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DaiViet
12-03-2017, 02:05 AM
Californian test scores show differences between different Asian ethnicities of various ages. Generally, East Asians, Vietnamese, and Indians score above whites and other Asians.


https://randomcriticalanalysis.wordpress.com/2015/05/21/some-quick-plots-pertaining-to-various-asian-ethnic-groups/

Some comparisons:

https://randomcriticalanalysis.files.wordpress.com/2015/05/boxplot_algebraii.png

https://randomcriticalanalysis.files.wordpress.com/2015/05/boxplot_math_g7.png

https://randomcriticalanalysis.files.wordpress.com/2015/05/boxplot_sci_g10.png

Hamlet
12-03-2017, 02:06 AM
Clearly, they are the superior race.

DaiViet
12-03-2017, 02:08 AM
Clearly, they are the superior race.

Or they have culture that emphasizes academic achievement.

Hamlet
12-03-2017, 02:10 AM
Or they have culture that emphasizes academic achievement.

But that's not really something you'd boast about through a thread, is it

DaiViet
12-03-2017, 02:14 AM
But that's not really something you'd boast about through a thread, is it

Why not? Some cultural values are to be praised.

Hamlet
12-03-2017, 02:16 AM
Why not? Some cultural values are to be praised.

Come on and get real, don't even dare pretend to me that this post wasn't predominantly inspired by ethnocentrism (even though "Asian" isn't an ethnicity)

Iloko
12-03-2017, 02:21 AM
Vietnamese have the highest Genotypic-IQ I believe: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/genetics-iq-and-convergence/

DaiViet
12-03-2017, 02:23 AM
Come on and get real, don't even dare pretend to me that this post wasn't predominantly inspired by ethnocentrism (even though "Asian" isn't an ethnicity)

Yes, cultures that emphasize academic achievement produce better students. Is that a problem?

Anthony PV
12-03-2017, 02:32 AM
Yes, cultures that emphasize academic achievement produce better students. Is that a problem?
No. But academic achievement isn't the only set of skills kids must develop to make it in life.

DaiViet
12-03-2017, 04:32 AM
No. But academic achievement isn't the only set of skills kids must develop to make it in life.

Sure, but that’s another topic.

zhaoyun
12-03-2017, 04:34 AM
Vietnamese are the only SE Asians who are culturally East Asian. I see them as the cousins to Cantonese people tbh.

Fractal
12-03-2017, 04:34 AM
Californian test scores show differences between different Asian ethnicities of various ages. Generally, East Asians, Vietnamese, and Indians score above whites and other Asians.


https://randomcriticalanalysis.wordpress.com/2015/05/21/some-quick-plots-pertaining-to-various-asian-ethnic-groups/

Some comparisons:

https://randomcriticalanalysis.files.wordpress.com/2015/05/boxplot_algebraii.png

https://randomcriticalanalysis.files.wordpress.com/2015/05/boxplot_math_g7.png

https://randomcriticalanalysis.files.wordpress.com/2015/05/boxplot_sci_g10.png

I'm not gonna speak for East Asians - not my people .

But Indians definitely score the highest in California . Saratoga High School or Mission San Jose in Northern California have the highest SAT scores, highest AP Calculus and Physics enrollment, lowest drop out rates, etc..

zhaoyun
12-03-2017, 04:35 AM
I'm not gonna speak for East Asians - not my people .

But Indians definitely score the highest in California . Saratoga High School or Mission San Jose in Northern California have the highest SAT scores, highest AP Calculus and Physics enrollment, lowest drop out rates, etc..

Both Chinese and Indian Americans score very high. Who actually scores higher, probably depends on the place and subject.

DaiViet
12-03-2017, 09:31 AM
Vietnamese are the only SE Asians who are culturally East Asian. I see them as the cousins to Cantonese people tbh.


I think the process of cultural sinicization began as early as 2nd century BC when Nanyue absorbed what is present-day northern Vietnam and continued when the territory became a southern province to successive Chinese Dynasties from Han all the way to Tang.

Even after Annam’s (Vietnam) independence post-Tang, the tradition of Imperial Examinations continued until its abolishment by the French in the 20th century. Vietnam was the last country to abandon Confucian Imperial Exams with the last one taking place in 1919.

Below is an early 20th century photo of Vietnamese scholar officials from Nguyen Dynasty.

http://blog.smilingalbino.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Nguyen-Dynasty.jpg

As with other Sinospheric cultures, the legacy of academic accomplishments being held in high esteem continues today.

Fractal
12-03-2017, 09:46 AM
Or they have culture that emphasizes academic achievement.

Yes. Funny how people discuss IQ and not the culture.

The reason why Whites and Latinos are dumber than Indians or Vietnamese in the USA is simply because their cultures doesn't emphasize academics as much.

But I've noticed the Vietnamese-Americans are lower on the socioeconomic scale than the Koreans and Chinese, why is that? They are just as intelligent it seems and have the same culture.

zhaoyun
12-03-2017, 04:23 PM
I think the process of cultural sinicization began as early as 2nd century BC when Nanyue absorbed what is present-day northern Vietnam and continued when the territory became a southern province to successive Chinese Dynasties from Han all the way to Tang.

Even after Annam’s (Vietnam) independence post-Tang, the tradition of Imperial Examinations continued until its abolishment by the French in the 20th century. Vietnam was the last country to abandon Confucian Imperial Exams with the last one taking place in 1919.

Below is an early 20th century photo of Vietnamese scholar officials from Nguyen Dynasty.

http://blog.smilingalbino.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Nguyen-Dynasty.jpg

As with other Sinospheric cultures, the legacy of academic accomplishments being held in high esteem continues today.

Honestly, Vietnam was well on the way to becoming another Han Chinese province, all of the Southern Chinese provinces went through the same process. But Vietnam fought hard for its independence and that's why it is an independent country today.

zhaoyun
12-03-2017, 04:24 PM
Yes. Funny how people discuss IQ and not the culture.

The reason why Whites and Latinos are dumber than Indians or Vietnamese in the USA is simply because their cultures doesn't emphasize academics as much.

But I've noticed the Vietnamese-Americans are lower on the socioeconomic scale than the Koreans and Chinese, why is that? They are just as intelligent it seems and have the same culture.

Vietnam is poorer than China and Korea. But it's developing rapidly now. I think over time the differences will disappear with the 2nd and 3rd generation Viets because they are pretty hardworking and entrepreneurial.

Yeah, I agree. IQ comes from culture primarily, not from genetics.

DaiViet
12-03-2017, 04:43 PM
Majority of Vietnamese immigrants to the US were war refugees rather than graduate students or working professionals. The current household income is about the same level as Koreans in America, who also tend to be newer immigrants.

In regards to Vietnam’s economic development, after the war US placed an economic embargo on Vietnam, and this wasn’t lifted until 1997. It was only a few years ago that Vietnam’s GDP/capita surpassed India’s.

To put things into proper perspective, remember China started their economic reforms in late 1970’s, so it took China nearly 40 years to get to where they are today, and the pace really picked up about 15-20 years ago. Development takes time.

https://moneymorning.com/images2/china_chart_2.jpg

zhaoyun
12-03-2017, 04:49 PM
Majority of Vietnamese immigrants to the US were war refugees rather than graduate students or working professionals. The current household income is about the same level as Koreans in America, who also tend to be newer immigrants.

In regards to Vietnam’s economic development, after the war US placed an economic embargo on Vietnam, and this wasn’t lifted until 1997. It was only a few years ago that Vietnam’s GDP/capita exceeded India’s.

To put things into proper perspective, remember China had reformed their economy in late 1970’s, so it took China nearly 40 years to get to where they are today, and the pace really picked up about 10 years ago. Development takes time.

I'm pretty sure in 30 years, Vietnam will be the most powerful SE Asian country because of the Confucian culture that none of the others have (except tiny Singapore)

DaiViet
12-03-2017, 05:06 PM
Honestly, Vietnam was well on the way to becoming another Han Chinese province, all of the Southern Chinese provinces went through the same process. But Vietnam fought hard for its independence and that's why it is an independent country today.

A lot of Vietnamese nationalists would deny this fact, but rebellion was not at all unique to Annam. Look at the list of rebellions here. It’s not even close to a comprehensive list:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rebellions_in_China

Going off on a tangent here, but I’d like to elaborate on this issue.

Territorial fracture was common after the collapse of each Chinese Dynasty. For a period of over 75 years after Tang dissolved, its former territories were fractured into multiple pieces controlled by different warlords. Present-day northern Vietnam was one of them (then known as Annam). Annam was originally a part of Southern Han territory but broke off from them. When the Song Dynasty grew in prominence and started to reabsorb the other territories, Annam was able to resist this process through superior military tactics. The rest is history.

Map of China after Tang broke into pieces:

https://media1.britannica.com/eb-media/00/7500-004-2545F6E3.jpg

Vietnam exists as an artifact of history rather than some long-held nationalistic struggle that most Vietnamese falsely believe.

zhaoyun
12-03-2017, 05:12 PM
A lot of Vietnamese nationalists would deny this fact, but rebellion was not at all unique to Annam. Look at the list of rebellions here. It’s not even close to a comprehensive list:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rebellions_in_China

Going off on a tangent here, but I’d like to elaborate on this issue.

Territorial fracture was common after the collapse of each Chinese Dynasty. For a period of over 75 years after Tang dissolved, its former territories were fractured into multiple pieces controlled by different warlords. Present-day northern Vietnam was one of them (then known as Annam). Annam was originally a part of Southern Han territory but broke off from them. When the Song Dynasty grew in prominence and started to reabsorb the other territories, Annam was able to resist this process through superior military tactics. The rest is history.

Map of China after Tang broke into pieces:

https://media1.britannica.com/eb-media/00/7500-004-2545F6E3.jpg

Vietnam exists as an artifact of history rather than some long-held nationalistic struggle that most Vietnamese falsely believe.

Yeah I am well aware of that history. China is the only civilization to have constantly fallen apart and reunited. Yes, many of the former kingdoms that make up different provinces of China rebelled at one point or another. But Vietnam managed to become independent. I think it's a result of it's very Southern location and also the fact that Vietnamese are very resilient and stubborn fighters. Either way, Vietnam would've ended up as a more Southern Guangdong if it had stayed a part of China. The Cantonese are basically the Han version of the Vietnamese IMO.

DaiViet
12-03-2017, 05:39 PM
Back to the topic of academic test comparisons. Here is a list of top ranking of math scores (Quant) on the GRE by country. For those who are not familiar with the GRE, it’s the standardized exam used by graduate schools to assess a candidate’s entrance qualifications.

1. China
2. Taiwan
3. Hong Kong
4. Singapore
5. S. Korea
6. Vietnam
7. Turkey
8. Japan
9. Iran
10. France

Source: https://gnxp.nofe.me/2017/11/09/patterns-in-international-gre-scores/

http://i66.tinypic.com/2hdntwk.jpg


Verbal scores seem to be directly related to English language proficiency.

zhaoyun
12-03-2017, 06:45 PM
Back to the topic of academic test comparisons. Here is a list of top ranking of math scores (Quant) on the GRE by country. For those who are not familiar with the GRE, it’s the standardized exam used by graduate schools to assess a candidate’s entrance qualifications.

1. China
2. Taiwan
3. Hong Kong
4. Singapore
5. S. Korea
6. Vietnam
7. Turkey
8. Japan
9. Iran
10. France

Source: https://gnxp.nofe.me/2017/11/09/patterns-in-international-gre-scores/

http://i66.tinypic.com/2hdntwk.jpg


Verbal scores seem to be directly related to English language proficiency.

So these are primary candidates for graduate schools in the US correct? It's not really a reflection of the general population of those countries then.

DaiViet
12-03-2017, 07:40 PM
So these are primary candidates for graduate schools in the US correct? It's not really a reflection of the general population of those countries then.

It’s a reflection of students who have already completed their bachelors from each country. They’re not necessarily primary candidates for graduate schools, but only making an attempt to get accepted. Interesting comparison nevertheless.

East Asian undergraduate schools clearly have greater focus on development of quantitative skills.

DaiViet
12-08-2017, 06:33 AM
2017 Math/Chemistry/Physics Olympiad Rankings (out of over 100 countries):

International Mathematics Olympiad
1. South Korea
2. China
3. Vietnam

International Chemistry Olympiad
1. Taiwan
2. USA
3. Vietnam/China (tied)

International Physics Olympiad
1. Singapore
2. Russia
3. South Korea
4. China
5. Vietnam


http://imo-official.org/year_country_r.aspx?year=2017

zhaoyun
12-08-2017, 06:50 AM
2017 Math/Chemistry/Physics Olympiad Rankings (out of over 100 countries):

International Mathematics Olympiad
1. South Korea
2. China
3. Vietnam

International Chemistry Olympiad
1. Taiwan
2. USA
3. Vietnam/China (tied)

International Physics Olympiad
1. Singapore
2. Russia
3. South Korea
4. China
5. Vietnam


http://imo-official.org/year_country_r.aspx?year=2017

Vietnam does disproportionately well in these competitions relative to its development level, which adds to my belief that it will definitely be the rising star in Southeast Asia.

Aside from Singapore, you won't see any of the other SE Asian countries up there.

serenesam
12-09-2017, 08:53 PM
Vietnamese have the highest Genotypic-IQ I believe: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/genetics-iq-and-convergence/

I having difficulty telling the difference between phenotypic IQ and genotypic IQ. Can someone please explain it to me?

DaiViet
12-10-2017, 09:10 AM
I having difficulty telling the difference between phenotypic IQ and genotypic IQ. Can someone please explain it to me?

First off, I wouldn’t take that blog post too seriously.

To answer your question though, phenotype is impacted by environment whereas genotype reveals potential based on genetic makeup.

Iloko
12-10-2017, 09:39 AM
First off, I wouldn’t take that blog post too seriously.

To answer your question though, phenotype is impacted by environment whereas genotype reveals potential based on genetic makeup.
It would be pretty cool and interesting if 23andme provided some type of report for our exact genotypic-IQ. I'm curious if there are any other third-party sites or apps which can provide this info.

DaiViet
12-10-2017, 09:42 AM
It would be pretty cool and interesting if 23andme provided some type of report for our exact genotypic-IQ. I'm curious if there are any other third-party sites or apps which can provide this info.

Well a number of papers have found SNP’s associated with IQ, but they only account for a few points of difference. There hasn’t been any findings yet that have identified genes that control more than this.

serenesam
12-10-2017, 03:53 PM
First off, I wouldn’t take that blog post too seriously.

To answer your question though, phenotype is impacted by environment whereas genotype reveals potential based on genetic makeup.

Obviously, I know what the difference is between "phenotype" and "genotype" but I'm still having difficulty understanding the difference between "phenotypic IQ" and "genotypic IQ." For how does one determine the degree and/or potential to the genetic makeup of IQ as opposed to IQ that is impacted by environment?