Traditional Albanian Cities/Architecture

[Arjana]

Basically the from of architecture in old traditional Albanian cities, especially the ones that were protected and not affected by the mass constructions of after the 90s.

Ancient Illyrian City of Shkodra, being more than 3200 years old, the capital of the Illyrian Kingdom and later on an important Roman city, where several Illyrian-Roman Emperors came from that region.

Falling again in the Albanian hands in the middle 14th century it was the last Albanian city to fall under Ottomans in 1480.

It was the center of the independent Albanian Pashallek of Bushati that holded a big territory between 1750-1832.

It is the center of Albanian Catholics.


http://vispoj.com.mk/sites/default/files/u49/shkoder11.jpg
https://previews.123rf.com/images/milosk/milosk1408/milosk140800097/30639698-View-at-Albanian-nature-from-Rozafa-Castle-Stock-Photo.jpg
http://www.yllpress.com/fotografite/artikujt_origjinale/nje_rrefim_per_shkodren_.jpg
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/-rdUZJBpCAI/maxresdefault.jpg
http://shkoder.net/images/shkodra/shkodra_qendra.jpg
http://blonde-gypsy.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/Town-Center-Skhoder-Shkodra-Albania-%C2%A9-The-Blonde-Gypsy-1024x682.jpg
https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/x/morning-view-city-center-shkoder-albania-54546957.jpg
http://www.albdreams.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/b_trip-2101_crop.jpg
http://choosebalkans.com/images/tirana_Shkorda_Highlights/Kisha-e-Madhe-.jpg

[Arjana]

Shkodra continuing ...

http://montenegro-for.me/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/Shkodra-Sheshi-featured.jpg
http://bestbalkantours.com/img/tours/sh11.jpg
http://kotortotirana.com/galerija/v-shkoder-1458911427-8.jpg
http://www.aadf.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/aanewsshkodra21.jpg
https://njeriunatyra.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/shkodra-e-transformume-firi-vezullues-i-nje-qyteti-qe-te-magjeps-me-bukuri-dhe-art-histori-dhe-personazhe-1.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6d/Rruga_Kol%C3%AB_Idromeno%2C_Shkod%C3%ABr.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3486/3752790396_3f8da4451e.jpg
http://i.istockimg.com/file_thumbview_approve/21861346/2/stock-photo-21861346-shkoder-downtown.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/83/Castillo_de_Rozafa%2C_Shkodra%2C_Albania%2C_2014-04-18%2C_DD_17.JPG/1200px-Castillo_de_Rozafa%2C_Shkodra%2C_Albania%2C_2014-04-18%2C_DD_17.JPG
http://www.panacomp.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/shkoder-panorama.jpg?x23386
http://i.imgur.com/g5i5kY0.jpg?1

[Arjana]

Old City of Korca

It was part of the Muzaka Albanian family in the 14th centiry when it started to develope as an actual city and has retained it's original from through the centuries.

It is one of the centers of Albanian Orthodoxy

http://drmkorce.akm.gov.al/resources/img/katedralja_korce.jpg
http://albania.al/Images/Resized/xnbk5lgw58190af1edc25_2400_1400_C_75.jpg
http://photos.wikimapia.org/p/00/01/45/40/08_big.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/sq/4/46/Korca_pamje_ajrore.jpg
http://albania4ever.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/korca-6.jpg
http://www.festaebirres.com/files4users/images/gallery/b1.jpg
https://www.gazetaexpress.com/public/uploads/image/korca-3_1501718474-9627232.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/74/Korca_medresesi.jpg
http://albania.al/Images/Resized/j44n1i1658167c576f9b1_600_600_C_60.jpg
http://www.citynews.al/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/korca-e1497546622913.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f0/Shkolla_e_par%C3%AB_shqipe_n%C3%AB_Kor%C3%A7%C3%AB .jpg
http://albanian.biz/uploads/korca.jpg

[Arjana]

Ancient City of Berat

Was created as a sicyt since 2,400 years ago.

It was changed into hands between Illyrian kings and Macedonian kingdom.

Was an important center of the Eastern Roman Empire.

Was the center of the Albanian Principality of Muzaka in the 13th,14th and 15th centuries.

Was the center of the Independent Albanian Pashallek of Berat until it was conquered by the powerful Albanian Lord, Ali Pashe Tepelena.

Was a center of commerce and Albanian intellectuals.

Now it is in UNESCO.


http://fluturoj.al/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/berati1.jpg
http://l7.alamy.com/zooms/90d71e2ea8f447ba969b92ad1ce3a38e/berati-albania-europe-cfdggw.jpg
http://zenithtravelalbania.com/uploads/images/Berati2.jpg
http://i1.trekearth.com/photos/57711/beratigoricasmall.jpg
http://fluturoj.al/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/berati3.jpg
http://www.intours.al/tours-albania/media/k2/galleries/248/berat.jpg

http://www.airtour.net/uploads/82db42b76d883c678354dec5ac22edd6.jpg
http://fluturoj.al/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/berati4.jpg

[Arjana]

Ancient city of Gjirokastra

UNESCO city like Berat.

Important city of the Despotate of Epir and later on the center of the Albanian Principality of Zenebishti. Was later on taken over by Arianiti albanian family until it felt down to the Ottomans.

Was an important city of the Independent Albanian Pashallek/Empire of Ali Pashe Tepelena, also called '' Lion'' of the east.

Was an epi center of Albanian nobility and governors of the ottoman empire. It become later on a center of Albanian nationalists like Korca and Berat.

Called also '' Stone City'' because it is based on the typical Albanian stone towers on which the model of the city was based on.


http://malishevapress.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/Gjirokastra-Arnavutluk.jpg
http://www.respublica.al/sites/default/files/2017/02/maxresdefault_2017_02_08_23.jpg
http://lajmi.net/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Gjirokastra.jpg
http://cdn.mobile.ikub.al/upload/a8/a8c16d50-0d13-4bdb-a544-5bdaa4739280---0.jpg
http://opinion.al/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/Gjirokastra01.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/736x/c3/cd/0d/c3cd0de3e5ed559414ab2f57734d5bfb--albania-aga.jpg
http://www.albinfo.ch/wp-content/uploads/files/gjirokastra.jpg
http://www.mapo.al/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/gjiro-3.jpg
http://www.pravoslavie.ru/sas/image/102444/244419.p.jpg?mtime=1470827859
http://www.albtoursd.com/userFiles/fotografijeCMS/202_gjirokastra5.jpg

[Arjana]

Tepelena, the city where the powerful Albanian independent Pasha/Lord, Ali Pashe Tepelena was born.

http://www.javanews.al/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/23.jpg
http://www.javanews.al/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/tepelene-rilindje.jpg
http://argjirolajm.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/tepelene.jpg
https://www.ps.al/photos/shares/galleries/30358/14589584_10154126906866523_8596357433909006177_o-860x497.jpg?token=d2032c09581e9ed2bad35a10c615832f
http://www.javanews.al/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/4-27.jpg
http://www.panorama.com.al/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/12321582_10153515526911523_1422587991323604103_n.j pg

[DarknessWin]

Ancient city of Gjirokastra

UNESCO city like Berat.

Important city of the Despotate of Epir and later on the center of the Albanian Principality of Zenebishti. Was later on taken over by Arianiti albanian family until it felt down to the Ottomans.

Was an important city of the Independent Albanian Pashallek/Empire of Ali Pashe Tepelena, also called '' Lion'' of the east.

Was an epi center of Albanian nobility and governors of the ottoman empire. It become later on a center of Albanian nationalists like Korca and Berat.

Called also '' Stone City'' because it is based on the typical Albanian stone towers on which the model of the city was based on.


http://malishevapress.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/Gjirokastra-Arnavutluk.jpg
http://www.respublica.al/sites/default/files/2017/02/maxresdefault_2017_02_08_23.jpg
http://lajmi.net/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Gjirokastra.jpg
http://cdn.mobile.ikub.al/upload/a8/a8c16d50-0d13-4bdb-a544-5bdaa4739280---0.jpg
http://opinion.al/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/Gjirokastra01.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/736x/c3/cd/0d/c3cd0de3e5ed559414ab2f57734d5bfb--albania-aga.jpg
http://www.albinfo.ch/wp-content/uploads/files/gjirokastra.jpg
http://www.mapo.al/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/gjiro-3.jpg
http://www.pravoslavie.ru/sas/image/102444/244419.p.jpg?mtime=1470827859
http://www.albtoursd.com/userFiles/fotografijeCMS/202_gjirokastra5.jpg


This is beautiful
its Greek city actually and name come from Αργυρόκαστρο - Argyrokastro

[Kelmendasi]

This is beautiful
its Greek city actually and name come from Αργυρόκαστρο - Argyrokastro
It was a Greek city in antiquity but now it's Albanian

[Laberia]

It was a Greek city in antiquity but now it's Albanian

When was a greek city in antiquity? Because is the first time that i hear this. Never was Gjirokastra a greek city, never.

[Kelmendasi]

When was a greek city in antiquity? Because is the first time that i hear this. Never was a greek city, never.
I mean Greek controlled, not Greek ethnically. And it's not really antiquity but the Kingdom of Epirus had control over it at one point and so did other Byzantine states.

[Laberia]

I mean Greek controlled, not Greek ethnically. And it's not really antiquity but the Kingdom of Epirus had control over it at one point and so did other Byzantine states.

Never was Greek controlled.

And it's not really antiquity but the Kingdom of Epirus had control over it at one point and so did other Byzantine states.
Nothing greek in all these.

[Kelmendasi]

Never was Greek controlled.

Nothing greek in all these.
What were they then?

[Kelmendasi]

...

[Laberia]

What were they then?

Tribes of Epir in antiquity were Illyrian tribes, barbarian.
Byzantines(a terminology invented after the fell of the Roman Empire) were Romans.
These are basic knowledge.

[Laberia]

http://montenegro-for.me/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/t1.jpg

http://zbulo.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/AM-gallery-59.jpg

Kelmendasi, theadi eshte per qytetet shqiptare, jo per fshatrat.

[Kelmendasi]

Kelmendasi, theadi eshte per qytetet shqiptare, jo per fshatrat.
Oh yh shit

[Kelmendasi]

Tribes of Epir in antiquity were Illyrian tribes, barbarian.
Byzantines(a terminology invented after the fell of the Roman Empire) were Romans.
These are basic knowledge.
The Byzantines weren't ethnically Italic and Greek had replaced Latin as an official language in the Eastern Roman Empire and the Epirus I am talking about is the one which was a successor state of the Byzantines not ancient Epirus

[Lavrentis]

Never was Greek controlled.

Nothing greek in all these.

Are you sure?

"Archaeological evidence points out, that during the Bronze Age the region was inhabited by populations that probably spoke a northwestern Greek dialect.[20]The earliest recorded inhabitants of the area around Gjirokastër were the Greek-speaking tribe of the Chaonians, that belonged to the Epirote group."[22]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gjirokast%C3%ABr

[Laberia]

The Byzantines weren't ethnically Italic and Greek had replaced Latin as an official language in the Eastern Roman Empire and the Epirus I am talking about is the one which was a successor state of the Byzantines not ancient Epirus

I didn't mentioned Italians.
Today the official language of EU is English but GB is out of the Union and the leading country of this new European "Empire" is Germany and the "Empress" is German. Maybe tomorrow will be France who will lead Europe or Italy, who knows. Lingua franca has nothing to do with the ethnicity of the people.

[Laberia]

Are you sure?

"Archaeological evidence points out, that during the Bronze Age the region was inhabited by populations that probably spoke a northwestern Greek dialect.[20]The earliest recorded inhabitants of the area around Gjirokastër were the Greek-speaking tribe of the Chaonians, that belonged to the Epirote group."[22]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gjirokast%C3%ABr

The crap written by Alexikoua of Wkipidhi. Any idea who is this individual?

[Lavrentis]

The crap written by Alexikoua of Wkipidhi. Any idea who is this individual?

No

[Vlatko Vukovic]

I was in Tirana and Shkoder once, and Shkoder is great town indeed.

[wvwvw]

https://youtu.be/0Ur5nIoOBgs

[Laberia]

No

Read Scylax, he explains perfectly where the Greece begins, beyond Ambracia.

[Laberia]

I was in Tirana and Shkoder once, and Shkoder is great town indeed.

Yes, Shkodër is beautiful. I am curious about this your visit in Albania.

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Yes, Shkodër is beautiful. I am curious about this your visit in Albania.

Well that was before 3-4 years. I was in that time with parents in Ulcinj, in Montenegro. And that's not far away from border with Albania, so we go in Albania haha.

I was surprised when i saw, 80% of your old people riding bike. I never saw something like that before lol xD

[DarknessWin]

Tribes of Epir in antiquity were Illyrian tribes, barbarian.
Byzantines(a terminology invented after the fell of the Roman Empire) were Romans.
These are basic knowledge.

I see you continue all these lies , Kelmendasi know a bit of history but you take it nationalistic and propagandist to a new level.
Tribe of Epirus were Greek and not Illyrian , you would change the History now???
I read Britannica , maybe we need to change Historians also to fit your propaganda???

[Laberia]

Well that was before 3-4 years. I was in that time with parents in Ulcinj, in Montenegro. And that's not far away from border with Albania, so we go in Albania haha.

I was surprised when i saw, 80% of your old people riding bike. I never saw something like that before lol xD

Shkodra in North and Korça in South are considered the cradles of Albanian culture. But Shkodra is far much older than Korça.
Yes it's true about the bikes. They have had always the best cycling team. It's an tradition in Shkodra.

[Laberia]

I see you continue all these lies , Kelmendasi know a bit of history but you take it nationalistic and propagandist to a new level.
Tribe of Epirus were Greek and not Illyrian , you would change the History now???
I read Britannica , maybe we need to change Historians also to fit your propaganda???

I am not changing nothing and there is nothing lies in my word. It's not you an asiatic that will teach the history of my country. Go learn the alpha, what means barbar and open the Oxford dictionary, there you can learn the meaning.

[DarknessWin]

I am not changing nothing and there is nothing lies in my word. It's not you an asiatic that will teach the history of my country. Go learn the alpha, what means barbar and open the Oxford dictionary, there you can learn the meaning.

Ok sent me an Engyclopedia which support that Epirus tribes were not Greeks but Illyrians.
I wait

[Laberia]

Ok sent me an Engyclopedia which support that Epirus tribes were not Greeks but Illyrians.
I wait
1774
Johann Thunmann:
On the History and Language
of the Albanians and Vlachs

The first people that history recognises in this region are the Illyrians, a large and mighty nation living on the Adriatic Sea, from the Po to the Ambracian Gulf, and northwards to the Danube. Strabo believes that this people spread westwards to Lake Constance, through Noricum and Vindelicia. He also asserts that the Pannonians stemmed from this people. Appian notes clearly that the Pannonians were Illyrians. The Istrians, Japodes, Dalmatae, Liburnians, Dardanians, Ardiaei, Autariates, in short, all the peoples down to the Ceraunian mountains are generally regarded as Illyrians. But they also inhabited wide reaches of Macedonia, Epirus and Thessaly.
Only a small portion of Macedonia was inhabited by the Greeks. The mass of the population was Illyrian and Thracian. The Dassaretae, the Lyncestae, the Bryges or Phrygians, the Pelagones, The Eordi, the Elimiotes, the Atintanes, the inhabitants of the region around Candavia, Pella, Edessa and Verva have all been expressly referred to as Illyrian. To a great extent, it was almost only the towns on the coast that had Greek inhabitants. The Macedonians had a language of their own that was also spoken in the regions along the Ionian Sea across from Corfu and, thus in Greek Illyria and Epirus.
There were also many non-Greek peoples in Epirus who, as noted above, spoke the Macedonian language, or the Illyrian language, which was probably the same thing. But the Greek colonies here and the dynasty of Aeacides introduced the Greek language such that the various peoples spoke two languages. The Amphilochans further to the south also belonged to this group, and for this reason are also referred to as barbarians by Thucydides. In Thessaly there were also other peoples of foreign origin, such as the Perrhaedans, referred to by Appian as Illyrians, the Athamanes, the Aethices, the Tymphaei and the Penestae, the Helots of the Thessalians, who had probably been the same people as the Illyrian Penestae. Scylax notes that only beyond Ambracia, the Peneus and the town or mountain of Homotion in Magnesia, had the Greeks begun to inhabit the region in a compact manner. In Strabo’s time, the barbarians owned large parts of Greece, and he reports that the Thracians inhabited Macedonia and parts of Thessaly at that time.
Source:
from: Johann Thunmann, Über die Geschichte und Sprache der Albaner und der Wlachen (Leipzig 1774). Translated from the German by Robert Elsie.

[Laberia]

'In October 1984, 70 historians and archaeologists from Greece, Albania, Romania, Italy and several other countries of Europe convened in Clermont-Ferrand, France. They held a colloquium with a group of Specialists in ancient history who were working there under the direction of Proffesor Pierre Kaban, the renowned expert on Epirus. They compared studies on the tribal and ethnic groups which gradually organised into urban life, then federated into state organisations. They compared juridical institutions such as family right of ownership, the role of the woman in the family and the procedure in freeing slaves. Similarities of Epirotes centers like Dodona and those of Southern Illyria were evidenced by the layout, architecture, and political organisation, also the circulation of coins, the structure of groves, the burial rites and articles found in the tumuli. But scholars concluded that from early antiquity until the Roman times THAT CULTURE OF SOUTHERN ILLYRIA AND EPIRUS, INCLUDING MOLOSSIA, WAS QUITE DIFFERENT FROM THAT OF CLASSICAL GREECE AS FOUND IN ATHENS AND SPARTA' (Jaques 1995:80/81)


Bibliography:

Edwin.E.Jaques 1995 'The Albanians: An ethnic history from prehistoric times to the present'

[wvwvw]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6d/AncientgrsetlinAlb.svg/424px-AncientgrsetlinAlb.svg.png
Ancient Greek settlements in Albania. Classical Epirus shown in grey. Borders of ancient Epirus (blue), Macedonia (green).

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b5/Map_of_ancient_Epirus_and_environs.png
Tribes of Epirus in antiquity

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/50/Epirus_%26_modern_borders.jpg
The Roman provinces of Epirus.in relation to modern borders.

[DarknessWin]

1774
Johann Thunmann:
On the History and Language
of the Albanians and Vlachs

Source:
from: Johann Thunmann, Über die Geschichte und Sprache der Albaner und der Wlachen (Leipzig 1774). Translated from the German by Robert Elsie.


I ask for Modern Day Encyclopedias and you sent me someones writings from 1774???
Is this a joke??
Today is proven after Coins and Statues finding in the region that both Epirus and Macedonia were 100% Greek tribes and
have nothing to do with Illyrians

I trust only Britannica and that is what asked for, reliable source that all modern Historians accept.
This is what Brittanica say about Albanians in Epirus and when they come in the region:

https://i.imgur.com/diqO9WK.png

[wvwvw]

The city appears in the historical record dating back in 1336 by its Greek name, Αργυρόκαστρο - Argyrokastro

During the Ottoman period conversions to Islam and an influx of Muslim converts from the surrounding countryside made Gjirokastër go from being an overwhelmingly Christian city in the 16th century into one with a large Muslim population by the early 19th century.

Taken by the Hellenic Army during the Balkan Wars of 1912–3 on account of its large Greek population,[8] it was eventually incorporated into the newly independent state of Albania in 1913. This proved highly unpopular with the local Greek population, who rebelled; after several months of guerrilla warfare, the short-lived Autonomous Republic of Northern Epirus was established in 1914 with Gjirokastër as its capital. It was definitively awarded to Albania in 1921.[9] In more recent years, the city witnessed anti-government protests that lead to the Albanian civil war of 1997.[10]

Along Muslim and Orthodox Albanians, the city is also home to a substantial Greek minority.[11][12] The city together with Sarandë, is considered one of the centers of the Greek community in Albania, and there is a consulate of Greece.

[Laberia]

I ask for Modern Day Encyclopedias and you sent me someones writings from 1774???
Is this a joke??
Today is proven after Coins and Statues finding in the region that both Epirus and Macedonia were 100% Greek tribes and
have nothing to do with Illyrians

I trust only Britannica and that is what asked for, reliable source that all modern Historians accept.
This is what Brittanica say about Albanians in Epirus and when they come in the region:

https://i.imgur.com/diqO9WK.png



Herodotus' HISTORY BOOK 7 (POLYMNIA) Complete

Moreover a wall had once been built at this pass, and in old times there was a gate set in it; which wall was built by the Phokians, who were struck with fear because the Thessalians had come from the land of the Thesprotians to settle in the Aiolian land, the same which they now possess. Since then the Thessalians, as they supposed, were attempting to subdue them, the Phokians guarded themselves against this beforehand; and at that time they let the water of the hot springs run over the passage, that the place might be converted into a ravine, and devised every means that the Thessalians might not make invasion of their land. Now the ancient wall had been built long before, and the greater part of it was by that time in ruins from lapse of time; the Hellenes however resolved to set it up again, and at this spot to repel the Barbarian from Hellas: and very near the road there is a village called Alpenoi, from which the Hellenes counted on getting supplies.
http://www.ellopos.net/elpenor/greek...ry-7.asp?pg=73

[Laberia]

Greeks derailing an thread in Albanian subforum. But especially the video of Raine is very offensive.
Pedakia, tomorrow don't start to cry.

[Laberia]

Interesting is the fact that the descendants of the Christian Turks who arrived in Greece during the exchange of population between Turkey and Greece, are the most active from greek members of this forum in this discussion about Epir. They are aware that they were settled in a stolen land.

[wvwvw]

Greeks derailing an thread in Albanian subforum. But especially the video of Raine is very offensive.
Pedakia, tomorrow don't start to cry.

You do the derailing, why don't you tell us one thing Illyrian about the Epirotes.

[Laberia]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6d/AncientgrsetlinAlb.svg/424px-AncientgrsetlinAlb.svg.png
Ancient Greek settlements in Albania. Classical Epirus shown in grey. Borders of ancient Epirus (blue), Macedonia (green).

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b5/Map_of_ancient_Epirus_and_environs.png
Tribes of Epirus in antiquity

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/50/Epirus_%26_modern_borders.jpg
The Roman provinces of Epirus.in relation to modern borders.
Who is the author/s of the map Raine, Alexikoua again?

[wvwvw]

Interesting is the fact that the descendants of the Christian Turks who arrived in Greece during the exchange of population between Turkey and Greece, are the most active from greek members of this forum in this discussion about Epir. They are aware that they were settled in a stolen land.

They arrived because their land which was part of Greece, was annexed by the Turks. That was internal migration from one part of Greece to another. Those people were never called Turks unlike your people who were known as Turkalbanians.

[DarknessWin]

Herodotus' HISTORY BOOK 7 (POLYMNIA) Complete

http://www.ellopos.net/elpenor/greek...ry-7.asp?pg=73

Why you sent me that and what is supposed to mean with this???
I want proofs like Britannica and Herodotus tell nothing about Albanians or that Epirotans were not Greeks. Barbarian term is just political and modern Historians can explain this to you better if you ever read some modern Encyclopedias .
Albanians come dont to the Region of Epirus along with Serbs in 1318

Thats enough

[wvwvw]

Ok sent me an Engyclopedia which support that Epirus tribes were not Greeks but Illyrians.
I wait

Lol even genetic studies show the Epirotes were Greek. They spoke the North-West dialect of Greek. The most important centre of the Zeus cult was located in Epirus.

As for Pyrrhus also known as Neoptolemos he was the son of the Achilles and the princess Deidamia (one of King Lycomedes's seven daughters). Homer calls them Hellenes.

[wvwvw]

Why are Albanians from Epirus genetically close to Greeks and both are genetically close to Myceneans and Minoans if they're Illyrian?

Macedonians and other Greeks never regarded Illyrians as their kinsmen. Alexander the Great left no doubt as to who the Ancient Macedonians were by emphasizing the Otherness of the Illyrians, in contrast to them.

Ancient Macedonians/Epirotes and Illyrians had a different Religion and different Customs

Since Macedonians/Epirotes were Greeks, they shared the common religious and cultural features of the Hellenic world. Consequently the gods worshipped among Southern Greeks can also be found in Macedonia and Epirus.

On the other hand, the 12 gods of Olympus were not shared by Illyrians. Aristophanes in his “Όρνιθες” places the gods οf the Triballians/Illyrians above Zeus, distinguishing this way the 12 Olympian Gods from the gods of Triballians/Illyrians. A clear delimitation of the Hellenic world and its borders with Illyrians. Similarly, those two ancient people had different culture. Herodotus refers to the Eneti tribe in Illyria and their habit of taking their daughters to the marketplace to sell them for marriage, a Barbarian custom which was found only among Babylonians.

The ancient sources leave no doubt that the ancients saw among Macedonians and Illyrians not only two different people, but the persistent source-tradition portrays Illyrians as the greatest enemies of Macedonians. Illyrian incursions in Macedonian territory was a frequent phenomenon before Philip’s Reign.

During Perdiccas and Brasidas joint expedition, their Illyrian Allies changed sides without scruples and became the chief instrument or the explulsion of the Macedonian expeditionary force. Later, Illyrians resisted the power of Archelaos‘ resurgent Macedon. Amyntas, the father of Philip II, was driven out of his country by Illyrians who invaded Macedonia. He could surely give up hope for his crown, had the Thessalians not decided to intervene, in order to restore him to his throne. Philip’s brother, Perdiccas III was killed during a battle against Illyrians together with 4,000 Macedonians. Phillip’s massive victory against the Bardyllis, possibly in 359 BC, put an end to the ambitious plans of the Illyrian king.

Alexander the Great, in the battle of Pelium (335 BC) defeated the Illyrian forces of Glaukias and Cleitus. The persistent armed conflicts between the two rival people kept up during Hellenistic ages till the Roman Occupation.

[Laberia]

Why you sent me that and what is supposed to mean with this???
I want proofs like Britannica and Herodotus tell nothing about Albanians or that Epirotans were not Greeks. Barbarian term is just political and modern Historians can explain this to you better if you ever read some modern Encyclopedias .
Albanians come dont to the Region of Epirus along with Serbs in 1318

Thats enough

According to Oxford dictionary a barbarian is: 2. Hist. a. One not a Greek.
Albanians are natives in Epir and didn't arrived in Epir with servs in 1318. Albanians were ruler of Epir and exactly Gjirokastër before the year 1318 mentioned by you. The Albanian ruling family of the region was Zenebishti or Zenevisi:

The "Zenevias", probably the Zenevisi, are mentioned in 1304 as one of the families that were granted privileges by the Angevin Philip I, Prince of Taranto.[1] According to Robert Elsie, the family originated from the Zagoria region between Gjirokastra and Përmet, in modern-day southern Albania.[2]

[wvwvw]

According to Oxford dictionary a barbarian is: 2. Hist. a. One not a Greek.
Albanians are natives in Epir and didn't arrived in Epir with servs in 1318. Albanians were ruler of Epir and exactly Gjirokastër before the year 1318 mentioned by you. The Albanian ruling family of the region was Zenebishti or Zenevisi:

The natives before their partial Albanisation were Greek. I say partial because a sizeable Greek minority is still there. Why you think there is no mention of Albanian Sqhiptaris until the 11th century?

[Kouros]

Some of the Skhondra pics remind me of Greek islands and Italy. Really nice.

[wvwvw]

According to Oxford dictionary a barbarian is: 2. Hist. a. One not a Greek.
Albanians are natives in Epir and didn't arrived in Epir with servs in 1318. Albanians were ruler of Epir and exactly Gjirokastër before the year 1318 mentioned by you. The Albanian ruling family of the region was Zenebishti or Zenevisi:

A barbarian was not only someone who was not Greek. Athenians called even those who did not speak the Attic dialect of Greek barbarians. And politicians frequently called each other barbarians.

The differences between the Athenians and the Megarians portrayed in Old Comedy show that the stereotype of the Dorian Megarians shares certain characteristics with both barbarian groups and the (mostly Ionian) subjects/allies of Athens. In addition to the lengthy scene with the Megarian merchant in the Akharnians, fourteen other references create a vivid and consistent stereotype of Megara: the comic poets repeatedly characterize the Megarians, like the barbarians and the Athenian subjects/allies, as inferior, vulgar, childlike, and conniving.

Prof. Florence concludes:
“Why do the Megarians not conform to the comic stereotypes of other Dorian groups? I suggest in the second part of the paper that the stereotype of the Megarians is inextricably linked to Athenian imperial ideology. By attributing characteristics typically associated with barbarians and subjects/allies to their Megarian neighbors, the comic poets suggest that the local Greek landscape requires Athenian control and, thereby, sanction Athenian mastery over it.”

[DarknessWin]

According to Oxford dictionary a barbarian is: 2. Hist. a. One not a Greek.
Albanians are natives in Epir and didn't arrived in Epir with servs in 1318. Albanians were ruler of Epir and exactly Gjirokastër before the year 1318 mentioned by you. The Albanian ruling family of the region was Zenebishti or Zenevisi:

I am Greek so let me know better what the greek word Barbarian meaning ,
Athenians used the term politically and especially for enemy Greek tribes that have not Democracy.
Also used it for rude people not matter Greek or not

Britannica say that Albanians came in 1318 to Epirus and not me

[Arjana]

This is beautiful
its Greek city actually and name come from Αργυρόκαστρο - Argyrokastro

Gjirokastra was never '' greek'' in it's entire history.

It was the center of Roman-Albanian nobles in the 12th and 13th centuries and the center of Zenebishti Albanian Principality in the 14th and 15th centuries.

It was also called the city of Albanian Vezires because of the high amount of high ranking Albanian Ottoman oficial that came from this city.

It was also very important for the Albanian Lord, Ali Pashe Tepelena.

It was also a center of Albanian patriotism.

It's stone architecture is typical albanian.

How the names comes it is still a mystery . It was called Gjinokaster by albanians for centuries.

You have went off topic and all the idiocies states here in this thread will be deleted.

Dont go off topic again.

[Arjana]

I mean Greek controlled, not Greek ethnically. And it's not really antiquity but the Kingdom of Epirus had control over it at one point and so did other Byzantine states.

Let the ancient Epirotes out if this because you aregoing 2400 years back.

'' Byzantines'' were not an ethnicity, but a mix of different people that identified with the roman empire.

Many of this people were orthodox Albanians. and the term '' byzantines'' themselves is a rescent invention because the empire was called '' the roman empire''.

The Empire was initiated by Illyrian Emperors, specifically Constantine the Great, was ruled until 585 by Illyrian Emperors and the greatest Emperor was another Illyrian, Justinian the Great.

Albanians continued to be citiznes of this empire until middle ages and even with a special status of self governance which other nations did not have.

Albanian nobles ruling in albanian lands had extensive marriages and blood relations associated with high atitles from both Komnennos and Paleologo dynasties.

Even the State of Skanderbeg was called the last '' byzantine'' land for example.

These are simple facts that you should know, simple terms and definitions.

The ignorance of some Albanians is insane.

[Kelmendasi]

Let the ancient Epirotes out if this because you aregoing 2400 years back.

'' Byzantines'' were not an ethnicity, but a mix of different people that identified with the roman empire.

Many of this people were orthodox Albanians. and the term '' byzantines'' themselves is a rescent invention because the empire was called '' the roman empire''.

The Empire was initiated by Illyrian Emperors, specifically Constantine the Great, was ruled until 585 by Illyrian Emperors and the greatest Emperor was another Illyrian, Justinian the Great.

Albanians continued to be citiznes of this empire until middle ages and even with a special status of self governance which other nations did not have.

Albanian nobles ruling in albanian lands had extensive marriages and blood relations associated with high atitles from both Komnennos and Paleologo dynasties.

Even the State of Skanderbeg was called the last '' byzantine'' land for example.

These are simple facts that you should know, simple terms and definitions.

The ignorance of some Albanians is insane.
Who the hell was talking about the ancient Epirotes? Pipe up when you actually have a clue about what I said, Jesus Christ. The Komnennos and Paleologo were Greeks and they are the ones who ruled Byzantium, also can you tell me where I said Byzantine is an ethnicity?

[Catholic Riffs]

ALL OF THIS IS ROMAN, SLAVIC OR OTTOMAN

[Ujku]

Well that was before 3-4 years. I was in that time with parents in Ulcinj, in Montenegro. And that's not far away from border with Albania, so we go in Albania haha.

I was surprised when i saw, 80% of your old people riding bike. I never saw something like that before lol xD

They ride bikes because in their youth cars were banned.

You will see old people in bikes everywhere in Albania.

[Laberia]

Why you sent me that and what is supposed to mean with this???
I want proofs like Britannica and Herodotus tell nothing about Albanians or that Epirotans were not Greeks. Barbarian term is just political and modern Historians can explain this to you better if you ever read some modern Encyclopedias .
Albanians come dont to the Region of Epirus along with Serbs in 1318

Thats enough
No, it`s not enough, because it`s not the truth first of all.
First, let me explain you that Albanians didn`t arrived in Epir with servs in year 1318:
The presence of Albanians in the Epeirote lands from the beginning
of the thirteenth century is also attested by two documentary sources:
the first is a Venetian document of 1210, which states that the continent
facing the island of Corfu is inhabited by Albanians;(20) and the second
is letters of the Metropolitan of Naupaktos John Apokaukos to a
certain George Dysipati, who was considered to be an ancestor of
the famous Shpata family.(21) Furthermore, I suggest that names that
appear in two acts of the Angevins of Naples dated 1304 (22) using the
forms, Albos, Spatos, Catarucos, Bischesini, Aranitos, Lecenis,
Turbaceos, Marchaseos, Scuras, Zeneuias, Bucceseos, Logoresc and
Mateseos are either well-known, less-known or totally unknown names
of Albanian clan leaders at that time.

You can continue to read my entire post here. (https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?204408-Slavic-I2a1-in-southern-Albania&p=4277479&highlight=Xhufi#post4277479)

(20.) G. Tafel - G. Tomas (1856), 122.
(21). N. Bees - E. Seferli, 'Unedierte Schriftstiicke aus der Kanzlei des Johannes
Apokaukos', BN] 21 (1974), doc. 62. For views on this name as being ancestral to
the name 'Shpata', see P. Xhufi (1994), 47 and note 132.
(22). L. Thalloczy - K. Jirecek - M. Sufflay (1913), 166a, doc. 563 and 167-168,
doc. 569.
Second, Herodotus explain very well who is Greek and who is Barbarian, let me quote you again him:

Moreover a wall had once been built at this pass, and in old times there was a gate set in it; which wall was built by the Phokians, who were struck with fear because the Thessalians had come from the land of the Thesprotians to settle in the Aiolian land, the same which they now possess. Since then the Thessalians, as they supposed, were attempting to subdue them, the Phokians guarded themselves against this beforehand; and at that time they let the water of the hot springs run over the passage, that the place might be converted into a ravine, and devised every means that the Thessalians might not make invasion of their land. Now the ancient wall had been built long before, and the greater part of it was by that time in ruins from lapse of time; the Hellenes however resolved to set it up again, and at this spot to repel the Barbarian from Hellas: and very near the road there is a village called Alpenoi, from which the Hellenes counted on getting supplies.
And i want to quote you an greek scholar, Titos Jochalas because the similarity is very interesting, centuries later:
1971
Titos Jochalas:
On Albanian Migration to Greece

Johannes Cantacuzene then adds a brief note that is worth mentioning because it reveals that when Sirjannis was ostracized from Byzantium, he is said to have landed in Euboea, Locris and Acarnia and to have sought refuge amongst the Albanians in Thessaly, whom he had known from the time when he was “General of the West.” We know that Sirjannis held this office around the year 1315 and can thus conclude that the Albanians were already present in Thessaly at the start of the 14th century.
Source:
Titos Jochalas: ‘Über die Einwanderung der Albaner in Griechenland, eine zusammenfassende Betrachtung.’ in: Dissertationes Albanicae in honorem Josephi Valentini et Ernesti Koliqi Septuagenariorum (Munich: Trofenik 1971), pp. 89-106. Translated from the German by Robert Elsie. For the 94 footnotes, that are omitted in this English version, the interested reader should refer to the German original.
The whole study of Jochalas you can read here (http://www.albanianhistory.net/1971_Jochalas/index.html).
So, in year 1315 Albanians Albanians were an political factor in Thessaly. And of course they settled in Thessaly before year 1315. When? We don`t know.
And let me quote also an important scholar, N.G.L. Hammond:
....To the settled peoples they were a terror. “Deus misit hanc pestem," wrote the author of the Gesta Dei per Francos 2.293. They came, like a plague of locusts, in huge numbers ("in tanta quantitate numerosa") and in 1325 they ravaged and destroyed everything in Thessaly outside the fortified centres ("ornnia quae erant extra castra"). When they wanted to leave Thessaly and go elsewhere, many others appeared with their wives and children ("multicum uxoribus et filiis") and their combined forces proceeded to wreck other parts of Thessaly.... (https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?217199-More-than-Myth-Ancient-DNA-Reveals-Roots-of-1st-Greek-Civilizations&p=4786796&highlight=Hammond#post4786796)
History repeat itself, like in the description of Herodotus.
So, the story don`t start in year 1318. Albanians were present in Epir long time before the arrving of the servs. Ask Raine to find in greek an document that mention Muzaka in 11th century. And Muzaka are an family from South Albania that ruled large part of Epir, they were the Despot of Epir.

[Catholic Riffs]

ALL OF THIS IS ROMAN, SLAVIC OR OTTOMAN

[Wrong]

ALL OF THIS IS ROMAN, SLAVIC OR OTTOMAN
Yep.

There is no such thing as "Albanian architecture". It is all inspired from the cultures above.

[-Scar-]

Britannica say that Albanians came in 1318 to Epirus and not me

They overran the whole of Epirus together with Vlachs and Slavs during the Dark Ages. So in other words ''they'' are you.

[The Great Uniter]

Yep.

There is no such thing as "Albanian architecture". It is all inspired from the cultures above.

Why? We all evolve and beneficially advance forward, everyone has been influence by another culture whenever is Greek from Egyptians and Babylonians or Romans from Greeks. Or Arabs from Persians, Greeks, Arabians (not Arabs) and Romans. Greek colons were highly influenced by Ancient Egyptian architecture such as Djoser's Pyramid Complex. Literally because Greeks didn't have the decency to admit they have stolen Ancient Egyptian architecture this doesn't make it any less 100% validly true.