Phenotypical representation of Messina Sicily

[Alessio]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HxP8VVH6NjY

It's Catania by the way :p

[Sikeliot]

They look somewhere between Cretans/Dodecanese (South Aegean island Greeks) with a Levant influence, and North Africans.

Very exotic set. I could honestly believe most of them as being from coastal Egypt or the Levant. Judging from DNA results from Messina they may be as outlying as Calabria is.

They are actually more exotic looking than I would have assumed, believe it or not.

[Alessio]

They look somewhere between Cretans/Dodecanese (South Aegean island Greeks) with a Levant influence, and North Africans.

Very exotic set. I could honestly believe most of them as being from coastal Egypt or the Levant. Judging from DNA results from Messina they may be as outlying as Calabria is.

They are actually more exotic looking than I would have assumed, believe it or not.

No different from some area's in Naples I've been to. However I think that Catania has more darker types on average.

[Oddone]

It's Catania by the way :p

It's Librino by the way, one of the poorest suburbs of Catania.

[wvwvw]

Typical Southern Italians imo. Massive Greek input - massive latin input and some of the stereotypical exotic types brought up from Northern Africa.

This girl looks indian to me.

https://i.snag.gy/3pfCM1.jpg

Some may be children of immigrants. Don't assume everyone is S.Italian.

[wvwvw]

It's Librino by the way, one of the poorest suburbs of Catania.

Is Catania in Sicily?

[Alessio]

It's Librino by the way, one of the poorest suburbs of Catania.

In Catania :)

[wvwvw]

I didn't assume anything. Don't assume what people are thinking.

Sorry I thought I was replying to Sikeliot

[Alessio]

Is Catania in Sicily?

Duhh

[Oddone]

Is Catania in Sicily?

Sure, it is. But it's one of the poorest suburb of Catania. If there is non-Sicilian DNA it's surely there.

[Sikeliot]

The poorest Sicilians should be darker anyway since the Norman, Lombard, etc settlers would have been intermarrying into the upper classes, not the lower classes. The poorest people are more likely to have the least amount of recent European ancestry.

[Sebastianus Rex]

It's Librino by the way, one of the poorest suburbs of Catania.

Looks like a shithole, usually those neighbourhoods are full of gypsies and low caste MENA looking social welfare parasites.

[Argentano]

It's Librino by the way, one of the poorest suburbs of Catania.

Honestly if i saw some of this people in Argentina i would think they are mixed with amerindian

The girl with glasses, the boy with glasses, the boy who says he prefers to stay at home, the fat boy with the black nike jacket.

[Sikeliot]

Looks like a shithole, usually those neighbourhoods are full of gypsies and low caste MENA looking people.

See my explanation above. The poorest Sicilians were less likely to absorb ancestry from North European rulers and settlers.

[Sikeliot]

No different from some area's in Naples I've been to. However I think that Catania has more darker types on average.

Where do you think the people pass outside of their native area in the video?

I think Calabria/Campania, Cyprus, Levant, northern Egypt. But maybe when they get older it'll change. I doubt there is much if any Gypsy ancestry in them.

[Alessio]

Compare with a suburb in Naples:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3P7a4d2E8A

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74ae-yeBpJU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcXhBfjNWOw

[Sebastianus Rex]

See my explanation above. The poorest Sicilians were less likely to absorb ancestry from North European rulers and settlers.

Not only that, social selection also produces this result on the socially lower class fringes of the population. I notice that in Portugal those kind of neighbourhoods are over represented by MENA looking types also, i believe it a transversal reality in many countries.

[crazyladybutterfly]

Looks like a shithole, usually those neighbourhoods are full of gypsies and low caste MENA looking social welfare parasites.

i would say just roma ancestry... south italy isnt like india where the northernest looking ones are the richest while the mena looking ones are socially excluded lol

[crazyladybutterfly]

Where do you think the people pass outside of their native area in the video?

I think Calabria/Campania, Cyprus, Levant, northern Egypt. But maybe when they get older it'll change. I doubt there is much if any Gypsy ancestry in them.

in my opinion it's the other way around , because richest people were more likely to marry sephardi jews. (and there are few in southern italy as well) , the neapolitan rich people are so fucking exotic that it's absurd :D i bet it's the same for sicily

also many normans were soldiers , i doubt they married only rich people but those of middle class as well . moreover people with poor grandparents often have surnames that were given to orphaned chidren in middle age , since the normans etc have been often violent at the beginning it isnt so absurd to think that the admixture of "north european blood" in the lowest class can be for rape and for prostitution as well.

if anything the poorest ones are roma admixted, since poor people are more likely to marry other poor people .. such as the romas.

[crazyladybutterfly]

Not only that, social selection also produces this result on the socially lower class fringes of the population. I notice that in Portugal those kind of neighbourhoods are over represented by MENA looking types also, i believe it a transversal reality in many countries.

they're probably part roma . before industrialization romas werent even seen as badly as they re now (i have read so on a online book about flamenco)

[Argentano]

It should be taken into account that normally extreme poverty types have a huge over representation of foreigners. For example in Argentina, if you go to a Buenos Aires slum more than 60% of the people will have Paraguayan/Bolivian/Peruvian ancestry. Its kind of unfair to use them as a representation of the country.

I dont know if that happens in south italy.

[Sebastianus Rex]

i would say just roma ancestry... south italy isnt like india where the northernest looking ones are the richest while the mena looking ones are socially excluded lol


in my opinion it's the other way around , because richest people were more likely to marry sephardi jews. (and there are few in southern italy as well) , the neapolitan rich people are so fucking exotic that it's absurd :D i bet it's the same for sicily

Don't make me laugh. The poorest circles have clearly more MENA types than the middle and upper classes in most of southern Europe.

[Sikeliot]

in my opinion it's the other way around , because richest people were more likely to marry sephardi jews. (and there are few in southern italy as well) , the neapolitan rich people are so fucking exotic that it's absurd :D i bet it's the same for sicily

if anything the poorest ones are roma admixted, since poor people are more likely to marry other poor people .. such as the romas.

Norman and Lombard ancestry should be higher in the rich, not the poor.

Anyway, there were not many Gypsies in Sicily at all.

[Sebastianus Rex]

in my opinion it's the other way around , because richest people were more likely to marry sephardi jews. (and there are few in southern italy as well) , the neapolitan rich people are so fucking exotic that it's absurd :D i bet it's the same for sicily

if anything the poorest ones are roma admixted, since poor people are more likely to marry other poor people .. such as the romas.

Rich families of Camorrista background are still counted as of lower class origin.

[Alessio]

in my opinion it's the other way around , because richest people were more likely to marry sephardi jews. (and there are few in southern italy as well) , the neapolitan rich people are so fucking exotic that it's absurd :D i bet it's the same for sicily

also many normans were soldiers , i doubt they married only rich people but those of middle class as well . moreover people with poor grandparents often have surnames that were given to orphaned chidren in middle age , since the normans etc have been often violent at the beginning it isnt so absurd to think that the admixture of "north european blood" in the lowest class can be for rape and for prostitution as well.

if anything the poorest ones are roma admixted, since poor people are more likely to marry other poor people .. such as the romas.

Rich Neapolitan people exotic?

[crazyladybutterfly]

Rich families of Camorrista background are still counted as of lower class origin.

they appeared in a tv program about funny ceremonies. i highly doubt the mafiosos would be allowed to appear on tv

[crazyladybutterfly]

Rich families of Camorrista background are still counted as of lower class origin.

they appeared in a tv program about funny ceremonies. i highly doubt the mafiosos would be allowed to appear on tv

[Sebastianus Rex]

they appeared in a tv program about funny ceremonies. i highly doubt the mafiosos would be allowed to appear on tv

Can you post some examples ?

[crazyladybutterfly]

Well it is best to start from the point of view that Sicily is one of the most exotic places genetically in Europe - and that is not from recent immigration, but immigration stretching back into prehistory.

https://i.snag.gy/t3UpyQ.jpg

yes but we're talking about why so many kids of the lowest class are so exotic. and looking at their BLACK STRAIGHT hair i wonder if they have roma ancestry., they re even more exotic than i was as a child and i am probably part black or amerindian (i have prognathism)

[crazyladybutterfly]

Can you post some examples ?

http://it.dplay.com/il-boss-delle-cerimonie/stagione-3-mariarca-e-vincenzo/ in all these videos there are many neapolitans that look exotic although they re often tanned , that makes a east med 1000 times more exotic

[Sebastianus Rex]

yes but we're talking about why so many kids of the lowest class are so exotic. and looking at their BLACK STRAIGHT hair i wonder if they have roma ancestry., they re even more exotic than i was as a child and i am probably part black or amerindian (i have prognathism)

You have Greek relatives/ancestry ? You're possibly from the same prognathic lineage of Casandrinos.

[crazyladybutterfly]

Rich Neapolitan people exotic?

yes, there are some sephardis in campania .. a friend of mine is half sephardi and lives in neaples. needless to say she is extremely exotic.

[Sebastianus Rex]

http://it.dplay.com/il-boss-delle-cerimonie/stagione-3-mariarca-e-vincenzo/ in all these videos there are many neapolitans that look exotic although they re often tanned , that makes a east med 1000 times more exotic

I can't see the video, not avaliable to show in my location.

[crazyladybutterfly]

You have Greek relatives/ancestry ? You're possibly from the same prognathic lineage of Casandrinos.

i think in the case of casandrino it's just a deformity but in my case it looks like it's the shape of my bones that gives me prognathism ( but i have deep bite as well )

[crazyladybutterfly]

I can't see the video, not avaliable to show in my location.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=il+boss+delle+cerimonie

[crazyladybutterfly]

Norman and Lombard ancestry should be higher in the rich, not the poor.

Anyway, there were not many Gypsies in Sicily at all.

only the noble one. those nobles moved in sicily without poor soldiers at all? and you're underestimating how many kids prostitutes had

[Alessio]

Rich families of Camorrista background are still counted as of lower class origin.

No, a significant amount of families came from rich families like e.g. Schiavone/Sandokan.

[Sebastianus Rex]

yes, there are some sephardis in campania .. a friend of mine is half sephardi and lives in neaples. needless to say she is extremely exotic.

They don't look upscale Neapolitans at all...that's new money there not well established middle or upper class families.

[Alessio]

I can't see the video, not avaliable to show in my location.

That program is shit.

[Oddone]

No, a significant amount of families came from rich families like e.g. Schiavone/Sandokan.

Rich family? Schiavone/Sandokan started as the driver of a boss in the 70s, he wasn't rich. Most of the Camorristi/Mafiosi are uneducated and come from the lower class. It's the simple truth.

[Sebastianus Rex]

No, a significant amount of families came from rich families like e.g. Schiavone/Sandokan.

They're Camorrists not traditional middle/upper classes.

[Alessio]

Rich family? Schiavone/Sandokan started as the driver of a boss in 70s, he wasn't rich. Most of the Camorristi/Mafiosi come from the lower class. It's the simple truth.

Look up his heritage, not recent per se.

[Sebastianus Rex]

Rich family? Schiavone/Sandokan started as the driver of a boss in 70s, he wasn't rich. Most of the Camorristi/Mafiosi come from the lower class. It's the simple truth.

That's quite evident my friend...Alessio and crazylady live on denial or are clueless about this.

[crazyladybutterfly]

They don't look upscale Neapolitans at all...that's new money there not well established middle or upper class families.

i bet even the ones of noble origin have a lot of jewish admixture.

[Sebastianus Rex]

Someone end this and show 5 men of old money from Naples, surely it can't that hard?

Good idea. I trust Oddone or Tacitus to show us, they know well their country.

[Alessio]

That's quite evident my friend...Alessio and crazylady live on denial or are clueless about this.

Well, I have read actual books. Oddone likes to read as well, and he knows much.

[crazyladybutterfly]

That's quite evident my friend...Alessio and crazylady live on denial or are clueless about this.

i am not on denial lol. many rich people are admixted with jews . it's laughable to consider them as northern as a whole

[Sikeliot]

I wish people would stop using "Gypsies' as an excuse for exotic types when Sicily has one of the smallest Gypsy populations in Europe. See here:

http://i.imgur.com/wm3OP.png

[crazyladybutterfly]

Don't make me laugh. The poorest circles have clearly more MENA types than the middle and upper classes in most of southern Europe.

so why are the lowest class iberians mena looking if iberians dont have much mena blood?

[Sebastianus Rex]

i am not on denial lol. many rich people are admixted with jews . it's laughable to consider them as northern as a whole

I din't wrote northern looking, i wrote that MENA types are over represented among the poorest sections of the population and that is not the case of the middle and upper classes.

[crazyladybutterfly]

I wish people would stop using "Gypsies' as an excuse for exotic types when Sicily has one of the smallest Gypsy populations in Europe. See here:

http://i.imgur.com/wm3OP.png

they peak on some provinces, neaples is full of them ..

[crazyladybutterfly]

I din't wrote northern looking, i wrote that MENA types are over represented among the poorest sections of the population and that is not the case of the middle and upper classes.

if the rich and middle class people are more likely to marry jews while the poorest are least likely to marry them .. then it's the richest who should be more mena looking.

[Bell Beaker]

so why are the lowest class iberians mena looking if iberians dont have much mena blood?

Crypto Gypsie blood.

Crypto-Mourisco

Crypto-Jew.


This peoples behave like immigrants, don't have money, probably never heard the word "genetic" test in their lifes.

Or do you think the Iberians tested in all these genetic tests are lower class?

Most of them are middle-upper class and middle class.

[Sebastianus Rex]

so why are the lowest class iberians mena looking if iberians dont have much mena blood?

The AVERAGE of the population doesn0t have much MENA blood but surely some people have more than others and on the worst neighbourhoods MENA types are clearly over represented.

[Oddone]

That's quite evident my friend...Alessio and crazylady live on denial or are clueless about this.

Agree. More clueless I'd say.


i bet even the ones of noble origin have a lot of jewish admixture.

Not all the Jewish are rich even today, let alone three or four centuries ago. This is just another sterotype of yours. In Milan there are some Jewish quarters. One of the Jewish quarters is called the "poor Jewish quarter", the other one "the rich Jewish quarter" (and it's a middle-class quarter, richer Milanesi live in richer quarters). I have an Ashkenazi friend who is costantly with no money and no work. The idea that all Jewish are rich because they are Jewish is a fairy tale.

[Sikeliot]

None of the people in the video look Gypsy either.

This is what Gypsies in Italy look like:

http://images.teamsugar.com/files/upl1/19/193328/20_2008/56418847.preview.jpg
http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00682/roma-children-demos_682554c.jpg
http://www.everyonegroup.com/EveryOne/MainPage/Entries/2010/5/4_Florence,_a_city_against_the_Roma_people_files/shapeimage_2.png
http://put.edidomus.it/domus/binaries/imagedata/big_250193_1300_IMAGE2_big.jpg

[Alessio]

Rich family? Schiavone/Sandokan started as the driver of a boss in the 70s, he wasn't rich. Most of the Camorristi/Mafiosi are uneducated and come from the lower class. It's the simple truth.

Definitely true that most come from the underdeveloped area's; this is where you can get easy support. I meant that some bosses have a higher class heritage of which some were very proud.

[Bell Beaker]

if the rich and middle class people are more likely to marry jews .. then it's them who should be more mena looking.

No, Jews in the Medieval ages until the XVIII/XIX century were banned from having noble titles and were very segregated.

[Bell Beaker]

The first Jews with noble titles were precisely the Rothschild.

[crazyladybutterfly]

No, Jews in the Medieval ages until the XVIII/XIX century were banned from having noble titles and were very segregated.

in fact they intermarried mostly during and after industrialization

[Oddone]

I wish people would stop using "Gypsies' as an excuse for exotic types when Sicily has one of the smallest Gypsy populations in Europe. See here:

http://i.imgur.com/wm3OP.png

Those are official stats. The Italian Gypsies who fled to Abruzzo and expanded up to all of southern Italy aren't considered and counted anymore as Gypsies in Italy.

It's in Italian (and not very accurate by the way) but if you want to pass as expert of Italian things it's time for you to learn Italian.

https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rom_abruzzesi

[Bell Beaker]

they intermarried mostly during industrialization.

Jews?

Jews were always segregated. That's why even before Hitler, they were expulsed from a thousand countries. In 1900's a lot of them went to America after the Progroms in Russia.

[MinervaItalica]

Good job by using one of the poorest zones of Sicily as representation of Catania...

[crazyladybutterfly]

Jews?

Jews were always segregated. That's why even before Hitler, they were expulsed from a thousand countries. In 1900's a lot of them went to America after the Progroms in Russia.

they werent as much segregated as you think xD i have read tons of stories on marriages between roman patricians and jews (and i think most of european nobles have patrician ancestry needless to say i am sure that the majority of patricians who married a "foreigner" married a mena rather than a noble from northern place . i have even seen a swedish king . karl and something that looked more like me than to his fellow swedes lol )
and between 1700 and up nobles and jews . anyway the nobles who were more likely to marry them were the ones who were getting poor.

[Sebastianus Rex]

they werent as much segregated as you think xD i have read tons of stories on marriages between roman patricians and jews (and i think most of european nobles have patrician ancestry , i have even seen a swedish king . karl and something that looked more like me than to his fellow swedes lol )
and between 1700 and up nobles and jews . anyway the nobles who were more likely to marry them were the ones who were getting poor.

Another nonsense, European aristocracy/monarchies were almost entirely established after the Fall of the Western Roman Empire and founded by Germanic lineages.

Jewish inflitration on aristocratic families was something quite restricted, even more in countries wich had the Inquisition, a rather marginal reality.

[Oddone]

Definitely true that most come from the underdeveloped area's; this is where you can get easy support. I meant that some bosses have a higher class heritage of which some were very proud.

Those bosses lie about that because they are ashamed of their origins. As soon they become boss and rich, they want to become like those white collars to whom they give their money for the money laundering.

[Sikeliot]

At least that video I can say they look much more Levantine than Roma.

https://nabadfordevelopment.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/dsc06318.jpg
https://hummusforthought.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/childwork.jpg
http://axisoflogic.com/artman/uploads/2/Ain_al_Helweh_children-399.jpg
http://www.un.org/News/dh/photos/large/2016/April/04-04-2016LebanSyria.jpg

[crazyladybutterfly]

At least that video I can say they look much more Levantine than Roma.

https://nabadfordevelopment.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/dsc06318.jpg
https://hummusforthought.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/childwork.jpg
http://axisoflogic.com/artman/uploads/2/Ain_al_Helweh_children-399.jpg
http://www.un.org/News/dh/photos/large/2016/April/04-04-2016LebanSyria.jpg

cute kids where have you taken these pictures?

i dont mean as 50% or even 100% roma but something like 10% that can be enough to make someone look uberexotic especially if mixed with the southernmost of europeans

[Sikeliot]

cute kids where have you taken these pictures?

Lebanon

The kids in the video look like them, nothing like Roma.

[crazyladybutterfly]

Lebanon

The kids in the video look like them, nothing like Roma.

yes but a couple would be even exotic among those kids.

[Bell Beaker]

they werent as much segregated as you think xD i have read tons of stories on marriages between roman patricians and jews (and i think most of european nobles have patrician ancestry needless to say i am sure that the majority of patricians who married a "foreigner" married a mena rather than a noble from northern place . i have even seen a swedish king . karl and something that looked more like me than to his fellow swedes lol )
and between 1700 and up nobles and jews . anyway the nobles who were more likely to marry them were the ones who were getting poor.

Look Ashkenazis have European blood, but they are still Jewish. If anything the ones who married with Jews integrated the Jewish society.

[Tooting Carmen]

Funnily enough, I visited Catania last year, and while there were some darker types, it didn't strike me as being exceptional for Mediterranean Europe, and nor do I remember the kids being as exotic as in the video. Anyway, even in the UK (though Debian/bloody especially does exaggerate it) where the population is darker than classical Northern Euros such as the Scandinavians, Northern Germans and Dutch, I have definitely over time noticed a slight class divide in this respect. Namely, the middle and esp upper classes tend to be a bit blonder and more Germanic-looking than the working classes, probably because they have more ancestry from Vikings, Saxons, Danes etc.

[Alessio]

Those are official stats. The Italian Gypsies who fled to Abruzzo and expanded up to all of southern Italy aren't considered and counted anymore as Gypsies in Italy.

It's in Italian (and not very accurate by the way) but if you want to pass as expert of Italian things it's time for you to learn Italian.

https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rom_abruzzesi

The so called ''Mafia Capitale'' were zingari and originally from Abruzzo. Some of them look proper S. Italian I noticed.

[Sikeliot]

Funnily enough, I visited Catania last year, and while there were some darker types, it didn't strike me as being exceptional for Mediterranean Europe, and nor do I remember the kids being as exotic as in the video..

As I've mentioned, Sicilians are not darker than other Med Europeans, but they do often have more exotic features.

[Alessio]

At least that video I can say they look much more Levantine than Roma.

https://nabadfordevelopment.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/dsc06318.jpg
https://hummusforthought.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/childwork.jpg
http://axisoflogic.com/artman/uploads/2/Ain_al_Helweh_children-399.jpg
http://www.un.org/News/dh/photos/large/2016/April/04-04-2016LebanSyria.jpg

Only that girl could be of partial Roma ancestry, but then still we all know that S. Italy has its exotic types and not all of them have Roma ancestry because they deviate from the average.

If there are too many 'exotic' types in one video ,,it must be due to the poorer areas being flooded with Gypsies and the likes''.

[Sikeliot]

Only that girl could be of partial Roma ancestry, but then still we all know that S. Italy has its exotic types and not all of them have Roma ancestry because they deviate from the average.

I think Palermo is somewhat more exotic than Catania if you could get photos there. There are people there with actual outlying amounts of MENA ancestry though there is an upper class elite in Palermo too who may have more Norman and Lombard.

[Alessio]

I think Palermo is somewhat more exotic than Catania if you could get photos there. There are people there with actual outlying amounts of MENA ancestry though there is an upper class elite in Palermo too who may have more Norman and Lombard.

Could be, who knows what surprises Palermo may have.

[Sikeliot]

Could be, who knows what surprises Palermo may have.

Likely some people plotting much further north in Italy and then some outliers near Moroccan Jews.

[Oddone]

Someone end this and show 5 men of old money from Naples, surely it can't be that hard?

Old money? Do you mean upper-class families?


The so called ''Mafia Capitale'' were zingari and originally from Abruzzo. Some of them look proper S. Italian I noticed.

Correct, one clan was of Gypsy ancestry but not all the clans were Gypsies. Mafia Capitale was an alliance of 4/5 criminal organizations. Trust me, very strange organization that surprised even many Italians who generally do not get easily surprised.

One criminal organization was the so called "clan dei Casamonica", and they are Gypsies and originally from Abruzzo. Another organizations was a Camorra clan from Campania. Then another organization was composed mostly of neofascists, their boss was Carminati, a neofascist born in North Italy who moved to Roma as a boy. Carminati was also the boss of the whole organization Mafia Capitale. Why the fuck the neo-fascists allied with the gypsies and the Camorra is one of the things that are hard to explain to those who do not live in Italy.

Vittorio Casamonica, boss of the Gypsies clan

http://i.imgur.com/sEgx3rr.jpg


Massimo Carminati, boss of the neofascists and boss of the entire organization called Mafia Capitale

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/it/3/38/Massimo_Carminati.png

http://www.blitzquotidiano.it/wp/wp/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/massimo_carminati_anni_80.jpg



Only that girl could be of partial Roma ancestry, but then still we all know that S. Italy has its exotic types and not all of them have Roma ancestry because they deviate from the average.

If there are too many 'exotic' types in one video ,,it must be due to the poorer areas being flooded with Gypsies and the likes''.

Those kids are Lebanese and they don't look Sicilian to me. Not a problem of dark or light types.



They look somewhere between Cretans/Dodecanese (South Aegean island Greeks) with a Levant influence, and North Africans.

Very exotic set. I could honestly believe most of them as being from coastal Egypt or the Levant. Judging from DNA results from Messina they may be as outlying as Calabria is.

They are actually more exotic looking than I would have assumed, believe it or not.

You should really go to Egypt, especially in the suburbs of Cairo or Alexandria. The average SSA admixture is so high that even the most exotic Sicilians would look to you more European-looking. Picking the most European-looking Egyptians and the most-exotic Sicilians doesn't prove anything when the average population is quite different, I have been in Egypt one month.


Don't make me laugh. The poorest circles have clearly more MENA types than the middle and upper classes in most of southern Europe.

Indeed.

[Sikeliot]

You should really go to Egypt, especially in the suburbs of Cairo or Alexandria. The average SSA admixture is so high that even the most exotic Sicilians would look to you more European-looking. Picking the most European-looking Egyptians and the most-exotic Sicilians doesn't prove anything when the average population is quite different, I have been in Egypt one month.

I have been told the SSA in Alexandria is not visible.

[Oddone]

I have been told the SSA in Alexandria is not visible.

Mmm. I haven't seen differences with Cairo.

[Myanthropologies]

A lot of them looked darker and couldn't even pass in my family. I'm guessing some are immigrants though.

[Oddone]

Yes.

New money = recently wealthy.
Old money = rich from generations back.

Ok, I got it. I'll try, not easy because I fear that most of the Old money Neapolitan families (who were often but not always of noble descent) could have left Naples to settle in north Italy or abroad.

[Sebastianus Rex]

Only that girl could be of partial Roma ancestry, but then still we all know that S. Italy has its exotic types and not all of them have Roma ancestry because they deviate from the average.

If there are too many 'exotic' types in one video ,,it must be due to the poorer areas being flooded with Gypsies and the likes''.

Those pics are from Lebanese/Syrians children.

[Alessio]

Old money? Do you mean upper-class families?



Correct, one clan was of Gypsy ancestry but not all the clans were Gypsies. Mafia Capitale was an alliance of 4/5 criminal organizations. Trust me, very strange organization that surprised even many Italians who generally do not get easily surprised.

One criminal organization was the so called "clan dei Casamonica", and they are Gypsies and originally from Abruzzo. Another organizations was a Camorra clan from Campania. Then another organization was composed mostly of neofascists, their boss was Carminati, a neofascist born in North Italy who moved to Roma as a boy. Carminati was also the boss of the whole organization Mafia Capitale. Why the fuck the neo-fascists allied with the gypsies and the Camorra is one of the things that are hard to explain to those who do not live in Italy.

Vittorio Casamonica, boss of the Gypsies clan

http://i.imgur.com/sEgx3rr.jpg


Massimo Carminati, boss of the neofascists and boss of the entire organization called Mafia Capitale

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/it/3/38/Massimo_Carminati.png

http://www.blitzquotidiano.it/wp/wp/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/massimo_carminati_anni_80.jpg




Those kids are Lebanese and they don't look Sicilian to me. Not a problem of dark or light types.




You should really go to Egypt, especially in the suburbs of Cairo or Alexandria. The average SSA admixture is so high that even the most exotic Sicilians would look to you more European-looking. Picking the most European-looking Egyptians and the most-exotic Sicilians doesn't prove anything when the average population is quite different, I have been in Egypt one month.



Indeed.

I think you misunderstood my comment to Sikeliot; it was not a reaction on the Lebanese kids, but on the video that I shared.

Indeed it were more organisations working together, with Massimo Carminati as some sort of coordinator of all the groups working together. I thought that they primarily referred to that Gypsy clan when talking about ''Mafia capitale''. I didn't find it all too interesting though, so it's due to a lack of interest on my part, however I knew that there were more parties involved.

I think there is no controversy in the fact that a criminal is a criminal regardless of his/her political background and/or position. They mostly care about profit and power - much like an everyday businessman - for me they are one and the same (serving the same purpose), in different levels of ''good and bad''. I don't care about the following of formal rules that society implies on us, but rather trying to be a good moral person that acts upon his/her moral obligations without the need of a ''moral-agent'' that the government (I don't recognize this to be authoritative regarding ethics'') has established for us.

[Alessio]

Those pics are from Lebanese/Syrians children.

It was not a reaction on the photo's.

[aherne]

They look like diversitoids.