he will most certainly be enslaved in spirit, and will seek spiritual slavery to goods, to pleasures, to Mammon, to be brief. Cultural slavery, the purest form of slavery, places men in their natural place in the order of society, and binds them to their caste. In this system, the slave is bound by rite and observance to his state; it is his natural state, his racial state. Unlike the social slave, he cannot remember a time when he was not a slave; for insofar as a man is himself nothing more or less than his people, for as long as his family has been bound, so too he has been bound.

This Cultural Slavery is both a reflection of as well as the root of the Slave-mind, for it exists in a culture in which the natural castes are intact: the ruled and the ruler, the subject and the sovereign. Among certain people, castes are more explicit than in others. We of the West may speak, as our immediate predecessors and Eastern cousins, of Four Castes: the Priest, the Warrior, the Merchant, and the Slave. It has known many incarnations, but there can be no doubt it has existed in every society; the Indo-Europeans recognised it and formalised it, but it is found in some form or another in almost all cultures. Some leave out levels, some combine them, some add extras. The Hindus, for example, add a fifth tier of “out-castes”, in the literal sense, called Dalits. The Germanic people had all four: King, Earl, Churl, Thrall. The Greeks, we find, express only three: Guardians, Auxiliaries, and Producers. The Egyptians had three as well: the God-man, the priesthood, and the people. Their religion reflected a similar hierarchy of God – gods – god-man – humanity.

The slave is the lowest state of man, but it is also the most poignant. Man judges himself to be what he is in relation to what he is not; indeed, all things are defined by what they are note. The Will to Power Nietzsche spoke of begins as the Will to Freedom, for he who has not freedom has the least amount of power. He is the most poignant reminder that there is division. The recognition of the Slave-mind, more than anything else, makes recognition of its opposite, the Philosopher-King, possible. Freedom belongs only to those who are born to it, for it is only the Spiritual Aristocrat who has the potentiality to be free of all worldly things. Cultural slavery emphasises this. Without it, there can be no healthy, living society that recognises the castes.

Now then, what of the slave? Is he denied spiritual freedom because of his material state? No, and again no! He is hard-pressed, tested by fate to be sure, but a slave can be more spiritually free than his master if he fulfils his spiritual potentiality and his master neglects his own. Spiritual Aristocrat or Spiritual Slave, spiritual awakening is available to all and can be seized but only by acceptance of one’s state. The slave has more to overcome in this task, but does that not make his accomplishment greater? Indeed, in this view, slavery is a completely positive thing.

[Albion]

I personally think that slavery is revolting and that no man should be the property of his fellow man but I do think that someone who is in serious debt to someone (to a private person of equal standing- not a bank) or who has committed a serious crime should be put to work in order to pay of his debt (to society). But an indentured servant should be treated as a human being, not as a slave and cannot be "sold". If the person who the servant is in debt with wants to cease the status then that servant should be released.

My views match yours.

[European blood]

Finally an African American tells other blacks how their people were actually enslaved by their own people.

IoxTOWP0Jmo

[European blood]

The shocking story of black girls being kidnapped in Africa and transported to America as slaves today! Yes blacks are still enslaving other blacks in Africa and shipping them to America just like they did in the 18th century.

cNeruDWEtCQ

[Johnston]

Care to sell me some thralls? I'll need some to do my chores around here and to help take a load off. I want to do something fun for a change.

[Anglian]

Care to sell me some thralls? I'll need some to do my chores around here and to help take a load off. I want to do something fun for a change.

Not you again you Black cunt:D

[Johnston]

Not you again you Black cunt:DDid you just call me a cunt?:eek:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7c/Raven_croak.jpg/1024px-Raven_croak.jpg

[Johnston]

My views match yours.How about selling your debt to other people, like creditors do?:(

[Boudica]

Not you again you Black cunt:D

Did you just call me a cunt?

http://www.streetfightingclip.com/babelogger_images/ghetto_black_girl_fight.jpg

[Johnston]

Here's more evidence that Anglian is Turkey Lurkey:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showpost.php?p=548043&postcount=193

[Albion]

How about selling your debt to other people, like creditors do?:(

I'm against that.

[Johnston]

I'm against that.I'm against that and insurance. I don't like paying people for a protection racket.

[LastManOnEarth]

One very interesting part of history regarding slavery is the old-Roman distinction between two different types of man.

HOMO, as contrasted to HUMANUS.

The original term signifying an individual of our species was HOMO in Latin.

Gradually, the concept of HUMANUS was introduced, to describe a lesser type of man with limited rights. A "monster" or freak of nature, this lesser man (commoner), was according to Roman law subjugated to the will of his master and therefore, so to speak, legally a slave.

The concept was carrried ahead further by Roman Catholic canon law and was absolutely imperative in enslaving all of the indigenous populations in the so called "New world" during the time of the discoverers and subsequent colonization.

I sometimes play with the thought: -What if this concept of superiority-inferiority had not been there? What if people could have discovered each others as equals, instead learning from each other and mutually respecting each other?

But we all know what happened.
Genocides. Slavery. Exploitation of natural resources and other parasitism.
All over the world.

And it was all considered legal because of the Roman Catholic Canon law concept of making a distinction between HOMO and HUMANUS.

There has not been any serious challenge to the basic concept of law as defined by the Catholic church, at least for the last 1000 years.

[2DREZQ]

I sometimes play with the thought: -What if this concept of superiority-inferiority had not been there? What if people could have discovered each others as equals, instead learning from each other and mutually respecting each other?

And it was all considered legal


All you are asking is that basic human nature (the tendency to values self, then family, then tribe) be overridden in favor of some intrinsically noble philosophy which manifestly did not immediately materially benefit the explorers or their backers. The definition of such a people is "Extinct"

Such a benign moral code can only be held by a people who are rich enough and powerful enough to afford such indulgence. Tragically, the west is about to discover it cannot be afforded for long.

Technically, the U.S. constitution does not prohibit all slavery, it just reserves its exercise to the government alone, as punishment for a crime. (13th amendment)

[LastManOnEarth]

Such a benign moral code can only be held by a people who are rich enough and powerful enough to afford such indulgence. Tragically, the west is about to discover it cannot be afforded for long.


Good point. Personally I believe the only way for a member of the Homo Sapiens species to become anything more than a simple beast is to strive for such a code.
Individually as well as collectively.

[2DREZQ]

Good point. Personally I believe the only way for a member of the Homo Sapiens species to become anything more than a simple beast is to strive for such a code.
Individually as well as collectively.

We are in very deep philosophical waters here.

Scroll back up a bit to Magister's post. He seems to think that Spiritual growth can, and once did, take a very divergent path than the one you yearn for.

On a personal level, it might work out just fine. You'll be eminently popular with all your fellow Thralls.

[Supreme American]

What are your ideas towards the institution of slavery and indentured servitude (long since passed into history) ?

I personally think that slavery is revolting and that no man should be the property of his fellow man but I do think that someone who is in serious debt to someone (to a private person of equal standing- not a bank) or who has committed a serious crime should be put to work in order to pay of his debt (to society). But an indentured servant should be treated as a human being, not as a slave and cannot be "sold". If the person who the servant is in debt with wants to cease the status then that servant should be released.

My biggest beef against slavery is that it has deluged white colonies in the Americas with all type of filth. Importing such labor to get things done quicker doesn't justify the practice, and has only left us with trouble.

As modern Westerners most of us agree the institution of slavery itself is morally repugnant, however much of the world for millenia has not viewed it that way, and it's worth pointing out that neither the Quran nor the Bible outlawed the practice.

[2DREZQ]

and it's worth pointing out that neither the Quran nor the Bible outlawed the practice.

The credit card companies think it is a pretty swell idea, too.

[Supreme American]

The credit card companies think it is a pretty swell idea, too.

Interesting. I don't recall Wells Fargo hogtying me and selling me on the block at the town square. Perhaps I forgot.

[Supreme American]

The credit card companies think it is a pretty swell idea, too.

Interesting. I don't recall Wells Fargo hogtying me and selling me on the block at the town square. Perhaps I forgot.

[Great Dane]

I'm opposed to slavery but I don't see the point in being repulsed at slavery in the past. It is only within the last 200 years that slavery has become unacceptable in western nations. Slavery has been the norm for most of human history and is still practiced in parts of Africa, the Middle East and Asia.

[LastManOnEarth]

We are in very deep philosophical waters here.

Scroll back up a bit to Magister's post. He seems to think that Spiritual growth can, and once did, take a very divergent path than the one you yearn for.

On a personal level, it might work out just fine. You'll be eminently popular with all your fellow Thralls.

Brother, the spiritual growth (or whatever you want to call it) of mankind as a whole is an absolute disaster.
And it doesn´t look like it´s getting better.

In fact, it´s getting exponentially worse.


http://www.thedailygreen.com/cm/thedailygreen/images/MR/lady-gaga-meat-dress-lg.jpg

[Supreme American]

I'm opposed to slavery but I don't see the point in being repulsed at slavery in the past. It is only within the last 200 years that slavery has become unacceptable in western nations. Slavery has been the norm for most of human history and is still practiced in parts of Africa, the Middle East and Asia.

White guilt?

If one has such sentiments, they should consider that only whites ended slavery.

[Supreme American]

Brother, the spiritual growth (or whatever you want to call it) of mankind as a whole is an absolute disaster.
And it doesn´t look like it´s getting better.

In fact, it´s getting exponentially worse.


http://www.thedailygreen.com/cm/thedailygreen/images/MR/lady-gaga-meat-dress-lg.jpg

There's a liberal myth taught in schools that basically says that humankind is always progressing for the better. Cultural degeneracy and degradation such as in your Lady Gag photo show otherwise. We are absolutely regressing.

As far as spirituality goes, it's rather difficult to be such when there's no proof one way or another. This realm is bound to be stagnant, only progressing in terms of what rational thought can add.

[rhiannon]

As far as spirituality goes, it's rather difficult to be such when there's no proof one way or another. This realm is bound to be stagnant, only progressing in terms of what rational thought can add.

Yep. Gotta agree with this, too:thumb001:

[LastManOnEarth]

There's a liberal myth taught in schools that basically says that humankind is always progressing for the better. Cultural degeneracy and degradation such as in your Lady Gag photo show otherwise. We are absolutely regressing.

As far as spirituality goes, it's rather difficult to be such when there's no proof one way or another. This realm is bound to be stagnant, only progressing in terms of what rational thought can add.

That´s what I always come to; technologically and in the realm of scientific thought there has been a lot of progress.
However when it comes to spirituality mankind seems incompetent and hesitant in general.
Apart from some bright spots here and there it´s all depravity, greed and lack of purpose after the first "fix" of satisfaction.

The important question for me is if this debauchery is a result of:

- The basic inability of the Homo Sapiens species to do better in terms of spiritual development.

- A constant and invisible man-made satanic force striving to curse as many souls as possible at any given time for the purpose of rebelling against spiritual harmony and divine law in general.


http://cdn.thegloss.com/files/2011/07/formichetti.png
Nicola Formichetti, Lady Gagas designer

http://static3.slamxhype.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/nicola-formichetti-rick-genest-04.png
Example of his work

There are countless other examples of people like this using the same symbolism, engaging in the same kind of repulsive, degenerate behaviour.
I mean, these people must come from somewhere.

Sorry for derailing the thread somewhat.
However I think my contribution is still related to slavery in a way.

[2DREZQ]

The important question for me is if this debauchery is a result of:

- The basic inability of the Homo Sapiens species to do better in terms of spiritual development.

- A constant and invisible man-made satanic force striving to curse as many souls as possible at any given time for the purpose of rebelling against spiritual harmony and divine law in general.

[CENTER]http://cdn.thegloss.com/files/2011/07/formichetti.png
Nicola Formichetti, Lady Gagas designer

Sorry for derailing the thread somewhat.
However I think my contribution is still related to slavery in a way.

Look at the number of species that have existed on earth for hundreds of millions of years. Look at where we appear to be headed with a running start of just a few tens of thousands of years.

Intelligence itself may be an evolutionary dead end.:eek::eek:

Mother Nature on the phone to God: "Yes, Uh huh. No, a complete waste of time and resources. Yes, I agree completely. The mess? No problem I'll have it cleaned up in 10,000 and change. Next? Well, I've been working on an improved Trilobite, look how long those lasted! OK, I'll send up the budget. You look it over and let me know. If you sign off we can be up and running again in less than 1.5 million. Great, and thanks again, it was rather fun, wasn't it?"

[2DREZQ]

Interesting. I don't recall Wells Fargo hogtying me and selling me on the block at the town square. Perhaps I forgot.

Yeah. I even tried trading my firstborn for the balance, but they weren't interested.

[LastManOnEarth]

Look at the number of species that have existed on earth for hundreds of millions of years. Look at where we appear to be headed with a running start of just a few tens of thousands of years.

Intelligence itself may be an evolutionary dead end.:eek::eek:

Mother Nature on the phone to God: "Yes, Uh huh. No, a complete waste of time and resources. Yes, I agree completely. The mess? No problem I'll have it cleaned up in 10,000 and change. Next? Well, I've been working on an improved Trilobite, look how long those lasted! OK, I'll send up the budget. You look it over and let me know. If you sign off we can be up and running again in less than 1.5 million. Great, and thanks again, it was rather fun, wasn't it?"

Yeah sure, I mean these are the kind of thoughts you get after watching pictures of people like Lady Gggagaga et al; "F#ck it all, let´s just cancel humanity in general and cover the whole planet with a huge brown tarp and then maybe in 500.000 years perhaps a more deserving species can title itself the "crown of creation".

The awarenenss of humanity is just so deep into this weird, degenerated, disappointing Mickey Mouse reality that it´s difficult to fathom.
I totally agree. Sad but true.