Copt's Near East Neolithic K13 Results

[oblivion]

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 NATUFIAN 35.22
2 CHG_EEF 20.8
3 IRAN_NEOLITHIC 17.58
4 ANATOLIA_NEOLITHIC 16.32
5 SUB_SAHARAN 8.01
6 SE_ASIAN 1.62
7 SHG_WHG 0.41
8 PAPUAN 0.04

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 BedouinA 5.12
2 Egyptian 7.14
3 Palestinian 7.2
4 Jordanian 9.17
5 Jew_Libyan 10.71
6 Jew_Tunisian 11.09
7 Libyan 12.32
8 Syrian 12.35
9 Lebanese 12.42
10 Yemeni 14.09
11 Saudi 14.73
12 Druze 14.95
13 Jew_Yemenite 15.17
14 Jew_Moroccan 16.03
15 Cypriot 17.68
16 Jew_iraqi 19.32
17 Algerian 20.7
18 Moroccan 21.82
19 Jew_Iranian 22.13
20 Turkish_Adana 22.82

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 59.3% Libyan + 40.7% Cypriot @ 2.96
2 62.3% Egyptian + 37.7% Jew_Tunisian @ 3.1
3 92.7% BedouinA + 7.3% Stuttgart @ 3.11
4 55.1% Libyan + 44.9% Druze @ 3.25
5 72.7% BedouinA + 27.3% Jew_Libyan @ 3.43
6 91.7% BedouinA + 8.3% Sardinian @ 3.44
7 73.8% BedouinA + 26.2% Jew_Tunisian @ 3.5
8 62% Egyptian + 38% Jew_Libyan @ 3.58
9 76.7% Palestinian + 23.3% Algerian @ 3.68
10 95.6% BedouinA + 4.4% Europe_EN @ 3.7
11 73.9% Egyptian + 26.1% Cypriot @ 3.72
12 50.2% Libyan + 49.8% Lebanese @ 3.75
13 96% BedouinA + 4% Anatolia_N @ 3.76
14 80% Palestinian + 20% Saharawi @ 3.79
15 63% Druze + 37% Saharawi @ 3.89
16 95.5% BedouinA + 4.5% Europe_MNChL @ 3.99
17 56.6% Jew_Tunisian + 43.4% Yemeni @ 4
18 92.9% BedouinA + 7.1% Levant_N @ 4
19 61.9% Libyan + 38.1% Jew_iraqi @ 4.13
20 66.5% Palestinian + 33.5% Libyan @ 4.21


Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Druze +50% Libyan @ 3.694484


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% BedouinA +25% Jew_Tunisian +25% Libyan @ 2.579927


Using 4 populations approximation:
1 Druze + Jew_Tunisian + Libyan + Libyan @ 2.236040
2 Jew_iraqi + Jew_Tunisian + Saharawi + Saudi @ 2.257945
3 Jew_iraqi + Jew_Tunisian + Libyan + Libyan @ 2.301840
4 BedouinA + Jew_Tunisian + Libyan + Palestinian @ 2.356502
5 Jew_iraqi + Jew_Tunisian + Jew_Yemenite + Saharawi @ 2.372715
6 Algerian + BedouinA + Cypriot + Jew_Yemenite @ 2.423052
7 Jew_iraqi + Jew_Libyan + Libyan + Libyan @ 2.458825
8 Cypriot + Libyan + Libyan + Palestinian @ 2.485890
9 Druze + Jew_Libyan + Libyan + Libyan @ 2.487565
10 Cypriot + Jew_Yemenite + Jordanian + Saharawi @ 2.490916
11 Jew_iraqi + Jew_Libyan + Saharawi + Saudi @ 2.502137
12 Druze + Jew_Tunisian + Jew_Yemenite + Moroccan @ 2.518095
13 Algerian + Cypriot + Jew_Yemenite + Palestinian @ 2.519897
14 Cypriot + Jordanian + Saharawi + Saudi @ 2.527536
15 Cypriot + Lebanese + Saharawi + Saudi @ 2.538497
16 BedouinA + Jew_Libyan + Libyan + Palestinian @ 2.545199
17 BedouinA + BedouinA + Jew_Tunisian + Libyan @ 2.579927
18 Jew_iraqi + Jew_Libyan + Jew_Yemenite + Saharawi @ 2.583795
19 Cypriot + Jew_Yemenite + Lebanese + Saharawi @ 2.600007
20 Cypriot + Moroccan + Palestinian + Saudi @ 2.605683

[oblivion]

It looks like a copt is basically 60% egyptian and the rest is levantine.

[oblivion]

These are when I add in a coptic reference sample:

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Egyptian_copt @ 2.553831
2 BedouinA @ 5.531731
3 Egyptian @ 7.102025
4 Palestinian @ 7.579343
5 Jordanian @ 9.795496
6 Jew_Libyan @ 11.14695
7 Jew_Tunisian @ 11.485301
8 Libyan @ 12.448845
9 Lebanese @ 12.996097
10 Syrian @ 13.127326
11 Yemeni @ 14.701466
12 Saudi @ 15.249781
13 Druze @ 15.384133
14 Jew_Yemenite @ 15.755295
15 Jew_Moroccan @ 16.711168
16 Cypriot @ 18.258377
17 Jew_iraqi @ 20.082989
18 Algerian @ 20.724307
19 Moroccan @ 21.376377
20 Jew_Iranian @ 23.143772
145 iterations.

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 Egyptian_copt+Egyptian_copt @ 2.553831
2 BedouinA+Egyptian_copt @ 3.547057
3 Druze+Libyan @ 3.834907
4 Lebanese+Libyan @ 4.043854
5 Egyptian+Egyptian_copt @ 4.130684
6 Egyptian+Jew_Tunisian @ 4.145697
7 Cypriot+Libyan @ 4.397147
8 Egyptian+Jew_Libyan @ 4.489073
9 Egyptian_copt+Palestinian @ 4.632145
10 Jew_Tunisian+Libyan @ 4.761802
11 Jew_Tunisian+Yemeni @ 4.778246
12 Egyptian+Palestinian @ 4.937368
13 BedouinA+Jew_Libyan @ 4.967986
14 Jordanian+Libyan @ 4.969166
15 BedouinA+Jew_Tunisian @ 5.121143
16 Jew_Libyan+Yemeni @ 5.219741
17 Jew_iraqi+Saharawi @ 5.314313
18 Libyan+Palestinian @ 5.373356
19 Libyan+Syrian @ 5.40371
20 Jew_Libyan+Libyan @ 5.417202
10585 iterations.

Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Libyan +25% Druze +25% Jew_Tunisian @ 2.506461
2 50% Egyptian_copt +25% Jew_Tunisian +25% Libyan @ 2.5447
3 50% Libyan +25% Jew_iraqi +25% Jew_Tunisian @ 2.567294
4 50% Egyptian_copt +25% Egyptian +25% Jew_Tunisian @ 2.603494
5 50% Libyan +25% Cypriot +25% Palestinian @ 2.72744
6 50% Egyptian_copt +25% Druze +25% Libyan @ 2.759762
7 50% Libyan +25% Jew_iraqi +25% Jew_Libyan @ 2.768445
8 50% Libyan +25% Druze +25% Jew_Libyan @ 2.792191
9 50% Egyptian_copt +25% Egyptian +25% Jew_Libyan @ 2.797275
10 50% BedouinA +25% Jew_Tunisian +25% Libyan @ 2.80271
11 50% Egyptian_copt +25% BedouinA +25% Egyptian_copt @ 2.838481
12 50% Egyptian_copt +25% Cypriot +25% Libyan @ 2.851793
13 50% Egyptian +25% Egyptian_copt +25% Jew_Tunisian @ 2.862244
14 50% Egyptian_copt +25% Jew_Libyan +25% Libyan @ 2.906656
15 50% Egyptian_copt +25% Egyptian +25% Egyptian_copt @ 2.989622
16 50% Palestinian +25% Jew_Tunisian +25% Libyan @ 3.010856
17 50% Egyptian_copt +25% Lebanese +25% Libyan @ 3.012805
18 50% Egyptian_copt +25% BedouinA +25% Jew_Libyan @ 3.032555
19 50% Egyptian +25% Jew_Moroccan +25% Saudi @ 3.043101
20 50% Egyptian_copt +25% BedouinA +25% Jew_Tunisian @ 3.045878
605674 iterations.

Using 4 populations approximation:
1 Egyptian_copt+Jew_Tunisian+Libyan+Palestinian @ 2.266827
2 BedouinA+Egyptian_copt+Jew_Tunisian+Libyan @ 2.381277
3 Algerian+Cypriot+Egyptian_copt+Jew_Yemenite @ 2.404283
4 Druze+Jew_Tunisian+Libyan+Libyan @ 2.506461
5 Egyptian_copt+Jew_Libyan+Libyan+Palestinian @ 2.523637
6 Egyptian_copt+Egyptian_copt+Jew_Tunisian+Libyan @ 2.5447
7 Egyptian_copt+Egyptian_copt+Egyptian_copt+Egyptian _copt @ 2.553831
8 Jew_iraqi+Jew_Tunisian+Saharawi+Saudi @ 2.558962
9 Jew_iraqi+Jew_Tunisian+Libyan+Libyan @ 2.567294
10 BedouinA+Egyptian+Egyptian_copt+Jew_Tunisian @ 2.597665
11 Egyptian+Egyptian_copt+Egyptian_copt+Jew_Tunisian @ 2.603494
12 BedouinA+Jew_Tunisian+Libyan+Palestinian @ 2.63594
13 Cypriot+Egyptian_copt+Moroccan+Saudi @ 2.670283
14 Algerian+Cypriot+Egyptian_copt+Saudi @ 2.676245
15 Jew_iraqi+Jew_Tunisian+Jew_Yemenite+Saharawi @ 2.6868
16 Algerian+BedouinA+Cypriot+Jew_Yemenite @ 2.716546
17 Cypriot+Libyan+Libyan+Palestinian @ 2.72744
18 BedouinA+Egyptian_copt+Jew_Libyan+Libyan @ 2.753774
19 Druze+Egyptian_copt+Egyptian_copt+Libyan @ 2.759762
20 Cypriot+Egyptian_copt+Jew_Yemenite+Moroccan @ 2.76798
21 Jew_iraqi+Jew_Libyan+Libyan+Libyan @ 2.768445
22 BedouinA+Egyptian+Egyptian_copt+Jew_Libyan @ 2.781019
23 Egyptian+Egyptian_copt+Jew_Moroccan+Saudi @ 2.784387
24 Druze+Jew_Libyan+Libyan+Libyan @ 2.792191
25 Cypriot+Jew_Yemenite+Jordanian+Saharawi @ 2.794983
26 Egyptian+Egyptian_copt+Egyptian_copt+Jew_Libyan @ 2.797275
27 BedouinA+BedouinA+Jew_Tunisian+Libyan @ 2.80271
28 Egyptian_copt+Jew_Tunisian+Jordanian+Libyan @ 2.824267
29 Algerian+Cypriot+Jew_Yemenite+Palestinian @ 2.825454
30 Cypriot+Jordanian+Saharawi+Saudi @ 2.828386
31 Jew_iraqi+Jew_Libyan+Saharawi+Saudi @ 2.835543
32 Cypriot+Lebanese+Saharawi+Saudi @ 2.83743
33 BedouinA+Egyptian_copt+Egyptian_copt+Egyptian_copt @ 2.838481
34 Egyptian_copt+Saharawi+Saudi+Turkish_Trabzon @ 2.841211
35 Cypriot+Egyptian+Egyptian_copt+Libyan @ 2.844916
36 BedouinA+Jew_Libyan+Libyan+Palestinian @ 2.84922
37 Cypriot+Egyptian_copt+Egyptian_copt+Libyan @ 2.851793
38 BedouinA+Cypriot+Egyptian_copt+Libyan @ 2.853062
39 Egyptian+Egyptian+Egyptian_copt+Jew_Tunisian @ 2.862244
40 Egyptian_copt+Jew_Moroccan+Libyan+Saudi @ 2.886692
1218103 iterations.

[Maguzanci]

Interesting. Can you post any other gedmatch results like ANE K6, West Eurasia K8 or Steppe K10 if you don't mind?

[oblivion]

Interesting. Can you post any other gedmatch results like ANE K6, West Eurasia K8 or Steppe K10 if you don't mind?

I don't see those tests on gedmatch.. how do I do those? Can I send you my data and you do it for me?

[Kamal900]

They seem to cluster the closest to other Egyptians, Southern Levantines and Northern Bedouin peoples than to other North Africans. Nice results.:thumb001:

[gültekin]

I don't see those tests on gedmatch.. how do I do those? Can I send you my data and you do it for me?
Never send your data to someone. Those tests which he ask is not availeble at gedmach. Just Google about it you Will find

[Petalpusher]

K6 ANE is under Gedrosia, she can try it on Gedmatch. SteppeK10 is a DIY.

[oblivion]

K6 ANE is under Gedrosia, she can try it on Gedmatch. SteppeK10 is a DIY.

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Natufian 55.15
2 West_European_Hunter_Gartherer 15.73
3 Ancestral_North_Eurasian 15.03
4 Sub_Saharan 11.36
5 East_Asian 1.52
6 Ancestral_South_Eurasian 1.22

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 BedouinA 6.18
2 Egyptian 7.35
3 Palestinian 7.69
4 Jordanian 8.34
5 Saudi 8.72
6 Jew_Yemenite 9.37
7 Jew_Tunisian 9.6
8 Jew_Libyan 9.89
9 Libyan 9.93
10 Lebanese 9.99
11 Syrian 10.71
12 Levant_BA 11.9
13 Jew_Moroccan 11.91
14 Druze 13.2
15 Yemeni 13.23
16 Cypriot 13.44
17 Jew_Ashkenazi 15.98
18 Jew_iraqi 17.99
19 Sicilian 18.1
20 Turkish 18.16

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 54.6% Libyan + 45.4% Levant_BA @ 1.47
2 65% Levant_BA + 35% Moroccan @ 1.6
3 69.8% Saudi + 30.2% Algerian @ 1.97
4 62.6% Levant_BA + 37.4% Algerian @ 2
5 68.3% Jew_Yemenite + 31.7% Algerian @ 2.13
6 71.9% Saudi + 28.1% Saharawi @ 2.14
7 70.5% Jew_Yemenite + 29.5% Saharawi @ 2.58
8 63.1% Egyptian + 36.9% Levant_BA @ 2.89
9 65.1% Levant_BA + 34.9% Saharawi @ 2.9
10 72.6% Saudi + 27.4% Moroccan @ 2.92
11 53.6% Saudi + 46.4% Libyan @ 3.05
12 71.1% Jew_Yemenite + 28.9% Moroccan @ 3.17
13 51.6% Jew_Yemenite + 48.4% Libyan @ 3.28
14 84.4% BedouinA + 15.6% Anatolia_N @ 3.53
15 58.5% Libyan + 41.5% Cypriot @ 3.93
16 68.5% Yemeni + 31.5% Anatolia_N @ 4.04
17 87.5% BedouinA + 12.5% Europe_EN @ 4.1
18 81.8% Egyptian + 18.2% Anatolia_N @ 4.11
19 89.3% Levant_BA + 10.7% Mota @ 4.16
20 76.8% Palestinian + 23.2% Saharawi @ 4.2


Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Levant_BA +50% Libyan @ 1.772285


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Levant_BA +25% Libyan +25% Libyan @ 1.772285


Using 4 populations approximation:
1 Algerian + Egyptian + Levant_BA + Levant_BA @ 1.063067
2 Algerian + BedouinA + Levant_BA + Levant_BA @ 1.406837
3 Anatolia_N + Jew_Yemenite + Yemeni + Yemeni @ 1.411981
4 BedouinA + Levant_BA + Levant_BA + Moroccan @ 1.498652
5 BedouinA + Levant_BA + Levant_BA + Saharawi @ 1.531816
6 Jordanian + Levant_BA + Levant_BA + Saharawi @ 1.592438
7 Anatolia_N + Saudi + Yemeni + Yemeni @ 1.646890
8 Algerian + BedouinA + Levant_BA + Saudi @ 1.649951
9 Jordanian + Levant_BA + Saharawi + Saudi @ 1.663532
10 Jew_Tunisian + Jew_Yemenite + Levant_BA + Saharawi @ 1.678842
11 BedouinA + Levant_BA + Saharawi + Saudi @ 1.688128
12 Levant_BA + Palestinian + Saharawi + Saudi @ 1.696607
13 Jew_Tunisian + Levant_BA + Saharawi + Saudi @ 1.696658
14 Jew_Tunisian + Jew_Yemenite + Jew_Yemenite + Saharawi @ 1.720538
15 Egyptian + Levant_BA + Levant_BA + Moroccan @ 1.724707
16 Algerian + BedouinA + Jew_Yemenite + Levant_BA @ 1.735804
17 Jew_Tunisian + Levant_BA + Libyan + Libyan @ 1.762515
18 Levant_BA + Levant_BA + Libyan + Libyan @ 1.772285
19 Jew_Yemenite + Jordanian + Levant_BA + Saharawi @ 1.773337
20 Jew_Tunisian + Jew_Yemenite + Saharawi + Saudi @ 1.781747

Done.

[oblivion]

They seem to cluster the closest to other Egyptians, Southern Levantines and Northern Bedouin peoples than to other North Africans. Nice results.:thumb001:

I think a copt is basically a 60% egyptian and 40% levantine.. it seems..which seems to come out as bedouin as my top match in this calculators.

[oblivion]

Interesting. Can you post any other gedmatch results like ANE K6, West Eurasia K8 or Steppe K10 if you don't mind?

I posted the ane k6... where is west eurasia k8 and steppe k10?

[Petalpusher]

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Natufian 55.15
2 West_European_Hunter_Gartherer 15.73
3 Ancestral_North_Eurasian 15.03
4 Sub_Saharan 11.36
5 East_Asian 1.52
6 Ancestral_South_Eurasian 1.22

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 BedouinA 6.18
2 Egyptian 7.35
3 Palestinian 7.69
4 Jordanian 8.34
5 Saudi 8.72
6 Jew_Yemenite 9.37
7 Jew_Tunisian 9.6
8 Jew_Libyan 9.89
9 Libyan 9.93
10 Lebanese 9.99
11 Syrian 10.71
12 Levant_BA 11.9
13 Jew_Moroccan 11.91
14 Druze 13.2
15 Yemeni 13.23
16 Cypriot 13.44
17 Jew_Ashkenazi 15.98
18 Jew_iraqi 17.99
19 Sicilian 18.1
20 Turkish 18.16

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 54.6% Libyan + 45.4% Levant_BA @ 1.47
2 65% Levant_BA + 35% Moroccan @ 1.6
3 69.8% Saudi + 30.2% Algerian @ 1.97
4 62.6% Levant_BA + 37.4% Algerian @ 2
5 68.3% Jew_Yemenite + 31.7% Algerian @ 2.13
6 71.9% Saudi + 28.1% Saharawi @ 2.14
7 70.5% Jew_Yemenite + 29.5% Saharawi @ 2.58
8 63.1% Egyptian + 36.9% Levant_BA @ 2.89
9 65.1% Levant_BA + 34.9% Saharawi @ 2.9
10 72.6% Saudi + 27.4% Moroccan @ 2.92
11 53.6% Saudi + 46.4% Libyan @ 3.05
12 71.1% Jew_Yemenite + 28.9% Moroccan @ 3.17
13 51.6% Jew_Yemenite + 48.4% Libyan @ 3.28
14 84.4% BedouinA + 15.6% Anatolia_N @ 3.53
15 58.5% Libyan + 41.5% Cypriot @ 3.93
16 68.5% Yemeni + 31.5% Anatolia_N @ 4.04
17 87.5% BedouinA + 12.5% Europe_EN @ 4.1
18 81.8% Egyptian + 18.2% Anatolia_N @ 4.11
19 89.3% Levant_BA + 10.7% Mota @ 4.16
20 76.8% Palestinian + 23.2% Saharawi @ 4.2


Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Levant_BA +50% Libyan @ 1.772285


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Levant_BA +25% Libyan +25% Libyan @ 1.772285


Using 4 populations approximation:
1 Algerian + Egyptian + Levant_BA + Levant_BA @ 1.063067
2 Algerian + BedouinA + Levant_BA + Levant_BA @ 1.406837
3 Anatolia_N + Jew_Yemenite + Yemeni + Yemeni @ 1.411981
4 BedouinA + Levant_BA + Levant_BA + Moroccan @ 1.498652
5 BedouinA + Levant_BA + Levant_BA + Saharawi @ 1.531816
6 Jordanian + Levant_BA + Levant_BA + Saharawi @ 1.592438
7 Anatolia_N + Saudi + Yemeni + Yemeni @ 1.646890
8 Algerian + BedouinA + Levant_BA + Saudi @ 1.649951
9 Jordanian + Levant_BA + Saharawi + Saudi @ 1.663532
10 Jew_Tunisian + Jew_Yemenite + Levant_BA + Saharawi @ 1.678842
11 BedouinA + Levant_BA + Saharawi + Saudi @ 1.688128
12 Levant_BA + Palestinian + Saharawi + Saudi @ 1.696607
13 Jew_Tunisian + Levant_BA + Saharawi + Saudi @ 1.696658
14 Jew_Tunisian + Jew_Yemenite + Jew_Yemenite + Saharawi @ 1.720538
15 Egyptian + Levant_BA + Levant_BA + Moroccan @ 1.724707
16 Algerian + BedouinA + Jew_Yemenite + Levant_BA @ 1.735804
17 Jew_Tunisian + Levant_BA + Libyan + Libyan @ 1.762515
18 Levant_BA + Levant_BA + Libyan + Libyan @ 1.772285
19 Jew_Yemenite + Jordanian + Levant_BA + Saharawi @ 1.773337
20 Jew_Tunisian + Jew_Yemenite + Saharawi + Saudi @ 1.781747

Done.

I think this is very accurate, of course there s no Copt sample but your point is above Egyptian in the direction of Levantines, where copts should be.

K10 is a DIY you should be able to run calculators on your own : http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?177271-Tutorial-for-autosomal-calculators
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?170036-Post-your-Steppe-K10-results


K8 was done on request by Eurogenes, don't think you can have it anymore, it's somewhat outdated anyway.

[oblivion]

I think this is very accurate, of course there s no Copt sample but your point is above Egyptian in the direction of Levantines, where copts should be.

K10 is a DIY you should be able to run calculators on your own : http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?177271-Tutorial-for-autosomal-calculators
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?170036-Post-your-Steppe-K10-results


K8 was done on request by Eurogenes, don't think you can have it anymore, it's somewhat outdated anyway.

How did you calculate my point?

[Petalpusher]

How did you calculate my point?

I did just mentally looking at a pca, it works the same with K15 since everybody is used to it

You look at the mix mode and you imagine a line 70% towards Saudi, you ll find your point, using for example "69.8% Saudi + 30.2% Algerian @ 1.97" It's not your first fit but still good one with the samples that are included in K15

https://s14.postimg.org/tieod6y73/K15_V3_NEafrica.jpg

[oblivion]

I did just mentally looking at a pca, it works the same with K15 since everybody is used to it

You look at the mix mode and you imagine a line 70% towards Saudi, you ll find your point, using for example "69.8% Saudi + 30.2% Algerian @ 1.97" It's not your first fit but still good one with the samples that are included in K15

https://s14.postimg.org/tieod6y73/K15_V3_NEafrica.jpg

So since copts represent egyptians pre islam.. we were less african and more near eastern...

[PunhetaDeBacalhau]

I did just mentally looking at a pca, it works the same with K15 since everybody is used to it

You look at the mix mode and you imagine a line 70% towards Saudi, you ll find your point, using for example "69.8% Saudi + 30.2% Algerian @ 1.97" It's not your first fit but still good one with the samples that are included in K15

https://s14.postimg.org/tieod6y73/K15_V3_NEafrica.jpg

How come North Sea is so western in that PCA? In most maps Iberians appear as the most "western" after Basques and Sardinians, but since North Sea is so western in that map and Baltic is also half-western and half-eastern instead on mostly eastern, even Norwegians and Danes that have a lot of Eastern European genetics appear as more western than Iberians. I suppose the distance between components on the map is calculated using fst, but how do they decide where the components start on the map?

[oblivion]

Interesting. Can you post any other gedmatch results like ANE K6, West Eurasia K8 or Steppe K10 if you don't mind?

Steppe K10 ADMIXTURE Proportions.

68.57% Near_Eastern
2.19% East_Asian
0.19% Siberian
0.26% Oceanian
2.43% WHG-UHG
10.89% Sub-Saharan
12.22% Hindu_Kush
3.23% Steppe
0.00% Amerindian
0.02% Southeast_Asian

Waiting for the west eurasia results..will post shortly.

[Profileid]

Copts aren't a separate ethnic group. They're just Egyptian.

[oblivion]

Copts aren't a separate ethnic group. They're just Egyptian.

Not according to genetics... copts are slightly different genetically.. we lack west african dna and have a more near eastern profile than our muslim brothers..

[Profileid]

Not according to genetics... copts are slightly different genetically.. we lack west african dna and have a more near eastern profile than our muslim brothers..

Slight genetic differences can be attributed to differences between regions. A Muslim Egyptian living in Cairo is going to have less SSA than a Muslim Egyptian living in Aswan.
Furthermore, slight genetic differences do not mean they're a separate ethnic group.

[oblivion]

Turkic K11

28.07% SE_European
61.48% W_Asian
0.00% SE_Asian
10.03% SSA
0.00% NE_European
0.00% Indian
0.42% NW_European
0.00% Turkic
0.00% Mongol
0.00% Papuan
0.00% NE_Asian

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Egyptian @ 6.010771
2 Libyan @ 8.140937
3 Druze @ 12.989977
4 Arabs_Israel @ 15.006335
5 BedouinA @ 15.141324
6 Cypriot @ 16.790792
7 Jordanians @ 17.145664
8 Turkish_Adana @ 18.535581
9 Jew_Libyan @ 18.689052
10 Turkish_Kayseri @ 25.926109
11 Jew_iraqi @ 26.105292
12 Assyrians @ 28.562986
13 Jew_Ashkenazi @ 30.339206
14 Kurd_N @ 34.346566
15 Iranian @ 36.07309
16 Kurd_C @ 36.163424
17 North-Ossetians @ 36.521448
18 Azerbaijanis @ 36.87056
19 Kurd_F @ 36.932725
20 Tunisian @ 36.98327
145 iterations.

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 Druze+Libyan @ 3.951191
2 BedouinA+Jew_Libyan @ 5.005806
3 Cypriot+Egyptian @ 5.540379
4 Arabs_Israel+Libyan @ 5.590799
5 Jew_iraqi+Tunisian @ 5.897774
6 Egyptian+Egyptian @ 6.010771
7 Egyptian+Libyan @ 6.33862
8 Armenian+Tunisian @ 6.44615
9 Saudi+Tunisian @ 6.44615
10 Tunisian+Yemeni @ 6.44615
11 BedouinA+Cypriot @ 6.483052
12 Armenian+Moroccan @ 6.606652
13 Moroccan+Saudi @ 6.606652
14 Moroccan+Yemeni @ 6.606652
15 Jew_Libyan+Jordanians @ 6.750978
16 Druze+Egyptian @ 6.943283
17 Cypriot+Libyan @ 7.043261
18 Egyptian+Jew_Libyan @ 7.225125
19 Jordanians+Libyan @ 7.672303
20 Libyan+Turkish_Adana @ 7.686014
10585 iterations.

Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Egyptian +25% Cypriot +25% Egyptian @ 1.152837
2 50% Libyan +25% BedouinA +25% Cypriot @ 1.456818
3 50% Libyan +25% Cypriot +25% Jordanians @ 1.502763
4 50% Arabs_Israel +25% BedouinA +25% Moroccan @ 1.648747
5 50% Libyan +25% Arabs_Israel +25% Cypriot @ 1.671442
6 50% Tunisian +25% Armenian +25% Jew_iraqi @ 1.681212
7 50% Tunisian +25% Jew_iraqi +25% Saudi @ 1.681212
8 50% Tunisian +25% Jew_iraqi +25% Yemeni @ 1.681212
9 50% BedouinA +25% Druze +25% Tunisian @ 1.820443
10 50% Arabs_Israel +25% Jordanians +25% Moroccan @ 1.893214
11 50% Arabs_Israel +25% Egyptian +25% Tunisian @ 2.072206
12 50% Egyptian +25% Cypriot +25% Libyan @ 2.076811
13 50% Armenian +25% Algerian +25% Tunisian @ 2.195504
14 50% Saudi +25% Algerian +25% Tunisian @ 2.195504
15 50% Yemeni +25% Algerian +25% Tunisian @ 2.195504
16 50% Arabs_Israel +25% Arabs_Israel +25% Moroccan @ 2.201039
17 50% Arabs_Israel +25% BedouinA +25% Tunisian @ 2.229446
18 50% Jordanians +25% Druze +25% Moroccan @ 2.303762
19 50% BedouinA +25% Arabs_Israel +25% Tunisian @ 2.451872
20 50% Jordanians +25% Egyptian +25% Tunisian @ 2.457755
285300 iterations.

Using 4 populations approximation:
1 Armenian+Cypriot+Libyan+Tunisian @ 0.960457
2 Cypriot+Libyan+Saudi+Tunisian @ 0.960457
3 Cypriot+Libyan+Tunisian+Yemeni @ 0.960457
4 Armenian+Cypriot+Egyptian+Moroccan @ 1.065878
5 Cypriot+Egyptian+Moroccan+Saudi @ 1.065878
6 Cypriot+Egyptian+Moroccan+Yemeni @ 1.065878
7 Algerian+Arabs_Israel+Armenian+Egyptian @ 1.072002
8 Algerian+Arabs_Israel+Egyptian+Saudi @ 1.072002
9 Algerian+Arabs_Israel+Egyptian+Yemeni @ 1.072002
10 Cypriot+Egyptian+Egyptian+Egyptian @ 1.152837
11 Algerian+Armenian+Egyptian+Jordanians @ 1.17605
12 Algerian+Egyptian+Jordanians+Saudi @ 1.17605
13 Algerian+Egyptian+Jordanians+Yemeni @ 1.17605
14 Algerian+Armenian+Jew_iraqi+Libyan @ 1.295648
15 Algerian+Jew_iraqi+Libyan+Saudi @ 1.295648
16 Algerian+Jew_iraqi+Libyan+Yemeni @ 1.295648
17 BedouinA+Cypriot+Libyan+Libyan @ 1.456818
18 Cypriot+Jordanians+Libyan+Libyan @ 1.502763
19 Arabs_Israel+Jew_iraqi+Libyan+Tunisian @ 1.527384
20 Arabs_Israel+Arabs_Israel+BedouinA+Moroccan @ 1.648747
21 Arabs_Israel+Cypriot+Libyan+Libyan @ 1.671442
22 Armenian+Jew_iraqi+Tunisian+Tunisian @ 1.681212
23 Jew_iraqi+Saudi+Tunisian+Tunisian @ 1.681212
24 Jew_iraqi+Tunisian+Tunisian+Yemeni @ 1.681212
25 Arabs_Israel+BedouinA+Druze+Moroccan @ 1.717691
26 Arabs_Israel+Egyptian+Jordanians+Tunisian @ 1.785668
27 Armenian+Cypriot+Libyan+Moroccan @ 1.818885
28 Cypriot+Libyan+Moroccan+Saudi @ 1.818885
29 Cypriot+Libyan+Moroccan+Yemeni @ 1.818885
30 BedouinA+BedouinA+Druze+Tunisian @ 1.820443
31 BedouinA+Cypriot+Egyptian+Libyan @ 1.841751
32 Arabs_Israel+Arabs_Israel+Jordanians+Moroccan @ 1.893214
33 Algerian+Armenian+BedouinA+Egyptian @ 1.946667
34 Algerian+BedouinA+Egyptian+Saudi @ 1.946667
35 Algerian+BedouinA+Egyptian+Yemeni @ 1.946667
36 Druze+Egyptian+Jew_iraqi+Tunisian @ 1.96796
37 Armenian+Egyptian+Jew_Libyan+Tunisian @ 1.984802
38 Egyptian+Jew_Libyan+Saudi+Tunisian @ 1.984802
39 Egyptian+Jew_Libyan+Tunisian+Yemeni @ 1.984802
40 Armenian+Cypriot+Egyptian+Tunisian @ 2.002485
147911 iterations.


Gaussian method.
Noise dispersion set to 0.459692

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Egyptian @ 2.976417
2 Libyan @ 3.075051
3 BedouinA @ 4.631492
4 Jordanians @ 5.818998
5 Jew_Libyan @ 5.910621
6 Arabs_Israel @ 6.650005
7 Tunisian @ 8.003449
8 Moroccan @ 9.131557
9 Druze @ 9.638793
10 Jew_Ashkenazi @ 10.674914
11 Sicilian @ 11.371064
12 Greek @ 15.939192
13 Italian_South @ 17.861161
14 Cypriot @ 18.711695
15 Turkish_Adana @ 18.938891
16 Jew_iraqi @ 19.401164
17 Turkish_Kayseri @ 19.753719
18 Algerian @ 19.787566
19 Assyrians @ 19.972504
20 Turkish_Balikesir @ 21.016064
145 iterations.

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 Armenian+Moroccan @ 2.30154
2 Moroccan+Saudi @ 2.30154
3 Moroccan+Yemeni @ 2.30154
4 Armenian+Tunisian @ 2.491237
5 Saudi+Tunisian @ 2.491237
6 Tunisian+Yemeni @ 2.491237
7 Algerian+Armenian @ 2.830077
8 Algerian+Saudi @ 2.830077
9 Algerian+Yemeni @ 2.830077
10 Egyptian+Egyptian @ 2.976417
11 Egyptian+Libyan @ 2.99207
12 Libyan+Libyan @ 3.075051
13 BedouinA+Libyan @ 3.313847
14 Arabs_Israel+Libyan @ 3.375621
15 Cypriot+Libyan @ 3.420451
16 Cypriot+Egyptian @ 3.568963
17 Jew_iraqi+Tunisian @ 3.592255
18 Druze+Libyan @ 3.615229
19 BedouinA+Egyptian @ 3.643896
20 Jew_iraqi+Moroccan @ 3.689309
10585 iterations.

Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Armenian +25% Algerian +25% Moroccan @ 1.998923
2 50% Saudi +25% Algerian +25% Moroccan @ 1.998923
3 50% Yemeni +25% Algerian +25% Moroccan @ 1.998923
4 50% Armenian +25% Algerian +25% Tunisian @ 2.029228
5 50% Saudi +25% Algerian +25% Tunisian @ 2.029228
6 50% Yemeni +25% Algerian +25% Tunisian @ 2.029228
7 50% Armenian +25% Albanians +25% Somali @ 2.084958
8 50% Armenian +25% Kosovo +25% Somali @ 2.084958
9 50% Armenian +25% Somali +25% Stuttgart @ 2.084958
10 50% Saudi +25% Albanians +25% Somali @ 2.084958
11 50% Saudi +25% Kosovo +25% Somali @ 2.084958
12 50% Saudi +25% Somali +25% Stuttgart @ 2.084958
13 50% Yemeni +25% Albanians +25% Somali @ 2.084958
14 50% Yemeni +25% Kosovo +25% Somali @ 2.084958
15 50% Yemeni +25% Somali +25% Stuttgart @ 2.084958
16 50% Armenian +25% Algerian +25% Libyan @ 2.288282
17 50% Saudi +25% Algerian +25% Libyan @ 2.288282
18 50% Yemeni +25% Algerian +25% Libyan @ 2.288282
19 50% Armenian +25% Moroccan +25% Moroccan @ 2.30154
20 50% Moroccan +25% Armenian +25% Saudi @ 2.30154
374272 iterations.

Using 4 populations approximation:
1 Algerian+Armenian+Armenian+Moroccan @ 1.998923
2 Algerian+Armenian+Moroccan+Saudi @ 1.998923
3 Algerian+Armenian+Moroccan+Yemeni @ 1.998923
4 Algerian+Moroccan+Saudi+Saudi @ 1.998923
5 Algerian+Moroccan+Saudi+Yemeni @ 1.998923
6 Algerian+Moroccan+Yemeni+Yemeni @ 1.998923
7 Algerian+Armenian+Armenian+Tunisian @ 2.029228
8 Algerian+Armenian+Saudi+Tunisian @ 2.029228
9 Algerian+Armenian+Tunisian+Yemeni @ 2.029228
10 Algerian+Saudi+Saudi+Tunisian @ 2.029228
11 Algerian+Saudi+Tunisian+Yemeni @ 2.029228
12 Algerian+Tunisian+Yemeni+Yemeni @ 2.029228
13 Albanians+Armenian+Armenian+Somali @ 2.084958
14 Albanians+Armenian+Saudi+Somali @ 2.084958
15 Albanians+Armenian+Somali+Yemeni @ 2.084958
16 Albanians+Saudi+Saudi+Somali @ 2.084958
17 Albanians+Saudi+Somali+Yemeni @ 2.084958
18 Albanians+Somali+Yemeni+Yemeni @ 2.084958
19 Armenian+Armenian+Kosovo+Somali @ 2.084958
20 Armenian+Armenian+Somali+Stuttgart @ 2.084958
21 Armenian+Kosovo+Saudi+Somali @ 2.084958
22 Armenian+Kosovo+Somali+Yemeni @ 2.084958
23 Armenian+Saudi+Somali+Stuttgart @ 2.084958
24 Armenian+Somali+Stuttgart+Yemeni @ 2.084958
25 Kosovo+Saudi+Saudi+Somali @ 2.084958
26 Kosovo+Saudi+Somali+Yemeni @ 2.084958
27 Kosovo+Somali+Yemeni+Yemeni @ 2.084958
28 Saudi+Saudi+Somali+Stuttgart @ 2.084958
29 Saudi+Somali+Stuttgart+Yemeni @ 2.084958
30 Somali+Stuttgart+Yemeni+Yemeni @ 2.084958
31 Algerian+Armenian+Armenian+Libyan @ 2.288282
32 Algerian+Armenian+Libyan+Saudi @ 2.288282
33 Algerian+Armenian+Libyan+Yemeni @ 2.288282
34 Algerian+Libyan+Saudi+Saudi @ 2.288282
35 Algerian+Libyan+Saudi+Yemeni @ 2.288282
36 Algerian+Libyan+Yemeni+Yemeni @ 2.288282
37 Armenian+Armenian+Moroccan+Moroccan @ 2.30154
38 Armenian+Moroccan+Moroccan+Saudi @ 2.30154
39 Armenian+Moroccan+Moroccan+Yemeni @ 2.30154
40 Moroccan+Moroccan+Saudi+Saudi @ 2.30154
317103 iterations.

[oblivion]

Slight genetic differences can be attributed to differences between regions. A Muslim Egyptian living in Cairo is going to have less SSA than a Muslim Egyptian living in Aswan.
Furthermore, slight genetic differences do not mean they're a separate ethnic group.

To me a separate ethnic group exists when they cluster closely together.. copts tend to cluster amongst, northern bedouins, southern levantines and egyptians.. but i still see copts as a separate group..

[Profileid]

To me a separate ethnic group exists when they cluster closely together.. copts tend to cluster amongst, northern bedouins, southern levantines and egyptians.. but i still see copts as a separate group..

So religion=ethnicity? Are they not Egyptians or something?

[Maguzanci]

I posted the ane k6... where is west eurasia k8 and steppe k10?

Sorry I just saw your quote.

Here is the Steppe K10 can be find from here: http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?4402-eurogenes-steppe-k10

West Eurasia K8, you will have to contact Davidski or Generalissmo in Anthrogenica or ask for it. This is what the spreadsheet look like if you are interest: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kd9Q9vFrL1Cra9ayqMYVFKXrUdnThmQJVMtjczLhoTs/edit#gid=74932529
It has Egyptian samples, but unfortunately only Muslim Egyptians samples.

m not sure if you still have to donate $20 to him. It is your choice though if you don't want to donate.

[oblivion]

So religion=ethnicity? Are they not Egyptians or something?

Copts are an ethno religious group .. they only marry within themselves and are definitely egyptians but represent pre islamic egypt..

[oblivion]

Sorry the Steppe K10 can be find from here: http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?4402-eurogenes-steppe-k10

West Eurasia K8, you will have to contact Davidski or Generalissmo in Anthrogenica or ask for it. Im not sure if you still have to donate $20 to him but if you don't want to, you don't need to. It's your choice.

I put stepp k10 here.. but the west eurasian one is no longer available.

[Petalpusher]

How come North Sea is so western in that PCA? In most maps Iberians appear as the most "western" after Basques and Sardinians, but since North Sea is so western in that map and Baltic is also half-western and half-eastern instead on mostly eastern, even Norwegians and Danes that have a lot of Eastern European genetics appear as more western than Iberians. I suppose the distance between components on the map is calculated using fst, but how do they decide where the components start on the map?

They are all like that, just not rotated/oriented the same, but arguably, if we had to take a reference for north/south and make it our vertical axe with WHG, it would be E.Africa as it's like the opposite. If you notice N.Africans are pretty much half way between E_Africa and Basques, because they score 15-25% SSA but with different levels of WHG, both negating each others. That should be the vertical axe if anything.
North Sea probably emcompasses the most WHG with not much ANE, these components are still based on ancients, their proportions are arbitrary to represent a virtual regioning of West Eurasian but they are still made of WHG/ANE/ENF in the end and some other things eventually. Just like i could create an "Azores" component and place it at let's say "30 WHG + 10% ANE + 60 ENF", it would still work, people would score it.

I remember Eurogenes posted once exactly the proportion, it's also based on ancient dna Loschbour/AG2-3 and LBK or similar, like all admixture tests. K15 is still very decent, though it is using less ancient dna than some more recent calculators since it's like 2-3 years old maybe now.


Scandinavians have a good amount of what is called here Baltic, but their first component is by far North Sea as they are highly WHG/SHG, and still more Atlantid than Baltic, they don't really score a lot of eastern stuff. Ukrainians are like two times more Baltic, but all these labels don't matter much, it's just a way to place a proportions of WHG/ANE, etc.. At K7/K6 Scandinavians don't have much ANE, around or under 20%. "Eastern" is probably the most ANE, it's halfway WHG and Amerindian, it has to be since it's where it peaks in modern people.

[Profileid]

Copts are an ethno religious group .. they only marry within themselves and are definitely egyptians but represent pre islamic egypt..

What do they have that makes them an ethnic group exactly? They're culturally the same as other Egyptians. The only real difference is religion.

[Petalpusher]

What do they have that makes them an ethnic group exactly? They're culturally the same as other Egyptians. The only real difference is religion.

They are more similar to Levantines than other Egyptians, less SSA.

[Profileid]

They are more similar to Levantines than other Egyptians, less SSA.

Minor differences in genetics does not make an ethnic group.

[Petalpusher]

Minor differences in genetics does not make an ethnic group.

It's enough to form a distinct cluster, please tell us your threshold for ethnic groups so the world of genetics is finally enlightened.

[Profileid]

It's enough to form a distinct cluster, please tell us your threshold for ethnic groups so the world of genetics is finally enlightened.

well ethnicity is about things created by humans. Culture.

[oblivion]

well ethnicity is about things created by humans. Culture.
What I know about ethnicity is that it is defined by cultural things but also by genetics.. copts are considered an ethnic group within egypt..along with bedouins..who form another distinct cluster...

[Sikeliot]

Not that they are particularly close but I have seen one or two Coptic results come surprisingly close to Ashkenazim and Sicilians, compared to other North Africans.

[randomguy1235]

They are more similar to Levantines than other Egyptians, less SSA.

With Muslim Southern Levantines? Certainly not with indigenous Levantine populations.

[wvwvw]

Not that they are particularly close but I have seen one or two Coptic results come surprisingly close to Ashkenazim and Sicilians, compared to other North Africans.

Those who are close to Sicilians may have Greek admixture.

[wvwvw]

With Muslim Southern Levantines? Certainly not with indigenous Levantine populations.

Randomguy Palestinians have diverse origins. Even the brown Palestinians are natives to Palestine as Southern Levant was ruled by Egypt. Palestinians are the descendants of all tribes that lived in the region, the Moabites, Amonites, Edomites, Iudamians etc and the Christian Palestinians are probably the descendents of what was left of the Philistines and Hellenistic Greeks.

[randomguy1235]

Randomguy Palestinians have diverse origins. Even the brown Palestinians are natives to Palestine as Southern Levant was ruled by Egypt. Palestinians are the descendants of all tribes that lived in the region, the Moabites, Amonites, Edomites, Iudamians etc and the Christian Palestinians are probably the descendents of what was left of the Philistines and Hellenistic Greeks.

Yes, Muslim Palis have some foreign admixture and a substantial minority aren't indigenous. However, we know through population genetics that there are isolated populations (like Pali Christians, Druze, and some Muslim tribes) who've maintained genetic continuity. And no, Pali Christians have no extra affinity to Greeks.

[Petalpusher]

With Muslim Southern Levantines? Certainly not with indigenous Levantine populations.

I meant they go in that direction, compared to other Egyptians, not that they are more similar to Levantines.