LivingDNA Ydna result

[Dibran]

Hello all,

So I received my LivingDNA haplogroup result. Not sure what ancient groups it may be connected to. I am grouped as R-Z283

[Dibran]

Who is Z283 connected to ancestrally?

[Hevo]

R-Z283= R1a-Z283.

https://scontent-amt2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/11091032_785307661553240_6021342968062039210_o.jpg ?oh=80fb0df527c3b69541cf6d0e54fd3db7&oe=59C47676

[Tschaikisten]

Slavic ancestry :laugh:

[Lek]

Slavic ancestry :laugh:

Is it common in slavs ? Some sources say its Jewish.

[Tschaikisten]

Is it common in slavs ? Some sources say its Jewish.


R-Z283= R1a-Z283.

https://scontent-amt2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/11091032_785307661553240_6021342968062039210_o.jpg ?oh=80fb0df527c3b69541cf6d0e54fd3db7&oe=59C47676

[Lek]

Whats interesting, OP doesnt show any slavic admixture on autosomal. Hes extremely southern plotting. While im Northern. Even Albanians who get slavic/north europe on autosomal tests and Albanians with i2a dinaric are more Southern plotting than me and plot with greeks. They also get some jewish/italian in some. I never got any of this and im one of the most Northern plotting Albanians ive ever seen. On gedmatch I get abnormally high steppe though.

Seems like jews absorbed some slavic ydnas like this and i2a and there are jews even with j2b2 l283 , latter they probably picked up in the balkans.

http://jewishdna.net/R1a-Z283.html

When Jews settled in Europe they absorbed these and i think some Albanians got i2a dinaric and r1a z83 from jews and possibly even some ev13.

Explains why they are so Southern and get jewish on autosomal.


Either that or these autosomal tests are completely bullshit.

[Jana]

Whats interesting, OP doesnt show any slavic admixture on autosomal.
He doesn't need to, autosomal admixture can be completely diluted in less than 10 generations.
Except if he has Scandinavian type of R1a subclade of Z283(virtually non-existant in southeastern Europe), it's pretty obvious his direct paternal ancestry is Slavic.

It doesn't make him Slavic or any less Albanian, so don't see problem with it.

[Lek]

He doesn't need to, autosomal admixture can be completely diluted in less than 10 generations.
Except if he has Scandinavian type of R1a subclade of Z283(virtually non-existant in southeastern Europe), it's pretty obvious his direct paternal ancestry is Slavic.

It doesn't make him Slavic or any less Albanian, so don't see problem with it.

Im not saying its a problem. Im saying these autosomal results and pca maps dont make any sense.


There are autosomal tests that go like 1000 to 1500 years back such as MyOrigins supposedly goes back 2000 years. If he has tested then he should show obvious slavic admixture. Gedmatch calcs go even much further back, they go back thousands of years. Yet he doesnt show much signs of it if I remember correctly.

Neither dna land, not even drawing slim who is I2a1b does much. Although kurt/drawing slim does get some east euro and north euro noise on 23andme but not much sign on dna land or gedmatch.

Maybe if they both tested myorigins to see as some autosomal tests do seem accurate such as some getting east euro on myorigins also get some smaller east euro on 23andme.

And yes Albanians obviously absorbed Jews. There were large jewish communities in east europe, they absorbed slavic ydnas and later migrated again. Just look at the link i posted.. both this type of r1a and i2a din are found in jews. Even j2b2 l283 which jews got from balkanites. I dont see whats the problem with this obvious fact as some Albanians also get Jewish on autosomal.

[Dick]

Congrats

[Jana]

Im not saying its a problem. Im saying these autosomal results and pca maps dont make any sense.
There are autosomal tests that go like 1000 to 1500 years back such as MyOrigins supposedly goes back 2000 years. If he has tested then he should show obvious slavic admixture. Gedmatch calcs go even much further back, they go back thousands of years. Yet he doesnt show much signs of it if I remember correctly.
Neither dna land, not even drawing slim who is I2a1b does much.

There is a Jewish (in pink) and mediterranean/Greek (purple) cluster of I2-dinaric
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-8HC1MhoJTns/V7slh2IcUVI/AAAAAAAACWA/SPK4pT0oQwoulb_46TKY0H4LjQQpO5SEQCLcB/s1600/Screen%2BShot%2B2016-08-22%2Bat%2B9.15.58%2BAM.png

But to see if I2-dinaric Albanians have that they need to do a deep subclade testing. Same with R1a, FTDNA projects are good for that.

[Voskos]

Have you received a congratulation phonecall from Rethel yet?

[Era]

Hevo's chart doesnt associate it with slavs. It's a big group. You will need to test it further for a more specific clade.

[Lek]

Hevo's chart doesnt associate it with slavs. It's a big group. You will need to test it further for a more specific clade.

Thats what i was thinking too. That picture didnt tell me much.

[Karol Klačansky]

It doesn't make him Slavic or any less Albanian, so don't see problem with it.

Sure it does. He's descended from some Slavic dude

Sent from my KIW-L21 using Tapatalk

[Dibran]

Sure it does. He's descended from some Slavic dude

Sent from my KIW-L21 using Tapatalk

All studies on it associate it with Corded Ware and the Kurgans. It's also older than Proto Slavic branches. So it can't be Slavic when Proto Slavic among Scandinavian clades descend from it.

[Kelmendasi]

I have seen some sources claim that it's of Corded ware and later on Germanic origin

[Kelmendasi]

"The Germanic branch

The first major expansion of R1a took place with the westward propagation of the Corded Ware (or Battle Axe) culture (2800-1800 BCE) from the northern forest-steppe in the Yamna homeland. This was the first wave of R1a into Europe, the one that brought the Z283 subclade to Germany and the Netherlands, and Z284 to Scandinavia. The Corded Ware R1a people would have mixed with the pre-Germanic I1 and I2 aborigines, which resulted in the first Indo-European culture in Germany and Scandinavia, although that culture could not be considered Proto-Germanic - it was simply Proto-Indo-European at that stage, or perhaps or Proto-Balto-Slavic."

[Kelmendasi]

Judging by the R1a project on Ftdna, Z283 is found in Germanic countries, Slavic countries and even in some MENA countries

[Lek]

Sure it does. He's descended from some Slavic dude

Sent from my KIW-L21 using Tapatalk

Nice logic. Proto Albanians were indo europeans, they absorbed non-IE people, going by your logic those people are not Albanians..

What about all the I2a and I1.. it wasnt originially slavic or about all the EV13 and R1b in south slavs which is obviously from vlachs and Albanians. I gotplentyof slavicized Serbs whos paternal ancestors were Albanians which exceeds by far the slavic ancestry in Albs

But when an Albanian tests a non Albanian ydna like slavic , you all get excited lol.. there was an Albanian recently tested i2a1b.. both are still minorities in the hundreds of Albanians tested. There are by far more south slavs with ev13 etc

[Hevo]

Hevo's chart doesnt associate it with slavs. It's a big group. You will need to test it further for a more specific clade.

Basically, it's like this: Z283 is way to old to be associated with any modern groups. It's possible the OP belongs to an unidentified subclade of Z283.(Although I don't know if LivingDNA tests subclades of Z283 like Z80.)

[Dick]

OP should've done ftdna

[Peterski]

Congrats! So you are the only Albanian with R1a so far?:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?213008-Albanian-Ydna-Project-statistics-June-2017&p=4463994&viewfull=1#post4463994

[Kelmendasi]

@Dick: He's doing the most advanced fullgenomes test

[Peterski]

I have seen some sources claim that it's of Corded ware and later on Germanic origin

Only R1a-Z284 and R1a-L664 can be considered Germanic.

If Dibran wants to know if his branch is Slavic or Germanic, he needs to test it downstream.

I recommend either Y-SEQ or FTDNA R1a Backbone SNP Pack.

The Jewish subclade is R1a-M582/CTS6, and it is under R1a-Z93, not under R1a-Z283.

[Kelmendasi]

Only R1a-Z284 and R1a-L664 can be considered Germanic.

If Dibran wants to know if his branch is Slavic or Germanic, he needs to test it downstream.

I recommend either Y-SEQ or FTDNA R1a Backbone SNP Pack.

The Jewish subclade is R1a-M582/CTS6, and it is under R1a-Z93, not under R1a-Z283.
He's doing Fullgenomes which is the most advanced Ydna test AFAIK

[Peterski]

R1a-Z280 and R1a-M458 (both downstream of R1a-Z283) are the main Slavic branches.

Here is the structure of R1a in Poland, I counted this data a year ago from FTDNA Projects:

Sample size: 1208 Poles with R1a (last updated: 18.06.2016):

R1a-Z283 is as much as 96.61% (1167 out of 1208) of Polish R1a:

http://i.imgur.com/olrCthH.png

A more detailed look at R1a-Z280 and R1a-M458 (1151 out of 1208):

http://i.imgur.com/NxRGDVS.png

[Dick]

Only R1a-Z284 and R1a-L664 can be considered Germanic.

If Dibran wants to know if his branch is Slavic or Germanic, he needs to test it downstream.

I recommend either Y-SEQ or FTDNA R1a Backbone SNP Pack.

The Jewish subclade is R1a-M582/CTS6, and it is under R1a-Z93, not under R1a-Z283.

How is that considered a jewish subclade

[Dick]

He's doing Fullgenomes which is the most advanced Ydna test AFAIK

Big y is most advanced

[Peterski]

How is that considered a jewish subclade

Because it is the main Y-DNA lineage of Ashkenazi Levites (a priestly class).

Of course it was originally Indo-European (as all other R1a-Z93), not Semitic.

These Jewish Levites are descended from a Non-Jewish convert to Judaism.

Today it is associated with Jews, doesn't mean that it was always Jewish.

[Peterski]

Whats interesting, OP doesnt show any slavic admixture on autosomal.

Actually, he does show ca. 1-2% of Slavic (Early Medieval Polish) admixture.

He asked me for nMonte some time ago but I didn't have time to do it before:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?214485-K36-Ancient-2-0-focus-on-Iron-Age-amp-Bronze-Age

I found some time now. Here is Eurogenes K36 Ancient nMonte for Dibran:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?214486-K36-Ancient-2-0-Discussion-Thread

1) Normal nMonte:

Dibran

LateBronzeAge_Hungary_BR2 42.60
CopperAge_MarmaraSea_I1584 29.35
CopperAge_Italy_RISE489 18.10
LateBronzeAge_Armenia_RISE412 6.90
EarlyMedieval_Slavic_Mar7 1.65
BronzeAge_Levant_I1705 1.40
IronAge_Sarmatian_I0575 0.00
IronAge_LevantEgypt_3DRIF26 0.00
IronAge_GaelicCelt_6DRIF18 0.00
IronAge_BritishCelt_6DRIF23 0.00
IronAge_GaulishCelt_6DRIF22 0.00
IronAge_PictishBrit_6DRIF21 0.00
IronAge_CelticBriton_HI1 0.00
IronAge_CelticBriton_HI4 0.00
IronAge_Celto-German_6DRIF3 0.00
IronAge_Celto-German_3DRIF16 0.00
IronAge_EastGermanic_Kow55 0.00
IronAge_EastGermanic_Kow25 0.00
IronAge_EastGermanic_Kow22 0.00
IronAge_EastGermanic_Kow45 0.00
IronAge_EastGermanic_Mas5 0.00
IronAge_Egypt_JK2911 0.00
EarlyMedieval_AngloSaxon_HS2 0.00
EarlyMedieval_AngloSaxon_HS1 0.00
EarlyMedieval_Northumbrian_NO3423 0.00
Hunter_Ethiopia_Mota 0.00
BronzeAge_Iberia_ATP9 0.00
LateBronzeAge_Sudovia_RISE598 0.00
LateBronzeAge_Denmark_RISE276 0.00
LateBronzeAge_EastGermany_I0099 0.00
BronzeAge_Ireland_Rathlin1 0.00
BronzeAge_Hungary_BR1 0.00
BronzeAge_Cuiavia_PLN17 0.00
BronzeAge_Silesia_RISE150 0.00
BronzeAge_Silesia_RISE154 0.00
BronzeAge_Czechia_RISE577 0.00
BronzeAge_Czechia_RISE586 0.00
BronzeAge_EastGermany_I0047 0.00
BronzeAge_EastGermany_I0116 0.00
BronzeAge_EastGermany_I0164 0.00
BronzeAge_EastGermany_I0803 0.00
LateBronzeAge_Armenia_RISE397 0.00
BronzeAge_Armenia_I1633 0.00
BronzeAge_Armenia_I1635 0.00
BronzeAge_Armenia_I1656 0.00
BronzeAge_Armenia_I1658 0.00
BronzeAge_Levant_I1706 0.00
BronzeAge_Levant_I1730 0.00
CopperAge_Iran_I1665a 0.00
CopperAge_Iran_I1665b 0.00
CopperAge_Iran_I1674 0.00
LateNeolithic_Iran_I1671 0.00
CopperAge_Iran_I1661a 0.00
CopperAge_Iran_I1661b 0.00
CopperAge_Iran_I1662 0.00
IronAge_Scythian_I0247 0.00
IronAge_Hungary_IR1 0.00
IronAge_Sweden_RISE174 0.00
IronAge_Iran_F38 0.00
LateMedieval_Iran_I1955 0.00
EarlyMedieval_Slavic_RISE568 0.00
EarlyMedieval_Balto-Slav_Niem34 0.00
Megalithic_Iberia_I0408 0.00
Megalithic_Iberia_I0406 0.00
CopperAge_Iberia_ATP16 0.00
CopperAge_Iberia_ATP2 0.00
CopperAge_Iberia_I1300 0.00
CopperAge_Iberia_I1281 0.00
CopperAge_Iberia_I1303 0.00
CopperAge_Iberia_I1314 0.00
CopperAge_Iberia_I1280 0.00
CopperAge_Iberia_I1277 0.00
CopperAge_Iberia_I1274 0.00
CopperAge_Italy_RISE487 0.00
CopperAge_Italy_RISE486 0.00
BronzeAge_Steppe_RISE505 0.00
BronzeAge_Steppe_RISE395 0.00
BronzeAge_Steppe_I0423 0.00
BronzeAge_Steppe_RISE500 0.00
BronzeAge_Steppe_I0232 0.00
Ancestral_Amerindian 0.00
Ancestral_Basque 0.00
Ancestral_Central_African 0.00
Ancestral_East_African 0.00
Ancestral_East_Asian 0.00
Ancestral_East_Central_Asian 0.00
Ancestral_Indochinese 0.00
Ancestral_Malayan 0.00
Ancestral_North_African 0.00
Ancestral_Northeast_African 0.00
Ancestral_Oceanian 0.00
Ancestral_Pygmy 0.00
Ancestral_Siberian 0.00
Ancestral_South_Asian 0.00
Ancestral_South_Chinese 0.00
Ancestral_West_African 0.00

2) Restricted nMonte:

Dibran

LateBronzeAge_Hungary_BR2 42.60
CopperAge_MarmaraSea_I1584 29.35
CopperAge_Italy_RISE489 18.10
LateBronzeAge_Armenia_RISE412 6.90
EarlyMedieval_Slavic_Mar7 1.65
BronzeAge_Levant_I1705 1.40

=======================

Mar7 is an Early Slavic Polish sample from Early Medieval Markowice:

https://s4.postimg.org/3n9kl6d5p/mapa.jpg

Ylla also gets some admixture from Poland, but from Pre-Slavic Poland:

Mas5 is one of Wielbark culture samples from Masłomęcz (in Poland):

http://i.imgur.com/rmBr8Vp.png

[Peterski]

All Albanians show up as a mix of BR2 (Bronze Hungary) + I1584 (Copper Marmara) + Copper Italy + other stuff. I don't have ancient Balkan samples, that's why they get a mix of these three.

[Peterski]

Judging by the R1a project on Ftdna, Z283 is found in Germanic countries

The distribution of R1a in Germany correlates strongly with historic western limit of Slavic settlement (1/3 of modern Germany and most of Austria used to be Slavic-inhabited in the Early Middle Ages):

http://oi68.tinypic.com/6enpso.jpg

Autosomal DNA shows the same pattern, with Eastern Germans shifted towards Slavic populations:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?213808-Genetic-divisions-of-Europe-mirror-languages-in-1100-AD&p=4481336&viewfull=1#post4481336

Languages in 1100 AD (by that time most of Austria was already De-Slavicized since 800 AD):

http://s155239215.onlinehome.us/turkic/40_Language/KranzG1988GeogrDevelopmOfEurLanguages/KrantzGCh7Fig26.jpg

Maximum of Slavic expansion in the west (around years 800-850 AD):

http://s16.postimg.org/6c858un85/Slavic_expansion.png

[Dibran]

Basically, it's like this: Z283 is way to old to be associated with any modern groups. It's possible the OP belongs to an unidentified subclade of Z283.(Although I don't know if LivingDNA tests subclades of Z283 like Z80.)

Unless I was ill advised, they stated they test for all the downstream like z280 etc which according to them I was negative for.

[Era]

Actually, he does show ca. 1-2% of Slavic (Early Medieval Polish) admixture.

He asked me for nMonte some time ago but I didn't have time to do it before:

]

I think he asked for that K36 map you did for all of us.

[Dibran]

OP should've done ftdna

I'm doing Yelite wit FGC. Ftdna would be a waste of money considering FGC is more specific.

[Peterski]

I think he asked for that K36 map you did for all of us.

OK, I can do it for him too. That was Ancient Oracle 1.0 (Neolithic - Copper Age).

By the way, here is K36 nMonte Modern for Dibran:

1) Normal mode:

Dibran

Albania_FYROM 61.45
IT_Tuscany 19.30
IT_Sardinia 10.85
IT_Lazio 2.65
IT_Abruzzo 2.50
Albania_North 1.95
Albania_South 0.75
Kosovo 0.25
GR_Istanbul 0.20
IT_Apulia 0.05
Albania_Montenegro 0.05

2) Restricted mode:

Dibran

Albania_FYROM 68.2
IT_Tuscany 20.4
IT_Sardinia 11.4

[1] "1. CLOSEST SINGLE ITEM DISTANCES"
Albania_FYROM Albania_North Albania_South Kosovo
11.87947 12.07842 12.25134 12.78643
IT_Tuscany IT_Lazio Albania_Montenegro IT_Abruzzo
13.32141 13.40269 13.88721 14.47686

================

And K36 Admix-4 Oracle:

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Albania_FYROM @ 11,885726
2 Albania_North @ 12,084445
3 Albania_South @ 12,256978
4 Kosovo @ 12,792611
5 IT_Tuscany @ 13,325738
6 IT_Lazio @ 13,407116
7 Albania_Montenegro @ 13,893432
8 IT_Abruzzo @ 14,481902
9 Gr_Eubea @ 14,6298
10 Greek_Peloponnes @ 14,741904
11 IT_Marche @ 15,509158
12 IT_North @ 15,930839
13 IT_Apulia @ 16,387335
14 FR_Corsica @ 16,445909
15 IT_Friuli @ 16,725231
16 Greek_Macedonia @ 17,066045
17 IT_Veneto @ 17,381144
18 IT_Campania @ 17,620295
19 GR_Istanbul @ 17,646706
20 Bulgaria @ 17,950178
335 iterations.

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 IT_Tuscany+Albania_FYROM @ 10,817586
2 IT_Lazio+Albania_FYROM @ 10,993524
3 IT_Tuscany+Albania_North @ 11,269229
4 IT_Lazio+Kosovo @ 11,337641
5 IT_Lazio+Albania_North @ 11,401381
6 IT_Tuscany+Albania_South @ 11,44459
7 IT_Tuscany+Kosovo @ 11,518853
8 IT_Lazio+Albania_Montenegro @ 11,688168
9 IT_Lazio+Albania_South @ 11,708664
10 FR_Corsica+Albania_FYROM @ 11,813812
11 Albania_North+Albania_FYROM @ 11,835042
12 IT_Abruzzo+Albania_FYROM @ 11,839746
13 Albania_South+Albania_FYROM @ 11,865755
14 Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 11,885726
15 IT_Tuscany+Albania_Montenegro @ 11,976845
16 IT_Abruzzo+Kosovo @ 12,017649
17 Albania_North+Albania_South @ 12,037678
18 IT_North+Albania_FYROM @ 12,039179
19 Albania_North+Albania_North @ 12,084445
20 Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 12,092318
56280 iterations.

Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Lazio +25% IT_Tuscany @ 10,741776
2 50% IT_Tuscany +25% Albania_FYROM +25% Albania_FYROM @ 10,817586
3 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Tuscany +25% Albania_FYROM @ 10,887821
4 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Sardinia +25% Albania_FYROM @ 10,945093
5 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Tuscany +25% Albania_North @ 10,947234
6 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Tuscany +25% Albania_South @ 10,985296
7 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Abruzzo +25% IT_Tuscany @ 10,986598
8 50% IT_Lazio +25% Albania_FYROM +25% Albania_FYROM @ 10,993524
9 50% IT_Tuscany +25% Albania_North +25% Albania_FYROM @ 11,005084
10 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Lazio +25% Albania_FYROM @ 11,006851
11 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Tuscany +25% Kosovo @ 11,051691
12 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Lazio +25% Albania_North @ 11,056116
13 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Lazio +25% Kosovo @ 11,079313
14 50% IT_Tuscany +25% Albania_South +25% Albania_FYROM @ 11,079731
15 50% Albania_North +25% IT_Tuscany +25% Albania_FYROM @ 11,087434
16 50% IT_Lazio +25% Albania_FYROM +25% Kosovo @ 11,096878
17 50% IT_Tuscany +25% Albania_FYROM +25% Kosovo @ 11,103735
18 50% Albania_FYROM +25% FR_Corsica +25% Albania_FYROM @ 11,128458
19 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Lazio +25% Albania_South @ 11,128882
20 50% Albania_FYROM +25% IT_Lazio +25% IT_North @ 11,149301
13607768 iterations.

Using 4 populations approximation:
1 IT_Lazio+IT_Tuscany+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 10,741776
2 IT_Tuscany+IT_Tuscany+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 10,817586
3 IT_Tuscany+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYR OM @ 10,887821
4 IT_Lazio+IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM @ 10,920947
5 IT_Lazio+IT_Tuscany+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 10,93909
6 IT_Sardinia+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FY ROM @ 10,945093
7 IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYR OM @ 10,947234
8 IT_Tuscany+Albania_South+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYR OM @ 10,985296
9 IT_Abruzzo+IT_Tuscany+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 10,986598
10 IT_Lazio+IT_Lazio+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 10,993524
11 IT_Tuscany+IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM @ 11,005084
12 IT_Lazio+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 11,006851
13 IT_Lazio+IT_Tuscany+Albania_South+Albania_FYROM @ 11,031555
14 IT_Tuscany+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 11,051691
15 IT_Lazio+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 11,056116
16 IT_Lazio+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 11,079313
17 IT_Tuscany+IT_Tuscany+Albania_South+Albania_FYROM @ 11,079731
18 IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_FYR OM @ 11,087434
19 IT_Lazio+IT_Lazio+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 11,096878
20 IT_Tuscany+IT_Tuscany+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 11,103735
21 IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Albania_South+Albania_FYR OM @ 11,104142
22 IT_Lazio+IT_Tuscany+Albania_FYROM+Albania_Monteneg ro @ 11,123252
23 FR_Corsica+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYR OM @ 11,128458
24 IT_Lazio+Albania_South+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 11,128882
25 IT_Abruzzo+IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM @ 11,136957
26 IT_Abruzzo+IT_Tuscany+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 11,14106
27 IT_Lazio+IT_North+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 11,149301
28 IT_Lazio+IT_Lazio+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM @ 11,159236
29 IT_Lazio+IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Albania_North @ 11,177674
30 IT_Tuscany+FR_Corsica+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 11,180754
31 IT_Lazio+Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM @ 11,185553
32 IT_Tuscany+Albania_South+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 11,188824
33 IT_Tuscany+Albania_South+Albania_South+Albania_FYR OM @ 11,193155
34 IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 11,197708
35 IT_Lazio+IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Kosovo @ 11,202523
36 IT_Lazio+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 11,215596
37 IT_Lazio+FR_Corsica+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 11,219162
38 IT_Lazio+Albania_North+Albania_South+Albania_FYROM @ 11,236855
39 IT_Lazio+Albania_South+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 11,241454
40 IT_Lazio+IT_Lazio+Albania_FYROM+Albania_Montenegro @ 11,248614
400823717 iterations.

Gaussian method.
Noise dispersion set to 0,130062

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Albania_North @ 4,904054
2 Kosovo @ 4,916698
3 Albania_South @ 5,139966
4 Albania_FYROM @ 5,209804
5 Albania_Montenegro @ 5,232281
6 Gr_Eubea @ 5,314046
7 Greek_Peloponnes @ 5,353266
8 Greek_Macedonia @ 5,442626
9 IT_Veneto @ 5,460059
10 IT_Tuscany @ 5,766139
11 IT_North @ 5,804009
12 GR_Cyclades @ 5,826981
13 IT_Friuli @ 5,862802
14 Macedonia_FYROM @ 5,895218
15 IT_Apulia @ 5,987313
16 Bulgaria @ 6,027852
17 Gr_Chios @ 6,072517
18 Montenegro @ 6,182489
19 Serbian @ 6,330619
20 South_Romania @ 6,410774
335 iterations.

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 Albania_North+Kosovo @ 4,903653
2 Albania_North+Albania_North @ 4,904054
3 Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,916698
4 FR_Corsica+Kosovo @ 4,928335
5 IT_Tuscany+Kosovo @ 4,932281
6 IT_Lazio+Kosovo @ 4,940847
7 IT_Abruzzo+Kosovo @ 4,943017
8 IT_Abruzzo+Albania_FYROM @ 4,956068
9 IT_Tuscany+Albania_North @ 4,97229
10 IT_Lazio+Albania_Montenegro @ 4,974103
11 FR_Corsica+Albania_Montenegro @ 4,97692
12 IT_Abruzzo+Albania_Montenegro @ 4,97873
13 IT_Abruzzo+Albania_North @ 4,982835
14 Albania_South+Kosovo @ 4,984285
15 FR_Corsica+Albania_North @ 4,993103
16 IT_Tuscany+Albania_Montenegro @ 4,996493
17 FR_Corsica+Albania_FYROM @ 4,999261
18 Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 5,005639
19 Albania_North+Albania_South @ 5,00641
20 IT_Tuscany+Albania_FYROM @ 5,012994
56280 iterations.

Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Kosovo +25% FR_Corsica +25% Kosovo @ 4,841861
2 50% Kosovo +25% FR_Corsica +25% Albania_North @ 4,846057
3 50% Albania_North +25% FR_Corsica +25% Kosovo @ 4,854152
4 50% Kosovo +25% FR_Corsica +25% Albania_FYROM @ 4,86075
5 50% Kosovo +25% IT_Lazio +25% Kosovo @ 4,865086
6 50% Albania_North +25% FR_Corsica +25% Albania_North @ 4,866432
7 50% Kosovo +25% IT_Abruzzo +25% Albania_North @ 4,868997
8 50% Albania_North +25% IT_Abruzzo +25% Kosovo @ 4,869089
9 50% Kosovo +25% IT_Lazio +25% Albania_North @ 4,869539
10 50% Kosovo +25% IT_Abruzzo +25% Kosovo @ 4,872813
11 50% Albania_North +25% IT_Abruzzo +25% Albania_North @ 4,873342
12 50% Kosovo +25% FR_Corsica +25% Albania_Montenegro @ 4,876441
13 50% Albania_North +25% IT_Lazio +25% Kosovo @ 4,878193
14 50% Kosovo +25% IT_Tuscany +25% Albania_North @ 4,87907
15 50% Kosovo +25% IT_Tuscany +25% Kosovo @ 4,879474
16 50% Albania_North +25% IT_Tuscany +25% Kosovo @ 4,883447
17 50% Albania_North +25% FR_Corsica +25% Albania_FYROM @ 4,885769
18 50% Albania_North +25% FR_Corsica +25% Albania_Montenegro @ 4,886414
19 50% Kosovo +25% IT_Abruzzo +25% Albania_FYROM @ 4,89106
20 50% Albania_North +25% IT_Lazio +25% Albania_North @ 4,891351
16714162 iterations.

Using 4 populations approximation:
1 FR_Corsica+Kosovo+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,841861
2 FR_Corsica+Albania_North+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,846057
3 FR_Corsica+Albania_North+Albania_North+Kosovo @ 4,854152
4 FR_Corsica+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,86075
5 IT_Lazio+Kosovo+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,865086
6 FR_Corsica+Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_Nor th @ 4,866432
7 IT_Abruzzo+Albania_North+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,868997
8 IT_Abruzzo+Albania_North+Albania_North+Kosovo @ 4,869089
9 IT_Lazio+Albania_North+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,869539
10 FR_Corsica+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 4,871344
11 IT_Abruzzo+Kosovo+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,872813
12 IT_Abruzzo+Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_Nor th @ 4,873342
13 FR_Corsica+Albania_Montenegro+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,876441
14 IT_Lazio+Albania_North+Albania_North+Kosovo @ 4,878193
15 IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,87907
16 IT_Tuscany+Kosovo+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,879474
17 FR_Corsica+Albania_North+Albania_Montenegro+Kosovo @ 4,87975
18 IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Albania_North+Kosovo @ 4,883447
19 FR_Corsica+Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_FYR OM @ 4,885769
20 FR_Corsica+Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_Mon tenegro @ 4,886414
21 IT_Abruzzo+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 4,89036
22 IT_Abruzzo+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,89106
23 IT_Lazio+Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_North @ 4,891351
24 IT_Tuscany+Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_Nor th @ 4,892536
25 IT_Abruzzo+Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_FYR OM @ 4,893296
26 FR_Corsica+Albania_FYROM+Albania_Montenegro+Kosovo @ 4,894271
27 IT_Sardinia+Kosovo+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,894971
28 IT_Lazio+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,896562
29 GR_Thrace+IT_Sardinia+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM @ 4,897667
30 GR_Thrace+IT_Sardinia+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 4,898588
31 FR_Corsica+Albania_FYROM+Albania_FYROM+Kosovo @ 4,900489
32 IT_Lazio+Albania_Montenegro+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,900958
33 IT_Sardinia+Albania_Montenegro+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,901012
34 Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_North+Kosovo @ 4,902237
35 FR_Corsica+Albania_South+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,902882
36 FR_Corsica+Albania_North+Albania_FYROM+Albania_Mon tenegro @ 4,903292
37 Albania_North+Albania_North+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,903653
38 IT_Lazio+Albania_North+Albania_Montenegro+Kosovo @ 4,903861
39 Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_North+Albania_ North @ 4,904054
40 IT_Abruzzo+IT_North+Kosovo+Kosovo @ 4,904398
533339647 iterations.

[Jana]

Unless I was ill advised, they stated they test for all the downstream like z280 etc which according to them I was negative for.
If you are confirmed negative for all downstream Z283 subclades, than it is definitelly not Slavic or Germanic but way older than that and easily native Balkan haplogroup.

[Dibran]

I will post the autosomal as soon as I get in from work.

[Dibran]

At least hats what I was told via email. Then again who knows. They moved my mtdna back to H even though 23 has me at H11a

[Peterski]

I think he asked for that K36 [ancient] map you did for all of us.

In new version Albanians get these as their top ancient populations (+ some others but these are Top 3):

http://i.imgur.com/OLB7Ogr.png

Every Albanian has these as their main three. Differences are only when it comes to minor admixtures.

[Kelmendasi]

In new version Albanians get these as their top ancient populations (+ some others but these are Top 3):

http://i.imgur.com/OLB7Ogr.png

Every Albanian has these as their main three. Differences are only when it comes to minor admixtures.
Can you please do the K36 ancient oracle 2.0 for me? I posted my K36 in the discussion thread

[Era]

In new version Albanians get these as their top ancient populations (+ some others but these are Top 3):

htt.png

Every Albanian has these as their main three. Differences are only when it comes to minor admixtures.

This one Litvin. I think this is more accurate. It showed my higher west mena as I have higher red sea. I also agree with the rest.

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?212851-K36-Ancient-where-did-your-ancestors-live-5000-years-ago

[Herr Abubu]

Im not saying its a problem. Im saying these autosomal results and pca maps dont make any sense.


There are autosomal tests that go like 1000 to 1500 years back such as MyOrigins supposedly goes back 2000 years. If he has tested then he should show obvious slavic admixture. Gedmatch calcs go even much further back, they go back thousands of years. Yet he doesnt show much signs of it if I remember correctly.

Neither dna land, not even drawing slim who is I2a1b does much. Although kurt/drawing slim does get some east euro and north euro noise on 23andme but not much sign on dna land or gedmatch.

Maybe if they both tested myorigins to see as some autosomal tests do seem accurate such as some getting east euro on myorigins also get some smaller east euro on 23andme.

And yes Albanians obviously absorbed Jews. There were large jewish communities in east europe, they absorbed slavic ydnas and later migrated again. Just look at the link i posted.. both this type of r1a and i2a din are found in jews. Even j2b2 l283 which jews got from balkanites. I dont see whats the problem with this obvious fact as some Albanians also get Jewish on autosomal.

Dude, Jews lived in Eastern Europe, meaning the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth and Russia. In the Balkans, they were pretty much confined to Salonica, today Thessaloniki, and Istanbul.

Jews always lived in the cities, especially the trade centers. Albania didn't have that. Neither did most of the Balkans. Jews are entirely irrelevant when it comes to Albania in particular.

[Lek]

Dude, Jews lived in Eastern Europe, meaning the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth and Russia. In the Balkans, they were pretty much confined to Salonica, today Thessaloniki, and Istanbul.

Jews always lived in the cities, especially the trade centers. Albania didn't have that. Neither did most of the Balkans. Jews are entirely irrelevant when it comes to Albania in particular.

No, they aren't. There are still Jewish minorities in Kosovo and Albania and there used to be much more, They either migrated or got asimilated into Albanians.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Aalbania



The history of the Jews in Albania dates back about 2,000 years.

According to historian Apostol Kotani (Albania and the Jews):[1] "Jews may have first arrived in Albania as early as 70 C.E. as captives on Roman ships that washed up on the country's southern shores...descendants of these captives that would build the first synagogue in the southern port city of Sarandë in the fifth century... Little is known about the Jewish community in the area until the 15th century."[2][3]







[B]First reports of Jews living in Albania date from the 70 CE. By the early 16th century, there were Jewish settlements in most of major cities of Albania such as Berat, Elbasan, Vlorë, Durrës and also they are reported as well in Kosovo region. These Jewish families were mainly of Sephardic origin and descendants of the Spanish and Portuguese Jews expelled from Iberia in the end of 15th century CE. In 1520 in Vlorë were reported 609 Jewish households and also Vlorë was also the site of Albania's only synagogue which was destroyed in the First World War. In 1673 the charismatic Jewish prophet Sabbatai Zevi was exiled by the sultan to the Albanian port of Ulqin, also called Ulcinj, now in Montenegro, dying there three years later.[



Some Albanians get Jewish on autosomal tests while others don't, theres obviously something to it.

Albanians also hid Jews from nazis during world war 2 and Albania was

Dont ''dude'' me, you fucking faggot. If you wanna point out that im wrong then do it in a simply polite manner, Ok?

Good girl.

And stfu about things you have no idea about.

[Era]

In new version Albanians get these as their top ancient populations (+ some others but these are Top 3):

http://i.imgur.com/OLB7Ogr.png

Every Albanian has these as their main three. Differences are only when it comes to minor admixtures.

How far back Myheritage goes compare to this? If we have the Marmara component we should have west asian on Myheritage, no? Plenty of south italians had it that Sikeliot posted and we don't.

[Tschaikisten]

Be real, there are low chances for him to ''score'' a non-slavic branch of R1a-Z283.
It's also interesting that Albanian FTDNA project % of R1a is like a 0% when on population genetics studies it's always between 7-9%.

[Kelmendasi]

Be real, there are low chances for him to ''score'' a non-slavic branch of R1a-Z283.
It's also interesting that Albanian FTDNA project % of R1a is like a 0% when on population genetics studies it's always between 7-9%.
He is negative for the Z283 downstreams which could mean that its not Slavic or Germanic but perhaps older

[Peterski]

How far back Myheritage goes compare to this? If we have the Marmara component we should have west asian on Myheritage, no? Plenty of south italians had it that Sikeliot posted and we don't.

This is Anatolian Copper Age. I called it Marmara because it is from Barcin* near the Marmara Sea, at the borderland between Anatolia/Europe, and I don't have any samples from South-Eastern Europe.

*Barcin: http://www.nit-istanbul.org/projects/barc-n-hoyuk-excavations


we should have west asian on Myheritage, no?

I don't know. But here is GEDmatch kit number of that ancient Marmara Sea sample I1584:

M091434

Here is what she scores on Eurogenes K36 (East_Med is her main admixture):

Population
Amerindian -
Arabian -
Armenian 16.24
Basque 1.77
Central_African -
Central_Euro -
East_African -
East_Asian -
East_Balkan -
East_Central_Asian -
East_Central_Euro -
East_Med 28.03
Eastern_Euro -
Fennoscandian -
French -
Iberian 8.03
Indo-Chinese -
Italian 19.44
Malayan -
Near_Eastern 1.85
North_African -
North_Atlantic -
North_Caucasian 3.04
North_Sea -
Northeast_African -
Oceanian -
Omotic -
Pygmy -
Siberian -
South_Asian -
South_Central_Asian -
South_Chinese -
Volga-Ural -
West_African -
West_Caucasian 9.03
West_Med 12.57

================================

Copper Age Marmara Sea I1584 in Eurogenes K15:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 East_Med 32.07
2 West_Asian 26.22
3 West_Med 24.01
4 Atlantic 11.2
5 North_Sea 6.51

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 South_Italian 13.23
2 Central_Greek 14.86
3 Cyprian 15.19
4 East_Sicilian 15.69
5 Italian_Jewish 15.96
6 Sephardic_Jewish 16.43
7 Italian_Abruzzo 16.69
8 Algerian_Jewish 16.83
9 West_Sicilian 18.09
10 Turkish 18.13
11 Ashkenazi 18.51
12 Tunisian_Jewish 18.69
13 Lebanese_Muslim 19.32
14 Armenian 19.56
15 Greek 19.68
16 Libyan_Jewish 20.22
17 Assyrian 20.53
18 Greek_Thessaly 20.69
19 Georgian_Jewish 21.22
20 Tuscan 21.35

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 64.6% Armenian + 35.4% Sardinian @ 6.39
2 63% Georgian_Jewish + 37% Sardinian @ 8.18
3 64.2% Assyrian + 35.8% Sardinian @ 8.94
4 59.9% Kurdish + 40.1% Sardinian @ 10.35
5 67.8% South_Italian + 32.2% Armenian @ 10.71
6 81.9% South_Italian + 18.1% Abhkasian @ 10.93
7 69.3% Turkish + 30.7% Sardinian @ 10.96
8 80.9% South_Italian + 19.1% Georgian @ 11.13
9 61.9% Kurdish_Jewish + 38.1% Sardinian @ 11.22
10 73.3% Algerian_Jewish + 26.7% Abhkasian @ 11.57
11 62.4% Azeri + 37.6% Sardinian @ 11.58
12 73.9% South_Italian + 26.1% Georgian_Jewish @ 11.65
13 75.5% Italian_Jewish + 24.5% Abhkasian @ 11.66
14 61% Iranian_Jewish + 39% Sardinian @ 11.7
15 53.3% Armenian + 46.7% Tuscan @ 11.72
16 66.1% Armenian + 33.9% Spanish_Andalucia @ 11.73
17 71.5% Algerian_Jewish + 28.5% Georgian @ 11.77
18 53.2% West_Sicilian + 46.8% Armenian @ 11.78
19 84.2% South_Italian + 15.8% Ossetian @ 11.81
20 60.6% Armenian + 39.4% North_Italian @ 11.84

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Armenian +50% Sardinian @ 11.420547

Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Armenian +25% Sardinian +25% South_Italian @ 7.982128

Using 4 populations approximation:
1 Armenian + Armenian + Sardinian + South_Italian @ 7.982128
2 Armenian + Armenian + Italian_Jewish + Sardinian @ 8.440107
3 Armenian + Armenian + Cyprian + Sardinian @ 8.499011
4 Armenian + Armenian + Central_Greek + Sardinian @ 8.538765
5 Armenian + Armenian + Italian_Abruzzo + Sardinian @ 8.640818
6 Algerian_Jewish + Armenian + Armenian + Sardinian @ 8.659837
7 Armenian + Armenian + Sardinian + Sephardic_Jewish @ 8.747274
8 Abhkasian + Cyprian + Cyprian + Sardinian @ 8.751656
9 Armenian + Armenian + East_Sicilian + Sardinian @ 8.776332
10 Abhkasian + Lebanese_Druze + Sardinian + South_Italian @ 8.778069
11 Armenian + Georgian_Jewish + Sardinian + South_Italian @ 8.801810
12 Armenian + Armenian + Sardinian + West_Sicilian @ 8.832202
13 Cyprian + Cyprian + Georgian + Sardinian @ 8.905140
14 Abhkasian + Lebanese_Christian + Sardinian + South_Italian @ 9.025162
15 Abhkasian + Italian_Jewish + Lebanese_Druze + Sardinian @ 9.096087
16 Armenian + Armenian + Sardinian + Tunisian_Jewish @ 9.102440
17 Armenian + Assyrian + Sardinian + South_Italian @ 9.111494
18 Algerian_Jewish + Armenian + Georgian + Sardinian @ 9.125845
19 Georgian + Lebanese_Druze + Sardinian + South_Italian @ 9.133508
20 Abhkasian + Cyprian + Italian_Jewish + Sardinian @ 9.158104

[Dick]

I'm doing Yelite wit FGC. Ftdna would be a waste of money considering FGC is more specific.

I'm not familiar with them but at least ftdna gives you matches. You must be rare.

[Peterski]

^^^
^^^
That is DNA from the Marmara Sea region 5000 years ago (around 3000 BC).

At the borderland between North-Western Anatolia and South-Eastern Europe.

[Tschaikisten]

He is negative for the Z283 downstreams which could mean that its not Slavic or Germanic but perhaps older

Тhen FTDNA is only solution for him.

[Era]

Big y is most advanced

I read there that BigY is good if you want to find close relatives, but Y-67 is better ethnicity wise.

[Dick]

I read there that BigY is good if you want to find close relatives, but Y-67 is better ethnicity wise.other way around.

[Tschaikisten]

I read there that BigY is good if you want to find close relatives, but Y-67 is better ethnicity wise.

Big-Y is great for rare haplogroup members in some nation, for example some R1b-U106 among Balkanites.

[Herr Abubu]

No, they aren't. There are still Jewish minorities in Kosovo and Albania and there used to be much more, They either migrated or got asimilated into Albanians.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Aalbania






Some Albanians get Jewish on autosomal tests while others don't, theres obviously something to it.

Albanians also hid Jews from nazis during world war 2 and Albania was

Dont ''dude'' me, you fucking faggot. If you wanna point out that im wrong then do it in a simply polite manner, Ok?

Good girl.

And stfu about things you have no idea about.

You have some very serious personality issues. I wasn't rude at all, but it seems you just get upset like that because of, I guess, deep-seated insecurities and because you are quite simply not right in the head generally speaking. And speaking of faggotry, it's quite an effeminate thing to take offense so easily, especially for non-issues and perceived slights. Then there's your username...

The Jewish population in Albania and generally in the Balkans were nothing to speak of. I never said it was entirely non-existent, although even your very deep research into this topic on Wikipedia also shows that they almost were entirely non-existent in Albania. In the history of Albania there has been one synagogue. Think of that. And if you knew anything about history, you'd know exactly why it doesn't make sense that there should be large Jewish communities in Albania.

Autosomal calculators mean very little because they aren't accurate and they don't show actual genealogical admixture but simply approximations to make it simple to create a calculator. People getting 1.2% Jewish or East Asian or whatever means absolutely nothing.

[Dick]

If you're adopted then 37 markers is often sufficient to identify your likely surname. You only need more markers if you get too many matches and need to narrow down your list.

[Rethel]

Congrats

http://silvermanmortgage.com/wp-content/uploads/shock.jpg

[Peterski]

Slavic ancestry :laugh:

Albanian reaction to your comment:

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/masonry/000/259/943/694.png

[Era]

other way around.

Other way around makes more sense, but I read it and I thought it was counter intuitive. I'm trying to find the comment but no luck so far. I just saw they have a group EIJ Norman Project for Great Britain. Ever heard of this?

[Rethel]

Hello all,

So I received my LivingDNA haplogroup result. Not sure what ancient groups it may be connected to. I am grouped as R-Z283


http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=65586&d=1499370285

[Dibran]

Тhen FTDNA is only solution for him.

Yelite FGC. Better than big y in Ftdna. So no, not the only solution. Ftdna is a big waste of money. Probably will transfer over the bam file just to upload my results.

Also, considering German and Scandinavian clades are downstream of Z283 as well, it is not Slavic but the parent group to Slavic clades among others. Most Albanians are E-V13. Yet ev13 is not responsible for the spread of its indo European language. Just because R1a is predominantly in Eastern Europe does not make its origin Slavic.

Also, to my knowledge I2-Din correlates quite well with the Slavic migrations. Especially TMRCA. If that's anything to go by.

[Tschaikisten]

Yelite FGC. Better than big y in Ftdna. So no, not the only solution. Ftdna is a big waste of money. Probably will transfer over the bam file just to upload my results.

Also, considering German and Scandinavian clades are downstream of Z283 as well, it is not Slavic but the parent group to Slavic clades among others. Most Albanians are E-V13. Yet ev13 is not responsible for the spread of its indo European language. Just because R1a is predominantly in Eastern Europe does not make its origin Slavic.

Also, to my knowledge I2-Din correlates quite well with the Slavic migrations. Especially TMRCA. If that's anything to go by.

You have full right. Anyway, good luck. ;)

[Dick]

Yelite FGC. Better than big y in Ftdna. So no, not the only solution. Ftdna is a big waste of money. Probably will transfer over the bam file just to upload my results.



Big y tests for specific Snps not markers, does that company do the same? Also as I said you get matches from certain regions of Europe which narrows it down to a tee basically.

Can you upload your result to yfull.com? that will put you in a specific subclade with matches too.

[Kelmendasi]

Big y tests for specific Snps not markers, does that company do the same? Also as I said you get matches from certain regions of Europe which narrows it down to a tee basically.

Can you upload your result to yfull.com? that will put you in a specific subclade with matches too.
AFAIK fullgenomes does the sane thing as BigY but is apparently more detailed and advanced

[Kelmendasi]

Can you please show us your autosomal results from LivingDNA?

[Dick]

AFAIK fullgenomes does the sane thing as BigY but is apparently more detailed and advanced

Advanced but you get no matches. Ok then.

[Dibran]

LivingDNA got back to me. They told me these are the following clades downstream of Z283 that they test(all of which I am negative):


They are as follows:
M458/PF6241
L260/S222
Z280
S204/Z91
CTS8557/Z661
CTS91/S344/Z660
S205/Z92
CTS1211/S3357
P278/P278.1/P278.2
P278/P278.1/P278.2
CTS3402/S3361/V2670
L365/S468
S443/Z289
S221/Z284
L448/S200
S223/Z287
S345/Z288
S342/Z88

[The Illyrian Warrior]

Your y-dna result is rather too general to breakdown into a particular group, you should've gone for Y Elite 2.1 to have the crystal clear picture of your clade.


Congrats! So you are the only Albanian with R1a so far?:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?213008-Albanian-Ydna-Project-statistics-June-2017&p=4463994&viewfull=1#post4463994

The only Gheg with R1a, so far.

[Dibran]

Your y-dna result is rather too general to breakdown into a particular group, you should've gone for Y Elite 2.1 to have the crystal clear picture of your clade.



The only Gheg with R1a, so far.

I mentioned it like a few times lol. I already am testing with Yelite FGC. Additionally there are quite a few Gheg matches on 23 with R1a. A couple male cousins of mine. Some as far as I know not related. I doubt the compiled data for Albanian DNA project has every Albanian tester on it. I'm not included either. Not until I get my Yelite and upload to yfull from there. Etc.

So I am sure there are plenty. Also l, of DNA testing becomes more common place, im sure new things will be revealed that could turn previous data on its head. Time will tell. I posted above you all the clades downstream of z283 that they test. All of which o was negative for.

So Yelite will shed more light on this.

[Noman]

Slavic-Baltic-German - Z283

[Peterski]

LivingDNA got back to me.

They told me these are the following clades downstream of Z283 that they test (all of which I am negative):

They are as follows:
M458/PF6241
L260/S222
Z280
S204/Z91
CTS8557/Z661
CTS91/S344/Z660
S205/Z92
CTS1211/S3357
P278/P278.1/P278.2
P278/P278.1/P278.2
CTS3402/S3361/V2670
L365/S468
S443/Z289
S221/Z284
L448/S200
S223/Z287
S345/Z288
S342/Z88

So maybe you are CTS4385/L664, because apparently they did not test for it.

Polish Korfanty family belongs to L664, but they are descended from an Italian Condottiero from Veneto, named Corfanti, born in 1619 - who settled in Upper Silesia during the Thirty Years' War. If your ancestor was an Italian Condottiero, then maybe he was also CTS4385/L664 like that Corfanti.

Edit: I forgot to add, Corfanti was probably Croatian (a colonel of Croat cavalry):

http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?1516-R1a-and-Corded-Ware&p=156257&viewfull=1#post156257


Corfanti, who was born in Venetia in merchant family - he was a colonel in a Croat light cavalry unit.
At some point, during 30 Years' War, Corfanti was badly injured and he decided to stay in Silesia. He bought some land, married Amanda von Jurowski and fortunately for him, he was able to extend his lineage.

Corfanti and von Jurowski married in 1641 and they settled in Siemianowice:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siemianowice_Śląskie

One of his descendants: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wojciech_Korfanty

[Trojet]

So maybe you are CTS4385/L664, because apparently they didn't test it.

Polish Korfanty family belongs to L664, but they are descended from an Italian Condotieri from Veneto, named Corfanti, born in 1619 - who settled in Upper Silesia during the Thirty Years' War. If your ancestor was an Italian Condotieri, then maybe he was also CTS4385/L664 like that Corfanti.

Korfanty: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wojciech_Korfanty

He can't be because CTS4385,L664 is not derived from Z283 and he is confirmed Z283+
Assuming these SNP calls from LivingDNA are correct, I think he is likely either Y17491 or YP4758, or something rare:
http://i63.tinypic.com/1582a0.jpg

http://i67.tinypic.com/25gukur.jpg
https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-Z283/


Anyways, Dibran has ordered Y-Elite 2.1 which will nail this down.

[Peterski]

Oh shit you are right, I forgot that L664+ is an earlier-split branch. :picard1:

BTW, L664 was found in ancient DNA from western Corded Ware culture.


Anyways, Dibran has ordered Y-Elite 2.1 which will nail this down.

Nice.

[Peterski]

Of course R1a-Z283 is, just like L664, also from Corded Ware:

http://eurogenes.blogspot.com/2017/03/baltic-corded-ware-rich-in-r1a-z645.html

All of R1a downstream of M198 (or at least M417) is most likely from Corded Ware.

But Corded Ware culture was huge, from the Volga to the Rhine.

[Dibran]

Should be really interesting. So far every test has at least predicted a correct trajectory and not backtracked clades. So perhaps its ancestral z283? Maybe some undiscovered clades that branched off? Assuming the false negatives are not positive and the positives arent really false positives. Its very interesting, but I am a laymen in these things which is why I will be providing my reslts for better understanding when I get my yelite.

[Rethel]

Polish Korfanty family belongs to L664, but they are descended from an Italian Condottiero from Veneto, named Corfanti, born in 1619 - who settled in Upper Silesia during the Thirty Years' War. If your ancestor was an Italian Condottiero, then maybe he was also CTS4385/L664 like that Corfanti.

You see, another "slav" from not slavic country :p

[Karol Klačansky]

At least hats what I was told via email. Then again who knows. They moved my mtdna back to H even though 23 has me at H11aI was confirmed to be R1a-L260 so they definitely test further subclades. I'm surprised they didn't get you at H11a though

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