Do these GEDmatch Oracle results make sense for me?

[Sikeliot]

For some reason my Sardinian side seems to disappear in some of these results. Do they make sense otherwise?

I overall am close to North Italians, Kosovars, Albanians, Bulgarians, Tuscans and mainland Greeks.

I often come up half Ashkenazi or Moroccan Jewish even, too. When divided in fourths, I often come up 25% Syrian.

MDLP K23b:
Using 1 population approximation:
1 Italian_North @ 3.182965
2 Kosovar @ 9.537361
3 Greek_Northwest @ 9.836071
4 Italian_Piedmont @ 11.092868
5 German-Volga @ 11.520050
6 Italian_Tuscan @ 11.569202
7 Bulgarian @ 11.877937
8 Greek_Thessaly @ 12.138401
9 Albanian_Tirana @ 12.241836
10 Italian_Bergamo @ 12.420009
11 Greek_Thessaloniki @ 12.538855
12 Greek_Peloponnesos @ 12.671625
13 Macedonian @ 13.261055
14 Montenegrian @ 13.499665
15 South_German @ 14.061942
16 Serb_Serbia @ 14.194846
17 French @ 14.257866
18 Romanian @ 15.121736
19 Belgian @ 15.337873
20 Central_Greek @ 15.352347

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Ashkenazi +50% Welsh @ 2.257293


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Ashkenazi_Jew +25% French_South +25% Sorb @ 1.832459


Eurogenes K15:
Using 1 population approximation:
1 North_Italian @ 7.536254
2 Tuscan @ 10.337492
3 Bulgarian @ 12.919882
4 Portuguese @ 13.215020
5 Romanian @ 13.575787
6 Spanish_Galicia @ 13.614240
7 Greek_Thessaly @ 13.756536
8 Spanish_Extremadura @ 13.919705
9 Greek @ 14.384192
10 Spanish_Andalucia @ 14.470642
11 Serbian @ 14.567369
12 Spanish_Murcia @ 14.711063
13 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 14.750749
14 Spanish_Cataluna @ 14.778295
15 Spanish_Valencia @ 15.736538
16 West_Sicilian @ 16.784250
17 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 16.977787
18 Italian_Abruzzo @ 17.396460
19 Spanish_Cantabria @ 17.521114
20 Southwest_French @ 18.048649

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Greek_Thessaly +50% Southwest_French @ 4.985856


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Bulgarian +25% French +25% Sardinian @ 2.701136


Dodecad V3:
Using 1 population approximation:
1 Tuscan @ 10.439878
2 Tuscan @ 10.483774
3 TSI @ 11.486133
4 N_Italian @ 12.118563
5 O_Italian @ 13.650196
6 Romanians_14 @ 14.481263
7 Tuscan @ 16.129522
8 North_Italian @ 16.988232
9 Balkans @ 17.451427
10 C_Italian @ 18.148546
11 Ashkenazy_Jews @ 18.784306
12 Slovenian @ 19.529737
13 Portuguese @ 19.880548
14 Hungarians @ 19.995298
15 Ashkenazi @ 20.129622
16 IBS @ 21.466003
17 Spanish @ 22.271790
18 Greek @ 22.583429
19 Spaniards @ 22.668583
20 S_Italian_Sicilian @ 23.486015

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% C_Italian +50% Slovenian @ 4.636837


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Hungarians +25% Morocco_Jews +25% Sardinian @ 1.962076


Dodecad K12b:
Using 1 population approximation:
1 N_Italian @ 7.441685
2 O_Italian @ 9.830331
3 North_Italian @ 10.369100
4 TSI30 @ 11.532285
5 Tuscan @ 13.114626
6 C_Italian @ 15.102679
7 Romanians @ 15.932857
8 Bulgarians @ 16.377279
9 Bulgarian @ 16.640142
10 Baleares @ 16.735388
11 Galicia @ 17.212929
12 Extremadura @ 18.348637
13 Portuguese @ 18.690540
14 French @ 19.264210
15 French @ 19.444281
16 Greek @ 19.481239
17 Murcia @ 20.277555
18 Castilla_Y_Leon @ 20.695543
19 Canarias @ 20.939262
20 Cataluna @ 21.254999

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Bulgarian +50% Galicia @ 2.542460


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Ashkenazi +25% Belorussian +25% French_Basque @ 1.615143


Harappaworld:

Using 1 population approximation:
1 italian @ 6.163892
2 tuscan @ 10.041017
3 tuscan @ 10.338904
4 tuscan @ 10.777489
5 romanian-a @ 11.335858
6 bulgarian @ 12.620722
7 serbian @ 15.832575
8 spaniard @ 16.245134
9 spaniard @ 17.354712
10 french @ 17.776808
11 ashkenazi @ 20.044819
12 hungarian @ 21.087976
13 ashkenazy-jew @ 23.090309
14 slovenian @ 23.139427
15 puerto-rican @ 24.998402
16 utahn-white @ 26.503754
17 n-european @ 27.036816
18 utahn-white @ 28.022871
19 british @ 28.104010
20 morocco-jew @ 28.882809

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% ashkenazi +50% french @ 2.274144


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% ashkenazi +25% slovenian +25% spain-basc @ 1.235583


PuntDNA-L K12b:
Using 1 population approximation:
1 Italian_Bergamo @ 7.672976
2 Albanian @ 7.819532
3 Tuscan @ 8.445963
4 Bulgarian @ 8.835263
5 Greek @ 9.039985
6 Romanian @ 9.294235
7 Spanish_Southwest @ 9.948606
8 French @ 10.495569
9 Spanish_Northeast @ 12.130370
10 Croatian @ 12.189461
11 Spanish_Canaries @ 12.299376
12 Belgian @ 12.412498
13 German_South @ 14.230084
14 Sicilian_West @ 14.667812
15 Utahn_European @ 14.895694
16 Dutch_South @ 14.972186
17 Hungarian @ 16.506372
18 Ashkenazi_Jew @ 16.847931
19 Sicilian_East @ 17.050163
20 English_South @ 17.244341

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Norwegian +50% Turkish_Jew @ 2.156061


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Dutch_North +25% Sardinian +25% Syrian @ 1.407079


Gedrosia K15:
Using 1 population approximation:
1 Bulgarian @ 9.179237
2 Albanian @ 10.471212
3 Greek @ 14.187987
4 Bergamo @ 14.770732
5 French @ 15.472638
6 Spanish @ 15.682572
7 Sicilian @ 18.509541
8 Croatian @ 19.793566
9 English @ 20.533316
10 Ashkenazi_Jew @ 21.164791
11 Hungarian @ 22.997208
12 French_South @ 26.399530
13 Norwegian @ 27.695242
14 Czech @ 27.830887
15 Turkish @ 31.289482
16 Ukrainian @ 36.576263
17 Turkmen @ 36.975540
18 Cypriot @ 37.709354
19 Turkmen_Afghan @ 38.982548
20 Tajik @ 39.014042

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Ashkenazi_Jew +50% English @ 3.894651


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% English +25% Iraqi_Jew +25% Spanish @ 2.661131


Near East Neolithic K13:
Using 1 population approximation:
1 Albanian @ 5.687429
2 Greek @ 6.222092
3 Bulgarian @ 7.535620
4 Sicilian @ 9.241049
5 Romanian @ 10.416935
6 Italian_South @ 10.928293
7 Jew_Ashkenazi @ 11.792473
8 Croatian @ 15.429381
9 French @ 15.602474
10 Hungarian @ 17.917059
11 Turkish_Istanbul @ 18.562473
12 Jew_Moroccan @ 18.938543
13 Turkish @ 19.303577
14 Turkish_Balekesir @ 21.107605
15 English @ 21.612019
16 Scottish @ 21.930376
17 Czech @ 21.963432
18 Sardinian @ 22.831295
19 Turkish_Aydin @ 22.986570
20 Ukrainian @ 23.277941

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% French +50% Jew_Moroccan @ 4.606801


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% French +25% Sardinian +25% Syrian @ 2.824588

[Sikeliot]

What do people think?

[Sikeliot]

I am closer to mainland Greeks than full Sicilians are, also.

[Seya]

u get close results to balkanites and yes..it makes sense to me. i also get often between 30% to 50% Ashkenazi_Jew, Iraqi_Jew, Iranian_Jew, Yemenite_Jew or Jew_Moroccan and also 29.4% Jordanian, 27.9% Palestinian, 29.7% Syrian or 31.5% Lebanese...so i guess it's normal for your mix

[Petalpusher]

Don't read too much in the mathematical fits, unless they never vary. This is how your admixture could be generally best described, something western, something northeast, something very south, to the point it can go as far as picking a MENA/Jewish pop but this is just a product of over balancing everything together sometimes.

[RN97]

I think that the 3 populations approximation tries to find combos that best fit your genetic make-up. It's easier to find something closer to individuals by using mixes rather than only one ethnic group/ population. It doesn't mean that the mixes it came up to you have some special relation to them.

[Sikeliot]

Don't read too much in the mathematical fits, unless they never vary. This is how your admixture could be generally best described, something western, something northeast, something very south, to the point it can go as far as picking a MENA/Jewish pop but this is just a product of over balancing everything together sometimes.

It seems that I am more West Med shifted on account of being part Sardinian, but I still have 25% that is best modeled with the Levant, which implies to me that my Sicilian side would be modeled with at least half Levantine.

[Petalpusher]

It seems that I am more West Med shifted on account of being part Sardinian, but I still have 25% that is best modeled with the Levant, which implies to me that my Sicilian side would be modeled with at least half Levantine.

It takes all your very southern admixture and little African from the Portuguese and Sicilian and see it as a chunk of Levantine or someting similar. Once you ve stripped all that of your admixture from the Portuguese in particular, the remaining part looks West or even up to NW. Then the Polish/Baltic kicks in for a NE population.

Several ways to get to the same point, this is basically the broad patterns admixture is seeing. It works with the same material than IBD, but looks at it in a completely different way.

[Sikeliot]

It takes all your very southern admixture and little African from the Portuguese and Sicilian and see it as a chunk of Levantine or someting similar. Once you ve stripped all that of your admixture from the Portuguese in particular, the remaining part looks West or even up to NW. Then the Polish/Baltic kicks in for a NE population.

Several ways to get to the same point, this is basically the broad patterns admixture is seeing. It works with the same material than IBD, but looks at it in a completely different way.

So basically the southernmost/most exotic part of my Sicilian plus the 1.6% from my mother comes off like Levantine. And then everything else more or less falls into place.

My paternal aunt is going to test, as is my cousin's daughter, so we'll have a greater sense of how some of my paternal side would plot.

[Petalpusher]

So basically the southernmost/most exotic part of my Sicilian plus the 1.6% from my mother comes off like Levantine. And then everything else more or less falls into place.

My paternal aunt is going to test, as is my cousin's daughter, so we'll have a greater sense of how some of my paternal side would plot.

Yes, let's say you wouldn't have a little African from the Portuguese side it could never support such fits using a MENA pop, but this is also obviously due for the most part of the Sicilian. It's the combination of the two.

[Seya]

It seems that I am more West Med shifted on account of being part Sardinian, but I still have 25% that is best modeled with the Levant, which implies to me that my Sicilian side would be modeled with at least half Levantine.

it depends in which combinations u get that 25% syrian. i get even 64.2% Ashkenazi_Jew when combined with 35.8% Czech, 34.4% Iraqi_Jew with 65.6% Hungarian, 50% Norwegian+50% Iraqi_Jew, 51% Norwegian +49% Iraqi_Chaldeans, 70% Croatian +30% Syrian, 74,1% Hungarian + 25,9% Yemenite_Jew, 53% French + 47% Jew_Moroccan...it only depends on the other half. obviously your sicilian part pulls u eastern but still not so eastern as the balkanits ...

[Sikeliot]

Yes, let's say you wouldn't have a little African from the Portuguese side it could never support such fits using a MENA pop, but this is also obviously due for the most part of the Sicilian. It's the combination of the two.

It'd probably come up 25% Cypriot then, since they don't have much African affinity.

[Sikeliot]

obviously your sicilian part pulls u eastern but still not so eastern as the balkanits ...

Sicilians score more affinity to the Levant and West Asia than do Balkan people.

I am closer to a Bulgarian, Albanian, Romanian, or mainland Greek than a full Sicilian would be, and the reason for this is the Polish side pulling me into the Balkans.

[Seya]

Sicilians score more affinity to the Levant and West Asia than do Balkan people.

I am closer to a Bulgarian, Albanian, Romanian, or mainland Greek than a full Sicilian would be, and the reason for this is the Polish side pulling me into the Balkans.

i thought we are talking about u here..not about sicilians in general

[RN97]

it depends in which combinations u get that 25% syrian. i get even 64.2% Ashkenazi_Jew when combined with 35.8% Czech, 34.4% Iraqi_Jew with 65.6% Hungarian, 50% Norwegian+50% Iraqi_Jew, 51% Norwegian +49% Iraqi_Chaldeans, 70% Croatian +30% Syrian, 74,1% Hungarian + 25,9% Yemenite_Jew, 53% French + 47% Jew_Moroccan...it only depends on the other half. obviously your sicilian part pulls u eastern but still not so eastern as the balkanits ...
I don't get how that would work :confused:
On Pca plot, that would give you something south of Greeks
http://i.imgur.com/Isya61y.png
Maybe it's based on different components rather than the WHG, ANE(or EHG) and basal Eurasian model most PCA's are based upon. No idea how that would make sense TBH.

[Seya]

I don't get how that would work :confused:
On Pca plot, that would give you something south of Greeks

Maybe it's based on different components rather than the WHG, ANE(or EHG) and basal Eurasian model most PCA's are based upon. No idea how that would make sense TBH.

i don't know man..this is what i get

[Petalpusher]

I don't get how that would work :confused:
On Pca plot, that would give you something south of Greeks
http://i.imgur.com/Isya61y.png
Maybe it's based on different components rather than the WHG, ANE(or EHG) and basal Eurasian model most PCA's are based upon. No idea how that would make sense TBH.

You also have to check at wich @value this fit is made. If it's high, it's meaningless to get an idea on a pca. Some calculators like some old Gedrosia make these terrible fits because they don't have much samples to work with, or the calculator is simply bad (there s a few on gedmatch). A good fit is usually @1-2-3, not much more.



For example Gedrosia K12 :

78.7% Norwegian + 21.3% Georgian @ 11.83

It's silly and totally wrong on a pca, there s no living population there even if it was a better match than 11.83

[Dick]

Ancient calcs are better

[Petalpusher]

Ancient calcs are better

All peer review studies use ancient samples based calculators. There s a few modern available that are decent, but it's an outdated way to do admixture now, using crazy made up stuff like "Atlantic_Baltic" (what the hell is that...)

[Dick]

All peer review studies use ancient samples based calculators. There s a few modern available that are decent, but it's an outdated way to do admixture now.

I just think it's cool they show you admixture from different cultures like Yamna, bell beaker, OETZI , battle axe etc

[Petalpusher]

I just think it's cool they show you admixture from different cultures like Yamna, bell beaker, OETZI , battle axe etc

Ah yea but you are talking about the samples. You can also give modern nations with the same calculators, it's just a different sample choice, you admixture can still be based off real stuff that actually existed like WHG, etc.. That's what they do in the Lazardidis above, testing WHG, ANE, etc.. applied to modern populations.

[Sikeliot]

i thought we are talking about u here..not about sicilians in general

I was confused when I made my comment, but it appears that I am close to various Balkan groups. In one calculator I am closer to Albanians and Epirote Greeks, in another to Bulgarian.. it varies depending on the calculator.

[Seya]

I was confused when I made my comment, but it appears that I am close to various Balkan groups. In one calculator I am closer to Albanians and Epirote Greeks, in another to Bulgarian.. it varies depending on the calculator.
i see..we get similar results. for example u get:

Near East Neolithic K13:
Using 1 population approximation:
1 Albanian @ 5.687429
2 Greek @ 6.222092
3 Bulgarian @ 7.535620
4 Sicilian @ 9.241049
5 Romanian @ 10.416935

and i get here:
# Population (source) Distance
1 Bulgarian 5.67
2 Romanian 7.22
3 Albanian 7.49
4 Greek 7.88
5 Sicilian 9.95

on other calculates i get albanian on first place or greek...

[RN97]

i see..we get similar results. for example u get:

Near East Neolithic K13:
Using 1 population approximation:
1 Albanian @ 5.687429
2 Greek @ 6.222092
3 Bulgarian @ 7.535620
4 Sicilian @ 9.241049
5 Romanian @ 10.416935

and i get here:
# Population (source) Distance
1 Bulgarian 5.67
2 Romanian 7.22
3 Albanian 7.49
4 Greek 7.88
5 Sicilian 9.95

on other calculates i get albanian on first place or greek...

How do you get so far from the Romanian sample :P? Are you fully Romanian? You'd think that you'd be more northern with your look compared to the average Romanian.

[Seya]

How do you get so far from the Romanian sample :P? Are you fully Romanian? You'd think that you'd be more northern with your look compared to the average Romanian.

i think that's the average romanian result but if u split the country by regions u get different results. probably i'm close to the south-easterners...

[Petalpusher]

i think that's the average romanian result but if u split the country by regions u get different results. probably i'm close to the south-easterners...

You should try Eurogenes K15 and its pca, it's the most reliable to find out your position compared to Romania.

[RN97]

i think that's the average romanian result but if u split the country by regions u get different results. probably i'm close to the south-easterners...

Maybe that result is the culmination of all Romanians and I guess they have some northern samples as well, so probably that's why it's more north than you if you're from the southeast. The southeast was also part of the byzantine empire if that had any effect.

[RN97]

You should try Eurogenes K15 and its pca, it's the most reliable to find out your position compared to Romania.

I've seen Romanian results on athrogenica that were closest to Sicilians. Wish I could find them though.

[Dick]

You should try Eurogenes K15 and its pca, it's the most reliable to find out your position compared to Romania.

I wouldn't mind seeing her in a certain position too.

[Petalpusher]

I've seen Romanian results on athrogenica that were closest to Sicilians. Wish I could find them though.

You can come out as anything, an ID card is just that if you have shady ancestry. I ve seen people with very unexpected results, usually it's more the Muricans though.

[Petalpusher]

I wouldn't mind seeing her in a certain position too.

Im gonna upvote that post, but im ashamed of you.

[Sikeliot]

If I was another 25% Sicilian rather than Portuguese I'd probably plot close to a mainland Greek, though there is some West Med and Atlantid affinity to Greeks also such that even now I am not that far away.

[Dick]

im ashamed of you.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/5e/77/5c/5e775cbd5460d87e2a5925c6f55cf3d4.gif

[RN97]

I wouldn't mind seeing her in a certain position too.

BOOOOOOI IFUDONNNT!