Early Medieval Russian DNA

[Peterski]

Grand Duchy of Vladimir sample (Sunghir6) is on GEDmatch:

Sunghir6 (years ca. 1040-1220 AD) - kit number T005824

And his Y-DNA haplogroup was I2a1b2a1a1a1a3-A16681.

Sungir6's K36 similarity map:

https://s6.postimg.org/5f9yexzjj/Sungir6_K36.png

https://s6.postimg.org/5f9yexzjj/Sungir6_K36.png

https://s1.postimg.org/3tj8tymf33/Screen_Hunter_2032_Oct._10_11.03.jpg

http://science.sciencemag.org/content/sci/suppl/2017/10/04/science.aao1807.DC1/aao1807_Sikora_SM.pdf

[Peterski]

Eurogenes K13:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Baltic 46.99
2 North_Atlantic 27.29
3 West_Med 12.79
4 East_Med 5.08
5 West_Asian 4.98
6 Siberian 1.22
7 Amerindian 1.17
8 Oceanian 0.46
9 Red_Sea 0.01
10 Northeast_African 0.01

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Ukrainian 3.62
2 Polish 4.33
3 Estonian_Polish 4.6
4 Russian_Smolensk 4.72
5 Southwest_Russian 4.9
6 Ukrainian_Lviv 5.39
7 Belorussian 5.9
8 Ukrainian_Belgorod 5.92
9 South_Polish 5.99
10 Kargopol_Russian 8.67
11 Lithuanian 8.82
12 Estonian 9.47
13 Croatian 10.93
14 Erzya 11.03
15 Finnish 12.01
16 East_Finnish 12.5
17 Southwest_Finnish 12.82
18 Moldavian 13.9
19 Hungarian 15.11
20 East_German 16.04

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 86.7% Lithuanian + 13.3% Sardinian @ 2.34
2 76.5% Ukrainian + 23.5% Lithuanian @ 2.53
3 93.6% Estonian_Polish + 6.4% Sardinian @ 2.58
4 60.3% Ukrainian + 39.7% Estonian_Polish @ 2.64
5 93.7% Russian_Smolensk + 6.3% Sardinian @ 2.89
6 63.6% Ukrainian + 36.4% Russian_Smolensk @ 2.94
7 71.1% Ukrainian + 28.9% Belorussian @ 2.97
8 55.9% Lithuanian + 44.1% Croatian @ 3
9 82.9% Ukrainian + 17.1% Estonian @ 3.11
10 75.7% Estonian_Polish + 24.3% Croatian @ 3.14
11 62.2% Lithuanian + 37.8% Moldavian @ 3.18
12 56.7% Estonian_Polish + 43.3% Ukrainian_Lviv @ 3.2
13 80.6% Estonian_Polish + 19.4% Moldavian @ 3.24
14 70.5% Ukrainian + 29.5% Southwest_Russian @ 3.29
15 81.3% Lithuanian + 18.7% North_Italian @ 3.32
16 65.9% Ukrainian_Lviv + 34.1% Lithuanian @ 3.32
17 91.8% Estonian_Polish + 8.2% North_Italian @ 3.33
18 75.7% Lithuanian + 24.3% Bulgarian @ 3.34
19 88.3% Ukrainian + 11.7% Erzya @ 3.34
20 67% Ukrainian + 33% Polish @ 3.36

Eurogenes K36:

Population
Amerindian -
Arabian -
Armenian -
Basque 1.69
Central_African -
Central_Euro 8.12
East_African -
East_Asian -
East_Balkan 7.02
East_Central_Asian -
East_Central_Euro 23.49
East_Med -
Eastern_Euro 22.27
Fennoscandian 6.56
French 8.82
Iberian 0.91
Indo-Chinese -
Italian -
Malayan -
Near_Eastern -
North_African -
North_Atlantic 7.48
North_Caucasian 0.49
North_Sea 9.40
Northeast_African -
Oceanian -
Omotic -
Pygmy -
Siberian -
South_Asian -
South_Central_Asian -
South_Chinese -
Volga-Ural 0.86
West_African -
West_Caucasian -
West_Med 2.89

[Leto]

This is awesome, thank you! The results looks like normal Russian results.

[dimadoe]

Out of curiosity, eye color:

https://i.imgur.com/LDm25jR.jpg

[Peterski]

More about Sunghir6:

http://forum.molgen.org/index.php/topic,10....html#msg393890 (http://forum.molgen.org/index.php/topic,10359.msg393890.html#msg393890)

http://s019.radikal.ru/i635/1710/02/5bcbe7e6ee21.png


This is awesome, thank you! The results looks like normal Russian results.

Don't modern Russians score a bit more of Siberian admixture?

[Leto]

Dodecad K7b Oracle results:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Atlantic_Baltic 76.37
2 West_Asian 13.23
3 Southern 7.06
4 Siberian 2.85
5 African 0.45
6 South_Asian 0.03

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Mixed_Slav (Dodecad) 1.25
2 Ukranians (Yunusbayev) 2.12
3 Polish (Dodecad) 2.99
4 Russian_B (Behar) 4.14
5 Russian (Dodecad) 4.32
6 Belorussian (Behar) 4.48
7 Argyll (1000Genomes) 4.81
8 Dutch (Dodecad) 5.3
9 Swedish (Dodecad) 5.86
10 Orkney (1000Genomes) 5.91

Ancient Eurasia K6 Oracle results:
gedrosia K6 Oracle

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 West_European_Hunter_Gartherer 45.65
2 Natufian 33.03
3 Ancestral_North_Eurasian 17.31
4 East_Asian 3.73
5 Sub_Saharan 0.29

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Ukrainian 3.28
2 Scottish 3.47
3 Czech 3.73
4 Norwegian 3.79
5 Icelandic 4.07
6 English 4.2
7 Europe_LNBA 4.76
8 Hungarian 5.14
9 Estonian 5.57
10 Lithuanian 6.45

[PunhetaDeBacalhau]

No matter the calculator, he always seems to match pretty well with modern day Western Russians, Ukrainians, Belorusians, Polish, etc :)

[Leto]

Don't modern Russians score a bit more of Siberian admixture?
Yes, but there's still a lot of people who are only 2-3% Asian. The average is closer to 5% or so, according to my personal observation. Also, I count Ukrainians and Belorussians as Russians, especially if they reside in Russia.

[Peterski]

I2a1b2a1a1a1a3-A16681 - what was that "Ancient Illyrian" doing in 11th century Russia? :laugh:

People from FTDNA with A16681:

https://s1.postimg.org/1tf9eyws67/Screen_Hunter_2029_Oct._09_10.14.jpg

[Leto]

I2a1b2a1a1a1a3-A16681 - what was that "Ancient Illyrian" doing in 11th century Russia? :laugh:
This haplogroup is widely present across Ukraine, European Russia and Belarus, if I remember correctly.

[Hevo]

The sample has a quite low Siberian score for an average Russian. This sample could have been be a migrant from further west or the Slavs did not mix much with the Finno-Ugric tribes in Grand Duchy of Vladimir.

[Herr Abubu]

This haplogroup is widely present across Ukraine, European Russia and Belarus, if I remember correctly.

It's the 2nd or 3rd most common haplogroup in Russia and even more strongly present in Rusyn, f.e... Only people with an agenda want it to be pre-Slavic Balkan.

[Leto]

He has a quite low Siberian score for an average Russian. He could be a migrant or some sort of merchant from further west or the Slavs did not mix much with the Finno-Ugric tribes in Grand Duchy of Vladimir.
Most likely, there weren't that many Finnics as you think or they were very European themselves.

[Leto]

It's the 2nd or 3rd most common haplogroup in Russia and even more strongly present in Rusyn, f.e... Only people with an agenda want it to be pre-Slavic Balkan.
Well, it might be originally from there, who knows.

[Ülev]

I2a1b2a1a1a1a3-A16681 - what was that "Ancient Illyrian" doing in 11th century Russia? :laugh:

quite easy,

Slavs were Baptised by Byzanthine and later Roman Empires
Cyril & Methodius &Co were of Balkanic origin, elite rulers
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianization_of_Kievan_Rus%27

[Hudayar]

looks like he's either mixed or something like that.

[Kelmendasi]

Further evidence of I2a1b being expanded with Slavs into the Balkans

[Fustan]

Well, it might be originally from there

nope

[Lavrentis]

nope

Just accept it and move on, the facts have presented themselves

[Kelmendasi]

Just accept it and move on, the facts have presented themselves
It's not native though, the native theory was accepted in the years of around 2010-14 now they are debunked by ancient DNA samples and studies on the haplogroups

[Lavrentis]

It's not native though, the native theory was accepted in the years of around 2010-14 now they are debunked by ancient DNA samples and studies on the haplogroups

Which clades of I2a are native in the Balkans?

[Fustan]

Just accept it and move on, the facts have presented themselves

the only thing that one could accept here is that you are probably one of the most retarded posters on this site

[Lavrentis]

the only thing that one could accept here is that you are probably one of the most retarded posters on this site

Aren't you that virgin incel from the discord chat with all the other toxic retards? Accept science or stfu btw

[Kelmendasi]

Which clades of I2a are native in the Balkans?
There is a possibility of some I2a2a clades being native since there was multiple I2a2a found in the ancient Balkans although today most of the I2a2a in Balkanites is of Germanic input, another I2a clade which has a chance of being native is maybe some I2a1a which is found among Sardinians also some I2c could be native but idk about that one

[Lavrentis]

There is a possibility of some I2a2a clades being native since there was multiple I2a2a found in the ancient Balkans although today most of the I2a2a in Balkanites is of Germanic input, another I2a clade which has a chance of being native is maybe some I2a1a which is found among Sardinians also some I2c could be native but idk about that one

Thanks for the answer, I thought that I2b was the other Germanic clade and not I2a2a but it seems that both are

[Kelmendasi]

Thanks for the answer, I thought that I2b was the other Germanic clade and not I2a2a but it seems that both are
I2b is the old name for I2a2

[Lavrentis]

I2b is the old name for I2a2

I'm new to all this :D :picard1:

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Grand Duchy of Vladimir sample (Sunghir6) is on GEDmatch:

Sunghir6 (years ca. 1040-1220 AD) - kit number T005824

And his Y-DNA haplogroup was I2a1b2a1a1a1a3-A16681.

I tought that Vladimir was N1c1 (Vladimir of viking Rurikid dynasty)

[Peterski]

(...)

This guy is just some commoner, not part of the Rurikid dynasty.

[Rethel]

Grand Duchy of Vladimir

Zalesie/sya.

[Rethel]

I tought that Vladimir was N1c1 (Vladimir of viking Rurikid dynasty)

Vladimir was/is the capital city of Grand Duchy. :picard2:

[wvwvw]

I is Germanic not Slavic

[Pahli]

Sunghir was Polak af

[Rethel]

I is Germanic not Slavic

:picard1:


Sunghir was Polak af

:coffee:

[Peterski]

Eurogenes K36 results of Sunghir6:

1. North-Eastern components = 61.30%:

Central_Euro 8.12
East_Central_Euro 23.49
Eastern_Euro 22.27
Fennoscandian 6.56
Volga-Ural 0.86

2. North-Western components = 25.70%:

French 8.82
North_Atlantic 7.48
North_Sea 9.40

4. South-Eastern components = 7.51%:

East_Balkan 7.02
North_Caucasian 0.49

5. South-Western components = 2.60%:

Basque 1.69
Iberian 0.91

6. South-Central components = 2.89%:

West_Med 2.89

^^^
Based on Aha's map:

https://i.imgur.com/VQ3kQ9F.jpg

[Peterski]

I think that his % of North-Western components is rather high for a Russian. Especially French.

[Rethel]

Aborigens would be much more interesting than this guy...

[Vlatko Vukovic]

Vladimir was/is the capital city of Grand Duchy. :picard2:

I know. I though that is theme about Rurikid prince Vladimir, who was N1c1 haplogroup.

[Peterski]

Sunghir6 has been added to YFull tree of I2a haplogroup:

https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-Y5596/

https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-Z16971*/

[Rethel]

Sunghir6 has been added to YFull tree of I2a haplogroup:

https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-Y5596/

https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-Z16971*/

1-5 were too?

[JQP4545]

Interesting that the component is lower in Bosnia and Herzegovina where the concentration of I2a peaks, than it is in Serbia where there is more R1a.

[Peterski]

Sunghir6 was autosomally more Western than modern Russians (he was rather closer to modern Ukrainians than Russians, and had no Siberian or Mongoloid admixture). Suzdal and Vladimir on Klyazma were settled by Slavs in 1040-1220 AD, roughly the same period when Sunghir6 lived. But there were also Ugric and Volgaic Finnic Merya in that area (related to modern Mari). Rostov (Hrossthiolf) and Suzdal (Syrgisdalir) were originally Varangian colonies. Which is probably why Sunghir6 shows an elevated level of North Sea admixture compared to modern Russians. He was probably partially Varangian.

Edit:

Well, his K15 North Sea is actually well within the present-day Russian range.

[Leto]

Sunghir6 was autosomally more Western than modern Russians (he was rather closer to modern Ukrainians than Russians, and had no Siberian or Mongoloid admixture). Suzdal and Vladimir on Klyazma were settled by Slavs in 1040-1220 AD, roughly the same period when Sunghir6 lived. But there were also Ugric and Volgaic Finnic Merya in that area (related to modern Mari). Rostov (Hrossthiolf) and Suzdal (Syrgisdalir) were originally Varangian colonies. Which is probably why Sunghir6 shows an elevated level of North Sea admixture compared to modern Russians. He was probably partially Varangian.

Edit:

Well, his K15 North Sea is actually well within the present-day Russian range.
He does have some Siberian (minor)

MDLP World Oracle results:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 North_and_East_European 49.4
2 South_and_West_European 39.11
3 Caucaus_Parsia 6.76
4 Arctic_Amerind 1.53
5 North_Asian 1.16
6 Indian 1.07
7 Middle_East 0.63
8 Melanesian 0.18
9 Sub_Saharian 0.16

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Sorb 2.6
2 Belarusian_V 3.31
3 Ukrainian_V 3.91
4 Ukrainian-Center 4.08
5 Swedish_V 4.17
6 Ukrainian-West 4.31
7 Ukrainian 4.35
8 Polish_V 4.38
9 Russian_cossack 4.49
10 Ukrainian-East 4.84
11 Russian_South 4.91
12 Slovakian 5.04
13 German 5.96
14 Polish 6.12
15 Swedish 6.15
16 German-North 6.34
17 Czech 6.74
18 Russian_V 7.18
19 Russian_Center 7.73
20 Norwegian_V 7.89

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 72.5% Russian_South + 27.5% CEU @ 1.58
2 73.7% Russian_South + 26.3% Orcadian @ 1.58
3 71.5% Russian_South + 28.5% Welsh @ 1.59
4 74.5% Russian_South + 25.5% British @ 1.65
5 62.6% Russian_South + 37.4% Norwegian_V @ 1.7
6 56.2% Russian_South + 43.8% Swedish @ 1.74
7 65.5% Swedish + 34.5% Mordovian @ 1.75
8 61.9% Russian_Center + 38.1% CEU @ 1.79
9 97.4% Sorb + 2.6% Chukchi @ 1.79
10 52.5% Russian_V + 47.5% Norwegian_V @ 1.79
11 57.1% Russian_South + 42.9% German-North @ 1.83
12 88.6% Russian_South + 11.4% Basque @ 1.84
13 65.1% Russian_V + 34.9% Orcadian @ 1.85
14 68.6% Russian_South + 31.4% CEU_V @ 1.85
15 97.7% Sorb + 2.3% Koryak @ 1.85
16 71.4% German-North + 28.6% Inkeri @ 1.85
17 76% Russian_cossack + 24% Orcadian @ 1.87
18 50.7% Ukrainian-Center + 49.3% Swedish_V @ 1.88
19 65.3% Russian_cossack + 34.7% Norwegian_V @ 1.88
20 50.7% German + 49.3% Polish @ 1.89

But yeah, a bit more Western

[Peterski]

But I've heard that this sample is in 10% contaminated with modern DNA.

Not sure if true. Isn't it possible to isolate/separate modern from original?

[Leto]

But I've heard that this sample is in 10% contaminated with modern DNA.

Not sure if true. Isn't it possible to isolate/separate modern from original?
Don't know. To me the quality is pretty good. People post results of much older samples. Those might be significantly contaminated. This one is less than a 1,000 years old.