Time is ripe for Russia - EU visa-free regime - Medvedev

[poiuytrewq0987]

Russian President Dmitry Medvedev said on Thursday that the time is ripe for scrapping the visa regime between Russia and EU.

"We want a visa free regime," Medvedev said. "We think that we are ready for this; our businesses and people are in favor of it; you could say it is the spirit of the time," Medvedev said at a press-conference on results of the Russian-German interstate consultations.

Medvedev said Russia had sent a draft of the agreement on the visa-free regime to the EU.

"It is clear that this is just a draft and there are difficulties within the EU," he said. "Our partners are discussing it and we hope there will be real progress."

Russian President Dmitry Medvedev and German Chancellor Angela Merkel arrived in the Urals city of Yekaterinburg on Wednesday for bilateral talks.

Merkel promised to assist with the possible introduction of visa-free regime between Russia and the EU.

Medvedev said he was confident a decision on a visa-free regime would eventually be reached if there was the necessary "good will and desire."

During the Russia-EU summit from May 31-June 1 in Rostov-on-Don, Russia handed over to the EU a draft agreement on abolishing the visa regime.

http://en.rian.ru/russia/20100715/159824137.html

[The Lawspeaker]

That's a wonderful development as European brother-nations should not employ a visa wall against each other.

I wonder whether it would be a good idea for the EU and Russia (and Schengen-signatories) to pursue a common visa-policy ? A kind of European visa that would be mandatory for anyone from non-European countries that is travelling to Europe. So if you get turned down in one country you are automatically turned down in all signatory states.

[Austin]

Isn't half of Russia's population working in the EU anyways?

[The Lawspeaker]

Isn't half of Russia's population working in the EU anyways?
You mean that 58 million Russians are working in the EU (Russia has over 100 million Russian inhabitants) ?
The answer is no although there are certainly Russians working in the EU but mainly in the Baltic.

[Austin]

You mean that 58 million Russians are working in the EU (Russia has over 100 million Russian inhabitants) ?
The answer is no although there are certainly Russians working in the EU but mainly in the Baltic.



Well right but Russia doesn't even have 200 million people so having 58 million in other neighboring countries means that whatever immigration policies exist are being ignored anyways..I doubt this visa thing would change that reality.

[The Lawspeaker]

Well right but Russia doesn't even have 200 million people so having 58 million in other neighboring countries means that whatever immigration policies exist are being ignored anyways..I doubt this visa thing would change that reality.
Well. I used 58 million to indicate that your notion of "half of Russia being in Europe" is false. It would be quite impossible that half of Russia (roughly 58 million) would be in Europe and we wouldn't have talked about it on the forum.

The reality of it all is that the number of Russians that are living in Europe (apart from the Baltic) is not much more then a couple of million at best.

[Austin]

Well. I used 58 million to indicate that your notion of "half of Russia being in Europe" is false. It would be quite impossible that half of Russia (roughly 58 million) would be in Europe and we wouldn't have talked about it on the forum.

The reality of it all is that the number of Russians that are living in Europe (apart from the Baltic) is not much more then a couple of million at best.


Well yeah now that I think about it that makes sense. I just don't get the impression the average Russian cares much about whatever the immigration policy is anyways based on how many are illegally in the EU currently.

[Thorum]

I hadn't heard of this. I think this is a great idea. I also believe it would be good to have the same agreement for Canada/USA and Russia. Long overdue in my opinion.

[poiuytrewq0987]

Actually I see Russia's lower class going over to Western Europe for jobs should the visa regime be removed between both sides. Probably up to one, five or ten million will most likely emigrate but not "half" of Russia that's not possible at all.

[Fortis in Arduis]

Yes, this will be particularly beneficial for ESTONIA.

*waits for Karl*

[Äike]

Yes, this will be particularly beneficial for ESTONIA.

*waits for Karl*

Well, it changes things for Estonians as much as for the other EU citizens.

The thing is, a lot of Russians here have Alien passports, not Estonian- nor Russian citizenship. They can travel visa-free in Russia, with an alien passport. While us, Estonian citizens need a visa.

So I do not understand how a visa-free regime would be more beneficial to Estonia than it is to some other EU country.

I wouldn't have replied in this thread, if you wouldn't have "waited" for me. I do not understand your logic.

[Osweo]

This will make things easier for me personally, who regularly travels back and forth there, but I'm unsure of wider ramifications.

Will it ease human trafficking and drug smuggling? Applying for visas is a bit of a pain in the arse, but it at least represents a means of keeping an eye on movements in and out of a country. Perhaps one idea behind it is to take revenue from organised crime that profits from visa fraud... :chin:

[Eldritch]

I wouldn't support visa-free mobility between EU and Russia anymore than I would support it between the EU and Turkey or northern Africa.

[poiuytrewq0987]

I wouldn't support visa-free mobility between EU and Russia anymore than I would support it between the EU and Turkey or northern Africa.

Why? Because most Russians are poor?

[Eldritch]

Why? Because most Russians are poor?

I think in this case, when changes to the existing status quo are proposed, it's up to the people who support the changes to justify them.

EDIT:

But no, it's got nothing to do with poverty as such.

[InvaderNat]

Why? Because most Russians are poor?

No, probably because it will just allow millions of poor Turkic, Mongoloid and Caucasian immigrants living in Russia into Europe. Which of course has plenty of jobs to go around doesn't it...no wait...the opposite is true.;)

[Eldritch]

No, probably because it will just allow millions of poor Turkic, Mongoloid and Caucasian immigrants living in Russia into Europe. Which of course has plenty of jobs to go around doesn't it...no wait...the opposite is true.;)

Also let's not forget that Russia borders more countries than any other nation in the world. And the Asian part of Russia is not too far from being ran on a skeleton crew. I would presume that gaining entry into Russia is not an incredibly difficult feat (not that entering the EU is either, but that's beside the point rigt now), and therefore, well ...

[Loki]

I would support the same privileges for Russians than for any other Europeans. Europe is not complete without Russia.



Russia, Germany may set example for EU on easing of visa rules - Putin (http://www.en.rian.ru/russia/20101126/161516590.html)

Russia and Germany may set an example for the EU on the issue of the simplification of visa formalities, Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin said on Friday.

"The Russian approach to this issue is well known," Putin said at a joint news-conference with German Chancellor Angela Merkel. "We stand for the maximum simplification of visa procedures in our relationship and have repeatedly announced our readiness for a visa-free regime," he continued.

Putin called on the European Union (EU) to determine bilateral visa scrapping terms and a schedule in an interview with Germany's Suddeutsche Zeitung on Thursday.

The Kremlin has made visa-free travel between Russia and the EU a foreign policy priority.

The premier also said earlier in the day that Russia would soon simplify the procedure for foreigners to buy shares in strategic sectors of economy,
Russia and the European Union must strengthen their ties in order to stay competitive in today's world, he added.

BERLIN, November 26 (RIA Novosti)

[Gamera]

Recently in the news here they were saying that now Peruvians can travel to Russia visa-free as well. I find it positive. We can travel almost nowhere visa-free.

[poiuytrewq0987]

Also let's not forget that Russia borders more countries than any other nation in the world. And the Asian part of Russia is not too far from being ran on a skeleton crew. I would presume that gaining entry into Russia is not an incredibly difficult feat (not that entering the EU is either, but that's beside the point rigt now), and therefore, well ...

Anybody can sneak through a sparsely populated area to enter a big country. So, really, your point is moot on this.


Recently in the news here they were saying that now Peruvians can travel to Russia visa-free as well. I find it positive. We can travel almost nowhere visa-free.

Not like Peruvians can travel anyhow.

[Eldritch]

Anybody can sneak through a sparsely populated area to enter a big country. So, really, your point is moot on this.


If you're really interested in having serious arguments, then learn to read people's posts properly, and then reply to them in a coherent way that actually means something.

[Albion]

How are they going to ensure no one from Asia (excluding Russian Asia - Siberia) jump the longest borders in the world?

[The Lawspeaker]

How are they going to ensure no one from Asia (excluding Russian Asia - Siberia) jump the longest borders in the world?
That's indeed the only problem that I have got with it. Luckily Russki's are the kind of people that arrest and question anyone that looks suspicious.

And if the militia doesn't catch them then the local groups themselves will... and immigrants are not particularly keen on meeting those local groups...

[poiuytrewq0987]

That's indeed the only problem that I have got with it. Luckily Russki's are the kind of people that arrest and question anyone that looks suspicious.

And if the militia doesn't catch them then the local groups themselves will... and immigrants are not particularly keen on meeting those local groups...

To be honest, any illegal immigrants will always be self-policied by communities that notice people who stand out. It's impossible to police the border down to the last millimeter but good luck to them trying to blend in.

[Osweo]

Russia's Border Guards are a branch of the FSB (KGB). The borders are well looked after, believe me.

As for worrying about Europe being flooded by illegal Chinese immigrants, Russia should worry more about the millions of Jihadists who live in the EU as privileged citizens!

[poiuytrewq0987]

Russia's Border Guards are a branch of the FSB (KGB). The borders are well looked after, believe me.

As for worrying about Europe being flooded by illegal Chinese immigrants, Russia should worry more about the millions of Jihadists who live in the EU as privileged citizens!

Is there even a flow of illegal Chinese into Russia?

[Osweo]

Is there even a flow of illegal Chinese into Russia?
Lazy wiki quote;

Russia
Russia experiences a constant flow of immigration. On average, 200,000 legal immigrants enter the country every year; about half are ethnic Russians from other republics of the former Soviet Union. In addition, there are an estimated 10-12 million illegal immigrants in the country.[88]
I know some, actually. They are Russians from the Crimea! :rolleyes:

There has been a significant influx of ethnic Georgians, Armenians, Azerbaijanis, Tajiks, and Uzbeks into big Russian cities in recent years, which has been viewed very unfavorably by many citizens, and has contributed to nationalist sentiments.[89][90][91] Many immigrant ethnic groups have much higher birth rates than native Russians, further shifting the balance. Some Chinese flee the overpopulation and birth control regulations of their home country and settle in the Far East and in southern Siberia. Russia's main Pacific port and naval base of Vladivostok, once closed to foreigners, today is bristling with Chinese markets, restaurants and trade houses.[92] This has been occurring a lot since the Soviet collapse.
I was in Vladivostok a few years ago, and the only Chinese I saw were businessmen fooling about in the casinos and on a tourist boat in the harbour.

Illegal border crossing is considered a crime, and on occasions captured illegal border crossers are sentenced to a prison term. For example, Rossiyskaya Gazeta reported in October 2008 the case of a North Korean who was detained after illegally crossing the Amur River from China. Considered by Russian authorities an "economic migrant", he was sentenced to 6 months in prison, and was to be deported to the country of his nationality after serving his sentence, even though he may now risk an even heavier penalty there. That was just one of the 26 cases year-to-date of illegal entrants, of various nationalities, receiving criminal punishment in Amur Oblast.[93]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_immigration#Russia


For the UK, in comparison;

There are between 500,000 and 700,000 illegal immigrants in the United Kingdom. The United Kingdom is a difficult country to reach as it is mostly located on a single island, but traffickers in Calais, France have tried to smuggle illegal immigrants into the UK. Many of the illegal immigrants come from Africa and Asia. There are also many from Eastern Europe and Latin America who are in the UK illegally, having overstayed their visas.[71] [72]


I honestly don't know anything for sure. You hear rumours of the Chinese taking over Primorskiy Krai, but this may be as much an old fear as a real danger.

I can't be bothered reading the following, but you might;
http://www.russiablog.org/2006/10/chinas_growing_influence_in_ru.php

Visa-free travel would mean that non-Russians in Russia would have to get a decent passport. I myself had a bit of a dressing down leaving the country once, when the plastic film on the photo page of my passport was a bit damaged, so these Caucasians and Chinese who hide in their own ghettos might think twice about taking advantage of the change suggested in this thread.