Caspian Report's Origin of the Somali Civil War

[Wadaad]

This is by far the best summary for the situation in Somalia today.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clsarDL0RQY

[Dick]

What's up with the Masonic star on the flag.

[Wadaad]

What's up with the Masonic star on the flag.

It's not Masonic, its Pan-Somali...each point represents a Somali region that needed to be freed from foreign occupation:

British Somaliland
Italian Somaliland
French Somaliland (now Djibouti)
The Ogaden (occupied by Ethiopia)
Northern Frontier Province (awarded to Kenya by the British)

http://s29.postimg.org/jvqz6baon/five_Somali.jpg

http://markacadey.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/Somaliweyn.jpg

[Dick]

It's not Masonic, its Pan-Somali...each point represents a Somali region that needed to be freed from foreign occupation:

British Somaliland
Italian Somaliland
French Somaliland (now Djibouti)
The Ogaden (occupied by Ethiopia)
Northern Frontier Province (awarded to Kenya by the British)

http://s29.postimg.org/jvqz6baon/five_Somali.jpg

http://markacadey.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/Somaliweyn.jpg

okay.

[Shah-Jehan]

The Horn of Africa for me is the most interesting part of Africa. A lot of diversity, and great history. Hopefully, the wars and stuff end soon.

[al-Bosni]

When I visited family in Sweden it was an area that was about 80% Somali. There was some Bosnian and Turkish families as well. They are pious people from what I've seen. I'm hopeful for the situation in Somalia, numerous countries are trying to influence it with un-Islamic ideologies, but a portion of the people in Somalia are persistent in resisting it.

[Wadaad]

Islam is inimical to the Somali identity. If you are not Muslim you are not Somali...which isnt the case for neighboring ethnic groups like Oromos, Amharas and Tigrays, who have both Muslim and Christian members.

[RN97]

Somalia needs a strong authoritarian dictator.

[crazyladybutterfly]

all my support goes to the somali army :)

[Sekarotuinen]

For some reason I cant get the video to load.

My impression of the situation is that it stems from the Communist Somali Military's crushing defeat at the hands of the Soviets in the Odgen war. The instability from that and the fall of the eastern bloc led to civil war which is only now beginning to calm.

[Sekarotuinen]

Also, how much control does Somalia have over Somaliland, I'm under the impression that Al Shabaab is really the only game in town at this point for anti-government factions, after the ICU's defeat, and it is slowly weakening.

Once they are through with Al Shabaab, will Somalia inevitably go to war with Somaliland? How does the autonomous Puntland region factor into this?

[Sekarotuinen]

It's not Masonic, its Pan-Somali...each point represents a Somali region that needed to be freed from foreign occupation:

British Somaliland
Italian Somaliland
French Somaliland (now Djibouti)
The Ogaden (occupied by Ethiopia)
Northern Frontier Province (awarded to Kenya by the British)

http://s29.postimg.org/jvqz6baon/five_Somali.jpg

http://markacadey.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/Somaliweyn.jpg
You're like a German, my only response can be 'Should've won the war!'

[Wadaad]

all my support goes to the somali army :)

Al Shabab is just one small challenge...and yes Somalia needs a strong army, but it wont be allowed. This foreign supported government is only allowed to operate if it is weak. Neither Kenya or Ethiopia will be happy with a strong Somali army since about 40% of Somali 'land' is in their territory.

[Sekarotuinen]

Al Shabab is just one small challenge...and yes Somalia needs a strong army, but it wont be allowed. This foreign supported government is only allowed to operate if it is weak. Neither Kenya or Ethiopia will be happy with a strong Somali army since about 40% of Somali 'land' is in their territory.
What's your opinion of Afars, will you conquer Djibouti for greater Somali?

[Wadaad]

Also, how much control does Somalia have over Somaliland, I'm under the impression that Al Shabaab is really the only game in town at this point for anti-government factions, after the ICU's defeat, and it is slowly weakening.

Once they are through with Al Shabaab, will Somalia inevitably go to war with Somaliland? How does the autonomous Puntland region factor into this?

Somaliland is basically the model for a stable Somalia. The secret to Somaliland's success is that it is based around one particular clan etho-state. The Isaaq are maybe 15-18% of Somalis. There is nothing tying Somaliland right now with the Mogadishu gov't, and there is no need for a war. If a war were to erupt, it would be over the "Saul and Sanaag" region of eastern Somaliland/west Puntland since it has non-Isaaq people living there (Dhulbahanta and Warsangali Somalis who are more related to their Puntland kin). But in that Somaliland-Puntland dynamic we have Ethiopian support.

Actually, Ethiopia is very pro-Somaliland since its success means the less chance of a "Pan-Somali movement".

Finally, Somaliland diaspora is very powerful...many are based in the UK. Such as Britain olympic medalist Sir Mohamed Farah

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8288/7773251708_9c1e2ce53b_b.jpg

or BBC editor Raage Omaar

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/b-FEkvBrT20/maxresdefault.jpg

http://www.somalilandsun.com/images/2016/july/sl_deserve_un_seat.jpg

Either way...Somaliland's success is not just a model for our Somali brothers, but a model for all of Africa. And only something evil would cause an invasion of Somaliland, why else would anyone want it to fail? It is a democratic entity, with political parties and multiple and successfully monitored elections since 1991...it does not rely on foreign id like Somalia, but rather on Somaliland diaspora fundraising and self taxation.

[Sekarotuinen]

Somaliland is basically the model for a stable Somalia. The secret to Somaliland's success is that it is based around one particular clan etho-state. The Isaaq are maybe 15-18% of Somalis. There is nothing tying Somaliland right now with the Mogadishu gov't, and there is no need for a war. If a war were to erupt, it would be over the "Saul and Sanaag" region of eastern Somaliland/west Puntland since it has non-Isaaq people living there (Dhulbahanta and Warsangali Somalis who are more related to their Puntland kin). But in that Somaliland-Puntland dynamic we have Ethiopian support.

Actually, Ethiopia is very pro-Somaliland since its success means the less chance of a "Pan-Somali movement".

Finally, Somaliland diaspora is very powerful...many are based in the UK. Such as Britain olympic medalist Sir Mohamed Farah

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8288/7773251708_9c1e2ce53b_b.jpg

or BBC editor Raage Omaar

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/b-FEkvBrT20/maxresdefault.jpg

http://www.somalilandsun.com/images/2016/july/sl_deserve_un_seat.jpg

Either way...Somaliland's success is not just a model for our Somali brothers, but a model for all of Africa. And only something evil would cause an invasion of Somaliland, why else would anyone want it to fail? It is a democratic entity, with political parties and multiple and successfully monitored elections since 1991...it does not rely on foreign id like Somalia, but rather on Somaliland diaspora fundraising and self taxation.
So are you in favor of a federal 'greater Somalia' with provincial borders drawn around clan lines, or do you wish to see the clan system broken, in order to foster greater unity - a truly Somali identity.

[Wadaad]

What's your opinion of Afars, will you conquer Djibouti for greater Somali?

Djibouti is 2/3 Somali...Djibouti city is a Somali city.

Afars live in Tadjoura and Obock, and the majorit of Afars are to be found in Eritrea and Ethiopia's Afar state (where they found Lucy's bones and other Austrolopithecene fossils)


They are the closest ethnic group to Somalis, but unlike us, do not have a Afar country to call their own. Out of Cushitic solidarity I have a soft spot for them, Afars remind me of the fate of Somalis had we continued being under Abyssinian colonism, so in a sense, thank you white man, for carving up colonies that would be able to gain independence in 1960...while the poor Afars had to live with being under Ethiopian imperialism, then split up between Ethiopia and Eritrea. (I admit though, Eritrea has been good to its Afars and every ethnic group in Eritrea were Eritrean patriots who fought againt Ethiopia, except the Rashaida Arabs).

There are no issues between Somalis (the collective) and the Afar...they have small conflicts with the one Somali tribe they border, the Issa, but the Issa are the Somalis who resemble and behave the most similar to Afars anyways, so its just a 'cosmetic' issue (clash over watering wells, camel disputes, etc) nothing serious.

[Wadaad]

So are you in favor of a federal 'greater Somalia' with provincial borders drawn around clan lines, or do you wish to see the clan system broken, in order to foster greater unity - a truly Somali identity.

There is no Somali identity without the clan system. It cannot be dismantled except under some Maoist 'great leap forward' BS which is not worth the effort.

I'm in favor of a Emiratization of Somalia. There should be 5 or 6 Somali emirates under a United Somali Emirate.

Actually, Im in favor of the emiratization of Palestine as well...there should be atleast 2-3 Palistinian emirates.

Emirate of Gaza
Emirate of Ramallah
Emirate of Nablus

[Sekarotuinen]

There is no Somali identity without the clan system. It cannot be dismantled except under some Maoist 'great leap forward' BS which is not worth the effort.

I'm in favor of a Emiratization of Somalia. There should be 5 or 6 Somali emirates under a United Somali Emirate.

Actually, Im in favor of the emiratization of Palestine as well...there should be atleast 2-3 Palistinian emirates.

Emirate of Gaza
Emirate of Ramallah
Emirate of Nablus
Palestinians, and Levantines in general are a lot less clanish than other Arabs, please no.

As far as Somalia goes, how do you think the civil can be best solved/ ended, and are Somalis in Somalia generally Muslim or, """Muslim""" such as in a lot of Arab countries. Will Somalis accept a government that is not based in the Sharia if it comes to that?

[Wadaad]

Palestinians, and Levantines in general are a lot less clanish than other Arabs, please no.

As far as Somalia goes, how do you think the civil can be best solved/ ended, and are Somalis in Somalia generally Muslim or, """Muslim""" such as in a lot of Arab countries. Will Somalis accept a government that is not based in the Sharia if it comes to that?

Palestinians are indeed very clannish. There are the Barghouti clan that run Ramallah to this day for eg, the Jarrar who were the tax collecters in Jenin for the Ottomans, etc etc.
Palestinians and Levantines are actually more tribal than say Egyptians, who dont have such tribal concepts and are more urbane vs peasant in their dynamic.

Sharia is embedded in any civil law construct. If you mean things like a law decriminalizing polygamy, Somalis will fight it ofcourse, since that will be something imposed from outside, and we do not accept impositions.

[Sekarotuinen]

Palestinians are indeed very clannish. There are the Barghouti clan that run Ramallah to this day for eg, the Jarrar who were the tax collecters in Jenin for the Ottomans, etc etc.
Palestinians and Levantines are actually more tribal than say Egyptians, who dont have such tribal concepts and are more urbane vs peasant in their dynamic.

Sharia is embedded in any civil law construct. If you mean things like a law decriminalizing polygamy, Somalis will fight it ofcourse, since that will be something imposed from outside, and we do not accept impositions.

They are really more prominent families than clans. Palestine is more akin to how Sicily was in the past. There are powerful familes, and people gravitate towards them, but they are more like mafia familes than true clans. There isnt clan identity in Palestine.

I was mistaken about the government of Somalia, I thought it was fully secular, my mistake. From wikipedia: "Article 2 of Somali 2012 Constitution states no law can be enacted that is not compliant with the general principles and objectives of Sharia." - as it should be.

[crazyladybutterfly]

Al Shabab is just one small challenge...and yes Somalia needs a strong army, but it wont be allowed. This foreign supported government is only allowed to operate if it is weak. Neither Kenya or Ethiopia will be happy with a strong Somali army since about 40% of Somali 'land' is in their territory.

you're a mistery to me.

[Wadaad]

They are really more prominent families than clans. Palestine is more akin to how Sicily was in the past. There are powerful familes, and people gravitate towards them, but they are more like mafia familes than true clans. There isnt clan identity in Palestine.

I was mistaken about the government of Somalia, I thought it was fully secular, my mistake. From wikipedia: "Article 2 of Somali 2012 Constitution states no law can be enacted that is not compliant with the general principles and objectives of Sharia." - as it should be.

A family consisting of 5,000 people is a clan/tribe...I think you just dont like the tribal association, but it is what it is.

There are whole towns and villages in Palestine and all of MENA which consists of one 'family'....that is a tribal unit. Some become more prominent than others, and the mafioso of Sicily had its origin from MENA society in anycase.

[Wadaad]

you're a mistery to me.

Did you know the former leader/head of al Shabab was a Somalilander? (we use al shabab proxies to punish the mogadishu folks)...but any al Shabab found in Somaliland will get a bullet in his head

other Somalis call us 'the jews' of Somalia hehe.

[Sekarotuinen]

A family consisting of 5,000 people is a clan/tribe...I think you just dont like the tribal association, but it is what it is.

There are whole towns and villages in Palestine and all of MENA which consists of one 'family'....that is a tribal unit. Some become more prominent than others, and the mafioso of Sicily had its origin from MENA society in anycase.
It's in the same vein, but just not remotely as prominent.

[Sekarotuinen]

Did you know the former leader/head of al Shabab was a Somalilander? (we use al shabab proxies to punish the mogadishu folks)...but any al Shabab found in Somaliland will get a bullet in his head

other Somalis call us 'the jews' of Somalia hehe.
Are you of Somalilander descent?

[Wadaad]

Are you of Somalilander descent?

yes...I'm an Isaaq from the Habr Awal subclan

http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/africa/txu-pclmaps-oclc-795784383-somalia_2012_clan_distro.jpg

[Sekarotuinen]

yes...I'm an Isaaq from the Habr Awal subclan

http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/africa/txu-pclmaps-oclc-795784383-somalia_2012_clan_distro.jpg
Interesting. Are you Canadian born?

[Wadaad]

Interesting. Are you Canadian born?

No I was fortunately born in Hargeisa (which makes me eligible for Somaliland presidency). I came to Canada at the age of 5...spent 85% of my life here. My younger siblings are Canadian born.

[Sekarotuinen]

No I was fortunately born in Hargeisa (which makes me eligible for Somaliland presidency). I came to Canada at the age of 5...spent 85% of my life here. My younger siblings are Canadian born.
Fortunately? Do you want to return to Somaliland? And do you intend to run for presdident?

[Wadaad]

Fortunately? Do you want to return to Somaliland? And do you intend to run for presdident?

I've been slowly slowly building up a network to eventually do what the yahoodis call an 'aliya'. I travelled there several times over the past 5 years...Im in a business partnership with my dad and have some projects that I will focus on inshallah, when I resettle there in the next few years. If I were to have kids, I certainly would want them to be raised in Somaliland and not the west.

I intend to be in politics when in my 50s, since people are drawn to my ideas and see me as a 'leadership material', I would naturally make a good politician. I remember even as early as 5th grade, the girl who had a crush on me tried to groom me for class president, and campaigned for me hard.

[crazyladybutterfly]

Did you know the former leader/head of al Shabab was a Somalilander? (we use al shabab proxies to punish the mogadishu folks)...but any al Shabab found in Somaliland will get a bullet in his head

other Somalis call us 'the jews' of Somalia hehe.

why do you dislike al shabaab but at the same time like boko haram?

[crazyladybutterfly]

I've been slowly slowly building up a network to eventually do what the yahoodis call an 'aliya'. I travelled there several times over the past 5 years...Im in a business partnership with my dad and have some projects that I will focus on inshallah, when I resettle there in the next few years. If I were to have kids, I certainly would want them to be raised in Somaliland and not the west.

I intend to be in politics when in my 50s, since people are drawn to my ideas and see me as a 'leadership material', I would naturally make a good politician. I remember even as early as 5th grade, the girl who had a crush on me tried to groom me for class president, and campaigned for me hard.

IF YOU WANT TO BECOME POLITICIAN YOU SHOULD BEGIN AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. even in italy politicians begin when in their 20s /30s

[Sekarotuinen]

I've been slowly slowly building up a network to eventually do what the yahoodis call an 'aliya'. I travelled there several times over the past 5 years...Im in a business partnership with my dad and have some projects that I will focus on inshallah, when I resettle there in the next few years. If I were to have kids, I certainly would want them to be raised in Somaliland and not the west.

Well, it's good that you want to help build your homeland up! In an optimal world, I would like my theoretical children to grow up exposed to as little of the prevalent western hedonism as possible, but that isnt an option for me, as I have no true ethnic homeland, and I am far too much of an American nationalist to ever leave my nation, despite its faults. This is why I intend to move to a rural area.

Also, Somali women are so beautiful inside and out, I'm sure you'll find a wonderful wife. I used to volunteer my time assisting homeless children (I did it for about four years), there was a Somali woman there. So beautiful, and talk about a good Muslim, she was nearly a Hafiza as a high schooler. All her friend were the same, and oh, it made me feel a bit jealous I must say.

[Wadaad]

why do you dislike al shabaab but at the same time like boko haram?

al Shabaab's 'philosophy' is un-Somali. They are salafists with an ideology developed in a land full of shia and other sects...Somalis were always sunni Muslims under the shafi'ite madhab, like Yemen, Indonesia, Kurdistan, Upper Egypt, and the Hejaz before the wahabi saud took it.

Just like I dont like western imposed idealogies force-fed into our people (Mao had to kill 60 million chinese to 'force feed' western marxism into his people). Idealogies are liek clothes, if you are fat, dont put skinny jeans on. Shabaabism is a Saudi solution to a Saudi problem, it has no help for Somalia, it will be like a fat man putting skinny jeans.

Boko Haraam though salafist aswell, is a move by Nigerians for Nigerians, and the foundation principle is similar to mine..."Remove negative foreign/alien ideas". Yes they have alot of salafis in their rank, but Boko Haram are not saudi wannabes...while shabab are. And I never respect or admire lapdogs.

[crazyladybutterfly]

al Shabaab's 'philosophy' is un-Somali. They are salafists with an ideology developed in a land full of shia and other sects...Somalis were always sunni Muslims under the shafi'ite madhab, like Yemen, Indonesia, Kurdistan, Upper Egypt, and the Hejaz before the wahabi saud took it.

Just like I dont like western imposed idealogies force-fed into our people (Mao had to kill 60 million chinese to 'force feed' western marxism into his people). Idealogies are liek clothes, if you are fat, dont put skinny jeans on. Shabaabism is a Saudi solution to a Saudi problem, it has no help for Somalia, it will be like a fat man putting skinny jeans.

Boko Haraam though salafist aswell, is a move by Nigerians for Nigerians, and the foundation principle is similar to mine..."Remove negative foreign/alien ideas". Yes they have alot of salafis in their rank, but Boko Haram are not saudi wannabes...while shabab are. And I never respect or admire lapdogs.

in which way is alshabaab foreign? can you explain better?

[Sekarotuinen]

al Shabaab's 'philosophy' is un-Somali. They are salafists with an ideology developed in a land full of shia and other sects...Somalis were always sunni Muslims under the shafi'ite madhab, like Yemen, Indonesia, Kurdistan, Upper Egypt, and the Hejaz before the wahabi saud took it.

Just like I dont like western imposed idealogies force-fed into our people (Mao had to kill 60 million chinese to 'force feed' western marxism into his people). Idealogies are liek clothes, if you are fat, dont put skinny jeans on. Shabaabism is a Saudi solution to a Saudi problem, it has no help for Somalia, it will be like a fat man putting skinny jeans.

Boko Haraam though salafist aswell, is a move by Nigerians for Nigerians, and the foundation principle is similar to mine..."Remove negative foreign/alien ideas". Yes they have alot of salafis in their rank, but Boko Haram are not saudi wannabes...while shabab are. And I never respect or admire lapdogs.
If foreign influence is your only problem, what do you think of the ICU. They were home grown Salafis, no?

[Wadaad]

in which way is alshabaab foreign? can you explain better?

They want to replace Somali with Arabic
They want to replace Somali clothing (dirac, guntiino, etc...which are obviously halal and 'islamic') with those black Saudi abayas/niqabs
They destroy Somali historical legacy, what little that we have, under their primitive iconoclasm superstitions
They declare kufr on their own people, while workin with foreigners to control the locals.
They destroying the clan system..as corrupt as our elders are, we still respect them. They want some 20 something year old who memorized a few suras to order around our Elders. I would rather my Elder in his corruption and warlord ways, then listen to some illiterate 20 year old thug.

and many more...

[Sekarotuinen]

They want to replace Somali with Arabic
They want to replace Somali clothing (dirac, guntiino, etc...which are obviously halal and 'islamic') with those black Saudi abayas/niqabs
They destroy Somali historical legacy, what little that we have, under their primitive iconoclasm superstitions
They declare kufr on their own people, while workin with foreigners to control the locals.
They destroying the clan system..as corrupt as our elders are, we still respect them. They want some 20 something year old who memorized a few suras to order around our Elders. I would rather my Elder in his corruption and warlord ways, then listen to some illiterate 20 year old thug.

and many more...
They really want to replace Somali culture? Horrible. Especially considering the clothing, considering the verses on Hijab only say what should be covered, not how. Seems to me that enforcing one standard based around Arab culture rather than based around what the Quran says is VERY wrong.

[Wadaad]

If foreign influence is your only problem, what do you think of the ICU. They were home grown Salafis, no?

ICU is history...Al Shabaab is a mutation of it.

The ICU were UNPRECEDENTED. Only SOME were salafi. Others were sufi, others were just faqihs and muftis. Basically a collection of ulema that came together and said Somalia needed more than anything law and order and peace and security. Al Shabaab was their 'youth wing' and if Ethiopia did not invade in 2006 to dismantle the Islamic Courts Union, and kill off the Ulema...Al Shabaab would not exist today.


Why do I say ICU was unprecedented? Because only two times had the world witnessed the rule by Judges...first time was the Biblical state of Israel under Saul, David and Solomon...second time was in Somalia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kritarchy

[Wadaad]

They really want to replace Somali culture? Horrible. Especially considering the clothing, considering the verses on Hijab only say what should be covered, not how. Seems to me that enforcing one standard based around Arab culture rather than based around what the Quran says is VERY wrong.

Agreed.

[crazyladybutterfly]

They want to replace Somali with Arabic
They want to replace Somali clothing (dirac, guntiino, etc...which are obviously halal and 'islamic') with those black Saudi abayas/niqabs
They destroy Somali historical legacy, what little that we have, under their primitive iconoclasm superstitions
They declare kufr on their own people, while workin with foreigners to control the locals.
They destroying the clan system..as corrupt as our elders are, we still respect them. They want some 20 something year old who memorized a few suras to order around our Elders. I would rather my Elder in his corruption and warlord ways, then listen to some illiterate 20 year old thug.

and many more...


They want to replace Somali clothing (dirac, guntiino, etc...which are obviously halal and 'islamic') with those black Saudi abayas/niqabs
They destroy Somali historical legacy, what little that we have, under their primitive iconoclasm superstitions


http://leadership.ng/features/397962/boko-haram-made-society-alienate-women-niqab

how isnt boko haram made of thus?
http://www.latimes.com/world/africa/la-fg-nigeria-abducted-girls-snap-story.html

When 14-year-old Yakaka was seized from a village near Bama, one of the towns hit hardest by Boko Haram, the fighters who oppose Western-style education told her they were taking her away so that she could learn the Koran.

She said every fighter in the Boko Haram camp had a wife, most of whom were abducted. She was married to a man named Modu Gana.

“I never liked him,” said Yakaka, her expression numb and her voice a soft monotone. “I was forcefully married, and if I refused, I would have been killed. I did it to survive.”

The Los Angeles Times is withholding her surname because she is a minor and a sexual assault victim.

http://www.torontosun.com/2016/12/29/boko-haram-rape-school-girls-scream-and-cry-for-help


forced marriage to the captors; and sexual abuse, including rape,”
A 15-year-old girl who was held in a Boko Haram camp for four weeks in 2013 described being forced to marry a militant more than twice her age. “After we were declared married I was ordered to live in his cave but I always managed to avoid him. He soon began to threaten me with a knife to have sex with him, and when I still refused he brought out his gun, warning that he would kill me if I shouted. Then he began to rape me every night. He was a huge man in his mid-30s and I had never had sex before. It was very painful and I cried bitterly because I was bleeding afterwards.”

A social worker who has dealt with victims of Boko Haram violence told HRW that the rape of abducted women had been underreported because of the stigma and shame attached to sexual abuse in northern Nigeria. One 15-year-old girl said: “I could not stop crying even when the insurgents threatened to kill me if I did not keep quiet. I kept on thinking, is it not better to die now than to face whatever terrible things they could do to me when we get to their camp? Even after I escaped from them and live far away from my village, I am still afraid. I think of death many times. My father tries. He encourages me to forget everything, but it is not easy for me. I have terrible dreams at night.”



how is the niqab native to nigeria?

[Sekarotuinen]

ICU is history...Al Shabaab is a mutation of it.

The ICU were UNPRECEDENTED. Only SOME were salafi. Others were sufi, others were just faqihs and muftis. Basically a collection of ulema that came together and said Somalia needed more than anything law and order and peace and security. Al Shabaab was their 'youth wing' and if Ethiopia did not invade in 2006 to dismantle the Islamic Courts Union, and kill off the Ulema...Al Shabaab would not exist today.


Why do I say ICU was unprecedented? Because only two times had the world witnessed the rule by Judges...first time was the Biblical state of Israel under Saul, David and Solomon...second time was in Somalia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kritarchy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Courts_Union

I did not realize that, but reading more.about them, that seems to be the case. Seems wonderful, and had they only had the chance to purge their Saudi plants, it could have been the end of the civil war.

[Wadaad]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Courts_Union

I did not realize that, but reading more.about them, that seems to be the case. Seems wonderful, and had they only had the chance to purge their Saudi plants, it could have been the end of the civil war.

Their leader is still conducting interviews...but he's good as dead.

http://hagenews.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/Sheikh-Hassan-Dahir-Aweys.jpg

http://hagenews.com/2017/03/11/my-meeting-with-a-forgotten-terrorist-in-somalia/

[Sekarotuinen]

Their leader is still conducting interviews...but he's good as dead.

http://hagenews.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/Sheikh-Hassan-Dahir-Aweys.jpg

http://hagenews.com/2017/03/11/my-meeting-with-a-forgotten-terrorist-in-somalia/
From Wikipedia:

The Shabab caused difficulties for the ICU in maintaining a good international image on a number of occasions due to their hot-headedness and zealousness, such as abducting critical journalists, harassing overly-hip youngsters, and murdering wounded JVA soldiers in a Bu'aale hospital.

The ICU formally apologized for each of the incidents and attempted to make it clear that these actions did not reflect ICU policy. Nevertheless, these incidents gave their opponents excellent propaganda ammunition and aided the global perception of the ICU being like the Taliban.

Seems to me like they werent terrorists. Click bait title, lol.

[Wadaad]

http://leadership.ng/features/397962/boko-haram-made-society-alienate-women-niqab
how is the niqab native to nigeria?

There is a difference here...you gotta understand West Africans lack the devotion and knowledge of the deen. I personally know Nigerians who have christian and muslim in the same family...one week they go to church, next week masjid, next week some Voodoo rituals...Islam is all just a vague mish mash for them and really not yet embedded in their psyche. They are Muslim not as long as other places. This is also true in for eg, Bali, Sumatra, etc.

So these places, they need tough measures like niqaab IMO. to 'sift' and 'sort' the garbage from the pure, it is necessary.

[Wadaad]

From Wikipedia:

The Shabab caused difficulties for the ICU in maintaining a good international image on a number of occasions due to their hot-headedness and zealousness, such as abducting critical journalists, harassing overly-hip youngsters, and murdering wounded JVA soldiers in a Bu'aale hospital.

The ICU formally apologized for each of the incidents and attempted to make it clear that these actions did not reflect ICU policy. Nevertheless, these incidents gave their opponents excellent propaganda ammunition and aided the global perception of the ICU being like the Taliban.

Seems to me like they werent terrorists. Click bait title, lol.

those are exactly who the West wants to label terrorists...the rational, good willed people like Sheikh Dahir Aweis.

All Journalism is click bait, and journalism itself is a haram profession, as any career built on slandering other humans is haram. In my world, all journalists will be killed or imprisoned, and journalism will cease. Every citizen should be a journalist (in the sense that they chronicle for themselves or history, current events but not for a 'publication' or news service like reuters), not a professional cadre of 'truth tellers' (infact, slanderers and gossip mongers, aswell as outright liars)

[Sekarotuinen]

those are exactly who the West wants to label terrorists...the rational, good willed people like Sheikh Dahir Aweis.

All Journalism is click bait, and journalism itself is a haram profession, as any career built on slandering other humans is haram. In my world, all journalists will be killed or imprisoned, and journalism will cease. Every citizen should be a journalist, not a professional cadre of 'truth tellers' (infact, slanderers and gossip mongers, aswell as liars)
Journalism is a legitimate profession as long as it does not devolve into gossipy nonsense. The power of a righteous journalist is huge.

And killing ALL journalists, what? That's insane.

[crazyladybutterfly]

boko haram is made of child rapist as much as al shabaab if not more.
would you really rape a 14 years old virgin chaste kid only because she is a christian? that's what boko haram thugs do.
you've got proof of those young girls holding toddlers in their videos.
you might justify the rape of an adult woman (around 17 and over) but of a 13-14 years old girl? how is she mentally ready to become a mother?

[crazyladybutterfly]

boko haram is made of child rapist as much as al shabaab if not more.
would you really rape a 14 years old virgin chaste kid only because she is a christian? that's what boko haram thugs do.
you've got proof of those young girls holding toddlers in their videos.
you might justify the rape of an adult woman (around 17 and over) but of a 13-14 years old girl? how is she mentally ready to become a mother?

[Sekarotuinen]

While it seems that the ICU could have become something great one day, it didnt.

Somalia had stability handed to it on a platter back in 1993, but they threw it away.

THIS MAN IS YOUR FRIEND, HE FIGHTS FOR YOUR FREEDOM!

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170406/3e439ddc61f8c2c64ae1914423f78658.jpg

[Wadaad]

Journalism is a legitimate profession as long as it does not devolve into gossipy nonsense. The power of a righteous journalist is huge.

And killing ALL journalists, what? That's insane.

I meant killing journalism, the profession and industry.

[Sekarotuinen]

I meant killing journalism, the profession and industry.
Journalism is good, the industry is what needs a shakeup. Good journalists expose the rotten underbelly of a society, they are needed.

[Wadaad]

While it seems that the ICU could have become something great one day, it didnt.

Somalia had stability handed to it on a platter back in 1993, but they threw it away.

THIS MAN IS YOUR FRIEND, HE FIGHTS FOR YOUR FREEDOM!

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170406/3e439ddc61f8c2c64ae1914423f78658.jpg

Do not troll my thread.

America embarassed itself in Somalia in 1993. They thought we are a 'easy PR' people like Haiti or whatever. They did not realize we are put on this earth to cause trouble hehe, and they got nothing out of that adventure except a bloody nose, a loss in stature and prestige, and desecrated bodies.

The reason America got embarassed? Because they did not intend to help, but just photo-op. In anycase that is history, America is no longer run by photo-op seeking generals, but neo-conservatives, and they do not want 'photo-op' oppurtinities when it comes to Somalis (or Palestinians for that matter) but genocide and social engineering. So the next miltary adventure the US intends for Somalia will be similar to what happened in Iraq, what will happen to Iran and so on.

The US in the end, is the miltary wing of those that want the end of Islam, and for that to change, Islam has to have a hold in America (happening) and Zionists have to lose power in America (not going to happen anytime soon).

[Böri]

It's not Masonic, its Pan-Somali...each point represents a Somali region that needed to be freed from foreign occupation:

British Somaliland
Italian Somaliland
French Somaliland (now Djibouti)
The Ogaden (occupied by Ethiopia)
Northern Frontier Province (awarded to Kenya by the British)

http://s29.postimg.org/jvqz6baon/five_Somali.jpg

http://markacadey.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/Somaliweyn.jpg

Man İ didnt know your lands were taken by foreigners. I support Greater Somalia. Somali will grow and become 'Horn Turan, :) Focuse on Ethiopia first but before unite with Djibuti.

[Sekarotuinen]

Do not troll my thread.

America embarassed itself in Somalia in 1993. They thought we are a 'easy PR' people like Haiti or whatever. They did not realize we are put on this earth to cause trouble hehe, and they got nothing out of that adventure except a bloody nose, a loss in stature and prestige, and desecrated bodies.

The reason America got embarassed? Because they did not intend to help, but just photo-op. In anycase that is history, America is no longer run by photo-op seeking generals, but neo-conservatives, and they do not want 'photo-op' oppurtinities when it comes to Somalis (or Palestinians for that matter) but genocide and social engineering. So the next miltary adventure the US intends for Somalia will be similar to what happened in Iraq, what will happen to Iran and so on.

The US in the end, is the miltary wing of those that want the end of Islam, and for that to change, Islam has to have a hold in America (happening) and Zionists have to lose power in America (not going to happen anytime soon).

>Bloody nose
19 dead Americans, 1000 dead Somali militants and 1000 dead non combatants. That seems fine to me.

But yes, part of the mission was PR, and when the PR opportunity fell through, we pulled out.

>The US wants genocide
We have prevented more genocides than the rest of the world combined.

Zionism is a problem, but that doesnt detract from the overall fact that the US is the greatest nation on earth at the moment. Would Islam make it better? Yes, much, but that can change.

Anerican conservatism is actually quite aligned with Islamic values man, I dont know why you hate it.

[Wadaad]

Man İ didnt know your lands were taken by foreigners. I support Greater Somalia. Somali will grow and become 'Horn Turan, :) Focuse on Ethiopia first but before unite with Djibuti.

Emperor Haile Selassie came to Mogadishu during the UN trusteeship in the 1950s....and made a speech saying Somalia was part of the 'greater Ethiopian nation'. It is just a luck that Somalia has a country, believe me.

His grandfather Menelik was the one who occupy and colonize the Ogaden in 1897, and ofcourse the European colonials allowed him due to the christian solidarity. He even tried to marry a Bulgarian Orthodox princess and sent emisars to them, but ofcourse they just laugh at the idea of marrying a white to some Black nobleman even if the emperor of Ethiopia. But they give him all the weapons he needed.

[Sekarotuinen]

Emperor Haile Selassie came to Mogadishu during the UN trusteeship in the 1950s....and made a speech saying Somalia was part of the 'greater Ethiopian nation'. It is just a luck that Somalia has a country, believe me.

His grandfather Menelik was the one who occupy and colonize the Ogaden in 1897, and ofcourse the European colonials allowed him due to the christian solidarity. He even tried to marry a Bulgarian Orthodox princess and sent emisars to them, but ofcourse they just laugh at the idea of marrying a white to some Black nobleman even if the emperor of Ethiopia. But they give him all the weapons he needed.

Better be careful, wouldnt want to slander Christ reincarnate, now would we? Jah's marijuana laced wrath and all... [emoji12]

[Böri]

Emperor Haile Selassie came to Mogadishu during the UN trusteeship in the 1950s....and made a speech saying Somalia was part of the 'greater Ethiopian nation'. It is just a luck that Somalia has a country, believe me.

His grandfather Menelik was the one who occupy and colonize the Ogaden in 1897, and ofcourse the European colonials allowed him due to the christian solidarity. He even tried to marry a Bulgarian Orthodox princess and sent emisars to them, but ofcourse they just laugh at the idea of marrying a white to some Black nobleman even if the emperor of Ethiopia. But they give him all the weapons he needed.

Somalia has Turkish military base now :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCdxQtjNUu8

Ethiopia will be crushed and Somalia will create own Turan ;) Ethiopia is one of the oldest Xtian nation in the world it's why it was not colonized properly by European powers and it will have friends.

[Wadaad]

Better be careful, wouldnt want to slander Christ reincarnate, now would we? Jah's marijuana laced wrath and all... [emoji12]

You have no idea how many times I mock rastafarians and told them the truth about Haile Selassie. Their messiah is buried under a toilet seat btw...(you can thank Mengistu, the half Bantu marxist who resented being called a slave by the 'noble' Abyssinians)

[Wadaad]

Somalia has Turkish military base now :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCdxQtjNUu8

Ethiopia will be crushed and Somalia will create own Turan ;) Ethiopia is one of the oldest Xtian nation in the world it's why it was not colonized properly by European powers and it will have friends.

You can also use this base to interrogate your kiros :)

[Sekarotuinen]

You have no idea how many times I mock rastafarians and told them the truth about Haile Selassie. Their messiah is buried under a toilet seat btw...(you can thank Mengistu, the half Bantu marxist who resented being called a slave by the 'noble' Abyssinians)
Lol, too good.