Why do ligers and tigons look so different if their autosomal mixtures are the same?

[Peterski]

From a discussion on another forum about haplogroups and phenotype:

Quote:

"I completely agree with that. Y-DNA may only have a minor influence on looks. Nevertheless, when we see what happens when a tiger mates with a lion, and how different the offspring look depending on which of the two is the father or the mother, it looks like the X and Y chromosomes play a considerable role in looks as well. Here is a male and a female liger (cross between a male lion and a female tiger).

http://www.lovethesepics.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Male-Ligers.jpg

http://www.liger-hercules.com/liger-hercules-moksha-bybee/liger-hercules-moksha-bybee-liger-cub-aries.jpg

Compare it with a male tigon (cross between a male tiger and a female lion).

http://www.ligerzoos.com/liger-zoo-harbin-china/liger-zoo-harbin-china.jpg

And a female tigon

http://3parblog.typepad.com/files/tigon-1.jpg

One thing that differs clearly is the body size. What's more, tigons resemble tigers more than lions. This is especially true of female tigons. But the facial features are also quite different. The male liger, which has a lion's Y-chromosome, does have a typical lion face. The male tigon's face is neither typically lion nor tiger."

End of quote.

Very interesting, I wonder if this also applies to mixed-race humans ???

For example do first generation Mulattos with an African father and a European mother usually look different than first generation Mulattos with a European father and an African mother? Etc., etc.

Edit:

Well of course humans are one species, while tigers and lions are two different species:

Lions diverged from tigers at least ca. 3.5 million years ago, according to this graph:

https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-4f77460a5b88f97e9945a38d518b7964

[Ilma]

Mixing feline races comparing mixing human races is somehow interesting for the fact it clearly shows up the genetical problems resulting of it.

The female took more physically from the tigger indeed while the male took more from the lion. IMO this is probably due to the fact we inherit physically more the phenotype of our father with some facial features from our mother in many cases.

Is this because of Y DNA ? I dont think so. More likely due to recessive and dominant genes expressing in phenotype, maybe those from father are more dominant generally, I dont know.

The inherited pheno anyway is alterred in facial features by the mother then after many generations the male line looks still different than the former male. This is why Y DNA does not carry "a look" IMO. Maybe for 3 generations only or so. Too much alterred by centuries of mixing with females from different ethnicities etc.

[cosmoo]

Sex chromosomes do have functional genes indeed, but it is not certain what do they exactly regulate. That study where men with I haplogroup were found to have 50% of increased chance for cardiovascular diseases over all other lineages certainly comes to mind.

[Sacrificed Ram]

Very interesting, I wonder if this also applies to mixed-race humans ???


The age of communism in Poland still left their hurts...

First you should ask: Why do humans so differents if the are genetically so similar?

Tiger and Lion = Different species
Humans = Only one species

The genes in Lions and Tigers works in differnt ways because they are different species. Humans genes working the same because we are the same species. The only situation where male and female combination will affect the descendents are characteristics regulated by Y-cromossome, like hemophilia or the disease of that english baby related with mitochondria.

I live in Brazil, I see all combinations possible, and I see none difference.

[Peterski]

I live in Brazil, I see all combinations possible, and I see none difference.

Have you done proper research, gathered a statistically representative sample and applied scientific methods?

[Wrong]

Answer: Traits

[Rethel]

Why do ligers and tigons look so different if their autosomal mixtures are the same?

It is simple: they have different Ys.
As pictures show, they are more daddy's.

[Neon Knight]

The age of communism in Poland still left their hurts...

First you should ask: Why do humans so differents if the are genetically so similar?

Tiger and Lion = Different species
Humans = Only one species

The genes in Lions and Tigers works in differnt ways because they are different species. Humans genes working the same because we are the same species. The only situation where male and female combination will affect the descendents are characteristics regulated by Y-cromossome, like hemophilia or the disease of that english baby related with mitochondria.

I live in Brazil, I see all combinations possible, and I see none difference.
If lions and tiggers :D can cross-breed then they must be the same species/race. How else would you make a meaningful distinction between species?

[Rethel]

Is this because of Y DNA ?

Chromosme Y is reshaping everything.
Think about all differences between males and females.
All of this becasue one slight chromosome, who has not even a pair.


I dont think so. More likely due to recessive and dominant genes expressing in phenotype, maybe those from father are more dominant generally, I dont know.

Yes, they are, as Y is dominant itself.
If would be not, then males wouldn;t be born at all.
Remember, that we are half X, when females are twice Xs.
So, Y has to be dominant to create a male.


This is why Y DNA does not carry "a look" IMO.

If Y does not carryies a look, then why men do not look like women? :rolleyes:

[Kriptc06]

Aren't they sterile? Mixed race humans aren't sterile.

[Sacrificed Ram]

Have you done proper research, gathered a statistically representative sample and applied scientific methods?

Petrovich comrade, if someone try to do this NAZI-like research in my country, he will go to jail.

Even this tiger-lioness/lion-tigress admixtures are considered mistreatment against the animals because the descendents tend to have serious health problems.

There are things that poles never will understand because they are socio-culturally very homogeneous. Most problems in a heterogeneous society isn't intrinsically the race, but because the race is also associated with a diverse socio-cultural content. Imagine a blond pole doesn't have problem to marry with a dark haired pole, in a homogeneous socio-cultural society, a black wouldn't have problem to marry a white.

[Rethel]

Aren't they sterile? Mixed race humans aren't sterile.

Some are, some aren't.

But it is not about sterility, but how genes from concrete sex infunece offspring.
This is very good example - which is the same among others hybrids too, like
zonkeys, zebroids, whatever - i dont remember all names :)

[Kriptc06]

Some are, some aren't.

But it is not about sterility, but how genes from concrete sex infunece offspring.
This is very good example - which is the same among others hybrids too, like
zonkeys, zebroids, whatever - i dont remember all names :)

I think there's a difference in humans too, but it would need to be tested, and It would be a weird experiment lol
As much as I wish to deny you, it happened in my family, my father look like his father and I look like mine, and of course I resemble my grandfather.

In fact I always felt like an alien when I visited my mothers relatives xD

[Rethel]

As much as I wish to deny you, it happened in my family, my father look like his father and I look like mine, and of course I resemble my grandfather. In fact I always felt like an alien when I visited my mothers relatives xD

So you see on your own skin... :)

[Kriptc06]

So you see on your own skin... :)

I think the same way men look more like their father's, women look more like their mother's, and it looks obvious if you start thinking, you would look more like parent you have the same sex.

[Rethel]

I think the same way men look more like their father's, women look more like their mother's, and it looks obvious if you start thinking, you would look more like parent you have the same sex.

In the case of women it depends, which X is dominant - mother's or father's.

[Finnish Swede]

I felt sad then looked those photos (same with white tigers...a sick one below...thanks to humans).

Humans should not act like being Gods or something..

https://assets3.thrillist.com/v1/image/2618561/size/tmg-article_tall;jpeg_quality=20.jpg


Nope. These animals are much more beautiful just like nature has developed/ment them to be...Amur tigers are my favorits.

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/17/0e/1e/170e1eaa06a35e7568b26d5f7ebfdabc--siberian-tiger-beautiful-cats.jpg

PS: I'm not Putin fan...but here he won 6-0 Trump's son:
http://p1.img.cctvpic.com/photoworkspace/contentimg/2014/10/12/2014101211443772954.jpg
http://www.straight.com/files/v3/images/17/02/trumps.jpg

[RN97]

I felt sad then looked those photos (same with white tigers...a sick one below...thanks to humans).

Humans should not act like being Gods or something..

https://assets3.thrillist.com/v1/image/2618561/size/tmg-article_tall;jpeg_quality=20.jpg


Nope. These animals are much more beautiful just like nature has developed/ment them to be...Amur tigers are my favorits.

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/17/0e/1e/170e1eaa06a35e7568b26d5f7ebfdabc--siberian-tiger-beautiful-cats.jpg

PS: I'm not Putin fan...but here he won 6-0 Trump's son:
http://p1.img.cctvpic.com/photoworkspace/contentimg/2014/10/12/2014101211443772954.jpg
http://www.straight.com/files/v3/images/17/02/trumps.jpg

A lion will sometimes sit there and torture another animal (or human) for one hour or more just to make a territorial point. Some of those animals hunted cost a shitton of money. You have to pay to do it and usually they're carefully selected. It's not often that it's a female in heath or something like that. Actually, it helps conservation because the cost of losing the animal itself is lower than the payment in money. It's sorta like a carbon tax if it makes sense.
This is also unrelated, but the first one is a pure white tiger. He's just inbred because you obv. don't breed animals to make them uber-inbred. It's the result of a stupid breeder, but it can be done correctly. If it should be is unrelated...

[Finnish Swede]

A lion will sometimes sit there and torture another animal (or human) for one hour or more just to make a territorial point. Some of those animals hunted cost a shitton of money. You have to pay to do it and usually they're carefully selected. It's not often that it's a female in heath or something like that. Actually, it helps conservation because the cost of losing the animal itself is lower than the payment in money. It's sorta like a carbon tax if it makes sense.
This is also unrelated, but the first one is a pure white tiger. He's just inbred because you obv. don't breed animals to make them uber-inbred. It's the result of a stupid breeder, but it can be done correctly. If it should be is unrelated...

I do't care **** about dirty (killing) money...and what comes to breedings (by humans)...that was what I exactly meant. Incl. those 1 page ''creatures''.

[Ilma]

Chromosme Y is reshaping everything.
Think about all differences between males and females.
All of this becasue one slight chromosome, who has not even a pair.

Yes, they are, as Y is dominant itself.
If would be not, then males wouldn;t be born at all.
Remember, that we are half X, when females are twice Xs.
So, Y has to be dominant to create a male.

If Y does not carryies a look, then why men do not look like women? :rolleyes:

What happens during the fecondation depends actually on the sperm which penetrates the oocyte. The oocyte is basically carrying only one chromosome, the X. The winner sperm coming to meet it carries EITHER the Y chromosome from the father, EITHER the X chromosome from the father (since father has both). It just depend which sperm is winning the access of it actually. So yes, if that happens the winner sperm carries the Y, it will be dominant on the X from the oocyte and resulting in a male baby.

It does not carries a look, it generates hormonal and biological differences resulting in sexual dimorphism, therefore men and women look obviously different. There is no "Y look" or whatsoever just what it express to develop you as man or a woman IMO. The X chromosome brings itself (and the rest of genes from the mother as well) lot of physical differences from the father that you will express or not.

Imagine two persons like two brothers for example. They wont inherit exactly the same genes from each side (father / mother). One can get genes from the maternal grandmother even while the other one would maybe take instead genes from the paternal grandfather etc, resulting they won't look like each others because they are obviously not twins (not genetically copy paste of each others xD). This is why sometimes brothers / sisters look that much different you wonder if they are all from the same father haha.

If the Y would carry absolutely a look, it would mean all brothers from the same father and mother would look the same. Then you know it's not the case in many families, brothers look different. Sometimes it happens brothers look close to each others and even look more like their father but sometimes not. I think because the paternal look is maybe dominant or not depending his genes maybe ?

[Chev Chelios]

Even among mixed humans, you see such differences. For example, Half-Black Half-White people. When father is black, offspring usually have dominant Negroid phenotypes. Or when father is white, Caucasoid traits may be more visible. BUT again, Having a white or black father does not guarantee those results. The results may vary.

My opinion may sound unscientific, but I think sometimes father is dominant and sometimes mother is dominant. So children may become more similar to one of their parents. Paternal side or maternal side.

[Ilma]

Even among mixed humans, you see such differences. For example, Half-Black Half-White people. When father is black, offspring usually have dominant Negroid phenotypes. Or when father is white, Caucasoid traits may be more visible. BUT again, Having a white or black father does not guarantee those results. The results may vary.

My opinion may sound unscientific, but I think sometimes father is dominant and sometimes mother is dominant. So children may become more similar to one of their parents. Paternal side or maternal side.

This is magic of nature, somehow pretty random when it comes to inheriting physical traits...

[Chev Chelios]

Also, I saw it among East Asian/Mongoloid + other mixed kids. When father is Mongoloid, kids are usually 50-50. But when mother is Mongoloid, kids have dominant Mongoloid facial features.

[Peterski]

Also, I saw it among East Asian/Mongoloid + other mixed kids. When father is Mongoloid, kids are usually 50-50. But when mother is Mongoloid, kids have dominant Mongoloid facial features.

I also got an impression that for some reason AMWF hapas look more Caucasoid than WMAF hapas.

Where did you see it?

[Chev Chelios]

I also got an impression that for some reason AMWF hapas look more Caucasoid than WMAF hapas.

Where did you see it?

Bruce Lee and his kids are a proof. xD

I saw many White men + Asian women couples and its seem the maternal side is strongly dominant for most cases. The kids are more similar to their mothers rather than the fathers.

If White men want to marry a non-White, the best choices are non-white Caucasoids and Black women. Unlike Black Man White Woman couples, WMBW combo works very well.

[Sacrificed Ram]

Bruce Lee and his kids are a proof. xD

But Bruce Lee was grandchild of germans.

[Kriptc06]

Even among mixed humans, you see such differences. For example, Half-Black Half-White people. When father is black, offspring usually have dominant Negroid phenotypes. Or when father is white, Caucasoid traits may be more visible. BUT again, Having a white or black father does not guarantee those results. The results may vary.

My opinion may sound unscientific, but I think sometimes father is dominant and sometimes mother is dominant. So children may become more similar to one of their parents. Paternal side or maternal side.

this dude is half japanese, his father is american, his caucasoid side is stronger.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HewathKGZ2Q

[Sacrificed Ram]

this dude is half japanese, his father is american, his caucasoid side is stronger.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HewathKGZ2Q

Who is half japanese? I don't know how to listen english! I just read and write.

[Chev Chelios]

But Bruce Lee was grandchild of germans.

Very weak factor. See his wikipedia page:

There is no proof in any documents that Bruce Lee had a maternal German grandfather as popularly thought, rather his European ancestry came from an English maternal grandmother. His mother had an English mother and a Chinese father.

[Chev Chelios]

this dude is half japanese, his father is american, his caucasoid side is stronger.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HewathKGZ2Q

And I didn't say all half-Caucasoid half-Mongoloid people who have a Mongoloid mother are similar to their mothers. I said most of them look like their mothers. That's just my personal experience based on my real life encounters (not scientific).

[Kriptc06]

Who is half japanese? I don't know how to listen english! I just read and write.

the guy on the left.