Which race is genetically closest to the chimpanzee?

[Iloko]

Anyone know?

[Desperado]

Probably anthrocels.

[Sacrificed Ram]

Some sources say black west africans closes more, but I don't know if it is true.

[Peterski]

People from Anthrogenica know:

http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?5387-Interesting-Ancient-Dstats&p=109877&viewfull=1#post109877

http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?5387-Interesting-Ancient-Dstats&p=110053&viewfull=1#post110053

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?185263-A-possibility-of-admixture-from-a-very-archaic-hominid-in-Africa&p=3840635&viewfull=1#post3840635


Ok folks here is the latest run. I increased the number of markers to around 280/290K, and included some non human primates, Neandertal, Denisova, and more African populations.

Everything below Kostenki14 is less similar to Chimp than Papuan. I color coded by approximate groupings. Neandertal and Denisova results were a little surprising. Otherwise, the pattern seems to be Pygmy groups, followed by SSA non Pygmies, followed by E Africans.



SOURCE 1
SOURCE 2
TARGET
OUTGROUP
DSTAT
Z
SNPs


Papuan
Gorilla
Chimp
Macaque
-0.4906
-54.27
282911


Papuan
Ancient_Denisova
Chimp
Macaque
-0.3563
-33.1
282899


Papuan
Ancient_Neandertal
Chimp
Macaque
-0.3234
29.08
262329


Papuan
Mbuti
Chimp
Macaque
-0.0777
-11.147
297350


Papuan
Biaka
Chimp
Macaque
-0.0705
-10.858
297350


Papuan
Khomani
Chimp
Macaque
-0.0622
-9.462
297350


Papuan
Ju_hoan_North
Chimp
Macaque
-0.06
-8.48
297349


Papuan
BantuSA
Chimp
Macaque
-0.0461
-7.05
297350


Papuan
Mandenka
Chimp
Macaque
-0.0384
-5.955
297350


Papuan
Esan
Chimp
Macaque
-0.0375
-5.468
297350


Papuan
Yoruba
Chimp
Macaque
-0.0366
-5.782
297350


Papuan
Masai
Chimp
Macaque
-0.029
-4.734
297350


Papuan
Somali
Chimp
Macaque
-0.0181
-2.878
297350


Papuan
Orang
Chimp
Macaque
-0.0102
-1.018
274770


Papuan
Kostenki14
Chimp
Macaque
-0.0083
-0.702
279223


Papuan
Bougainville
Chimp
Macaque
0.0013
0.225
297351


Papuan
LaBrana1
Chimp
Macaque
0.0017
0.147
280430


Papuan
Ust_Ishim
Chimp
Macaque
0.0039
0.439
296753


Papuan
MA1
Chimp
Macaque
0.0041
0.319
212643


Papuan
Iranian
Chimp
Macaque
0.0076
1.155
297350


Papuan
BedouinB
Chimp
Macaque
0.0079
1.174
297350


Papuan
Jordanian
Chimp
Macaque
0.0082
1.249
297350


Papuan
Makrani
Chimp
Macaque
0.0094
1.498
297350


Papuan
Turkish
Chimp
Macaque
0.0108
1.709
297350


Papuan
Dai
Chimp
Macaque
0.0112
1.701
297350


Papuan
Karitiana
Chimp
Macaque
0.0112
1.454
297350


Papuan
Balochi
Chimp
Macaque
0.0119
1.871
297350


Papuan
Punjabi
Chimp
Macaque
0.012
1.856
297350


Papuan
Saudi
Chimp
Macaque
0.0124
1.824
297350


Papuan
Karelia_HG
Chimp
Macaque
0.0126
1.116
286727


Papuan
Ami
Chimp
Macaque
0.0127
1.813
297350


Papuan
GujaratiD
Chimp
Macaque
0.0134
1.999
297350


Papuan
Armenian
Chimp
Macaque
0.0139
2.107
297350


Papuan
Estonian
Chimp
Macaque
0.0142
2.142
297350


Papuan
English
Chimp
Macaque
0.0147
2.208
297350


Papuan
Loschbour
Chimp
Macaque
0.0149
1.492
294807


Papuan
Yamnaya
Chimp
Macaque
0.0154
1.993
296227


Papuan
Georgian
Chimp
Macaque
0.0165
2.439
297350


Papuan
Lithuanian
Chimp
Macaque
0.0172
2.56
297350


Papuan
Stuttgart
Chimp
Macaque
0.0252
2.707
292696


Papuan
LBK_EN
Chimp
Macaque
0.0269
3.617
296856



This is strange by the way.

All should be equally close to chimpanzees because the common ancestor of all humans split from common ancestor of all chimpanzees at the same time. Probably only actual chimpanzee admixture (or some other very archaic chimpanzee-like admixture) could make some populations genetically closer to them than others?

[Ibericus]

Africans are, altough the distances are very small :

http://anthropogenesis.kinshipstudies.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Anthropogenesis-SkoglundPCA2.jpg

[Peterski]

So out of modern populations Mbuti Pygmies are closest to chimpanzees and Lithuanians are the least close.

[Desperado]

This is strange by the way.

All should be equally close to the chimpanzees because the common ancestor of all humans split from common ancestor of all chimpanzees at the same time. Probably only actual chimpanzee admixture (or some other very chimpanzee-like admixture) could make some population genetically closer to them.

There is nothing strange, actually. The common ancestors of all humans was still fairly similar genetically to the common ancestors of all chimpanzees. Some human populations have just drifted away from their common ancestor more than the others.

[Ibericus]

This is strange by the way.

All should be equally close to chimpanzees because the common ancestor of all humans split from common ancestor of all chimpanzees at the same time. Probably only actual chimpanzee admixture (or some other very archaic chimpanzee-like admixture) could make some populations genetically closer to them than others?
No because humans around the world have admixed with other more archaic humans which had varying degrees of closeness to chimps. In Africa there is probably admixture with some yet unknown hominid.
Also there is genetic drift and evolution (mutations from adaptation) which some populations have had more than others since we became humans.

[Peterski]

Some human populations have just drifted away from their common ancestor more than the others.

Or some of them mixed with very archaic hominids (a possible explanation suggested by Megalophias):

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?185263-A-possibility-of-admixture-from-a-very-archaic-hominid-in-Africa&p=3840635&viewfull=1#post3840635


Africans are, altough the distances are very small :

http://anthropogenesis.kinshipstudies.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Anthropogenesis-SkoglundPCA2.jpg

What is the source of this PCA and which Native American population is closer to Neanderthals than the rest?

[Sacrificed Ram]

I found some studies saying any human has the same distance to Chimpz and Bonobos, incorrect methods of analysis that result in wrong conclusions:

https://notpoliticallycorrect.me/2015/11/28/response-to-daily-stormer-article-black-africans-are-genetically-closer-to-bonobos-than-to-white-humans/

[Desperado]

Or some of them mixed with very archaic hominids (a possible explanation suggested by Megalophias):

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?185263-A-possibility-of-admixture-from-a-very-archaic-hominid-in-Africa&p=3840635&viewfull=1#post3840635

There is more genetic diversity between African populations than between Africans and non-Africans, to the point where Eurasians could be considered to be an African tribe which might:

- have not received admixture from this archaic hominid (this is possible but far-fetched as the links you provided suggests).
- have received a similar admixture as everyone else but drifted further away because of isolation from other African tribes (by virtue of not being in Africa anymore).

It could be both but Occam's Razor suggests that the second option is a lot more likely.

[Robocop]

Anyone know?

Bonobos apes are closest to chimpanzees. :)

[PunhetaDeBacalhau]

People from Anthrogenica know:

http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?5387-Interesting-Ancient-Dstats&p=109877&viewfull=1#post109877



Is it known why LBK and Stuttgard are significantly further from Chimps than other groups? In K15 West_Med is also the furthest away from Africans. Why is that? Simply happened to be? There's something about their history that must be a bit different from the others.

[Petalpusher]

Is it known why LBK and Stuttgard are significantly further from Chimps than other groups? In K15 West_Med is also the furthest away from Africans. Why is that? Simply happened to be? There's something about their history that must be a bit different from the others.

They are the most distant at the same time to Africans, East Asians and ASE. That's why they get 99,9% W.Eurasia at K3.

Kurd's dstat is interesting but it shows just one part of the story, it only compares if you are more related to Chimp than Papuans. Knowing that most certainly ASE have archaic admix and/or is simply highly drifted OOA (not chimp per say ofc, but archaic are closer to chimp), it's not really the most to least related to chimp.
Seeing the results though, maybe the best dstat would be something between LBK and Lithuanian compared to Chimp.

[Iloko]

Any chimpanzee samples on gedmatch lol?

[1R0N M4N XL]

Anyone know?

humans share 98% dna with chimpanzee

[Hadouken]

Any chimpanzee samples on gedmatch lol?

lmao

[Lucas]

Any chimpanzee samples on gedmatch lol?

I'm also seeking them:) Especially I'm interested in one-to-one comparison:cool:

[Petalpusher]

If Kurd is using it in dstat, it is publicly available somewhere, as all studies for outgroups in stats. Which is actually the point he was trying to make, there is a difference in humans so it could be questionnable to use it as the definitive outgroup.

All it takes is someone to try to upload it, im not sure it would work there..

[Lucas]

If Kurd is using it in dstat, it is publicly available somewhere, as all studies for outgroups in stats. Which is actually the point he was trying to make, there is a difference in humans so it could be questionnable to use it as the definitive outgroup.

All it takes is someone to try to upload it, im not sure it would work there..

Wow, it's possible!

[Grab the Gauge]

The thing about Neanderthals and Denisovans is that they had a very, very high recessive mutational load from being isolated from everyone else for so long, living in small nuclear families, reproducing with their sisters and their mothers, etc. To the point where they were highly genetically and anatomically removed from Homo sapiens. For instance, Neanderthals have tiny mastoid processes, with a crest. Modern humans and chimpanzees are similar to eachother and different from Neanderthals in this regard, in that they have comparatively larger mastoid processes, and completely lack the crest that is found in Neanderthal skulls behind the ear lobe. Although Neanderthals have a lot of primitive features, they also have other features which are quite derived and very different from chimpanzees. When you get down to the minutia they are very different from chimpanzees. The smaller mastoid process is also an example of Neanderthals being more evolved than modern humans, because this is considered a primitive trait.

If Africans are closer to Chimpanzees, I would expect that to be because they lack archaic Eurasian ancestry and haven't . There is no need for them to have archaic African ancestry of any kind. If Native Americans are farthest from Chimpanzees, I would expect that to be due to retention of more archaic introgression, plus additional population bottlenecking from living in America and being isolated for so long.

[Rethel]

Evolutionists and TAübermensches... :laugh:

[Iloko]

If Kurd is using it in dstat, it is publicly available somewhere, as all studies for outgroups in stats. Which is actually the point he was trying to make, there is a difference in humans so it could be questionnable to use it as the definitive outgroup.

All it takes is someone to try to upload it, im not sure it would work there..
I read that it might even be possible to uploads dogs on there lol

[Hadouken]

Any chimpanzee samples on gedmatch lol?


lmao

man this is so funny :rofl:

[JohnSmith]

Humans are like 98% similar to Chimps. It makes you think how we look so different but genetically so similar.

[Iloko]

Apparently chimps are physically much stronger than humans..

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/Wellness/chimpanzees-humans-sizing-strength/story?id=16696826


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wbVIgVi66k

[Iloko]

Can anyone understand the meaning of this chart:

http://anthropogenesis.kinshipstudies.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Anthropogenesis-ChimpAfricans-copy.jpg

[SamJunior]

Anyone know?

My sources say Gujarati Indians.

[Petalpusher]

Can anyone understand the meaning of this chart:

http://anthropogenesis.kinshipstudies.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Anthropogenesis-ChimpAfricans-copy.jpg

Do you have the study that comes with it?
The pca on the right is a projection of the little one, so indeed Africa slightly closer to Chimp, Euro to Neanderthal and Oceania to Denisova, not much surprises here though the distances are obviously immense.

[Iloko]

Do you have the study that comes with it?
The pca on the right is a projection of the little one, so indeed Africa slightly closer to Chimp, Euro to Neanderthal and Oceania to Denisova, not much surprises here though the distances are obviously immense.
http://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1004353#pgen.1004353.s009
http://anthropogenesis.kinshipstudies.org/2017/01/world-science-en-route-from-out-of-africa-to-out-of-america-first-stop-is-out-of-asia/

[Nurzat]

Africans are, altough the distances are very small :

http://anthropogenesis.kinshipstudies.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Anthropogenesis-SkoglundPCA2.jpg

it seems Iberians and all Europeans are closer to Chimps than Native Americans. that is good to know

[Petalpusher]

http://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1004353#pgen.1004353.s009
http://anthropogenesis.kinshipstudies.org/2017/01/world-science-en-route-from-out-of-africa-to-out-of-america-first-stop-is-out-of-asia/

It confirms what we see on the pca, this is mostly due to us having more Neanderthal, and E_Asians having both Neanderthal and Denisovans.


Yuan et al. (2017) use this autosomal molecular divergence dates as evidence for Multiregional Evolution. They believe that there were two out-of-Africa migrations: one involving Homo erectus some 2 myr ago and the other one involving the ancestors of Neanderthals and Denisovans who left Africa roughly 1.5 myr after the divergence of the Homo clade. They dispute the argument made over and over again by other genetic labs that modern humans absorbed genetic admixture from such Eurasian hominins as Neanderthals and Denisovans. This argument was based on an observation of a set of derived (as compared to a reference chimpanzee sequence) autosomal markers that are shared between non-Africans, on the one hand, and/or Neanderthals and Denisovans, on the other. In all those cases, modern Africans agree with chimpanzees in showing ancestral alleles. Yuan et al. (2017) respond:


“The assumption of D-statistics is that all modern groups are equidistant to chimpanzees so that presence of derived alleles (different from chimpanzees) was due to gene flow from Neanderthal. If in fact Africans are closer to chimpanzees or carrying more ancestral alleles in general, the conclusion of gene flow into non-Africans would become invalid. We examined this by measuring genetic distance between 1000 genomes and 10 previously sequenced chimpanzee genomes (de Manuel et al., 2016). Using the random 255K SNPs set, we found closer hom distance between Africans and chimpanzees than between non-Africans and chimpanzees (Supplementary Figure S5). As presence of Neanderthal derived alleles in a non-African are mostly in het state (Fu et al., 2014), which could be observed to be biased toward non-Africans only if Africans are in hom ancestral state, the fact of more hom ancestral alleles in Africans (or closer hom distance between Africans and chimpanzees) therefore deems invalid the previous finding of Neanderthal gene flow into non-Africans.”

http://anthropogenesis.kinshipstudies.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Anthropogenesis-YuanChimp-copy.jpg

[Peter Nirsch]

Look at these pictures and you'll get the answer:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/41/Truganini_and_last_4_tasmanian_aborigines.jpg

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b9/William_Laney.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/58/b2/e7/58b2e71ee8482938455bc6356d6bc944.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/e4/17/88/e41788fe0ca4cb6da3e33fcfc5d623c5.jpg