African civilizations

[crazyladybutterfly]

I was tired of hearing costantly about how africans are supposedly "too dumb to create anything" so i made this thread to share just some historical facts.

[LieDetector]

kangz n sheeit?

[Dominicanese]

a very very nice thread

ill help out

i heard of a dug up ancient city in Nigeria but no one has seemed to really published it out there

it's forest overgrown, so that means that the city has had the forest over grown over it so it could not be seen

Quoted:
On 23 May 1999, the Sunday Times carried an astonishing article entitled Jungle reveals traces of Sheba's fabled kingdom. Over the next few days many other papers followed suit. Even the Daily Mail one day later asked "Was the Queen of Sheba really a Black woman from Nigeria?" As the evidence emerged, however, the queen of Sheba link proved to be hype. The real Sheba was an Ethiopian queen who lived three thousand years ago. What was undeniable, however, was that the southern Nigerian rainforests had an even more amazing secret to tell. The secret was this. During the Middle Ages, Africans built by far the largest city the world had ever seen. In size, this city dwarfed Baghdad, Cairo, Cordoba and Rome. The achievement was on a scale even bigger that that of the Great Pyramid of Giza, Africa's most celebrated monument.

At one time, scholars used to divide the three thousand-year history of southern Nigeria into four great cultural periods. They used to speak of the Nok Culture, the Igbo-Ukwu Culture, the Yoruba Kingdoms and the Benin Empire. This view was boldly challenged by the findings of a team of Bournemouth University scholars led by archaeologist Dr Patrick Darling. Since 1994, the team discovered and mapped the remains of yet another Nigerian kingdom, this time covered by centuries of forest overgrowth. Barnaby Phillips of the BBC described the discoveries as possibly "Africa's largest single monument." As we shall see, this is typical British understatement.

At Eredo, in south western Nigeria, Darling's team found a huge earthen wall with moated sections. This encircled an ancient kingdom or city. From the ditch to the summit of the rampart measured a towering 70 feet. According to Mark Macaskill of the Sunday Times, the rampart was "100 mile[s]" long and formed a rough circle, enclosing "more than 400 square miles." The building was on a truly epic scale. The builders shifted 3.5 million cubic metres of earth to build just the rampart alone. According to the BBC this is, incidentally, "one million cubic metres more than the amount of rock and earth used in the Great Pyramid at Giza." Therefore Eredo's construction is estimated to have "involved about one million more man-hours that were necessary to build the Great Pyramid." The ramparts may indicate the boundary of the original Ijebu kingdom that was ruled by a spiritual leader called the "Awujale". Macaskill, however, disagrees. He describes Eredo as a "city". If he is correct, this would make Eredo one of the very largest cities in all of human history. It was larger than modern London, and was definitely the largest city built in the ancient and mediaeval world.

Among the discoveries, a three-story ruin has been tentatively identified as the royal palace. It had living quarters, shrines and courtyards. It is possible that thousands of smaller buildings are still concealed by the forests. These will be mapped in time. Radiocarbon dating has so far established that the buildings and walls were more than 1,000 years old. Dates such as 800 AD have been given as a good ball-park figure.

People who live near the ruined kingdom or city today have traditions that a wealthy and childless queen, Bilikisu Sungbo, built the city. Some say that she built the city as a religious offering. It is also claimed that Sungbo's territory had a gold and ivory trade. Moreover, her royal household are said to have kept eunuchs. Portuguese documents dating back 500 years, allude to the power of an Ijebu kingdom that some scholars think is possibly this very one. Today, the ruins continue to be of great importance. There are yearly pilgrimages to Sungbo's grave.

Despite this great African achievement it is, however, disconcerting to note that racist theories are already being formulated about this kingdom. For example, Barnaby Phillips wrote that the building of Eredo was: "carried out by people who could not read or write, and with only the most basic of tools. Thousands of labourers - probably slaves - must have toiled in the thick rain forests and dark labyrinth swamps for years."

Naturally, he offers no evidence for the assertions of slavery and illiteracy. On the other hand, the evidence of iron smelting and the other highly advanced metallurgical activities for which the Nigerian civilisations were world leaders seems to disprove the notion that the builders had only basic tools at their disposal.

On a happy note, Dr Darling, the leader of the archaeological team, suggested that Eredo may well gain World Heritage Status. This will put the Eredo kingdom or city on an equal footing with other African marvels such as the Pyramids of Giza and the city of Djenné. It also places this great achievement on a footing with other great marvels from around the world such as Stonehenge.

http://www.blackhistorystudies.com/shop/the-great-mighty-wall/article-about-eredo/

[crazyladybutterfly]

The Kingdom of Aksum

http://img.tebyan.net/library/english/8616_Aksum0.png

By 350, Aksum conquered the Kingdom of Kush. At its height, Aksum controlled northern Ethiopia, Eritrea, northern Sudan, southern Egypt, Djibouti, Western Yemen, and southern Saudi Arabia, totalling 1.25 million square kilometers.

The Aksum or Aksum empire was the 3rd largest African empire at 1.25 million sq km. In the sixth century, the kingdom of Aksum (Axum ) was doing what many elsewhere had been doing: pursuing trade and empire. Despite the disintegration of the Roman Empire in the 400s and the decline in world trade, Aksum's trade increased during that century. Its exports of ivory, glass crystal, brass and copper items, and perhaps slaves, among other things, had brought prosperity to the kingdom. Some people had become wealthy and cosmopolitan. Aksum's port city on the Red Sea, Adulis , bustled with activity. Its agriculture and cattle breeding flourished, and Aksum extended its rule to Nubia , across the Red Sea to Yemen , and it had extended its rule to the northern Ethiopian Highlands and along the coast to Cape Guardafui .


From Aksum's beginnings in the third century, Christianity there had spread. But at the peak of Christianity's success, Aksum began its decline. In the late 600s, Aksum's trade was diminished by the clash between Constantinople and the Sassanid Empire. The Sassanid Empire clashed with Constantinople over trade on the Red Sea and expanded into Yemen, driving Aksum out of Arabia. Then Islam united Arabia and began expanding. In the 700s, Muslims occupied the Dahlak Islands just off the coast of Adulis, which had been ruled by Aksum. The Muslims moved into the port city of Adulis, and Aksum's trade by sea ended.


Aksum was now cut off from much of the world. Greek- the language of trade - declined there. Minted coins became rare. And it has been surmised that the productivity of soil in the area was being diminished by over-exploitation and the cutting down of trees. Taking advantage of Aksum's weakness, the Bedja people, who had been living just north of Aksum, moved in. The people of Aksum, in turn, migrated into the Ethiopian Highlands, where they overran small farmers and settled at Amhara , among other nearby places. And with this migration a new Ethiopian civilization began.


http://www.ducksters.com/history/africa/aksum_obelisk.jpg

Architecture and Towers Unlike their northern neighbors of Egypt, Aksum did not build pyramids. Instead, Aksum is famous for building tall towers called stelae. The tallest of these towers was nearly 100 feet high. The towers were elaborately carved with inscriptions, stone doors, and fake windows. The most famous of these towers is the Obelisk of Axum which was taken by Italian soldiers upon conquering Ethiopia in 1937. The tower was later returned in pieces and reconstructed in 2008.

https://hiddenincatours.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/axum_obelisk.jpg

The city of Axum still exists in northern Ethiopia. It is a fairly small city with a population of just over 50,000 people. It is one of the oldest continuously inhabited cities in Africa. The stone buildings in Aksum were built without the use of mortar. Instead, the stones were carved to fit snugly together. The city of Adulis was destroyed by Islamic invaders in 710. This isolated Aksum and began its decline. With merchants from all around the world coming to Aksum to trade, Greek was generally used as the common language.

sources : http://www.ducksters.com/history/africa/kingdom_of_aksum_axum.php
http://www.africankingdoms.com/

[crazyladybutterfly]

kangz n sheeit?

no somthing to learn. :picard2:

i am seriously very tired.

i will post a little by little because there is so much to add

[Defiance]

I expect evidence. Be advised that words on a screen is not evidence.

[Ülev]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d9/Great-Zimbabwe-2.jpg


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Zimbabwe

[Dominicanese]

there's a lot in africa

we just weren't taught that in school

i don't even think they teach that astuff in africa niether, their own history is forgotten

[Annie999]

I remember going to the MEC in NYC, tons of history from all around the world from Egypt (north Africa) to Asia, Europe and so on, and honestly the rest of African section was unimpressive, there was a few people visiting and I could see why. I'm not saying Africans didn't do anything, but even in that museum there wasn't much worth to see, specially in contrast to the rest of impressive things displayed there :/

[Tobi]

Northern Africa is/was very impressive, but the Sub Saharan side not really.

[KMack]

Africa is a big continent, but most people are pretty aware of the N. Africans civilizations. Ancient Egypt has probably been more covered, more investigated, more movies/TV shows/books etc. etc.

[KMack]

BTW the Ethiopian Church says they have and have had the Arch of the Covenant for years.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCfVrjIV80U

[Egyptian]

Egypt,Nubia and Sudan were the main civilizations in Africa...Kush Civilization and pyramids of Sudan

http://up.qloob.com/upfiles/ogM25791.jpg

https://dotmsrstaging.s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/2015/08/free-2110649580876878295.jpg

[Egyptian]

inside one of the Sudanese pyramids

http://www.eremnews.com/erempictures/inline/6305b544be479c4b74ac0895dc1319bd/4.jpg

[Egyptian]

Be aware the Egypt,Nubia and Sudan were connected like they were kinda 1 State till they united in 1 country and split in 1956.

[Poise n Pen]

The middle enjoys pushing out the fantasy that civilization came out of the middle east. In fact the first large settlements are in europe many thousands of years earlier.

There's also tons of ruins all over the place that go back far beyond the written timeframe. 15k years old in europe, 10k+ years old in India, and so on. Not to mention it can be hard to carbon date things like rock so possibly south american civilizations go back much further than credited.

But while there's civilizations all over there is no black civilization in africa because they only spread out from the jungle about 3k years ago. It's like asking why the eskimos built no cities. Well, they had a small population and an environment where that is not really possible! But there is also the possibility that black africans originally came out of southern india and a few other theories like that which could mean they did have cities at one time.


Despite this great African achievement it is, however, disconcerting to note that racist theories are already being formulated about this kingdom. For example, Barnaby Phillips wrote that the building of Eredo was: "carried out by people who could not read or write, and with only the most basic of tools. Thousands of labourers - probably slaves - must have toiled in the thick rain forests and dark labyrinth swamps for years."

All the ancient cities were built with slavery. In fact social stratification is one of the retarded ways they define "civilization". They also always assume EVERYONE is illiterate unless proven otherwise by very extensive proof. I am not so sure they were all illiterate but that is typically assumed unless they find a enough inscriptions to show a real language was being used for certain.

[slavoj333]

I like ancient Egypt .

[Egyptian]

The middle enjoys pushing out the fantasy that civilization came out of the middle east. In fact the first large settlements are in europe many thousands of years earlier.

There's also tons of ruins all over the place that go back far beyond the written timeframe. 15k years old in europe, 10k+ years old in India, and so on. Not to mention it can be hard to carbon date things like rock so possibly south american civilizations go back much further than credited.

But while there's civilizations all over there is no black civilization in africa because they only spread out from the jungle about 3k years ago. It's like asking why the eskimos built no cities. Well, they had a small population and an environment where that is not really possible! But there is also the possibility that black africans originally came out of southern india and a few other theories like that which could mean they did have cities at one time.



All the ancient cities were built with slavery. In fact social stratification is one of the retarded ways they define "civilization". They also always assume EVERYONE is illiterate unless proven otherwise by very extensive proof. I am not so sure they were all illiterate but that is typically assumed unless they find a enough inscriptions to show a real language was being used for certain.

Black had a big civilization in Sudan and Nubia

[Egyptian]

temple of aba damak (the lion god ) in Sudan

http://www.eremnews.com/erempictures/inline/7c88f85a139fff87ff2381965bb92226/3.jpg

[Ülev]

still better than middle-ages Europe (at least no winters there)


https://youtu.be/I1KRjQmFEIc

[Egyptian]

more photos of Sudan Pyramids

http://abunawaf.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Pyramids-of-Meroe-1024x648.jpg

https://dotmsrstaging.s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/2015/05/free-1513735340786115930.jpg

http://d2a0do11gpvbrl.cloudfront.net/t.php?y=album_image&wx=930&p=http://st.wthr.ws/sites/default/files/pyramids-of-Meroe.jpg

[Mingle]

Nobody can ever name an African civilization that wasn't from North Africa or the Horn of Africa.

Here are some of the more well-known ones from Sub-Saharan Africa:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sao_civilisation

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nok_culture

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Songhai_Empire

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jolof_Empire

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Jolof

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghana_Empire

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Kongo

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Mutapa

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zulu_Kingdom

[Taiguaitiaoghyrmmumin]

The middle enjoys pushing out the fantasy that civilization came out of the middle east. In fact the first large settlements are in europe many thousands of years earlier.

There's also tons of ruins all over the place that go back far beyond the written timeframe. 15k years old in europe, 10k+ years old in India, and so on. Not to mention it can be hard to carbon date things like rock so possibly south american civilizations go back much further than credited.

But while there's civilizations all over there is no black civilization in africa because they only spread out from the jungle about 3k years ago. It's like asking why the eskimos built no cities. Well, they had a small population and an environment where that is not really possible! But there is also the possibility that black africans originally came out of southern india and a few other theories like that which could mean they did have cities at one time.



All the ancient cities were built with slavery. In fact social stratification is one of the retarded ways they define "civilization". They also always assume EVERYONE is illiterate unless proven otherwise by very extensive proof. I am not so sure they were all illiterate but that is typically assumed unless they find a enough inscriptions to show a real language was being used for certain.

most of africa was illiterate but few did have some use symbols for meaning. And i am not talking egyptians.theres one called nbsidi . Theres another script i forgot what its called. I am not sure if its the val script or another one but it was rediscovered in brazil with brazilian africans still using the script and was restored into use fo one of the countries. But even most africans dont even know anything about stuff like that. They werent allowed to learn about stuff like that anyways in colonial times.

the tauregs are said to als to be the closest to the ancient berber script. They are mixed though

they also had had blacksmithing in some parts that was done. Nok people i think are ones to first do it for them and did it independantly. Its why they had sword weapons also and some bronze art in african empires predating colonialism.

[Ülev]

https://youtu.be/AyKrTdv-t4E

[Poise n Pen]

most of africa was illiterate but few did have some use symbols for meaning. And i am not talking egyptians.theres one called nbsidi . Theres another script i forgot what its called. I am not sure if its the val script or another one but it was rediscovered in brazil with brazilian africans still using the script and was restored into use fo one of the countries. But even most africans dont even know anything about stuff like that. They werent allowed to learn about stuff like that anyways in colonial times.

the tauregs are said to als to be the closest to the ancient berber script. They are mixed though

they also had had blacksmi
ithing in some parts that was done. Nok people i think are ones to first do it for them and did it independantly. Its why they had seord weapons also and some bronze art

Proof of literacy, regardless of location, only shows up relatively recently. Most ruins are of groups that are just assumed illiterate because there is no proof of it (though they may well have been regardless).

I don't think that any mention of the age of the nigerian ruins was found. There's also lots of weird ruins in south africa as well, but again what people mostly seem to care about are black africans and they only came there very recently. Who lived there thousands of years ago? It is not clear. How old are the ruins? Impossible to say, but they generally just make up some BS number - they could be 10k years old for all we know.

[Taiguaitiaoghyrmmumin]

Proof of literacy, regardless of location, only shows up relatively recently. Most ruins are of groups that are just assumed illiterate because there is no proof of it (though they may well have been regardless).

I don't think that any mention of the age of the nigerian ruins was found. There's also lots of weird ruins in south africa as well, but again what people mostly seem to care about are black africans and they only came there very recently. Who lived there thousands of years ago? It is not clear. How old are the ruins? Impossible to say, but they generally just make up some BS number - they could be 10k years old for all we know.
They are some old civilizations probably that predate most likely. But the bulk of more recent african civilization in west africa stems from the bantu migration out. Theres a old story folklore about one african guy from a specific kingdom that helped pread the bantu migration. Id have to look it up later. But yea like the case of zimbabwe stone structures is unknown case. Most west africans that were literate were practicing islam and wrote in arabic and thats how they had the library of timbiktu which i think was from the mandinkas but i could be wrong

[Mingle]

Proof of literacy, regardless of location, only shows up relatively recently. Most ruins are of groups that are just assumed illiterate because there is no proof of it (though they may well have been regardless).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Nubian_language

Nubians were writing in the eight century before most Europeans. The earliest form of writing in Europe is the Greek alphabet in the late eight century BC which came from the Phoenicians.

[Mingle]

Sub-Saharan Africans smelted iron in 500 B.C.

http://www.sahistory.org.za/article/iron-age-kingdoms-southern-africa

[crazyladybutterfly]

or Kerma Culture

http://www.ducksters.com/history/africa/kush_map.jpg

The Kingdom of Kush lasted for over 1400 years. It was first established around 1070 BCE when it gained its independence from Egypt. It quickly became a major power in Northeast Africa. In 727 BCE, Kush took control of Egypt and ruled until the Assyrians arrived. The empire began to weaken after Rome conquered Egypt and eventually collapsed sometime in the 300s CE.

The Kingdom of Kush was very similar to Ancient Egypt in many aspects including government, culture, and religion. Like the Egyptians, the Kushites built pyramids at burial sites, worshiped Egyptian gods, and mummified the dead. The ruling class of Kush likely considered themselves Egyptian in many ways.

http://www.ducksters.com/history/africa/kush_pyramids_at_meroe.jpg

Two of the most important resources of Ancient Kush were gold and iron. Gold helped Kush to become wealthy as it could be traded to the Egyptians and other nearby nations. Iron was the most important metal of the age. It was used to make the strongest tools and weapons.

Outside of the Pharaoh and the ruling class, the priests were the most important social class in Kush. They made the laws and communicated with the gods. Just below the priests were the artisans and scribes. Artisans worked the iron and gold that was such an important part of the Kushite economy. Farmers were also respected as they provided the food for the country. At the bottom were servants, laborers, and slaves.



Read more at: http://www.ducksters.com/history/africa/kingdom_of_kush.php
This text is Copyright © Ducksters. Do not use without permission.

[Taiguaitiaoghyrmmumin]

Sub-Saharan Africans smelted iron in 500 B.C.

http://www.sahistory.org.za/article/iron-age-kingdoms-southern-africa

Yeah metal age was late for BantusBut it spread like wild fire once it happened. They pushed out other cushitic /san related groups out that were there before.

[crazyladybutterfly]

i will continue later

[Melki]

In 1884, during the Berlin Conference, the whole African continent was divided among European powers (Great Britain, France, Portugal, Italy, Germany, Spain and the Ottoman Empire).
This was the beginning of the so-called "scramble for Africa", an era of New Imperialism. Europeans were supposed to "bring civilization" to "swarthy backward peoples", just another pretext to steal their natural resources.

But Africans didn't need help from Europe to build prestigious (and sometimes long-lived civilizations).

Everybody knows the civilization of Ancient Egypt. But most of the world's population ignores everything about:
-The Nok culture (Nigeria - 8th Century BC - 9th Century AD)
-The Kingdom of Ghana (West Africa - 8-9th Century AD)
-The Kingdom of Mali (West Africa - 12-14th c.)
-Yorubaland (Nigeria - 12-19th c.)
-The Kingdom of Benin (West Africa - 13-19th c.)
-The Songhai Empire (West Africa - 14-16th c.)
-The Ashanti Empire (Ghana - 18-19th c.)
-The Sokoto Caliphate (West Africa - 19th c.)
-The Kanem-Bornu Empire (Lake Chad - 9-19th c.)
-The Kingdom of Mutapa (Zimbabwe - 11-17th c.)
-The Zulu Kingdom(South Africa - 19th c.)
-Last but not least, the powerful Ethiopian Empire.

[Dominicanese]

Egypt,Nubia and Sudan were the main civilizations in Africa...Kush Civilization and pyramids of Sudan

http://up.qloob.com/upfiles/ogM25791.jpg

https://dotmsrstaging.s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/2015/08/free-2110649580876878295.jpg

it looks so modern that to our eyes it looks like the future

these guys were def ahead of us now, cause they were working with nature and not against it

[KMack]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Nubian_language

Nubians were writing in the eight century before most Europeans. The earliest form of writing in Europe is the Greek alphabet in the late eight century which came from the Phoenicians.

8th Century BC

[LieDetector]

Africa does have a great history and it was because of NORTH AFRICANS.

[Peterski]

Ethiopians and other Horners are ~50% Eurasian (Caucasoid).

Please tell us about ~100% Negroid (Bantu etc.) civilizations.

Edit: And how about some Australian kingdoms and empires?

[Mingle]

Ethiopians and other Horners are ~50% Eurasian (Caucasoid).

Please tell us about ~100% Negroid (Bantu etc.) civilizations.

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?196562-African-civilizations&p=4093415&viewfull=1#post4093415

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?196562-African-civilizations&p=4093638&viewfull=1#post4093638

[Peterski]

Name one thing that each of those kingdoms and empires was famous for.

For example:

Zulu Kingdom, 19th century - famous for building one two-storey building.

Wait... Actually they did not build any two-storey buildings, AFAIK.

[Egyptian]

it looks so modern that to our eyes it looks like the future

these guys were def ahead of us now, cause they were working with nature and not against it

Ya , Sudan got some very nice monuments , but it's connected to Egypt (mainly the same shape but different design) , our Pyramids in Egypt were Huge and consisted of many floors , while Sudan pyramids were kinda small with small chambers , but inside of it were paintings same to Egyptian ones.

Sudan , Nubia and Egypt complete each others.

[Peterski]

How many (and which ones) of African civilizations fulfilled all - or the majority - of these criteria:

1) They have the knowledge of building in brick or stone, if the necessary materials are available in their territory.

2) At least few percent of them are urban population who live in towns or/and walled cities.

3) They exchange property by the use of money. There is long-distance trading, sale of goods and services.

4) They have a system of laws, accused ones can defend themselves and bring witnesses, punishments are proportional ("eye for an eye").

5) Their religious system includes also ethical and moral elements, it is not just purely or grossly superstitious.

6) They use a script to communicate ideas, they keep records and use things like counting boards, etc.

7) There is some facility in the abstract use of numbers (at least a start has been made in mathematics).

8) They use the scale, sundial clock, measures of length, a calendar accurate to within a few days in a year.

9) There is some appreciation of the fine arts and they build some monumental structures.

10) At least some part of the young population is enrolled in some sort of education.

11) There is some order and planning in their towns or cities. They use water storage, sewage system, etc.

12) They use irrigation or paddy fields. They use drainage. They use some crop rotation.

13) They know most or many of these materials: leather, glass, iron, copper, silver, zinc, lead, boron, tin, mercury, bronze, papyrus, pottery, linen, silk, cotton. They know technologies such as: the loom, knitting, smelting, metal casting, quarrying, mining.

14) They practice some sort of recreation and sports: such as for example racing or board games.

15) Transportation: they know the sail, the anchor, pack animals, wheeled vehicles or sledges.

16) Transport infrastructure: they know how to build roads, bridges, canals, tunnels, harbors.

17) Basic medicine: they use opiates, herbal pharmaceuticals, basic surgery, medical training.

18) Governance: there is separation of secular from religious leadership, there is separation of military and civil powers, some complex administrative systems, some hierarchical structures, they the knowledge of mapping (nbasic cartography).

19) Non-agricultural production: there is some specialization of labor and some cottage industries.

20) They have some sciences like Astronomy and Philosophy, etc. They have some Literature.

[Taiguaitiaoghyrmmumin]

In 1884, during the Berlin Conference, the whole African continent was divided among European powers (Great Britain, France, Portugal, Italy, Germany, Spain and the Ottoman Empire).
This was the beginning of the so-called "scramble for Africa", an era of New Imperialism. Europeans were supposed to "bring civilization" to "swarthy backward peoples", just another pretext to steal their natural resources.

But Africans didn't need help from Europe to build prestigious (and sometimes long-lived civilizations).

Everybody knows the civilization of Ancient Egypt. But most of the world's population ignores everything about:
-The Nok culture (Nigeria - 8th Century BC - 9th Century AD)
-The Kingdom of Ghana (West Africa - 8-9th Century AD)
-The Kingdom of Mali (West Africa - 12-14th c.)
-Yorubaland (Nigeria - 12-19th c.)
-The Kingdom of Benin (West Africa - 13-19th c.)
-The Songhai Empire (West Africa - 14-16th c.)
-The Ashanti Empire (Ghana - 18-19th c.)
-The Sokoto Caliphate (West Africa - 19th c.)
-The Kanem-Bornu Empire (Lake Chad - 9-19th c.)
-The Kingdom of Mutapa (Zimbabwe - 11-17th c.)
-The Zulu Kingdom(South Africa - 19th c.)
-Last but not least, the powerful Ethiopian Empire.

some south african ones:
Kingdom of Mapungubwe (9th century–14th century CE)
Kingdom of Zimbabwe (1220–1450 CE)
Kingdom of Mutapa (1430-1760 CE)
Kingdom of Butua (1450-1683 CE)
Torwa dynasty (1450-1683 CE)
Mutapa Empire (1450–1629 CE)


Oyo empire
Bornu Empire
Mandara Kingdom
Bamana Empire
Mossi Kingdoms
Sao civilization
kingdom of Bonoman ( akan) ( akans migrated from the sahara down to near nubia and then westward who formed the ashanti empire)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akan_people#Origin_and_ethnogenesis

Oral traditions of the ruling Abrade (Aduana) Clan relate that they originated from ancient Ghana. They migrated from the north, they went through Egypt and settled in Nubia (Sudan). Around 500AD (5th century), due to the pressure exerted on Nubia by Axumite kingdom of Ethiopia, Nubia was shattered, and the Akan people moved west and established small trading kingdoms. These kingdoms grew, and around 750AD the Empire of Ghana was formed. The Empire lasted from 750AD to 1200AD and collapsed as a result of the introduction of Islam in the Western Sudan, and the zeal of the Muslims to impose their religion: their ancestors eventually left for Kong (i.e. present day Ivory Coast). From Kong they moved to Wam and then to Dormaa (both located in present day Brong-Ahafo region). The movement from Kong was necessitated by the desire of the people to find suitable savannah conditions since they were not used to forest life. Around the 14th century, they moved from Dormaa South Eastwards to Twifo-Hemang, North West Cape Coast. This move was commercially motivated.[7]
Benin kingdom
Some old benin kingdom Art ( Edit ) oen of two of these is probably yoruba Oyo art. The benin come from Yoruba Oyo I think. But they later ended up warring. The Plaque of the soldiers is benin though.

http://68.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m800javsDQ1qhs7suo1_1280.jpg
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/c2/25/89/c22589f0ba2897323154c9373d865326.jpg
http://arttattl.ipower.com/Images/Europe/England/London/British%20Museum/Kingdom%20of%20Ife/05.jpg
http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/hd/nok/hd_nok.htm
Nok terracotta art 200BC - 500AD http://www.historyworld.net/images/treasures/NokTerracotta250.jpg
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/f8/7a/0f/f87a0f44ecef2a465034f3d339e2bdea.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/05/A_man_ride_a_horse%2CNok_terracotta_figurine.jpg


Dogon not an empire but interesting are supposed believed to have some descent from egypt.
Nsude Pyramids. Not the most impressive. But interesting they wanted to make some. So they must have been interacting with nubians or egyptians
http://jonesarchive.siu.edu/wp-content/uploads/arunsi10.jpg

Sankore mosque is interesting looking
http://m9.i.pbase.com/o6/93/329493/1/77817629.kqYpZbja.MaliNov063503.jpg

Old pages Library of timbuktu
http://www.outsideonline.com/sites/default/files/styles/three-quarter-page-scaled-1x/public/migrated-images/bonfire-6_fe.jpg?itok=gis-4kM2
Nok was making metal 500 bc at least by then. Nok are the ancestors of Yoruba and others
http://archive.archaeology.org/1107/features/nok_nigeria_africa_terracotta.html

[Dr. Robotnik the Subbotnik]

Everyone keeps talking about North-Africans and Horners (Caucasoid-mixed Africans).

Let's see some Sub-Saharan (pure Negroid) achievements!

[Dr. Robotnik the Subbotnik]

some south african ones:
Kingdom of Mapungubwe (9th century–14th century CE)
Kingdom of Zimbabwe (1220–1450 CE)
Kingdom of Mutapa (1430-1760 CE)
Kingdom of Butua (1450-1683 CE)
Torwa dynasty (1450-1683 CE)
Mutapa Empire (1450–1629 CE)


Oyo empire
Bornu Empire
Mandara Kingdom
Bamana Empire
Mossi Kingdoms
Sao civilization
kingdom of Bonoman ( akan) ( akans migrated from the sahara down to near nubia and then westward who formed the ashanti empire)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akan_people#Origin_and_ethnogenesis

Some old benin kingdom Art

http://68.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m800javsDQ1qhs7suo1_1280.jpg
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/c2/25/89/c22589f0ba2897323154c9373d865326.jpg
http://arttattl.ipower.com/Images/Europe/England/London/British%20Museum/Kingdom%20of%20Ife/05.jpg
http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/hd/nok/hd_nok.htm
Nok terracotta art 200BC - 500AD http://www.historyworld.net/images/treasures/NokTerracotta250.jpg
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/f8/7a/0f/f87a0f44ecef2a465034f3d339e2bdea.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/05/A_man_ride_a_horse%2CNok_terracotta_figurine.jpg


Dogon not an empire but interesting are supposed believed to have some descent from egypt.
Nsude Pyramids
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-q7Lc_8XUcTQ/UPHNOHkG1jI/AAAAAAAAAKM/G_wM6uVGy5M/s1600/step_pyramid.jpeg

The Benin stuff is cool.

[Dominicanese]

Ethiopians and other Horners are ~50% Eurasian (Caucasoid).

Please tell us about ~100% Negroid (Bantu etc.) civilizations.

Edit: And how about some Australian kingdoms and empires?

i posted one

about the ancient giant Nigerian city, believed to be one of the largest cities ever in the world

and these guys were Blacks, blacker than the Nigerians there today or the same

[Dominicanese]

thats another good point though

i wonder if Australia has any ancient cities

i don't see why not

im gonna look into it though, it be pretty interesting to see what the ancient Australians did

[Defiance]

Is this a question of race, or merely one of geography? The constructs of Sudan and Ethiopia are indeed fairly impressive, but I wonder if there's really any evidence that they were built by Negroids (and no, such a thing should not be assumed).

[Peterski]

http://68.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m800javsDQ1qhs7suo1_1280.jpg
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/c2/25/89/c22589f0ba2897323154c9373d865326.jpg
http://arttattl.ipower.com/Images/Europe/England/London/British%20Museum/Kingdom%20of%20Ife/05.jpg

This is actually pretty impressive.

Some Sub-Saharan societies had really advanced metallurgy.

Here some more Sub-Saharan art:

https://www.google.pl/search?client=opera&hs=JdZ&sa=X&biw=1366&bih=658&q=kingdom+of+benin&tbm=isch&imgil=F0EKXpknahfvLM%253A%253B07ZHXOlI4yqfiM%253Bh ttps%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.pinterest.com%25252Fl indaglovinghom%25252Fsculptures%25252F&source=iu&pf=m&tbs=simg:CAESpQIJwBN4hqj0I2IamQILEKjU2AQaBAgCCD4MC xCwjKcIGmIKYAgDEijFC70WwQvEC9kKywq5FswLuBfYCuAp3CT 5LYYuhC6jKPc3hyLeJKw0GjB9WhkJNdBcNsLZ_1M2VH-5CH49Njkgc6YV7c4TFrEEpNsvypHEWNvMWIAYLDAv2lmYgBAwL EI6u_1ggaCgoICAESBGhNm8QMCxCd7cEJGoQBChcKBW1ldGFs2 qWI9gMKCggvbS8wNHQ3bAoZCgZzdGF0dWXapYj2AwsKCS9tLzA xM18xYwoXCgVicmFzc9qliPYDCgoIL20vMDE1MDQKGwoJc2N1b HB0dXJl2qWI9gMKCggvbS8wNm1zcQoYCgZicm9uemXapYj2Awo KCC9tLzAxYnJmDA&fir=F0EKXpknahfvLM%253A%252C07ZHXOlI4yqfiM%252C_&usg=__OROMOp-dZaqNaYhGcIFVFOk55VM%3D&ved=0ahUKEwj53bDmt9HQAhUDGCwKHVQnAscQyjcIVg&ei=MUY_WLmBDIOwsAHUzoi4DA#imgrc=_

http://www.randafricanart.com/images/hb_1979.206.86_1_.jpg

[Peterski]

it be pretty interesting to see what the ancient Australians did

https://www.google.pl/search?q=Australian+rock+art&client=opera&hs=82E&biw=1366&bih=658&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjU1Z3-uNHQAhWGjCwKHbtBAjEQ_AUIBigB

[Amor Vincit Omnia]

Age of Empires II: The African Kingdoms:rolleyes:

[Amor Vincit Omnia]

seriously now

there is a lot about africa in general and very much about african history, Kingdoms and civilizations

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Africa

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_empires

[crazyladybutterfly]

The Kingdom of Ghana

The region lies just south of the Sahara Desert and is mostly savanna grasslands.
The first outsider to mention Ghana, the kingdom of the Soninke tribe, was an Arab geographer named al-Fazari, writing in the court records of Baghdad in 773. However, the name is confusing for more than one reason. First, the natives called it Wagadu.(9) The king's title was Ghana, and people gradually switched from calling this place "the kingdom of the Ghana" to simply Ghana, much like how the name of a South American king, the Inca, eventually became the name of his people. Second, the kingdom was located on the north bank of the Senegal and Niger Rivers, in what is now southeast Mauritania and southwest Mali, approximately five hundred miles northwest of the modern nation of Ghana.


Read more at: http://www.ducksters.com/history/africa/empire_of_ancient_ghana.php
This text is Copyright © Ducksters. Do not use without permission.

Important archaeological discoveries late in the 1970's have revealed a more complex and much earlier development, well before Ancient Ghana of 300 AD, of early state-like communities and even early cities. Surveys and excavations in this 'Middle Niger' region completed in 1984 at no fewer than forty-three sites of ancient settlement, proved that they belonged to an Iron Age culture developing there since about 250 BC, that the settlements grew into urban centres of natural size and duration'.

http://www.ducksters.com/history/africa/ghana_empire_africa_map.jpg

Ancient Ghana ruled from around 300 to 1100 CE. The empire first formed when a number of tribes of the Soninke peoples ( who excelled in the use and manufacture of iron had the advantage of superior weapons) were united under their first king, Dinga Cisse. The government of the empire was a feudal government with local kings who paid tribute to the high king, but ruled their lands as they saw fit. Historians say that the use of the horse and camel, along with iron, were important factors in how rulers were able to incorporate small farmers and herders into their empires.

The main source of wealth for the Empire of Ghana was the mining of iron and gold. . The peoples of West Africa had independently developed their own gold mining techniques and began trading with people of other regions of Africa and later Europe as well. Iron was used to produce strong weapons and tools that made the empire strong. Gold was used to trade with other nations for needed resources like livestock, tools, and cloth. They established trade relations with the Muslims of Northern Africa and the Middle East. Long caravans of camels were used to transport goods across the Sahara Desert.

At its heart was Kumbi-Salah which acted as a hive of extensive trade and attracted caravans from a variety of regions. Famed for its gold from the Wangara region, commented upon by the Arab writer Ibn Fazari who called Ghana the land of gold, compered it in size to its northern contemporary Morocco, while salt came to the city from the Sahara. Due to their expertise with iron and other metals, ancient Ghana traded in some of the finest artefacts in the area. Along side cotton, it was also known for its leather work called 'Moroccan Leather' despite the fact that it indeed originated in Ghana.

More wonders came from these African lands as attested too by another Arab geographer Ibn Haukal who commented in amazement on the lucrative trade that flourished in the region. His comments made in 951 CE mentions a cheque produced for the sum of 42,900 golden dinars written for a merchant in the state of Audoghast from a partner in Sidjilmassa in the north! Tales abound of one particular gold nugget weighing 30 pounds! This was truly a land of astonishing wonders and lavished wealth. A far cry from the misconception of the African languishing in barbarity and ignorance!

Ibn Khaldun again makes mention of the lifestyle of the ancient Ghanaians while quoting from a book written in 1067 by Abu Ubaid Al-Bakri. He describes the Muslim quarter which had sprung up to facilitate the trans-Saharan trade with north Africa, containing 12 mosques, buildings of stone and acacia wood, schools and centres of education. It was described further as 'the resort of the learned, of the rich and pious of all nations'.

In 990 CE Audoghast to the north was captured and included into the sprawling Ghanaian Empire. It was a fine addition and boasted a dense population including many from as far away as Spain. Its streets were lined with elegant houses, public buildings and mosques. The surroundings were rich in pastoral lands including sheep and cattle, making meat plentiful. Wheat was found in the market places in abundance imported from the north, honey from the south and a variety of foodstuffs from other regions. Robes of blue and red from Morocco was a popular fashion at the time. All which exchanged hands with payments of gold dust, cowrie shells or salt.

Around 1050 CE, the Empire of Ghana began to come under pressure from the Muslims to the north to convert to Islam. The Kings of Ghana refused and soon came under constant attacks from Northern Africa. At the same time, a group of people called the Susu broke free of Ghana. Over the next few hundred years, Ghana weakened until it eventually became part of the Mali Empire.

Around 1054, the Almoravid rulers came south to conquer the Kingdom of Ghana and convert the people to Islam. The authority of the king eventually diminished, which opened the way for the Kingdom of Mali to begin to gain power. The trade that had begun, however, continued to prosper.

Two important sources that have told historians about the history of the Kingdom of Ghana are the writings of a Spanish Muslim named Al-Bakri and archaeological finds. Archaeologists have worked at excavating a site that many believe to be one of the king's cities of the Kingdom of Ghana, Kumbi Saleh.

http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/images/h5/h5_1980.429.jpg

http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/images/h5/h5_1978.412.563.jpg


Historians used to believe that the Arabs brought civilization to Ghana and the rest of West Africa, but recent discoveries like Jenné-Jeno now tell us that the Arabs merely finished the job, by introducing Islam and the Arabic alphabet. The political evolution, from tribe to city-state to confederation to centralized kingdom, most likely took place in the fifth or sixth century, quite some time before the first trans-Saharan contact.

sources: http://xenohistorian.faithweb.com/africa/af05.html

http://www.africankingdoms.com/

http://www.ducksters.com/history/africa/empire_of_ancient_ghana.php

http://answersafrica.com/ghana-empire.html


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMwGmQqpab0

[Taiguaitiaoghyrmmumin]

I just saw this interesting video
Sculpture of a giraffe in an Indian temple. But maybe Its indians who visited africa

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4vJpmkzIz8

[Danaan]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Nubian_language

Nubians were writing in the eight century before most Europeans. The earliest form of writing in Europe is the Greek alphabet in the late eight century BC which came from the Phoenicians.

I am not Eurocentric but what you 've wrote shows ignorance.

There was also Linear A. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_A

By the way, writing in Europe could have existed much earlier than that.

There's also the "Old European script", although not everyone agrees if it was really a form of writing and some claim that Tărtăria tablets in Romania could have been a forgery.

If we assume that it is really a script we had writing in South-Eastern Europe since 6th millenium BC.

[Melki]

The Kingdom of Ghana

The region lies just south of the Sahara Desert and is mostly savanna grasslands.
The first outsider to mention Ghana, the kingdom of the Soninke tribe, was an Arab geographer named al-Fazari, writing in the court records of Baghdad in 773. However, the name is confusing for more than one reason. First, the natives called it Wagadu.(9) The king's title was Ghana, and people gradually switched from calling this place "the kingdom of the Ghana" to simply Ghana, much like how the name of a South American king, the Inca, eventually became the name of his people. Second, the kingdom was located on the north bank of the Senegal and Niger Rivers, in what is now southeast Mauritania and southwest Mali, approximately five hundred miles northwest of the modern nation of Ghana.


Read more at: http://www.ducksters.com/history/africa/empire_of_ancient_ghana.php
This text is Copyright © Ducksters. Do not use without permission.

Important archaeological discoveries late in the 1970's have revealed a more complex and much earlier development, well before Ancient Ghana of 300 AD, of early state-like communities and even early cities. Surveys and excavations in this 'Middle Niger' region completed in 1984 at no fewer than forty-three sites of ancient settlement, proved that they belonged to an Iron Age culture developing there since about 250 BC, that the settlements grew into urban centres of natural size and duration'.

http://www.ducksters.com/history/africa/ghana_empire_africa_map.jpg

Ancient Ghana ruled from around 300 to 1100 CE. The empire first formed when a number of tribes of the Soninke peoples ( who excelled in the use and manufacture of iron had the advantage of superior weapons) were united under their first king, Dinga Cisse. The government of the empire was a feudal government with local kings who paid tribute to the high king, but ruled their lands as they saw fit. Historians say that the use of the horse and camel, along with iron, were important factors in how rulers were able to incorporate small farmers and herders into their empires.

The main source of wealth for the Empire of Ghana was the mining of iron and gold. . The peoples of West Africa had independently developed their own gold mining techniques and began trading with people of other regions of Africa and later Europe as well. Iron was used to produce strong weapons and tools that made the empire strong. Gold was used to trade with other nations for needed resources like livestock, tools, and cloth. They established trade relations with the Muslims of Northern Africa and the Middle East. Long caravans of camels were used to transport goods across the Sahara Desert.

At its heart was Kumbi-Salah which acted as a hive of extensive trade and attracted caravans from a variety of regions. Famed for its gold from the Wangara region, commented upon by the Arab writer Ibn Fazari who called Ghana the land of gold, compered it in size to its northern contemporary Morocco, while salt came to the city from the Sahara. Due to their expertise with iron and other metals, ancient Ghana traded in some of the finest artefacts in the area. Along side cotton, it was also known for its leather work called 'Moroccan Leather' despite the fact that it indeed originated in Ghana.

More wonders came from these African lands as attested too by another Arab geographer Ibn Haukal who commented in amazement on the lucrative trade that flourished in the region. His comments made in 951 CE mentions a cheque produced for the sum of 42,900 golden dinars written for a merchant in the state of Audoghast from a partner in Sidjilmassa in the north! Tales abound of one particular gold nugget weighing 30 pounds! This was truly a land of astonishing wonders and lavished wealth. A far cry from the misconception of the African languishing in barbarity and ignorance!

Ibn Khaldun again makes mention of the lifestyle of the ancient Ghanaians while quoting from a book written in 1067 by Abu Ubaid Al-Bakri. He describes the Muslim quarter which had sprung up to facilitate the trans-Saharan trade with north Africa, containing 12 mosques, buildings of stone and acacia wood, schools and centres of education. It was described further as 'the resort of the learned, of the rich and pious of all nations'.

In 990 CE Audoghast to the north was captured and included into the sprawling Ghanaian Empire. It was a fine addition and boasted a dense population including many from as far away as Spain. Its streets were lined with elegant houses, public buildings and mosques. The surroundings were rich in pastoral lands including sheep and cattle, making meat plentiful. Wheat was found in the market places in abundance imported from the north, honey from the south and a variety of foodstuffs from other regions. Robes of blue and red from Morocco was a popular fashion at the time. All which exchanged hands with payments of gold dust, cowrie shells or salt.

Around 1050 CE, the Empire of Ghana began to come under pressure from the Muslims to the north to convert to Islam. The Kings of Ghana refused and soon came under constant attacks from Northern Africa. At the same time, a group of people called the Susu broke free of Ghana. Over the next few hundred years, Ghana weakened until it eventually became part of the Mali Empire.

Around 1054, the Almoravid rulers came south to conquer the Kingdom of Ghana and convert the people to Islam. The authority of the king eventually diminished, which opened the way for the Kingdom of Mali to begin to gain power. The trade that had begun, however, continued to prosper.

Two important sources that have told historians about the history of the Kingdom of Ghana are the writings of a Spanish Muslim named Al-Bakri and archaeological finds. Archaeologists have worked at excavating a site that many believe to be one of the king's cities of the Kingdom of Ghana, Kumbi Saleh.

http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/images/h5/h5_1980.429.jpg

http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/images/h5/h5_1978.412.563.jpg


Historians used to believe that the Arabs brought civilization to Ghana and the rest of West Africa, but recent discoveries like Jenné-Jeno now tell us that the Arabs merely finished the job, by introducing Islam and the Arabic alphabet. The political evolution, from tribe to city-state to confederation to centralized kingdom, most likely took place in the fifth or sixth century, quite some time before the first trans-Saharan contact.

sources: http://xenohistorian.faithweb.com/africa/af05.html

http://www.africankingdoms.com/

http://www.ducksters.com/history/africa/empire_of_ancient_ghana.php

http://answersafrica.com/ghana-empire.html


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMwGmQqpab0

Thanks for your instructive threads, crazyladybutterfly. You're like a gold mine for this short-sighted forum.

[Peterski]

But still no evidence that those cultures fulfilled the criteria of advanced civilizations:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?196562-African-civilizations&p=4094800&viewfull=1#post4094800

Note that e.g. Mesoamerican and Andean civilizations did fulfill most of these criteria.

[Taiguaitiaoghyrmmumin]

How many (and which ones) of African civilizations fulfilled all - or the majority - of these criteria:


1) They have the knowledge of building in brick or stone, if the necessary materials are available in their territory.
Wall of benin : https://people.ucsc.edu/~jcmonroe/UCSC-APAP/Home_files/IMG_0212.png
Koso walls
https://csweb.bournemouth.ac.uk/africanlegacy/old_oyo.htm
Kanos citiy walls
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Kano_City_Walls
http://i0.wp.com/kanoreports.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/gates.gif?fit=1050%2C700
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ngazargamu

Tichitt-Walata Ruins Mauritania 4000 to 2300 BP
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/fa/1f/a9/fa1fa957c83ac9a64e0500710ef5609f.jpg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sungbo's_Eredo
Town of Djenne
https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/73767c8158808f57b510b7e497d77ef8e07ba98e/0_65_2544_1526/master/2544.jpg?w=620&q=55&auto=format&usm=12&fit=max&
Zimbabwe
http://www.colonialvoyage.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Great-Zimbabwe.-Author-and-Copyright-Chris-Dunbar.1-660x330.jpg
Theres probably a lot more. I know theres another kingdom of south Africa as well but I don’t want to look for it would take forever.
Ancient African Site South Africa
http://www.viewzone.com/adamscalendar.html
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3m2hRIXXo_Y



2) At least few percent of them are urban population who live in towns or/and walled cities.
Go to one

3) They exchange property by the use of money. There is long-distance trading, sale of goods and services.
They used gold. Some of Asanti used Gold dust as currency. Manilla also as currency. Cowry is also used as currency
http://www.hamillgallery.com/CURRENCY/CurrencyExhibition.html

4) They have a system of laws, accused ones can defend themselves and bring witnesses, punishments are proportional ("eye for an eye").
They likely do but I don’t feel like trying to find it. And it would be hard to find in non Islamic ones because most did not write laws. It was announced
5) Their religious system includes also ethical and moral elements, it is not just purely or grossly superstitious.
All religions are superstitious and have a moral or ethical element.

6) They use a script to communicate ideas, they keep records and use things like counting boards, etc.
Islamic ones used Arabic script. Hence library of Timbuktu. Maybe they were other scripts and lost but most non Islamic ones didn’t have scripts maybe.
Writing:
Nbisidi
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ALjAstudJw0/TYJxGBXqznI/AAAAAAAAARo/4q2vnw5vA1s/s1600/Nsibidi%2Bhieroglyphs.png
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-1GfTu_O0Mu0/Vd3i33CLYEI/AAAAAAAAAVY/iDpXzVvysQg/s1600/mende%2Bnsibidi%2Bshumon.jpg
Bassa Script
http://www.omniglot.com/writing/bassa.htm
In the 1900s, a Bassa by the name of Dr Flo Darvin Lewis discovered that former slaves of Bassa origin living in Brazil and the West Indies were still using the Bassa alphabet. Dr Lewis had not encountered the alphabet before and, after learning it himself, he decided to try to revive the alphabet in Liberia.


7) There is some facility in the abstract use of numbers (at least a start has been made in mathematics).
The beginning of mathematics is actually african
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1AxhxirMuI
http://etopia.sintlucas.be/3.14/Ishango_meeting/Mathematics_Africa.pdf
http://sudaneseonline.com/cgi-bin/esdb/2bb.cgi?seq=print&board=12&msg=1283356463&rn=
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEQ2VQhIAgA
And Islamic empires in West Africa were practicing mathematics


8) They use the scale, sundial clock, measures of length, a calendar accurate to within a few days in a year.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akan_goldweights
Islamic ones know about that stuff already.
http://yorupedia.com/subjects/education/yoruba-numbers/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoruba_calendar
http://www.afropedea.org/yoruba
http://www.sacred-texts.com/afr/yor/yor09.htm
Hausa
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ajami_script#Hausa_Ajami_Script
Hausa has been written in ajami, since the early 15th century. There is no standard system of using ajami, and different writers may use letters with different values. Short vowels are written regularly with the help of vowel marks, which are seldom used in Arabic texts other than the Quran. Many medieval Hausa manuscripts similar to the Timbuktu Manuscripts written in the Ajami script, have been discovered recently and some of them even describe constellations and calendars.[2]
In the following table, some vowels are shown with the Arabic letter for t as an example.


9) There is some appreciation of the fine arts and they build some monumental structures.
I posted some already.

10) At least some part of the young population is enrolled in some sort of education.

Islamic ones all had some education. This includes Mali Ghana and Songhai. If not it was done orally.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashanti_Empire#Education_and_children
Education in the Ashanti Kingdom was conducted by Asante and imported scholars and Ashanti people would often attend schools in Europe for their higher education.



11) There is some order and planning in their towns or cities. They use water storage, sewage system, etc.
I cant find information to this part. But if Islamic countries had these probably Islamic African countries did

12) They use irrigation or paddy fields. They use drainage. They use some crop rotation.
Burn and slash.
Ancient Irrigation system:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0nstL6jM5c
http://classroom.synonym.com/importance-farming-economy-ancient-ghana-20732.html
Evidence of farming in the Niger River delta began to appear around 500 C.E. After flooding from the rainy season receded, farmers planted rice in the rich soils left behind. In 500 years, their agricultural skills became increasingly efficient through the use of irrigation and iron farming tool



13) They know most or many of these materials: leather, glass, iron, copper, silver, zinc, lead, boron, tin, mercury, bronze, papyrus, pottery, linen, silk, cotton. They know technologies such as: the loom, knitting, smelting, metal casting, quarrying, mining.

14) They practice some sort of recreation and sports: such as for example racing or board games.
The practiced wrestling stick fighting boxing and some raced on horse back or donkeys.
Dambe boxing , sengalese wrestling but embarrassingly they pra
https://travel.jumia.com/blog/ng/top-4-nigerian-traditional-games-to-try-1129
Oware board game an Asanti game

15) Transportation: they know the sail, the anchor, pack animals, wheeled vehicles or sledges.
They used camals cattle donkeys and horses. Sometimes they used canoes to transport stuff by the rivers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Songhai_Empire#History
Economic trade existed throughout the Empire, due to the standing army stationed in the provinces throughout the empire. Central to the regional economy were independent gold fields. The Julla (merchants) would form partnerships, and the state would protect these merchants and the port cities of the Niger. It was a very strong trading kingdom, known for its production of practical crafts as well as religious artifacts.

Trade routes of the Western Sahara c. 1000-1500. Goldfields are indicated by light brown shading.
The Songhai economy was based on a clan system. The clan a person belonged to ultimately decided one's occupation. The most common were metalworkers, fishermen, and carpenters. Lower caste participants consisted of mostly non-farm working immigrants, who at times were provided special privileges and held high positions in society. At the top were noblemen and direct descendants of the original Songhai people, followed by freemen and traders. At the bottom were war captives and European slaves obligated to labor, especially in farming. James Olson describes the labor system as resembling modern day unions, with the Empire possessing craft guilds that consisted of various mechanics and artisans.[17]

16) Transport infrastructure: they know how to build roads, bridges, canals, tunnels, harbors.
I will look at this more later
17) Basic medicine: they use opiates, herbal pharmaceuticals, basic surgery, medical training.
This as well I will look more into but I saw something about small pox with this. That one of them was treating small pox before Euros were doing it or something. And they had herbal medicine. That’s common even stone age people.

18) Governance: there is separation of secular from religious leadership, there is separation of military and civil powers, some complex administrative systems, some hierarchical structures, they the knowledge of mapping (nbasic cartography).

That’s alittle strange since most Ancient civilizations had some religious leadership involved. Religion tied heavily in Europe to Leadership and politics. Especially European dark ages. China was much more secular. Islamic empires are about this as well.
This is something I would have to look more later on
Government:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashanti_Empire#Government_and_politics
The Ashanti government was built upon a sophisticated bureaucracy in Kumasi, with separate ministries to handle the state's affairs. Of particular note was Ashanti's Foreign Office based in Kumasi; despite its small size, it allowed the state to pursue complex negotiations with foreign powers. The Office was divided into departments to handle relations separately with the British, French, Dutch, and Arabs. Scholars of Ashanti history, such as Larry Yarak and Ivor Wilkes, disagree over the power of this sophisticated bureaucracy in comparison to the Asantahene, but agree that it was a sign of a highly developed government with a complex system of checks and balances.
http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Oyo_Empire#The_functions_of_government
theres probably more but I don’t want to look right now probably another time
19) Non-agricultural production: there is some specialization of labor and some cottage industries.

This is something I can look up another time. Its a lot of stuff to look up

20) They have some sciences like Astronomy and Philosophy, etc. They have some Literature.
Most of African philosophy seemed to be tied to religion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_philosophy#Pre-modern

West Africa[edit]
The most prominent of West Africa's pre-modern philosophical traditions have been identified as that of the Yoruba philosophical tradition and the distinctive worldview that emerges from it over thousands of years of its development, as well as the cosmologies and philosophies of the Akan, Dogon and Dahomey.
Historically the West African and North African philosophical traditions have had a significant impact on Islamic philosophy as a whole as much of the Islamic philosophical tradition was subject to the influence of scholars born or working in the African continent in centres of learning such as Cairo in Egypt and Timbuktu in Mali. Many of these intellectuals and scholars created a philosophical tradition in these cities.[/QUOTE]

[crazyladybutterfly]

The Kingdom of Mali

Mali first appeared as a tribal kingdom around the ninth century, but until the reign of Sundiata Keita (1230-55), it had always been in Ghana's shadow. By 1300, Mali not only ruled Ghana but also Senegal and Gambia (giving the kingdom an outlet on the Atlantic), Walata, Gao, and Tadmekka. Gao was the home of the Songhay, a tribe we'll be hearing a lot from in the next chapter, and Tadmekka was a source of copper, a commodity so much in demand that foot-long rods of copper were used as currency.

The Kingdom of Mali came to control the gold trade that the Kingdom of Ghana had controlled before it, but it also expanded its trading in many ways. The Kingdom of Mali controlled the salt trade in the north and many caravan trade routes. Additionally, it traded extensively with Egypt and the copper mine areas to the east.

The most celebrated king of Mali was Mansa Musa. He greatly extended Mali's territory and power during his reign. He made a name for himself in distant regions throughout the Muslim world through his pilgrimage to Mecca, which is in present-day Saudi Arabia. Sixty thousand people and eighty camels carrying 300 lbs. of gold each accompanied him to Mecca.


Several great centers of Islamic learning were also established during the Kingdom of Mali. Among them were the legendary Timbuktu, Djenne, and Gao. Scholars came from all over the Muslim world to study at these places, which have a long and rich history of learning in religion, mathematics, music, law, and literature.
It was in these cities that vast libraries were built and madrasas (Islamic universities) were endowed. They became meeting-places of the finest poets, scholars, and artists of Africa and the Middle East.
Timbuktu, in particular, had become legendary in the European imagination, representing all the wealth of Africa. The kings of Mali made it a great religious center as well as a commercial center. Over the course of the fourteenth and fifteenth centuries, 150 madrasas (Moslem religious schools) were built, and the copying of religious manuscripts became an important industry. By the early sixteenth century, Timbuktu had a population of 40,000, and its book trade provided a better profit than any other kind of commerce. Timbuktu's most prominent landmark is the Sankore Mosque, built in the fourteenth century. The walls are made out of adobe, and every year, after the rainy season, the structure needs to be resurfaced with fresh mud; the poles sticking out are then used as scaffolding.

http://xenohistorian.faithweb.com/africa/images/Timbuktu.JPG

In the capital Niana the Mansa erected the famous Hall of Audience a grand structure which boasted some of the finest examples of architectural techniques of the time including cut stone, adornments of arabesques, windows framed in gold and silver, wooden floors framed in silver foil and surmounted by a dome.


Although many people in Mali maintained their indigenous religions during this time, Islam was becoming well established throughout the kingdom. The people in the gold-producing area remained pagan, and when a Mali king tried to convert them, it threatened to disrupt gold production, and the pressure for conversion was withdrawn.

http://xenohistorian.faithweb.com/africa/images/Mali.jpg


The fourteenth-century traveler Ibn Battuta visited ancient Mali a few decades after Musa's death and was much impressed by the peace and lawfulness he found strictly enforced there. The Mali empire extended over an area larger than western Europe and consisted of numerous vassal kingdoms and provinces. Following Mansa Musa's death, Mali went into a long decline, shrinking to the size of its original territory by 1645.


Ibn Battuta describes the Malians as such:
The blacks are seldom unjust and have a greater abhorrence to injustice than any other people. Their Sultan shows no mercy to anyone who is guilty of the act. There is complete security in their country. Neither traveler nor inhabitant in it has anything to fear from robbers or men of violence.

By way of establishing diplomatic ties with other African nations Emperor Mansa Musa sent hand picked gifts of friendship to the sultan of Morocco Abu Al-Hassan who in like manner send lavish presents but Emperor Mansa Musa died before they could reach his court. His successor Mansa Suleiman nonetheless received the gifts and established a tradition of similar exchanges for years to come.

By the fifteenth century, and like Ghana before it, the empire of Mali fell victim to internal feuding, droughts and invasion.
Mansa Musa's brother Sulayman (1341-60) managed the realm effectively, but none of the kings that followed were very competent, and the Mali empire declined as fast as it had risen. Part of the problem was the issue of succession; even in the beginning, Sundiata seemed to want the throne to pass from brother to brother, not from father to son. Within two generations after Mansa Musa's death, his vast fortune was spent. In 1375 Gao became independent, and the Songhay built an empire of their own that soon eclipsed Mali. Our list of Mali kings stops abruptly with the crowning of one Mahmud in 1390, leading some scholars to believe the kingdom broke into two or three parts at the end of the fourteenth century.
By 1400 the Senegambia region was also independent; most of Senegal and Gambia came under the domination of a settled tribe, the Wolof, while a pastoral tribe, the Fulani, migrated east toward the Niger River. On the banks of the upper Niger, the last part of Mali survived until the 1490s, but from the mid-fifteenth century onward, Songhay was West Africa's most important state.

http://hblg-apwh.weebly.com/uploads/2/4/3/5/24358622/2307297_orig.jpg

https://everythingspossible.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/img_0347.jpg

https://media1.britannica.com/eb-media/84/178084-004-A7B85647.jpg

http://www.accessgambia.com/information/large/mali-11.jpg

http://sirismm.si.edu/eepa/eep1/eepa_16094.jpg

https://awayfarers.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/house-1.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/df/f1/40/dff140a8c43f2406605a122ad769fc5a.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/11/fc/a9/11fca9ac0630a99194cd1394aa208253.jpg

http://a404.idata.over-blog.com/5/66/62/22/segou.jpg

http://pedagogie84.pagesperso-orange.fr/images/mali/segou-architecture.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3193/2817716635_e3d4443849.jpg

the reason why they have all those "spikes" is practical. it helps the inhabitants to keep maintenance of the building.

[crazyladybutterfly]

UNESCO about Timbuktu :

Home of the prestigious Koranic Sankore University and other madrasas, Timbuktu was an intellectual and spiritual capital and a centre for the propagation of Islam throughout Africa in the 15th and 16th centuries. Its three great mosques, Djingareyber, Sankore and Sidi Yahia, recall Timbuktu's golden age. Although continuously restored, these monuments are today under threat from desertification.

Founded in the 5th century, the economic and cultural apogee of Timbuktu came about during the15th and 16th centuries. It was an important centre for the diffusion of Islamic culture with the University of Sankore, with 180 Koranic schools and 25,000 students. It was also a crossroads and an important market place where the trading of manuscripts was negotiated, and salt from Teghaza in the north, gold was sold, and cattle and grain from the south.

The mosques are exceptional examples of earthen architecture and of traditional maintenance techniques, which continue to the present time.

http://whc.unesco.org/en/list/119/

http://whc.unesco.org/en/list/119/video


https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=j4V-QAzKQ3A



http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-22704960

How Timbuktu's manuscripts were smuggled to safety 4 June 2013


When Islamist rebels set fire to two libraries in Timbuktu earlier this year, many feared the city's treasure trove of ancient manuscripts had been destroyed. But many of the texts had already been removed from the buildings and were at that very moment being smuggled out of the city, under the rebels' noses.

"These manuscripts are really precious to us. They are family heirlooms. Our history, our heritage," says Dr Abdel Kader Haidara, owner of one of Timbuktu's biggest private libraries, containing manuscripts dating back to the 16th Century.
"In our family there have been generations and generations of great scholars, great astronomers, and we have always looked after these documents."

Under their strict interpretation of Islam, the rebels soon began destroying shrines they considered "idolatrous". The documents held in Timbuktu since its glory days as a centre of Islamic learning in the 13th to 17th Centuries were equally vulnerable.
As a precaution, Haidara and other big book-owning families, together with officials of the state-run Ahmed Baba Institute, had already removed most documents from major collections, hiding them in private homes.
After the destruction of the shrines, it became clear a more radical approach was necessary.
"We realised we needed to find another solution to take them entirely out of Timbuktu itself," says Haidara. "It was very difficult. There were loads of manuscripts. We needed thousands of metal boxes and we didn't have the means to get them out. We needed help from outside."

http://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/624/media/images/67954000/jpg/_67954022_boxes.jpg

"One car could only take two or three metal boxes at the most. So we did it little by little."

Haidara estimates that only a few hundred manuscripts were destroyed.

http://www.tombouctoumanuscripts.org/images/sized/images/uploads/Saints_of_Timbuktu-220x218.jpg

http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/65579000/jpg/_65579708_manuscript1.jpg

https://t160k.files.wordpress.com/2014/11/t160k-dsc_8431.jpg

http://www.princeclausfund.org/files/image/2013%20Evacuation%20manuscripts%20Timbuktu,%20copy right%20Prince%20Claus%20Fund%20(6).JPG

https://t160k.org/media/projects/campaign/images/manuscript3.jpg

http://tripfreakz.com/uploads/tim02.jpg

When the European Renaissance was just gaining force, this exotic city on the edge of the Sahara Desert had already been established as the cultural center with a rich literary tradition.

However, in 1591 this miracle was destined to perish under the onslaught of Moroccan invaders. Many outstanding scientists who lived in Timbuktu, were forced to flee or were relocated ny force to the northern regions of Africa.

Scientists estimate that in the Timbuktu town there is no less than 100,000 manuscripts, and 700,000 to a million manuscripts alltogether in Mali.

Scientists believe that in their cultural and historical significance the manuscripts of Timbuktu can be compared with the famous Dead Sea Scrolls. They are a symbol and the essence of African Islamic medieval culture. The texts written in both Arabic and African languages shed light on the historical role of Timbuktu as a guardian of peace in a very troubled region. Ancient manuscripts of Timbuktu demonstrate a vivid example of peaceful coexistence and tolerance in a multicultural world. There are manuscripts on various topics and subjects - such as mathematics, chemistry, physics, optics, astronomy, medicine, theology, history, geography – most areas of human knowledge.

During the occupation of the north of Mali by al-Qaeda in 2012, the residents hid their manuscripts and buried them in the backyards. Out of 40,000 manuscripts from the libraries 4,000 manuscripts - among which were many old Quran writings - were burnt by Islamic radicals, and 10,000 remained intact.

http://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/624/media/images/67957000/jpg/_67957426_ashes_afp464.jpg

The owner of the Mamma Haidara Commemorative Library donated the digital images for everyone to see. Some manuscripts, which were taken in the colonial time can be seen in London, Paris and other cities. An exhibit of some items is also available at the Library of Congress.

Besides being ravaged by time, the manuscripts are facing other threats - improper storage conditions, being illegally sold at the art market or being sold by the poor refugee families for a piece of bread to survive.


http://tripfreakz.com/galleries/the-invaluable-timbuktu-manuscripts/tim07.jpg

http://tripfreakz.com/galleries/the-invaluable-timbuktu-manuscripts/tim05.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-MeMSc3uHzGI/URN8wJ4vNqI/AAAAAAAADTU/1VfO0fmKrAM/s1600/pretty.JPG

http://www.tombouctoumanuscripts.org/images/sized/images/uploads/Djenne_pic1with_cover_1-620x466.JPG

https://arablit.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/manuscript2_200px.jpg

http://www.warscapes.com/sites/default/files/field/image/timbuktu-manuscripts.jpg

In 2016, a book about the manuscripts and the efforts to save them in the midst of the assault and occupation of northern Mali by Islamists jihadis, was published. The book, The Bad-Ass Librarians of Timbuktu, provides vivid details about the collection of the manuscripts into libraries, and subsequent efforts to remove them to safety during the dangerous conflict, in which the Islamist jihadis threatened to destroy them.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkF-RR1-97Q


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vKBcJsqmOA

https://socialfeed.info/from-ancient-christian-texts-to-the-islamic-manuscripts-of-timbuktu-meet-the-2491742

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/mali-al-qaeda-radical-who-destroyed-timbuktu-mausoleums-begs-forgiveness-icc-trial-1577333


https://youtu.be/CJ4U835LjuY

[crazyladybutterfly]

Africa does have a great history and it was because of NORTH AFRICANS.

the ghana empire was destryed by north africans lol

anyway their less negroid neighbours have indeed helped them but with trading, making these african population rich .. there was some cultural influence
but the scholars, their laws, their architects, their gold mining techniques, their gold use techniques , fabrication of weapons etc were all made/invented by local black people.

let's give them credit for it.

[Szegedist]

Ethiopians, Egyptians (and other North Africans) were not Negro Africans, real negroids are indeed to dumb to create any civilisation.

[Szegedist]

But still no evidence that those cultures fulfilled the criteria of advanced civilizations:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?196562-African-civilizations&p=4094800&viewfull=1#post4094800

Note that e.g. Mesoamerican and Andean civilizations did fulfill most of these criteria.
The word "civilisation" is used very liberally in this thread. Cave paintings and sharpened tools are not "civilisation".

[NetflixFan]

Ethiopians, Egyptians (and other North Africans) were not Negro Africans, real negroids are indeed to dumb to create any civilisation.

Also, Black Africans have never even developed a written script let alone invented the wheel. Everything in this thread is utter LIES.

[crazyladybutterfly]

lol at the butthurt racists :rofl:

anyway where have I included cave painting as form of civilization? the only one who mentioned them was livtin and it was about aboriginal australians and i don't think they're "too dumb" to create any meaningful civilization , it has to do with environment and isolation .. anyway throughout MOST of their existence pure white people lived without any sort of civilization .. lol

[crazyladybutterfly]

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=61390&d=1471874957

+


Ancient Ghana ruled from around 300 to 1100 CE.


menas , south europeans , some amerindians, sudanese , soninke people (+ other subsaharians) smarter than central and northern europeans?

sudanese and soninke people had a much less favorable environment too :rofl:

[LieDetector]

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=61390&d=1471874957

sudanese smarter than central and northern europeans?

North Africans built it lol

[Kamal900]

lol at the butthurt racists :rofl:

anyway where have I included cave painting as form of civilization? the only one who mentioned them was livtin and it was about aboriginal australians and i don't think they're "too dumb" to create any meaningful civilization , it has to do with environment and isolation .. anyway throughout MOST of their existence pure white people lived without any sort of civilization .. lol

Ironically, the more darker or Australoid looking peoples of Southern India tend to be more advanced and smarter than their lighter counterparts of northern India. Black history is very under appreciated honestly.

[Szegedist]

And yet, superior African civilisation got rekt.

[Szegedist]

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Rome_451596_755053.jpg

[crazyladybutterfly]

North Africans built it lol

yeah north africans with such black skin??? historians agree that it was the subsaharians..

[LieDetector]

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Rome_451596_755053.jpg

https://poseidonawoke.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/cutamprvaaacg0w.jpg

[crazyladybutterfly]

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Rome_451596_755053.jpg

true , too bad only a small minority of african people lives in such primitive way

and some european people (ex saamis) wouldnt live much differently if it wasn't for the influence of other europeans.

[crazyladybutterfly]

https://poseidonawoke.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/cutamprvaaacg0w.jpg

you weren't living in the caves but in huts made of wood. i give you credit for that

[crazyladybutterfly]

And yet, superior African civilisation got rekt.

well westerners are going to get "rekt" by east and south asians :D

[Szegedist]

true , too bad only a small minority of african people lives in such primitive way



Yeah, most live like this instead. Dat progress.jpg

http://www.welthungerhilfe.de/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/slum_afrika_1050x700-690x460.jpg

[NetflixFan]

well westerners are going to get "rekt" by east and south asians :D

Do you know how easy it is for a Black American to be accepted to Ivy League or high end university with mediocre grades and SAT scores? If Black people are so advanced and sophisticated, why do they need affirmative action?

[crazyladybutterfly]

Do you know how easy it is for a Black American to be accepted to Ivy League or high end university with mediocre grades and SAT scores? If Black people are so advanced and sophisticated, why do they need affirmative action?

they are no different than poor rednecks in terms of education. if what you're saying is true (that they're accepted in universities only for their race) then i am against it , but i have only read (from "confirmed sources") that they're favored by some companies ..

[crazyladybutterfly]

Yeah, most live like this instead. Dat progress.jpg

http://www.welthungerhilfe.de/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/slum_afrika_1050x700-690x460.jpg

much better thabìn that (the majority)

they're still poor thoufh but this can be blamed to colonialism (both "the old good one" and the recent economical one) and corruption (on wikileaks you'll find many documents about this, regarding in particular the republic of congo) of their politicians and even UN

[Peterski]

Paris should also be added to the UNESCO list of African heritage sites: :cool:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfkDzXuWhkk


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQkkEwSyAoA

[Antimage]

People aren't concerned about their past, but their present.

[NetflixFan]

they are no different than poor rednecks in terms of education. if what you're saying is true (that they're accepted in universities only for their race) then i am against it , but i have only read (from "confirmed sources") that they're favored by some companies ..

by what companies? you read WRONG or NONSENSE. You really think Silicon Valley start ups would prefer Black American and Nigerian programmers over the ones they already have? lol. I'm pretty sure they are happy with Indian H1bs (which is another topic of discussion)

[Peterski]

you weren't living in the caves but in huts made of wood. i give you credit for that

I'd rather live in one of these huts made of wood in Alaska, than in a crowded neighbourhood in Detroit:

http://s-static.cinccdn.com/images/uploads/UPVLZZZWX6QN15VB.jpg

http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/4d/ff/d5/4dffd5a717f2e4e297f7c95fcd0e2d95.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/87/06/0c/87060cf460c6b23afb7d4f96578e5751.jpg

http://archzine.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/H%C3%BCtte-Blockhaus-Gebirge-Wald-See.jpg

[crazyladybutterfly]

I'd rather live in one of these huts made of wood in Alaska, than in a crowded neighbourhood in Detroit:

http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/4d/ff/d5/4dffd5a717f2e4e297f7c95fcd0e2d95.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/87/06/0c/87060cf460c6b23afb7d4f96578e5751.jpg

http://archzine.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/H%C3%BCtte-Blockhaus-Gebirge-Wald-See.jpg

but the ancient europeans' huts werent that much comfortable :P

oh and some even had human sacrifies and slavery .. i dont know if your fate would be rosy if you travel back in time and end up at the hands of such european populations (though the same can be said by some of the subsaharians)

[Peterski]

Still barbarian lifestyle was better than life of poor urban plebs in "civilized" societies:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEvjPGtQ4oc#t=48m15s

Full documentary:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEvjPGtQ4oc

[Taiguaitiaoghyrmmumin]

People over estimate Native civilizations way too much. Truth is African civilizations were stronger, Also most of them outlasted Native civilizations. Most african empires died around mid 1850 -1900. Most Native Civilizations died out way before that. The only exception is the mapuche an Iroquois nation. Others ended up defeated or put on reserves forced to live in The Euro controlled colonial society or scattered out in small communities. native civilizations were impressive but way over estimated

[Melki]

Also, Black Africans have never even developed a written script let alone invented the wheel. Everything in this thread is utter LIES.

Ancient Mayas never made metal weapons or tools, and never invented the wheel. But it never prevented them from becoming one of the most advanced civilizations in ancient history.

Their knowledge of astronomy was astonishing. They developed a precise system of calendars and sundials, were able to predict in advance any solar eclipse, comet, the position and movement of the stars and the planets, solstice and equinox dates for the two next milleniums and with an extraordinary accuracy.

They were masters of mathematics, their temples and pyramides were perfectly shaped, totally symetrical, built to last several milleniums, just like the Ancient Egyptians and Greeks.

I bet this young fellow (now banned) has never visited the Mayan, Teotihuacan, Toltec or Aztec archaeological sites in Mexico or Central America. I bet he believes that Heroic Fantasy Viking warriors and a Playstation 4 are the greatest Human achievements.

[Melki]

The word "civilisation" is used very liberally in this thread. Cave paintings and sharpened tools are not "civilisation".

The Huns, the different Celtic and Germanic tribes and the Vikings were even less advanced. It didn't prevent them from developing civilizations of their own.

Many years ago I visited the ruined city of Great Zimbabwe in ex-Rhodesia. I was the only tourist. I had this huge and impressive site only for myself...it was a heaven for the baboons and the vervet monkeys.

Next to the ruins, a museum displayed the objects found in the archaeological site. The most notable were Ming-dynasty porcelain fragments.
The obvious proof that southern Africans had contacts with China in the 15th century. Chinese Admiral Zheng He was an experimented navigator who sailed all the way to Africa.

Back in those days, it was the Middle-Ages in almost all Europe. Only the Italian City-States were really advanced, the Byzantine Empire was finishing to collapse.

[Leo Iscariot]

The Kingdom of Mali

Mali first appeared as a tribal kingdom around the ninth century, but until the reign of Sundiata Keita (1230-55), it had always been in Ghana's shadow. By 1300, Mali not only ruled Ghana but also Senegal and Gambia (giving the kingdom an outlet on the Atlantic), Walata, Gao, and Tadmekka. Gao was the home of the Songhay, a tribe we'll be hearing a lot from in the next chapter, and Tadmekka was a source of copper, a commodity so much in demand that foot-long rods of copper were used as currency.

The Kingdom of Mali came to control the gold trade that the Kingdom of Ghana had controlled before it, but it also expanded its trading in many ways. The Kingdom of Mali controlled the salt trade in the north and many caravan trade routes. Additionally, it traded extensively with Egypt and the copper mine areas to the east.

The most celebrated king of Mali was Mansa Musa. He greatly extended Mali's territory and power during his reign. He made a name for himself in distant regions throughout the Muslim world through his pilgrimage to Mecca, which is in present-day Saudi Arabia. Sixty thousand people and eighty camels carrying 300 lbs. of gold each accompanied him to Mecca.


Several great centers of Islamic learning were also established during the Kingdom of Mali. Among them were the legendary Timbuktu, Djenne, and Gao. Scholars came from all over the Muslim world to study at these places, which have a long and rich history of learning in religion, mathematics, music, law, and literature.
It was in these cities that vast libraries were built and madrasas (Islamic universities) were endowed. They became meeting-places of the finest poets, scholars, and artists of Africa and the Middle East.
Timbuktu, in particular, had become legendary in the European imagination, representing all the wealth of Africa. The kings of Mali made it a great religious center as well as a commercial center. Over the course of the fourteenth and fifteenth centuries, 150 madrasas (Moslem religious schools) were built, and the copying of religious manuscripts became an important industry. By the early sixteenth century, Timbuktu had a population of 40,000, and its book trade provided a better profit than any other kind of commerce. Timbuktu's most prominent landmark is the Sankore Mosque, built in the fourteenth century. The walls are made out of adobe, and every year, after the rainy season, the structure needs to be resurfaced with fresh mud; the poles sticking out are then used as scaffolding.

http://xenohistorian.faithweb.com/africa/images/Timbuktu.JPG

In the capital Niana the Mansa erected the famous Hall of Audience a grand structure which boasted some of the finest examples of architectural techniques of the time including cut stone, adornments of arabesques, windows framed in gold and silver, wooden floors framed in silver foil and surmounted by a dome.


Although many people in Mali maintained their indigenous religions during this time, Islam was becoming well established throughout the kingdom. The people in the gold-producing area remained pagan, and when a Mali king tried to convert them, it threatened to disrupt gold production, and the pressure for conversion was withdrawn.

http://xenohistorian.faithweb.com/africa/images/Mali.jpg


The fourteenth-century traveler Ibn Battuta visited ancient Mali a few decades after Musa's death and was much impressed by the peace and lawfulness he found strictly enforced there. The Mali empire extended over an area larger than western Europe and consisted of numerous vassal kingdoms and provinces. Following Mansa Musa's death, Mali went into a long decline, shrinking to the size of its original territory by 1645.


Ibn Battuta describes the Malians as such:
The blacks are seldom unjust and have a greater abhorrence to injustice than any other people. Their Sultan shows no mercy to anyone who is guilty of the act. There is complete security in their country. Neither traveler nor inhabitant in it has anything to fear from robbers or men of violence.

By way of establishing diplomatic ties with other African nations Emperor Mansa Musa sent hand picked gifts of friendship to the sultan of Morocco Abu Al-Hassan who in like manner send lavish presents but Emperor Mansa Musa died before they could reach his court. His successor Mansa Suleiman nonetheless received the gifts and established a tradition of similar exchanges for years to come.

By the fifteenth century, and like Ghana before it, the empire of Mali fell victim to internal feuding, droughts and invasion.
Mansa Musa's brother Sulayman (1341-60) managed the realm effectively, but none of the kings that followed were very competent, and the Mali empire declined as fast as it had risen. Part of the problem was the issue of succession; even in the beginning, Sundiata seemed to want the throne to pass from brother to brother, not from father to son. Within two generations after Mansa Musa's death, his vast fortune was spent. In 1375 Gao became independent, and the Songhay built an empire of their own that soon eclipsed Mali. Our list of Mali kings stops abruptly with the crowning of one Mahmud in 1390, leading some scholars to believe the kingdom broke into two or three parts at the end of the fourteenth century.
By 1400 the Senegambia region was also independent; most of Senegal and Gambia came under the domination of a settled tribe, the Wolof, while a pastoral tribe, the Fulani, migrated east toward the Niger River. On the banks of the upper Niger, the last part of Mali survived until the 1490s, but from the mid-fifteenth century onward, Songhay was West Africa's most important state.

http://hblg-apwh.weebly.com/uploads/2/4/3/5/24358622/2307297_orig.jpg

https://everythingspossible.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/img_0347.jpg

https://media1.britannica.com/eb-media/84/178084-004-A7B85647.jpg

http://www.accessgambia.com/information/large/mali-11.jpg

http://sirismm.si.edu/eepa/eep1/eepa_16094.jpg

https://awayfarers.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/house-1.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/df/f1/40/dff140a8c43f2406605a122ad769fc5a.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/11/fc/a9/11fca9ac0630a99194cd1394aa208253.jpg

http://a404.idata.over-blog.com/5/66/62/22/segou.jpg

http://pedagogie84.pagesperso-orange.fr/images/mali/segou-architecture.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3193/2817716635_e3d4443849.jpg

the reason why they have all those "spikes" is practical. it helps the inhabitants to keep maintenance of the building.

Not to mention that Musa gave out so much gold on his trip to Egypt that he cause a massive decline in its value.

[Numidia]

Punic empire

http://www.riadreviews.com/assets/images/misc/resources/phoeniciancolontradeposts.jpg

[VuduNet]

Ancient Mayas never made metal weapons or tools, and never invented the wheel. But it never prevented them from becoming one of the most advanced civilizations in ancient history.

Their knowledge of astronomy was astonishing. They developed a precise system of calendars and sundials, were able to predict in advance any solar eclipse, comet, the position and movement of the stars and the planets, solstice and equinox dates for the two next milleniums and with an extraordinary accuracy.

They were masters of mathematics, their temples and pyramides were perfectly shaped, totally symetrical, built to last several milleniums, just like the Ancient Egyptians and Greeks.

I bet this young fellow (now banned) has never visited the Mayan, Teotihuacan, Toltec or Aztec archaeological sites in Mexico or Central America. I bet he believes that Heroic Fantasy Viking warriors and a Playstation 4 are the greatest Human achievements.

They also practiced human sacrifice and cannibalism, as did Black Africans (and continue to do, as some reports suggest). And they were NOT one of the most advanced ancient civilizations.

[JMack]

Punic empire

http://www.riadreviews.com/assets/images/misc/resources/phoeniciancolontradeposts.jpg

This is not an African Civilization, but a Middle Eastern one. Carthaginians were Phoenicians.

[Numidia]

This is not an African Civilization, but a Middle Eastern one. Carthaginians were Phoenicians.

No carthaginians were mostly north africans with minor immigrants from phoenicia, the capital of punic empire was carthage (tunisia) it has never been a colony of phoenicia, it's christians lebanese who are searching for a identity who claim that. Phoenicia was destroyed by romans and others a long time ago (it started around 2000 BC) that's why the last one have migrated in all the meditteranean.

[JMack]

No carthaginians were mostly north africans with minor immigrants from phoenicia, the capital of punic empire was carthage (tunisia) it has never been a colony of phoenicia, it's christians lebanese who are searching for a identity who claim that. Phoenicia was destroyed by romans and others a long time ago (it started around 2000 BC) that's why the last one have migrated in all the meditteranean.

So much dumbness in only one post... There wasn't any 'Romans' in 2000 BC. Carthaginians, for what we know, were culturally Phoenician, they spoke Phoenician language, worshiped Levantine gods (e.g. Baal) and were probably mostly Levantines racially.

[Melki]

I didn't include Ancient Egypt, the Punic Empire, nor the Umayyad Empire, the Almoravid Dynasty and the Almohad Empire to my list because in my opinion, these civilizations belonged to the Mediterranean civilizational area. I prefered to focus on SSA.


They also practiced human sacrifice and cannibalism, as did Black Africans (and continue to do, as some reports suggest). And they were NOT one of the most advanced ancient civilizations.

This comment was left by another banned sockpuppet, so I wonder why I'm wasting my time, but whatever...

Human sacrifices and cannibalism were practices common to several regions in the world, including Europe in times of famine.

Later, cannibalism was overly used by Europeans to stygmatize the colonized "savage" people and justify the presence of European missionaries, enslavers, gold prospectors, ivory poachers...evenually leading to that famous stereotype:

http://zupimages.net/up/16/49/m82k.jpg (http://zupimages.net/viewer.php?id=16/49/m82k.jpg)

Cannibalism was a true practice in the Americas, New Guinea, Africa and even China, but corresponded most of the time to ancient sacred rites:
-The dead corpse of the ancestor was incinerated, reduced to powder and mixed to a liquid, absorbed by the members of the family or even the whole tribe, so that the spirit of the ancestor could live forever in them.
-A small piece of flesh belonging to the dead enemy was ingurgitated by the victorious tribe in order to gain the power and the spirit animal of the defeated opponents.

In all cases, it's the demonstration of a sophisticated culture, not a proof of barbarian inferiority.

But sometimes, cannibalism was the tragic result of overhunting:
Mammals were very rare in New Zealand. The giant avifauna was depleted and finally exterminated by the Maoris who came from the Polynesian islands. Starving to death, the peaceful Maoris began to develop a warlike culture, eating their captured enemies in order to survive.
When the first British colons arrived, the Maoris were no longer cannibals, but were still fierce warriors.

And remember that anthropophagy saved the lives of these Uruguayan rugby players whose plane had crashed in the Andes.

You should better read anthropologist Claude Lévi-Strauss instead of opening fake accounts to spread bullshit.

[Taiguaitiaoghyrmmumin]

Ancient Mayas never made metal weapons or tools, and never invented the wheel. But it never prevented them from becoming one of the most advanced civilizations in ancient history.

Their knowledge of astronomy was astonishing. They developed a precise system of calendars and sundials, were able to predict in advance any solar eclipse, comet, the position and movement of the stars and the planets, solstice and equinox dates for the two next milleniums and with an extraordinary accuracy.

They were masters of mathematics, their temples and pyramides were perfectly shaped, totally symetrical, built to last several milleniums, just like the Ancient Egyptians and Greeks.

I bet this young fellow (now banned) has never visited the Mayan, Teotihuacan, Toltec or Aztec archaeological sites in Mexico or Central America. I bet he believes that Heroic Fantasy Viking warriors and a Playstation 4 are the greatest Human achievements.

They invented the wheel but It was only used as a toy. But yea they never invented metal tools I think. They used Obsidian I think instead. I know aztecs used obsidian blades for their machetes

[johen]

Cannibalism was a true practice in the Americas, New Guinea, Africa and even China, but corresponded most of the time to ancient sacred rites:
-The dead corpse of the ancestor was incinerated, reduced to powder and mixed to a liquid, absorbed by the members of the family or even the whole tribe, so that the spirit of the ancestor could live forever in them.
-A small piece of flesh belonging to the dead enemy was ingurgitated by the victorious tribe in order to gain the power and the spirit animal of the defeated opponents.

In all cases, it's the demonstration of a sophisticated culture, not a proof of barbarian inferiority.


I am always curious about american Indian and polynesian's cannibalism, looking for the reason. However, I have never heard that there were cannibalism in ancient china, even if there were human sacrifice practice. Can you tell me more details?

[Taiguaitiaoghyrmmumin]

I am always curious about american Indian and polynesian's cannibalism, looking for the reason. However, I have never heard that there were cannibalism in ancient china, even if there were human sacrifice practice. Can you tell me more details?

There was cannibalism in Europe also sometimes but not as much. Druids used to perform religious cannibalism. And I saw something about british royal family doing that. Sometimes in the crusades they used to eat Muslims bodies also.

[Taiguaitiaoghyrmmumin]

So much dumbness in only one post... There wasn't any 'Romans' in 2000 BC. Carthaginians, for what we know, were culturally Phoenician, they spoke Phoenician language, worshiped Levantine gods (e.g. Baal) and were probably mostly Levantines racially.

phonecians were lebanese who migrated to north africa and spain.

[Melki]

I am always curious about american Indian and polynesian's cannibalism, looking for the reason. However, I have never heard that there were cannibalism in ancient china, even if there were human sacrifice practice. Can you tell me more details?

I read it once in one of my books, I have to find it again. The author claimed that anthropophagy has always been an universal practice as old as the first Humanoids. He drew up a list of various people in the 6 continents who used to practice cannibalism at some point or another. Among them were the Irish, the Basques and the Chinese. Whether it was to perform religious rituals or due to a famine like in the case of the Maoris was not precised.

However, what Taiguaitiaoghyrmmumin wrote about the druids looks interesting.

[Numidia]

So much dumbness in only one post... There wasn't any 'Romans' in 2000 BC. Carthaginians, for what we know, were culturally Phoenician, they spoke Phoenician language, worshiped Levantine gods (e.g. Baal) and were probably mostly Levantines racially.

Because you don't see your own dumbness trying to teach me north african history punic is not a phoenician language, some used to pray baal, levantine is not a racial group dna test on mummie show that cartaginians were north african this phoenician were more sailors than a sedentary people

[Bezprym]

So much dumbness in only one post... There wasn't any 'Romans' in 2000 BC. Carthaginians, for what we know, were culturally Phoenician, they spoke Phoenician language, worshiped Levantine gods (e.g. Baal) and were probably mostly Levantines racially.


Because you don't see your own dumbness trying to teach me north african history punic is not a phoenician language, some used to pray baal, levantine is not a racial group dna test on mummie show that cartaginians were north african this phoenician were more sailors than a sedentary people

I think you both actually agree with each other, but talk about two different things. :p

Phoenicians were for Carthaginians similar people as Vikings for Kievan Rus. They came and created the fundaments of Carthage, but people who later will be called as Carthaginians already lived there. Phoenicians were merchants, they haven't moved from Phoenicia to Tunisia. They brought their culture, which was a root of Carthaginian identity. But Carthaginians weren't Phoenicians per se.

[Mingle]

I think you both actually agree with each other, but talk about two different things. :p

Phoenicians were for Carthaginians similar people as Vikings for Kievan Rus. They came and created the fundaments of Carthage, but people who later will be called as Carthaginians already lived there. Phoenicians were merchants, they haven't moved from Phoenicia to Tunisia. They brought their culture, which was a root of Carthaginian identity. But Carthaginians weren't Phoenicians per se.

The Vikings were just the ruling elite of Kievan Rus, not the majority population. And they founded Rus but did nothing else.

The Phoenicians and Carthaginians are one and the same. They spoke the same language, lived on the same land, and had the same culture. Saying that they are different is like saying that the Soviet Union and Russia are different.

[Wadaad]

Carthaginian civilization was similar to Arab civilization in the Swahili coast of East Africa (Mombasa, Zanzibar, Dar es Salaam). There was a 'punicization' of the Berbers in the Tunisian and Algerian hinterlands, but Carthaginians maintained their levantine culture and religions (Baal/Molec worship). All that would come to an end with the formation of the Roman province of Africa.

[Bezprym]

Saying that they are different is like saying that the Soviet Union and Russia are different.

...

I think I simply won't comment your post.

[Mingle]

...

I think I simply won't comment your post.

What's the big difference between Phoenicia and Carthage? They were the same people and spoke the same language. Its similar to Russia and the SU. The Vikings were just a tiny minority i.e. the ruling elite of Kievan Rus.

[Wadaad]

What's the big difference between Phoenicia and Carthage? They were the same people and spoke the same language. Its similar to Russia and the SU. The Vikings were just a tiny minority i.e. the ruling elite of Kievan Rus.

More like England and (WASP) America. The Maghreb, Balaeric islands and Southern Iberia was the 'new world' for Phoenicia.

[Bezprym]

What's the big difference between Phoenicia and Carthage? They were the same people and spoke the same language. Its similar to Russia and the SU. The Vikings were just a tiny minority i.e. the ruling elite of Kievan Rus.

You basically suggest that Phoenicians came to Tunisia, built Carthage in 814 BCE, and had so much sex to produce so much children, to be eventually able to create a powerful military - powerful enough to be potentially able to resist Rome? Or maybe they simply had a great exodus from present day Lebanon and they settled in the middle of nowhere deciding: here we will built Carthage, since it is a very peaceful, uninhabited place?

There were people already.

[Ta seti]

Ya , Sudan got some very nice monuments , but it's connected to Egypt (mainly the same shape but different design) , our Pyramids in Egypt were Huge and consisted of many floors , while Sudan pyramids were kinda small with small chambers , but inside of it were paintings same to Egyptian ones.

Sudan , Nubia and Egypt complete each others.

Actually we do complete each others. Here is one of the larger pyramids in Sudan.

Most of the pyramids is ruined, but some of the pyramids is conserved.


http://www.designindaba.com/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/node/news/19092/gallery/sudan-08nuri0438.jpg?itok=TEqh5jyR


http://orientenresor.se/wp-content/blogs.dir/1/files/2011/10/Nuri-F-31-700x350.jpg


http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=63287&d=1481423913


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ea/Sudan_Nuri_Pyramids_2012a.jpg

Inside one of the pyramids in the complex.



One of the last kings of the 25th Dynasty, Taharqa (known in the bible, Kings 19:9, as Tirakah), moved to Nuri, a site just on the other side of the river from Gebel Barkal, to build his pyramid. There, he built a much larger pyramid measuring some 51.75 meters square with a height of between 40 and 50 meters. It was the largest pyramid ever built at Nuri, and is unique among the Nubian pyramids in having been built in two stages. The first pyramid was encased in smooth sandstone. Drawings and written reports of the early 19th century reveal the truncated top of the inner pyramid projecting from the top of the decaying outer pyramid. The outer pyramid was the first of a type with stepped courses and planed corners. It had a sloped angle of about 69 degrees. An enclosure wall tightly encircled the pyramid, but Reisner was not able to unearth any traces of a chapel.



However, the subterranean chambers of this pyramid are the most elaborate of any Nubian tomb. The entrance was by way of an eastern stairway trench, north of the pyramid's central axis, but in alignment with the original smaller pyramid. Three steps led down to a doorway with a molded frame and cavetto cornice. The doorway then led to a tunnel that widened and opened into an antechamber with a barrel- vaulted ceiling. Six huge pillars carved from the natural rock divided the burial chamber into two side aisles and a central nave, each with a barrel-vaulted ceiling.



Though a rectangular recess was cut into the floor of the burial chamber for a sarcophagus, no sarcophagus was found. In addition, there were four rectangular niches in the north and south walls and two in the west wall. The whole of the chamber was surrounded by a moat-like corridor that could be entered by way of steps leading down from in front of the antechamber doorway. Another set of steps led to the corridor from the west end of the nave. Indeed, the whole arrangement is not unlike the Osireion, a symbolic Osiris tomb built by Seti I at Abydos.

http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/nubiapyramids.htm


The chambers would look something like this according to Reisner.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4075/4746300026_82b391c273_b.jpg


http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/03/69/f5/97/real-egypt-tours-day.jpg


Excavation of the pyramid complex by American Archaeologist George Reisner. Here is the link of his excavation(below) link

https://books.google.com/books?id=J84aAAAAYAAJ&pg=RA1-PA67&lpg=RA1-PA67&dq=george+reisner+at+nuri+pyramids&source=bl&ots=GgYp-bkL-f&sig=jAR3CRZUqCF0TYCy1OwK9MGhCwc&hl=en&sa=X&ei=JI6JUev8Kca6iwLCj4DICA#v=onepage&q=george%20reisner%20at%20nuri%20pyramids&f=false

[Ta seti]

Soleb Temple ruins Sudan.

http://i-cias.com/e.o/slides/soleb02.jpg


http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/51754160.jpg

[Robocop]

I remember going to the MEC in NYC, tons of history from all around the world from Egypt (north Africa) to Asia, Europe and so on, and honestly the rest of African section was unimpressive, there was a few people visiting and I could see why. I'm not saying Africans didn't do anything, but even in that museum there wasn't much worth to see, specially in contrast to the rest of impressive things displayed there :/

We cannot count Egypt as "African" civilization, this thread is about black ppl civilizations. :)

[Annie999]

We cannot count Egypt as "African" civilization, this thread is about black ppl civilizations. :)

I agree, and maybe I expressed myself wrong, but I didn't mean to include Egypt as "African", at least not SSA (that's why I said "north Africa", to make a distinction) and then I said "the rest of Africa". Egypt civilization was something else indeed, and they weren't black (SSA) that's why I didn't include them with the rest of Africa.

[Robocop]

I agree, and maybe I expressed myself wrong, but I didn't mean to include Egypt as "African", at least not SSA (that's why I said "north Africa", to make a distinction) and then I said "the rest of Africa". Egypt civilization was something else indeed, and they weren't black (SSA) that's why I didn't include them with the rest of Africa.

I have nothin against blacks, but they are going on my nerves when they claim Ancient Egypt as "black civilization", and believe it or not, many AfroAmericans think that is a fact.

Pathetic lol.

And what's worse today western education is encouraging them in that even though that is total Historical blasphemy/idiocracy.

Ancient Egyptians were more or less like present day ones, nevermind today Egyptians are arabized in terms of language.

[Bezprym]

I have nothin against blacks, but they are going on my nerves when they claim Ancient Egypt as "black civilization", and believe it or not, many AfroAmericans think that is a fact.


Anubis was black.

His head at least

[Ta seti]

(Amara West) in Northern Sudan. Continuing excavation at this site here by both local and foreign Archaeologist.

The temple is reburied in the Sudan.

https://eesamarawestexpedition.files.wordpress.com/2015/08/aw-pict-38-39-a182.jpg


http://www.bible.ca/archeology/bible-archeology-yahweh-inscription-cartouche-land-of-the-shasu-of-yahweh-amarah-west-temple-rameses-II-1304-1237bc.jpg

Recent finds.

https://britishmuseumamarawestblog.files.wordpress.com/2015/02/img_2431.jpg?w=815&h=1245


The fragments of two sandstone doorjambs in the shaft of G321, with sandbags used to keep the fill of the chamber from entering the shaft.

The shaft of G321, the better preserved pyramid itself already yielded some very important finds. Discarded in the shaft, 4m below the surface, were fragments of two large sandstone doorjambs. Both bear finely carved hieroglyphic inscriptions and may once have stood at the entrance to the funerary chapel.

https://blog.amarawest.britishmuseum.org/2015/02/

https://britishmuseumamarawestblog.files.wordpress.com/2015/02/west-gate-out-to-w-suburb-1.jpg?w=815&h=567



We intend to undertake a full architectural recording of the monument, including additional inscriptions, to better understood how it was built, modified and used. It needs to be reburied before the end of the season to protect it for future generations. Other than the imposing monumentality of the gateway – over 6m long, over 3m wide, and once standing over 4m tall – it is striking how the ground level of the house outside are set high above it, partly set on rubbish dumps.



https://britishmuseumamarawestblog.files.wordpress.com/2015/02/boshi-shaft.jpg


At a depth of 2.5m below present surface, workmen Al-Nezir Mohamed (“Bushi”) and Abou Ad (right) revealed the top of an ancient doorway in the shaft cut through the schist bedrock below pyramid G321. Patience is needed, with the sand fill removed by hauling buckets up the shaft, before we can glimpse into the burial chamber.

[Robocop]

Anubis was black.

His head at least

LOL, the only black Egyptian ever. lol

[Ta seti]

Ruins of Jebel Barkal Sudan this is inside the santuary.

http://c8.alamy.com/comp/AJ2Y0F/jebel-barkal-the-temple-of-amon-from-above-AJ2Y0F.jpg

http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/engravings-inside-the-temple-of-the-goddess-mut-at-the-foot-of-jebel-picture-id649028323?k=6&m=649028323&s=594x594&w=0&h=YrShYrxcuP90fHYFppV4Ix27KTGOYMGevOdA7SSGL_I=


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3290/2964951592_dac077b746.jpg

http://www.learningsites.com/GebelBarkal-2/B303-NandEwalls_EF.jpg


http://l7.alamy.com/zooms/82021e5153384d849df8b7acdce3d488/mammisi-chapel-of-the-temple-of-amun-at-the-foot-of-jebel-barkal-karima-d6a7tm.jpg

http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/sudan-northern-province-karima-mammisi-chapel-of-the-temple-of-amun-picture-id534994366


http://c8.alamy.com/comp/FWF05J/karima-temple-of-mut-at-jebel-barkal-FWF05J.jpg


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8543/8650053801_dbcaafa567_z.jpg

[Ta seti]

Nigeria bust 12th century and 13 century, i believe the Yoruba or IFE people

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-v9OPaOrxomA/UpgkqMINsjI/AAAAAAAADRU/B6vmwbMlJrc/s1600/Screen+Shot+2013-11-28+at+10.22.17+PM.png

http://medieval-illumination.blogspot.com/2013/11/nigerian-busts-12-15th-century.html


http://arttattler.com/Images/NorthAmerica/NewYork/Brooklyn%20Museum/African%20Innovation/13-Fragment-of-a-Head.jpg

[Ta seti]

Sudanese rarely talk about this period, Which is the former Christian period of the country which consisted of what is today Northern Sudan region and parts of Upper Egypt, at one time it reached as far as Akhmim.


By the middle of the tenth century, hostilities had again broken out with Egypt. The Nubians invaded that country and, benefiting from the state of disorder there, reached, in the year A.D. 962, as far as the town of Akhmim, and for a time controlled Upper Egypt, at least to the north of Edfu. The discovery there of Nubian documents in the monastery of St. Mercurios suggests that it had become a centre of Nubian culture.

http://rumkatkilise.org/nubia.htm

There were three Christian states during this period the Kingdom of Nobatia, Makuria, and Alodia. Makuria pretty much merged with Nobatia fighting against the rulers in Egypt during that period.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makuria
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobatia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alodia
https://blog.britishmuseum.org/2014/08/08/death-the-great-equaliser-christianity-on-the-middle-nile/

Makurian art and how the people during the christian period portraited themselves.

http://i.imgur.com/t6NEDZa.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/Bddei1m.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/Q5363wd.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/hhVoZmG.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/D21MDnv.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/GCeQfFP.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/S2a7hFR.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/WnYmFMz.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/sog6r6O.jpg

http://www.local-life.com/poznan/event/b.31451-1_medieval_africa_revealed.jpg


http://scienceinpoland.pap.pl/Data/Thumbs/_plugins/information/409710/MTAyNHg3Njg,24266115_24208450.jpg



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59Jqul5OTds

[Numidia]

What's the big difference between Phoenicia and Carthage? They were the same people and spoke the same language. Its similar to Russia and the SU. The Vikings were just a tiny minority i.e. the ruling elite of Kievan Rus.

They used to talk punic (mix of amazigh dialects and old phoenician). The phoenician language disappeared a long time ago.


You basically suggest that Phoenicians came to Tunisia, built Carthage in 814 BCE, and had so much sex to produce so much children, to be eventually able to create a powerful military - powerful enough to be potentially able to resist Rome? Or maybe they simply had a great exodus from present day Lebanon and they settled in the middle of nowhere deciding: here we will built Carthage, since it is a very peaceful, uninhabited place?

There were people already.

One of the army that fought rome were composed of 400 000 soldiers (mostly natives maghrebians and spagniards/south italians). Even carthaginians/phoenicians area in south europe were mostly composed of natives. Dna tests on coastal maghrebians have revealed that their are north african with a little spanish/italians admixture because of trade. I have no idea why some lebanese claim phoenicians nobody know from where they came from, at first they have settled in east mediterranean coasts not in lebanon

[Ta seti]

Queen Tiye ruins Sedeinga in Northern Sudan. She is the mother of Akhenaten and grand mother of King tut.



Tiye (c. 1398 BC – 1338 BC, also spelled Taia, Tiy and Tiyi) was the daughter of Yuya and Tjuyu (also spelled Thuyu). She became the Great Royal Wife of the Egyptian pharaoh Amenhotep III. She was the mother of Akhenaten and grandmother of Tutankhamun. Her mummy was identified as "The Elder Lady" found in the tomb of Amenhotep II (KV35) in 2010.



Her husband devoted a number of shrines to her and constructed a temple dedicated to her in Sedeinga in Nubia where she was worshipped as a form of the goddess Hathor-Tefnut.[9] He also had an artificial lake built for her in his Year 12.[10] As the American Egyptologists David O'Connor and Eric Cline note:
“ The unprecedented thing about Tiyi. ... is not where she came from but what she became. No previous queen ever figured so prominently in her husband's lifetime. Tiyi regularly appeared besides Amenhotep III in statuary, tomb and temple reliefs, and stelae while her name is paired with his on numerous small objects, such as vessels and jewelry, not to mention the large commemorative scarabs, where her name regularly follows his in the dateline. New elements in her portraiture, such as the addition of cows' horns and sun disks—attributes of the goddess Hathor—to her headdress, and her representation in the form of a sphinx—an image formerly reserved for the king—emphasize her role as the king's divine, as well as earthly partner. Amenhotep III built a temple to her in Sedeinga in northern Sudan, where she was worshiped as a form of Hathor ... The temple at Sedeinga was the pendant to Amenhotep III's own, larger temple at Soleb, fifteen kilometres to the south (an arrangement followed a century later by Ramses II at Abu Simbel, where there are likewise two temples, the larger southern temple dedicated to the king, and the smaller, northern temple dedicated to the queen, Nefertiry, as Hathor

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiye

https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7043/6819097276_c01ec1d2e5_b.jpg

http://m5.i.pbase.com/o6/93/329493/1/120833465.8zuV2SB3.SudanDec091794.jpg

http://nubie-international.fr/photos/404020MarieJoseGS483.jpg


http://www.dailystar.com.lb/dailystar/Pictures/2013/03/30/160665_img650x420_img650x420_crop.jpg





SEDEINGA

Some Meroitic texts mention gods, dignitaries and priests of Atiye. According to Audran Labrousse, Atiye perpetuates the name given by the Egyptians of the New Kingdom to a place called Hut Tiy (hwt Tiy), the temple of the queen Tiy. Today it is still called Adeye (Atiye) or Sedeinga.
The site includes:


- the remains of a sanctuary for the sovereign Amenhotep III and his spouse, the queen Tiy (c. 1391-1354 BC),
- a large Napatan and Meroitic necropolis (VII Century BC to V Century AD)
- a Christian settlement (VII to XII Century AD)
According to the pre-historian Jacques Reinold, Sedeinga has Neolithic remains. A large necropolis extends for almost a kilometre from north to south, to the west of the Temple.

The temple of the queen Tiy (Hut Tiy)
The excavations of Michela Schiff Giorgini began in 1963. In an area that today is desert, it is no more than a mass of blocks of sandstone with a single column standing, with a Hathor capital. The grooved shaft carries the name of the queen on two sides.
The Hut Tiy is associated with that of Soleb, which is located about 15km further south. Mid-way between them, the speos of Jebel Docha, a rock-cut sanctuary in a mountain by the banks of the Nile, attests the Egyptian presence since Thutmose III.


The investigations of the French Archaeological Mission of Sedeinga confirm that no other structure was erected before the Hut Tiy. The temple is orientated east-west and seems to have been preceded by a colonnade. According to the drawings of R. Lepsius, the hypostyle hall included sixteen columns with Hathor capitals. At the rear, towards the west of the hypostyle hall, a door would have led to the antechamber that gave access to three sanctuaries.


According to Audran Labrousse, the iconography of the reliefs seems to be in accord with the rise to power and the coronation of the sovereign Amenhotep III.
The lintel of the door that led from the vestibule to the hypostyle hall is unique. The publication by E.A. Wallis Budge in 1907, shows in the upper register the queen Tiy with the body of a lion in a walking attitude and a human face wearing a modius (circular head decoration sometimes with a crown superimposed) similar to that worn by the queen Nefertiti. The lower register is decorated with three cartouches on which are superimposed feathers of Maat: the name of the queen is surrounded by those of Amenhotep III (Neb Maat Ra). Among the blocks there are two scenes of the ritual race of the king which bring to mind the feast of Heb-Sed.


As at Soleb, the god Amun and the deified king Amenhotep III are worshipped. The queen is associated with this cult in the form of the goddess Hathor.
During the Napatan and Meroitic periods, it is perhaps in the Hut Tiy that the goddess Isis and the god Horus are worshipped.
précédentstopsuivant vers la gauche nubie-international.frnubie-international.frnubie-international.frnubie-international.frnubie-international.fr vers la droite
nubie-international.fr
Napatean cemetery situated in the western part of the temple of Sedeinga / Nécropole napatéenne située à l'ouest du temple de Sedeinga
The great Napatan and Meroitic necropolis (VII BC – V Century AD)


This necropolis of more than 200 graves extends to the north of the Hut Tiy. It crosses two wadis and covers more than 600m to the south and 200m from east to west.
The superstructures of the graves, made of mud-brick or of black schist are of a pyramidal shape. Their height, with a very steep slope, could reach between 3 and 9m. Oriented east-west, the chamber was accessed through a descendary that could be as long as 17m. Some complexes had in their sub-structure an antechamber and a chamber.
When the earth the grave was dug into was too friable, the chamber took the shape of a shaft covered by a mud-brick vault that supported a fill. The excavators have found modest inhumations: slipper shaped tombs where the deceased was arranged in a small niche in the chamber, or graves with a lateral cut, where the deceased was placed in an extended position on the main axis of the shaft.
The funerary material: besides some bases of wooden coffins, traces of shrouds made of a net of beads, ceramics and perfume burners, numerous bottles, flutes, caliciform cups and globular recipients have also been found. The most beautiful finds are a pair of footed blue flute glasses decorated with gold leaf, representing Osiris seated on a throne. Carriers of offerings process in front of him. An inscription reads Drink (to) live. Without doubt this is a reference to the god of resurrection, Osiris, who since the oldest antiquity is described 'as the one of the wine'.

In 1963 a group of nine pyramids located at about 500m from the Hut Tiy intrigued the archaeologists. They cover the Neolithic burials on the highest point of the site. The most important one (each side measuring 9.8m) in black schist, has the footing of a door jamb, bearing the name and the silhouette of Taharqo. The chamber had been robbed but still presents the remains of a male body of some fifty years of age. Some sheets of gold leaf confirm the presence of rich funerary goods. Audran Labrousse wonders whether it is the burial of the sovereign, or was he buried at Nuri, as Reisner thought? The door jamb is perhaps reused from a building erected in the Hut Tiy under Taharqo.

The Christain settlement (VII-XII Century)
The excavations have revealed, at the south of the Hut Tiy, in front of a long vein of quartz that appears like a wall, a settlement of the Christian period: located near a small church, remains in mud brick could have belonged to a monastery. The cemetery prolongs, to the south, the Napatan and Meroitic necropolis.


http://nubie-international.fr/accueil.php?a=page164020&lang=en

http://www.livescience.com/images/i/000/036/431/original/sedeinga-pyramids-1.jpg?1360161752?interpolation=lanczos-none&downsize=*:1400


The Bust of Queen Tiye found in Egypt.

http://www.ancient.eu/uploads/images/display-5432.jpg

another statue of her at the temple site in Northern Sudan.

http://mfas3.s3.amazonaws.com/objects/E6171CR-d1.jpg

http://www.mfa.org/collections/object/head-of-queen-tiye-46188

[Ta seti]

The Lion temple North Sudan.

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3403/3513340270_a821e68067_z.jpg


http://cdn.c.photoshelter.com/img-get/I0000Tn3i7_tParg/s/860/860/Sudan-47.jpg


http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/sudan-sahara-desert-musawwarat-an-engraving-on-one-of-the-exterior-picture-id125209709

[Ta seti]

El kurru site. (North Sudan)
'
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-JCw7NzWqbfE/VOmOMIBfm7I/AAAAAAAABPQ/B1p99P4EU2k/s1600/CamA-IMG_0381%2Bsmall.jpg


https://thevelvetrocket.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/el-kurru1.jpg



http://m7.i.pbase.com/o6/93/329493/1/120876327.6oyacosJ.SudanDec092390.jpg


https://lsa.umich.edu/kelsey/research/current-field-projects/el-kurru--sudan/_jcr_content/par/textimage/image.transform/bigfree/image.jpg

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-2T4QXt6gOv0/U1PLs8iU_bI/AAAAAAAAApI/tqgdIfCmDNU/s1600/100_IMG_0973.JPG


http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-xv2Koe_4Z0c/UwGN4h6qlYI/AAAAAAAAAdo/-tdh3qr8IKI/s1600/Rm+3+opening.jpg

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-1XvSPFvm-Yw/Ux9NGn8w0YI/AAAAAAAAAiA/XHqzuIksOEY/s1600/temple%20Nacho.jpg


http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-DJXGY4GDTEs/VOmM6B8a5_I/AAAAAAAABO0/5k6ep7R_5HU/s1600/CamA-IMG_0829%2Bsmall.jpg


http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Pb5w85ocMjY/VRMm21ZnVaI/AAAAAAAABXI/AxVjaxVQTAg/s1600/CamB-IMG_0420.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-gZEah3yPuKg/VRMHngaUrHI/AAAAAAAABWw/qeuYCXha3CU/s1600/CamB-IMG_0440.jpg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-L1Vq5ebT-QU/Uwr6Q6iq6mI/AAAAAAAAAe0/LyfcReNltMM/s1600/Jamaal+Shabaqo.jpg


https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/28/0d/cd/280dcd60e89eadce0701088a22bafddb.jpg



http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3038/2964119671_4424950965.jpg


http://66.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m31d5hh2121qgfbgio1_500.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3043/2964117729_7c22d99e2a.jpg

http://farm9.static.flickr.com/8246/8654798152_be4fa60dab.jpg


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MhD3f9MPo4

[Ta seti]

Buhen Temple Sudan.


http://i.pbase.com/o6/93/329493/1/120837632.Sib0NOKy.SudanDec094623.jpg


http://www.ancient.co.uk/userfiles/images/The%20land%20of%20kush%202013/Buhen%20Temple%2017%20SNM.jpg

This temple and other temples is presently in Sudan national Museum in Khartoum

[Egyptian]

Ta seti , Sudanese? welcome brother <3

[Ta seti]

Ta seti , Sudanese? welcome brother <3

Yeah, I am Sudani. Thanks you brother.

[Bezprym]

One of the army that fought rome were composed of 400 000 soldiers (mostly natives maghrebians and spagniards/south italians). Even carthaginians/phoenicians area in south europe were mostly composed of natives. Dna tests on coastal maghrebians have revealed that their are north african with a little spanish/italians admixture because of trade. I have no idea why some lebanese claim phoenicians nobody know from where they came from, at first they have settled in east mediterranean coasts not in lebanon

Yet they were in Lebanon, and they definitely were reproducing. The Lebanese have roots among Phoenicians, as well as among other peoples who lived there in various times. On the other hand it is impossible for them to be purely Phoenician, naturally.

[Robocop]

...

I am Archaeologist and thank you for all this great pictures man. Cheers

[Melki]

Edited

[StonyArabia]

Axum and Nubia

[Ta seti]

Items from the National Museum in Khartoum, and some taken abroad.

http://i.pbase.com/o6/93/329493/1/120837521.oak56wV2.SudanDec094494.jpg


http://ic2.pbase.com/o6/93/329493/1/120837539.lZ9DUltX.SudanDec094521.jpg


http://llukasz.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/IMG_4583.jpg

http://llukasz.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/IMG_4620.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/14/9f/db/149fdbcfc651b9b3f0b57e5263724b19.jpg


http://www.britishmuseum.org/images/ps233315_l.jpg


http://llukasz.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/IMG_4675.jpg

http://llukasz.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/IMG_4678.jpg

[Iloko]

Nigerian architecture is awesome:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWS89_DJ1N4

[Ta seti]

Sudan temple santuary Jebel Barkal

I know it is a form of writing but i like the art.

http://www.westwards.de/.a/6a00d8341e0c5153ef01b7c8b41b66970b-800wi


http://mfas3.s3.amazonaws.com/objects/SC138062.jpg
http://www.mfa.org/collections/object/statue-of-lady-sennuwy-141967


http://isaw.nyu.edu/exhibitions/nubia/images/checklist-med/20.1207.jpg

Semna Temple
http://img13.deviantart.net/019f/i/2011/021/5/f/semna_temple___gate_by_zooz898-d37oirl.jpg

[Ta seti]

Swahili coast Gedi ruins Kenya

https://www.lonnolodge.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/Town-Door-of-Gedi.jpg


http://www.silverbirdsafari-africa.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/article_zoom_1803_2.jpg


http://www.charlesbabaultsafaris.com/gallery/images/kenya/gedi.jpg


http://www.visualquotations.com/kenya/mombasa/slides/Kenya_8-22a.jpg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruins_of_Gedi

[crazyladybutterfly]

bump

[wvwvw]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Nubian_language

Nubians were writing in the eight century before most Europeans. The earliest form of writing in Europe is the Greek alphabet in the late eight century BC which came from the Phoenicians.

Actually Greeks have an uninterrupted written tradition since 1800 BC and so do Cypriots who used Linear A a sister script of Linear A to write GREEK. Besides the oldest script in the world is found in Greece.

The Cadmeian script does not date to the 8th century but to 1450 BC. By 800 BC at least five different variants of Greek script existed the Ionian, Athenian, Corinthian, Argive, Euboean, Cypriot, Italian-Greek that originated from the same root centuries before 1000 BC.

The tribes of Africa had access to writing from the time of the Egyptians, Phoenician and Greek colonisation of Africa. In Islamic times when these people were enslaved they had access to Arabic written traditions and this access continued unbroken until Americans started dealing with the Arab slave traders.

[GiCa]

This history is ignored in Italian and European school

Like we ignore the history of Japan and East asia

It s all Euro-American centric

It s very said. We could and must know also others

[GiCa]

There are 300 ad churches in Ethiopia.. And nobody seem to put those in book for history

They commerced also with Romans

They also made Italian world War II prisoners building some of their churches in Addis abeba

[MMuniz]

good topic.

[Swahili_sultan]

Heres some info on Swahili history

https://swahili.hypotheses.org/swahili-historyhttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180209/77263cfc0d117f49920fed610f0c7308.jpg

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

[Jacques de Imbelloni]

Benin masks

http://c8.alamy.com/comp/D98A17/carved-ivory-mask-benin-nigeria-edo-peoples-c-16th-century-ad-the-D98A17.jpg
http://www.authenticafricanbronzesandceramics.com/images/Mucchio-bronzi-w.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/72/Benin_bronze_in_Bristol_Museum.jpg/300px-Benin_bronze_in_Bristol_Museum.jpg
http://www.edo-nation.net/esig.jpg

[Jacques de Imbelloni]

Igbo art

Igbo art (Igbo: Ǹkà Igbo) is any body of visual art originating from the Igbo people. The Igbo produce a wide variety of art including traditional figures, masks, artifacts and textiles, plus works in metals such as bronze. Artworks form the Igbo have been found from as early as 9th century with the bronze artifacts found at Igbo Ukwu.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/85/Bronze_ornamental_staff_head%2C_9th_century%2C_Igb o-Ukwu.JPG/250px-Bronze_ornamental_staff_head%2C_9th_century%2C_Igb o-Ukwu.JPG
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2e/Intricate_bronze_ceremonial_pot%2C_9th_century%2C_ Igbo-Ukwu%2C_Nigeria.jpg/300px-Intricate_bronze_ceremonial_pot%2C_9th_century%2C_ Igbo-Ukwu%2C_Nigeria.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1c/Bronze_pot%2C_Igbo-Ukwu%2C_9th_century.JPG
http://www.logbaby.com/files/new_image/581.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/236x/ed/f5/41/edf5411625e8666b6d6147f00a054efe--maiden-african-art.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/83/Bronze_ceremonial_vessel_in_form_of_a_snail_shell% 2C_9th_century%2C_Igbo-Ukwu%2C_Nigeria.JPG/800px-Bronze_ceremonial_vessel_in_form_of_a_snail_shell% 2C_9th_century%2C_Igbo-Ukwu%2C_Nigeria.JPG

[Jacques de Imbelloni]

Zangbeto

Zangbeto are the traditional voodoo guardians of the night in the Yoruba religion of Benin and Togo which are known as the "Nightwatchmen". Similar to Egunguns, they are highly revered and act as an unofficial police force patrolling the streets, watching over people and tracking down criminals and presenting them to the community to punish.[1] Originally created to scare the enemy away, Zangbeto will wander around the streets to detect thieves and witches, and to provide law and order.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9y-bu4hhSQI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYZYLL9uBE4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0G_jjElg9jc

[Lemon Kush]

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/fo2hB8Tk1Jo/maxresdefault.jpg

[Kriptc06]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqWFdUp2OA4

[Alessio]

This will definitely work! :voodoo::evilb::dance nerd

[Alessio]

Zangbeto

Zangbeto are the traditional voodoo guardians of the night in the Yoruba religion of Benin and Togo which are known as the "Nightwatchmen". Similar to Egunguns, they are highly revered and act as an unofficial police force patrolling the streets, watching over people and tracking down criminals and presenting them to the community to punish.[1] Originally created to scare the enemy away, Zangbeto will wander around the streets to detect thieves and witches, and to provide law and order.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9y-bu4hhSQI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYZYLL9uBE4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0G_jjElg9jc

7:31 first video, the chickendance! :bouncing-boobs:punjabidance

[Alessio]

Okay, this stuff is actually quite amazing but at rhe same time a little spooky. This could easily be a succesful circus act and horrorshow in one package.

[Jacques de Imbelloni]

7:31 first video, the chickendance! :bouncing-boobs:punjabidance


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGyOaCXr8Lw

[Alessio]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGyOaCXr8Lw

White version of the Voodoo dance? :cool:

[Bobby Martnen]

I bless the Raine down in Africa!

[Ta seti]

Ancient Temple of Soleb Sudan(North)


https://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=75533&d=1526628443









75534



https://c8.alamy.com/compde/en35w6/tempel-des-amun-soleb-nordlichen-bundesstaat-nubia-sudan-en35w6.jpg

[Ülev]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d9/Great-Zimbabwe-2.jpg


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Zimbabwe



https://youtu.be/I1KRjQmFEIc

[Dominicanese]

we will all fuck eachother on one a these ancient city remains

[Ülev]

bump

[Isleño]

Be aware the Egypt,Nubia and Sudan were connected like they were kinda 1 State till they united in 1 country and split in 1956.
I’d say they were maybe connected in the manner that they possibly shared culture or traditions over time or traded at times, but I don’t think they were happy go lucky, one big family as in some super state. There is just too much evidence from ancient Egypt that the Egyptians hated the Nubians and viewed them as enemies.

Ramesses II his enemies by the hair, two semites and a Nubian:

https://i1.wp.com/marchofthetitans.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/ram-enemies-grasp-1.jpg?resize=482%2C315

Enemy slave of Egypt, the Nubian:

http://cofcc.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/prisoner.jpg

King Tuts sandals showing Nubians as a captured and bound enemy under foot:

https://i.pinimg.com/236x/d5/14/6d/d5146d90e4489023941ab8600cc6fee1--tutankhamun-ancient-egypt.jpg


Egyptians captured enemies as slaves:

http://i46.tinypic.com/2nvyz39.jpg

Egypt invaded Nubia in 1500BC.

Also, in 747 BC, Nubia invaded Egypt.

They were far from being one state. They hated each other.

[Smeagol]

There's no such thing. All Civilization in Africa comes from Caucasoid people.

[Isleño]

What comes to mind for me, from West Africa that black American Afrocentrists can look to and leave Egypt alone is the Ghana and Songhai empires. And for East Africans, the Aksum Empire.

[Lemon Kush]

https://i.imgur.com/jCwdwLT.png

[Ta seti]

I’d say they were maybe connected in the manner that they possibly shared culture or traditions over time or traded at times, but I don’t think they were happy go lucky, one big family as in some super state. There is just too much evidence from ancient Egypt that the Egyptians hated the Nubians and viewed them as enemies.

Ramesses II his enemies by the hair, two semites and a Nubian:

https://i1.wp.com/marchofthetitans.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/ram-enemies-grasp-1.jpg?resize=482%2C315

Enemy slave of Egypt, the Nubian:

http://cofcc.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/prisoner.jpg

King Tuts sandals showing Nubians as a captured and bound enemy under foot:

https://i.pinimg.com/236x/d5/14/6d/d5146d90e4489023941ab8600cc6fee1--tutankhamun-ancient-egypt.jpg


Egyptians captured enemies as slaves:

http://i46.tinypic.com/2nvyz39.jpg

Egypt invaded Nubia in 1500BC.

Also, in 747 BC, Nubia invaded Egypt.

They were far from being one state. They hated each other.


Here is something to get your brain in confusion. The whole relationship to Egyptians and Nubians were very complex. The Egyptians were allies with nubian groups such as the Medjay, and Ta seti, but were enemies of groups such as cush. Sometimes groups such as Ta Seti(nubian) were the rulers of Egypt, but were enemies of other nubian groups. The 12 dynasty is a testament of the reality.


Various pharaohs of Nubian origin are held by some Egyptologists to have played an important part towards the area in different eras of Egyptian history, particularly the 12th Dynasty. These rulers handled matters in typical Egyptian fashion, reflecting the close cultural influences between the two regions.

[T]he XIIth Dynasty (1991–1786 B.C.E.) originated from the Aswan region. As expected, strong Nubian features and dark coloring are seen in their sculpture and relief work. This dynasty ranks as among the greatest, whose fame far outlived its actual tenure on the throne. Especially interesting, it was a member of this dynasty that decreed that no Nehsy (riverine Nubian of the principality of Kush), except such as came for trade or diplomatic reasons, should pass by the Egyptian fortress and cops at the southern end of the Second Nile Cataract. Why would this royal family of Nubian ancestry ban other Nubians from coming into Egyptian territory? Because the Egyptian rulers of Nubian ancestry had become Egyptians culturally; as pharaohs, they exhibited typical Egyptian attitudes and adopted typical Egyptian policies. (Yurco 1989) [28]



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nubia

[Hamilcar]

Culture of Ife (Nigeria), XII-XVth century :

https://i.imgur.com/Y5Nqq90.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/lIlJd0W.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/elgxExQ.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/sv4G432.jpg



Ashanti artifacts (Ghana), XVIIIth - XXth century :

https://i.imgur.com/W4dvO78.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/bo4bMbF.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/j6lYzOc.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/e4CwVqu.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/JlJnHMh.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/aJzfpno.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/7efuPnz.jpg

[Faklon]

The Horn had some civilizations that go unnoticed (Land of Pund, etc) but there is no notable civilization in Africa outside the Semitic sphere and Carthage.

[Hamilcar]

Aksumite palace ( Ta'akha Maryam palace/Ethiopia), IVth century BC - Xth century AD :

https://i.imgur.com/lXcpDLw.jpg


Obelisk of Aksum :

https://i.imgur.com/DvYUYUP.jpg


Dungur Palace :

https://i.imgur.com/ZLNJ9rx.jpg


Church in an aksumite style :

https://i.imgur.com/a5UtFvV.jpg

[Hamilcar]

The Horn had some civilizations that go unnoticed (Land of Pund, etc) but there is no notable civilization in Africa outside the Semitic sphere and Carthage.

Most civilizations in the horn were not "semitic" (btw the aksumite kingdom even managed to conquer the kingdom of Himyar in modern day Yemen) and both North African and Horn civilizations were geographically advantaged in comparison to more isolated places likes west and central Africa who didn't take part in intensive exchanges with non-african civilizations. But even taking this into account, we do know that many civilizations/cultures flourished in Africa, People are simply not aware of them.

[dark-mysterio]

The Horn had some civilizations that go unnoticed (Land of Pund, etc) but there is no notable civilization in Africa outside the Semitic sphere and Carthage.

some existed in west africa (once why you ad Mali and Songhai in the civilization) and the eastern african civilization also included the Sawhili coast (Kenya,Mozambique) and if i d'ont get wrong the Portuguese entered in contact with Kongolese (they are also in civilization 6 although i don't know anything about there civilization)