Zmey Gorynych
08-17-2016, 09:29 PM
http://i1283.photobucket.com/albums/a552/ZmeyG/YDNAZ_zpsq6gfcmiw.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d4/R1a._Info-19.05.2014.jpg
http://cdn.eupedia.com/images/content/Haplogroup-R1a-M458.png
http://i1283.photobucket.com/albums/a552/ZmeyG/R1a%20M458%20Tree_zpso4ei4r0r.jpg
My path (shorter version): R1a >>> M458 > L1029 > YP263 > Y18892*
Looks like I belong to the M458 branch of R1a known as the Slavic branch (also called the Central European branch). M458 peaks in west slavs (particularly poles). The M458 has 2 large branches of its own - L260 (named the west slavic branch or the P type) and L1029 (the central European branch or the N type). L260 is a distinctive polish marker with high frequency in Poland & Czech Republic and low frequency everywhere else. L1029 is not as a clear cut polish or west-slavic marker as L260, it can be found in decent amounts among germans, russians, swedes. Actually the frequency of L1029 among germans is very high for a sub-branch of a so called slavic marker (M458). There are several markers downstream of L1029, one of them being YP263 which is part of the western cluster as opposed to YP417 (eastern cluster - the cluster of most M458 east slavs).
Here's what a R1a savvy person wrote to me about YP263:
Hello Zmey,
As for my personal view on the origin of YP263, let me quote one of my posts from the R1a project's Activity Feed page:
"YP263 seems to be one of the largest subclades under L1029 (probably second to YP417 only). Our project member Stephen Socci (who is also a member of YP263) suspects that this subclade has been associated mostly with the Northern (or South Baltic) part of the territory once occupied by the expanding Early Slavs, and he might be right about it (even though finding YP263 in Greece indicates that YP263 was also able to expand in other directions, including south). As you probably know, there is no common agreement as to the exact location of the L1029 homeland (just like there is no consensus regarding the Proto-Slavic homeland), so I can only repeat that I personally consider the "Belarusian/Ukrainian theory" most likely. Under this assumption, I would also hypothesize that the majority of the early YP263+ people were a part of the Early Slavic wave that expanded mostly north-west, ie. initially towards Mazovia (so they could have been a part of the so-called Szeligi-Haćki-Zimno horizon, usually dated to about 550-650 AD and represented by the earliest Slavic strongholds in Poland) and then moving further north-west, towards Kuyavia, Greater Poland, Pomerania and Northern Polabia (thus contributing to the Sukow-Dziedzice culture). Importantly, it seems that Mazovia encountered a secondary wave of the Early Slavic settlement (coming from the South and/or South-East and probably rich in L260, a "West-Slavic" clade that is much more common today among the people originating from SE Poland and Mazovia than among those native to Northern Poland, including Pomerania). Of course, YP263 could not have been the only Y-DNA clade involved in the suggested north-western expansion of the Early Slavs, and my scenario assumes that YP263 was also accompanied by L365, YP1018>YP1017, L1280>FGC19283, S18681 (all under Z280>CTS1211>CTS3402) and probably YP515 (a brother clade of L1029), among others."
Little is known about Y18892 except the fact that it's about 1600-1800 years old and that it's attested in Germany, Poland and Norway (info is from the same person).
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d4/R1a._Info-19.05.2014.jpg
http://cdn.eupedia.com/images/content/Haplogroup-R1a-M458.png
http://i1283.photobucket.com/albums/a552/ZmeyG/R1a%20M458%20Tree_zpso4ei4r0r.jpg
My path (shorter version): R1a >>> M458 > L1029 > YP263 > Y18892*
Looks like I belong to the M458 branch of R1a known as the Slavic branch (also called the Central European branch). M458 peaks in west slavs (particularly poles). The M458 has 2 large branches of its own - L260 (named the west slavic branch or the P type) and L1029 (the central European branch or the N type). L260 is a distinctive polish marker with high frequency in Poland & Czech Republic and low frequency everywhere else. L1029 is not as a clear cut polish or west-slavic marker as L260, it can be found in decent amounts among germans, russians, swedes. Actually the frequency of L1029 among germans is very high for a sub-branch of a so called slavic marker (M458). There are several markers downstream of L1029, one of them being YP263 which is part of the western cluster as opposed to YP417 (eastern cluster - the cluster of most M458 east slavs).
Here's what a R1a savvy person wrote to me about YP263:
Hello Zmey,
As for my personal view on the origin of YP263, let me quote one of my posts from the R1a project's Activity Feed page:
"YP263 seems to be one of the largest subclades under L1029 (probably second to YP417 only). Our project member Stephen Socci (who is also a member of YP263) suspects that this subclade has been associated mostly with the Northern (or South Baltic) part of the territory once occupied by the expanding Early Slavs, and he might be right about it (even though finding YP263 in Greece indicates that YP263 was also able to expand in other directions, including south). As you probably know, there is no common agreement as to the exact location of the L1029 homeland (just like there is no consensus regarding the Proto-Slavic homeland), so I can only repeat that I personally consider the "Belarusian/Ukrainian theory" most likely. Under this assumption, I would also hypothesize that the majority of the early YP263+ people were a part of the Early Slavic wave that expanded mostly north-west, ie. initially towards Mazovia (so they could have been a part of the so-called Szeligi-Haćki-Zimno horizon, usually dated to about 550-650 AD and represented by the earliest Slavic strongholds in Poland) and then moving further north-west, towards Kuyavia, Greater Poland, Pomerania and Northern Polabia (thus contributing to the Sukow-Dziedzice culture). Importantly, it seems that Mazovia encountered a secondary wave of the Early Slavic settlement (coming from the South and/or South-East and probably rich in L260, a "West-Slavic" clade that is much more common today among the people originating from SE Poland and Mazovia than among those native to Northern Poland, including Pomerania). Of course, YP263 could not have been the only Y-DNA clade involved in the suggested north-western expansion of the Early Slavs, and my scenario assumes that YP263 was also accompanied by L365, YP1018>YP1017, L1280>FGC19283, S18681 (all under Z280>CTS1211>CTS3402) and probably YP515 (a brother clade of L1029), among others."
Little is known about Y18892 except the fact that it's about 1600-1800 years old and that it's attested in Germany, Poland and Norway (info is from the same person).